From simonzwise at gmail.com Sun Sep 1 04:14:35 2013 From: simonzwise at gmail.com (Simon Wise) Date: Sun, 01 Sep 2013 12:14:35 +0800 Subject: [LAU] Custom UI development in Pure Data In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <5222BF2B.9090503@gmail.com> On 01/09/13 03:26, Heikki Ketoharju wrote: > Hi everyone! > > I don't know if this should be asked in LAD, but I'm fed up with Pure > Data's own gui components, and would like to develop my own gui with > something else (GTK? QT?). I don't have earlier experience with any UI > toolkit, so I don't have any favourites. What is easiest approach to custom > gui development with PD? > > I need something like list boxes and buttons with custom text. Nothing too > special. You have some choices: 1/ use whatever toolkit you prefer to build your GUI app, and send messages to PD over a socket. Pd is a language, you don't need to use the GUI parts of it at all ... it has very mature ways of listening to input of all sorts. 2/ ditto, but send osc or midi instead of native pd messages 3/ ditto, but use real hardware interfaces rather than the somewhat limited ascii - mouse - screen interface of most toolkits. 4/ use libpd to give access to lots of PD from within the GUI application you are building 5/ look at droid party for a project that provides another GUI method, using libpd internally, for making interfaces on Android (and iOS) devices. http://droidparty.net/ All these have advantages, but of course they all involve more work than just using the GUI elements built into the language. Simon From marc at hacklava.net Sun Sep 1 05:53:24 2013 From: marc at hacklava.net (Marc =?UTF-8?B?TGF2YWxsw6ll?=) Date: Sun, 1 Sep 2013 01:53:24 -0400 Subject: [LAU] Custom UI development in Pure Data In-Reply-To: <5222BF2B.9090503@gmail.com> References: <5222BF2B.9090503@gmail.com> Message-ID: <20130901015324.5053c2ed@telecino> There's an old method to create a remote GUI for PD, that uses wxWindows and communicate through sockets. It's not a replacement GUI, but it helps to create front-ends: http://crca.ucsd.edu/~jsarlo/gripd/ -- Marc Sun, 01 Sep 2013 12:14:35 +0800, Simon Wise a ?crit : > On 01/09/13 03:26, Heikki Ketoharju wrote: > > Hi everyone! > > > > I don't know if this should be asked in LAD, but I'm fed up with > > Pure Data's own gui components, and would like to develop my own > > gui with something else (GTK? QT?). I don't have earlier experience > > with any UI toolkit, so I don't have any favourites. What is > > easiest approach to custom gui development with PD? > > > > I need something like list boxes and buttons with custom text. > > Nothing too special. > > You have some choices: > > 1/ use whatever toolkit you prefer to build your GUI app, and send > messages to PD over a socket. Pd is a language, you don't need to use > the GUI parts of it at all ... it has very mature ways of listening > to input of all sorts. > > 2/ ditto, but send osc or midi instead of native pd messages > > 3/ ditto, but use real hardware interfaces rather than the somewhat > limited ascii - mouse - screen interface of most toolkits. > > 4/ use libpd to give access to lots of PD from within the GUI > application you are building > > 5/ look at droid party for a project that provides another GUI > method, using libpd internally, for making interfaces on Android (and > iOS) devices. > > http://droidparty.net/ > > > All these have advantages, but of course they all involve more work > than just using the GUI elements built into the language. > > Simon From marc at hacklava.net Sun Sep 1 06:04:25 2013 From: marc at hacklava.net (Marc =?UTF-8?B?TGF2YWxsw6ll?=) Date: Sun, 1 Sep 2013 02:04:25 -0400 Subject: [LAU] Custom UI development in Pure Data In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20130901020425.34978c53@telecino> PD have a new GUI Plugins API: http://puredata.info/docs/guiplugins/ -- Marc Sat, 31 Aug 2013 22:26:35 +0300, Heikki Ketoharju a ?crit : > Hi everyone! > > I don't know if this should be asked in LAD, but I'm fed up with Pure > Data's own gui components, and would like to develop my own gui with > something else (GTK? QT?). I don't have earlier experience with any UI > toolkit, so I don't have any favourites. What is easiest approach to > custom gui development with PD? > > I need something like list boxes and buttons with custom text. > Nothing too special. > > Heikki From brummer- at web.de Sun Sep 1 06:42:49 2013 From: brummer- at web.de (hermann meyer) Date: Sun, 01 Sep 2013 08:42:49 +0200 Subject: [LAU] Free Impulse Response files for guitarists In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <5222E1E9.5050100@web.de> /Fri Mar 29 12:05:27 UTC 2013 /Giorgio - Audiophilo wrote: > Thank you so much for the hint! > Do you know of any documentation on how to create those files? I have some > interesting amps and i'd love to create some impulse response files to > share with the community. Hi Giorgio Andreas Degert from the guitarix project have done some research on this field and comes up with a new program (specmatch) to generate Impulse Response files. It's available in the guitarix git repository now. It generate IR-files by compare the spectrum of two files (Orginal <> Sample), it's a handy python application and easy to use. greets hermann -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From anomalsound at gmail.com Sun Sep 1 09:07:29 2013 From: anomalsound at gmail.com (Giorgio - Audiophilo) Date: Sun, 1 Sep 2013 11:07:29 +0200 Subject: [LAU] Free Impulse Response files for guitarists In-Reply-To: <5222E1E9.5050100@web.de> References: <5222E1E9.5050100@web.de> Message-ID: Sounds great, thank you so much again Il giorno 01/set/2013 08:42, "hermann meyer" ha scritto: > *Fri Mar 29 12:05:27 UTC 2013 *Giorgio - Audiophilo wrote: > > Thank you so much for the hint! > Do you know of any documentation on how to create those files? I have some > interesting amps and i'd love to create some impulse response files to > share with the community. > > > Hi Giorgio > > Andreas Degert from the guitarix project have done some research on this > field and comes up with a new program (specmatch) to generate Impulse > Response files. It's available in the guitarix git repository now. It > generate IR-files by compare the spectrum of two files (Orginal <> Sample), > it's a handy python application and easy to use. > > greets > hermann > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From simonzwise at gmail.com Sun Sep 1 10:06:44 2013 From: simonzwise at gmail.com (Simon Wise) Date: Sun, 01 Sep 2013 18:06:44 +0800 Subject: [LAU] Custom UI development in Pure Data In-Reply-To: <20130901020425.34978c53@telecino> References: <20130901020425.34978c53@telecino> Message-ID: <522311B4.3020108@gmail.com> On 01/09/13 14:04, Marc Lavall?e wrote: > > PD have a new GUI Plugins API: > http://puredata.info/docs/guiplugins/ yes ... the pd interface is much more flexible, you can change the look, change the behaviour, great work has been done there ... but if you want a different slider or whatever then you need to write one (or find one), and if you want to use some other toolkit to build an interface then it is communication with pd or pd as a library you are after. One option I forgot to mention is building an interface in pd using GEM windows, but I was thinking the OP was wanting to use a existing toolkit with the look and options and pre-built bits that that provides. Simon From fede2001 at hotmail.com Sun Sep 1 16:30:11 2013 From: fede2001 at hotmail.com (Federico Lopez) Date: Sun, 1 Sep 2013 11:30:11 -0500 Subject: [LAU] Custom UI development in Pure Data In-Reply-To: <5222BF2B.9090503@gmail.com> References: <5222BF2B.9090503@gmail.com> Message-ID: On 08/31/2013 11:14 PM, Simon Wise wrote: > On 01/09/13 03:26, Heikki Ketoharju wrote: >> Hi everyone! >> >> I don't know if this should be asked in LAD, but I'm fed up with Pure >> Data's own gui components, and would like to develop my own gui with >> something else (GTK? QT?). I don't have earlier experience with any UI >> toolkit, so I don't have any favourites. What is easiest approach to >> custom >> gui development with PD? >> >> I need something like list boxes and buttons with custom text. >> Nothing too >> special. > > You have some choices: > > 1/ use whatever toolkit you prefer to build your GUI app, and send > messages to PD over a socket. Pd is a language, you don't need to use > the GUI parts of it at all ... it has very mature ways of listening to > input of all sorts. > There is a toolkit using WebSockets to communicate Pd and HTML5/javascript http://dancingbonemachine.elsoftwarehamuerto.org/tutorial.html > 2/ ditto, but send osc or midi instead of native pd messages > > 3/ ditto, but use real hardware interfaces rather than the somewhat > limited ascii - mouse - screen interface of most toolkits. > > 4/ use libpd to give access to lots of PD from within the GUI > application you are building > > 5/ look at droid party for a project that provides another GUI method, > using libpd internally, for making interfaces on Android (and iOS) > devices. > > http://droidparty.net/ > > > All these have advantages, but of course they all involve more work > than just using the GUI elements built into the language. > > Simon > _______________________________________________ > Linux-audio-user mailing list > Linux-audio-user at lists.linuxaudio.org > http://lists.linuxaudio.org/listinfo/linux-audio-user > > From marc at hacklava.net Sun Sep 1 18:01:45 2013 From: marc at hacklava.net (Marc =?UTF-8?B?TGF2YWxsw6ll?=) Date: Sun, 1 Sep 2013 14:01:45 -0400 Subject: [LAU] Custom UI development in Pure Data In-Reply-To: References: <5222BF2B.9090503@gmail.com> Message-ID: <20130901140145.26928a46@telecino> Federico Lopez a ?crit : > There is a toolkit using WebSockets to communicate Pd and > HTML5/javascript > > http://dancingbonemachine.elsoftwarehamuerto.org/tutorial.html Interesting. It uses libpd. Id didn't know much about libpd: https://github.com/libpd/libpd/wiki There's APIs for many languages and environnements, including a recent for addon for OpenFrameworks: https://github.com/danomatika/ofxPd -- Marc From rm at mh-freiburg.de Sun Sep 1 18:17:45 2013 From: rm at mh-freiburg.de (R. Mattes) Date: Sun, 1 Sep 2013 20:17:45 +0200 Subject: [LAU] Custom UI development in Pure Data In-Reply-To: <20130901140145.26928a46@telecino> References: <5222BF2B.9090503@gmail.com> <20130901140145.26928a46@telecino> Message-ID: <20130901180843.M99543@mh-freiburg.de> On Sun, 1 Sep 2013 14:01:45 -0400, Marc Lavall?e wrote > Federico Lopez a ?crit : > > > There is a toolkit using WebSockets to communicate Pd and > > HTML5/javascript > > > > http://dancingbonemachine.elsoftwarehamuerto.org/tutorial.html > > Interesting. It uses libpd. Id didn't know much about libpd: > https://github.com/libpd/libpd/wiki > There's APIs for many languages and environnements, > including a recent for addon for OpenFrameworks: > https://github.com/danomatika/ofxPd Just keep in mind: libpd can only _run_ pd patches, you cannot create/modify patches. Iff this is all you need than libpd might be a valid replacement for Pd proper. Another obstacle to consider: libpd doesn't provide any build-in way to handle audio data. You need to write code to send/receive audio/midi data to your framework-of-choice. On Linux that means writing quite some jack code (and, since libpd's model of operation is push/pull, that code isn't really trivial). That's where the example code is astonishing terse :-) : ----[file: cppTest$/src/main.cpp]------------------------------------ // fill inbuf here pd.processFloat(1, inbuf, outbuf); // use outbuf here --------------------------------------------------------------------- Frankly, I'd rather write my GUI in Qt (or whatever) and communicate whith a headless pd process by means of OSC or even "raw" pd messages. Cheers, Ralf Mattes -- R. Mattes - Hochschule fuer Musik Freiburg rm at inm.mh-freiburg.de From marc at hacklava.net Sun Sep 1 18:25:23 2013 From: marc at hacklava.net (Marc =?UTF-8?B?TGF2YWxsw6ll?=) Date: Sun, 1 Sep 2013 14:25:23 -0400 Subject: [LAU] Custom UI development in Pure Data In-Reply-To: <20130901180843.M99543@mh-freiburg.de> References: <5222BF2B.9090503@gmail.com> <20130901140145.26928a46@telecino> <20130901180843.M99543@mh-freiburg.de> Message-ID: <20130901142523.2ee5a3de@telecino> "R. Mattes" a ?crit : > Frankly, I'd rather write my GUI in Qt (or whatever) and communicate > whith a headless pd process by means of OSC or even "raw" pd messages. That what I used to do when I was programming "interactive art installations" (~10 years ago). The "raw" pd messages protocol is called "FUDI"; OSC is useful for handling hierarchically structured messages, but is overkill in most situations. -- Marc From harryhaaren at gmail.com Sun Sep 1 18:59:52 2013 From: harryhaaren at gmail.com (Harry van Haaren) Date: Sun, 1 Sep 2013 19:59:52 +0100 Subject: [LAU] Custom UI development in Pure Data In-Reply-To: <20130901180843.M99543@mh-freiburg.de> References: <5222BF2B.9090503@gmail.com> <20130901140145.26928a46@telecino> <20130901180843.M99543@mh-freiburg.de> Message-ID: On Sun, Sep 1, 2013 at 7:17 PM, R. Mattes wrote: > That's where the example code is astonishing terse :-) : Or hidden away on a github repo... https://github.com/harryhaaren/openAudioProgrammingTutorials/tree/master/pureDataHost > Frankly, I'd rather write my GUI in Qt (or whatever) and communicate whith > a headless pd process by means of OSC or even "raw" pd messages. I have implemented a libPD "front-end", which parses the patch file manually, and creates a canvas using GANV[1] and GTK. Note this was an experiment, and I'm no longer working on this. Screenshot link: https://www.dropbox.com/s/sbd2uxwa7xtwshr/libpdUiFrontend.png HTH, -Harry [1] http://svn.drobilla.net/lad/trunk/ganv -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From gheskett at wdtv.com Sun Sep 1 19:22:18 2013 From: gheskett at wdtv.com (Gene Heskett) Date: Sun, 1 Sep 2013 15:22:18 -0400 Subject: [LAU] Custom UI development in Pure Data In-Reply-To: References: <20130901180843.M99543@mh-freiburg.de> Message-ID: <201309011522.18087.gheskett@wdtv.com> On Sunday 01 September 2013 15:13:45 Harry van Haaren did opine: > On Sun, Sep 1, 2013 at 7:17 PM, R. Mattes wrote: > > That's where the example code is astonishing terse :-) : > Or hidden away on a github repo... > https://github.com/harryhaaren/openAudioProgrammingTutorials/tree/master > /pureDataHost > > > Frankly, I'd rather write my GUI in Qt (or whatever) and communicate > > whith a headless pd process by means of OSC or even "raw" pd > > messages. > > I have implemented a libPD "front-end", which parses the patch file > manually, and creates a canvas > using GANV[1] and GTK. Note this was an experiment, and I'm no longer > working on this. > Screenshot link: > https://www.dropbox.com/s/sbd2uxwa7xtwshr/libpdUiFrontend.png > This one is a passing resemblance to a linux gizmo by the name of rockhopper. It analyses the .hal configuration file of a linuxcnc installation, and generates a web (http://host:8000) viewable .svg file, useless because its images are so small for screen reading, file that is a logic diagram of the control code for a specific cnc controlled machine. You can save the file and posterize it to print it, tape the prints together and get a wall poster that is readable. My little toy 7x12 lathe is 6 landscape pages done that way. Even at 6 pages, its a "busy" diagram. > HTH, -Harry > > [1] http://svn.drobilla.net/lad/trunk/ganv Cheers, Gene -- "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) My web page: is up! My views No problem is so large it can't be fit in somewhere. A pen in the hand of this president is far more dangerous than 200 million guns in the hands of law-abiding citizens. From heikki.ketoharju at iki.fi Sun Sep 1 21:57:21 2013 From: heikki.ketoharju at iki.fi (Heikki Ketoharju) Date: Mon, 2 Sep 2013 00:57:21 +0300 Subject: [LAU] Custom UI development in Pure Data In-Reply-To: <201309011522.18087.gheskett@wdtv.com> References: <20130901180843.M99543@mh-freiburg.de> <201309011522.18087.gheskett@wdtv.com> Message-ID: Thanks everyone! I think I'll choose some language and toolkit. Maybe this is nice opportunity to learn Python & GTK... Dancing Bone Machine seemed fun way to develop UIs to patches but I don't want to run music software in browser. BTW Harry's Libpd frontend looks nice! I think pd's official UI would be much better with some other toolkit than tcl... -Heikki 2013/9/1 Gene Heskett > On Sunday 01 September 2013 15:13:45 Harry van Haaren did opine: > > > On Sun, Sep 1, 2013 at 7:17 PM, R. Mattes wrote: > > > That's where the example code is astonishing terse :-) : > > Or hidden away on a github repo... > > https://github.com/harryhaaren/openAudioProgrammingTutorials/tree/master > > /pureDataHost > > > > > Frankly, I'd rather write my GUI in Qt (or whatever) and communicate > > > whith a headless pd process by means of OSC or even "raw" pd > > > messages. > > > > I have implemented a libPD "front-end", which parses the patch file > > manually, and creates a canvas > > using GANV[1] and GTK. Note this was an experiment, and I'm no longer > > working on this. > > Screenshot link: > > https://www.dropbox.com/s/sbd2uxwa7xtwshr/libpdUiFrontend.png > > > > This one is a passing resemblance to a linux gizmo by the name of > rockhopper. It analyses the .hal configuration file of a linuxcnc > installation, and generates a web (http://host:8000) viewable .svg file, > useless because its images are so small for screen reading, file that is a > logic diagram of the control code for a specific cnc controlled machine. > You can save the file and posterize it to print it, tape the prints > together and get a wall poster that is readable. My little toy 7x12 lathe > is 6 landscape pages done that way. Even at 6 pages, its a "busy" diagram. > > > HTH, -Harry > > > > [1] http://svn.drobilla.net/lad/trunk/ganv > > > Cheers, Gene > -- > "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: > soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." > -Ed Howdershelt (Author) > My web page: is up! > My views > > No problem is so large it can't be fit in somewhere. > A pen in the hand of this president is far more > dangerous than 200 million guns in the hands of > law-abiding citizens. > _______________________________________________ > Linux-audio-user mailing list > Linux-audio-user at lists.linuxaudio.org > http://lists.linuxaudio.org/listinfo/linux-audio-user > -- http://heikki.ketoharju.info -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From termtech at rogers.com Mon Sep 2 02:17:12 2013 From: termtech at rogers.com (Tim E. Real) Date: Sun, 01 Sep 2013 22:17:12 -0400 Subject: [LAU] MusE: Transforming midi foot controller programs to toggled CC values Message-ID: <1478527.CeRLh9C0JP@col-desktop> This may be of interest to anyone who has a midi foot controller which only sends out program change messages, who also has an effects unit or SW which can map CC to effect parameters/bypass/etc, and who has a desire to use the foot switches like a regular 'stomp box chain' for *TOGGLED* control of individual effects. MusE's "Midi Input Transformator" plugin now allows you to do it. I pushed a wee mod and some fixes to our SF git repository. It should appear next release. The repo may change soon. Here's an example setup which maps Program Changes 0 - 3 to CC num = (Program + 10) and CC val = (TOGGLE 0 / 127): https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/53315356/Patch2ToggledCCTransform.jpeg The neat thing is, you can KEEP program changes that are above a certain number (Program 4 and above in the example), so that the very same foot controller can be used to change patches AND control individual effects. Common foot controllers have four Program switches and two Bank up/down switches, so by going to the next Bank (Programs 4 - 7 in the example), it can be used to switch Programs, then go back to Bank 0 (Programs 0 -3) and the switches act upon the individual effects again. Note that MusE currently allows mapping midi controllers to any LADSPA Rack Plugin parameters *except* the 'Bypass' switch. So if MusE *itself* is to be the effects unit, properly a 'Bypass' controller should be added. Cheers, Tim. www.muse-sequencer.org/ From jamshark70 at gmail.com Mon Sep 2 02:22:12 2013 From: jamshark70 at gmail.com (James Harkins) Date: Mon, 2 Sep 2013 02:22:12 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [LAU] =?utf-8?q?Fwd=3A_Re=3A_Asus/Ubuntu/Audacity_searching_a_rel?= =?utf-8?q?iable=09usb-recordig_interface=2E?= References: <521DBAAD.3040505@gmx.net> Message-ID: Jose van Rooy writes: > Hallo Harry, i appreciate you give me the name of this Esi Maya 44 usb recording-interface of 100 euro {to convert a tape into digital formats}, but it's like you didn't read my letter... I'm going to suggest here that maybe we have a typical introvert/extravert stylistic clash. To generalize (maybe over-generalize), extraverts like to talk through problems. Jose's e-mails sound a lot like "thinking out loud" -- extraverted behavior. Introverts (again, generalizing) tend to think, "Don't spend a lot of time on chitchat, just get to the point." Consistent with that, several of the responses to the very long e-mails have gone along the same lines: - "Your emails are extremely long winded: if you want advice, please be concise. You'll notice more people reply to short, clear emails." - "I've snipped away lots of your email, trying to focus on the important parts" -- after which, only two lines remained... the implication of which is obvious to any introvert :-p - And more harshly, "After reading all this junk.... you want me to read the rest?" It's reasonable to guess that people who like to spend free time tinkering with computer audio are likely to be more introverted than extraverted. Jose, if you want help from a bunch of introverts, you'll get a lot better help by focusing on two or three main points and cutting down the verbal diarrhea to a minimum. If it's not *directly* related to those 2-3 points, save it for another time. And, introverts like myself need to respect a different mental style that prefers talking-through over thinking-then-talking. (But, respect for that style doesn't manufacture enough time of day for me to read several screens full of text where the main point is hidden in there... somewhere...) hjh From espiritocz at gmail.com Mon Sep 2 02:57:48 2013 From: espiritocz at gmail.com (Milan Lazecky) Date: Mon, 2 Sep 2013 10:57:48 +0800 Subject: [LAU] WX5 MIDI mapping Message-ID: Hi, I am sorry for a beginner question, but your advice would be helpful.. I have an electronic saxophone, Yamaha WX5. I use with MIDI->USB, using Qsynth (through jack), the sound is working well, but every time I try to record midi footage, using either rosegarden or ardour3, the midi record is: - in strange tones (the melody is there, but notes are transposed for +32 or -32) (note that using Qsynth, or connecting with virtual keyboard, the notes are ok...) - when I try to transpose the recorded melody to normal scale, it doesn't play anything (yes, I map some midi instrument there, but it seems like if there is some strange volume=0 was set, or I don't know - but I haven't found a way to set it to other values) I know it is very messy question. But maybe you know what is wrong in my case.. maybe to try another software, or I miss some settings there? Thank you very much. Milan -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From termtech at rogers.com Mon Sep 2 08:23:36 2013 From: termtech at rogers.com (Tim E. Real) Date: Mon, 02 Sep 2013 04:23:36 -0400 Subject: [LAU] WX5 MIDI mapping In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <1574179.oeRxnNaLEE@col-desktop> On September 2, 2013 10:57:48 AM Milan Lazecky wrote: > Hi, > > I am sorry for a beginner question, but your advice would be helpful.. > > I have an electronic saxophone, Yamaha WX5. > > I use with MIDI->USB, using Qsynth (through jack), the sound is working > well, but every time I try to record midi footage, using either rosegarden > or ardour3, the midi record is: > > - in strange tones (the melody is there, but notes are transposed for +32 or > -32) (note that using Qsynth, or connecting with virtual keyboard, the notes > are ok...) > > - when I try to transpose the recorded melody to normal scale, it doesn't > play anything (yes, I map some midi instrument there, but it seems like if > there is some strange volume=0 was set, or I don't know - but I haven't > found a way to set it to other values) > > > I know it is very messy question. But maybe you know what is wrong in my > case.. maybe to try another software, or I miss some settings there? > > Thank you very much. > > > Milan > Hello. Nice controller, congratulations! Let's see if we can get you rockin'... First let me get an obvious question out of the way, although it sounds like there's no problem here: Do you know the WX5 works properly with some known setup? In particular, is it possible that the Octave buttons have had liquid spillage or sweat, such that they are intermittently changing your octave? Try MusE. It is similar to Rosegarden, or Cakewalk on Windows. By default MusE is set up to get the user recording soon. When you create a midi track, by default it will record all events, from all channels, on all input devices. Later, you learn how to refine it to record from specific devices but not others. Like any app, it's up to whatever output device you choose, to playback the recording, whether it uses the specific controllers or not. In MusE you set a midi track's 'output device'. If a QSynth instance is running, it should show as an available output device. Or, you can create a FluidSynth MESS Synthesizer Device track and assign the midi track to it. Yes, MusE has its own built-in FluidSynth plugin. A GUI will popup where you can load SoundFonts, make settings and so on. To see an example, simply start MusE and click File -> New and open the Template named 'synti.med'. You can change synth type, save as and so on. Also try different SoundFonts, or other synthesizer types: MusE supports MESS, DSSI, and Win/Linux VST synths. We do pass all controllers to these synths so if the synth supports it, it should work. Ultimately, we allow mapping of midi controllers (breath etc) to track parameters such as 'track audio volume'. So this is yet another option that should work, no matter what built-in synthesizer is used. OK, now arm the midi track, and arm the transport, hit transport play and start recording. MusE will automatically detect and record all controller data, such as breath, as well as any played notes. The WX5 can send velocity data (and MusE records it) but Yamaha recommends setting constant velocity and using the breath controller for volume, which MusE will record. After recording hit transport stop. You should see some newly recorded part(s) on the track. Open a part by double-clicking on it, or via menu options. You should see your recorded notes. And you can edit them. Also in the editor you'll see some buttons for viewing the recorded controller graphs (Ctrl, S, X). If anything was recorded, the particular controllers should show up in the list of available controller graphs (the Ctrl button). Hopefully your data graphs are there. Upon playback, the chosen output device can respond to them. So... If the weird notes problem persists, please save and send me the resultant recording (*.med file). I'll take a look. Ask if any other help needed. Tim. From paul at linuxaudiosystems.com Mon Sep 2 13:16:45 2013 From: paul at linuxaudiosystems.com (Paul Davis) Date: Mon, 2 Sep 2013 09:16:45 -0400 Subject: [LAU] WX5 MIDI mapping In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: use aseqdump to create a trace of the incoming MIDI stream. post it here. On Sun, Sep 1, 2013 at 10:57 PM, Milan Lazecky wrote: > Hi, > I am sorry for a beginner question, but your advice would be helpful.. > I have an electronic saxophone, Yamaha WX5. > I use with MIDI->USB, using Qsynth (through jack), the sound is working > well, but every time I try to record midi footage, using either rosegarden > or ardour3, the midi record is: > - in strange tones (the melody is there, but notes are transposed for +32 > or -32) (note that using Qsynth, or connecting with virtual keyboard, the > notes are ok...) > - when I try to transpose the recorded melody to normal scale, it doesn't > play anything (yes, I map some midi instrument there, but it seems like if > there is some strange volume=0 was set, or I don't know - but I haven't > found a way to set it to other values) > > I know it is very messy question. But maybe you know what is wrong in my > case.. maybe to try another software, or I miss some settings there? > > Thank you very much. > > Milan > > _______________________________________________ > Linux-audio-user mailing list > Linux-audio-user at lists.linuxaudio.org > http://lists.linuxaudio.org/listinfo/linux-audio-user > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From espiritocz at gmail.com Mon Sep 2 15:26:39 2013 From: espiritocz at gmail.com (Milan Lazecky) Date: Mon, 2 Sep 2013 23:26:39 +0800 Subject: [LAU] WX5 MIDI mapping In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Dear Tim, dear Paul, thank you. I just tried Muse - mapped some soundfont there and recorded some melody and.... I got my first notation :) Thank you. Anyway, aseqdump is running and showing "Pitch bend", "Control change", another "Control change" - all the time.. so maybe Rosegarden got a bit crazy because of these - or I have done something wrong that time .. Anyway, now I got into it. Thanks to you guys, cheers! Milan 2013/9/2 Paul Davis > use aseqdump to create a trace of the incoming MIDI stream. post it here. > > > On Sun, Sep 1, 2013 at 10:57 PM, Milan Lazecky wrote: > >> Hi, >> I am sorry for a beginner question, but your advice would be helpful.. >> I have an electronic saxophone, Yamaha WX5. >> I use with MIDI->USB, using Qsynth (through jack), the sound is working >> well, but every time I try to record midi footage, using either rosegarden >> or ardour3, the midi record is: >> - in strange tones (the melody is there, but notes are transposed for +32 >> or -32) (note that using Qsynth, or connecting with virtual keyboard, the >> notes are ok...) >> - when I try to transpose the recorded melody to normal scale, it doesn't >> play anything (yes, I map some midi instrument there, but it seems like if >> there is some strange volume=0 was set, or I don't know - but I haven't >> found a way to set it to other values) >> >> I know it is very messy question. But maybe you know what is wrong in my >> case.. maybe to try another software, or I miss some settings there? >> >> Thank you very much. >> >> Milan >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Linux-audio-user mailing list >> Linux-audio-user at lists.linuxaudio.org >> http://lists.linuxaudio.org/listinfo/linux-audio-user >> >> > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From nickycopeland at hotmail.com Mon Sep 2 16:10:25 2013 From: nickycopeland at hotmail.com (Nick Copeland) Date: Mon, 2 Sep 2013 18:10:25 +0200 Subject: [LAU] WX5 MIDI mapping In-Reply-To: References: , , Message-ID: > thank you. I just tried Muse - mapped some soundfont there and recorded some melody and.... > I got my first notation :) > Thank you. > Anyway, aseqdump is running and showing "Pitch bend", "Control change", another "Control > change" - all the time.. so maybe Rosegarden got a bit crazy because of these - or I have > done something wrong that time .. Anyway, now I got into it. Thanks to you guys, cheers! Are you sure you were playing the Sax correctly? If you breath too hard into a Sax it will also jump octaves and yours might have been a bit sensitive in how it wanted to render that to MIDI. All that Control Change stuff is streaming 'emphasis', most MIDI controllers dothis including guitar controllers for pitch bend and polypressure keyboards forpressure events. If the MIDI Sax only mapped the fingering events then you might as well be playing a Hohner Melodica MIDI (I am going to get flamed for this comparison so let me I apologise in advance, the melodica is pretty cool, bless the ChiLites and New Order but it isn't a MIDI Sax....). The reed in your sax probably registers air pressure and sends those as control events to let your music be more expressive and there can be _lots_ of those events. If you record in some app and then drive a synth that maps those control events to pitch bend but don't do it too subtly then you might find the results to be unexpected. It shouldn't have affected how the music was scored since the note selection will have been done with literal NOTE_ON/OFF events from fingering but it might well affect how it was played back since you finger a note, mouth it, then the pressure events make the frequency go wild by jumping octaves the way a Sax does anyway if you breath too hard. If you get issues again then check out the synth you are driving and try and find out what it does with the controller ID in the message. Go a bit further and you will be able to do things like map the controller ID to the synth filter or cutoff and have a bit of fun with how you mouth your notes. Which is pretty comparable to what the ChiLites did with the Melodica - they sang into its mouthpiece and the result was something akin to a mechanical vocorder (and hopefully that little bit of respect will save me from being called a melodicist). Regards, nick. 2013/9/2 Paul Davis use aseqdump to create a trace of the incoming MIDI stream. post it here. On Sun, Sep 1, 2013 at 10:57 PM, Milan Lazecky wrote: Hi, I am sorry for a beginner question, but your advice would be helpful.. I have an electronic saxophone, Yamaha WX5. I use with MIDI->USB, using Qsynth (through jack), the sound is working well, but every time I try to record midi footage, using either rosegarden or ardour3, the midi record is: - in strange tones (the melody is there, but notes are transposed for +32 or -32) (note that using Qsynth, or connecting with virtual keyboard, the notes are ok...) - when I try to transpose the recorded melody to normal scale, it doesn't play anything (yes, I map some midi instrument there, but it seems like if there is some strange volume=0 was set, or I don't know - but I haven't found a way to set it to other values) I know it is very messy question. But maybe you know what is wrong in my case.. maybe to try another software, or I miss some settings there? Thank you very much. Milan _______________________________________________ Linux-audio-user mailing list Linux-audio-user at lists.linuxaudio.org http://lists.linuxaudio.org/listinfo/linux-audio-user _______________________________________________ Linux-audio-user mailing list Linux-audio-user at lists.linuxaudio.org http://lists.linuxaudio.org/listinfo/linux-audio-user -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From dlphillips at woh.rr.com Tue Sep 3 10:43:24 2013 From: dlphillips at woh.rr.com (Dave Phillips) Date: Tue, 03 Sep 2013 06:43:24 -0400 Subject: [LAU] an AVS waveguide demo Message-ID: <5225BD4C.8010708@woh.rr.com> Greetings, A brief demonstration of Jean-Pierre Lemoine's implementation of the Csound waveguide filter in AVSynthesis : https://soundcloud.com/davephillips69/an-avsynthesis-csound For those not on the cloud : http://linux-sound.org/audio/avs-waveguide-demo.mp3 http://linux-sound.org/audio/avs-waveguide-demo.ogg Best, dp From julien at mail.upb.de Tue Sep 3 11:01:34 2013 From: julien at mail.upb.de (Julien Claassen) Date: Tue, 3 Sep 2013 13:01:34 +0200 (CEST) Subject: [LAU] an AVS waveguide demo In-Reply-To: <5225BD4C.8010708@woh.rr.com> References: <5225BD4C.8010708@woh.rr.com> Message-ID: Hello Dave! I like it. Atmospheric. It appears simple enough, but it touches a nerve somewhere. First a feeling of being with one's self, starting of almost fearful or menacing. then the opening to the outside world, the cosmos mayhap, and the impression of width, of room and an uncertainly lightness. Weightlessness, which can be everything. Always changing subtlely. Nice little demo! I enjoyed that. Warm regards Julien ---------------------------------------- http://juliencoder.de/nama/music.html From dlphillips at woh.rr.com Tue Sep 3 11:28:02 2013 From: dlphillips at woh.rr.com (Dave Phillips) Date: Tue, 03 Sep 2013 07:28:02 -0400 Subject: [LAU] an AVS waveguide demo In-Reply-To: References: <5225BD4C.8010708@woh.rr.com> Message-ID: <5225C7C2.70209@woh.rr.com> On 09/03/2013 07:01 AM, Julien Claassen wrote: > Hello Dave! > I like it. Atmospheric. It appears simple enough, but it touches a > nerve somewhere. First a feeling of being with one's self, starting of > almost fearful or menacing. then the opening to the outside world, the > cosmos mayhap, and the impression of width, of room and an uncertainly > lightness. Weightlessness, which can be everything. Always changing > subtlely. Nice little demo! I enjoyed that. Thanks, Julien, as always I appreciate your ears and commentary. FYI, the demo is the first movement of a "sinfonia" I'm writing. So far I'm not impressed with anything I've composed for it, but I do like what the waveguide does to that one movement. It's likely to engender an entirely different piece. You know how that goes. :) > Warm regards > Julien Best always to you too, dp From ralf.mardorf at alice-dsl.net Tue Sep 3 15:52:30 2013 From: ralf.mardorf at alice-dsl.net (Ralf Mardorf) Date: Tue, 03 Sep 2013 17:52:30 +0200 Subject: [LAU] Do have all versions off Matrix-1000, 6, 6R have the same MIDI implementation? Message-ID: <1378223550.1220.15.camel@archlinux> Hi :) since Wiki mentions that the "Matrix-6R and Matrix-1000 are both rackmount versions of the Matrix-6" and I'm writing a command line tool for editing the Matrix-1000, I wonder if sysex remote parameter edit parameters and values are equal for all three synths? At least the device ID for all three synths is the same, 06 hex. If there should be minor differences for parameters and/or values I could add a Matrix-6 and Matrix-R6 mode. I also wonder if regarding to the MIDI implementation different versions of the Matrix-1000 were released. AFAIK there are no different versions off the Matrix-1000 regarding to the MIDI implementation and sysex remote parameter edit parameters and values are equal for Matrix-1000, Matrix-6 and Matrix-6R. Is anybody aware about differences? Regards, Ralf From dlphillips at woh.rr.com Tue Sep 3 17:51:06 2013 From: dlphillips at woh.rr.com (Dave Phillips) Date: Tue, 03 Sep 2013 13:51:06 -0400 Subject: [LAU] an AVS waveguide demo In-Reply-To: References: <5225BD4C.8010708@woh.rr.com> <5225C7C2.70209@woh.rr.com> Message-ID: <5226218A.9010209@woh.rr.com> On 09/03/2013 12:13 PM, Rusty Perez wrote: > Very interesting, I was most intrigued by the second half or so the > sound seemed to sortof shif, and sortof surround me. > What was I listening to? > What is this waveguide business? :-) > > Thanks! > Rusty Hi Rusty, Right, the second half is a filtered version of the first half. You can learn something about waveguides here : http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Digital_waveguide_synthesis I confess that the maths are beyond me, my evaluation of the filter is empirical, i.e. I use my ears. Best, dp > > > On 9/3/13, Dave Phillips wrote: >> On 09/03/2013 07:01 AM, Julien Claassen wrote: >>> Hello Dave! >>> I like it. Atmospheric. It appears simple enough, but it touches a >>> nerve somewhere. First a feeling of being with one's self, starting of >>> almost fearful or menacing. then the opening to the outside world, the >>> cosmos mayhap, and the impression of width, of room and an uncertainly >>> lightness. Weightlessness, which can be everything. Always changing >>> subtlely. Nice little demo! I enjoyed that. >> Thanks, Julien, as always I appreciate your ears and commentary. FYI, >> the demo is the first movement of a "sinfonia" I'm writing. So far I'm >> not impressed with anything I've composed for it, but I do like what the >> waveguide does to that one movement. It's likely to engender an entirely >> different piece. You know how that goes. :) >> >>> Warm regards >>> Julien >> Best always to you too, >> >> dp >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Linux-audio-user mailing list >> Linux-audio-user at lists.linuxaudio.org >> http://lists.linuxaudio.org/listinfo/linux-audio-user >> From dlphillips at woh.rr.com Tue Sep 3 17:54:31 2013 From: dlphillips at woh.rr.com (Dave Phillips) Date: Tue, 03 Sep 2013 13:54:31 -0400 Subject: [LAU] an AVS waveguide demo In-Reply-To: <5225BD4C.8010708@woh.rr.com> References: <5225BD4C.8010708@woh.rr.com> Message-ID: <52262257.70907@woh.rr.com> On 09/03/2013 06:43 AM, Dave Phillips wrote: > Greetings, > > A brief demonstration ... Sorry, I should have described it for those who will skip SoundCloud. The first half is an untreated series of chords played by some wind instruments in the 8mbgmsfx.sf2 soundfont, the second half is the same series with the waveguide filter applied. Best, dp From fero.kiraly at gmail.com Wed Sep 4 15:37:05 2013 From: fero.kiraly at gmail.com (Fero Kiraly) Date: Wed, 4 Sep 2013 17:37:05 +0200 Subject: [LAU] Custom UI development in Pure Data Message-ID: what about SwingOSC ? it looks nice. fero -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From ralf.mardorf at alice-dsl.net Wed Sep 4 20:31:15 2013 From: ralf.mardorf at alice-dsl.net (Ralf Mardorf) Date: Wed, 04 Sep 2013 22:31:15 +0200 Subject: [LAU] 3.10-rt kernels unusable In-Reply-To: <1377716460.29168.3.camel@archlinux> References: <1377507650.914.3.camel@archlinux> <521D9128.2060809@localhost> <521E1F06.2030304@localhost> <1377716460.29168.3.camel@archlinux> Message-ID: <1378326675.717.13.camel@archlinux> Update 3.10.10-rt7 x86_64 :( While login hangs, doesn't work, lightdm is usable, but a shutdown doesn't finish, IOW still unusable like older versions of 3.10-rt kernels. Still no issues with 3.8.13-rt14 and no issues with non-rt 3.10.10. If the next patch shouldn't work, I'll investigate a little bit, can't do it now. From brent at keycorner.org Thu Sep 5 18:07:47 2013 From: brent at keycorner.org (Brent Busby) Date: Thu, 5 Sep 2013 13:07:47 -0500 (CDT) Subject: [LAU] mastering dilemma Message-ID: I'm going about the process of trying to learn what goes into commercial mastering (yeah, I know...), and one of the conundrums I've run into is that while most commercially produced music has a particular sort of common EQ curve to it, I have to really force myself to try to want that curve when I'm mixing. Really, it just sounds cold. Almost anything sounds better (at least on good speakers) with less cutting around 120-180Hz than most CD's seem to have. And it really must be the result of EQ cuts too -- apart from my digital Yamaha SY99 (which sounds pretty cold), I don't think I have any instruments in my whole studio that could produce sound so anemic in the low mids as what I hear on CD's without *lots* of cuts. When it comes down to it, there's almost no instrument that really sounds like that. So, my dilemma is twofold... 1) To use spectrum analyzers and careful listening to try to understand the "tone" that the commercial mastering world has apparently agreed on, and 2) To figure out why I would want that. On most decent speakers, it seems to sound thin and lack authority. It's terrible having to cater to the lowest common denominator. Anyone else have this problem? Ever wish you could turn up those low mids just a little bit more and get some power underneath? -- + Brent A. Busby + "We've all heard that a million monkeys + Sr. UNIX Systems Admin + banging on a million typewriters will + University of Chicago + eventually reproduce the entire works of + James Franck Institute + Shakespeare. Now, thanks to the Internet, + Materials Research Ctr + we know this is not true." -Robert Wilensky From nettings at stackingdwarves.net Thu Sep 5 18:15:43 2013 From: nettings at stackingdwarves.net (=?UTF-8?B?SsO2cm4gTmV0dGluZ3NtZWllcg==?=) Date: Thu, 05 Sep 2013 20:15:43 +0200 Subject: [LAU] pro gear that runs embedded linux... Message-ID: <5228CA4F.9040907@stackingdwarves.net> hi guys! i'm sure you all have seen your share of professional audio, video, and lighting gear that apparently runs embedded linux but never mentions it much (unless you happen upon the briefly flashing penguins immediately after booting)... i just came across the midas pro2 (which i have to learn for an upcoming job), and lo and behold, in the manual, midas saith: "The PRO2 uses the reliable Linux operating system." not exactly in the brochure afaict, but in the very prominent first section of the manual. :) other expensive boxes i've seen and used which appear to be running linux: * Allen & Heath iLive and GLD series audio mixers * LAWO mc? series of audio mixers * grandMA2 series of lighting controllers * the DirectOut M.1k2 16x16 MADI router none of these make a secret out of their OS, but it doesn't seem to be an advertising item, either. is it because people are generally disinterested in and/or frightened by the fact that their gear has to have some sort of operating system inside? i wonder if we'll live to see the day where "linux inside" is a hot marketing punchline. i wonder if you guys have seen other pro gear whose data gets shuffled around by industrious yet unseen penguins under the hood? -- J?rn Nettingsmeier Lortzingstr. 11, 45128 Essen, Tel. +49 177 7937487 Meister f?r Veranstaltungstechnik (B?hne/Studio) Tonmeister VDT http://stackingdwarves.net From nickycopeland at hotmail.com Thu Sep 5 18:49:48 2013 From: nickycopeland at hotmail.com (Nick Copeland) Date: Thu, 5 Sep 2013 20:49:48 +0200 Subject: [LAU] pro gear that runs embedded linux... In-Reply-To: <5228CA4F.9040907@stackingdwarves.net> References: <5228CA4F.9040907@stackingdwarves.net> Message-ID: The world of commercial/enterprise networking and security products is rife with applications running under Linux on badged appliances. There are thousands of them and some very successfulcompanies have basically just sold FOSS software on rack-mount Linux boxes under their ownname - Barracuda and Fortinet both started out this way but even the likes of CheckPoint, Ciscoand many others are also doing exactly the same, albeit some with their own enhancements. Will 'Linux Inside' ever become a respected badge? No. It is worth noting that about 10 years ago there was a big shift when people started to recognisethat Linux/FOSS software was actually a lot more trustworthy than closed source - it was aroundthe time that BIND, Apache, Tomcat, Postgress and all the other apps started running the internet,they were without much contest far better than the closed source equivalents. That period is close to over since these apps are now being delivered in commercial products, theconcept of 'powered by linux' is no longer really of relevance. It is just there, we use it and why should we really care? The bigger move at the moment is the slow, death by a thousand cuts that is happening to MS.Smartphone, tablets, fridges, microwave, phablets are now all running some version of Unix, bethat thanks to google, apple or embedded systems. MS can fight to keep the desktop - they don't have much action that suggest they really willplay in other spaces but that is not going to be a benefit for Linux as such: The concept that youare using linux is now irrelevant. We here might be using it and be proud of it on LAU and LAD butthe far vaster majority of happy users have it on their android phones (and Apple i* (tm) gear, this is after all just Unix) and don't really give a monkeys uncle what it is, as long as it does what theywant. MS has not got their head around that yet but finally, and correctly, the OS is no longerof much significance in most market segments Penguin under the hood? Who cares? What the product does might be enabled by the OS and Unixhas become that OS but it is totally irrelevant with respect to the capabilities of the product itself - the OS is the petrol, diesel or LPG that you put in your car, the car is what you are reallyinterested in. As I said, this might not be the case on LAU/LAD so this might be a little OT. Regards, nick. "at the end of the day its nil nil at half time?. Trevor Brooking > Date: Thu, 5 Sep 2013 20:15:43 +0200 > From: nettings at stackingdwarves.net > To: linux-audio-user at lists.linuxaudio.org > Subject: [LAU] pro gear that runs embedded linux... > > hi guys! > > > i'm sure you all have seen your share of professional audio, video, and > lighting gear that apparently runs embedded linux but never mentions it > much (unless you happen upon the briefly flashing penguins immediately > after booting)... > > i just came across the midas pro2 (which i have to learn for an upcoming > job), and lo and behold, in the manual, midas saith: > "The PRO2 uses the reliable Linux operating system." > > not exactly in the brochure afaict, but in the very prominent first > section of the manual. :) > > other expensive boxes i've seen and used which appear to be running linux: > > * Allen & Heath iLive and GLD series audio mixers > * LAWO mc? series of audio mixers > * grandMA2 series of lighting controllers > * the DirectOut M.1k2 16x16 MADI router > > none of these make a secret out of their OS, but it doesn't seem to be > an advertising item, either. is it because people are generally > disinterested in and/or frightened by the fact that their gear has to > have some sort of operating system inside? i wonder if we'll live to see > the day where "linux inside" is a hot marketing punchline. > > i wonder if you guys have seen other pro gear whose data gets shuffled > around by industrious yet unseen penguins under the hood? > > > -- > J?rn Nettingsmeier > Lortzingstr. 11, 45128 Essen, Tel. +49 177 7937487 > > Meister f?r Veranstaltungstechnik (B?hne/Studio) > Tonmeister VDT > > http://stackingdwarves.net > > _______________________________________________ > Linux-audio-user mailing list > Linux-audio-user at lists.linuxaudio.org > http://lists.linuxaudio.org/listinfo/linux-audio-user -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From julien at mail.upb.de Thu Sep 5 18:49:48 2013 From: julien at mail.upb.de (Julien Claassen) Date: Thu, 5 Sep 2013 20:49:48 +0200 (CEST) Subject: [LAU] pro gear that runs embedded linux... In-Reply-To: <5228CA4F.9040907@stackingdwarves.net> References: <5228CA4F.9040907@stackingdwarves.net> Message-ID: Hello Joern! I seem to remember, that the Yamaha Motif synthesizer series is powered by Linux. This was discussed some timeago, when the first family member came out. some people were trying for an accessibility hack. Yamaha didn't really promote the fact, if I remember correctly. The other synth I can remember was the Korg Oasis. Its flagship of a couple years ago. I think there was a little more mention of the fact. I'm not sure, if Korg still use Linux in their latest Kronos series. It seems to have similar features plus a lot of updates, but who knows. I think mainly people aren't interested on what their gear is running. If they don't see it, they don't want/need to know about it. Especially since most platforms (synths, mixers, etc.) don't appear to allow the installation of extra apps. :-) that might make a difference. :-) Warm regards Julien ---------------------------------------- http://juliencoder.de/nama/music.html From gnome at hawaii.rr.com Thu Sep 5 18:58:52 2013 From: gnome at hawaii.rr.com (david) Date: Thu, 05 Sep 2013 08:58:52 -1000 Subject: [LAU] pro gear that runs embedded linux... In-Reply-To: <5228CA4F.9040907@stackingdwarves.net> References: <5228CA4F.9040907@stackingdwarves.net> Message-ID: <5228D46C.8070504@hawaii.rr.com> On 09/05/2013 08:15 AM, J?rn Nettingsmeier wrote: > hi guys! > > > i'm sure you all have seen your share of professional audio, video, and > lighting gear that apparently runs embedded linux but never mentions it > much (unless you happen upon the briefly flashing penguins immediately > after booting)... > > i just came across the midas pro2 (which i have to learn for an upcoming > job), and lo and behold, in the manual, midas saith: > "The PRO2 uses the reliable Linux operating system." > > not exactly in the brochure afaict, but in the very prominent first > section of the manual. :) > > other expensive boxes i've seen and used which appear to be running linux: > > * Allen & Heath iLive and GLD series audio mixers > * LAWO mc? series of audio mixers > * grandMA2 series of lighting controllers > * the DirectOut M.1k2 16x16 MADI router > > none of these make a secret out of their OS, but it doesn't seem to be > an advertising item, either. is it because people are generally > disinterested in and/or frightened by the fact that their gear has to > have some sort of operating system inside? i wonder if we'll live to see > the day where "linux inside" is a hot marketing punchline. I think most musicians don't think of operating systems. Wouldn't be surprised if they think the audio app they use most is the OS. ;-) -- David gnome at hawaii.rr.com authenticity, honesty, community http://dancingtreefrog.com http://clanjones.org/david/ http://dancing-treefrog.deviantart.com/ From ralf.mardorf at alice-dsl.net Thu Sep 5 19:02:12 2013 From: ralf.mardorf at alice-dsl.net (Ralf Mardorf) Date: Thu, 05 Sep 2013 21:02:12 +0200 Subject: [LAU] mastering dilemma In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <1378407732.787.17.camel@archlinux> Hi Brent, On Thu, 2013-09-05 at 13:07 -0500, Brent Busby wrote: > with less cutting around 120-180Hz than most CD's seem to have That does sound like a HiFi bass tone control pot usually at around 100 Hz is cutting the bass ;), but I don't know what CDs and CD player you own. > I don't think I have any instruments in my whole studio that > could produce sound so anemic in the low mids as what I hear on CD's > without *lots* of cut I guess you are speaking about "music" made with virtual synth. Sure, absolutely no virtual synth can compare to vintage synth that use CEM (Curtis) chips. > 2) To figure out why I would want that. On most decent speakers, it > seems to sound thin and lack authority. It's terrible having to cater > to the lowest common denominator. And why do you want/need to do that? > Anyone else have this problem? Ever wish you could turn up those low > mids just a little bit more and get some power underneath? Just for my record player, since I wasn't able to pay for a new stylus in the last years and I'm still using crappy Audio-Technica replacement. However, you can't boost what's not there. I read that even a lot of the old music was remastered, fortunately I own lot of LPs that even don't have a bar code. Many of the young rock musicians (half as old as I am) today record on analog tapes, playing original Mellotrons etc., so I suspect you're listening to other music than I do. Regards, Ralf From fons at linuxaudio.org Thu Sep 5 19:04:50 2013 From: fons at linuxaudio.org (Fons Adriaensen) Date: Thu, 5 Sep 2013 19:04:50 +0000 Subject: [LAU] pro gear that runs embedded linux... In-Reply-To: <5228CA4F.9040907@stackingdwarves.net> References: <5228CA4F.9040907@stackingdwarves.net> Message-ID: <20130905190450.GA6581@linuxaudio.org> On Thu, Sep 05, 2013 at 08:15:43PM +0200, J?rn Nettingsmeier wrote: > i wonder if you guys have seen other pro gear whose data gets > shuffled around by industrious yet unseen penguins under the hood? Meyer Sound's D-Mitri processors, to name a big one... Ciao, -- FA A world of exhaustive, reliable metadata would be an utopia. It's also a pipe-dream, founded on self-delusion, nerd hubris and hysterically inflated market opportunities. (Cory Doctorow) From gianfranco at portalmod.com.br Thu Sep 5 19:06:02 2013 From: gianfranco at portalmod.com.br (Gianfranco Ceccolini) Date: Thu, 5 Sep 2013 16:06:02 -0300 Subject: [LAU] pro gear that runs embedded linux... In-Reply-To: <20130905190450.GA6581@linuxaudio.org> References: <5228CA4F.9040907@stackingdwarves.net> <20130905190450.GA6581@linuxaudio.org> Message-ID: The MOD processors are proudly Linux powered :-) www.portalmod.com 2013/9/5 Fons Adriaensen > On Thu, Sep 05, 2013 at 08:15:43PM +0200, J?rn Nettingsmeier wrote: > > > i wonder if you guys have seen other pro gear whose data gets > > shuffled around by industrious yet unseen penguins under the hood? > > Meyer Sound's D-Mitri processors, to name a big one... > > Ciao, > > -- > FA > > A world of exhaustive, reliable metadata would be an utopia. > It's also a pipe-dream, founded on self-delusion, nerd hubris > and hysterically inflated market opportunities. (Cory Doctorow) > > _______________________________________________ > Linux-audio-user mailing list > Linux-audio-user at lists.linuxaudio.org > http://lists.linuxaudio.org/listinfo/linux-audio-user > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From ralf.mardorf at alice-dsl.net Thu Sep 5 19:16:37 2013 From: ralf.mardorf at alice-dsl.net (Ralf Mardorf) Date: Thu, 05 Sep 2013 21:16:37 +0200 Subject: [LAU] pro gear that runs embedded linux... In-Reply-To: <5228CA4F.9040907@stackingdwarves.net> References: <5228CA4F.9040907@stackingdwarves.net> Message-ID: <1378408597.787.28.camel@archlinux> Some of the very expensive amateur automated mixer and hard disc recorder workstations from Yamaha, that expensive that I only know professionals who bought them in the 90s or was it around 2000?, so I at least will call it semi-pro, at startup showed Tux. Those workstations seem to be commercial flops. However, most consumer satellite television receivers have Linux inside, Android is Linux, but nobody would win customers, if they would advertise their gear with Linux inside. Too many people experience frustrating issues, when they tried to use Linux. Linux is available for free as in beer. A customer in addition might think that "if it's free, it can't be any good" and why is the gear that expensive, when they use free stuff inside? From jostein at vait.se Thu Sep 5 19:24:43 2013 From: jostein at vait.se (Jostein Chr. Andersen) Date: Thu, 05 Sep 2013 21:24:43 +0200 Subject: [LAU] pro gear that runs embedded linux... In-Reply-To: <5228CA4F.9040907@stackingdwarves.net> References: <5228CA4F.9040907@stackingdwarves.net> Message-ID: <5228DA7B.6020506@vait.se> On 09/05/2013 08:15 PM, J?rn Nettingsmeier wrote: ... > i wonder if you guys have seen other pro gear whose data gets shuffled > around by industrious yet unseen penguins under the hood? Harrison Consoles. A lot of their HW are Linux powered. Their use of Linux is not very unseen but i mention them anyway. Jostein From gnome at hawaii.rr.com Thu Sep 5 19:25:14 2013 From: gnome at hawaii.rr.com (david) Date: Thu, 05 Sep 2013 09:25:14 -1000 Subject: [LAU] pro gear that runs embedded linux... In-Reply-To: <1378408597.787.28.camel@archlinux> References: <5228CA4F.9040907@stackingdwarves.net> <1378408597.787.28.camel@archlinux> Message-ID: <5228DA9A.9060106@hawaii.rr.com> On 09/05/2013 09:16 AM, Ralf Mardorf wrote: > Some of the very expensive amateur automated mixer and hard disc > recorder workstations from Yamaha, that expensive that I only know > professionals who bought them in the 90s or was it around 2000?, so I at > least will call it semi-pro, at startup showed Tux. Those workstations > seem to be commercial flops. > > However, most consumer satellite television receivers have Linux inside, > Android is Linux, but nobody would win customers, if they would > advertise their gear with Linux inside. Too many people experience > frustrating issues, when they tried to use Linux. Linux is available for > free as in beer. A customer in addition might think that "if it's free, > it can't be any good" and why is the gear that expensive, when they use > free stuff inside? More likely to me: "If it's free, why do I have to pay you for it?" -- David gnome at hawaii.rr.com authenticity, honesty, community http://dancingtreefrog.com http://clanjones.org/david/ http://dancing-treefrog.deviantart.com/ From nickycopeland at hotmail.com Thu Sep 5 19:25:29 2013 From: nickycopeland at hotmail.com (Nick Copeland) Date: Thu, 5 Sep 2013 21:25:29 +0200 Subject: [LAU] pro gear that runs embedded linux... In-Reply-To: <1378408597.787.28.camel@archlinux> References: <5228CA4F.9040907@stackingdwarves.net>, <1378408597.787.28.camel@archlinux> Message-ID: > A customer in addition might think that "if it's free, > it can't be any good" and why is the gear that expensive, when they use > free stuff inside? I think most internet savvy users have gotten over that issue. They all know that the funniest thing they will see this year, or next, will be in a free sketchon youtube. You can pay for on-demand TV but it will not stack up to what isout there for free. No price tag. No demand for remuneration. No copyright. That is what people are looking for these days, innovation and entertainment no longer means youhave to pay for it. Linux is only a small part of that expectation. Nick. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From fons at linuxaudio.org Thu Sep 5 19:29:41 2013 From: fons at linuxaudio.org (Fons Adriaensen) Date: Thu, 5 Sep 2013 19:29:41 +0000 Subject: [LAU] mastering dilemma In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20130905192940.GB6581@linuxaudio.org> On Thu, Sep 05, 2013 at 01:07:47PM -0500, Brent Busby wrote: > 1) To use spectrum analyzers and careful listening to try to > understand the "tone" that the commercial mastering world has > apparently agreed on, and > > 2) To figure out why I would want that. On most decent speakers, > it seems to sound thin and lack authority. It's terrible having to > cater to the lowest common denominator. If someone's paying you to do some mixing/mastering job, and that's all there is to it, just do as the customer wants and get your money. OTOH, if you do have some artistic responsability, I see no reason why you should follow the mainstream (*) or want to do that. I agree that almost all pop music today sounds anemic. Male singers sound as if their b***s are in a vise, a combination of EQ that almost removes the fundamental and auto'talent'. Females sound as if ********* CENSORED **********. And it's not limited to pop. At least half of the classical releases today are being peppered up in ways that has nothing at all to do with a natural live sound. Ciao, (*) "Do you know what's on the bottom of the mainstream ?" "Mediocrity !" (From 'Death in Venice', T. Mann / L. Visconti) -- FA A world of exhaustive, reliable metadata would be an utopia. It's also a pipe-dream, founded on self-delusion, nerd hubris and hysterically inflated market opportunities. (Cory Doctorow) From czhenry at gmail.com Thu Sep 5 19:32:40 2013 From: czhenry at gmail.com (Charles Z Henry) Date: Thu, 5 Sep 2013 14:32:40 -0500 Subject: [LAU] pro gear that runs embedded linux... In-Reply-To: <1378408597.787.28.camel@archlinux> References: <5228CA4F.9040907@stackingdwarves.net> <1378408597.787.28.camel@archlinux> Message-ID: On Thu, Sep 5, 2013 at 2:16 PM, Ralf Mardorf wrote: > However, most consumer satellite television receivers have Linux inside, > Android is Linux, but nobody would win customers, if they would > advertise their gear with Linux inside. Too many people experience > frustrating issues, when they tried to use Linux. > *Raises hand* Yes, I've had some frustrating issues. Linux *is* frustrating to setup, but then tends to be very reliable and hassle-free once you've gone through the work to get there. Having an engineer setup and program my embedded electronics means that someone else has already had the headaches. Then, I get to enjoy the fun parts. Whether or not you get that across to your customers is just a marketing issue. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From czhenry at gmail.com Thu Sep 5 19:36:41 2013 From: czhenry at gmail.com (Charles Z Henry) Date: Thu, 5 Sep 2013 14:36:41 -0500 Subject: [LAU] pro gear that runs embedded linux... In-Reply-To: <20130905190450.GA6581@linuxaudio.org> References: <5228CA4F.9040907@stackingdwarves.net> <20130905190450.GA6581@linuxaudio.org> Message-ID: On Thu, Sep 5, 2013 at 2:04 PM, Fons Adriaensen wrote: > On Thu, Sep 05, 2013 at 08:15:43PM +0200, J?rn Nettingsmeier wrote: > > > i wonder if you guys have seen other pro gear whose data gets > > shuffled around by industrious yet unseen penguins under the hood? > > Meyer Sound's D-Mitri processors, to name a big one... > > Ciao, > > -- > FA Just checked out the D-Mitri line. I'm amazed, jealous. That's exactly the kind of scalable gear that I'd dream of building. Do they really have AVB on those? Chuck -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From clemens at ladisch.de Thu Sep 5 19:38:56 2013 From: clemens at ladisch.de (Clemens Ladisch) Date: Thu, 05 Sep 2013 21:38:56 +0200 Subject: [LAU] pro gear that runs embedded linux... In-Reply-To: <5228CA4F.9040907@stackingdwarves.net> References: <5228CA4F.9040907@stackingdwarves.net> Message-ID: <5228DDD0.2090308@ladisch.de> J?rn Nettingsmeier wrote: > i wonder if you guys have seen other pro gear whose data gets shuffled > around by industrious yet unseen penguins under the hood? http://www.google.com/search?q=gpl+site:yamaha.com http://www.google.com/search?q="source+code+distribution"+site:roland.com etc. Regards, Clemens From jeremy at autostatic.com Thu Sep 5 19:43:50 2013 From: jeremy at autostatic.com (Jeremy Jongepier) Date: Thu, 05 Sep 2013 21:43:50 +0200 Subject: [LAU] pro gear that runs embedded linux... In-Reply-To: <5228CA4F.9040907@stackingdwarves.net> References: <5228CA4F.9040907@stackingdwarves.net> Message-ID: <5228DEF6.3090003@autostatic.com> On 09/05/2013 08:15 PM, J?rn Nettingsmeier wrote: > hi guys! > > > i'm sure you all have seen your share of professional audio, video, and > lighting gear that apparently runs embedded linux but never mentions it > much (unless you happen upon the briefly flashing penguins immediately > after booting)... > > i just came across the midas pro2 (which i have to learn for an upcoming > job), and lo and behold, in the manual, midas saith: > "The PRO2 uses the reliable Linux operating system." > > not exactly in the brochure afaict, but in the very prominent first > section of the manual. :) > > other expensive boxes i've seen and used which appear to be running linux: > > * Allen & Heath iLive and GLD series audio mixers > * LAWO mc? series of audio mixers > * grandMA2 series of lighting controllers > * the DirectOut M.1k2 16x16 MADI router > > none of these make a secret out of their OS, but it doesn't seem to be > an advertising item, either. is it because people are generally > disinterested in and/or frightened by the fact that their gear has to > have some sort of operating system inside? i wonder if we'll live to see > the day where "linux inside" is a hot marketing punchline. > > i wonder if you guys have seen other pro gear whose data gets shuffled > around by industrious yet unseen penguins under the hood? > > Hi J?rn, Didn't the desk in the SPSC Studio at the IEM in Graz run on Linux? What was the brand already? Fairlight is using Linux: http://au.fairlight.com.au/product/quantum/ Jeremy -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 836 bytes Desc: OpenPGP digital signature URL: From ralf.mardorf at alice-dsl.net Thu Sep 5 20:20:48 2013 From: ralf.mardorf at alice-dsl.net (Ralf Mardorf) Date: Thu, 05 Sep 2013 22:20:48 +0200 Subject: [LAU] pro gear that runs embedded linux... In-Reply-To: References: <5228CA4F.9040907@stackingdwarves.net> <1378408597.787.28.camel@archlinux> Message-ID: <1378412448.787.46.camel@archlinux> On Thu, 2013-09-05 at 14:32 -0500, Charles Z Henry wrote: > Linux *is* frustrating to setup, but then tends to be very reliable > and hassle-free once you've gone through the work to get there. And that is exactly what people think. If it is based on Linux, it's for geeks. Customers, even professional audio and video engineers want to pay for something that already does work. Sure, they are aware that a product does work without the need to do the setup, but they experienced Linux with extra work and so it feels bad. Another emotional thing is the secret recipe. Secret is better than open in the minds of most customers. It's wiser not to advertise what's inside a product, there are just some exceptions, if a company can make hardcore heavy rotation commercials and sell a live style such as Apple and Microsoft, then it sells. "We sell the product with the secret recipe inside." An engineer want's to buy a mixer etc. and not a kernel. Known companies selling professional mixers don't advertise that they have Alps faders inside, this is done by companies who sell amateur mixers. Take a look at the way those companies try to sell their products: http://ams-neve.com/ -> http://ams-neve.com/products http://www.behringer.com/EN/Home.aspx -> http://www.behringer.com/EN/products/index.aspx Both do it target-group-specific. There's no target group for "once you've gone through the work", if you want to sell. From brent at keycorner.org Thu Sep 5 21:09:55 2013 From: brent at keycorner.org (Brent Busby) Date: Thu, 5 Sep 2013 16:09:55 -0500 (CDT) Subject: [LAU] mastering dilemma In-Reply-To: <1378407732.787.17.camel@archlinux> References: <1378407732.787.17.camel@archlinux> Message-ID: On Thu, 5 Sep 2013, Ralf Mardorf wrote: > On Thu, 2013-09-05 at 13:07 -0500, Brent Busby wrote: >> with less cutting around 120-180Hz than most CD's seem to have > > That does sound like a HiFi bass tone control pot usually at around > 100 Hz is cutting the bass ;), but I don't know what CDs and CD player > you own. No, not really. It varies with the album...material made in the 60's and 70's tended to be mixed warmer than stuff made now. Most albums these days are quite cold. > I guess you are speaking about "music" made with virtual synth. Sure, > absolutely no virtual synth can compare to vintage synth that use CEM > (Curtis) chips. No...I was comparing even to acoustic instruments...any instruments at all. With the exception of maybe the aforemention cold Yamaha, almost anything I record would have to have its low mids cut to have an EQ similar to commercial recordings. >> 2) To figure out why I would want that. On most decent speakers, it >> seems to sound thin and lack authority. It's terrible having to cater >> to the lowest common denominator. > > And why do you want/need to do that? Well, that's a good question. I don't know if I do. I suppose I'm just trying to make my recording portable to lots of listening gear, and also to make it not sound horrendously different in tone from what everyone expects. -- + Brent A. Busby + "We've all heard that a million monkeys + Sr. UNIX Systems Admin + banging on a million typewriters will + University of Chicago + eventually reproduce the entire works of + James Franck Institute + Shakespeare. Now, thanks to the Internet, + Materials Research Ctr + we know this is not true." -Robert Wilensky From p8rpp at aol.com Thu Sep 5 22:52:00 2013 From: p8rpp at aol.com (Peter P.) Date: Fri, 6 Sep 2013 00:52:00 +0200 Subject: [LAU] pro gear that runs embedded linux... In-Reply-To: <5228DEF6.3090003@autostatic.com> References: <5228CA4F.9040907@stackingdwarves.net> <5228DEF6.3090003@autostatic.com> Message-ID: <20130905225159.GA16914@aol.de> * Jeremy Jongepier [2013-09-05 21:44]: > On 09/05/2013 08:15 PM, J?rn Nettingsmeier wrote: > > hi guys! > > > > > > i'm sure you all have seen your share of professional audio, video, and > > lighting gear that apparently runs embedded linux but never mentions it > > much (unless you happen upon the briefly flashing penguins immediately > > after booting)... > > > > i just came across the midas pro2 (which i have to learn for an upcoming > > job), and lo and behold, in the manual, midas saith: > > "The PRO2 uses the reliable Linux operating system." > > > > not exactly in the brochure afaict, but in the very prominent first > > section of the manual. :) > > > > other expensive boxes i've seen and used which appear to be running linux: > > > > * Allen & Heath iLive and GLD series audio mixers > > * LAWO mc? series of audio mixers > > * grandMA2 series of lighting controllers > > * the DirectOut M.1k2 16x16 MADI router > > > > none of these make a secret out of their OS, but it doesn't seem to be > > an advertising item, either. is it because people are generally > > disinterested in and/or frightened by the fact that their gear has to > > have some sort of operating system inside? i wonder if we'll live to see > > the day where "linux inside" is a hot marketing punchline. > > > > i wonder if you guys have seen other pro gear whose data gets shuffled > > around by industrious yet unseen penguins under the hood? > > > > > > Hi J?rn, > > Didn't the desk in the SPSC Studio at the IEM in Graz run on Linux? What > was the brand already? This is the LAWO mc^2 series J?rn already mentioned. The SPSC is not part of IEM but an own institute right next to IEM at the University of Technology Graz. IEM belongs to the University of Music and Performing Arts Graz, who have a total of two MC^2, one in the Mumuth concert venue and another one in their classic/jazz recording studio. http://www.lawo.de/en/references/mumuth-graz.html J?rn, I was once using a Midas XL8, which already ran Linux some years ago. best, Peter From espiritocz at gmail.com Fri Sep 6 02:19:30 2013 From: espiritocz at gmail.com (Milan Lazecky) Date: Fri, 6 Sep 2013 10:19:30 +0800 Subject: [LAU] pro gear that runs embedded linux... In-Reply-To: <20130905225159.GA16914@aol.de> References: <5228CA4F.9040907@stackingdwarves.net> <5228DEF6.3090003@autostatic.com> <20130905225159.GA16914@aol.de> Message-ID: Dear Julien, and all, ok, probably kind of a geek question : ) But, as also Yamaha motif used linux - I was thinking to get some of these small "handcomputers" and install some linux inside, so I can use it as MIDI synthesizer, RECORDER, player of background music (when on street) and maybe a looper as well (with pedal). I don't know if such thing exists.. Milan 2013/9/6 Peter P. > * Jeremy Jongepier [2013-09-05 21:44]: > > On 09/05/2013 08:15 PM, J?rn Nettingsmeier wrote: > > > hi guys! > > > > > > > > > i'm sure you all have seen your share of professional audio, video, and > > > lighting gear that apparently runs embedded linux but never mentions it > > > much (unless you happen upon the briefly flashing penguins immediately > > > after booting)... > > > > > > i just came across the midas pro2 (which i have to learn for an > upcoming > > > job), and lo and behold, in the manual, midas saith: > > > "The PRO2 uses the reliable Linux operating system." > > > > > > not exactly in the brochure afaict, but in the very prominent first > > > section of the manual. :) > > > > > > other expensive boxes i've seen and used which appear to be running > linux: > > > > > > * Allen & Heath iLive and GLD series audio mixers > > > * LAWO mc? series of audio mixers > > > * grandMA2 series of lighting controllers > > > * the DirectOut M.1k2 16x16 MADI router > > > > > > none of these make a secret out of their OS, but it doesn't seem to be > > > an advertising item, either. is it because people are generally > > > disinterested in and/or frightened by the fact that their gear has to > > > have some sort of operating system inside? i wonder if we'll live to > see > > > the day where "linux inside" is a hot marketing punchline. > > > > > > i wonder if you guys have seen other pro gear whose data gets shuffled > > > around by industrious yet unseen penguins under the hood? > > > > > > > > > > Hi J?rn, > > > > Didn't the desk in the SPSC Studio at the IEM in Graz run on Linux? What > > was the brand already? > This is the LAWO mc^2 series J?rn already mentioned. > The SPSC is not part of IEM but an own institute right next to IEM at > the University of Technology Graz. > > IEM belongs to the University of Music and Performing Arts Graz, who > have a total of two MC^2, one in the Mumuth concert venue and another > one in their classic/jazz recording studio. > http://www.lawo.de/en/references/mumuth-graz.html > > J?rn, I was once using a Midas XL8, which already ran Linux some > years ago. > > best, Peter > _______________________________________________ > Linux-audio-user mailing list > Linux-audio-user at lists.linuxaudio.org > http://lists.linuxaudio.org/listinfo/linux-audio-user > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From espiritocz at gmail.com Fri Sep 6 02:31:49 2013 From: espiritocz at gmail.com (Milan Lazecky) Date: Fri, 6 Sep 2013 10:31:49 +0800 Subject: [LAU] WX5 MIDI mapping In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Thank you Nick. Aha, so, this is the "melodica" - I like this instrument. This video always makes me goosebumps: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0IqcmhkfJRE - this "melodica" is in the end, filling the music greatly. Now I listen to these ChiLites ("Have you seen her"), I see what you mean, it sounds very interesting. Well, I got wx5 + yamaha vl70-m. I hope I will be able to use it in practice. I first wanted to be just my practicing instrument - I live in .. let's say "quiet place" in Hong Kong, just for a short while. But I made a system to play it also in street, however something is still missing. I was trying playing with looper and usb pedal, but it simply didn't fill me - I am probably not that kind of musician and will always need some friends around to play with. Looking forward to get home soon and show up with some "enhanced sound". Thank you, cheers! Milan 2013/9/3 Nick Copeland > > thank you. I just tried Muse - mapped some soundfont there and recorded > some melody and.... > > I got my first notation :) > > Thank you. > > Anyway, aseqdump is running and showing "Pitch bend", "Control change", > another "Control > > change" - all the time.. so maybe Rosegarden got a bit crazy because of > these - or I have > > done something wrong that time .. Anyway, now I got into it. Thanks to > you guys, cheers! > > Are you sure you were playing the Sax correctly? If you breath too hard > into a Sax it will also > jump octaves and yours might have been a bit sensitive in how it wanted > to render that to MIDI. > > All that Control Change stuff is streaming 'emphasis', most MIDI > controllers do > this including guitar controllers for pitch bend and polypressure > keyboards for > pressure events. If the MIDI Sax only mapped the fingering events then you > might as well be playing a Hohner Melodica MIDI (I am going to get flamed > for this comparison so let me I apologise in advance, the melodica is > pretty cool, > bless the ChiLites and New Order but it isn't a MIDI Sax....). The reed > in your sax > probably registers air pressure and sends those as control events to let > your > music be more expressive and there can be _lots_ of those events. > > If you record in some app and then drive a synth that maps those control > events > to pitch bend but don't do it too subtly then you might find the results > to be > unexpected. It shouldn't have affected how the music was scored since the > note > selection will have been done with literal NOTE_ON/OFF events from > fingering > but it might well affect how it was played back since you finger a note, > mouth > it, then the pressure events make the frequency go wild by jumping octaves > the > way a Sax does anyway if you breath too hard. If you get issues again then > check out the synth you are driving and try and find out what it does with > the > controller ID in the message. Go a bit further and you will be able to do > things like map the controller ID to the synth filter or cutoff and have a > bit > of fun with how you mouth your notes. Which is pretty comparable to what > the > ChiLites did with the Melodica - they sang into its mouthpiece and the > result was > something akin to a mechanical vocorder (and hopefully that little bit of > respect will > save me from being called a melodicist). > > Regards, nick. > > > 2013/9/2 Paul Davis > > use aseqdump to create a trace of the incoming MIDI stream. post it here. > > > On Sun, Sep 1, 2013 at 10:57 PM, Milan Lazecky wrote: > > Hi, > I am sorry for a beginner question, but your advice would be helpful.. > I have an electronic saxophone, Yamaha WX5. > I use with MIDI->USB, using Qsynth (through jack), the sound is working > well, but every time I try to record midi footage, using either rosegarden > or ardour3, the midi record is: > - in strange tones (the melody is there, but notes are transposed for +32 > or -32) (note that using Qsynth, or connecting with virtual keyboard, the > notes are ok...) > - when I try to transpose the recorded melody to normal scale, it doesn't > play anything (yes, I map some midi instrument there, but it seems like if > there is some strange volume=0 was set, or I don't know - but I haven't > found a way to set it to other values) > > I know it is very messy question. But maybe you know what is wrong in my > case.. maybe to try another software, or I miss some settings there? > > Thank you very much. > > Milan > > _______________________________________________ > Linux-audio-user mailing list > Linux-audio-user at lists.linuxaudio.org > http://lists.linuxaudio.org/listinfo/linux-audio-user > > > > > _______________________________________________ Linux-audio-user mailing > list Linux-audio-user at lists.linuxaudio.org > http://lists.linuxaudio.org/listinfo/linux-audio-user > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From simonzwise at gmail.com Fri Sep 6 07:43:01 2013 From: simonzwise at gmail.com (Simon Wise) Date: Fri, 06 Sep 2013 15:43:01 +0800 Subject: [LAU] pro gear that runs embedded linux... In-Reply-To: <5228CA4F.9040907@stackingdwarves.net> References: <5228CA4F.9040907@stackingdwarves.net> Message-ID: <52298785.7030007@gmail.com> On 06/09/13 02:15, J?rn Nettingsmeier wrote: > none of these make a secret out of their OS, but it doesn't seem to be an > advertising item, either. is it because people are generally disinterested in > and/or frightened by the fact that their gear has to have some sort of operating > system inside? i wonder if we'll live to see the day where "linux inside" is a > hot marketing punchline. perhaps a big selling point for embedded system gear is that it is just there, it is dedicated to a single purpose ... and bringing an OS into the picture blurs that distinction, it sounds too much like a general purpose computer running an application to the marketing department. Simon From fero.kiraly at gmail.com Fri Sep 6 08:14:18 2013 From: fero.kiraly at gmail.com (Fero Kiraly) Date: Fri, 6 Sep 2013 10:14:18 +0200 Subject: [LAU] crackling sound Message-ID: Hi friends, I have a weird crackling sound (it happens sometines, but often) it is no xruns. I am using archlinux->jack->rtirq->presonus 1818VSL=>MIDI keyboard it happens when i hold long tones with Zynaddsubfx or bristol. Do you have an idea what it could be ? thanks. fero. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From steve at kingswayelec.co.uk Fri Sep 6 09:29:26 2013 From: steve at kingswayelec.co.uk (Steve Downes) Date: Fri, 6 Sep 2013 10:29:26 +0100 Subject: [LAU] crackling sound In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20130906092926.GA15762@kingswayelec.co.uk> I had a similar problem a couple of weeks ago. cleared it as follows:- Backed off the frames number to the next highest. I wasn't getting xruns either but I assume it was close to it (or something like that). Anyway it cleared it. Hopefully somebody will give you a more technical answer but in the meantime... Steve On Fri, Sep 06, 2013 at 10:14:18AM +0200, Fero Kiraly wrote: > Hi friends, > > I have a weird crackling sound (it happens sometines, but often) > it is no xruns. > > I am using archlinux->jack->rtirq->presonus 1818VSL=>MIDI keyboard > > it happens when i hold long tones with Zynaddsubfx or bristol. > > Do you have an idea what it could be ? > > thanks. > > fero. > _______________________________________________ > Linux-audio-user mailing list > Linux-audio-user at lists.linuxaudio.org > http://lists.linuxaudio.org/listinfo/linux-audio-user From nettings at stackingdwarves.net Fri Sep 6 09:52:30 2013 From: nettings at stackingdwarves.net (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?J=F6rn_Nettingsmeier?=) Date: Fri, 06 Sep 2013 11:52:30 +0200 Subject: [LAU] pro gear that runs embedded linux... In-Reply-To: References: <5228CA4F.9040907@stackingdwarves.net> <20130905190450.GA6581@linuxaudio.org> Message-ID: <5229A5DE.5090509@stackingdwarves.net> On 09/05/2013 09:36 PM, Charles Z Henry wrote: > > > > On Thu, Sep 5, 2013 at 2:04 PM, Fons Adriaensen > wrote: > > On Thu, Sep 05, 2013 at 08:15:43PM +0200, J?rn Nettingsmeier wrote: > > > i wonder if you guys have seen other pro gear whose data gets > > shuffled around by industrious yet unseen penguins under the hood? > > Meyer Sound's D-Mitri processors, to name a big one... > > Ciao, > > -- > FA > > > Just checked out the D-Mitri line. I'm amazed, jealous. That's exactly > the kind of scalable gear that I'd dream of building. > > Do they really have AVB on those? i haven't used the d-mitri yet (i did use galileos a couple of times, anyone know what those are running), but yes, meyer sound is a big player in avb gear, check out the babble at http://www.avnu.org/about_us/our_members . -- J?rn Nettingsmeier Lortzingstr. 11, 45128 Essen, Tel. +49 177 7937487 Meister f?r Veranstaltungstechnik (B?hne/Studio) Tonmeister VDT http://stackingdwarves.net From gordonjcp at gjcp.net Fri Sep 6 12:30:33 2013 From: gordonjcp at gjcp.net (Gordon JC Pearce) Date: Fri, 6 Sep 2013 13:30:33 +0100 Subject: [LAU] mastering dilemma In-Reply-To: <1378407732.787.17.camel@archlinux> References: <1378407732.787.17.camel@archlinux> Message-ID: <20130906123033.GA19663@gjcp.net> On Thu, Sep 05, 2013 at 09:02:12PM +0200, Ralf Mardorf wrote: > > > I don't think I have any instruments in my whole studio that > > could produce sound so anemic in the low mids as what I hear on CD's > > without *lots* of cut > > I guess you are speaking about "music" made with virtual synth. Sure, > absolutely no virtual synth can compare to vintage synth that use CEM > (Curtis) chips. Yeah, "virtual" analogue always sounds much better than shitty CEM filters. -- Gordonjcp MM0YEQ From markus.seeber at spectralbird.de Fri Sep 6 15:46:11 2013 From: markus.seeber at spectralbird.de (Markus Seeber) Date: Fri, 06 Sep 2013 17:46:11 +0200 Subject: [LAU] crackling sound In-Reply-To: <20130906092926.GA15762@kingswayelec.co.uk> References: <20130906092926.GA15762@kingswayelec.co.uk> Message-ID: <5229F8C3.8080906@spectralbird.de> Hi, in my case it was clipping. I had the exact same issue with Zynaddsubfx and amsynth. It only occured on some presets and when i hold the tone for a while. Turning down the volume (master volume in Zynaddsubfx) a bit in the synth fixed it for me. It seemed to me, that the presets are sometimes set quite loud. You may also check your jack connections. Once i had an issue, where i had two paths from the Synth output to my Audio interface, which resulted in a signal that was much louder than intended due to the summation of the signal. It was quite some time ago, so i don't remember if it was just one of these causes or a combination of both. Greetings Markus On 09/06/2013 11:29 AM, Steve Downes wrote: > I had a similar problem a couple of weeks ago. cleared it as follows:- > > Backed off the frames number to the next highest. I wasn't getting > xruns either but I assume it was close to it (or something like > that). Anyway it cleared it. > > Hopefully somebody will give you a more technical answer but in the > meantime... > > Steve > > On Fri, Sep 06, 2013 at 10:14:18AM +0200, Fero Kiraly wrote: >> Hi friends, >> >> I have a weird crackling sound (it happens sometines, but often) >> it is no xruns. >> >> I am using archlinux->jack->rtirq->presonus 1818VSL=>MIDI keyboard >> >> it happens when i hold long tones with Zynaddsubfx or bristol. >> >> Do you have an idea what it could be ? >> >> thanks. >> >> fero. >> _______________________________________________ >> Linux-audio-user mailing list >> Linux-audio-user at lists.linuxaudio.org >> http://lists.linuxaudio.org/listinfo/linux-audio-user > _______________________________________________ > Linux-audio-user mailing list > Linux-audio-user at lists.linuxaudio.org > http://lists.linuxaudio.org/listinfo/linux-audio-user > From fero.kiraly at gmail.com Fri Sep 6 21:10:54 2013 From: fero.kiraly at gmail.com (Fero Kiraly) Date: Fri, 6 Sep 2013 23:10:54 +0200 Subject: [LAU] crackling sound Message-ID: thanks for ideas. raising the frames number helps me today. i will try to check thw volumes too. all best -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From althompson58 at gmail.com Sat Sep 7 01:30:19 2013 From: althompson58 at gmail.com (Al Thompson) Date: Fri, 06 Sep 2013 21:30:19 -0400 Subject: [LAU] pro gear that runs embedded linux... In-Reply-To: <1378412448.787.46.camel@archlinux> References: <5228CA4F.9040907@stackingdwarves.net> <1378408597.787.28.camel@archlinux> <1378412448.787.46.camel@archlinux> Message-ID: <522A81AB.1070803@gmail.com> On 09/05/2013 04:20 PM, Ralf Mardorf wrote: > > An engineer want's to buy a mixer etc. and not a kernel. Known companies > selling professional mixers don't advertise that they have Alps faders > inside, this is done by companies who sell amateur mixers. Of course it is!! Professional grade companies use P&Gs! -- --- My bands, CD projects, music, news, and pictures: http://www.lateralforce.com My blog, with commentary on a variety of things, including audio, mixing, equipment, etc, is at: http://audioandmore.wordpress.com Staat hei?t das k?lteste aller kalten Ungeheuer. Kalt l?gt es auch; und diese L?ge kriecht aus seinem Munde: 'Ich, der Staat, bin das Volk.' - [Friedrich Nietzsche] From fons at linuxaudio.org Sat Sep 7 09:14:43 2013 From: fons at linuxaudio.org (Fons Adriaensen) Date: Sat, 7 Sep 2013 09:14:43 +0000 Subject: [LAU] pro gear that runs embedded linux... In-Reply-To: <522A81AB.1070803@gmail.com> References: <5228CA4F.9040907@stackingdwarves.net> <1378408597.787.28.camel@archlinux> <1378412448.787.46.camel@archlinux> <522A81AB.1070803@gmail.com> Message-ID: <20130907091443.GA10577@linuxaudio.org> On Fri, Sep 06, 2013 at 09:30:19PM -0400, Al Thompson wrote: > On 09/05/2013 04:20 PM, Ralf Mardorf wrote: > > > > An engineer want's to buy a mixer etc. and not a kernel. Known companies > > selling professional mixers don't advertise that they have Alps faders > > inside, this is done by companies who sell amateur mixers. > > Of course it is!! Professional grade companies use P&Gs! >From what I remember of the ads in e.g. Studio Sound during the heydays of big analog mixers, most of the big names used P&G, and that *was* as selling point. But there is indeed a very clear difference in how things are marketed to professionals, prosumers and amateurs, even if the first two seem to converge somewhat. If I see a plugin GUI with rack handles, screws, shiny surfaces, an agressive color scheme designed to stand out, big trademarks or any text yelling at me, an illogical layout or any non-functional graphics, I know that I shouldn't waste my time with it. Ciao, -- FA A world of exhaustive, reliable metadata would be an utopia. It's also a pipe-dream, founded on self-delusion, nerd hubris and hysterically inflated market opportunities. (Cory Doctorow) From cbannister at slingshot.co.nz Sat Sep 7 10:22:14 2013 From: cbannister at slingshot.co.nz (Chris Bannister) Date: Sat, 7 Sep 2013 22:22:14 +1200 Subject: [LAU] pro gear that runs embedded linux... In-Reply-To: <1378408597.787.28.camel@archlinux> References: <5228CA4F.9040907@stackingdwarves.net> <1378408597.787.28.camel@archlinux> Message-ID: <20130907102214.GE2558@tal> On Thu, Sep 05, 2013 at 09:16:37PM +0200, Ralf Mardorf wrote: > Android is Linux, ... Not really: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Android_(operating_system)#Linux -- "If you're not careful, the newspapers will have you hating the people who are being oppressed, and loving the people who are doing the oppressing." --- Malcolm X From ralf.mardorf at alice-dsl.net Sat Sep 7 11:06:42 2013 From: ralf.mardorf at alice-dsl.net (Ralf Mardorf) Date: Sat, 07 Sep 2013 13:06:42 +0200 Subject: [LAU] pro gear that runs embedded linux... In-Reply-To: <20130907091443.GA10577@linuxaudio.org> References: <5228CA4F.9040907@stackingdwarves.net> <1378408597.787.28.camel@archlinux> <1378412448.787.46.camel@archlinux> <522A81AB.1070803@gmail.com> <20130907091443.GA10577@linuxaudio.org> Message-ID: <1378552002.756.13.camel@archlinux> On Sat, 2013-09-07 at 09:14 +0000, Fons Adriaensen wrote: > On Fri, Sep 06, 2013 at 09:30:19PM -0400, Al Thompson wrote: > > On 09/05/2013 04:20 PM, Ralf Mardorf wrote: > > > > > > An engineer want's to buy a mixer etc. and not a kernel. Known companies > > > selling professional mixers don't advertise that they have Alps faders > > > inside, this is done by companies who sell amateur mixers. > > > > Of course it is!! Professional grade companies use P&Gs! > > >From what I remember of the ads in e.g. Studio Sound during > the heydays of big analog mixers, most of the big names used > P&G, and that *was* as selling point. Ok, perhaps a less good example, you at least can see what kind of faders are used by the fader knobs. Companies producing professional gear might mention what's inside too, but less often that eye-catching, as it is done for the amateurish gear I usually have to buy. > But there is indeed a very clear difference in how things are > marketed to professionals, prosumers and amateurs, even if the > first two seem to converge somewhat. If I see a plugin GUI with > rack handles, screws, shiny surfaces, an agressive color scheme > designed to stand out, big trademarks or any text yelling at me, > an illogical layout or any non-functional graphics, I know that > I shouldn't waste my time with it. That is a better description. While not all that flashy gear and not all those flashy plugins are crap. Formerly in Germany it was usual to cover names and logos with tape, when used in public and television, not only regarding to laws against covert advertising. However, sometimes there is Tux on a display of gear, but I never have seen a tag "Linux inside" and IMO it's ok not to mention it that way. From ralf.mardorf at alice-dsl.net Sat Sep 7 11:12:30 2013 From: ralf.mardorf at alice-dsl.net (Ralf Mardorf) Date: Sat, 07 Sep 2013 13:12:30 +0200 Subject: [LAU] pro gear that runs embedded linux... In-Reply-To: <20130907102214.GE2558@tal> References: <5228CA4F.9040907@stackingdwarves.net> <1378408597.787.28.camel@archlinux> <20130907102214.GE2558@tal> Message-ID: <1378552350.756.18.camel@archlinux> On Sat, 2013-09-07 at 22:22 +1200, Chris Bannister wrote: > On Thu, Sep 05, 2013 at 09:16:37PM +0200, Ralf Mardorf wrote: > > Android is Linux, ... > > Not really: > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Android_(operating_system)#Linux Regarding to this thread "Android consists of a kernel based on Linux kernel", it is the same as it usually is for gear using Linux. The hardware often does use a kernel "based" on Linux and not the vanilla and rt patched kernels we use and the "userspace" for stand alone gear usually isn't the software we know. From paul at linuxaudiosystems.com Sat Sep 7 13:46:25 2013 From: paul at linuxaudiosystems.com (Paul Davis) Date: Sat, 7 Sep 2013 09:46:25 -0400 Subject: [LAU] pro gear that runs embedded linux... In-Reply-To: <20130907102214.GE2558@tal> References: <5228CA4F.9040907@stackingdwarves.net> <1378408597.787.28.camel@archlinux> <20130907102214.GE2558@tal> Message-ID: Android is as much Linux as OS X is Unix (Darwin). Whatever that means. On Sat, Sep 7, 2013 at 6:22 AM, Chris Bannister wrote: > On Thu, Sep 05, 2013 at 09:16:37PM +0200, Ralf Mardorf wrote: > > Android is Linux, ... > > Not really: > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Android_(operating_system)#Linux > > -- > "If you're not careful, the newspapers will have you hating the people > who are being oppressed, and loving the people who are doing the > oppressing." --- Malcolm X > _______________________________________________ > Linux-audio-user mailing list > Linux-audio-user at lists.linuxaudio.org > http://lists.linuxaudio.org/listinfo/linux-audio-user > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From ralf.mardorf at alice-dsl.net Sat Sep 7 16:07:57 2013 From: ralf.mardorf at alice-dsl.net (Ralf Mardorf) Date: Sat, 07 Sep 2013 18:07:57 +0200 Subject: [LAU] pro gear that runs embedded linux... In-Reply-To: References: <5228CA4F.9040907@stackingdwarves.net> <1378408597.787.28.camel@archlinux> <20130907102214.GE2558@tal> Message-ID: <1378570077.2921.11.camel@archlinux> On Sat, 2013-09-07 at 09:46 -0400, Paul Davis wrote: > Android is as much Linux as OS X is Unix (Darwin). Whatever that > means. :) They are Linux and UNIX regarding to the context. "Sheldon: More wrong? Wrong is an absolute state and not subject to degradation Stuart: It's a little wrong to say to say a tomato is a vegetable, it's very wrong to say it's a suspension bridge" - The Big Bang Theory Assumed somebody considers that Android isn't Linux in the context of this thread, then I suspect that much of the gear with Linux inside, does not have Linux inside, even if a display should show Tux. Just a guess, no knowledge, I don't know statistics about how many products do use Linux and how many products do use something based on Linux. From moshwe at gmail.com Sat Sep 7 19:15:38 2013 From: moshwe at gmail.com (Moshe Werner) Date: Sat, 7 Sep 2013 22:15:38 +0300 Subject: [LAU] pro gear that runs embedded linux... In-Reply-To: <5228CA4F.9040907@stackingdwarves.net> References: <5228CA4F.9040907@stackingdwarves.net> Message-ID: Actually I've got a fun fact. When last year the Israeli parliament published the official requirements for the new FOH system in the plenum, it stated that no Microsoft driven console would be allowed:) Now they are running the Lawo mc2 series... I know this because I'm the sound engineer in the Israeli parliament:) Best Regards, Moshe On Thu, Sep 5, 2013 at 9:15 PM, J?rn Nettingsmeier < nettings at stackingdwarves.net> wrote: > hi guys! > > > i'm sure you all have seen your share of professional audio, video, and > lighting gear that apparently runs embedded linux but never mentions it > much (unless you happen upon the briefly flashing penguins immediately > after booting)... > > i just came across the midas pro2 (which i have to learn for an upcoming > job), and lo and behold, in the manual, midas saith: > "The PRO2 uses the reliable Linux operating system." > > not exactly in the brochure afaict, but in the very prominent first > section of the manual. :) > > other expensive boxes i've seen and used which appear to be running linux: > > * Allen & Heath iLive and GLD series audio mixers > * LAWO mc? series of audio mixers > * grandMA2 series of lighting controllers > * the DirectOut M.1k2 16x16 MADI router > > none of these make a secret out of their OS, but it doesn't seem to be an > advertising item, either. is it because people are generally disinterested > in and/or frightened by the fact that their gear has to have some sort of > operating system inside? i wonder if we'll live to see the day where "linux > inside" is a hot marketing punchline. > > i wonder if you guys have seen other pro gear whose data gets shuffled > around by industrious yet unseen penguins under the hood? > > > -- > J?rn Nettingsmeier > Lortzingstr. 11, 45128 Essen, Tel. +49 177 7937487 > > Meister f?r Veranstaltungstechnik (B?hne/Studio) > Tonmeister VDT > > http://stackingdwarves.net > > ______________________________**_________________ > Linux-audio-user mailing list > Linux-audio-user at lists.**linuxaudio.org > http://lists.linuxaudio.org/**listinfo/linux-audio-user > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From fons at linuxaudio.org Sat Sep 7 19:25:30 2013 From: fons at linuxaudio.org (Fons Adriaensen) Date: Sat, 7 Sep 2013 19:25:30 +0000 Subject: [LAU] pro gear that runs embedded linux... In-Reply-To: References: <5228CA4F.9040907@stackingdwarves.net> Message-ID: <20130907192530.GA8573@linuxaudio.org> On Sat, Sep 07, 2013 at 10:15:38PM +0300, Moshe Werner wrote: > Actually I've got a fun fact. > When last year the Israeli parliament published the official requirements > for the new FOH system in the plenum, it stated that no Microsoft driven > console would be allowed:) What is the (political, ethical, pragmatic, ...) motivation behind this choice ? I could have added security, but since plenum sessions are (I assume) public that seems to be irrelevant. Ciao, -- FA A world of exhaustive, reliable metadata would be an utopia. It's also a pipe-dream, founded on self-delusion, nerd hubris and hysterically inflated market opportunities. (Cory Doctorow) From moshwe at gmail.com Sat Sep 7 22:02:52 2013 From: moshwe at gmail.com (Moshe Werner) Date: Sun, 8 Sep 2013 01:02:52 +0300 Subject: [LAU] pro gear that runs embedded linux... In-Reply-To: <20130907192530.GA8573@linuxaudio.org> References: <5228CA4F.9040907@stackingdwarves.net> <20130907192530.GA8573@linuxaudio.org> Message-ID: Oh i believe it was for stability and reliability issues. In the past years we had "sound blackouts" on several occasions because of technical failures so there was a decision to go as failure proof as possible. I believe that the non Microsoft policy was actually induced by the head of AV department... On Sat, Sep 7, 2013 at 10:25 PM, Fons Adriaensen wrote: > On Sat, Sep 07, 2013 at 10:15:38PM +0300, Moshe Werner wrote: > > > Actually I've got a fun fact. > > When last year the Israeli parliament published the official requirements > > for the new FOH system in the plenum, it stated that no Microsoft driven > > console would be allowed:) > > What is the (political, ethical, pragmatic, ...) motivation behind this > choice ? > > I could have added security, but since plenum sessions are > (I assume) public that seems to be irrelevant. > > Ciao, > > -- > FA > > A world of exhaustive, reliable metadata would be an utopia. > It's also a pipe-dream, founded on self-delusion, nerd hubris > and hysterically inflated market opportunities. (Cory Doctorow) > > _______________________________________________ > Linux-audio-user mailing list > Linux-audio-user at lists.linuxaudio.org > http://lists.linuxaudio.org/listinfo/linux-audio-user > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From linuxaudio at showlabor.de Sat Sep 7 22:09:09 2013 From: linuxaudio at showlabor.de (Felix Homann) Date: Sun, 8 Sep 2013 00:09:09 +0200 Subject: [LAU] pro gear that runs embedded linux... In-Reply-To: References: <5228CA4F.9040907@stackingdwarves.net> <20130907192530.GA8573@linuxaudio.org> Message-ID: Am 08.09.2013 00:03 schrieb "Moshe Werner" : > > Oh i believe it was for stability and reliability issues. > In the past years we had "sound blackouts" on several occasions because of technical failures > so there was a decision to go as failure proof as possible. > I believe that the non Microsoft policy was actually induced by the head of AV department... That's a nice one :-) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From fons at linuxaudio.org Sat Sep 7 22:27:11 2013 From: fons at linuxaudio.org (Fons Adriaensen) Date: Sat, 7 Sep 2013 22:27:11 +0000 Subject: [LAU] pro gear that runs embedded linux... In-Reply-To: References: <5228CA4F.9040907@stackingdwarves.net> <20130907192530.GA8573@linuxaudio.org> Message-ID: <20130907222711.GB8573@linuxaudio.org> On Sun, Sep 08, 2013 at 01:02:52AM +0300, Moshe Werner wrote: > I believe that the non Microsoft policy was actually induced by the head of > AV department... Mazal tov to him ! -- FA A world of exhaustive, reliable metadata would be an utopia. It's also a pipe-dream, founded on self-delusion, nerd hubris and hysterically inflated market opportunities. (Cory Doctorow) From pshirkey at boosthardware.com Sun Sep 8 07:54:56 2013 From: pshirkey at boosthardware.com (Patrick Shirkey) Date: Sun, 8 Sep 2013 17:54:56 +1000 (EST) Subject: [LAU] pro gear that runs embedded linux... In-Reply-To: <20130907222711.GB8573@linuxaudio.org> References: <5228CA4F.9040907@stackingdwarves.net> <20130907192530.GA8573@linuxaudio.org> <20130907222711.GB8573@linuxaudio.org> Message-ID: <56578.5.12.190.150.1378626896.squirrel@boosthardware.com> On Sun, September 8, 2013 8:27 am, Fons Adriaensen wrote: > On Sun, Sep 08, 2013 at 01:02:52AM +0300, Moshe Werner wrote: > >> I believe that the non Microsoft policy was actually induced by the head >> of >> AV department... > > Mazal tov to him ! > That's officially a home goal :-) How long until he gets "taken out" or at least bribed to change his mind? -- Patrick Shirkey Boost Hardware Ltd From moshwe at gmail.com Sun Sep 8 08:12:07 2013 From: moshwe at gmail.com (Moshe Werner) Date: Sun, 8 Sep 2013 10:12:07 +0200 Subject: [LAU] pro gear that runs embedded linux... In-Reply-To: <56578.5.12.190.150.1378626896.squirrel@boosthardware.com> References: <5228CA4F.9040907@stackingdwarves.net> <20130907192530.GA8573@linuxaudio.org> <20130907222711.GB8573@linuxaudio.org> <56578.5.12.190.150.1378626896.squirrel@boosthardware.com> Message-ID: That seems a bit paranoid to me. Actually everyone is quite happy with the system On Sun, Sep 8, 2013 at 10:54 AM, Patrick Shirkey wrote: > > On Sun, September 8, 2013 8:27 am, Fons Adriaensen wrote: > > On Sun, Sep 08, 2013 at 01:02:52AM +0300, Moshe Werner wrote: > > > >> I believe that the non Microsoft policy was actually induced by the head > >> of > >> AV department... > > > > Mazal tov to him ! > > > > > That's officially a home goal :-) > > How long until he gets "taken out" or at least bribed to change his mind? > > > > -- > Patrick Shirkey > Boost Hardware Ltd > _______________________________________________ > Linux-audio-user mailing list > Linux-audio-user at lists.linuxaudio.org > http://lists.linuxaudio.org/listinfo/linux-audio-user > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From pshirkey at boosthardware.com Sun Sep 8 09:04:41 2013 From: pshirkey at boosthardware.com (Patrick Shirkey) Date: Sun, 8 Sep 2013 19:04:41 +1000 (EST) Subject: [LAU] pro gear that runs embedded linux... In-Reply-To: References: <5228CA4F.9040907@stackingdwarves.net> <20130907192530.GA8573@linuxaudio.org> <20130907222711.GB8573@linuxaudio.org> <56578.5.12.190.150.1378626896.squirrel@boosthardware.com> Message-ID: <57014.5.12.190.150.1378631081.squirrel@boosthardware.com> On Sun, September 8, 2013 6:12 pm, Moshe Werner wrote: > That seems a bit paranoid to me. > Actually everyone is quite happy with the system > It will be good to know if that is still that case in 3 - 6 months time. With all the paid M$ trolls monitoring this list you can't expect them to swallow that one easily... Anyway, I can sense you are wearing your shiny protective mind control apparel so that is a good sine ;-P > > On Sun, Sep 8, 2013 at 10:54 AM, Patrick Shirkey > > wrote: > >> >> On Sun, September 8, 2013 8:27 am, Fons Adriaensen wrote: >> > On Sun, Sep 08, 2013 at 01:02:52AM +0300, Moshe Werner wrote: >> > >> >> I believe that the non Microsoft policy was actually induced by the >> head >> >> of >> >> AV department... >> > >> > Mazal tov to him ! >> > >> >> >> That's officially a home goal :-) >> >> How long until he gets "taken out" or at least bribed to change his >> mind? >> >> >> >> -- >> Patrick Shirkey >> Boost Hardware Ltd >> _______________________________________________ >> Linux-audio-user mailing list >> Linux-audio-user at lists.linuxaudio.org >> http://lists.linuxaudio.org/listinfo/linux-audio-user >> > -- Patrick Shirkey Boost Hardware Ltd From ralf.mardorf at alice-dsl.net Sun Sep 8 10:29:00 2013 From: ralf.mardorf at alice-dsl.net (Ralf Mardorf) Date: Sun, 08 Sep 2013 12:29:00 +0200 Subject: [LAU] pro gear that runs embedded linux... In-Reply-To: References: <5228CA4F.9040907@stackingdwarves.net> Message-ID: <1378636140.721.2.camel@archlinux> On Sat, 2013-09-07 at 22:15 +0300, Moshe Werner wrote: > When last year the Israeli parliament published the official > requirements for the new FOH system in the plenum, it stated that no > Microsoft driven console would be allowed:) Was the reason the technical quality of Microsoft based products, economy or the fear that some kind of spy on would be possible? From ralf.mardorf at alice-dsl.net Sun Sep 8 10:31:02 2013 From: ralf.mardorf at alice-dsl.net (Ralf Mardorf) Date: Sun, 08 Sep 2013 12:31:02 +0200 Subject: [LAU] pro gear that runs embedded linux... In-Reply-To: <20130907192530.GA8573@linuxaudio.org> References: <5228CA4F.9040907@stackingdwarves.net> <20130907192530.GA8573@linuxaudio.org> Message-ID: <1378636262.721.4.camel@archlinux> On Sat, 2013-09-07 at 19:25 +0000, Fons Adriaensen wrote: > I could have added security, but since plenum sessions are > (I assume) public that seems to be irrelevant. Should have read your mail before I sent my mail. Likely not all proceedings are open for public, that's why my guess is the same as yours. From dlphillips at woh.rr.com Sun Sep 8 14:57:57 2013 From: dlphillips at woh.rr.com (Dave Phillips) Date: Sun, 08 Sep 2013 10:57:57 -0400 Subject: [LAU] some new and some updated scores Message-ID: <522C9075.5000804@woh.rr.com> Greetings, For those of you who follow the dots : http://linux-sound.org/dlp-music-lilypond/ I'm in the process of updating, adding, and getting rid of stuff on that page. Most of the older stuff will be removed permanently, new stuff is on the way. Best, dp From willgodfrey at musically.me.uk Sun Sep 8 15:37:38 2013 From: willgodfrey at musically.me.uk (Will Godfrey) Date: Sun, 8 Sep 2013 16:37:38 +0100 Subject: [LAU] [New music]: Days of Borrowed Time In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20130908163738.62b690b4@debian> On Wed, 21 Aug 2013 00:49:55 +0200 (CEST) Julien Claassen wrote: > Hello everyone! > Here is the serious piece of electronic music. Rather more depressive than I > would have predicted. > First though I have to express my gratitude to Alison Utter for the sweet > vocals, that she has supplied. Thanks! And then we have the links: > http://juliencoder.de/nama/borrowed_time.ogg > http://juliencoder.de/nama/borrowed_time.mp3 > And the lyrics: > http://juliencoder.de/nama/borrowed_time.html > Or you can access it all from the music page: > http://juliencoder.de/nama/music.html > Now about that song: technically speaking I used a lot of Midish and Nama. > And for the first time I really came to appreciate Ecasound's LV2-support. So > also a big thanks to Jeremy Salwen, who contributed that feature! > Musically, this is a mixture of different influences. I'm still not sure, if > it should be categorised as pop or electronica. there's some dubstep in this, > as well as some hiphop - in German! :-) - and some basic depressive pop. As to > instruments used: almost everything I have at my disposal. In software I only > used LinuxSampler for the Solina sample. Thanks to the friend, who made a > present of it to me! It's a versatile instrument! > This latest experiment concluded, I will just lean back and relax. As ever: > feedback is very welcome! > Warm regards and enjoy > Julien Finally got time to listen to this. Really impressed with what you've put together here. The contrast with Alison's voice adds to the drama of the entire piece. -- Will J Godfrey http://www.musically.me.uk Say you have a poem and I have a tune. Exchange them and we can both have a poem, a tune, and a song. From willgodfrey at musically.me.uk Sun Sep 8 15:47:25 2013 From: willgodfrey at musically.me.uk (Will Godfrey) Date: Sun, 8 Sep 2013 16:47:25 +0100 Subject: [LAU] a tango In-Reply-To: <521AA633.6010400@woh.rr.com> References: <521AA633.6010400@woh.rr.com> Message-ID: <20130908164725.3833670e@debian> On Sun, 25 Aug 2013 20:49:55 -0400 Dave Phillips wrote: > Greetings, > > An ominous but not an anonymous tango : > > https://soundcloud.com/davephillips69/tango-in-cm-for-strings-and > > For the non-nebulous : > > http://linux-sound.org/audio/Tango.mp3 > > http://linux-sound.org/audio/Tango.ogg > > Plain old tonic/dominant stuff here, all in moody good fun. > > Best, > > dp Certainly the 'heaviest' tango I can remember! BTW soundcloud link seems to have died. -- Will J Godfrey http://www.musically.me.uk Say you have a poem and I have a tune. Exchange them and we can both have a poem, a tune, and a song. From willgodfrey at musically.me.uk Sun Sep 8 18:50:06 2013 From: willgodfrey at musically.me.uk (Will Godfrey) Date: Sun, 8 Sep 2013 19:50:06 +0100 Subject: [LAU] an AVS waveguide demo In-Reply-To: <5225BD4C.8010708@woh.rr.com> References: <5225BD4C.8010708@woh.rr.com> Message-ID: <20130908195006.1926c1ac@debian> On Tue, 03 Sep 2013 06:43:24 -0400 Dave Phillips wrote: > Greetings, > > A brief demonstration of Jean-Pierre Lemoine's implementation of the > Csound waveguide filter in AVSynthesis : > > https://soundcloud.com/davephillips69/an-avsynthesis-csound > > For those not on the cloud : > > http://linux-sound.org/audio/avs-waveguide-demo.mp3 > > http://linux-sound.org/audio/avs-waveguide-demo.ogg > > Best, > > dp That's a pretty dramatic change :o -- Will J Godfrey http://www.musically.me.uk Say you have a poem and I have a tune. Exchange them and we can both have a poem, a tune, and a song. From nettings at stackingdwarves.net Sun Sep 8 22:37:25 2013 From: nettings at stackingdwarves.net (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?J=F6rn_Nettingsmeier?=) Date: Mon, 09 Sep 2013 00:37:25 +0200 Subject: [LAU] a tango In-Reply-To: <521AA633.6010400@woh.rr.com> References: <521AA633.6010400@woh.rr.com> Message-ID: <522CFC25.30006@stackingdwarves.net> On 08/26/2013 02:49 AM, Dave Phillips wrote: > Greetings, > > An ominous but not an anonymous tango : > > https://soundcloud.com/davephillips69/tango-in-cm-for-strings-and > > For the non-nebulous : > > http://linux-sound.org/audio/Tango.mp3 > > http://linux-sound.org/audio/Tango.ogg > > Plain old tonic/dominant stuff here, all in moody good fun. a perfect score for another "battle of wesnoth" campaign with loads of undead... -- J?rn Nettingsmeier Lortzingstr. 11, 45128 Essen, Tel. +49 177 7937487 Meister f?r Veranstaltungstechnik (B?hne/Studio) Tonmeister VDT http://stackingdwarves.net From julien at mail.upb.de Sun Sep 8 22:45:35 2013 From: julien at mail.upb.de (Julien Claassen) Date: Mon, 9 Sep 2013 00:45:35 +0200 (CEST) Subject: [LAU] [New music]: Days of Borrowed Time In-Reply-To: <20130908163738.62b690b4@debian> References: <20130908163738.62b690b4@debian> Message-ID: Hello Will! Thanks for your kind words. I'll be sure to pass it on to Alison as well. Warm regards Julien ---------------------------------------- http://juliencoder.de/nama/music.html From dlphillips at woh.rr.com Sun Sep 8 23:24:56 2013 From: dlphillips at woh.rr.com (Dave Phillips) Date: Sun, 08 Sep 2013 19:24:56 -0400 Subject: [LAU] a tango Message-ID: <522D0748.3020104@woh.rr.com> [Sorry if this is a dupe, I got a weird server error the first time I sent it.] On 09/08/2013 06:37 PM, J?rn Nettingsmeier wrote: > On 08/26/2013 02:49 AM, Dave Phillips wrote: >> Greetings, >> >> An ominous but not an anonymous tango : >> > a perfect score for another "battle of wesnoth" campaign with loads of > undead... > > It's the Tango Of The Living Dead. New "improved" version at http://linux-sound.org/audio/Tango.mp3 http://linux-sound.org/audio/Tango.ogg Middle section is extended with a bit of new material. Same crappy sounds though, so if anyone wants to have some fun re-orchestrating it (hi Will!) here's the MIDI file : http://linux-sound.org/audio/tango2.mid It's set up for standard GM layout. Best, dp From abhayadevs at gmail.com Mon Sep 9 08:39:03 2013 From: abhayadevs at gmail.com (Abhayadev S) Date: Mon, 9 Sep 2013 14:09:03 +0530 Subject: [LAU] Setting-up Focusrite Scarlett 8i6's Internal Mixer in Linux Message-ID: Anybody has any success in Setting-up Focusrite Scarlett 8i6's Internal Mixer in Linux Regards, Abhayadev S -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From cbannister at slingshot.co.nz Mon Sep 9 12:31:08 2013 From: cbannister at slingshot.co.nz (Chris Bannister) Date: Tue, 10 Sep 2013 00:31:08 +1200 Subject: [LAU] pro gear that runs embedded linux... In-Reply-To: References: <5228CA4F.9040907@stackingdwarves.net> <20130907192530.GA8573@linuxaudio.org> <20130907222711.GB8573@linuxaudio.org> <56578.5.12.190.150.1378626896.squirrel@boosthardware.com> Message-ID: <20130909123108.GF25870@tal> On Sun, Sep 08, 2013 at 10:12:07AM +0200, Moshe Werner wrote: > On Sun, Sep 8, 2013 at 10:54 AM, Patrick Shirkey > wrote: > > On Sun, September 8, 2013 8:27 am, Fons Adriaensen wrote: > > > On Sun, Sep 08, 2013 at 01:02:52AM +0300, Moshe Werner wrote: > > >> I believe that the non Microsoft policy was actually induced by the head > > >> of > > >> AV department... > > > > > > Mazal tov to him ! > > > > > > > > > That's officially a home goal :-) > > > > How long until he gets "taken out" or at least bribed to change his mind? > > That seems a bit paranoid to me. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Criticism_of_Microsoft http://www.vanwensveen.nl/rants/microsoft/IhateMS_5.html -- "If you're not careful, the newspapers will have you hating the people who are being oppressed, and loving the people who are doing the oppressing." --- Malcolm X From moshwe at gmail.com Mon Sep 9 15:00:09 2013 From: moshwe at gmail.com (Moshe Werner) Date: Mon, 9 Sep 2013 18:00:09 +0300 Subject: [LAU] pro gear that runs embedded linux... In-Reply-To: <20130909123108.GF25870@tal> References: <5228CA4F.9040907@stackingdwarves.net> <20130907192530.GA8573@linuxaudio.org> <20130907222711.GB8573@linuxaudio.org> <56578.5.12.190.150.1378626896.squirrel@boosthardware.com> <20130909123108.GF25870@tal> Message-ID: That was quite an interesting read. Maybe I should keep my mouth shut:) On 9 ?Sep 2013 15:31, "Chris Bannister" wrote: > On Sun, Sep 08, 2013 at 10:12:07AM +0200, Moshe Werner wrote: > > On Sun, Sep 8, 2013 at 10:54 AM, Patrick Shirkey < > pshirkey at boosthardware.com > > > wrote: > > > On Sun, September 8, 2013 8:27 am, Fons Adriaensen wrote: > > > > On Sun, Sep 08, 2013 at 01:02:52AM +0300, Moshe Werner wrote: > > > >> I believe that the non Microsoft policy was actually induced by the > head > > > >> of > > > >> AV department... > > > > > > > > Mazal tov to him ! > > > > > > > > > > > > > That's officially a home goal :-) > > > > > > How long until he gets "taken out" or at least bribed to change his > mind? > > > > That seems a bit paranoid to me. > > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Criticism_of_Microsoft > http://www.vanwensveen.nl/rants/microsoft/IhateMS_5.html > > > -- > "If you're not careful, the newspapers will have you hating the people > who are being oppressed, and loving the people who are doing the > oppressing." --- Malcolm X > _______________________________________________ > Linux-audio-user mailing list > Linux-audio-user at lists.linuxaudio.org > http://lists.linuxaudio.org/listinfo/linux-audio-user > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From brent at village.keycorner.org Mon Sep 9 22:42:22 2013 From: brent at village.keycorner.org (Brent Busby) Date: Mon, 9 Sep 2013 17:42:22 -0500 Subject: [LAU] M/S EQ in Linux Message-ID: <20130909224222.GA10562@village.keycorner.org> I've been looking for a way to try mid/side EQ in Linux. The documentation for the Calf plugins implies they can (http://calf.sourceforge.net/plugins.html#filter), but never says how. Also, I don't see anything in the GUI that would allow you to toggle mid versus side versus whole mix. Are mid/side EQ tricks possible with the Calf plugins, or any other way on Linux? -- + Brent A. Busby + "We've all heard that a million monkeys + Sr. UNIX Systems Admin + banging on a million typewriters will + University of Chicago + eventually reproduce the entire works of + James Franck Institute + Shakespeare. Now, thanks to the Internet, + Materials Research Ctr + we know this is not true." -Robert Wilensky From jh at brainiac.com Mon Sep 9 22:51:15 2013 From: jh at brainiac.com (Joe Hartley) Date: Mon, 9 Sep 2013 18:51:15 -0400 Subject: [LAU] M/S EQ in Linux In-Reply-To: <20130909224222.GA10562@village.keycorner.org> References: <20130909224222.GA10562@village.keycorner.org> Message-ID: <20130909185115.755742468195ac1180d1f9bf@brainiac.com> On Mon, 9 Sep 2013 17:42:22 -0500 Brent Busby wrote: > I've been looking for a way to try mid/side EQ in Linux. The > Are mid/side EQ tricks possible with the Calf plugins, or any other way > on Linux? I found this not long ago: http://www.zthmusic.se/Tutorial_Sidechaining If you find out how to do it with Calf plugins, please let us know. -- ====================================================================== Joe Hartley - UNIX/network Consultant - jh at brainiac.com Without deviation from the norm, "progress" is not possible. - FZappa From kevinc at cosgroves.us Mon Sep 9 23:04:44 2013 From: kevinc at cosgroves.us (Kevin Cosgrove) Date: Mon, 09 Sep 2013 16:04:44 -0700 Subject: [LAU] M/S EQ in Linux In-Reply-To: <20130909185115.755742468195ac1180d1f9bf@brainiac.com> Message-ID: <20130909230444.7D187BE05B@joseph.cosgroves.us> On 9 September 2013 at 18:51, Joe Hartley wrote: > On Mon, 9 Sep 2013 17:42:22 -0500 > Brent Busby wrote: > > I've been looking for a way to try mid/side EQ in Linux. The > > Are mid/side EQ tricks possible with the Calf plugins, or any other way > > on Linux? > > I found this not long ago: http://www.zthmusic.se/Tutorial_Sidechaining > If you find out how to do it with Calf plugins, please let us know. Brent were you trying to set EQ for the center of the audio field in one way, and the sides of the audio field in another way? That's how I read your question. If I read that right, then side-chaining (applying an effect to thing one based on the content of thing two) is something different. But Joe, your link about side-chaining with Ardour is great. Thanks.... -- Kevin From jh at brainiac.com Mon Sep 9 23:08:26 2013 From: jh at brainiac.com (Joe Hartley) Date: Mon, 9 Sep 2013 19:08:26 -0400 Subject: [LAU] M/S EQ in Linux In-Reply-To: <20130909230444.7D187BE05B@joseph.cosgroves.us> References: <20130909185115.755742468195ac1180d1f9bf@brainiac.com> <20130909230444.7D187BE05B@joseph.cosgroves.us> Message-ID: <20130909190826.d862fc2463d5c1cfa4359d3e@brainiac.com> On Mon, 09 Sep 2013 16:04:44 -0700 Kevin Cosgrove wrote: > If I read that right, then side-chaining (applying an effect to thing > one based on the content of thing two) is something different. But > Joe, your link about side-chaining with Ardour is great. Indeed, I failed to note he said EQ, I went running with the sidechain compression article since it was still fresh in my mind from having read it again recently. -- ====================================================================== Joe Hartley - UNIX/network Consultant - jh at brainiac.com Without deviation from the norm, "progress" is not possible. - FZappa From malnourite at gmail.com Tue Sep 10 00:04:26 2013 From: malnourite at gmail.com (J. Liles) Date: Mon, 9 Sep 2013 17:04:26 -0700 Subject: [LAU] M/S EQ in Linux In-Reply-To: <20130909224222.GA10562@village.keycorner.org> References: <20130909224222.GA10562@village.keycorner.org> Message-ID: On Mon, Sep 9, 2013 at 3:42 PM, Brent Busby wrote: > I've been looking for a way to try mid/side EQ in Linux. The > documentation for the Calf plugins implies they can > (http://calf.sourceforge.net/plugins.html#filter), but never says how. > Also, I don't see anything in the GUI that would allow you to toggle mid > versus side versus whole mix. > > Are mid/side EQ tricks possible with the Calf plugins, or any other way > on Linux? > There is a LADSPA plugin to convert Stereo to M/S. Then you just run different EQ settings on each of the outputs before later combining them (this is trivial to setup in Non Mixer). However, watch out for using EQs with different internal latencies. Also, I would expect to end up with phase isues if not using a linear-phase EQ (the only one of which I am aware is the one in Jamin). But from what you're aiming to do in the first place, I imagine you don't really care that much about correctness. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From ralf.mardorf at alice-dsl.net Tue Sep 10 07:29:45 2013 From: ralf.mardorf at alice-dsl.net (Ralf Mardorf) Date: Tue, 10 Sep 2013 09:29:45 +0200 Subject: [LAU] M/S EQ in Linux In-Reply-To: <20130909224222.GA10562@village.keycorner.org> References: <20130909224222.GA10562@village.keycorner.org> Message-ID: <1378798185.2970.34.camel@archlinux> On Mon, 2013-09-09 at 17:42 -0500, Brent Busby wrote: > I've been looking for a way to try mid/side EQ in Linux. The > documentation for the Calf plugins implies they can > (http://calf.sourceforge.net/plugins.html#filter), but never says how. > Also, I don't see anything in the GUI that would allow you to toggle mid > versus side versus whole mix. > > Are mid/side EQ tricks possible with the Calf plugins, or any other way > on Linux? I had to read http://www.soundonsound.com/sos/mar11/articles/live-tech-0311.htm first, because I didn't know this "term". I would stay away from those fashion mixing techniques. If you split the signal that way and manipulate it using an EQ, it is asking for serious trouble. From ralf.mardorf at alice-dsl.net Tue Sep 10 08:09:41 2013 From: ralf.mardorf at alice-dsl.net (Ralf Mardorf) Date: Tue, 10 Sep 2013 10:09:41 +0200 Subject: [LAU] M/S EQ in Linux In-Reply-To: <1378798185.2970.34.camel@archlinux> References: <20130909224222.GA10562@village.keycorner.org> <1378798185.2970.34.camel@archlinux> Message-ID: <1378800581.2970.62.camel@archlinux> On Tue, 2013-09-10 at 09:29 +0200, Ralf Mardorf wrote: > On Mon, 2013-09-09 at 17:42 -0500, Brent Busby wrote: > > I've been looking for a way to try mid/side EQ in Linux. The > > documentation for the Calf plugins implies they can > > (http://calf.sourceforge.net/plugins.html#filter), but never says how. > > Also, I don't see anything in the GUI that would allow you to toggle mid > > versus side versus whole mix. > > > > Are mid/side EQ tricks possible with the Calf plugins, or any other way > > on Linux? > > I had to read > http://www.soundonsound.com/sos/mar11/articles/live-tech-0311.htm first, > because I didn't know this "term". > > I would stay away from those fashion mixing techniques. If you split the > signal that way and manipulate it using an EQ, it is asking for serious > trouble. PS: You won't run that easy into issues, when you use different EQ settings for the channels of "normal" stereo signals, but even this only makes sense as an exception. IMO people should _learn_ to use EQs that effect the signal for the left and right channel by the same values. _Lerning_ how to use an EQ in many cases can replace all kinds of dynamic manipulating effects and then a good stereo mix can be done by using "normal" panning. From nettings at stackingdwarves.net Tue Sep 10 10:15:44 2013 From: nettings at stackingdwarves.net (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?J=F6rn_Nettingsmeier?=) Date: Tue, 10 Sep 2013 12:15:44 +0200 Subject: [LAU] M/S EQ in Linux In-Reply-To: <20130909224222.GA10562@village.keycorner.org> References: <20130909224222.GA10562@village.keycorner.org> Message-ID: <522EF150.1050409@stackingdwarves.net> On 09/10/2013 12:42 AM, Brent Busby wrote: > I've been looking for a way to try mid/side EQ in Linux. The > documentation for the Calf plugins implies they can > (http://calf.sourceforge.net/plugins.html#filter), but never says how. > Also, I don't see anything in the GUI that would allow you to toggle mid > versus side versus whole mix. > > Are mid/side EQ tricks possible with the Calf plugins, or any other way > on Linux? insert the stereo-to-ms plugin from swh in your original stereo bus. feed the result into two buses M and S. insert processing as required, collect them in another 2 channel bus and re-matrix them with the ms-to-stereo plugin. it's a bit involved to do it like this. but look at it this way: while you're setting it up, you get some free time to reflect whether MS processing is really worth it :) it should be noted that any form of MS processing only makes sense in complex stereo signals with some degree of decorrelation. it can be a great tool for mastering if you don't have the original stems (if you do, fix the problem upstream!), and it allows some control over the direct vs. diffuse field image of stereo microphone pairs. for anything else (like pan-potted mono sources), it does not buy you anything at all. -- J?rn Nettingsmeier Lortzingstr. 11, 45128 Essen, Tel. +49 177 7937487 Meister f?r Veranstaltungstechnik (B?hne/Studio) Tonmeister VDT http://stackingdwarves.net From Mathias.Krause at xse.de Tue Sep 10 11:59:28 2013 From: Mathias.Krause at xse.de (Krause, Mathias) Date: Tue, 10 Sep 2013 11:59:28 +0000 Subject: [LAU] pro gear that runs embedded linux... In-Reply-To: <1378636140.721.2.camel@archlinux> References: <5228CA4F.9040907@stackingdwarves.net> <1378636140.721.2.camel@archlinux> Message-ID: <74BB536895EF064DB2A9580AD0E95B752CE73024@XSRWWSEX01.xse.local> BTW: Electro-Voice's N8000 is also running a uClinux as host system. Regards, Mathias > -----Original Message----- > From: linux-audio-user-bounces at lists.linuxaudio.org [mailto:linux- > audio-user-bounces at lists.linuxaudio.org] On Behalf Of Ralf Mardorf > Sent: Sunday, September 08, 2013 12:29 PM > To: linux-audio-user at lists.linuxaudio.org > Subject: Re: [LAU] pro gear that runs embedded linux... > > On Sat, 2013-09-07 at 22:15 +0300, Moshe Werner wrote: > > When last year the Israeli parliament published the official > > requirements for the new FOH system in the plenum, it stated that no > > Microsoft driven console would be allowed:) > > Was the reason the technical quality of Microsoft based products, > economy or the fear that some kind of spy on would be possible? > > > _______________________________________________ > Linux-audio-user mailing list > Linux-audio-user at lists.linuxaudio.org > http://lists.linuxaudio.org/listinfo/linux-audio-user > From fons at linuxaudio.org Tue Sep 10 21:38:13 2013 From: fons at linuxaudio.org (Fons Adriaensen) Date: Tue, 10 Sep 2013 21:38:13 +0000 Subject: [LAU] M/S EQ in Linux In-Reply-To: <1378798185.2970.34.camel@archlinux> References: <20130909224222.GA10562@village.keycorner.org> <1378798185.2970.34.camel@archlinux> Message-ID: <20130910213813.GA9727@linuxaudio.org> On Tue, Sep 10, 2013 at 09:29:45AM +0200, Ralf Mardorf wrote: > I would stay away from those fashion mixing techniques. If you split the > signal that way and manipulate it using an EQ, it is asking for serious > trouble. MS is not a 'fashion mixing technique'. It's a rather fundamental way to represent a stereo signal, and one that has some unique advantages. Of course, like everything else, you can make a mess of it if you really want. Ciao, -- FA A world of exhaustive, reliable metadata would be an utopia. It's also a pipe-dream, founded on self-delusion, nerd hubris and hysterically inflated market opportunities. (Cory Doctorow) From malnourite at gmail.com Tue Sep 10 21:43:37 2013 From: malnourite at gmail.com (J. Liles) Date: Tue, 10 Sep 2013 14:43:37 -0700 Subject: [LAU] M/S EQ in Linux In-Reply-To: References: <20130909224222.GA10562@village.keycorner.org> Message-ID: On Mon, Sep 9, 2013 at 5:04 PM, J. Liles wrote: > > > > On Mon, Sep 9, 2013 at 3:42 PM, Brent Busby wrote: > >> I've been looking for a way to try mid/side EQ in Linux. The >> documentation for the Calf plugins implies they can >> (http://calf.sourceforge.net/plugins.html#filter), but never says how. >> Also, I don't see anything in the GUI that would allow you to toggle mid >> versus side versus whole mix. >> >> Are mid/side EQ tricks possible with the Calf plugins, or any other way >> on Linux? >> > > There is a LADSPA plugin to convert Stereo to M/S. Then you just run > different EQ settings on each of the outputs before later combining them > (this is trivial to setup in Non Mixer). However, watch out for using EQs > with different internal latencies. Also, I would expect to end up with > phase isues if not using a linear-phase EQ (the only one of which I am > aware is the one in Jamin). But from what you're aiming to do in the first > place, I imagine you don't really care that much about correctness. > BTW upon further review, I think the Multiband EQ from SWH LADSPA plugin suite is linear phase--you'd only have to watch out for the latency it introduces (which wouldn't be a problem if you used an instance each for M and S). -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From fons at linuxaudio.org Tue Sep 10 22:21:29 2013 From: fons at linuxaudio.org (Fons Adriaensen) Date: Tue, 10 Sep 2013 22:21:29 +0000 Subject: [LAU] M/S EQ in Linux In-Reply-To: References: <20130909224222.GA10562@village.keycorner.org> Message-ID: <20130910222129.GB9727@linuxaudio.org> On Tue, Sep 10, 2013 at 02:43:37PM -0700, J. Liles wrote: > BTW upon further review, I think the Multiband EQ from SWH LADSPA plugin > suite is linear phase--you'd only have to watch out for the latency it > introduces (which wouldn't be a problem if you used an instance each for M > and S). There is really no reason at all to think that linear phase EQ would provide any advantage or be required. Almost all physical processes that modify a frequency response (e.g. resonances) are minimum-phase, not linear phase. The minimum phase response is in a sense 'natural', it's the one that requires the least internal state and it can be the result of a very simple physical process. This is the reason why sounds that have a fast attack and an exponential decay (a 'ping', min-phase) occur much more easily that those that do the inverse (a 'gnip', max-phase) or have a symmetrical envelope ('gnipping', linear phase). Ciao, -- FA A world of exhaustive, reliable metadata would be an utopia. It's also a pipe-dream, founded on self-delusion, nerd hubris and hysterically inflated market opportunities. (Cory Doctorow) From rustys.lists at gmail.com Tue Sep 10 22:46:09 2013 From: rustys.lists at gmail.com (Rusty Perez) Date: Tue, 10 Sep 2013 15:46:09 -0700 Subject: [LAU] timing issues when using ladspa plugin 1769 click Message-ID: Hi guys, I'm using plugin 1769 in Nama, based on ecasound. Here's the scenario. I'm recording one track. When I begin recording, the click starts right on queue. I play along with the click. But, upon playback, when I press play, the click clicks repeetedly several times as the playback fades up and my recorded performance is no longer in sync with the click. Again, to reiterate, when I record, the click starts as I start the recording engine, but upon playback, the click sortof studders as the playback fades up, and then the click is no in sync with my recording. Thoughts? Thanks! Rusty From ralf.mardorf at alice-dsl.net Tue Sep 10 23:46:46 2013 From: ralf.mardorf at alice-dsl.net (Ralf Mardorf) Date: Wed, 11 Sep 2013 01:46:46 +0200 Subject: [LAU] M/S EQ in Linux In-Reply-To: <20130910213813.GA9727@linuxaudio.org> References: <20130909224222.GA10562@village.keycorner.org> <1378798185.2970.34.camel@archlinux> <20130910213813.GA9727@linuxaudio.org> Message-ID: <1378856806.1938.5.camel@archlinux> On Tue, 2013-09-10 at 21:38 +0000, Fons Adriaensen wrote: > MS is not a 'fashion mixing technique'. MS for microphony makes sense and I didn't call this a 'fashion mixing technique', I was talking about "mid/side EQ". I never heard the term "mid/side EQ" before and I've got doubts, that it's a useful mixing technique. From brent at keycorner.org Wed Sep 11 03:58:50 2013 From: brent at keycorner.org (Brent Busby) Date: Tue, 10 Sep 2013 22:58:50 -0500 (CDT) Subject: [LAU] M/S EQ in Linux In-Reply-To: <1378856806.1938.5.camel@archlinux> References: <20130909224222.GA10562@village.keycorner.org> <1378798185.2970.34.camel@archlinux> <20130910213813.GA9727@linuxaudio.org> <1378856806.1938.5.camel@archlinux> Message-ID: On Wed, 11 Sep 2013, Ralf Mardorf wrote: > On Tue, 2013-09-10 at 21:38 +0000, Fons Adriaensen wrote: >> MS is not a 'fashion mixing technique'. > > MS for microphony makes sense and I didn't call this a 'fashion mixing > technique', I was talking about "mid/side EQ". I never heard the term > "mid/side EQ" before and I've got doubts, that it's a useful mixing > technique. For all the appreciated criticisms of M/S EQ, I'm really just starting to learn about mastering, so I'm trying lots of things. Up until lately, my mixes have been simple enough that it hasn't been that difficult to get them to translate across different speaker systems, but lately, I have been creating some very complicated mixes that are offering me an opportunity to expand my mastering knowledge. So I'm experimenting...and learning a lot of things that are new to me. One of the things I've been disovering is that actually, the EQ that sounds right to me doesn't seem to be the problem. I've found that there are commercial mixes out there that are both colder than mine, and some from the 70's that are warmer than mine, and they all translate somehow. So EQ curve is probably not the problem either way. It seems more related to compression and limiting -- my newer mixes have lots of transients all over the place, which sound great on speakers that render them well. But some stereos seem to have woofers/subwoofers that only get engaged when there's a fair amount of power, which means that if you don't turn the volume up, it creates the impression that the EQ is mostly high mids and treble. If you turn up the volume, the "problem" disappears as the woofers begin to engage. Commercially recorded music doesn't do this on the same stereo. On other speaker systems, my mix never manifests a problem at any volume setting. This all seems to be about dynamics. I am already using some compression and limiting, but obviously I haven't nailed it yet. I'm wondering if the Calf multiband limiter and/or multiband compressor may be useful here. Obviously, I don't want to squash the life out of my mix, but I do want to get its transients tamed enough that they'll survive playback across lots of kinds of speakers. -- + Brent A. Busby + "We've all heard that a million monkeys + Sr. UNIX Systems Admin + banging on a million typewriters will + University of Chicago + eventually reproduce the entire works of + James Franck Institute + Shakespeare. Now, thanks to the Internet, + Materials Research Ctr + we know this is not true." -Robert Wilensky From malnourite at gmail.com Wed Sep 11 07:30:51 2013 From: malnourite at gmail.com (J. Liles) Date: Wed, 11 Sep 2013 00:30:51 -0700 Subject: [LAU] M/S EQ in Linux In-Reply-To: References: <20130909224222.GA10562@village.keycorner.org> <1378798185.2970.34.camel@archlinux> <20130910213813.GA9727@linuxaudio.org> <1378856806.1938.5.camel@archlinux> Message-ID: On Tue, Sep 10, 2013 at 8:58 PM, Brent Busby wrote: > On Wed, 11 Sep 2013, Ralf Mardorf wrote: > > On Tue, 2013-09-10 at 21:38 +0000, Fons Adriaensen wrote: >> >>> MS is not a 'fashion mixing technique'. >>> >> >> MS for microphony makes sense and I didn't call this a 'fashion mixing >> technique', I was talking about "mid/side EQ". I never heard the term >> "mid/side EQ" before and I've got doubts, that it's a useful mixing >> technique. >> > > For all the appreciated criticisms of M/S EQ, I'm really just starting to > learn about mastering, so I'm trying lots of things. Up until lately, my > mixes have been simple enough that it hasn't been that difficult to get > them to translate across different speaker systems, but lately, I have been > creating some very complicated mixes that are offering me an opportunity to > expand my mastering knowledge. So I'm experimenting...and learning a lot > of things that are new to me. > > One of the things I've been disovering is that actually, the EQ that > sounds right to me doesn't seem to be the problem. I've found that there > are commercial mixes out there that are both colder than mine, and some > from the 70's that are warmer than mine, and they all translate somehow. > So EQ curve is probably not the problem either way. It seems more related > to compression and limiting -- my newer mixes have lots of transients all > over the place, which sound great on speakers that render them well. > > But some stereos seem to have woofers/subwoofers that only get engaged > when there's a fair amount of power, which means that if you don't turn the > volume up, it creates the impression that the EQ is mostly high mids and > treble. If you turn up the volume, the "problem" disappears as the woofers > begin to engage. Commercially recorded music doesn't do this on the same > stereo. On other speaker systems, my mix never manifests a problem at any > volume setting. This all seems to be about dynamics. > > I am already using some compression and limiting, but obviously I haven't > nailed it yet. I'm wondering if the Calf multiband limiter and/or > multiband compressor may be useful here. Obviously, I don't want to squash > the life out of my mix, but I do want to get its transients tamed enough > that they'll survive playback across lots of kinds of speakers. > > In that case it does sound like mutliband compression is what you're looking for. You should definitely at least try Jamin, the idea is that it includes everything you need for mastering. *However*, this only applies if you're stuck with a stereo 'print'. If you have access to the pre-mix, better results will be obtained by applying compression/limiting or other remedies to the problem instruments on an individual basis. Commerically recorded music is criminally overcompressed, BTW, so I wouldn't use that as a measure of quality--unless you're trying to be the next pop star and/or appeal to prematurely deaf 12 year olds. The rest of us appreciate dynamics. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From mista.tapas at gmx.net Wed Sep 11 07:40:15 2013 From: mista.tapas at gmx.net (Florian Paul Schmidt) Date: Wed, 11 Sep 2013 09:40:15 +0200 Subject: [LAU] timing issues when using ladspa plugin 1769 click In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <52301E5F.90007@gmx.net> On 11.09.2013 00:46, Rusty Perez wrote: > Hi guys, > I'm using plugin 1769 in Nama, based on ecasound. > Here's the scenario. > I'm recording one track. > When I begin recording, the click starts right on queue. I play along > with the click. > But, upon playback, when I press play, the click clicks repeetedly > several times as the playback fades up and my recorded performance is > no longer in sync with the click. > > Again, to reiterate, when I record, the click starts as I start the > recording engine, but upon playback, the click sortof studders as the > playback fades up, and then the click is no in sync with my recording. > > Thoughts? Guessing: The LADSPA plugin has no information about the playback position. When you load a session (or instantiate the plugin) playback position at start it produces its first click right away once playback starts and its run function is called for the first time. Now run the plugin for some amount of time. It will internally always advance time, never taking into account how the playback position changes when you relocate. Flo > Thanks! > Rusty > _______________________________________________ > Linux-audio-user mailing list > Linux-audio-user at lists.linuxaudio.org > http://lists.linuxaudio.org/listinfo/linux-audio-user From devel at thesaddj.com Wed Sep 11 08:52:49 2013 From: devel at thesaddj.com (Marco Donnarumma) Date: Wed, 11 Sep 2013 10:52:49 +0200 Subject: [LAU] options for hard real time kernel for raring 13.04 Message-ID: Hey all, I just switched to Mint Olivia 15 (based on Ubuntu Raring 13.04). I use quite cpu-intensive puredata patches with processing of 2 live audio inputs on a firewire soundcard through ffado and qjackctl (jack2). Although my machine runs a low-latency kernel and it has been configured for pro audio (I use the realtimeConfigurationScan script), I still get xruns and sometimes qjackctl randomly hangs up making the sound to stop completely. Before, I used to work with ubuntu 10.04 and rt-kernel without a itch. Is anybody still using a rt-kernel with the latest Mint or Ubuntu, or just refining settings etc..? if a rt-kernel is the best option, should I patch mine, since it looks like there are no packaged rt-kernels for Raring? Can't access Abogani ppa, and KXS kernels are available up to Precise. thanks in advance for any hint, or suggestions about what to try! best wishes, -- Marco Donnarumma New Media + Sonic Arts Practitioner, Performer, Teacher, Director. Embodied Audio-Visual Interaction Research Team. Department of Computing, Goldsmiths University of London ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Portfolio: http://marcodonnarumma.com Research: http://res.marcodonnarumma.com Director: http://www.liveperformersmeeting.net -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jeremy at autostatic.com Wed Sep 11 09:08:17 2013 From: jeremy at autostatic.com (Jeremy Jongepier) Date: Wed, 11 Sep 2013 11:08:17 +0200 Subject: [LAU] options for hard real time kernel for raring 13.04 In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <52303301.7000804@autostatic.com> On 09/11/2013 10:52 AM, Marco Donnarumma wrote: > Hey all, > > I just switched to Mint Olivia 15 (based on Ubuntu Raring 13.04). I use > quite cpu-intensive puredata patches with processing of 2 live audio inputs > on a firewire soundcard through ffado and qjackctl (jack2). > > Although my machine runs a low-latency kernel and it has been configured > for pro audio (I use the realtimeConfigurationScan script), I still get > xruns and sometimes qjackctl randomly hangs up making the sound to stop > completely. > > Before, I used to work with ubuntu 10.04 and rt-kernel without a itch. Is > anybody still using a rt-kernel with the latest Mint or Ubuntu, or just > refining settings etc..? > > if a rt-kernel is the best option, should I patch mine, since it looks like > there are no packaged rt-kernels for Raring? > Can't access Abogani ppa, and KXS kernels are available up to Precise. > > thanks in advance for any hint, or suggestions about what to try! > best wishes, > > -- > Marco Donnarumma > New Media + Sonic Arts Practitioner, Performer, Teacher, Director. > Embodied Audio-Visual Interaction Research Team. > Department of Computing, Goldsmiths University of London > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > Portfolio: http://marcodonnarumma.com > Research: http://res.marcodonnarumma.com > Director: http://www.liveperformersmeeting.net Hi Marco, Did you consider building your own kernel? I'm using self-built RT kernels on Ubuntu 12.04 and that works great: http://wiki.linuxaudio.org/wiki/system_configuration#build_your_own_real-time_kernel And are you using rtirq? Alessio Abogani stopped maintaining th RT kernels for Ubuntu quite a while ago. You might want to ask falkTX about the possibilities of offering a raring RT kernel. Best, Jeremy -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 836 bytes Desc: OpenPGP digital signature URL: From raffaele.morelli at gmail.com Wed Sep 11 09:50:37 2013 From: raffaele.morelli at gmail.com (Raffaele Morelli) Date: Wed, 11 Sep 2013 11:50:37 +0200 Subject: [LAU] options for hard real time kernel for raring 13.04 In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: 2013/9/11 Marco Donnarumma > Hey all, > > I just switched to Mint Olivia 15 (based on Ubuntu Raring 13.04). I use > quite cpu-intensive puredata patches with processing of 2 live audio inputs > on a firewire soundcard through ffado and qjackctl (jack2). > > Although my machine runs a low-latency kernel and it has been configured > for pro audio (I use the realtimeConfigurationScan script), I still get > xruns and sometimes qjackctl randomly hangs up making the sound to stop > completely. > > Before, I used to work with ubuntu 10.04 and rt-kernel without a itch. Is > anybody still using a rt-kernel with the latest Mint or Ubuntu, or just > refining settings etc..? > > if a rt-kernel is the best option, should I patch mine, since it looks > like there are no packaged rt-kernels for Raring? > Can't access Abogani ppa, and KXS kernels are available up to Precise. > > thanks in advance for any hint, or suggestions about what to try! > best wishes > compiling a RT kernel is quite straightforward, BTW you can install a debian rt kernel: http://packages.debian.org/jessie/linux-image-rt-amd64 /r -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From nicola.di.marzo at vodafone.it Wed Sep 11 10:17:58 2013 From: nicola.di.marzo at vodafone.it (Nicola) Date: Wed, 11 Sep 2013 11:17:58 +0100 Subject: [LAU] options for hard real time kernel for raring 13.04 In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <52304356.9070600@vodafone.it> On 11/09/13 10:50, Raffaele Morelli wrote: > 2013/9/11 Marco Donnarumma > > > Hey all, > > I just switched to Mint Olivia 15 (based on Ubuntu Raring 13.04). > I use quite cpu-intensive puredata patches with processing of 2 > live audio inputs on a firewire soundcard through ffado and > qjackctl (jack2). > > Although my machine runs a low-latency kernel and it has been > configured for pro audio (I use the realtimeConfigurationScan > script), I still get xruns and sometimes qjackctl randomly hangs > up making the sound to stop completely. > > Before, I used to work with ubuntu 10.04 and rt-kernel without a > itch. Is anybody still using a rt-kernel with the latest Mint or > Ubuntu, or just refining settings etc..? > > if a rt-kernel is the best option, should I patch mine, since it > looks like there are no packaged rt-kernels for Raring? > Can't access Abogani ppa, and KXS kernels are available up to Precise. > > thanks in advance for any hint, or suggestions about what to try! > best wishes > Hi Marco, I recompiled a real time kernel for 13.04 following the system configuration guide (in this case the italian translation that reports "3.2.35-rt52"). http://linuxaudio.it/index.php/Configurazione_di_sistemi_audio_GNU/Linux#Compilare_il_tuo_real-time_kernel I'm using an hp pavilion 6 laptop with the ua-25 ex soundcard and with this particular real time Kernel everything works fine. 1 xrun discovered at 5,8 ms latency in 3 hours session, recording and mixing with Ardour. Best regards Nicola > > compiling a RT kernel is quite straightforward, BTW you can install a > debian rt kernel: http://packages.debian.org/jessie/linux-image-rt-amd64 > > /r > > > > _______________________________________________ > Linux-audio-user mailing list > Linux-audio-user at lists.linuxaudio.org > http://lists.linuxaudio.org/listinfo/linux-audio-user -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From countfuzzball at gmail.com Wed Sep 11 10:22:56 2013 From: countfuzzball at gmail.com (Andrew C) Date: Wed, 11 Sep 2013 11:22:56 +0100 Subject: [LAU] OT: Terrible open source definition Message-ID: Entirely OT, but I had a lecture at Uni yesterday and the first slide was talking about Eclipse and how it's 'open source, so it means it's free to use for both commercial and non-commercial purposes'. Needless to say, I cringed at the "definition". We now return you to your regularly scheduled linux audio related discussions. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From emiliano.grilli at gmail.com Wed Sep 11 10:26:13 2013 From: emiliano.grilli at gmail.com (Emiliano Grilli) Date: Wed, 11 Sep 2013 12:26:13 +0200 Subject: [LAU] options for hard real time kernel for raring 13.04 In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: It may sound obvious, but: did you checked that your are using the "performance" governor for cpu frequency scaling? I found that using the "ondemand" governor can cause more xruns... I don't know mint but there should be a cpufreq-utils package that provides relevant utilities for this. HTH Ciao Il giorno 11/set/2013 10:53, "Marco Donnarumma" ha scritto: > Hey all, > > I just switched to Mint Olivia 15 (based on Ubuntu Raring 13.04). I use > quite cpu-intensive puredata patches with processing of 2 live audio inputs > on a firewire soundcard through ffado and qjackctl (jack2). > > Although my machine runs a low-latency kernel and it has been configured > for pro audio (I use the realtimeConfigurationScan script), I still get > xruns and sometimes qjackctl randomly hangs up making the sound to stop > completely. > > Before, I used to work with ubuntu 10.04 and rt-kernel without a itch. Is > anybody still using a rt-kernel with the latest Mint or Ubuntu, or just > refining settings etc..? > > if a rt-kernel is the best option, should I patch mine, since it looks > like there are no packaged rt-kernels for Raring? > Can't access Abogani ppa, and KXS kernels are available up to Precise. > > thanks in advance for any hint, or suggestions about what to try! > best wishes, > > -- > Marco Donnarumma > New Media + Sonic Arts Practitioner, Performer, Teacher, Director. > Embodied Audio-Visual Interaction Research Team. > Department of Computing, Goldsmiths University of London > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > Portfolio: http://marcodonnarumma.com > Research: http://res.marcodonnarumma.com > Director: http://www.liveperformersmeeting.net > > _______________________________________________ > Linux-audio-user mailing list > Linux-audio-user at lists.linuxaudio.org > http://lists.linuxaudio.org/listinfo/linux-audio-user > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From devel at thesaddj.com Wed Sep 11 11:52:51 2013 From: devel at thesaddj.com (Marco Donnarumma) Date: Wed, 11 Sep 2013 13:52:51 +0200 Subject: [LAU] options for hard real time kernel for raring 13.04 In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Thanks guys! @Raffaele: that's great, didn't know there were more recent rt-kernels for debian. I have a 32bit machine, so I'm going to try this one: http://packages.debian.org/jessie/linux-image-3.10-2-rt-686-pae I have an nvidia driver (sigh), I guess it's likely that rt-kernel is not going to like it. I read I could patch some nvidia stuff into the rt-kernel, but that's another story. I'll try this first. @Emiliano: yes, I do set the governor to "performance" when I need it. I also wondered, maybe it could also be a faulty firewire cable causing the random freeze? Is the D-Bus enabled an annoyance to low-latency processes? thanks again, cheers, M -- Marco Donnarumma New Media + Sonic Arts Practitioner, Performer, Teacher, Director. Embodied Audio-Visual Interaction Research Team. Department of Computing, Goldsmiths University of London ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Portfolio: http://marcodonnarumma.com Research: http://res.marcodonnarumma.com Director: http://www.liveperformersmeeting.net On Wed, Sep 11, 2013 at 12:26 PM, Emiliano Grilli wrote: > It may sound obvious, but: did you checked that your are using the > "performance" governor for cpu frequency scaling? > > I found that using the "ondemand" governor can cause more xruns... > > I don't know mint but there should be a cpufreq-utils package that > provides relevant utilities for this. > > HTH > Ciao > Il giorno 11/set/2013 10:53, "Marco Donnarumma" ha > scritto: > >> Hey all, >> >> I just switched to Mint Olivia 15 (based on Ubuntu Raring 13.04). I use >> quite cpu-intensive puredata patches with processing of 2 live audio inputs >> on a firewire soundcard through ffado and qjackctl (jack2). >> >> Although my machine runs a low-latency kernel and it has been configured >> for pro audio (I use the realtimeConfigurationScan script), I still get >> xruns and sometimes qjackctl randomly hangs up making the sound to stop >> completely. >> >> Before, I used to work with ubuntu 10.04 and rt-kernel without a itch. Is >> anybody still using a rt-kernel with the latest Mint or Ubuntu, or just >> refining settings etc..? >> >> if a rt-kernel is the best option, should I patch mine, since it looks >> like there are no packaged rt-kernels for Raring? >> Can't access Abogani ppa, and KXS kernels are available up to Precise. >> >> thanks in advance for any hint, or suggestions about what to try! >> best wishes, >> >> -- >> Marco Donnarumma >> New Media + Sonic Arts Practitioner, Performer, Teacher, Director. >> Embodied Audio-Visual Interaction Research Team. >> Department of Computing, Goldsmiths University of London >> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ >> Portfolio: http://marcodonnarumma.com >> Research: http://res.marcodonnarumma.com >> Director: http://www.liveperformersmeeting.net >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Linux-audio-user mailing list >> Linux-audio-user at lists.linuxaudio.org >> http://lists.linuxaudio.org/listinfo/linux-audio-user >> >> -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From devel at thesaddj.com Wed Sep 11 12:02:12 2013 From: devel at thesaddj.com (Marco Donnarumma) Date: Wed, 11 Sep 2013 14:02:12 +0200 Subject: [LAU] options for hard real time kernel for raring 13.04 Message-ID: > > Did you consider building your own kernel? I'm using self-built RT > kernels on Ubuntu 12.04 and that works great: > > http://wiki.linuxaudio.org/wiki/system_configuration#build_your_own_real-time_kernel > And are you using rtirq? > Alessio Abogani stopped maintaining th RT kernels for Ubuntu quite a > while ago. You might want to ask falkTX about the possibilities of > offering a raring RT kernel. > > Best, > > Jeremy > > Hey Jeremy! Yes, that's the other thing I will try now, good to know it works on 12.04. My pain in the a... is that I have to use nvidia drivers, and had troubles some time ago with them and rt-kernels. Do you happen to know whether I need to patch nvidia support into the rt-kernel I build? (I guess so... just to be sure) thanks! best, M -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jeremy at autostatic.com Wed Sep 11 12:38:37 2013 From: jeremy at autostatic.com (Jeremy Jongepier) Date: Wed, 11 Sep 2013 14:38:37 +0200 Subject: [LAU] options for hard real time kernel for raring 13.04 In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <5230644D.2020302@autostatic.com> On 09/11/2013 02:02 PM, Marco Donnarumma wrote: > Hey Jeremy! > > Yes, that's the other thing I will try now, good to know it works on 12.04. > > My pain in the a... is that I have to use nvidia drivers, and had troubles > some time ago with them and rt-kernels. > > Do you happen to know whether I need to patch nvidia support into the > rt-kernel I build? (I guess so... just to be sure) > > thanks! > best, > M > Hello Marco, I'm using it with the proprietary Nvidia drivers because of http://askubuntu.com/questions/232439/lubuntu-12-04-unresponsive-windows-with-certain-applications You can find a patch here: https://raw.github.com/AutoStatic/nvidia-rt/master/patch-3.0-rt-nvidia.patch Iirc it applies cleanly to 3.2 too. Not sure about newer kernel versions. Best, Jeremy -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 836 bytes Desc: OpenPGP digital signature URL: From murks at tuxfamily.org Wed Sep 11 13:16:02 2013 From: murks at tuxfamily.org (Philipp =?UTF-8?B?w5xiZXJiYWNoZXI=?=) Date: Wed, 11 Sep 2013 15:16:02 +0200 Subject: [LAU] OT: Terrible open source definition In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20130911151602.2118e6b6@eeyore.mozart.uni-klu.ac.at> On Wed, 11 Sep 2013 11:22:56 +0100 Andrew C wrote: > Entirely OT, but I had a lecture at Uni yesterday and the first slide > was talking about Eclipse and how it's 'open source, so it means it's > free to use for both commercial and non-commercial purposes'. > Needless to say, I cringed at the "definition". > > We now return you to your regularly scheduled linux audio > related discussions. I hope you gave your lecturer and the audience a proper lecture. Regards, Philipp From raffaele.morelli at gmail.com Wed Sep 11 13:30:48 2013 From: raffaele.morelli at gmail.com (Raffaele Morelli) Date: Wed, 11 Sep 2013 15:30:48 +0200 Subject: [LAU] options for hard real time kernel for raring 13.04 In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: 2013/9/11 Marco Donnarumma > Thanks guys! > > @Raffaele: that's great, didn't know there were more recent rt-kernels for > debian. I have a 32bit machine, so I'm going to try this one: > http://packages.debian.org/jessie/linux-image-3.10-2-rt-686-pae > > I have an nvidia driver (sigh), I guess it's likely that rt-kernel is not > going to like it. I read I could patch some nvidia stuff into the > rt-kernel, but that's another story. I'll try this first > You can use dkms to compile nvidia kernel stuff, there's an nvidia-kernel-3.10-2-686-pae package /r -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From devel at thesaddj.com Wed Sep 11 14:46:10 2013 From: devel at thesaddj.com (Marco Donnarumma) Date: Wed, 11 Sep 2013 16:46:10 +0200 Subject: [LAU] options for hard real time kernel for raring 13.04 In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: update: 1_ tried to install 3.10-2-rt-686-pae_3.10.7-1_i386.deb from http://packages.debian.org/jessie/linux-image-3.10-2-rt-686-pae, but it didn't like my initramfs-tools version (apparently too old for the new kernel) and installed without configuration so had to remove. See log: dpkg: dependency problems prevent configuration of initramfs-tools: linux-image-3.10-2-rt-686-pae (3.10.7-1) breaks initramfs-tools (<< 0.110~) and is unpacked but not configured. Version of initramfs-tools to be configured is 0.103ubuntu0.7. 2_ my low-latency kernel is 3.8.0*. I compiled my own rt-kernel, using http://www.kernel.org/pub/linux/kernel/v3.x/linux-3.2.48.tar.bz2 and its related rt patch, as in the tutorial that Jeremy posted. The kernel compiles and installs fine, but when I load it from grub, Mint load correctly, and then (before seeing anything on screen) my screen goes black. Nothing to do there, tried to use hotkeys to get a tty, restart, or shutdown, but had only to push the power button. It's probably an nvidia driver-related issue, am I correct? Found some suggestions about patching the nvidia driver with some custom code here [1], but the driver they use there is quite old. And last time I had fiddled with nvidia driver it was the most painful experience ever... :) Will investigate further, please throw me suggestions if any, I might ask falkTX how he sees the rt-kernel for 13.04. I saw there is some working on Launchpad, but they are last modified sept. 2012 (?). thank you! best, M [1] -- Marco Donnarumma New Media + Sonic Arts Practitioner, Performer, Teacher, Director. Embodied Audio-Visual Interaction Research Team. Department of Computing, Goldsmiths University of London ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Portfolio: http://marcodonnarumma.com Research: http://res.marcodonnarumma.com Director: http://www.liveperformersmeeting.net On Wed, Sep 11, 2013 at 2:02 PM, Marco Donnarumma wrote: > Did you consider building your own kernel? I'm using self-built RT >> kernels on Ubuntu 12.04 and that works great: >> >> http://wiki.linuxaudio.org/wiki/system_configuration#build_your_own_real-time_kernel >> And are you using rtirq? >> Alessio Abogani stopped maintaining th RT kernels for Ubuntu quite a >> while ago. You might want to ask falkTX about the possibilities of >> offering a raring RT kernel. >> >> Best, >> >> Jeremy >> >> > Hey Jeremy! > > Yes, that's the other thing I will try now, good to know it works on 12.04. > > My pain in the a... is that I have to use nvidia drivers, and had troubles > some time ago with them and rt-kernels. > > Do you happen to know whether I need to patch nvidia support into the > rt-kernel I build? (I guess so... just to be sure) > > thanks! > best, > M > > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From devel at thesaddj.com Wed Sep 11 14:47:59 2013 From: devel at thesaddj.com (Marco Donnarumma) Date: Wed, 11 Sep 2013 16:47:59 +0200 Subject: [LAU] options for hard real time kernel for raring 13.04 In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: sorry, had forgot the link, see the 4th reply at http://askubuntu.com/questions/72964/how-can-i-install-a-realtime-kernel -- Marco Donnarumma New Media + Sonic Arts Practitioner, Performer, Teacher, Director. Embodied Audio-Visual Interaction Research Team. Department of Computing, Goldsmiths University of London ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Portfolio: http://marcodonnarumma.com Research: http://res.marcodonnarumma.com Director: http://www.liveperformersmeeting.net On Wed, Sep 11, 2013 at 4:46 PM, Marco Donnarumma wrote: > update: > > 1_ tried to install 3.10-2-rt-686-pae_3.10.7-1_i386.deb from > http://packages.debian.org/jessie/linux-image-3.10-2-rt-686-pae, but it > didn't like my initramfs-tools version (apparently too old for the new > kernel) and installed without configuration so had to remove. See log: > > dpkg: dependency problems prevent configuration of initramfs-tools: > linux-image-3.10-2-rt-686-pae (3.10.7-1) breaks initramfs-tools (<< > 0.110~) and is unpacked but not configured. > Version of initramfs-tools to be configured is 0.103ubuntu0.7. > > 2_ my low-latency kernel is 3.8.0*. I compiled my own rt-kernel, using > http://www.kernel.org/pub/linux/kernel/v3.x/linux-3.2.48.tar.bz2 and its > related rt patch, as in the tutorial that Jeremy posted. The kernel > compiles and installs fine, but when I load it from grub, Mint load > correctly, and then (before seeing anything on screen) my screen goes > black. Nothing to do there, tried to use hotkeys to get a tty, restart, or > shutdown, but had only to push the power button. > > It's probably an nvidia driver-related issue, am I correct? > > Found some suggestions about patching the nvidia driver with some custom > code here [1], but the driver they use there is quite old. And last time I > had fiddled with nvidia driver it was the most painful experience ever... :) > > Will investigate further, please throw me suggestions if any, > > I might ask falkTX how he sees the rt-kernel for 13.04. I saw there is > some working on Launchpad, but they are last modified sept. 2012 (?). > > thank you! > best, > M > > [1] > > > > -- > Marco Donnarumma > New Media + Sonic Arts Practitioner, Performer, Teacher, Director. > Embodied Audio-Visual Interaction Research Team. > Department of Computing, Goldsmiths University of London > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > Portfolio: http://marcodonnarumma.com > Research: http://res.marcodonnarumma.com > Director: http://www.liveperformersmeeting.net > > > On Wed, Sep 11, 2013 at 2:02 PM, Marco Donnarumma wrote: > >> Did you consider building your own kernel? I'm using self-built RT >>> kernels on Ubuntu 12.04 and that works great: >>> >>> http://wiki.linuxaudio.org/wiki/system_configuration#build_your_own_real-time_kernel >>> And are you using rtirq? >>> Alessio Abogani stopped maintaining th RT kernels for Ubuntu quite a >>> while ago. You might want to ask falkTX about the possibilities of >>> offering a raring RT kernel. >>> >>> Best, >>> >>> Jeremy >>> >>> >> Hey Jeremy! >> >> Yes, that's the other thing I will try now, good to know it works on >> 12.04. >> >> My pain in the a... is that I have to use nvidia drivers, and had >> troubles some time ago with them and rt-kernels. >> >> Do you happen to know whether I need to patch nvidia support into the >> rt-kernel I build? (I guess so... just to be sure) >> >> thanks! >> best, >> M >> >> >> > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From email.rafa at gmail.com Wed Sep 11 15:04:39 2013 From: email.rafa at gmail.com (Rafael Vega) Date: Wed, 11 Sep 2013 10:04:39 -0500 Subject: [LAU] options for hard real time kernel for raring 13.04 In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Have you looked at the KXStudio repos? They have a rt kernel that I have used successfully with Ubuntu 12.04 and 13.04 and it's really simple to install. They are currently moving from Ubuntu to Debian repos so their how-to in http://kxstudio.sourceforge.net/Repositories is broken, just look at these repos: https://launchpad.net/~kxstudio-team/+archive/kernel/ On Wed, Sep 11, 2013 at 9:47 AM, Marco Donnarumma wrote: > sorry, had forgot the link, see the 4th reply at > http://askubuntu.com/questions/72964/how-can-i-install-a-realtime-kernel > > -- > Marco Donnarumma > New Media + Sonic Arts Practitioner, Performer, Teacher, Director. > Embodied Audio-Visual Interaction Research Team. > Department of Computing, Goldsmiths University of London > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > Portfolio: http://marcodonnarumma.com > Research: http://res.marcodonnarumma.com > Director: http://www.liveperformersmeeting.net > > > On Wed, Sep 11, 2013 at 4:46 PM, Marco Donnarumma wrote: > >> update: >> >> 1_ tried to install 3.10-2-rt-686-pae_3.10.7-1_i386.deb from >> http://packages.debian.org/jessie/linux-image-3.10-2-rt-686-pae, but it >> didn't like my initramfs-tools version (apparently too old for the new >> kernel) and installed without configuration so had to remove. See log: >> >> dpkg: dependency problems prevent configuration of initramfs-tools: >> linux-image-3.10-2-rt-686-pae (3.10.7-1) breaks initramfs-tools (<< >> 0.110~) and is unpacked but not configured. >> Version of initramfs-tools to be configured is 0.103ubuntu0.7. >> >> 2_ my low-latency kernel is 3.8.0*. I compiled my own rt-kernel, using >> http://www.kernel.org/pub/linux/kernel/v3.x/linux-3.2.48.tar.bz2 and its >> related rt patch, as in the tutorial that Jeremy posted. The kernel >> compiles and installs fine, but when I load it from grub, Mint load >> correctly, and then (before seeing anything on screen) my screen goes >> black. Nothing to do there, tried to use hotkeys to get a tty, restart, or >> shutdown, but had only to push the power button. >> >> It's probably an nvidia driver-related issue, am I correct? >> >> Found some suggestions about patching the nvidia driver with some custom >> code here [1], but the driver they use there is quite old. And last time I >> had fiddled with nvidia driver it was the most painful experience ever... :) >> >> Will investigate further, please throw me suggestions if any, >> >> I might ask falkTX how he sees the rt-kernel for 13.04. I saw there is >> some working on Launchpad, but they are last modified sept. 2012 (?). >> >> thank you! >> best, >> M >> >> [1] >> >> >> >> -- >> Marco Donnarumma >> New Media + Sonic Arts Practitioner, Performer, Teacher, Director. >> Embodied Audio-Visual Interaction Research Team. >> Department of Computing, Goldsmiths University of London >> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ >> Portfolio: http://marcodonnarumma.com >> Research: http://res.marcodonnarumma.com >> Director: http://www.liveperformersmeeting.net >> >> >> On Wed, Sep 11, 2013 at 2:02 PM, Marco Donnarumma wrote: >> >>> Did you consider building your own kernel? I'm using self-built RT >>>> kernels on Ubuntu 12.04 and that works great: >>>> >>>> http://wiki.linuxaudio.org/wiki/system_configuration#build_your_own_real-time_kernel >>>> And are you using rtirq? >>>> Alessio Abogani stopped maintaining th RT kernels for Ubuntu quite a >>>> while ago. You might want to ask falkTX about the possibilities of >>>> offering a raring RT kernel. >>>> >>>> Best, >>>> >>>> Jeremy >>>> >>>> >>> Hey Jeremy! >>> >>> Yes, that's the other thing I will try now, good to know it works on >>> 12.04. >>> >>> My pain in the a... is that I have to use nvidia drivers, and had >>> troubles some time ago with them and rt-kernels. >>> >>> Do you happen to know whether I need to patch nvidia support into the >>> rt-kernel I build? (I guess so... just to be sure) >>> >>> thanks! >>> best, >>> M >>> >>> >>> >> > > _______________________________________________ > Linux-audio-user mailing list > Linux-audio-user at lists.linuxaudio.org > http://lists.linuxaudio.org/listinfo/linux-audio-user > > -- Rafael Vega email.rafa at gmail.com -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From devel at thesaddj.com Wed Sep 11 15:51:25 2013 From: devel at thesaddj.com (Marco Donnarumma) Date: Wed, 11 Sep 2013 17:51:25 +0200 Subject: [LAU] options for hard real time kernel for raring 13.04 In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: hey Rafael, yes, I had tried but to no avail, as I can't find any Raring package, The kernel repo is added, but aptitude can't find the package (linux-realtime-*). How did you install it on 13.04? thanks, M -- Marco Donnarumma New Media + Sonic Arts Practitioner, Performer, Teacher, Director. Embodied Audio-Visual Interaction Research Team. Department of Computing, Goldsmiths University of London ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Portfolio: http://marcodonnarumma.com Research: http://res.marcodonnarumma.com Director: http://www.liveperformersmeeting.net On Wed, Sep 11, 2013 at 5:04 PM, Rafael Vega wrote: > Have you looked at the KXStudio repos? They have a rt kernel that I have > used successfully with Ubuntu 12.04 and 13.04 and it's really simple to > install. They are currently moving from Ubuntu to Debian repos so their > how-to in http://kxstudio.sourceforge.net/Repositories is broken, just > look at these repos: https://launchpad.net/~kxstudio-team/+archive/kernel/ > > > On Wed, Sep 11, 2013 at 9:47 AM, Marco Donnarumma wrote: > >> sorry, had forgot the link, see the 4th reply at >> http://askubuntu.com/questions/72964/how-can-i-install-a-realtime-kernel >> >> -- >> Marco Donnarumma >> New Media + Sonic Arts Practitioner, Performer, Teacher, Director. >> Embodied Audio-Visual Interaction Research Team. >> Department of Computing, Goldsmiths University of London >> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ >> Portfolio: http://marcodonnarumma.com >> Research: http://res.marcodonnarumma.com >> Director: http://www.liveperformersmeeting.net >> >> >> On Wed, Sep 11, 2013 at 4:46 PM, Marco Donnarumma wrote: >> >>> update: >>> >>> 1_ tried to install 3.10-2-rt-686-pae_3.10.7-1_i386.deb from >>> http://packages.debian.org/jessie/linux-image-3.10-2-rt-686-pae, but it >>> didn't like my initramfs-tools version (apparently too old for the new >>> kernel) and installed without configuration so had to remove. See log: >>> >>> dpkg: dependency problems prevent configuration of initramfs-tools: >>> linux-image-3.10-2-rt-686-pae (3.10.7-1) breaks initramfs-tools (<< >>> 0.110~) and is unpacked but not configured. >>> Version of initramfs-tools to be configured is 0.103ubuntu0.7. >>> >>> 2_ my low-latency kernel is 3.8.0*. I compiled my own rt-kernel, using >>> http://www.kernel.org/pub/linux/kernel/v3.x/linux-3.2.48.tar.bz2 and >>> its related rt patch, as in the tutorial that Jeremy posted. The kernel >>> compiles and installs fine, but when I load it from grub, Mint load >>> correctly, and then (before seeing anything on screen) my screen goes >>> black. Nothing to do there, tried to use hotkeys to get a tty, restart, or >>> shutdown, but had only to push the power button. >>> >>> It's probably an nvidia driver-related issue, am I correct? >>> >>> Found some suggestions about patching the nvidia driver with some custom >>> code here [1], but the driver they use there is quite old. And last time I >>> had fiddled with nvidia driver it was the most painful experience ever... :) >>> >>> Will investigate further, please throw me suggestions if any, >>> >>> I might ask falkTX how he sees the rt-kernel for 13.04. I saw there is >>> some working on Launchpad, but they are last modified sept. 2012 (?). >>> >>> thank you! >>> best, >>> M >>> >>> [1] >>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> Marco Donnarumma >>> New Media + Sonic Arts Practitioner, Performer, Teacher, Director. >>> Embodied Audio-Visual Interaction Research Team. >>> Department of Computing, Goldsmiths University of London >>> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ >>> Portfolio: http://marcodonnarumma.com >>> Research: http://res.marcodonnarumma.com >>> Director: http://www.liveperformersmeeting.net >>> >>> >>> On Wed, Sep 11, 2013 at 2:02 PM, Marco Donnarumma wrote: >>> >>>> Did you consider building your own kernel? I'm using self-built RT >>>>> kernels on Ubuntu 12.04 and that works great: >>>>> >>>>> http://wiki.linuxaudio.org/wiki/system_configuration#build_your_own_real-time_kernel >>>>> And are you using rtirq? >>>>> Alessio Abogani stopped maintaining th RT kernels for Ubuntu quite a >>>>> while ago. You might want to ask falkTX about the possibilities of >>>>> offering a raring RT kernel. >>>>> >>>>> Best, >>>>> >>>>> Jeremy >>>>> >>>>> >>>> Hey Jeremy! >>>> >>>> Yes, that's the other thing I will try now, good to know it works on >>>> 12.04. >>>> >>>> My pain in the a... is that I have to use nvidia drivers, and had >>>> troubles some time ago with them and rt-kernels. >>>> >>>> Do you happen to know whether I need to patch nvidia support into the >>>> rt-kernel I build? (I guess so... just to be sure) >>>> >>>> thanks! >>>> best, >>>> M >>>> >>>> >>>> >>> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Linux-audio-user mailing list >> Linux-audio-user at lists.linuxaudio.org >> http://lists.linuxaudio.org/listinfo/linux-audio-user >> >> > > > -- > Rafael Vega > email.rafa at gmail.com > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From ralf.mardorf at alice-dsl.net Wed Sep 11 15:54:25 2013 From: ralf.mardorf at alice-dsl.net (Ralf Mardorf) Date: Wed, 11 Sep 2013 17:54:25 +0200 Subject: [LAU] M/S EQ in Linux In-Reply-To: References: <20130909224222.GA10562@village.keycorner.org> <1378798185.2970.34.camel@archlinux> <20130910213813.GA9727@linuxaudio.org> <1378856806.1938.5.camel@archlinux> Message-ID: <1378914865.997.11.camel@archlinux> On Tue, 2013-09-10 at 22:58 -0500, Brent Busby wrote: > But some stereos seem to have woofers/subwoofers that only get engaged > when there's a fair amount of power, which means that if you don't > turn the volume up, it creates the impression that the EQ is mostly > high mids and treble. If you turn up the volume, the "problem" > disappears as the woofers begin to engage. Some people have got 200 W speakers in their cars and in their 15 m? living rooms, where 20 W speakers already would be more than loud enough. You can not listen in household noise level on a 2 x 200 W stereo, you need to increase the volume to insane loudness, that has nothing to do with the mix, it's related to the speakers. I had a neighbour listening each night 4 to the flour that loud, that I couldn't listen to my music in household noise level. If a car has to stop at the lights perhaps 200 m away and my windows are closed, I anyway often can't hear the music in my flat anymore, because the car's hifis are that loud. Reconsider that your mixes are ok, but you try to listen to it on stereos of idiots. I use 20 W speakers and they could be that loud, that it could permanently damage the ears. From ralf.mardorf at alice-dsl.net Wed Sep 11 16:00:14 2013 From: ralf.mardorf at alice-dsl.net (Ralf Mardorf) Date: Wed, 11 Sep 2013 18:00:14 +0200 Subject: [LAU] M/S EQ in Linux In-Reply-To: References: <20130909224222.GA10562@village.keycorner.org> <1378798185.2970.34.camel@archlinux> <20130910213813.GA9727@linuxaudio.org> <1378856806.1938.5.camel@archlinux> Message-ID: <1378915214.997.15.camel@archlinux> On Wed, 2013-09-11 at 00:30 -0700, J. Liles wrote: > Commerically recorded music is criminally overcompressed, BTW, so I > wouldn't use that as a measure of quality--unless you're trying to be > the next pop star and/or appeal to prematurely deaf 12 year olds. The > rest of us appreciate dynamics. +1111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111 Regarding to the other information I disagree, not completely, but a little bit. If possible avoid compression for individual tracks (sometimes it makes sense to use compression for individual tracks), but learn to use EQs instead and then add a decent compression to the stereo sum. From jeremy at autostatic.com Wed Sep 11 18:00:22 2013 From: jeremy at autostatic.com (Jeremy Jongepier) Date: Wed, 11 Sep 2013 20:00:22 +0200 Subject: [LAU] options for hard real time kernel for raring 13.04 In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <5230AFB6.7000609@autostatic.com> On 09/11/2013 04:46 PM, Marco Donnarumma wrote: > update: > > 1_ tried to install 3.10-2-rt-686-pae_3.10.7-1_i386.deb from > http://packages.debian.org/jessie/linux-image-3.10-2-rt-686-pae, but it > didn't like my initramfs-tools version (apparently too old for the new > kernel) and installed without configuration so had to remove. See log: > > dpkg: dependency problems prevent configuration of initramfs-tools: > linux-image-3.10-2-rt-686-pae (3.10.7-1) breaks initramfs-tools (<< > 0.110~) and is unpacked but not configured. > Version of initramfs-tools to be configured is 0.103ubuntu0.7. > > 2_ my low-latency kernel is 3.8.0*. I compiled my own rt-kernel, using > http://www.kernel.org/pub/linux/kernel/v3.x/linux-3.2.48.tar.bz2 and its > related rt patch, as in the tutorial that Jeremy posted. The kernel > compiles and installs fine, but when I load it from grub, Mint load > correctly, and then (before seeing anything on screen) my screen goes > black. Nothing to do there, tried to use hotkeys to get a tty, restart, or > shutdown, but had only to push the power button. > Switching tty's probably works but you don't see it. Did you try switching with Alt+F1 and then rebooting with Ctrl+Alt+Del? If that doesn't work you could try Alt+SysRq+R,E,I,S,U,B, that should cleanly reboot the machine. > It's probably an nvidia driver-related issue, am I correct? > > Found some suggestions about patching the nvidia driver with some custom > code here [1], but the driver they use there is quite old. And last time I > had fiddled with nvidia driver it was the most painful experience ever... :) > Did you try the patch in my Github repository? You can download it with: wget https://raw.github.com/AutoStatic/nvidia-rt/master/patch-3.0-rt-nvidia.patch And then patch the Nvidia source, unfortunately I do noy know by heart how to proceed. Best, Jeremy > Will investigate further, please throw me suggestions if any, > > I might ask falkTX how he sees the rt-kernel for 13.04. I saw there is some > working on Launchpad, but they are last modified sept. 2012 (?). > > thank you! > best, > M > > [1] > > > > -- > Marco Donnarumma > New Media + Sonic Arts Practitioner, Performer, Teacher, Director. > Embodied Audio-Visual Interaction Research Team. > Department of Computing, Goldsmiths University of London > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > Portfolio: http://marcodonnarumma.com > Research: http://res.marcodonnarumma.com > Director: http://www.liveperformersmeeting.net > > > On Wed, Sep 11, 2013 at 2:02 PM, Marco Donnarumma wrote: > >> Did you consider building your own kernel? I'm using self-built RT >>> kernels on Ubuntu 12.04 and that works great: >>> >>> http://wiki.linuxaudio.org/wiki/system_configuration#build_your_own_real-time_kernel >>> And are you using rtirq? >>> Alessio Abogani stopped maintaining th RT kernels for Ubuntu quite a >>> while ago. You might want to ask falkTX about the possibilities of >>> offering a raring RT kernel. >>> >>> Best, >>> >>> Jeremy >>> >>> >> Hey Jeremy! >> >> Yes, that's the other thing I will try now, good to know it works on 12.04. >> >> My pain in the a... is that I have to use nvidia drivers, and had troubles >> some time ago with them and rt-kernels. >> >> Do you happen to know whether I need to patch nvidia support into the >> rt-kernel I build? (I guess so... just to be sure) >> >> thanks! >> best, >> M >> >> >> > -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 836 bytes Desc: OpenPGP digital signature URL: From gnome at hawaii.rr.com Wed Sep 11 18:26:20 2013 From: gnome at hawaii.rr.com (david) Date: Wed, 11 Sep 2013 08:26:20 -1000 Subject: [LAU] M/S EQ in Linux In-Reply-To: <1378914865.997.11.camel@archlinux> References: <20130909224222.GA10562@village.keycorner.org> <1378798185.2970.34.camel@archlinux> <20130910213813.GA9727@linuxaudio.org> <1378856806.1938.5.camel@archlinux> <1378914865.997.11.camel@archlinux> Message-ID: <5230B5CC.4070803@hawaii.rr.com> On 09/11/2013 05:54 AM, Ralf Mardorf wrote: > On Tue, 2013-09-10 at 22:58 -0500, Brent Busby wrote: >> But some stereos seem to have woofers/subwoofers that only get engaged >> when there's a fair amount of power, which means that if you don't >> turn the volume up, it creates the impression that the EQ is mostly >> high mids and treble. If you turn up the volume, the "problem" >> disappears as the woofers begin to engage. > > Some people have got 200 W speakers in their cars and in their 15 m? > living rooms, where 20 W speakers already would be more than loud > enough. You can not listen in household noise level on a 2 x 200 W > stereo, you need to increase the volume to insane loudness, that has > nothing to do with the mix, it's related to the speakers. I had a > neighbour listening each night 4 to the flour that loud, that I couldn't > listen to my music in household noise level. If a car has to stop at the > lights perhaps 200 m away and my windows are closed, I anyway often > can't hear the music in my flat anymore, because the car's hifis are > that loud. > > Reconsider that your mixes are ok, but you try to listen to it on > stereos of idiots. > > I use 20 W speakers and they could be that loud, that it could > permanently damage the ears. Somewhere ages ago I read that it only takes 1/10th of a watt to produce audible sound ... -- David gnome at hawaii.rr.com authenticity, honesty, community http://dancingtreefrog.com http://clanjones.org/david/ http://dancing-treefrog.deviantart.com/ From brent at keycorner.org Wed Sep 11 18:26:49 2013 From: brent at keycorner.org (Brent Busby) Date: Wed, 11 Sep 2013 13:26:49 -0500 (CDT) Subject: [LAU] M/S EQ in Linux In-Reply-To: <1378914865.997.11.camel@archlinux> References: <20130909224222.GA10562@village.keycorner.org> <1378798185.2970.34.camel@archlinux> <20130910213813.GA9727@linuxaudio.org> <1378856806.1938.5.camel@archlinux> <1378914865.997.11.camel@archlinux> Message-ID: On Wed, 11 Sep 2013, Ralf Mardorf wrote: > Some people have got 200 W speakers in their cars and in their 15 m? > living rooms, where 20 W speakers already would be more than loud > enough. You can not listen in household noise level on a 2 x 200 W > stereo, you need to increase the volume to insane loudness, that has > nothing to do with the mix, it's related to the speakers. I had a > neighbour listening each night 4 to the flour that loud, that I > couldn't listen to my music in household noise level. If a car has to > stop at the lights perhaps 200 m away and my windows are closed, I > anyway often can't hear the music in my flat anymore, because the > car's hifis are that loud. > > Reconsider that your mixes are ok, but you try to listen to it on > stereos of idiots. > > I use 20 W speakers and they could be that loud, that it could > permanently damage the ears. The stereo in question will provide reasonable playback of professionally mastered music without having to turn the volume up very much, even music that has decent dynamic range. Also, more importantly, it will get the right EQ balance at low volume levels too. My suspicion is that although one doesn't want to squash the peaks too much, there's still something about my track that is just too spiky to engage the woofers of some stereos until the volume is way up, whereas other songs get decent bass/midrange/treble distribution right away without needing to be so loud. So these spikes need to be squashed somewhat more than they are, even if one can go overboard. Now that I've determined it's not really an EQ problem, the trick is figuring out do I need a multiband limiter, a multiband compressor, or both, and what sort of settings will fix this. I can't figure out if I love this process of investigation or hate it. :-/ It's certainly intriguing. -- + Brent A. Busby + "We've all heard that a million monkeys + Sr. UNIX Systems Admin + banging on a million typewriters will + University of Chicago + eventually reproduce the entire works of + James Franck Institute + Shakespeare. Now, thanks to the Internet, + Materials Research Ctr + we know this is not true." -Robert Wilensky From ralf.mardorf at alice-dsl.net Wed Sep 11 19:15:43 2013 From: ralf.mardorf at alice-dsl.net (Ralf Mardorf) Date: Wed, 11 Sep 2013 21:15:43 +0200 Subject: [LAU] M/S EQ in Linux In-Reply-To: References: <20130909224222.GA10562@village.keycorner.org> <1378798185.2970.34.camel@archlinux> <20130910213813.GA9727@linuxaudio.org> <1378856806.1938.5.camel@archlinux> <1378914865.997.11.camel@archlinux> Message-ID: <1378926943.2132.29.camel@archlinux> On Wed, 2013-09-11 at 13:26 -0500, Brent Busby wrote: > Now that I've determined it's not really an EQ problem, the trick is > figuring out do I need a multiband [...] "multiband" does indicate an EQ task ;). A multiband compressor is a good tool, but it can't harm to learn how to mix without using a compressor, before making the fine tuning by using a compressor. Maybe you only need fine tuning, I don't know. Keep in mind that if you compare a home recording with a good professional recording, likely your microphones miss to record something, that only can be recorded by using very good microphones, or virtual instruments don't provide what vintage organs, vintage synth etc. do provide, etc.. What reverbs do you use etc., pp.. I never heard any mix, professional or home recording, that did sound good on every hifi equipment. This is impossible. From fons at linuxaudio.org Wed Sep 11 19:50:20 2013 From: fons at linuxaudio.org (Fons Adriaensen) Date: Wed, 11 Sep 2013 19:50:20 +0000 Subject: [LAU] M/S EQ in Linux In-Reply-To: References: <20130909224222.GA10562@village.keycorner.org> <1378798185.2970.34.camel@archlinux> <20130910213813.GA9727@linuxaudio.org> <1378856806.1938.5.camel@archlinux> <1378914865.997.11.camel@archlinux> Message-ID: <20130911195019.GA5807@linuxaudio.org> On Wed, Sep 11, 2013 at 01:26:49PM -0500, Brent Busby wrote: > My suspicion is that although one doesn't want to squash the > peaks too much, there's still something about my track that is just > too spiky to engage the woofers of some stereos until the volume is > way up This is getting out of control. What on earth is meant by 'engage the woofers' ? Trick them into producing some sound ? Psychology, marketing, sexual attraction or brainwashing ? Unless it's designed to produce lots of distortion, a playback system is linear. If you give it 1/10 of the signal, it will produce 1/100 of the power. If your mix sounds thin and lacking bass when reproduced on small speakers and/or at low levels, it just needs more low frequency energy, i.e. a different mix. That has nothing at all to do with how 'spiky' it is (whatever that means) or with 'squashing' peaks or whatever. Ciao, -- FA A world of exhaustive, reliable metadata would be an utopia. It's also a pipe-dream, founded on self-delusion, nerd hubris and hysterically inflated market opportunities. (Cory Doctorow) From email.rafa at gmail.com Wed Sep 11 20:05:03 2013 From: email.rafa at gmail.com (Rafael Vega) Date: Wed, 11 Sep 2013 15:05:03 -0500 Subject: [LAU] options for hard real time kernel for raring 13.04 In-Reply-To: <5230AFB6.7000609@autostatic.com> References: <5230AFB6.7000609@autostatic.com> Message-ID: To install it on 13.04, I manually added the following line to /etc/apt/sources.list deb http://ppa.launchpad.net/kxstudio-team/ppa/ubuntu precise main and then the usual sudo apt-get update && sudo apt-get install ... On Wed, Sep 11, 2013 at 1:00 PM, Jeremy Jongepier wrote: > On 09/11/2013 04:46 PM, Marco Donnarumma wrote: > > update: > > > > 1_ tried to install 3.10-2-rt-686-pae_3.10.7-1_i386.deb from > > http://packages.debian.org/jessie/linux-image-3.10-2-rt-686-pae, but it > > didn't like my initramfs-tools version (apparently too old for the new > > kernel) and installed without configuration so had to remove. See log: > > > > dpkg: dependency problems prevent configuration of initramfs-tools: > > linux-image-3.10-2-rt-686-pae (3.10.7-1) breaks initramfs-tools (<< > > 0.110~) and is unpacked but not configured. > > Version of initramfs-tools to be configured is 0.103ubuntu0.7. > > > > 2_ my low-latency kernel is 3.8.0*. I compiled my own rt-kernel, using > > http://www.kernel.org/pub/linux/kernel/v3.x/linux-3.2.48.tar.bz2 and its > > related rt patch, as in the tutorial that Jeremy posted. The kernel > > compiles and installs fine, but when I load it from grub, Mint load > > correctly, and then (before seeing anything on screen) my screen goes > > black. Nothing to do there, tried to use hotkeys to get a tty, restart, > or > > shutdown, but had only to push the power button. > > > > Switching tty's probably works but you don't see it. Did you try > switching with Alt+F1 and then rebooting with Ctrl+Alt+Del? If that > doesn't work you could try Alt+SysRq+R,E,I,S,U,B, that should cleanly > reboot the machine. > > > It's probably an nvidia driver-related issue, am I correct? > > > > Found some suggestions about patching the nvidia driver with some custom > > code here [1], but the driver they use there is quite old. And last time > I > > had fiddled with nvidia driver it was the most painful experience > ever... :) > > > > Did you try the patch in my Github repository? You can download it with: > wget > > https://raw.github.com/AutoStatic/nvidia-rt/master/patch-3.0-rt-nvidia.patch > > And then patch the Nvidia source, unfortunately I do noy know by heart > how to proceed. > > Best, > > Jeremy > > > Will investigate further, please throw me suggestions if any, > > > > I might ask falkTX how he sees the rt-kernel for 13.04. I saw there is > some > > working on Launchpad, but they are last modified sept. 2012 (?). > > > > thank you! > > best, > > M > > > > [1] > > > > > > > > -- > > Marco Donnarumma > > New Media + Sonic Arts Practitioner, Performer, Teacher, Director. > > Embodied Audio-Visual Interaction Research Team. > > Department of Computing, Goldsmiths University of London > > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > > Portfolio: http://marcodonnarumma.com > > Research: http://res.marcodonnarumma.com > > Director: http://www.liveperformersmeeting.net > > > > > > On Wed, Sep 11, 2013 at 2:02 PM, Marco Donnarumma >wrote: > > > >> Did you consider building your own kernel? I'm using self-built RT > >>> kernels on Ubuntu 12.04 and that works great: > >>> > >>> > http://wiki.linuxaudio.org/wiki/system_configuration#build_your_own_real-time_kernel > >>> And are you using rtirq? > >>> Alessio Abogani stopped maintaining th RT kernels for Ubuntu quite a > >>> while ago. You might want to ask falkTX about the possibilities of > >>> offering a raring RT kernel. > >>> > >>> Best, > >>> > >>> Jeremy > >>> > >>> > >> Hey Jeremy! > >> > >> Yes, that's the other thing I will try now, good to know it works on > 12.04. > >> > >> My pain in the a... is that I have to use nvidia drivers, and had > troubles > >> some time ago with them and rt-kernels. > >> > >> Do you happen to know whether I need to patch nvidia support into the > >> rt-kernel I build? (I guess so... just to be sure) > >> > >> thanks! > >> best, > >> M > >> > >> > >> > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > Linux-audio-user mailing list > Linux-audio-user at lists.linuxaudio.org > http://lists.linuxaudio.org/listinfo/linux-audio-user > > -- Rafael Vega email.rafa at gmail.com -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From brent at keycorner.org Wed Sep 11 20:06:57 2013 From: brent at keycorner.org (Brent Busby) Date: Wed, 11 Sep 2013 15:06:57 -0500 (CDT) Subject: [LAU] M/S EQ in Linux In-Reply-To: <20130911195019.GA5807@linuxaudio.org> References: <20130909224222.GA10562@village.keycorner.org> <1378798185.2970.34.camel@archlinux> <20130910213813.GA9727@linuxaudio.org> <1378856806.1938.5.camel@archlinux> <1378914865.997.11.camel@archlinux> <20130911195019.GA5807@linuxaudio.org> Message-ID: On Wed, 11 Sep 2013, Fons Adriaensen wrote: > On Wed, Sep 11, 2013 at 01:26:49PM -0500, Brent Busby wrote: > >> My suspicion is that although one doesn't want to squash the >> peaks too much, there's still something about my track that is just >> too spiky to engage the woofers of some stereos until the volume is >> way up > > This is getting out of control. What on earth is meant by 'engage the > woofers' ? Trick them into producing some sound ? Psychology, > marketing, sexual attraction or brainwashing ? Sorry about my poor terminology. You can probably intuit what I meant though (hopefully). > Unless it's designed to produce lots of distortion, a playback system > is linear. If you give it 1/10 of the signal, it will produce 1/100 of > the power. If your mix sounds thin and lacking bass when reproduced on > small speakers and/or at low levels, it just needs more low frequency > energy, i.e. a different mix. That has nothing at all to do with how > 'spiky' it is (whatever that means) or with 'squashing' peaks or > whatever. Actually what I'm suspecting here is that this particular stereo's dynamic response *isn't* linear, at least not in regard to bass. It seems to almost act as though the bass is reacting with more dynamic range than what is actually there, at least with reference to other playback systems. Sorry if that's totally wrong, but that's just what I think I'm seeing. -- + Brent A. Busby + "We've all heard that a million monkeys + Sr. UNIX Systems Admin + banging on a million typewriters will + University of Chicago + eventually reproduce the entire works of + James Franck Institute + Shakespeare. Now, thanks to the Internet, + Materials Research Ctr + we know this is not true." -Robert Wilensky From fons at linuxaudio.org Wed Sep 11 20:59:51 2013 From: fons at linuxaudio.org (Fons Adriaensen) Date: Wed, 11 Sep 2013 20:59:51 +0000 Subject: [LAU] M/S EQ in Linux In-Reply-To: References: <20130909224222.GA10562@village.keycorner.org> <1378798185.2970.34.camel@archlinux> <20130910213813.GA9727@linuxaudio.org> <1378856806.1938.5.camel@archlinux> <1378914865.997.11.camel@archlinux> <20130911195019.GA5807@linuxaudio.org> Message-ID: <20130911205951.GB5807@linuxaudio.org> On Wed, Sep 11, 2013 at 03:06:57PM -0500, Brent Busby wrote: > Actually what I'm suspecting here is that this particular stereo's > dynamic response *isn't* linear, at least not in regard to bass. It > seems to almost act as though the bass is reacting with more dynamic > range than what is actually there, at least with reference to other > playback systems. Sorry if that's totally wrong, but that's just > what I think I'm seeing. Unless that system has a multiband dynmics processor built into it, that is just not possible. Bass *allways* seems to have more dynamic range than it really has - just look at the equal loudness curves, they are very close together a low frequencies. Which means that small objective changes produce a large subjective effect. If you don't hear the bass at low volumes, that means there isn't enough of it. Ciao, -- FA A world of exhaustive, reliable metadata would be an utopia. It's also a pipe-dream, founded on self-delusion, nerd hubris and hysterically inflated market opportunities. (Cory Doctorow) From wizardofgosz at gmail.com Wed Sep 11 21:02:42 2013 From: wizardofgosz at gmail.com (Ricardus Vincente) Date: Wed, 11 Sep 2013 17:02:42 -0400 Subject: [LAU] M/S EQ in Linux In-Reply-To: References: <20130909224222.GA10562@village.keycorner.org> <1378798185.2970.34.camel@archlinux> <20130910213813.GA9727@linuxaudio.org> <1378856806.1938.5.camel@archlinux> <1378914865.997.11.camel@archlinux> <20130911195019.GA5807@linuxaudio.org> Message-ID: <5230DA72.7020402@gmail.com> On 09/11/2013 04:06 PM, Brent Busby wrote: > Actually what I'm suspecting here is that this particular stereo's > dynamic response *isn't* linear, at least not in regard to bass. It > seems to almost act as though the bass is reacting with more dynamic > range than what is actually there, at least with reference to other > playback systems. Sorry if that's totally wrong, but that's just what I > think I'm seeing. Then I would suggest you listen on a more linear playback system. How your mix translates in a crappy system should be of no interest to you. From fons at linuxaudio.org Wed Sep 11 21:06:52 2013 From: fons at linuxaudio.org (Fons Adriaensen) Date: Wed, 11 Sep 2013 21:06:52 +0000 Subject: [LAU] M/S EQ in Linux In-Reply-To: <5230DA72.7020402@gmail.com> References: <20130909224222.GA10562@village.keycorner.org> <1378798185.2970.34.camel@archlinux> <20130910213813.GA9727@linuxaudio.org> <1378856806.1938.5.camel@archlinux> <1378914865.997.11.camel@archlinux> <20130911195019.GA5807@linuxaudio.org> <5230DA72.7020402@gmail.com> Message-ID: <20130911210652.GC5807@linuxaudio.org> On Wed, Sep 11, 2013 at 05:02:42PM -0400, Ricardus Vincente wrote: > On 09/11/2013 04:06 PM, Brent Busby wrote: > > > Actually what I'm suspecting here is that this particular stereo's > > dynamic response *isn't* linear, at least not in regard to bass. It > > seems to almost act as though the bass is reacting with more dynamic > > range than what is actually there, at least with reference to other > > playback systems. Sorry if that's totally wrong, but that's just what I > > think I'm seeing. > > Then I would suggest you listen on a more linear playback system. How > your mix translates in a crappy system should be of no interest to you. Listening on systems with a limited response can help to produce a mix that works well everywhere. If a mix doesn't work on such a system, it probably means that it tries to balance the bass by boosting the lowest range and is lacking energy in the higher bass range. Ciao, -- FA A world of exhaustive, reliable metadata would be an utopia. It's also a pipe-dream, founded on self-delusion, nerd hubris and hysterically inflated market opportunities. (Cory Doctorow) From wizardofgosz at gmail.com Wed Sep 11 21:21:18 2013 From: wizardofgosz at gmail.com (Ricardus Vincente) Date: Wed, 11 Sep 2013 17:21:18 -0400 Subject: [LAU] M/S EQ in Linux In-Reply-To: <20130911210652.GC5807@linuxaudio.org> References: <20130909224222.GA10562@village.keycorner.org> <1378798185.2970.34.camel@archlinux> <20130910213813.GA9727@linuxaudio.org> <1378856806.1938.5.camel@archlinux> <1378914865.997.11.camel@archlinux> <20130911195019.GA5807@linuxaudio.org> <5230DA72.7020402@gmail.com> <20130911210652.GC5807@linuxaudio.org> Message-ID: <5230DECE.1030604@gmail.com> On 09/11/2013 05:06 PM, Fons Adriaensen wrote: >> Then I would suggest you listen on a more linear playback system. How >> your mix translates in a crappy system should be of no interest to you. > > Listening on systems with a limited response can help to produce a mix > that works well everywhere. If a mix doesn't work on such a system, > it probably means that it tries to balance the bass by boosting the > lowest range and is lacking energy in the higher bass range. Or it could just mean the system sucks. I mix on SLS S8Rs (and Genelec 1031s) in a decent room, and my mixes translate. It simply is not possible to get your mix to translate on every system. To worry about making it translate on every system is an exercise in futility. From brent at keycorner.org Wed Sep 11 21:26:40 2013 From: brent at keycorner.org (Brent Busby) Date: Wed, 11 Sep 2013 16:26:40 -0500 (CDT) Subject: [LAU] M/S EQ in Linux In-Reply-To: <5230DECE.1030604@gmail.com> References: <20130909224222.GA10562@village.keycorner.org> <1378798185.2970.34.camel@archlinux> <20130910213813.GA9727@linuxaudio.org> <1378856806.1938.5.camel@archlinux> <1378914865.997.11.camel@archlinux> <20130911195019.GA5807@linuxaudio.org> <5230DA72.7020402@gmail.com> <20130911210652.GC5807@linuxaudio.org> <5230DECE.1030604@gmail.com> Message-ID: On Wed, 11 Sep 2013, Ricardus Vincente wrote: > On 09/11/2013 05:06 PM, Fons Adriaensen wrote: > >>> Then I would suggest you listen on a more linear playback system. How >>> your mix translates in a crappy system should be of no interest to you. >> >> Listening on systems with a limited response can help to produce a mix >> that works well everywhere. If a mix doesn't work on such a system, >> it probably means that it tries to balance the bass by boosting the >> lowest range and is lacking energy in the higher bass range. > > Or it could just mean the system sucks. > > I mix on SLS S8Rs (and Genelec 1031s) in a decent room, and my mixes > translate. It simply is not possible to get your mix to translate on > every system. To worry about making it translate on every system is an > exercise in futility. Ok, points taken from everyone. I just wanted to aim for that because somehow, perhaps through secret elvish magic, commercially made mixes sound fine on my car's stereo, so I thought there was something worth pursuing there, however incorrect that system's response curves might be. Whatever is wrong with it, the big studios can deal with it, and I can't...so I wondered what it is I'm doing different. You are right though that if it plays on most speakers, it's pretty much fine. -- + Brent A. Busby + "We've all heard that a million monkeys + Sr. UNIX Systems Admin + banging on a million typewriters will + University of Chicago + eventually reproduce the entire works of + James Franck Institute + Shakespeare. Now, thanks to the Internet, + Materials Research Ctr + we know this is not true." -Robert Wilensky From ralf.mardorf at alice-dsl.net Wed Sep 11 22:00:11 2013 From: ralf.mardorf at alice-dsl.net (Ralf Mardorf) Date: Thu, 12 Sep 2013 00:00:11 +0200 Subject: [LAU] M/S EQ in Linux In-Reply-To: <20130911210652.GC5807@linuxaudio.org> References: <20130909224222.GA10562@village.keycorner.org> <1378798185.2970.34.camel@archlinux> <20130910213813.GA9727@linuxaudio.org> <1378856806.1938.5.camel@archlinux> <1378914865.997.11.camel@archlinux> <20130911195019.GA5807@linuxaudio.org> <5230DA72.7020402@gmail.com> <20130911210652.GC5807@linuxaudio.org> Message-ID: <1378936811.2132.41.camel@archlinux> On Wed, 2013-09-11 at 21:06 +0000, Fons Adriaensen wrote: > On Wed, Sep 11, 2013 at 05:02:42PM -0400, Ricardus Vincente wrote: > > On 09/11/2013 04:06 PM, Brent Busby wrote: > > > > > Actually what I'm suspecting here is that this particular stereo's > > > dynamic response *isn't* linear, at least not in regard to bass. It > > > seems to almost act as though the bass is reacting with more dynamic > > > range than what is actually there, at least with reference to other > > > playback systems. Sorry if that's totally wrong, but that's just what I > > > think I'm seeing. > > > > Then I would suggest you listen on a more linear playback system. How > > your mix translates in a crappy system should be of no interest to you. > > Listening on systems with a limited response can help to produce a mix > that works well everywhere. If a mix doesn't work on such a system, > it probably means that it tries to balance the bass by boosting the > lowest range and is lacking energy in the higher bass range. True https://www.google.de/search?q=auratone&client=firefox-a&hs=Clt&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&channel=np&tbm=isch&tbo=u&source=univ&sa=X&ei=aeQwUtCAGcGatQaHs4G4CA&ved=0CDEQsAQ&biw=1152&bih=703&dpr=1 However, modern crappy 200 W and more hifi equipment often only works when the music is insane loud, at sane levels the speakers and what ever else in the sound chain, are more biased, than at blast level. I had a neighbour who is young, with a modern hifi, who listened to black eyed peas or other crap that does sound as criminal as they do. The generation "I even listen to my music, when using the local public transport, at full power, by my smart phone speaker" owns gear that perhaps doesn't fulfill what should be expected for "HiFi" equipment. From raffaele.morelli at gmail.com Thu Sep 12 05:02:41 2013 From: raffaele.morelli at gmail.com (Raffaele Morelli) Date: Thu, 12 Sep 2013 07:02:41 +0200 Subject: [LAU] options for hard real time kernel for raring 13.04 In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: 2013/9/11 Marco Donnarumma > update: > > 1_ tried to install 3.10-2-rt-686-pae_3.10.7-1_i386.deb from > http://packages.debian.org/jessie/linux-image-3.10-2-rt-686-pae, but it > didn't like my initramfs-tools version (apparently too old for the new > kernel) and installed without configuration so had to remove. See log: > > Marco, you could try with 3.2x if you want a debian stock kernel http://packages.debian.org/wheezy/linux-image-3.2.0-4-rt-686-pae About nvidia, I am running nvidia kernel drivers (from debian repos) for an Nvidia Quadro FX 1700 without any issues from ages, nvidia-kernel-dkms is the package on debian. /r -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From raffaele.morelli at gmail.com Thu Sep 12 05:16:21 2013 From: raffaele.morelli at gmail.com (Raffaele Morelli) Date: Thu, 12 Sep 2013 07:16:21 +0200 Subject: [LAU] options for hard real time kernel for raring 13.04 In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: 2013/9/11 Marco Donnarumma > > sorry, had forgot the link, see the 4th reply at > http://askubuntu.com/questions/72964/how-can-i-install-a-realtime-kernel In 4th reply: `cp /boot/config-$(uname -r) .config && make oldconfig` this is quite unnecessary as `make oldconfig` will prompt you for newer configs not found in your current kernel configuration, moreover make-kpkg does run `make oldconfig` before start compiling. /r From jeremy at autostatic.com Thu Sep 12 07:31:56 2013 From: jeremy at autostatic.com (Jeremy Jongepier) Date: Thu, 12 Sep 2013 09:31:56 +0200 Subject: [LAU] options for hard real time kernel for raring 13.04 In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <52316DEC.3070805@autostatic.com> On 09/12/2013 07:16 AM, Raffaele Morelli wrote: > 2013/9/11 Marco Donnarumma >> >> sorry, had forgot the link, see the 4th reply at >> http://askubuntu.com/questions/72964/how-can-i-install-a-realtime-kernel > > In 4th reply: `cp /boot/config-$(uname -r) .config && make oldconfig` > > this is quite unnecessary as `make oldconfig` will prompt you for > newer configs not found in your current kernel configuration, moreover > make-kpkg does run `make oldconfig` before start compiling. > > /r True but you still need to run make oldconfig somehow otherwise you end up with the Preemption Model of the original config you're using. Best, Jeremy -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 836 bytes Desc: OpenPGP digital signature URL: From raffaele.morelli at gmail.com Thu Sep 12 07:40:08 2013 From: raffaele.morelli at gmail.com (Raffaele Morelli) Date: Thu, 12 Sep 2013 09:40:08 +0200 Subject: [LAU] options for hard real time kernel for raring 13.04 In-Reply-To: <52316DEC.3070805@autostatic.com> References: <52316DEC.3070805@autostatic.com> Message-ID: 2013/9/12 Jeremy Jongepier : > On 09/12/2013 07:16 AM, Raffaele Morelli wrote: >> 2013/9/11 Marco Donnarumma >>> >>> sorry, had forgot the link, see the 4th reply at >>> http://askubuntu.com/questions/72964/how-can-i-install-a-realtime-kernel >> >> In 4th reply: `cp /boot/config-$(uname -r) .config && make oldconfig` >> >> this is quite unnecessary as `make oldconfig` will prompt you for >> newer configs not found in your current kernel configuration, moreover >> make-kpkg does run `make oldconfig` before start compiling. >> >> /r > > True but you still need to run make oldconfig somehow otherwise you end > up with the Preemption Model of the original config you're using. > > Best, > > Jeremy Quote from man page: Normally, if kernel-package does not find a .config file in the current directory, it tries very hard to get an appropriate one (usually a con- fig file already tailored for Debian kernels for that architecture), and then calls make oldconfig to let the user answer any new questions. So if you apply the RT patch, make-kpkg will ask you about preemption model. /r From jeremy at autostatic.com Thu Sep 12 07:46:00 2013 From: jeremy at autostatic.com (Jeremy Jongepier) Date: Thu, 12 Sep 2013 09:46:00 +0200 Subject: [LAU] options for hard real time kernel for raring 13.04 In-Reply-To: References: <52316DEC.3070805@autostatic.com> Message-ID: <52317138.9060202@autostatic.com> On 09/12/2013 09:40 AM, Raffaele Morelli wrote: > 2013/9/12 Jeremy Jongepier : >> On 09/12/2013 07:16 AM, Raffaele Morelli wrote: >>> 2013/9/11 Marco Donnarumma >>>> >>>> sorry, had forgot the link, see the 4th reply at >>>> http://askubuntu.com/questions/72964/how-can-i-install-a-realtime-kernel >>> >>> In 4th reply: `cp /boot/config-$(uname -r) .config && make oldconfig` >>> >>> this is quite unnecessary as `make oldconfig` will prompt you for >>> newer configs not found in your current kernel configuration, moreover >>> make-kpkg does run `make oldconfig` before start compiling. >>> >>> /r >> >> True but you still need to run make oldconfig somehow otherwise you end >> up with the Preemption Model of the original config you're using. >> >> Best, >> >> Jeremy > > Quote from man page: > > Normally, if kernel-package does not find a .config file in the current > directory, it tries very hard to get an appropriate one (usually a con- > fig file already tailored for Debian kernels for that architecture), > and then calls make oldconfig to let the user answer any new questions. > > > So if you apply the RT patch, make-kpkg will ask you about preemption model. > > /r Yes I know but I didn't formulate my earlier e-mail well enough. What I mean is that you still need to run make oldconfig, be it separately or be it via make-kpkg. When I think about it I wondered why I replied in the first place, your mail explains it all. Sorry for the noise :-| Jeremy -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 836 bytes Desc: OpenPGP digital signature URL: From ralf.mardorf at alice-dsl.net Thu Sep 12 08:00:11 2013 From: ralf.mardorf at alice-dsl.net (Ralf Mardorf) Date: Thu, 12 Sep 2013 10:00:11 +0200 Subject: [LAU] options for hard real time kernel for raring 13.04 In-Reply-To: <52317138.9060202@autostatic.com> References: <52316DEC.3070805@autostatic.com> <52317138.9060202@autostatic.com> Message-ID: <1378972811.5755.19.camel@archlinux> On Thu, 2013-09-12 at 09:46 +0200, Jeremy Jongepier wrote: > On 09/12/2013 09:40 AM, Raffaele Morelli wrote: > > 2013/9/12 Jeremy Jongepier : > >> On 09/12/2013 07:16 AM, Raffaele Morelli wrote: > >>> 2013/9/11 Marco Donnarumma > >>>> > >>>> sorry, had forgot the link, see the 4th reply at > >>>> http://askubuntu.com/questions/72964/how-can-i-install-a-realtime-kernel > >>> > >>> In 4th reply: `cp /boot/config-$(uname -r) .config && make oldconfig` > >>> > >>> this is quite unnecessary as `make oldconfig` will prompt you for > >>> newer configs not found in your current kernel configuration, moreover > >>> make-kpkg does run `make oldconfig` before start compiling. > >>> > >>> /r > >> > >> True but you still need to run make oldconfig somehow otherwise you end > >> up with the Preemption Model of the original config you're using. > >> > >> Best, > >> > >> Jeremy > > > > Quote from man page: > > > > Normally, if kernel-package does not find a .config file in the current > > directory, it tries very hard to get an appropriate one (usually a con- > > fig file already tailored for Debian kernels for that architecture), > > and then calls make oldconfig to let the user answer any new questions. > > > > > > So if you apply the RT patch, make-kpkg will ask you about preemption model. > > > > /r > > Yes I know but I didn't formulate my earlier e-mail well enough. What I > mean is that you still need to run make oldconfig, be it separately or > be it via make-kpkg. When I think about it I wondered why I replied in > the first place, your mail explains it all. Sorry for the noise :-| It's sane to do it the cp /boot/config-$(uname -r) .config && make oldconfig way, so the OP does understand what's going on and the /boot/config-$(uname -r) could be replaced to use any other wanted config, instead the one of the running kernel. I even didn't know that make-kpkg does it automatically. I would recommend to edit the config, to fit to the OP's machine before running oldconfig. # e.g. for Opteron/Athlon64/Hammer/K8 echo "CONFIG_MK8=y" >> /path/to/.config # e.g. 32-bit only # HIGHMEM from 4G to 64G echo "CONFIG_HIGHMEM4G is not set" >> /path/to/.config echo "CONFIG_HIGHMEM64G=y" >> /path/to/.config 2 Cents, Ralf From tyranorl at free.fr Thu Sep 12 08:33:08 2013 From: tyranorl at free.fr (Aurelien) Date: Thu, 12 Sep 2013 10:33:08 +0200 Subject: [LAU] =?iso-8859-1?q?=5BA_bit_HS=5D_=5BArt_=26_Logiciels_Libres?= =?iso-8859-1?q?=5D_Groolot_=26_Sandra_Guillen_finalistes_des_Jeux_de_la_F?= =?iso-8859-1?q?rancophonie_cat=2E_Cr=E9ation_Num=E9rique_-_A_diffuser=5D?= Message-ID: <20130912083308.GB5106@sebkhachott.net> Hi all, Below is a message, written in French (sorry, if someone wants to translate it, don't hesitate) about two AMMD artists who were designed as France representative for 7th Jeux de la Francophonie (kind of Olympics, but only for French-speaking countries, and having artistic parts too) in the category Digital Creation. They're free artists, they publish their art as free art, and they do use free softwares for this. Finally, groolot also develops free software for stage pruposes. And they're now finalist for this challenge. There is still only 3 countries in the row, so they're now ensured to get a medal. I thought it might interest you. If you read french, there also a french article about this on linuxfr.org: http://linuxfr.org/news/plebiscite-une-oeuvre-libre-en-finale-des-jeux-de-la-francophonie Enjoy -- Aur?lien -------------- next part -------------- An embedded message was scrubbed... From: =?UTF-8?B?QXVyw6lsaWVuIC0gQ2hhcmfDqSBkZSBQb3JuIC0gQU1NRA==?= Subject: Fwd: [Art & Logiciels Libres] Groolot & Sandra Guillen finalistes des Jeux de la Francophonie cat. Cr?ation Num?rique - A diffuser Date: Thu, 12 Sep 2013 09:56:41 +0200 Size: 9543 URL: From raffaele.morelli at gmail.com Thu Sep 12 09:14:40 2013 From: raffaele.morelli at gmail.com (Raffaele Morelli) Date: Thu, 12 Sep 2013 11:14:40 +0200 Subject: [LAU] options for hard real time kernel for raring 13.04 In-Reply-To: <52317138.9060202@autostatic.com> References: <52316DEC.3070805@autostatic.com> <52317138.9060202@autostatic.com> Message-ID: > Yes I know but I didn't formulate my earlier e-mail well enough. What I > mean is that you still need to run make oldconfig, be it separately or > be it via make-kpkg. When I think about it I wondered why I replied in > the first place, your mail explains it all. Sorry for the noise :-| :-) /r From triplesquarednine at gmail.com Thu Sep 12 11:54:28 2013 From: triplesquarednine at gmail.com (jordan) Date: Thu, 12 Sep 2013 07:54:28 -0400 Subject: [LAU] options for hard real time kernel for raring 13.04 + nvidia Message-ID: I don't use Ubuntu/Debian but I do use Linux-rt + nVidia, in all of my H/W. So i thought i would clarify a point or two; > Found some suggestions about patching the nvidia driver with some > custom> code here [1], but the driver they use there is quite old. And last >time I had fiddled with nvidia driver it was the most painful experience > ever..:) > >Did you try the patch in my Github repository? You can download it with: >wgethttps://raw.github.com/AutoStatic/nvidia-rt/master/patch-3.0-rt-nvidia.patch This above patch only works for Nvidia driver < 325.xx ... 1. For Nvidia's newest drivers ~ you need my nvidia325xx-rt patch; http://sourceforge.net/projects/l-proaudio/files/nvidia-325xx-rt.patch/download (for me, this patch works fine on 3.8-rt and 3.10-rt. haven't tested anything older... I'm sure it's fine). When building the kernel module (don't know where this is done in Debian/ubuntu) you must ignore the PREEMPT_RT check in nvidia's installer, something like this; " make IGNORE_PREEMPT_RT_PRESENCE=1 SYSSRC=/usr/lib/modules/"${_kernver}/build" module " 2. I've also made available a patch for 319.32, patched for kernel 3.10 support (which then can be patched with the old rt patch, above "patch-3.0-rt-nvidia.patch"). - This is mainly for people who've experienced regressions with the 325xx nvidia driver, Patch is here; http://sourceforge.net/projects/l-proaudio/files/nVidia-319.32_lk310.patch/download I've also started a thread @ nvidia's dev portal about nvidia-rt; https://devtalk.nvidia.com/default/topic/572468/linux/nvidia-325-15-linux-rt-old-amp-amp-new-nvidia-rt-patch-methods-questions-about-nvidia-installer/ There aren't specific distro instructions, but a general "run down", instead. I don't know how different distros package nvidia, so it's beyond my own scope...and Since, i only use Archlinux, it is the only distro that i personally am concerned with. + anyone can see how Archlinux handles nvidia-rt by either reading through Arch's PKGBUILD in AUR; https://aur.archlinux.org/packages/nv/nvidia-rt/PKGBUILD ... then find out how to made your own distro apply what is needed. cheerz Jordan -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From lievenmoors at gmail.com Thu Sep 12 18:53:52 2013 From: lievenmoors at gmail.com (Lieven Moors) Date: Thu, 12 Sep 2013 20:53:52 +0200 Subject: [LAU] mastering dilemma In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20130912185351.GA753@satellite> On Thu, Sep 05, 2013 at 01:07:47PM -0500, Brent Busby wrote: > I'm going about the process of trying to learn what goes into > commercial mastering (yeah, I know...), and one of the conundrums > I've run into is that while most commercially produced music has a > particular sort of common EQ curve to it, I have to really force > myself to try to want that curve when I'm mixing. Really, it just > sounds cold. Almost anything sounds better (at least on good > speakers) with less cutting around 120-180Hz than most CD's seem to > have. And it really must be the result of EQ cuts too -- apart from Mastering is also about getting a good sound on a lot of different sound systems. My first guess would be that this frequency range could be problematic on some frequently used (and often cheap) systems, like car radios f.e. greetings, lieven From len at ovenwerks.net Thu Sep 12 19:31:45 2013 From: len at ovenwerks.net (Len Ovens) Date: Thu, 12 Sep 2013 12:31:45 -0700 Subject: [LAU] mastering dilemma In-Reply-To: <20130912185351.GA753@satellite> References: <20130912185351.GA753@satellite> Message-ID: <03d0459cf04fbcfc05a856d32b765945.squirrel@ssl.ovenwerks.net> On Thu, September 12, 2013 11:53 am, Lieven Moors wrote: > On Thu, Sep 05, 2013 at 01:07:47PM -0500, Brent Busby wrote: >> I'm going about the process of trying to learn what goes into >> commercial mastering (yeah, I know...), and one of the conundrums >> I've run into is that while most commercially produced music has a >> particular sort of common EQ curve to it, I have to really force >> myself to try to want that curve when I'm mixing. Really, it just >> sounds cold. Almost anything sounds better (at least on good >> speakers) with less cutting around 120-180Hz than most CD's seem to >> have. And it really must be the result of EQ cuts too -- apart from > > Mastering is also about getting a good sound on a lot of different > sound systems. My first guess would be that this frequency range could > be problematic on some frequently used (and often cheap) systems, > like car radios f.e. there are also some stereo preamps where the "loudness" if turned on, (or it maybe on all the time if there is no switch) "kicks out" part way through volume control range. So at low levels, loudness is on and at high levels not. If you happen to be mixing through one of these with the level below the threshold... you may be monitoring your mix with loudness on. This was before digital came along in preamp signal chains, newer ones may be doing a sliding loudness against level thing. Mixer -> power amp may be the best thing to try. Using a consumer amp for mix monitoring may give strange results. -- Len Ovens www.OvenWerks.net From bob at mellowood.ca Fri Sep 13 03:14:55 2013 From: bob at mellowood.ca (Bob van der Poel) Date: Thu, 12 Sep 2013 20:14:55 -0700 Subject: [LAU] M/S EQ in Linux In-Reply-To: <1378936811.2132.41.camel@archlinux> References: <20130909224222.GA10562@village.keycorner.org> <1378798185.2970.34.camel@archlinux> <20130910213813.GA9727@linuxaudio.org> <1378856806.1938.5.camel@archlinux> <1378914865.997.11.camel@archlinux> <20130911195019.GA5807@linuxaudio.org> <5230DA72.7020402@gmail.com> <20130911210652.GC5807@linuxaudio.org> <1378936811.2132.41.camel@archlinux> Message-ID: On Wed, Sep 11, 2013 at 3:00 PM, Ralf Mardorf wrote: > > However, modern crappy 200 W and more hifi equipment often only works > when the music is insane loud, at sane levels the speakers and what ever > else in the sound chain, are more biased, than at blast level. I had a > neighbour who is young, with a modern hifi, who listened to black eyed > peas or other crap that does sound as criminal as they do. The > generation "I even listen to my music, when using the local public > transport, at full power, by my smart phone speaker" owns gear that > perhaps doesn't fulfill what should be expected for "HiFi" equipment. > Funny, or sad ... in the 60s and 70s phone companies boasted about the fidelity and robustness of their landlines, and now we need to put up with the crappy cell phone (which sounds like shit, and drops calls more frequently than a whore's drawers). Stereo systems were installed and balanced to a room, now it's a $20 pair of ear buds on a phone playing a lo-res mp3. And all this when it is easy and cheap to create very high quality stuff. Something is wrong. I figure that this is why we die when we get older ... we just can't stand the BS that modern life brings. -- **** Listen to my CD at http://www.mellowood.ca/music/cedars **** Bob van der Poel ** Wynndel, British Columbia, CANADA ** EMAIL: bob at mellowood.ca WWW: http://www.mellowood.ca From althompson58 at gmail.com Fri Sep 13 03:34:22 2013 From: althompson58 at gmail.com (Al Thompson) Date: Thu, 12 Sep 2013 23:34:22 -0400 Subject: [LAU] M/S EQ in Linux In-Reply-To: References: <20130909224222.GA10562@village.keycorner.org> <1378798185.2970.34.camel@archlinux> <20130910213813.GA9727@linuxaudio.org> <1378856806.1938.5.camel@archlinux> <1378914865.997.11.camel@archlinux> <20130911195019.GA5807@linuxaudio.org> <5230DA72.7020402@gmail.com> <20130911210652.GC5807@linuxaudio.org> <1378936811.2132.41.camel@archlinux> Message-ID: <523287BE.4040408@gmail.com> On 09/12/2013 11:14 PM, Bob van der Poel wrote: > > Funny, or sad ... in the 60s and 70s phone companies boasted about the > fidelity and robustness of their landlines, and now we need to put up > with the crappy cell phone (which sounds like shit, and drops calls > more frequently than a whore's drawers). Stereo systems were installed > and balanced to a room, now it's a $20 pair of ear buds on a phone > playing a lo-res mp3. > > And all this when it is easy and cheap to create very high quality > stuff. Something is wrong. I figure that this is why we die when we > get older ... we just can't stand the BS that modern life brings. > My sentiments exactly!!!!! -- --- My bands, CD projects, music, news, and pictures: http://www.lateralforce.com Staat hei?t das k?lteste aller kalten Ungeheuer. Kalt l?gt es auch; und diese L?ge kriecht aus seinem Munde: 'Ich, der Staat, bin das Volk.' - [Friedrich Nietzsche] From ralf.mardorf at alice-dsl.net Fri Sep 13 05:33:13 2013 From: ralf.mardorf at alice-dsl.net (Ralf Mardorf) Date: Fri, 13 Sep 2013 07:33:13 +0200 Subject: [LAU] mastering dilemma In-Reply-To: <03d0459cf04fbcfc05a856d32b765945.squirrel@ssl.ovenwerks.net> References: <20130912185351.GA753@satellite> <03d0459cf04fbcfc05a856d32b765945.squirrel@ssl.ovenwerks.net> Message-ID: <1379050393.1061.13.camel@archlinux> On Thu, 2013-09-12 at 12:31 -0700, Len Ovens wrote: > there are also some stereo preamps where the "loudness" if turned on > > This was before digital came along in preamp signal chains, newer ones may > be doing a sliding loudness against level thing. Good point! To funny, I'm using such an amp, but doesn't use the amp's automagical EQ. For my Pioneer amp there is no loudness switch, but a switch to bypass the EQ, named "direct". If the EQ isn't bypassed, than the EQ does effect the signal more at low levels, than at loud levels. However, even if the EQ is in 0 (neutral) position, the sound is manipulated. My amp is an old analog amp and this "sliding loudness against level thing" is a PITA. FWIW my amp is not a good amp, but it anyway can be used for mastering. In addition to the speakers I use headphones and listen to the headphones by using the amp, the mixer and the card, this gives an impression about the biased signal. In a home studio we can have the best amps and speakers and anyway could experience issues. Unlikely that there is a chance to position the speakers correct, at least I can't do it in my too small music room. This doesn't mean that mastering has to be less good than done in a professional studio, it just takes much more time. From ralf.mardorf at alice-dsl.net Fri Sep 13 06:36:34 2013 From: ralf.mardorf at alice-dsl.net (Ralf Mardorf) Date: Fri, 13 Sep 2013 08:36:34 +0200 Subject: [LAU] M/S EQ in Linux In-Reply-To: References: <20130909224222.GA10562@village.keycorner.org> <1378798185.2970.34.camel@archlinux> <20130910213813.GA9727@linuxaudio.org> <1378856806.1938.5.camel@archlinux> <1378914865.997.11.camel@archlinux> <20130911195019.GA5807@linuxaudio.org> <5230DA72.7020402@gmail.com> <20130911210652.GC5807@linuxaudio.org> <1378936811.2132.41.camel@archlinux> Message-ID: <1379054194.1061.66.camel@archlinux> On Thu, 2013-09-12 at 20:14 -0700, Bob van der Poel wrote: > I figure that this is why we die when we get older ... we just can't > stand the BS that modern life brings. :D Nice joke, but just a half-truth. Regress is part of progress. We experiment with something new, some of the new is good and some isn't good. That is how evolution does work. Sharks kept their successful anatomy, they didn't make a regress, but they also didn't make progress. From gnome at hawaii.rr.com Fri Sep 13 06:48:57 2013 From: gnome at hawaii.rr.com (david) Date: Thu, 12 Sep 2013 20:48:57 -1000 Subject: [LAU] M/S EQ in Linux In-Reply-To: <1379054194.1061.66.camel@archlinux> References: <20130909224222.GA10562@village.keycorner.org> <1378798185.2970.34.camel@archlinux> <20130910213813.GA9727@linuxaudio.org> <1378856806.1938.5.camel@archlinux> <1378914865.997.11.camel@archlinux> <20130911195019.GA5807@linuxaudio.org> <5230DA72.7020402@gmail.com> <20130911210652.GC5807@linuxaudio.org> <1378936811.2132.41.camel@archlinux> <1379054194.1061.66.camel@archlinux> Message-ID: <5232B559.3080500@hawaii.rr.com> On 09/12/2013 08:36 PM, Ralf Mardorf wrote: > On Thu, 2013-09-12 at 20:14 -0700, Bob van der Poel wrote: >> I figure that this is why we die when we get older ... we just can't >> stand the BS that modern life brings. > > :D > > Nice joke, but just a half-truth. Regress is part of progress. We > experiment with something new, some of the new is good and some isn't > good. That is how evolution does work. Sharks kept their successful > anatomy, they didn't make a regress, but they also didn't make progress. Well, I'm kinda happy they didn't evolve the ability to levitate and breath air, or shoot laser beams from their mouths. But just think of the soundscapes a technological dolphin could come up with! -- David gnome at hawaii.rr.com authenticity, honesty, community http://dancingtreefrog.com http://clanjones.org/david/ http://dancing-treefrog.deviantart.com/ From ralf.mardorf at alice-dsl.net Fri Sep 13 07:42:40 2013 From: ralf.mardorf at alice-dsl.net (Ralf Mardorf) Date: Fri, 13 Sep 2013 09:42:40 +0200 Subject: [LAU] M/S EQ in Linux In-Reply-To: <5232B559.3080500@hawaii.rr.com> References: <20130909224222.GA10562@village.keycorner.org> <1378798185.2970.34.camel@archlinux> <20130910213813.GA9727@linuxaudio.org> <1378856806.1938.5.camel@archlinux> <1378914865.997.11.camel@archlinux> <20130911195019.GA5807@linuxaudio.org> <5230DA72.7020402@gmail.com> <20130911210652.GC5807@linuxaudio.org> <1378936811.2132.41.camel@archlinux> <1379054194.1061.66.camel@archlinux> <5232B559.3080500@hawaii.rr.com> Message-ID: <1379058160.1061.101.camel@archlinux> On Thu, 2013-09-12 at 20:48 -1000, david wrote: > But just think of the soundscapes a technological dolphin could come up > with! Perhaps not much different to Japanese classical music. AFAIK for Asian languages there are those pitch bend effects as birds and whales do too, at least the singing in Japanese classical music does include it, while it often sounds like it is done by whisky gargling old women, whereas birds and whales do sound more cute. Serious, the people making classical music often are stiff as a poker and the Japanese classical musicians are often stiff as a poker squared, I suspect that Dolphins are more playful, while making similar music. From ralf.mardorf at alice-dsl.net Fri Sep 13 07:48:20 2013 From: ralf.mardorf at alice-dsl.net (Ralf Mardorf) Date: Fri, 13 Sep 2013 09:48:20 +0200 Subject: [LAU] M/S EQ in Linux In-Reply-To: <1379058160.1061.101.camel@archlinux> References: <20130909224222.GA10562@village.keycorner.org> <1378798185.2970.34.camel@archlinux> <20130910213813.GA9727@linuxaudio.org> <1378856806.1938.5.camel@archlinux> <1378914865.997.11.camel@archlinux> <20130911195019.GA5807@linuxaudio.org> <5230DA72.7020402@gmail.com> <20130911210652.GC5807@linuxaudio.org> <1378936811.2132.41.camel@archlinux> <1379054194.1061.66.camel@archlinux> <5232B559.3080500@hawaii.rr.com> <1379058160.1061.101.camel@archlinux> Message-ID: <1379058500.1061.107.camel@archlinux> On Fri, 2013-09-13 at 09:42 +0200, Ralf Mardorf wrote: > On Thu, 2013-09-12 at 20:48 -1000, david wrote: > > But just think of the soundscapes a technological dolphin could come up > > with! > > Perhaps not much different to Japanese classical music. AFAIK for Asian > languages there are those pitch bend effects as birds and whales do too, > at least the singing in Japanese classical music does include it, while > it often sounds like it is done by whisky gargling old women, whereas > birds and whales do sound more cute. > Serious, the people making classical music often are stiff as a poker > and the Japanese classical musicians are often stiff as a poker squared, > I suspect that Dolphins are more playful, while making similar music. I'm not kidding about the musicians. It seems to be a cultural issue, even to brew tea is done in a ridiculous way by some Japanese people, might be good regarding to meditation or what ever, but it often is far away from being music or e.g. a useful way to brew a tea. From devel at thesaddj.com Fri Sep 13 10:12:10 2013 From: devel at thesaddj.com (Marco Donnarumma) Date: Fri, 13 Sep 2013 12:12:10 +0200 Subject: [LAU] options for hard real time kernel for raring 13.04 Message-ID: > Hi Marco, > > I recompiled a real time kernel for 13.04 following the system > configuration guide (in this case the italian translation that reports > "3.2.35-rt52"). > > http://linuxaudio.it/index.php/Configurazione_di_sistemi_audio_GNU/Linux#Compilare_il_tuo_real-time_kernel > > I'm using an hp pavilion 6 laptop with the ua-25 ex soundcard and with > this particular real time Kernel everything works fine. > 1 xrun discovered at 5,8 ms latency in 3 hours session, recording and > mixing with Ardour. > > Best regards > Nicola > > > Hi Nicola, thanks for sharing your experience. The process in that tutorial is very similar to the one I followed from the other tutorial in English. It's good to know it works well, yet my problem is with the nvidia driver that needs to be patched for -rt as well. thank you! best, M -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From devel at thesaddj.com Fri Sep 13 10:15:24 2013 From: devel at thesaddj.com (Marco Donnarumma) Date: Fri, 13 Sep 2013 12:15:24 +0200 Subject: [LAU] options for hard real time kernel for raring 13.04 Message-ID: > Hello Marco, > > I'm using it with the proprietary Nvidia drivers because of > > http://askubuntu.com/questions/232439/lubuntu-12-04-unresponsive-windows-with-certain-applications > > You can find a patch here: > > https://raw.github.com/AutoStatic/nvidia-rt/master/patch-3.0-rt-nvidia.patch > > Iirc it applies cleanly to 3.2 too. Not sure about newer kernel versions. > > Best, > > Jeremy > > Hey Jeremy, thanks a lot. I'll try your patch and report back. I'm travelling now but should be able to do it over the weekend. Will make another thread. best, M -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From devel at thesaddj.com Fri Sep 13 10:31:01 2013 From: devel at thesaddj.com (Marco Donnarumma) Date: Fri, 13 Sep 2013 12:31:01 +0200 Subject: [LAU] options for hard real time kernel for raring 13.04 Message-ID: Hey thanks all for the advice. I also learned a lot more about kernels :) Sorry if I didn't get back to each of you, I took notes of all your suggestions and I will test both patching the nvidia driver and use the pae kernel. I still can't get the kxstudio kernel after editing manually the apt sources though. I'll report back! best, M -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From ralf.mardorf at alice-dsl.net Fri Sep 13 10:36:23 2013 From: ralf.mardorf at alice-dsl.net (Ralf Mardorf) Date: Fri, 13 Sep 2013 12:36:23 +0200 Subject: [LAU] options for hard real time kernel for raring 13.04 In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <1379068583.1061.151.camel@archlinux> On Fri, 2013-09-13 at 12:12 +0200, Marco Donnarumma wrote: > yet my problem is with the nvidia driver that needs to be patched for > -rt as well Doing this it anyway could be, that it doesn't work, and the nouveau driver is very good nowadays, so I would use nouveau instead of the proprietary driver. I didn't follow the whole thread. Do you need rt? Threadirqs isn't good enough? A preempted kernel with threadirqs set at boot usually is nearly as good, as a kernel-rt and doesn't cause graphic driver issues. I used the kernel-rt with nouveau. 3D acceleration was very good, better then it is for me now, with the FLOSS ATI driver. From tim at quitte.de Fri Sep 13 10:39:59 2013 From: tim at quitte.de (Tim Goetze) Date: Fri, 13 Sep 2013 12:39:59 +0200 (CEST) Subject: [LAU] timing issues when using ladspa plugin 1769 click In-Reply-To: <52301E5F.90007@gmx.net> References: <52301E5F.90007@gmx.net> Message-ID: [Florian Paul Schmidt] > On 11.09.2013 00:46, Rusty Perez wrote: >> Again, to reiterate, when I record, the click starts as I start the >> recording engine, but upon playback, the click sortof studders as the >> playback fades up, and then the click is no in sync with my recording. >> >> Thoughts? > > Guessing: > > The LADSPA plugin has no information about the playback position. When you load > a session (or instantiate the plugin) playback position at start it produces > its first click right away once playback starts and its run function is called > for the first time. Now run the plugin for some amount of time. It will > internally always advance time, never taking into account how the playback > position changes when you relocate. What Flo said. If you can, it's probably the easiest for you to record the click track once and mute as needed. The Click plugin resets to time zero when the host calls its activate() function. Although it cannot tell the current transport position, it should never stutter. If you've found a way to make it stutter, please send me a recording of its output and/or detailed steps to replicate the problem. Tim From pianolivier at gmail.com Fri Sep 13 12:19:26 2013 From: pianolivier at gmail.com (olivier) Date: Fri, 13 Sep 2013 14:19:26 +0200 Subject: [LAU] =?utf-8?q?=5BA_bit_HS=5D_=5BArt_=26_Logiciels_Libres=5D_Gro?= =?utf-8?q?olot_=26_Sandra_Guillen_finalistes_des_Jeux_de_la_Franco?= =?utf-8?q?phonie_cat=2E_Cr=C3=A9ation_Num=C3=A9rique_-_A_diffuser?= =?utf-8?q?=5D?= In-Reply-To: <20130912083308.GB5106@sebkhachott.net> References: <20130912083308.GB5106@sebkhachott.net> Message-ID: Hi Aurelien, I added the info on linuxmao.org's homepage, hope you are pleased. Congrats to groolot & Sandra! http://www.linuxmao.org olivier On 12 September 2013 10:33, Aurelien wrote: > Hi all, > > Below is a message, written in French (sorry, if someone wants to > translate it, don't hesitate) about two AMMD artists who were designed > as France representative for 7th Jeux de la Francophonie (kind of > Olympics, but only for French-speaking countries, and having artistic > parts too) in the category Digital Creation. > > They're free artists, they publish their art as free art, and they do > use free softwares for this. Finally, groolot also develops free > software for stage pruposes. > > And they're now finalist for this challenge. There is still only 3 > countries in the row, so they're now ensured to get a medal. > > I thought it might interest you. > > If you read french, there also a french article about this on > linuxfr.org: > http://linuxfr.org/news/plebiscite-une-oeuvre-libre-en-finale-des-jeux-de-la-francophonie > > Enjoy > > > -- > Aur?lien > > > ---------- Forwarded message ---------- > From: "Aur?lien - Charg? de Porn - AMMD" > To: Aurelien > Cc: > Date: Thu, 12 Sep 2013 09:56:41 +0200 > Subject: Fwd: [Art & Logiciels Libres] Groolot & Sandra Guillen finalistes > des Jeux de la Francophonie cat. Cr?ation Num?rique - A diffuser > > > -------- Message original -------- > Sujet: [Art & Logiciels Libres] Groolot & Sandra Guillen finalistes des > Jeux de la Francophonie cat. Cr?ation Num?rique - A diffuser > Date : Wed, 11 Sep 2013 21:25:42 +0200 > De : ORL AMMD > R?pondre ? : orl at ammd.net > Organisation : AMMD > Pour : Aur?lien - Charg? de Prod AMMD > > Salut ? toi, > > (un pack de liens et d'explications est disponible en fin de mail - ce > mail ne contient pas d'image, afin que tu le lises vite et sans souci) > > Si tu re?ois ce mail, de quatre choses l'une : > > - soit tu connais groolot[1] (Gregory David) et/ou Sandra Guillen[2], ou > plus simplement l'AMMD[3] (dont font partie groolot et Sandra), > - soit tu t'int?resses ? l'art libre[6], > - soit tu t'int?resses aux logiciels libres[7], > - soit un peu des trois, ce qui est le plus probable. > > L'objet de ce mail est de t'informer que groolot et Sandra Guillen, avec > leur projet "Pl?biscite"[4], sont finalistes des 7e Jeux de la > Francophonie[5] dans la cat?gorie Cr?ation Num?rique pour laquelle ils > repr?sentent (!!!!) la France. > > On est donc tr?s fiers d'eux, et, encore plus, tr?s heureux pour eux, et > on t'invite ? suivre la suite de leur parcours, et notamment la finale > qui se tient Vendredi 13 Septembre, ? travers les diff?rents canaux de > communication[8] qu'on s'emploie ? martyriser pour faire vivre cette > actualit? artistique libre et talentueuse !!! > > N'h?site pas, toi aussi, ? faire tourner cette info. > > A tr?s bient?t. > > Aur?lien - AMMD > > > [1] groolot (a.k.a Gr?gory David dans ses oeuvres ?lectroniques) est un > compositeur de musiques ?lectroniques, qu'il s'emploie depuis quelques > ann?es ? faire vivre sur sc?ne ? travers des sc?nographies singuli?res, > r?unissant sa musique, les oeuvres plastiques de Sandra Guillen, des > capteurs divers et vari?s, des boards de programmation arduino, du > bouclage live... Il a ?galement particip? au spectacle jeune public > Sackboutboute, et a, ? ce titre, d?velopp? un logiciel d'?clairage de > sc?ne par vid?o-projection nomm? VSL. Il est r?guli?rement sollicit? par > des compagnies de th??tre pour l'?criture de trames et compositions > sonores pour les spectacles, mais aussi pour ses comp?tences en > informatique qu'il applique au spectacle vivant. > http://groolot.net > > [2] Sandra Guillen est une plasticienne et sc?nographe, travaillant > diff?rentes mati?res, en particulier v?g?tales et de r?cup?ration. Elle > collabore r?guli?rement avec groolot, participait ?galement au spectacle > Sackboutboute, et est ?galement intervenu dans la sc?nographie de > Sebkha-Chott. Avec les Baltringos elle r?alise ?galement des d?cors pour > des festivals, notamment les 3 El?phants (53), et s'implique en ce > moment dans un lieu de cr?ation et d'expression artistique appel? > l'Armoire ? Gaze. > http://www.sandra-guillen.fr > https://www.facebook.com/**pages/lArmoire-%C3%A0-gaze/**245685425476889 > > [3] L'AMMD est une coop?rative artistique libre, cr??e en 2004, et dont > l'objet est de "produire" de l'art libre, autant que possible avec des > logiciels et des mat?riels libres. Elle fait donc tour ? tour office de > tourneur, de producteur de disque, d'incubateur, de zone de cr?ation, de > zone de d?veloppement de logiciels libres pour le spectacle, bref une > marmite dans laquelle beaucoup de choses mijotent ! Et mieux, dans > l'AMMD, il n'y a pas d'"administratif permanent", les artistes > s'auto-g?rent !! groolot et Sandra Guillen en sont membres depuis > plusieurs ann?es maintenant. > > [4] Pl?biscite est le nouveau spectacle que groolot et Sandra Guillen > ont mont?, sous l'impulsion de groolot, lui-m?me impulsionn? par sa > s?lection en tant que repr?sentant de la France pour la cat?gorie > Cr?ation Num?rique des Jeux de la Francophonie. Il s'agit d'une oeuvre > audiovisuelle, destin?e ? ?tre jou?e live. > groolot en parle dans une interview accord?e ? l'?mission Symbiose : > http://symbiose.bonnes-ondes.**fr/ep/groolot-presente-**plebiscite > http://plebiscite.groolot.net > http://kisskissbankbank.com/**plebiscite(infos relativement ? jour dans > la section News) > > [5] Les Jeux de la Francophonie sont un ?quivalent des Jeux Olympiques > pour les pays francophones. Ils ont lieu l'ann?e suivant l'ann?e > Olympique, et ils comportent outre des ?preuves sportives des "?preuves > culturelles". 2013 est l'ann?e de la 7e ?dition des Jeux de la > Francophonie qui se d?roulent ? Nice. > http://jeux.francophonie.org > > [6] L'art libre est un art que l'on peut librement diffuser, reproduire > et modifier. Ce concept part du principe qu'on ne cr?e pas "ex nihilo", > mais qu'on s'inspire de ce qui nous entoure et de ce qui nous a pr?c?d?, > et que potentiellement, nous pourrions inspirer des choses dans la > suite. La licence Art Libre est une licence permettant de d?poser des > oeuvres d'Art Libre. Elle garantit la libert? d'usage, de reproduction, > de modification et de distribution des modifications ? la condition que > les modifications soient diffus?es sous la m?me licence. Tout cela > participe d'une dynamique de r?appropriation de l'art par tout ? chacun > et d'abolissement des barri?res entre artistes et publics. > http://artlibre.org > > [7] Les logiciels libres sont des logiciels que l'on peut librement > utiliser, recopier, modifier, et dont on peut distribuer les > modifications. A titre d'exemple, Firefox et OpenOffice sont des > logiciels libres. Les logiciels libres ?manent d'une partie de > l'informatique li?es aux syst?mes d'exploitation de type "distribution > GNU/Linux". Pour rappel le projet GNU, cr?? au d?but des ann?es 1980, > avait pour devise : "Free Software, Free Society". A travers donc le > d?veloppement de ce type de logiciels, c'est la reprise en main de > l'informatique par les utilisateurs qui est en jeu, et ? travers cela, > la reprise en main par "la population" de la probl?matique de son usage > des "outils informatiques". Les logiciels libres ont eu des > r?percussions dans de nombreux domaines, ? commencer par l'art libre, > les contenus (wikipedia), et ?galement les mat?riels libres (notamment > plans de tracteurs ou de r?frig?rateurs ? destination de l'Afrique ? > l'origine). > http://www.gnu.org > http://www.fsf.org > > [8] Tu peux suivre le projet au moyen des canaux suivants (au moins) : > - par mail > - http://www.ammd.net > - http://twitter.com/AMMDCoorp > > -- > Aur?lien - Charg? de productions Musiques > AMMD (Freak and Free Arts Coo[r]p) > [Booking - Productions - Promotion - Studio & Formations] > Mairie de Connerr? - Rue de l'Abreuvoir - 72160 Connerr? > +33 (0)95 234 72 48 (Mardi-Jeudi-Vendredi / 9h-17h) > www.ammd.net > > -- > Aur?lien - Charg? de productions Musiques > AMMD (Freak and Free Arts Coo[r]p) > [Booking - Productions - Promotion - Studio & Formations] > Mairie de Connerr? - Rue de l'Abreuvoir - 72160 Connerr? > +33 (0)95 234 72 48 (Mardi-Jeudi-Vendredi / 9h-17h) > www.ammd.net > > _______________________________________________ > Linux-audio-user mailing list > Linux-audio-user at lists.linuxaudio.org > http://lists.linuxaudio.org/listinfo/linux-audio-user > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From gheskett at wdtv.com Fri Sep 13 14:05:03 2013 From: gheskett at wdtv.com (Gene Heskett) Date: Fri, 13 Sep 2013 10:05:03 -0400 Subject: [LAU] M/S EQ in Linux In-Reply-To: References: <20130909224222.GA10562@village.keycorner.org> <1378936811.2132.41.camel@archlinux> Message-ID: <201309131005.03915.gheskett@wdtv.com> On Friday 13 September 2013 09:47:46 Bob van der Poel did opine: > On Wed, Sep 11, 2013 at 3:00 PM, Ralf Mardorf > > wrote: > > However, modern crappy 200 W and more hifi equipment often only works > > when the music is insane loud, at sane levels the speakers and what > > ever else in the sound chain, are more biased, than at blast level. I > > had a neighbour who is young, with a modern hifi, who listened to > > black eyed peas or other crap that does sound as criminal as they do. > > The generation "I even listen to my music, when using the local > > public transport, at full power, by my smart phone speaker" owns gear > > that perhaps doesn't fulfill what should be expected for "HiFi" > > equipment. > > Funny, or sad ... in the 60s and 70s phone companies boasted about the > fidelity and robustness of their landlines, and now we need to put up > with the crappy cell phone (which sounds like shit, and drops calls > more frequently than a whore's drawers). Stereo systems were installed > and balanced to a room, now it's a $20 pair of ear buds on a phone > playing a lo-res mp3. > > And all this when it is easy and cheap to create very high quality > stuff. Something is wrong. I figure that this is why we die when we > get older ... we just can't stand the BS that modern life brings. More truth than you want to admit there Bob. I, because I can't buy a sink bowl for our bathroom vanity (they haven't made that exact elliptical shape in years), had to replace the whole thing yesterday in what started out to be just a new faucet. $300 & change for a chipboard replacement for a real wooden unit now 40 years old. Real wood would have been special order, 2 months delivery, and $700. I didn't even bother to screw this ones back strap to the wall. I've a stock of white ash that would make an outstanding vanity, and the new, solid plastic top/sink will not notice when real wood replaces that chipboard crap, isn't even fit for kindling to start a fire with, base that is the one I just bought. With a little luck I might get the new base done before this one dissolves from the humidity. I'm only 79 in 3 weeks, I should have time enough left to do that. :) Cheers, Gene -- "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) My web page: should be up! Microsoft is not Y2K compliant: Windows 95, 98, ... and back again to 01 A pen in the hand of this president is far more dangerous than 200 million guns in the hands of law-abiding citizens. From harryhaaren at gmail.com Fri Sep 13 16:58:18 2013 From: harryhaaren at gmail.com (Harry van Haaren) Date: Fri, 13 Sep 2013 17:58:18 +0100 Subject: [LAU] OpenAV Fabla: 1.1 Release with Savage Drums preset Message-ID: Hey all, Its a pleasure to announce release Fabla 1.1: -UI opening in Ardour (visual) handled better -Pad state restore (visual) bug fixed -Colours behind dials (visual) fixed -Pad number redraw (visual) fixed -LV2 UI resize (visual) fixed -Added LICENSE file for Fedora packaging The acoustic drum sample pack "Savage Drums" is now included with Fabla! The sample pack was recorded at "The Music Hub" studio, in Limerick, Ireland. The drummer is Stephen Savage. Details available on http://openavproductions.com/fabla Cheers, -Harry -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From nicola.di.marzo at vodafone.it Fri Sep 13 18:55:02 2013 From: nicola.di.marzo at vodafone.it (Nicola Di Marzo) Date: Fri, 13 Sep 2013 19:55:02 +0100 Subject: [LAU] options for hard real time kernel for raring 13.04 In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <52335F86.5080304@vodafone.it> On 13/09/13 11:12, Marco Donnarumma wrote: > > Hi Marco, > > I recompiled a real time kernel for 13.04 following the system > configuration guide (in this case the italian translation that reports > "3.2.35-rt52"). > http://linuxaudio.it/index.php/Configurazione_di_sistemi_audio_GNU/Linux#Compilare_il_tuo_real-time_kernel > > I'm using an hp pavilion 6 laptop with the ua-25 ex soundcard and with > this particular real time Kernel everything works fine. > 1 xrun discovered at 5,8 ms latency in 3 hours session, recording and > mixing with Ardour. > > Best regards > Nicola > > > > > Hi Nicola, > > thanks for sharing your experience. The process in that tutorial is > very similar to the one I followed from the other tutorial in English. > It's good to know it works well, yet my problem is with the nvidia > driver that needs to be patched for -rt as well. > > thank you! > best, > M Hi Marco, Fortunately, i've never used proprietary drivers since i use Linux audio 'cause i always had intel video cards. Anyway, I'm interested in your issue and i will follow this thread, hope you will solve this soon! Regards Nicola -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From allcoms at gmail.com Fri Sep 13 21:23:16 2013 From: allcoms at gmail.com (Dan MacDonald) Date: Fri, 13 Sep 2013 22:23:16 +0100 Subject: [LAU] Mumble Rumble on archive.org Message-ID: Hi LA! I've just finished uploading my radio shows thus far to archive.org: MUMBLE RUMBLE 1 - BIRTH RUMBLE - 8/8/2013 Mumble Rumble is an irregular radio show broadcast on Dark City Radio using entirely free and open source software, most notably Mumble for VOIP. This is the debut episode of the show and discusses various aspects of Mumble and why I think its good enough to create a radio show to promote its use and why you should use it too, amongst other things. Please excuse the poor audio during the first few minutes - it gets better shortly after the introduction! TRACKS (edited out) apatt - Village Idiot tRANSELEMENt - King Henry https://archive.org/details/MumbleRumble1BirthRumble MUMBLE RUMBLE 2 - INTERVIEW WITH FALKTX - 15/8/2013 Mumble Rumble is an irregular radio show broadcast on Dark City Radio using entirely free and open source software, most notably Mumble for VOIP. Mumble Rumble was honoured to have legendary Linux audio hacker falkTX as its first ever guest for Mumble Rumble II. falkTX gets quizzed on his distribution/ repository KXStudio (as used to power Dark City Radio), his DISTRHO plugins, his plugin host Carla and much more! http://www.darkcityradio.com/ http://kxstudio.sourceforge.net/ https://archive.org/details/MumbleRumble2InterviewWithFalkTX MUMBLE RUMBLE 3 - MILES JOHNSTON INTERVIEW - 12/9/2013 Miles Johnston has not only played a significant role in both UK pirate radio (by setting up Kiss 103) as well as conventional broadcasting through his time at the BBC and SKY; he is more well known today as being one of the UK's leading researchers into UFO's, abductees, mind control and a whole host of other things that we're told don't exist, if we are aware of them at all. The main outlets of Miles research have been his Bases series of videos which started in the mid 90's by focusing on exposing the UK DUMBs (Deep Underground Military Bases) and more recently he played a major role in the AMMACH project, with which he is no longer involved. This show documents Miles first use of Mumble which he utilsed to express his feelings and notable memories of AMMACH, the media (including non-humans at the BBC), supersoldiers, implants, the Large Hadron Collider and much more! https://archive.org/details/MumbleRumble3MilesJohnstonInterview -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From gordonjcp at gjcp.net Sat Sep 14 08:21:01 2013 From: gordonjcp at gjcp.net (Gordon JC Pearce) Date: Sat, 14 Sep 2013 09:21:01 +0100 Subject: [LAU] M/S EQ in Linux In-Reply-To: <201309131005.03915.gheskett@wdtv.com> References: <20130909224222.GA10562@village.keycorner.org> <1378936811.2132.41.camel@archlinux> <201309131005.03915.gheskett@wdtv.com> Message-ID: <20130914082101.GB16961@gjcp.net> > On Friday 13 September 2013 09:47:46 Bob van der Poel did opine: > > Funny, or sad ... in the 60s and 70s phone companies boasted about the > fidelity and robustness of their landlines, and now we need to put up > with the crappy cell phone (which sounds like shit, and drops calls > more frequently than a whore's drawers). Stereo systems were installed > and balanced to a room, now it's a $20 pair of ear buds on a phone > playing a lo-res mp3. A bit off-topic, but if I never have to use a crackly lo-fi landline again I'll be quite happy. I haven't had a phone plugged in to mine for several years, and the only reason I still have a copper pair running to the house is that it's the only way to get broadband out here. I don't believe I actually have a landline phone to plug into it any more. In a month or so when I change phone contracts I'm going to stick a 3G router up on the mast and ditch ADSL and the expensive crappy landline altogether. -- Gordonjcp MM0YEQ From lorenzofsutton at gmail.com Sat Sep 14 08:43:40 2013 From: lorenzofsutton at gmail.com (Lorenzo Sutton) Date: Sat, 14 Sep 2013 10:43:40 +0200 Subject: [LAU] The World Will Note Message-ID: <523421BC.2060101@gmail.com> Dear LAU, I would like to share a work which was complete about 1 year ago which for various reasons is online only today: a video story (short film) by director Matteo Scerf? [1] for which I created the sound My part was done 100% in Linux. Links (see below for a brief explanation and linux-audio tech. details). Vimeo: http://vimeo.com/74006880 Direct link to ogv: https://copy.com/BlSzDxEA9kp4/the_world_will_note.ogv Audio only ogg: http://www.lorenzosu.net/video/the_world_will_note/wwn_audio_only.ogg I created the complete sound(track) as the final work for my electronic music diploma dissertation last year. As you can hear, this is not your tipical soundtrack :-). The film was initially conceived as silent, so my task was to give it sound at all levels. A more detailed explanation is provided in the accompanying paper [2] which I'm afraid is in Italian only, however I'll be happy to provide details if anyone is curious. All audio was created on Linux using FLOSS software. All audio was also generated, i.e. there is no sampled sound - with the exception of TTS which strictly speaking _does_ use samples. Audio software used. - JACK - Ardour (version 2 - with various LADSPA effects..) - Xjadeo (jack-transpor aware video player) - Pure Data (including Granita glanular synth) - Festival (speech synthesis - with some MBROLA voices) - Rosegarden - hexter DSSI - yoshimi Ardour + Xjadeo was my montage workbench. Pure Data was used to generate all sound ecept or TTS done through Festival. I owe much inspiration to Andy Farnell and his book Designing Sound [3] for the concepts, ideas and the philosophy of generating sound. Rosegarden was used to compose and sequence the 'musical' parts. Excluding TTS where wave files were generated and then imported into Ardour all the rest was directly fed and recorded into the DAW through JACK. Ciao, Lorenzo. [1] http://www.cinemaitaliano.info/pers/022008/matteo-scarfo.html [2] http://www.lorenzosu.net/video/the_world_will_note/twwn_documento.pdf [3] http://mitpress.mit.edu/books/designing-sound From dlphillips at woh.rr.com Sat Sep 14 12:16:27 2013 From: dlphillips at woh.rr.com (Dave Phillips) Date: Sat, 14 Sep 2013 08:16:27 -0400 Subject: [LAU] The World Will Note In-Reply-To: <523421BC.2060101@gmail.com> References: <523421BC.2060101@gmail.com> Message-ID: <5234539B.603@woh.rr.com> On 09/14/2013 04:43 AM, Lorenzo Sutton wrote: > Dear LAU, > > I would like to share a work which was complete about 1 year ago which > for various reasons is online only today: a video story (short film) > by director Matteo Scerf? [1] for which I created the sound My part > was done 100% in Linux. > ... Hi Lorenzo, I enjoyed all of it, especially the excellent sound-work. Thank you for sharing it, congratulations to everyone involved in the production. Bravo ! Best, dp From harryhaaren at gmail.com Sat Sep 14 12:36:35 2013 From: harryhaaren at gmail.com (Harry van Haaren) Date: Sat, 14 Sep 2013 13:36:35 +0100 Subject: [LAU] The World Will Note In-Reply-To: <523421BC.2060101@gmail.com> References: <523421BC.2060101@gmail.com> Message-ID: On Sat, Sep 14, 2013 at 9:43 AM, Lorenzo Sutton wrote: > I would like to share a work Thanks for sharing, I enjoyed watching it. What an attention to detail in the sound timing: I particularly liked the "putting-on-the-tie" scratch sounds. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From egor.sanin at gmail.com Sat Sep 14 15:57:14 2013 From: egor.sanin at gmail.com (Egor Sanin) Date: Sat, 14 Sep 2013 11:57:14 -0400 Subject: [LAU] The World Will Note In-Reply-To: <523421BC.2060101@gmail.com> References: <523421BC.2060101@gmail.com> Message-ID: On 9/14/13, Lorenzo Sutton wrote: > Dear LAU, > > I would like to share a work which was complete about 1 year ago which > for various reasons is online only today: a video story (short film) by > director Matteo Scerf? [1] for which I created the sound My part was > done 100% in Linux. Great work! I really enjoyed the film, and the sound design is very well executed, in my opinion. Thanks for sharing! From willgodfrey at musically.me.uk Sat Sep 14 18:04:13 2013 From: willgodfrey at musically.me.uk (Will Godfrey) Date: Sat, 14 Sep 2013 19:04:13 +0100 Subject: [LAU] The World Will Note In-Reply-To: <523421BC.2060101@gmail.com> References: <523421BC.2060101@gmail.com> Message-ID: <20130914190413.3e60f952@debian> On Sat, 14 Sep 2013 10:43:40 +0200 Lorenzo Sutton wrote: > Dear LAU, > > I would like to share a work which was complete about 1 year ago which > for various reasons is online only today: a video story (short film) by > director Matteo Scerf? [1] for which I created the sound My part was > done 100% in Linux. > > Links (see below for a brief explanation and linux-audio tech. details). > > Vimeo: > http://vimeo.com/74006880 > Direct link to ogv: > https://copy.com/BlSzDxEA9kp4/the_world_will_note.ogv > Audio only ogg: > http://www.lorenzosu.net/video/the_world_will_note/wwn_audio_only.ogg > > I created the complete sound(track) as the final work for my electronic > music diploma dissertation last year. > As you can hear, this is not your tipical soundtrack :-). The film was > initially conceived as silent, so my task was to give it sound at all > levels. A more detailed explanation is provided in the accompanying > paper [2] which I'm afraid is in Italian only, however I'll be happy to > provide details if anyone is curious. > > All audio was created on Linux using FLOSS software. All audio was also > generated, i.e. there is no sampled sound - with the exception of TTS > which strictly speaking _does_ use samples. > > Audio software used. > > - JACK > - Ardour (version 2 - with various LADSPA effects..) > - Xjadeo (jack-transpor aware video player) > - Pure Data (including Granita glanular synth) > - Festival (speech synthesis - with some MBROLA voices) > - Rosegarden > - hexter DSSI > - yoshimi > > Ardour + Xjadeo was my montage workbench. Pure Data was used to generate > all sound ecept or TTS done through Festival. I owe much inspiration to > Andy Farnell and his book Designing Sound [3] for the concepts, ideas > and the philosophy of generating sound. Rosegarden was used to compose > and sequence the 'musical' parts. > Excluding TTS where wave files were generated and then imported into > Ardour all the rest was directly fed and recorded into the DAW through JACK. > > Ciao, > Lorenzo. > > [1] http://www.cinemaitaliano.info/pers/022008/matteo-scarfo.html > [2] http://www.lorenzosu.net/video/the_world_will_note/twwn_documento.pdf > [3] http://mitpress.mit.edu/books/designing-sound > _______________________________________________ > Linux-audio-user mailing list > Linux-audio-user at lists.linuxaudio.org > http://lists.linuxaudio.org/listinfo/linux-audio-user Excellent work on the sound :) I'm afraid I couldn't really understand the video at all :( -- Will J Godfrey http://www.musically.me.uk Say you have a poem and I have a tune. Exchange them and we can both have a poem, a tune, and a song. From rustys.lists at gmail.com Sun Sep 15 00:49:28 2013 From: rustys.lists at gmail.com (Rusty Perez) Date: Sat, 14 Sep 2013 17:49:28 -0700 Subject: [LAU] Why would volume fluctuate while recording? Message-ID: I know this would be like finding a needle in a heystack, but, here goes. I just recorded an audio track in to ecasound via nama. Here's the input chain. Wide diafram condensor mic > Art Tube pack with compressor bipassed > line 3 of Delta 1010LT > DAW. There was no processing on the input chanel of the daw. But, while I was recording an energetic vocal/guitar track, the level of monitoring output on the mic only dropped about 15-20 db in my monitoring headphones. The click stayed at normal volume. Any thoughts at all? It's pretty hot here in the studio, could the heat be effecting things at all? CRAZY and mistifyed. Rusty From harryhaaren at gmail.com Sun Sep 15 02:00:01 2013 From: harryhaaren at gmail.com (Harry van Haaren) Date: Sun, 15 Sep 2013 03:00:01 +0100 Subject: [LAU] OpenAV : Sorcer 1.1 release Message-ID: Hey everybody, OpenAV is releasing Sorcer 1.1! Upgraded features such as a compressor and output level provide better feedback in an all new NTK based UI! Existing presets are remain unchanged: the compressor is off by default. Packagers will be happy to know that Sorcer now uses Make, so packaging should be easier. Details available on http://openavproductions.com/sorcer Cheers, -Harry -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jh at brainiac.com Sun Sep 15 02:34:47 2013 From: jh at brainiac.com (Joe Hartley) Date: Sat, 14 Sep 2013 22:34:47 -0400 Subject: [LAU] OpenAV : Sorcer 1.1 release In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20130914223447.91e855ee6f480f3ce23832f2@brainiac.com> On Sun, 15 Sep 2013 03:00:01 +0100 Harry van Haaren wrote: > Hey everybody, > > OpenAV is releasing Sorcer 1.1! Wow, between this and Fabla, you've been busy! Thanks! -- ====================================================================== Joe Hartley - UNIX/network Consultant - jh at brainiac.com Without deviation from the norm, "progress" is not possible. - FZappa From gnome at hawaii.rr.com Sun Sep 15 07:11:04 2013 From: gnome at hawaii.rr.com (david) Date: Sat, 14 Sep 2013 21:11:04 -1000 Subject: [LAU] M/S EQ in Linux In-Reply-To: <20130914082101.GB16961@gjcp.net> References: <20130909224222.GA10562@village.keycorner.org> <1378936811.2132.41.camel@archlinux> <201309131005.03915.gheskett@wdtv.com> <20130914082101.GB16961@gjcp.net> Message-ID: <52355D88.6070302@hawaii.rr.com> On 09/13/2013 10:21 PM, Gordon JC Pearce wrote: >> On Friday 13 September 2013 09:47:46 Bob van der Poel did opine: >> >> Funny, or sad ... in the 60s and 70s phone companies boasted about the >> fidelity and robustness of their landlines, and now we need to put up >> with the crappy cell phone (which sounds like shit, and drops calls >> more frequently than a whore's drawers). Stereo systems were installed >> and balanced to a room, now it's a $20 pair of ear buds on a phone >> playing a lo-res mp3. > > A bit off-topic, but if I never have to use a crackly lo-fi landline again I'll be quite happy. I haven't had a phone plugged in to mine for several years, and the only reason I still have a copper pair running to the house is that it's the only way to get broadband out here. I don't believe I actually have a landline phone to plug into it any more. I understand the old phone system audio was optimized for one thing: human speech. Narrow frequency range centered around the average human speech range. Listening to music over that was horrible! My cheap cell phone plays music far better than any landline phone ever did. -- David gnome at hawaii.rr.com authenticity, honesty, community http://dancingtreefrog.com http://clanjones.org/david/ http://dancing-treefrog.deviantart.com/ From brummer- at web.de Sun Sep 15 07:15:04 2013 From: brummer- at web.de (hermann meyer) Date: Sun, 15 Sep 2013 09:15:04 +0200 Subject: [LAU] Some new LV2 plugs Message-ID: <52355E78.6030707@web.de> Hi I've added some new LV2 plugs in the guitarix git repository lately. There are now beside the already known plugs some multiband plugs, which I've a lot of fun with. That's GxMultiband/ Distortion / Compressor / Echo and Delay. If you want to play with those plugs, you need to build from our git repository. http://sourceforge.net/p/guitarix/git/ci/master/tree/ greets hermann From gordonjcp at gjcp.net Sun Sep 15 10:15:52 2013 From: gordonjcp at gjcp.net (Gordon JC Pearce) Date: Sun, 15 Sep 2013 11:15:52 +0100 Subject: [LAU] Landlines, was Re: M/S EQ in Linux In-Reply-To: <52355D88.6070302@hawaii.rr.com> References: <20130909224222.GA10562@village.keycorner.org> <1378936811.2132.41.camel@archlinux> <201309131005.03915.gheskett@wdtv.com> <20130914082101.GB16961@gjcp.net> <52355D88.6070302@hawaii.rr.com> Message-ID: <20130915101552.GB22904@gjcp.net> On Sat, Sep 14, 2013 at 09:11:04PM -1000, david wrote: > I understand the old phone system audio was optimized for one thing: > human speech. Narrow frequency range centered around the average > human speech range. Listening to music over that was horrible! > > My cheap cell phone plays music far better than any landline phone ever did. > I use a lot of four-wire landlines at work, which are considerably "flatter" than normal phone circuits. You can order bare copper with flat response to about 10kHz which used to be used for broadcast links apparently. The new AOD stuff is more reliable (and can be switched like telephone calls, unlike hardwired links) but is restricted to "telephone bandwidth" by the digital codecs used. They're still hellish expensive though, at roughly eight grand per year per link ;-) -- Gordonjcp MM0YEQ From fons at linuxaudio.org Sun Sep 15 10:54:55 2013 From: fons at linuxaudio.org (Fons Adriaensen) Date: Sun, 15 Sep 2013 10:54:55 +0000 Subject: [LAU] Landlines, was Re: M/S EQ in Linux In-Reply-To: <20130915101552.GB22904@gjcp.net> References: <20130909224222.GA10562@village.keycorner.org> <1378936811.2132.41.camel@archlinux> <201309131005.03915.gheskett@wdtv.com> <20130914082101.GB16961@gjcp.net> <52355D88.6070302@hawaii.rr.com> <20130915101552.GB22904@gjcp.net> Message-ID: <20130915105455.GA429@linuxaudio.org> On Sun, Sep 15, 2013 at 11:15:52AM +0100, Gordon JC Pearce wrote: > I use a lot of four-wire landlines at work, which are considerably "flatter" than normal phone circuits. You can order bare copper with flat response to about 10kHz which used to be used for broadcast links apparently. The new AOD stuff is more reliable (and can be switched like telephone calls, unlike hardwired links) but is restricted to "telephone bandwidth" by the digital codecs used. In the early years when I was working in radio we used temporary landlines for all live outside broadcasts. They usually went from the concert venue to the nearest transmitter site, where we had microwave links back to Brussels unless those were in use by the TV people. Audio quality was usually more than good enough for FM broadcasting, and they were quite reliable. I remember only one occasion when we had any trouble with them. At some point we started experimenting with digital links based on multiple ISDN connections. Those were a nightmare, you couldn't trust them for more than five minutes. It took years before things were sorted out. Ciao, -- FA A world of exhaustive, reliable metadata would be an utopia. It's also a pipe-dream, founded on self-delusion, nerd hubris and hysterically inflated market opportunities. (Cory Doctorow) From brendan.jones.it at gmail.com Sun Sep 15 11:12:13 2013 From: brendan.jones.it at gmail.com (Brendan Jones) Date: Sun, 15 Sep 2013 13:12:13 +0200 Subject: [LAU] OpenAV : Sorcer 1.1 release In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <5235960D.1090003@gmail.com> On 09/15/2013 04:00 AM, Harry van Haaren wrote: > Hey everybody, > > OpenAV is releasing Sorcer 1.1! Upgraded features such as a compressor > and output level provide better feedback in an all new NTK based UI! > Existing presets are remain unchanged: the compressor is off by default. > > Packagers will be happy to know that Sorcer now uses Make, so packaging > should be easier. > Thanks Harry, if anyone is interested in a Fedora package you can roll your own here [1]. Shouldn't be too long before it s approved [2]. [1] http://bsjones.fedorapeople.org/reviews/lv2-sorcer-0.0.1-0.1.20130815git62d9577.fc19.src.rpm [2] https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=1004231 From willgodfrey at musically.me.uk Sun Sep 15 14:00:04 2013 From: willgodfrey at musically.me.uk (Will Godfrey) Date: Sun, 15 Sep 2013 15:00:04 +0100 Subject: [LAU] Landlines, was Re: M/S EQ in Linux In-Reply-To: <20130915101552.GB22904@gjcp.net> References: <20130909224222.GA10562@village.keycorner.org> <1378936811.2132.41.camel@archlinux> <201309131005.03915.gheskett@wdtv.com> <20130914082101.GB16961@gjcp.net> <52355D88.6070302@hawaii.rr.com> <20130915101552.GB22904@gjcp.net> Message-ID: <20130915150004.46d4137d@debian> On Sun, 15 Sep 2013 11:15:52 +0100 Gordon JC Pearce wrote: > On Sat, Sep 14, 2013 at 09:11:04PM -1000, david wrote: > > I understand the old phone system audio was optimized for one thing: > > human speech. Narrow frequency range centered around the average > > human speech range. Listening to music over that was horrible! > > > > My cheap cell phone plays music far better than any landline phone ever did. > > > > I use a lot of four-wire landlines at work, which are considerably "flatter" than normal phone circuits. You can order bare copper with flat response to about 10kHz which used to be used for broadcast links apparently. The new AOD stuff is more reliable (and can be switched like telephone calls, unlike hardwired links) but is restricted to "telephone bandwidth" by the digital codecs used. > > They're still hellish expensive though, at roughly eight grand per year per link ;-) > However... my experience is that, certainly for all the time I've had access to cell phones, for actual intelligible speech landlines are vastly superior in every respect. -- Will J Godfrey http://www.musically.me.uk Say you have a poem and I have a tune. Exchange them and we can both have a poem, a tune, and a song. From lorenzofsutton at gmail.com Sun Sep 15 14:32:58 2013 From: lorenzofsutton at gmail.com (Lorenzo Sutton) Date: Sun, 15 Sep 2013 16:32:58 +0200 Subject: [LAU] The World Will Note In-Reply-To: <20130914190413.3e60f952@debian> References: <523421BC.2060101@gmail.com> <20130914190413.3e60f952@debian> Message-ID: <5235C51A.5020103@gmail.com> On 14/09/13 20:04, Will Godfrey wrote: > On Sat, 14 Sep 2013 10:43:40 +0200 > Lorenzo Sutton wrote: > >> Dear LAU, >> >> I would like to share a work which was complete about 1 year ago which >> for various reasons is online only today: a video story (short film) by >> director Matteo Scerf? [1] for which I created the sound My part was >> done 100% in Linux. >> >> Links (see below for a brief explanation and linux-audio tech. details). >> >> Vimeo: >> http://vimeo.com/74006880 [...] > > Excellent work on the sound :) > I'm afraid I couldn't really understand the video at all :( > Thanks Will, Egor, Harry and Dave for the nice words. Will. Well, I guess the video is somewhat outside the box, and may not be everyone's cup of tea. I appreciate you enjoyed the sound anyhow :) Lorenzo. From jh at brainiac.com Sun Sep 15 14:45:38 2013 From: jh at brainiac.com (Joe Hartley) Date: Sun, 15 Sep 2013 10:45:38 -0400 Subject: [LAU] Landlines, was Re: M/S EQ in Linux In-Reply-To: <20130915105455.GA429@linuxaudio.org> References: <20130909224222.GA10562@village.keycorner.org> <1378936811.2132.41.camel@archlinux> <201309131005.03915.gheskett@wdtv.com> <20130914082101.GB16961@gjcp.net> <52355D88.6070302@hawaii.rr.com> <20130915101552.GB22904@gjcp.net> <20130915105455.GA429@linuxaudio.org> Message-ID: <20130915104538.ae43c8c010ed1379207f3cf1@brainiac.com> On Sun, 15 Sep 2013 10:54:55 +0000 Fons Adriaensen wrote: > In the early years when I was working in radio we used temporary > landlines for all live outside broadcasts. They usually went from > the concert venue to the nearest transmitter site, where we had > microwave links back to Brussels unless those were in use by the > TV people. Audio quality was usually more than good enough for FM > broadcasting, and they were quite reliable. I remember only one > occasion when we had any trouble with them. Came to be the old radio geezer posting about the landlines for remote broadcasts, see I'm beaten to the punch. Jump ahead to my days of owning an ISP, and finding out that we could install DSL modems on bare copper lines (aka alarm circuits), which were really, really cheap - until the telco caught on and stopped providing us with those circuits, which was probably illegal, but when does that ever stop big corporations?? > At some point we started experimenting with digital links based > on multiple ISDN connections. Those were a nightmare, you couldn't > trust them for more than five minutes. It took years before things > were sorted out. We then started provisioning ISDN circuits over Centrex, which eliminated the prohibitively high cost per minute charges(*) since the customer was considered a remote extension, and we paid by the mile away from one of our locations. It turned out that the telco (NYNEX, at the time) only had one technician, Jose, that had any idea how these circuits were to be installed. Unless he'd installed it, we knew the circuit wouldn't work until such time that Jose could be dispatched. We joked that NYNEX thought ISDN stood for "I Still Don't kNow". (*) We had one customer insist that they'd pay less money by going with an on-demand ISDN line that only connected when there was traffic, and would pay by the minute. They flipped when they got their first bill, as it was huge, They screamed at us until I proved that the traffic was caused by a Windows server that they had which would send some packets back to the Microsoft mothership every 5 or 10 minutes. They changed over to the dedicated line after that. -- ====================================================================== Joe Hartley - UNIX/network Consultant - jh at brainiac.com Without deviation from the norm, "progress" is not possible. - FZappa From fons at linuxaudio.org Sun Sep 15 15:20:54 2013 From: fons at linuxaudio.org (Fons Adriaensen) Date: Sun, 15 Sep 2013 15:20:54 +0000 Subject: [LAU] The World Will Note In-Reply-To: <5235C51A.5020103@gmail.com> References: <523421BC.2060101@gmail.com> <20130914190413.3e60f952@debian> <5235C51A.5020103@gmail.com> Message-ID: <20130915152054.GA580@linuxaudio.org> On Sun, Sep 15, 2013 at 04:32:58PM +0200, Lorenzo Sutton wrote: > Will. Well, I guess the video is somewhat outside the box, and may > not be everyone's cup of tea. I appreciate you enjoyed the sound > anyhow :) I enjoyed both very much. Congratulations to all involved ! -- FA A world of exhaustive, reliable metadata would be an utopia. It's also a pipe-dream, founded on self-delusion, nerd hubris and hysterically inflated market opportunities. (Cory Doctorow) From alf at mellomrommet.no Sun Sep 15 23:36:09 2013 From: alf at mellomrommet.no (Alf Haakon Lund) Date: Mon, 16 Sep 2013 01:36:09 +0200 Subject: [LAU] The World Will Note In-Reply-To: <523421BC.2060101@gmail.com> References: <523421BC.2060101@gmail.com> Message-ID: <52364469.2080202@mellomrommet.no> On 14. sep. 2013 10:43, Lorenzo Sutton wrote: > Dear LAU, > > I would like to share a work which was complete about 1 year ago which > for various reasons is online only today: a video story (short film) by > director Matteo Scerf? [1] for which I created the sound My part was > done 100% in Linux. > > Links (see below for a brief explanation and linux-audio tech. details). > > Vimeo: > http://vimeo.com/74006880 > Direct link to ogv: > https://copy.com/BlSzDxEA9kp4/the_world_will_note.ogv > Audio only ogg: > http://www.lorenzosu.net/video/the_world_will_note/wwn_audio_only.ogg > > I created the complete sound(track) as the final work for my electronic > music diploma dissertation last year. > As you can hear, this is not your tipical soundtrack :-). The film was > initially conceived as silent, so my task was to give it sound at all > levels. A more detailed explanation is provided in the accompanying > paper [2] which I'm afraid is in Italian only, however I'll be happy to > provide details if anyone is curious. > > All audio was created on Linux using FLOSS software. All audio was also > generated, i.e. there is no sampled sound - with the exception of TTS > which strictly speaking _does_ use samples. > > Audio software used. > > - JACK > - Ardour (version 2 - with various LADSPA effects..) > - Xjadeo (jack-transpor aware video player) > - Pure Data (including Granita glanular synth) > - Festival (speech synthesis - with some MBROLA voices) > - Rosegarden > - hexter DSSI > - yoshimi > > Ardour + Xjadeo was my montage workbench. Pure Data was used to generate > all sound ecept or TTS done through Festival. I owe much inspiration to > Andy Farnell and his book Designing Sound [3] for the concepts, ideas > and the philosophy of generating sound. Rosegarden was used to compose > and sequence the 'musical' parts. > Excluding TTS where wave files were generated and then imported into > Ardour all the rest was directly fed and recorded into the DAW through > JACK. > > Ciao, > Lorenzo. > > [1] http://www.cinemaitaliano.info/pers/022008/matteo-scarfo.html > [2] http://www.lorenzosu.net/video/the_world_will_note/twwn_documento.pdf > [3] http://mitpress.mit.edu/books/designing-sound Impressive work, Albeit a bit pessimistic. "And hardly less marvellous" is how all the sounds helps build the right, heavy atmosFear. My favourite part is the electornic voices and their mesmerizing messages. Thank you for sharing! Al F From simonzwise at gmail.com Mon Sep 16 06:56:46 2013 From: simonzwise at gmail.com (Simon Wise) Date: Mon, 16 Sep 2013 14:56:46 +0800 Subject: [LAU] Landlines, was Re: M/S EQ in Linux In-Reply-To: <20130915101552.GB22904@gjcp.net> References: <20130909224222.GA10562@village.keycorner.org> <1378936811.2132.41.camel@archlinux> <201309131005.03915.gheskett@wdtv.com> <20130914082101.GB16961@gjcp.net> <52355D88.6070302@hawaii.rr.com> <20130915101552.GB22904@gjcp.net> Message-ID: <5236ABAE.8070803@gmail.com> On 15/09/13 18:15, Gordon JC Pearce wrote: > On Sat, Sep 14, 2013 at 09:11:04PM -1000, david wrote: >> I understand the old phone system audio was optimized for one thing: >> human speech. Narrow frequency range centered around the average >> human speech range. Listening to music over that was horrible! >> >> My cheap cell phone plays music far better than any landline phone ever did. >> > > I use a lot of four-wire landlines at work, which are considerably "flatter" than normal phone circuits. You can order bare copper with flat response to about 10kHz which used to be used for broadcast links apparently. The new AOD stuff is more reliable (and can be switched like telephone calls, unlike hardwired links) but is restricted to "telephone bandwidth" by the digital codecs used. > > They're still hellish expensive though, at roughly eight grand per year per link ;-) > that's about what we paid in 1980 for such a link between to radio studios only a few kilometres apart ... that gave a high quality, tested, stereo link that was always ours, not shared in any way. Other landlines always varied a lot depending on there age and condition, but in terms of voice calls unless you had some old or long connection or something they were a lot clearer and more reliable than cellphones are here now. Simon From lorenzofsutton at gmail.com Mon Sep 16 08:11:58 2013 From: lorenzofsutton at gmail.com (Lorenzo Sutton) Date: Mon, 16 Sep 2013 10:11:58 +0200 Subject: [LAU] The World Will Note In-Reply-To: <52364469.2080202@mellomrommet.no> References: <523421BC.2060101@gmail.com> <52364469.2080202@mellomrommet.no> Message-ID: <5236BD4E.3080505@gmail.com> On 16/09/2013 01:36, Alf Haakon Lund wrote: > > > On 14. sep. 2013 10:43, Lorenzo Sutton wrote: >> Dear LAU, >> >> I would like to share a work which was complete about 1 year ago which >> for various reasons is online only today: a video story (short film) by >> director Matteo Scerf? [1] for which I created the sound My part was >> done 100% in Linux. [...] > > Impressive work, > > Albeit a bit pessimistic. "And hardly less marvellous" is how all the > sounds helps build the right, heavy atmosFear. My favourite part is the > electornic voices and their mesmerizing messages. > > Thank you for sharing! Thank you Alf. I guess it's worth mentioning all the 'spoken' parts (i.e. the electronic voices) as well as the title, are from historical sources: two speeches by Harry Truman - August 1945 - just after the Hiroshima attack [1] - I can see that the work can result pessimistic, our idea was that it is hopefully strongly thought-provoking. Lorenzo. [1] http://www.trumanlibrary.org/calendar/viewpapers.php?pid=100 and http://www.trumanlibrary.org/publicpapers/index.php?pid=104 From normalperson at yhbt.net Tue Sep 17 02:37:09 2013 From: normalperson at yhbt.net (Eric Wong) Date: Tue, 17 Sep 2013 02:37:09 +0000 Subject: [LAU] comparing audio recordings on the command-line? Message-ID: <20130917023709.GA21095@dcvr.yhbt.net> Hi, I'd like to compare recording quality of portable recorders. I only care about the line-in input of these portable recorders. I'm thinking: * play audio through a good DAC and feed the line-in of each recorder * copy audio files off the SD cards from the recorders * level match the inputs. Probably based on "sox FILE -n stats" output change input levels on each recorder to match levels. * play audio again through the DAC and feed the line-ins * copy audio files off the SD cards from the recorders again * run something like diff(1) for audio I'm willing to look at a spectrogram/graph image with feh(1), but I _really_ don't want to touch a mouse or tab through form buttons/boxes/inputs on a GUI. Thanks for reading. From ralf.mardorf at alice-dsl.net Tue Sep 17 07:04:38 2013 From: ralf.mardorf at alice-dsl.net (Ralf Mardorf) Date: Tue, 17 Sep 2013 09:04:38 +0200 Subject: [LAU] comparing audio recordings on the command-line? In-Reply-To: <20130917023709.GA21095@dcvr.yhbt.net> References: <20130917023709.GA21095@dcvr.yhbt.net> Message-ID: <1379401478.1697.10.camel@archlinux> A recorder that might do the better mic recording, might be less good in copying an analog line in signal. I would record the same audio source in the same location, from the same position, by different recorders using the microphones and then compare the signal from the read cards or at least copy it back using a digital output, resp. if you will using it to record line in, at least don't copy it back by using the analog way. I've got doubts that all recorders provide the same audio quality for mic in and line in. From ralf.mardorf at alice-dsl.net Tue Sep 17 07:42:47 2013 From: ralf.mardorf at alice-dsl.net (Ralf Mardorf) Date: Tue, 17 Sep 2013 09:42:47 +0200 Subject: [LAU] comparing audio recordings on the command-line? In-Reply-To: <20130917023709.GA21095@dcvr.yhbt.net> References: <20130917023709.GA21095@dcvr.yhbt.net> Message-ID: <1379403767.2725.1.camel@archlinux> On Tue, 2013-09-17 at 02:37 +0000, Eric Wong wrote: > I only care about the line-in input My apologies :D, didn't read carefully enough. However, why do you want to use analog line out? From ralf.mardorf at alice-dsl.net Tue Sep 17 07:46:45 2013 From: ralf.mardorf at alice-dsl.net (Ralf Mardorf) Date: Tue, 17 Sep 2013 09:46:45 +0200 Subject: [LAU] comparing audio recordings on the command-line? In-Reply-To: <20130917023709.GA21095@dcvr.yhbt.net> References: <20130917023709.GA21095@dcvr.yhbt.net> Message-ID: <1379404005.2725.4.camel@archlinux> On Tue, 2013-09-17 at 02:37 +0000, Eric Wong wrote: > Hi, I'd like to compare recording quality of portable recorders. > I only care about the line-in input of these portable recorders. > > I'm thinking: > > * play audio through a good DAC and feed the line-in of each recorder > > * copy audio files off the SD cards from the recorders Sorry, I guess I don't understand ... > * level match the inputs. Probably based on "sox FILE -n stats" > output change input levels on each recorder to match levels. > > * play audio again through the DAC and feed the line-ins ... why you want to do this? Forget what I've written. You seemingly want to test a copy of a copy, while doing some processing. IMO that won't give a valid result. From devel at thesaddj.com Tue Sep 17 08:42:07 2013 From: devel at thesaddj.com (Marco Donnarumma) Date: Tue, 17 Sep 2013 09:42:07 +0100 Subject: [LAU] options for hard real time kernel for raring 13.04 In-Reply-To: <52335F86.5080304@vodafone.it> References: <52335F86.5080304@vodafone.it> Message-ID: update #2 @Jeremy, I found out my machine suffers of the same freezing windows bug as yours when using the free driver. So I'm forced to get the nvidia driver working properly. No luck with it yet. @Jordan, thanks for your clarification. I had read your post [1] on the nvidia forum before writing to this list. I've tried both methods for Debian/Ubuntu that ulflj wrote in that thread, but none worked out. I guess it's because I'm using an older kernel 3.8 low latency and 3.2.6 rt. [1] http://bit.ly/16aUlqD SO... after a wrong trial that left me only with tty, I went with: \\\\\\ remove old nvidia stuff (it was corrupted in my case anyway) dpkg --get-selections | grep nvidia sudo apt-get purge {pkgs} \\\\\\ get the installer and patch it with rt patch boot in my low-latency 3.8 kernel tty level 3 downloaded the installer for 310.44 (the more recent driver that runs out of the box with my low latency kernel) ./NVIDIA-Linux-x86-310.44 --extract-only cd NVIDIA-Linux-x86-310.44/kernel/ patched it with Jeremy's patch: patch -Np1 -i nvidia-XXX-rt.patch sudo nvidia-installer This time apparently it worked for my low-latency kernel, but not for the rt kernel (a 3.2.6 custom one I compiled). What's curious is that when logging in the rt-kernel: - cinnamon crashes and goes in fall back mode without a way of recovering it - the nvidia module seems not to be loaded. I guess it's not because I don't see the flash screen NVidia at booting - so I launch the nvidia settings, and I'm welcomed with a message saying I'm not using the driver - so I launch the hardware driver utility, and I'm welcomed with another message saying the driver is installed What did I do wrong? Shall I have run the installer when running the rt-kernel? and if so, why is that, are modules kernel-dependent? I'm just wildly guessing the rt-kernel fails in loading the module.... any hint, again, is much appreciated. thank you! best wishes, M -- Marco Donnarumma New Media + Sonic Arts Practitioner, Performer, Teacher, Director. Embodied Audio-Visual Interaction Research Team. Department of Computing, Goldsmiths University of London ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Portfolio: http://marcodonnarumma.com Research: http://res.marcodonnarumma.com Director: http://www.liveperformersmeeting.net On Fri, Sep 13, 2013 at 7:55 PM, Nicola Di Marzo < nicola.di.marzo at vodafone.it> wrote: > On 13/09/13 11:12, Marco Donnarumma wrote: > > > Hi Marco, >> >> I recompiled a real time kernel for 13.04 following the system >> configuration guide (in this case the italian translation that reports >> "3.2.35-rt52"). >> >> http://linuxaudio.it/index.php/Configurazione_di_sistemi_audio_GNU/Linux#Compilare_il_tuo_real-time_kernel >> >> I'm using an hp pavilion 6 laptop with the ua-25 ex soundcard and with >> this particular real time Kernel everything works fine. >> 1 xrun discovered at 5,8 ms latency in 3 hours session, recording and >> mixing with Ardour. >> >> Best regards >> Nicola >> > >> > > Hi Nicola, > > thanks for sharing your experience. The process in that tutorial is very > similar to the one I followed from the other tutorial in English. It's good > to know it works well, yet my problem is with the nvidia driver that needs > to be patched for -rt as well. > > thank you! > best, > M > > Hi Marco, > > Fortunately, i've never used proprietary drivers since i use Linux audio > 'cause i always had intel video cards. > Anyway, I'm interested in your issue and i will follow this thread, hope > you will solve this soon! > > Regards > Nicola > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From ralf.mardorf at alice-dsl.net Tue Sep 17 10:02:54 2013 From: ralf.mardorf at alice-dsl.net (Ralf Mardorf) Date: Tue, 17 Sep 2013 12:02:54 +0200 Subject: [LAU] options for hard real time kernel for raring 13.04 In-Reply-To: References: <52335F86.5080304@vodafone.it> Message-ID: <1379412174.3152.13.camel@archlinux> On Tue, 2013-09-17 at 09:42 +0100, Marco Donnarumma wrote: > This time apparently it worked for my low-latency kernel, but not for > the rt kernel (a 3.2.6 custom one I compiled). What's curious is that > when logging in the rt-kernel: > > > - cinnamon crashes and goes in fall back mode without a way of > recovering it What does ~/.xsession-errors say? > - the nvidia module seems not to be loaded. I guess it's not because I > don't see the flash screen NVidia at booting Don't guess, take a look at /var/log/Xorg.0.log. When doing this, first grep EE, IOW run grep EE /var/log/Xorg.0.log > - so I launch the nvidia settings, and I'm welcomed with a message > saying I'm not using the driver Seems to be the answer ;). > - so I launch the hardware driver utility, and I'm welcomed with > another message saying the driver is installed Perhaps not the module for the kernel you use. > Shall I have run the installer when running the rt-kernel? and if so, > why is that, are modules kernel-dependent? Modules have to fit to the kernel. You should run the NVIDIA *run thingy manually. I've got no time to search for you an English howto, sorry, on the quick I only found a German howto: http://wiki.ubuntuusers.de/Grafikkarten/Nvidia/Manuelle_Treiberinstallation You perhaps need to stop by another way, than using /etc/init.d/..., this depends to the distro you're using. From ralf.mardorf at alice-dsl.net Tue Sep 17 10:26:23 2013 From: ralf.mardorf at alice-dsl.net (Ralf Mardorf) Date: Tue, 17 Sep 2013 12:26:23 +0200 Subject: [LAU] options for hard real time kernel for raring 13.04 In-Reply-To: References: <52335F86.5080304@vodafone.it> Message-ID: <1379413583.3152.18.camel@archlinux> Sorry, again a PS: On Tue, 2013-09-17 at 09:42 +0100, Marco Donnarumma wrote: > Shall I have run the installer when running the rt-kernel? Only if you run sudo sh NVIDIA-Linux-x86-100.14.09-pkg1.run -a -K --kernel-name=$(uname -r) you also could add the wanted kernel behind the "--kernel-name=" instead of "$(uname -r)", when doing it running another kernel. IIRC you don't need to sop X, when you only want to build the kernel module. From ralf.mardorf at alice-dsl.net Tue Sep 17 10:27:52 2013 From: ralf.mardorf at alice-dsl.net (Ralf Mardorf) Date: Tue, 17 Sep 2013 12:27:52 +0200 Subject: [LAU] options for hard real time kernel for raring 13.04 In-Reply-To: <1379413583.3152.18.camel@archlinux> References: <52335F86.5080304@vodafone.it> <1379413583.3152.18.camel@archlinux> Message-ID: <1379413672.3152.19.camel@archlinux> "Aller guten Dinge sind 3 :(" On Tue, 2013-09-17 at 12:26 +0200, Ralf Mardorf wrote: > Sorry, again a PS: > > On Tue, 2013-09-17 at 09:42 +0100, Marco Donnarumma wrote: > > Shall I have run the installer when running the rt-kernel? > > Only if you run > > sudo sh NVIDIA-Linux-x86-100.14.09-pkg1.run -a -K --kernel-name=$(uname -r) ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ add your NVIDIA driver version here. > you also could add the wanted kernel behind the "--kernel-name=" instead > of "$(uname -r)", when doing it running another kernel. IIRC you don't > need to sop X, when you only want to build the kernel module. > From nettings at stackingdwarves.net Tue Sep 17 10:46:06 2013 From: nettings at stackingdwarves.net (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?J=F6rn_Nettingsmeier?=) Date: Tue, 17 Sep 2013 12:46:06 +0200 Subject: [LAU] comparing audio recordings on the command-line? In-Reply-To: <20130917023709.GA21095@dcvr.yhbt.net> References: <20130917023709.GA21095@dcvr.yhbt.net> Message-ID: <523832EE.9080403@stackingdwarves.net> On 09/17/2013 04:37 AM, Eric Wong wrote: > Hi, I'd like to compare recording quality of portable recorders. > I only care about the line-in input of these portable recorders. if you have a "known good" signal source (that surpasses the quality of the unit under test in all aspects you care about), you can measure the line-in of your recorder from that. your best option would be to measure the impulse response of the recorder by feeding it a sine sweep from, say, 20 hz to 22 khz (or more, if you care about extended frequency response and the device is running at above 48khz sampling rate), recording that, and generating an impulse response from it. fons adriaensen's "aliki" tool is useful for that, if somewhat tricky to use. a look at the impulse reponse will reveal distortion, and a look at the raw sine sweep will give you a pretty good idea of the amplitude response over frequency. then there's "jnoisemeter", also by fons, which can give you a pretty good measurement of the noise floor. but all these measurements either rely on reference gear to produce the test signals, or _very_ careful thinking if the test signals might are already laden with their own problems. there's an old saying in german which unfortunately doesn't translate well: "wer viel misst, misst mist.", literally, "s/he who measures a lot, will measure dung" (as in, will obtain false or misleading results). there is no such thing as an audio diff, nor would it be meaningful. the only practical application of something resembling an audio diff is a dual fft that constantly compares the input of a P.A. system with its output as picked up by a measurement microphone in the room. you could do the same with your recorder, but it's compromised, because the program material will not be a good source signal for all aspects of audio quality. you can obtain better results with special test signals such as pink noise (which is obviously not possible during a show, except maybe for some fringe genres, hence the dual fft :) -- J?rn Nettingsmeier Lortzingstr. 11, 45128 Essen, Tel. +49 177 7937487 Meister f?r Veranstaltungstechnik (B?hne/Studio) Tonmeister VDT http://stackingdwarves.net From ralf.mardorf at alice-dsl.net Tue Sep 17 10:56:15 2013 From: ralf.mardorf at alice-dsl.net (Ralf Mardorf) Date: Tue, 17 Sep 2013 12:56:15 +0200 Subject: [LAU] comparing audio recordings on the command-line? In-Reply-To: <523832EE.9080403@stackingdwarves.net> References: <20130917023709.GA21095@dcvr.yhbt.net> <523832EE.9080403@stackingdwarves.net> Message-ID: <1379415375.3152.22.camel@archlinux> On Tue, 2013-09-17 at 12:46 +0200, J?rn Nettingsmeier wrote: > but all these measurements either rely on reference gear to produce > the test signals, or _very_ careful thinking if the test signals might > are already laden with their own problems. Good hints :)! Your hints anyway will provide a more valid result, than checking the copy of a copy. From edogawa at aon.at Tue Sep 17 12:08:54 2013 From: edogawa at aon.at (Edgar Aichinger) Date: Tue, 17 Sep 2013 14:08:54 +0200 Subject: [LAU] comparing audio recordings on the command-line? In-Reply-To: <523832EE.9080403@stackingdwarves.net> References: <20130917023709.GA21095@dcvr.yhbt.net> <523832EE.9080403@stackingdwarves.net> Message-ID: <2047040.MilOm5WUP9@edhp> Am Dienstag, 17. September 2013, 12:46:06 schrieb J?rn Nettingsmeier: > there's an old saying in german which unfortunately doesn't translate > well: "wer viel misst, misst mist.", literally, "s/he who measures a > lot, will measure dung" (as in, will obtain false or misleading results). "who measures much, measures mess", may sort of transport the idea, if it's not obvious from reading the original already... :D Edgar From fons at linuxaudio.org Tue Sep 17 13:43:17 2013 From: fons at linuxaudio.org (Fons Adriaensen) Date: Tue, 17 Sep 2013 13:43:17 +0000 Subject: [LAU] comparing audio recordings on the command-line? In-Reply-To: <523832EE.9080403@stackingdwarves.net> References: <20130917023709.GA21095@dcvr.yhbt.net> <523832EE.9080403@stackingdwarves.net> Message-ID: <20130917134317.GB11223@linuxaudio.org> On Tue, Sep 17, 2013 at 12:46:06PM +0200, J?rn Nettingsmeier wrote: > On 09/17/2013 04:37 AM, Eric Wong wrote: > > >Hi, I'd like to compare recording quality of portable recorders. > >I only care about the line-in input of these portable recorders. > > a look at the impulse reponse will reveal distortion, and a look at > the raw sine sweep will give you a pretty good idea of the amplitude > response over frequency. > > then there's "jnoisemeter", also by fons, which can give you a > pretty good measurement of the noise floor. The primary tools to measure an A/D or D/A (that's what it amounts to, the rest just be pretty transparent in any recorder) are jaaa and jnoisemeter. Both were explicitly designed for the job. > but all these measurements either rely on reference gear to produce > the test signals, or _very_ careful thinking if the test signals > might are already laden with their own problems. I you have a good quality audio card it is perfectly possible to use this as a signal source. First measure it separately, so you have an idea of the limits of what you can do using it. For some measurements you also need to calibrate it using a true RMS audio voltmeter which you can beg, steal or borrow. You may need some simple HW: passive attenuators (three resistors), and plugs or test cables to short-circuit inputs. For the rest you need to perfectly understand *what* you try to measure, and have a very systematic approach to doing it. > there's an old saying in german which unfortunately doesn't > translate well: "wer viel misst, misst mist.", literally, "s/he who > measures a lot, will measure dung" (as in, will obtain false or > misleading results). 99% percent of false results are due tp lack of understanding, and failing to verify basic things such as levels. Ciao, -- FA A world of exhaustive, reliable metadata would be an utopia. It's also a pipe-dream, founded on self-delusion, nerd hubris and hysterically inflated market opportunities. (Cory Doctorow) From egor.sanin at gmail.com Tue Sep 17 14:15:53 2013 From: egor.sanin at gmail.com (Egor Sanin) Date: Tue, 17 Sep 2013 10:15:53 -0400 Subject: [LAU] Why would volume fluctuate while recording? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On 9/14/13, Rusty Perez wrote: > Wide diafram condensor mic > Art Tube pack with compressor bipassed > > line 3 of Delta 1010LT > DAW. > There was no processing on the input chanel of the daw. > > But, while I was recording an energetic vocal/guitar track, the level > of monitoring output on the mic only dropped about 15-20 db in my > monitoring headphones. The click stayed at normal volume. > Any thoughts at all? Hi Rusty, I have had a similar problem with the Delta, and as far as I remember the problem was a faulty connection. Whether it was corrosion on the Delta input socket, or dirt, or both I don't know, but after wroking the plug in the socket a bit, the problem seems to have gone away for me. Hope that helps. From djdualcore at gmail.com Tue Sep 17 17:22:16 2013 From: djdualcore at gmail.com (Neil) Date: Tue, 17 Sep 2013 12:22:16 -0500 Subject: [LAU] Slides from my Ohio Linux Fest 2013 presentation Message-ID: I'm just home from this year's Ohio Linux Fest. I spoke on under-recognized musical uses for computers. The blog post linked below includes my slides. http://oldmixtapes.blogspot.com/2013/09/thank-you-to-everybody-who-attended-my.html Neil -- DJ Dual Core's Blog http://oldmixtapes.blogspot.com/ Order without government; Peace without violence. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From fons at linuxaudio.org Tue Sep 17 21:01:28 2013 From: fons at linuxaudio.org (Fons Adriaensen) Date: Tue, 17 Sep 2013 21:01:28 +0000 Subject: [LAU] Update of zita-ajbridge Message-ID: <20130917210128.GA5425@linuxaudio.org> Hello all, zita-ajbridge-0.4.0 is now available at the usual place: >From the README: * The 'JackPortIsTerminal' and 'JackPortIsPhysical' flags are set on the Jack ports. * The correct latency value is set on the Jack ports. This is the latency resulting from buffering and resampling. It does not include any additional latency due to processing by the sound card, e.g. from anti-alias filters. This can be added using the -I (for a2j) and -O (for j2a) options, in the same way as for Jack's ALSA backend. The README also explains how to test this. Ciao, -- FA A world of exhaustive, reliable metadata would be an utopia. It's also a pipe-dream, founded on self-delusion, nerd hubris and hysterically inflated market opportunities. (Cory Doctorow) From normalperson at yhbt.net Tue Sep 17 22:26:52 2013 From: normalperson at yhbt.net (Eric Wong) Date: Tue, 17 Sep 2013 22:26:52 +0000 Subject: [LAU] comparing audio recordings on the command-line? In-Reply-To: <1379403767.2725.1.camel@archlinux> References: <20130917023709.GA21095@dcvr.yhbt.net> <1379403767.2725.1.camel@archlinux> Message-ID: <20130917222652.GA6071@dcvr.yhbt.net> Ralf Mardorf wrote: > On Tue, 2013-09-17 at 02:37 +0000, Eric Wong wrote: > > I only care about the line-in input > > My apologies :D, didn't read carefully enough. However, why do you want > to use analog line out? I use external mics + battery box with the portable recorders for recording live music. Occasionally, I may also feed the tape-out of my stereo receiver to digitize vinyl since it's the only usable line-in+ADC I have. From ralf.mardorf at alice-dsl.net Tue Sep 17 23:19:20 2013 From: ralf.mardorf at alice-dsl.net (Ralf Mardorf) Date: Wed, 18 Sep 2013 01:19:20 +0200 Subject: [LAU] comparing audio recordings on the command-line? In-Reply-To: <20130917222652.GA6071@dcvr.yhbt.net> References: <20130917023709.GA21095@dcvr.yhbt.net> <1379403767.2725.1.camel@archlinux> <20130917222652.GA6071@dcvr.yhbt.net> Message-ID: <1379459960.1187.4.camel@archlinux> On Tue, 2013-09-17 at 22:26 +0000, Eric Wong wrote: > Ralf Mardorf wrote: > > On Tue, 2013-09-17 at 02:37 +0000, Eric Wong wrote: > > > I only care about the line-in input > > > > My apologies :D, didn't read carefully enough. However, why do you want > > to use analog line out? > > I use external mics + battery box with the portable recorders for > recording live music. > > Occasionally, I may also feed the tape-out of my stereo receiver to > digitize vinyl since it's the only usable line-in+ADC I have. Sorry again, I didn't read carefully. I meant the recorder's line out, but you didn't wrote about using it. Later I noticed that you copied from the SD card and then feed the line ins again. Instead of DA I read AD and I missed to read some sentences. :D From devel at thesaddj.com Wed Sep 18 11:56:08 2013 From: devel at thesaddj.com (Marco Donnarumma) Date: Wed, 18 Sep 2013 12:56:08 +0100 Subject: [LAU] (no subject) Message-ID: Thanks Ralf, helpful info. But no luck yet. see below. > - the nvidia module seems not to be loaded. I guess it's not because I > > don't see the flash screen NVidia at booting > > Don't guess, take a look at /var/log/Xorg.0.log. When doing this, first > grep EE, IOW run > > grep EE /var/log/Xorg.0.log > Failed to load module :) grep EE /var/log/Xorg.0.log [ 28.292] Current Operating System: Linux blackrottenchest 3.2.48-rt69 #1 SMP PREEMPT RT Wed Sep 11 15:34:00 CEST 2013 i686 (WW) warning, (EE) error, (NI) not implemented, (??) unknown. [ 28.296] Initializing built-in extension MIT-SCREEN-SAVER [ 30.244] (EE) NVIDIA: Failed to load the NVIDIA kernel module. Please check your [ 30.244] (EE) NVIDIA: system's kernel log for additional error messages. [ 30.244] (EE) Failed to load module "nvidia" (module-specific error, 0) [ 30.252] (EE) NVIDIA: Failed to load the NVIDIA kernel module. Please check your [ 30.252] (EE) NVIDIA: system's kernel log for additional error messages. [ 30.253] (EE) Failed to load module "nvidia" (module-specific error, 0) [ 30.310] (EE) [drm] KMS not enabled [ 30.310] (EE) open /dev/dri/card0: No such file or directory [ 30.334] (EE) open /dev/fb0: No such file or directory [ 31.077] (EE) Failed to initialize GLX extension (Compatible NVIDIA X driver not found) [ 31.149] (II) XKB: reuse xkmfile /var/lib/xkb/server-3781FECB9CB8D26EE03343DB2C93394EA704B98F.xkm > > Shall I have run the installer when running the rt-kernel? and if so, > > why is that, are modules kernel-dependent? > > Modules have to fit to the kernel. You should run the NVIDIA *run thingy > manually. > > I've got no time to search for you an English howto, sorry, on the quick > I only found a German howto: > http://wiki.ubuntuusers.de/Grafikkarten/Nvidia/Manuelle_Treiberinstallation > ok. that clarifies it, thank you. Anyway, I tried the module building only, and failed again. to be extra-safe, this time I booted the rt kernel and did: sudo ./nvidia-installer -a -K --kernel-name=$(uname -r) >From the nvidia log I can see the module being successfully built, but not installed because: ERROR: A DKMS kernel module with version 310.44 is already installed. ERROR: Installation has failed. So, something is still wrong. It would seem my previous installation had installed a module in the rt kernel, but that module doesn't work with rt kernel 3.2.xx? thanks, cheers, -- Marco Donnarumma New Media + Sonic Arts Practitioner, Performer, Teacher, Director. Embodied Audio-Visual Interaction Research Team. Department of Computing, Goldsmiths University of London ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Portfolio: http://marcodonnarumma.com Research: http://res.marcodonnarumma.com Director: http://www.liveperformersmeeting.net -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From devel at thesaddj.com Wed Sep 18 12:19:41 2013 From: devel at thesaddj.com (Marco Donnarumma) Date: Wed, 18 Sep 2013 13:19:41 +0100 Subject: [LAU] options for hard real time kernel for raring 13.04 Message-ID: [sorry, resending this to the list cuz I had forgot the subject] ~~~~~ Thanks Ralf, helpful info. But no luck yet. see below. > - the nvidia module seems not to be loaded. I guess it's not because I > > don't see the flash screen NVidia at booting > > Don't guess, take a look at /var/log/Xorg.0.log. When doing this, first > grep EE, IOW run > > grep EE /var/log/Xorg.0.log > Failed to load module :) grep EE /var/log/Xorg.0.log [ 28.292] Current Operating System: Linux blackrottenchest 3.2.48-rt69 #1 SMP PREEMPT RT Wed Sep 11 15:34:00 CEST 2013 i686 (WW) warning, (EE) error, (NI) not implemented, (??) unknown. [ 28.296] Initializing built-in extension MIT-SCREEN-SAVER [ 30.244] (EE) NVIDIA: Failed to load the NVIDIA kernel module. Please check your [ 30.244] (EE) NVIDIA: system's kernel log for additional error messages. [ 30.244] (EE) Failed to load module "nvidia" (module-specific error, 0) [ 30.252] (EE) NVIDIA: Failed to load the NVIDIA kernel module. Please check your [ 30.252] (EE) NVIDIA: system's kernel log for additional error messages. [ 30.253] (EE) Failed to load module "nvidia" (module-specific error, 0) [ 30.310] (EE) [drm] KMS not enabled [ 30.310] (EE) open /dev/dri/card0: No such file or directory [ 30.334] (EE) open /dev/fb0: No such file or directory [ 31.077] (EE) Failed to initialize GLX extension (Compatible NVIDIA X driver not found) [ 31.149] (II) XKB: reuse xkmfile /var/lib/xkb/server-3781FECB9CB8D26EE03343DB2C93394EA704B98F.xkm > > Shall I have run the installer when running the rt-kernel? and if so, > > why is that, are modules kernel-dependent? > > Modules have to fit to the kernel. You should run the NVIDIA *run thingy > manually. > > I've got no time to search for you an English howto, sorry, on the quick > I only found a German howto: > http://wiki.ubuntuusers.de/Grafikkarten/Nvidia/Manuelle_Treiberinstallation > ok. that clarifies it, thank you. Anyway, I tried the module building only, and failed again. to be extra-safe, this time I booted the rt kernel and did: sudo ./nvidia-installer -a -K --kernel-name=$(uname -r) >From the nvidia log I can see the module being successfully built, but not installed because: ERROR: A DKMS kernel module with version 310.44 is already installed. ERROR: Installation has failed. So, something is still wrong. It would seem my previous installation had installed a module in the rt kernel, but that module doesn't work with rt kernel 3.2.xx? thanks, cheers, -- Marco Donnarumma New Media + Sonic Arts Practitioner, Performer, Teacher, Director. Embodied Audio-Visual Interaction Research Team. Department of Computing, Goldsmiths University of London ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Portfolio: http://marcodonnarumma.com Research: http://res.marcodonnarumma.com Director: http://www.liveperformersmeeting.net -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From fons at linuxaudio.org Wed Sep 18 21:16:38 2013 From: fons at linuxaudio.org (Fons Adriaensen) Date: Wed, 18 Sep 2013 21:16:38 +0000 Subject: [LAU] Aeolus Message-ID: <20130918211638.GB26599@linuxaudio.org> Hello all, It has come to my attention that there are ATM at least two 'forks' of Aeolus. The first by the MuseScore team, the second by one Maurizio Gavioli. Neither of them even had the decency to let me know of their work, and both are taking Aeolus in a direction I do not approve of. Gavioli has even added his 'copyright' to the sources of the libraries that Aeolus depends on but which are not part of its source distribution. Apparently the intention is to release incompatible versions of those as well. If this is typical for the attitude taken by the Linux Audio community then my motivation to contribute to it will take a serious blow. As announced previously, there will be a fully reworked release of Aeolus next year (on the occasion of its 10th birthday). Apart from major improvements to the audio code it will be completely OSC controlled. None of this will be compatible with the forks of course, they'll find themselves instantly obsolete. And I will make sure that this sort of thing won't happen again, even if that means a more restrictive license. Ciao, -- FA A world of exhaustive, reliable metadata would be an utopia. It's also a pipe-dream, founded on self-delusion, nerd hubris and hysterically inflated market opportunities. (Cory Doctorow) From malnourite at gmail.com Wed Sep 18 21:29:02 2013 From: malnourite at gmail.com (J. Liles) Date: Wed, 18 Sep 2013 14:29:02 -0700 Subject: [LAU] [LAD] Aeolus In-Reply-To: <20130918211638.GB26599@linuxaudio.org> References: <20130918211638.GB26599@linuxaudio.org> Message-ID: On Wed, Sep 18, 2013 at 2:16 PM, Fons Adriaensen wrote: > Hello all, > > It has come to my attention that there are ATM at least two > 'forks' of Aeolus. The first by the MuseScore team, the second > by one Maurizio Gavioli. > > Neither of them even had the decency to let me know of their > work, and both are taking Aeolus in a direction I do not > approve of. Gavioli has even added his 'copyright' to the > sources of the libraries that Aeolus depends on but which > are not part of its source distribution. Apparently the > intention is to release incompatible versions of those as > well. > > If this is typical for the attitude taken by the Linux Audio > community then my motivation to contribute to it will take > a serious blow. > > As announced previously, there will be a fully reworked > release of Aeolus next year (on the occasion of its 10th > birthday). Apart from major improvements to the audio code > it will be completely OSC controlled. None of this will be > compatible with the forks of course, they'll find themselves > instantly obsolete. And I will make sure that this sort of > thing won't happen again, even if that means a more restrictive > license. > > Ciao, > > Respectfully, you granted people the right to fork your code in the first place. Now you say you might take this right away, but why? How has it harmed you or anyone else? Why should you have been notified that a fork took place? The whole point of free software is that people can adapt it to their needs and share their changes with those with similar needs. If those forks are better suited to the task at hand than your original code, then people may well use them (and that's a good thing!). If your new release is better, people may well use that. Isn't that the point? To help people? Plus, if the forks did/do make any improvements that you value, hey, that's great merge them, not that I think you'd ever do that ;-) We can't all be all things to everybody all the time. The value of your projects isn't necessarily in the complete package with your name on it. If someone takes your engine and slaps a new interface on it that people like better, well, they still use your engine, right? It's hard to put your ego aside sometimes, but I really recommend that you do. You've contributed a lot to Linux Audio and I'd hate to see that ruined by bruised egos and non-free licenses. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From zettberlin at linuxuse.de Wed Sep 18 21:54:57 2013 From: zettberlin at linuxuse.de (Hartmut Noack) Date: Wed, 18 Sep 2013 23:54:57 +0200 Subject: [LAU] [LAD] Aeolus In-Reply-To: References: <20130918211638.GB26599@linuxaudio.org> Message-ID: <523A2131.1040004@linuxuse.de> Am 18.09.2013 23:29, schrieb J. Liles: > On Wed, Sep 18, 2013 at 2:16 PM, Fons Adriaensen wrote: > >> Hello all, >> >> It has come to my attention that there are ATM at least two >> 'forks' of Aeolus. The first by the MuseScore team, the second >> by one Maurizio Gavioli. >> >> Neither of them even had the decency to let me know of their >> work, and both are taking Aeolus in a direction I do not >> approve of. [...] >> Ciao, >> >> > Respectfully, you granted people the right to fork your code in the first > place. I also see it that way but I also understand Fons. To fork without telling the author is allowed by license but anyway: it is also allowed by law to step into a room without answering, if someone says "good morning". License is one thing, manners are another and both should be observed. > Plus, if the forks did/do make any improvements that you value Looks like they do not ;-) @Fons: if you do not like the way in that your software is forked, maybe ask them to use a different name? just my 2c HZN > > > _______________________________________________ > Linux-audio-user mailing list > Linux-audio-user at lists.linuxaudio.org > http://lists.linuxaudio.org/listinfo/linux-audio-user > From julien at mail.upb.de Wed Sep 18 22:01:30 2013 From: julien at mail.upb.de (Julien Claassen) Date: Thu, 19 Sep 2013 00:01:30 +0200 (CEST) Subject: [LAU] Aeolus In-Reply-To: <20130918211638.GB26599@linuxaudio.org> References: <20130918211638.GB26599@linuxaudio.org> Message-ID: Hello Fons! As a user of Aeolus, you should know, that I've always appreciated it and I know of at least two other friends not on any list, who also love it. But you have been around along time now. As you said, it's Aeolus' 10th birthday next year. So you should know, that the community usually treats source code kindly, except the occasional flames about quality and technical approaches to problems. Where would we be without that? :-) I can understand, that you're vexed. I only hope, that this won't lead to a lot of people not sharing the potential of your software and other software and the potential of their performing music. Warmly yours Julien ---------------------------------------- http://juliencoder.de/nama/music.html From hanaghan.osaudio at gmail.com Wed Sep 18 22:10:24 2013 From: hanaghan.osaudio at gmail.com (Russell Hanaghan) Date: Wed, 18 Sep 2013 15:10:24 -0700 Subject: [LAU] Er, sorry folks! Message-ID: <49B2DD6F-36B6-4EE0-A6F5-11E210CA8F6B@gmail.com> Still alive obviously and still using Linux audio exclusively for all studio stuff. And because I just should, I'll make sure the GF has my correct email for personal biz! lol could be relevant... I have recorded her singing some way cool stuff on Linux too! Currently, Mixbus AND Ardour 3 atop KxStudio an AV Linux! My what a way we've come! ~ Russell From guido.aulisi at gmail.com Wed Sep 18 22:13:07 2013 From: guido.aulisi at gmail.com (Guido Aulisi) Date: Thu, 19 Sep 2013 00:13:07 +0200 Subject: [LAU] Aeolus In-Reply-To: <20130918211638.GB26599@linuxaudio.org> References: <20130918211638.GB26599@linuxaudio.org> Message-ID: <1379542387.3094.18.camel@yoda.heavyware> Fons Adriaensen said: > And I will make sure that this sort of > thing won't happen again, even if that means a more restrictive > license. > > Ciao, > That would be a pity. I think your great work is well known in the linux audio community and this thing shouldn't make you change the license of your software. I also think that if someone wants to fork a project to make such big changes, he should at least tell the original author and change the name of the forked software (like mysql and mariadb). I hope you can continue your great work in the audio thing! Ciao, Guido From zotz at 100jamz.com Wed Sep 18 22:25:13 2013 From: zotz at 100jamz.com (drew Roberts) Date: Wed, 18 Sep 2013 18:25:13 -0400 Subject: [LAU] Aeolus In-Reply-To: <20130918211638.GB26599@linuxaudio.org> References: <20130918211638.GB26599@linuxaudio.org> Message-ID: <201309181825.13580.zotz@100jamz.com> On Wednesday 18 September 2013 17:16:38 Fons Adriaensen wrote: > Hello all, > > It has come to my attention that there are ATM at least two > 'forks' of Aeolus. The first by the MuseScore team, the second > by one Maurizio Gavioli. Fine so far. I would be happy if people were to fork some of my inconsequential stuff. > > Neither of them even had the decency to let me know of their > work, Not a big problem. If this were to occur with some of my stuff in isolation, I might think it a not wise move on t heir part but I don't think I would be too miffed. > and both are taking Aeolus in a direction I do not > approve of. Fine, but that is part of the whole Freedom game. People can take my song lyrics and re-write them to convey a message that goes directly against what I belive in. That is what free people can do. I don't want the level of control over others that would allow me to prevent this. I would be happy if I could figure how to make such insightful arguments that people would not but that is a whole different ball game. > Gavioli has even added his 'copyright' to the > sources of the libraries that Aeolus depends on but which > are not part of its source distribution. Apparently the > intention is to release incompatible versions of those as > well. Here, you are being unclear and if it means one of the things I think it could, Ican see you properly having a very big issue with this. You say he has *even* added his 'copyright' to the sources of the libraries that Aeolus depends on. Does this mean he has also added his 'copyright' to Aeolus? And when you say *added* his 'copyright', do you mean added his copyright to the existing copyright notice or do you mean replaced the copyright notice with one indicating he is the copyright holder for the complete work? If copyright notices are getting replaced rather than updated with correct additions, this is a serious issue. > > If this is typical for the attitude taken by the Linux Audio > community then my motivation to contribute to it will take > a serious blow. I hope this issue gets sorted out to you satisfaction one way or another. I would hate to see your efforts removed from the Free Software and linmux audio realm. > > As announced previously, there will be a fully reworked > release of Aeolus next year (on the occasion of its 10th > birthday). Apart from major improvements to the audio code > it will be completely OSC controlled. None of this will be > compatible with the forks of course, they'll find themselves > instantly obsolete. And I will make sure that this sort of > thing won't happen again, even if that means a more restrictive > license. > > Ciao, all the best, drew From fons at linuxaudio.org Wed Sep 18 22:28:41 2013 From: fons at linuxaudio.org (Fons Adriaensen) Date: Wed, 18 Sep 2013 22:28:41 +0000 Subject: [LAU] [LAD] Aeolus In-Reply-To: References: <20130918211638.GB26599@linuxaudio.org> Message-ID: <20130918222841.GD26599@linuxaudio.org> On Wed, Sep 18, 2013 at 02:29:02PM -0700, J. Liles wrote: > Respectfully, you granted people the right to fork your code in the first > place. Yes, and now I know that was a mistake. Ciao, -- FA A world of exhaustive, reliable metadata would be an utopia. It's also a pipe-dream, founded on self-delusion, nerd hubris and hysterically inflated market opportunities. (Cory Doctorow) From email.rafa at gmail.com Wed Sep 18 22:40:25 2013 From: email.rafa at gmail.com (Rafael Vega) Date: Wed, 18 Sep 2013 17:40:25 -0500 Subject: [LAU] [LAD] Aeolus In-Reply-To: <20130918222841.GD26599@linuxaudio.org> References: <20130918211638.GB26599@linuxaudio.org> <20130918222841.GD26599@linuxaudio.org> Message-ID: Very respectfully, Fons. May I ask, why do you think it was a bad idea? Isn't this one of the good things about free software? The ability for people to fork and do different things with your code? If you don't like what they're doing, keep working on your original forks. Knowing the quality of your work and your reputation, this should not pose a problem to you. Where is it that you see this as a problem? Regards, Rafael Vega. On Wed, Sep 18, 2013 at 5:28 PM, Fons Adriaensen wrote: > On Wed, Sep 18, 2013 at 02:29:02PM -0700, J. Liles wrote: > > > Respectfully, you granted people the right to fork your code in the first > > place. > > Yes, and now I know that was a mistake. > > Ciao, > > -- > FA > > A world of exhaustive, reliable metadata would be an utopia. > It's also a pipe-dream, founded on self-delusion, nerd hubris > and hysterically inflated market opportunities. (Cory Doctorow) > > _______________________________________________ > Linux-audio-user mailing list > Linux-audio-user at lists.linuxaudio.org > http://lists.linuxaudio.org/listinfo/linux-audio-user > -- Rafael Vega email.rafa at gmail.com -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From lau at kudla.org Wed Sep 18 23:44:58 2013 From: lau at kudla.org (Rob Kudla) Date: Wed, 18 Sep 2013 19:44:58 -0400 Subject: [LAU] Aeolus In-Reply-To: <20130918211638.GB26599@linuxaudio.org> References: <20130918211638.GB26599@linuxaudio.org> Message-ID: <523A3AFA.4000701@kudla.org> On 2013-09-18 17:16, Fons Adriaensen wrote: > Neither of them even had the decency to let me know of their work, and > both are taking Aeolus in a direction I do not approve of. Gavioli has > even added his 'copyright' to the sources of the libraries that Aeolus > depends on but which are not part of its source distribution. Apparently > the intention is to release incompatible versions of those as well. If he's made changes to the libraries, he does own the copyright on his changes -- but only his changes. Diff yours and his, and that's his work. That doesn't affect your trunk, though, just his branch. And of course, if he removed your copyright details, or they weren't in every file to begin with, he's violated your license and therefore is infringing your copyright. (I can't seem to find his code, so I have no idea.) What he doesn't own is the "Aeolus" name, and I'd think a nice email would straighten that out right quick. (I'm surprised you never sent one to Red Hat over their recently discontinued Aeolus Project.) But being able to fork is one of the huge strengths of the free software model, as well as a weakness when people don't follow basic etiquette like naming the fork something else. There may still be issues (c.f. the ffmpeg vs. avconv hissyfit where the Debian maintainer preferred avconv and included a program still called "ffmpeg" in the package, which prints a "this program is deprecated, use avconv instead" message every time you run it, there is no proper ffmpeg available except through PPAs, and its command line options are just different enough to make ffmpeg wrappers puke) but when you cut to the chase, people being able to make their own versions of other people's software is the entire point of free software. And if they do something you like, you can use it too. It's not a bug, it's a feature. Surely you see the value of, say, Yoshimi, which began as a fork of zynaddsubfx? (I certainly do, not least because I'll never again have to see religious propaganda in the readme.) If he altered or removed your copyright notice, though, that's not part of the free software model, that's simply copyright infringement. > And I will make sure that this sort of thing won't happen again, even if > that means a more restrictive license. Well, that's your right, of course, but ask the OSS guys how well that worked out for them. If you change your license to a non-free one, one of the forks might very well replace Aeolus in, for example, Debian and its derivatives. I guess you could go proprietary, but then you're competing with free and your name is not Apple. As things stand, the version of Aeolus available to me as an Ubuntu user is yours, not one of the forks as far as I can tell. I suspect the same is true of other Linux audio friendly distributions. Free software is (normally) a meritocracy. What would make a distro pick theirs over yours? What direction are these other guys taking their forks in that bothers you, anyway? I mean, it seems to me that they're probably making a built-in instrument for use in their own software (like LMMS' embedded version of Zyn), not a viable competitor. If their code is sloppy or buggy or limited to one use case, no one's going to pay them much attention regardless. I'd have never known they existed if you hadn't mentioned them, and as I said above, I can't find their code. This may even all be a misunderstanding, as I found a bug report on the Musescore bug tracker from a year ago in which someone posted a link to your old skynet.be page with Aeolus 0.6.6 as the latest version, which made me think you'd let it languish till I thought to type "dpkg -l aeolus". If what they're doing is a fork of 0.6.6, I'd say that's the most likely situation, which would also explain why they didn't reach out to you -- especially if you don't get mail on your skynet.be email address anymore. Rob From brummer- at web.de Thu Sep 19 03:31:35 2013 From: brummer- at web.de (hermann meyer) Date: Thu, 19 Sep 2013 05:31:35 +0200 Subject: [LAU] [LAD] Aeolus In-Reply-To: <20130918222841.GD26599@linuxaudio.org> References: <20130918211638.GB26599@linuxaudio.org> <20130918222841.GD26599@linuxaudio.org> Message-ID: <523A7017.1040004@web.de> Am 19.09.2013 00:28, schrieb Fons Adriaensen: > On Wed, Sep 18, 2013 at 02:29:02PM -0700, J. Liles wrote: > >> Respectfully, you granted people the right to fork your code in the first >> place. > Yes, and now I know that was a mistake. > > Ciao, > I'm sad to hear that. :-( Please don't let you lead from the things you didn't like, let you lead from the things you like instead. I guess then it's necessary to let you know that we use /as well/ a fork of your work, the zita-convolver library, in the guitarix project. But we leave your copyright untouched, and the fork will only come in use, when the user set a explicit compile flag. We didn't promote it, or force the fork. Ordinary your original code is in use. We do it to use ffmpeg instead fftw3 FFT, which perform better on ARM devices. We do our best to let all users know that it is your work, which comes in use for the convolution. I really hope you re-think your stance and keep going with the GPL to enable Forks of your work, instead force us to re-invent the wheel. greets hermann From pshirkey at boosthardware.com Thu Sep 19 07:54:46 2013 From: pshirkey at boosthardware.com (Patrick Shirkey) Date: Thu, 19 Sep 2013 17:54:46 +1000 (EST) Subject: [LAU] Aeolus In-Reply-To: <523A3AFA.4000701@kudla.org> References: <20130918211638.GB26599@linuxaudio.org> <523A3AFA.4000701@kudla.org> Message-ID: <38306.86.127.135.98.1379577286.squirrel@boosthardware.com> > On 2013-09-18 17:16, Fons Adriaensen wrote: > Neither of them even had the decency to let me know of their work, and > both are taking Aeolus in a direction I do not approve of. Gavioli has > even added his 'copyright' to the sources of the libraries that Aeolus > depends on but which are not part of its source distribution. Apparently > the intention is to release incompatible versions of those as well. > Sounds like he is Italian. Why not organise to drop by and discuss the issues with him in person? At least give him a call and see if you can come to a mutual agreement about the functionality he is building and the direction he has chosen? -- Patrick Shirkey Boost Hardware Ltd From erik at zasran.com Thu Sep 19 08:34:41 2013 From: erik at zasran.com (Erik Steffl) Date: Thu, 19 Sep 2013 01:34:41 -0700 Subject: [LAU] Jack does not see USB sound card Boss Micro BR-80 Message-ID: <523AB721.3080501@zasran.com> trying to use Boss Micro BR-80 as USB soundcard with Jack but seems like jack (qjackctl) does not recognize it. My system: Ubuntu 13.04 with pretty much standard configuration (runs pulseaudio, installed jackd2, pulseaudio-module-jack, qjackctl) Have built in audio that I don't really plan to use with jack (or at least not in initial setup where I am just trying to make something work): 00:01.1 Audio device: Advanced Micro Devices [AMD] nee ATI Wrestler HDMI Audio [Radeon HD 6250/6310] 00:14.2 Audio device: Advanced Micro Devices [AMD] nee ATI SBx00 Azalia (Intel HDA) (rev 40) Boss Micro BR-80 seems to be recognized properly (see below) but qjackctl does not list it in Set under any of Interface, Input Device, Output Device choices, I only see /dev/dsp, /dev/audio, plughw:0 and hw:0. Any ideas why it does not work or how to troubleshoot it further? When I plug BR-80 in I get (output of usb-devices): T: Bus=08 Lev=01 Prnt=01 Port=01 Cnt=02 Dev#= 3 Spd=480 MxCh= 0 D: Ver= 2.00 Cls=ff(vend.) Sub=00 Prot=ff MxPS=64 #Cfgs= 1 P: Vendor=0582 ProdID=0130 Rev=00.00 S: Manufacturer=Roland S: Product=BR-80(AUDIO) C: #Ifs= 4 Cfg#= 1 Atr=80 MxPwr=400mA I: If#= 0 Alt= 0 #EPs= 0 Cls=ff(vend.) Sub=ff Prot=00 Driver=snd-usb-audio I: If#= 1 Alt= 0 #EPs= 0 Cls=ff(vend.) Sub=02 Prot=02 Driver=snd-usb-audio I: If#= 2 Alt= 0 #EPs= 0 Cls=ff(vend.) Sub=02 Prot=01 Driver=snd-usb-audio I: If#= 3 Alt= 1 #EPs= 2 Cls=ff(vend.) Sub=03 Prot=00 Driver=snd-usb-audio aplay seems to recognize it. aplay -l **** List of PLAYBACK Hardware Devices **** card 0: Generic [HD-Audio Generic], device 3: HDMI 0 [HDMI 0] Subdevices: 1/1 Subdevice #0: subdevice #0 card 1: SB [HDA ATI SB], device 0: ALC892 Analog [ALC892 Analog] Subdevices: 1/1 Subdevice #0: subdevice #0 card 1: SB [HDA ATI SB], device 1: ALC892 Digital [ALC892 Digital] Subdevices: 1/1 Subdevice #0: subdevice #0 card 2: BR80AUDIO [BR-80(AUDIO)], device 0: USB Audio [USB Audio] Subdevices: 1/1 Subdevice #0: subdevice #0 aplay -L default Playback/recording through the PulseAudio sound server hdmi:CARD=Generic,DEV=0 HD-Audio Generic, HDMI 0 HDMI Audio Output dmix:CARD=Generic,DEV=3 HD-Audio Generic, HDMI 0 Direct sample mixing device dsnoop:CARD=Generic,DEV=3 HD-Audio Generic, HDMI 0 Direct sample snooping device hw:CARD=Generic,DEV=3 HD-Audio Generic, HDMI 0 Direct hardware device without any conversions plughw:CARD=Generic,DEV=3 HD-Audio Generic, HDMI 0 Hardware device with all software conversions sysdefault:CARD=SB HDA ATI SB, ALC892 Analog Default Audio Device front:CARD=SB,DEV=0 HDA ATI SB, ALC892 Analog Front speakers surround40:CARD=SB,DEV=0 HDA ATI SB, ALC892 Analog 4.0 Surround output to Front and Rear speakers surround41:CARD=SB,DEV=0 HDA ATI SB, ALC892 Analog 4.1 Surround output to Front, Rear and Subwoofer speakers surround50:CARD=SB,DEV=0 HDA ATI SB, ALC892 Analog 5.0 Surround output to Front, Center and Rear speakers surround51:CARD=SB,DEV=0 HDA ATI SB, ALC892 Analog 5.1 Surround output to Front, Center, Rear and Subwoofer speakers surround71:CARD=SB,DEV=0 HDA ATI SB, ALC892 Analog 7.1 Surround output to Front, Center, Side, Rear and Woofer speakers iec958:CARD=SB,DEV=0 HDA ATI SB, ALC892 Digital IEC958 (S/PDIF) Digital Audio Output dmix:CARD=SB,DEV=0 HDA ATI SB, ALC892 Analog Direct sample mixing device dmix:CARD=SB,DEV=1 HDA ATI SB, ALC892 Digital Direct sample mixing device dsnoop:CARD=SB,DEV=0 HDA ATI SB, ALC892 Analog Direct sample snooping device dsnoop:CARD=SB,DEV=1 HDA ATI SB, ALC892 Digital Direct sample snooping device hw:CARD=SB,DEV=0 HDA ATI SB, ALC892 Analog Direct hardware device without any conversions hw:CARD=SB,DEV=1 HDA ATI SB, ALC892 Digital Direct hardware device without any conversions plughw:CARD=SB,DEV=0 HDA ATI SB, ALC892 Analog Hardware device with all software conversions plughw:CARD=SB,DEV=1 HDA ATI SB, ALC892 Digital Hardware device with all software conversions sysdefault:CARD=BR80AUDIO BR-80(AUDIO), USB Audio Default Audio Device front:CARD=BR80AUDIO,DEV=0 BR-80(AUDIO), USB Audio Front speakers surround40:CARD=BR80AUDIO,DEV=0 BR-80(AUDIO), USB Audio 4.0 Surround output to Front and Rear speakers surround41:CARD=BR80AUDIO,DEV=0 BR-80(AUDIO), USB Audio 4.1 Surround output to Front, Rear and Subwoofer speakers surround50:CARD=BR80AUDIO,DEV=0 BR-80(AUDIO), USB Audio 5.0 Surround output to Front, Center and Rear speakers surround51:CARD=BR80AUDIO,DEV=0 BR-80(AUDIO), USB Audio 5.1 Surround output to Front, Center, Rear and Subwoofer speakers surround71:CARD=BR80AUDIO,DEV=0 BR-80(AUDIO), USB Audio 7.1 Surround output to Front, Center, Side, Rear and Woofer speakers iec958:CARD=BR80AUDIO,DEV=0 BR-80(AUDIO), USB Audio IEC958 (S/PDIF) Digital Audio Output dmix:CARD=BR80AUDIO,DEV=0 BR-80(AUDIO), USB Audio Direct sample mixing device dsnoop:CARD=BR80AUDIO,DEV=0 BR-80(AUDIO), USB Audio Direct sample snooping device hw:CARD=BR80AUDIO,DEV=0 BR-80(AUDIO), USB Audio Direct hardware device without any conversions plughw:CARD=BR80AUDIO,DEV=0 BR-80(AUDIO), USB Audio Hardware device with all software conversions thanks! erik From pshirkey at boosthardware.com Thu Sep 19 08:46:11 2013 From: pshirkey at boosthardware.com (Patrick Shirkey) Date: Thu, 19 Sep 2013 18:46:11 +1000 (EST) Subject: [LAU] Testing JACK and PA latency In-Reply-To: <36869.86.127.135.98.1379572479.squirrel@boosthardware.com> References: <48937.86.127.135.98.1379486981.squirrel@boosthardware.com> <52796.86.127.135.98.1379501724.squirrel@boosthardware.com> <57026.86.127.135.98.1379518182.squirrel@boosthardware.com> <36869.86.127.135.98.1379572479.squirrel@boosthardware.com> Message-ID: <39035.86.127.135.98.1379580371.squirrel@boosthardware.com> Moving this thread to LAU as it seems to be a more generic issue now: I am testing the round trip latency when using PA and JACK together. I have the following connection graph: jack_system (in) -> pa_source (in) -> audacity (in) -> audacity (out) -> pa sink (out) -> jack_system (out) Audacity is run in pass through mode with internal latency set to 0. I would like to measure the round trip latency from jack_system (in) to jack_system (out) This is a slightly unusual request but it is actually a reasonably important measurement in the bigger scheme of things. Does anyone have any suggestions? Ideally I would like to get accurate measurements for both input and output latency. input: jack_system (in) -> pa_source (in) -> audacity (in) output: audacity (out) -> pa sink (out) -> jack_system (out) So a tool that allowed me to measure the latency between every node on the graph would be perfect. Obviously made alot harder by mixing PA and JACK together. I have tried jack_iodelay but it does not measure the input signal from the mic instead it provides it's own signal. I suppose I could modify jack_iodelay to accept an input signal as the starting point for the latency graph but I have not looked into the code yet to see how tricky that would be. -- Patrick Shirkey Boost Hardware Ltd From zettberlin at linuxuse.de Thu Sep 19 09:19:53 2013 From: zettberlin at linuxuse.de (Hartmut Noack) Date: Thu, 19 Sep 2013 11:19:53 +0200 Subject: [LAU] Testing JACK and PA latency In-Reply-To: <39035.86.127.135.98.1379580371.squirrel@boosthardware.com> References: <48937.86.127.135.98.1379486981.squirrel@boosthardware.com> <52796.86.127.135.98.1379501724.squirrel@boosthardware.com> <57026.86.127.135.98.1379518182.squirrel@boosthardware.com> <36869.86.127.135.98.1379572479.squirrel@boosthardware.com> <39035.86.127.135.98.1379580371.squirrel@boosthardware.com> Message-ID: <523AC1B9.8010102@linuxuse.de> Am 19.09.2013 10:46, schrieb Patrick Shirkey: > Moving this thread to LAU as it seems to be a more generic issue now: > > I am testing the round trip latency when using PA and JACK together. I > have the following connection graph: > > jack_system (in) -> pa_source (in) -> audacity (in) -> audacity (out) -> > pa sink (out) -> jack_system (out) > Unless your research is completely academic I do not see a practical use for its results on the user-side. For Audacity latency is not a big issue. It does not build for realtime-application rather for offline editing, audio-restauration etc, in that field a latency of 100ms is still OK.... > Audacity is run in pass through mode with internal latency set to 0. > > I would like to measure the round trip latency from jack_system (in) to > jack_system (out) > > This is a slightly unusual request but it is actually a reasonably > important measurement in the bigger scheme of things. > > Does anyone have any suggestions? > > Ideally I would like to get accurate measurements for both input and > output latency. > > input: > jack_system (in) -> pa_source (in) -> audacity (in) > > output: > audacity (out) -> pa sink (out) -> jack_system (out) > > So a tool that allowed me to measure the latency between every node on the > graph would be perfect. > > Obviously made alot harder by mixing PA and JACK together. I have tried > jack_iodelay but it does not measure the input signal from the mic instead > it provides it's own signal. > > I suppose I could modify jack_iodelay to accept an input signal as the > starting point for the latency graph but I have not looked into the code > yet to see how tricky that would be. > > > > -- > Patrick Shirkey > Boost Hardware Ltd > _______________________________________________ > Linux-audio-user mailing list > Linux-audio-user at lists.linuxaudio.org > http://lists.linuxaudio.org/listinfo/linux-audio-user > > From pshirkey at boosthardware.com Thu Sep 19 09:39:00 2013 From: pshirkey at boosthardware.com (Patrick Shirkey) Date: Thu, 19 Sep 2013 19:39:00 +1000 (EST) Subject: [LAU] Testing JACK and PA latency In-Reply-To: <523AC1B9.8010102@linuxuse.de> References: <48937.86.127.135.98.1379486981.squirrel@boosthardware.com> <52796.86.127.135.98.1379501724.squirrel@boosthardware.com> <57026.86.127.135.98.1379518182.squirrel@boosthardware.com> <36869.86.127.135.98.1379572479.squirrel@boosthardware.com> <39035.86.127.135.98.1379580371.squirrel@boosthardware.com> <523AC1B9.8010102@linuxuse.de> Message-ID: <39579.86.127.135.98.1379583540.squirrel@boosthardware.com> On Thu, September 19, 2013 7:19 pm, Hartmut Noack wrote: > Am 19.09.2013 10:46, schrieb Patrick Shirkey: >> Moving this thread to LAU as it seems to be a more generic issue now: >> >> I am testing the round trip latency when using PA and JACK together. I >> have the following connection graph: >> >> jack_system (in) -> pa_source (in) -> audacity (in) -> audacity (out) -> >> pa sink (out) -> jack_system (out) >> > > Unless your research is completely academic I do not see a practical use > for its results on the user-side. This is entirely professionally motivated and will also have major benefits to academia too. I'm seeking suggestion on how to go about it not arguments for why or if this is a useful thing to do... ;-) > For Audacity latency is not a big > issue. You can replace audacity with *any* application that can provide (near) 0 internal latency and full duplex pass through. > It does not build for realtime-application rather for offline > editing, audio-restauration etc, in that field a latency of 100ms is > still OK.... > In this case I have a hard limit of 20ms round trip latency from mic in to speaker out and I would like to test the combination of JACK and PA to determine where or if there are bottlenecks in the signal flow. > >> Audacity is run in pass through mode with internal latency set to 0. >> >> I would like to measure the round trip latency from jack_system (in) to >> jack_system (out) >> >> This is a slightly unusual request but it is actually a reasonably >> important measurement in the bigger scheme of things. >> >> Does anyone have any suggestions? >> >> Ideally I would like to get accurate measurements for both input and >> output latency. >> >> input: >> jack_system (in) -> pa_source (in) -> audacity (in) >> >> output: >> audacity (out) -> pa sink (out) -> jack_system (out) >> >> So a tool that allowed me to measure the latency between every node on >> the >> graph would be perfect. >> >> Obviously made alot harder by mixing PA and JACK together. I have tried >> jack_iodelay but it does not measure the input signal from the mic >> instead >> it provides it's own signal. >> >> I suppose I could modify jack_iodelay to accept an input signal as the >> starting point for the latency graph but I have not looked into the code >> yet to see how tricky that would be. >> >> >> >> -- >> Patrick Shirkey >> Boost Hardware Ltd >> _______________________________________________ >> Linux-audio-user mailing list >> Linux-audio-user at lists.linuxaudio.org >> http://lists.linuxaudio.org/listinfo/linux-audio-user >> >> > > _______________________________________________ > Linux-audio-user mailing list > Linux-audio-user at lists.linuxaudio.org > http://lists.linuxaudio.org/listinfo/linux-audio-user > -- Patrick Shirkey Boost Hardware Ltd From fons at linuxaudio.org Thu Sep 19 09:42:10 2013 From: fons at linuxaudio.org (Fons Adriaensen) Date: Thu, 19 Sep 2013 09:42:10 +0000 Subject: [LAU] Testing JACK and PA latency In-Reply-To: <39035.86.127.135.98.1379580371.squirrel@boosthardware.com> References: <48937.86.127.135.98.1379486981.squirrel@boosthardware.com> <52796.86.127.135.98.1379501724.squirrel@boosthardware.com> <57026.86.127.135.98.1379518182.squirrel@boosthardware.com> <36869.86.127.135.98.1379572479.squirrel@boosthardware.com> <39035.86.127.135.98.1379580371.squirrel@boosthardware.com> Message-ID: <20130919094210.GA9491@linuxaudio.org> On Thu, Sep 19, 2013 at 06:46:11PM +1000, Patrick Shirkey wrote: > jack_system (in) -> pa_source (in) -> audacity (in) -> audacity (out) -> > pa sink (out) -> jack_system (out) > > Audacity is run in pass through mode with internal latency set to 0. > > I would like to measure the round trip latency from jack_system (in) to > jack_system (out) Easy using jack_delay. 1. Measure the round-trip latency of your sound card (with an external analog loop). 2. Measure jack_delay -> pa_source -> audacity -> pa_sink -> jack_delay. 3. If pa_source and pa_sink are a single Jack client (probably not), subtract one period from the result of (2). 4. Add the two values. Ciao, -- FA A world of exhaustive, reliable metadata would be an utopia. It's also a pipe-dream, founded on self-delusion, nerd hubris and hysterically inflated market opportunities. (Cory Doctorow) From clemens at ladisch.de Thu Sep 19 09:46:27 2013 From: clemens at ladisch.de (Clemens Ladisch) Date: Thu, 19 Sep 2013 11:46:27 +0200 Subject: [LAU] Jack does not see USB sound card Boss Micro BR-80 In-Reply-To: <523AB721.3080501@zasran.com> References: <523AB721.3080501@zasran.com> Message-ID: <523AC7F3.1090401@ladisch.de> Erik Steffl wrote: > aplay -l > card 2: BR80AUDIO [BR-80(AUDIO)], device 0: USB Audio [USB Audio] > Boss Micro BR-80 seems to be recognized properly but qjackctl does not > list it in Set under any of Interface, Input Device, Output Device > choices, I only see /dev/dsp, /dev/audio, plughw:0 and hw:0. "hw:2" should appear in those lists. Did you start QjackCtl before plugging the device in? Can you start Jack manually with "jackd -d alsa -d hw:2"? Regards, Clemens From pshirkey at boosthardware.com Thu Sep 19 10:04:04 2013 From: pshirkey at boosthardware.com (Patrick Shirkey) Date: Thu, 19 Sep 2013 20:04:04 +1000 (EST) Subject: [LAU] Testing JACK and PA latency In-Reply-To: <20130919094210.GA9491@linuxaudio.org> References: <48937.86.127.135.98.1379486981.squirrel@boosthardware.com> <52796.86.127.135.98.1379501724.squirrel@boosthardware.com> <57026.86.127.135.98.1379518182.squirrel@boosthardware.com> <36869.86.127.135.98.1379572479.squirrel@boosthardware.com> <39035.86.127.135.98.1379580371.squirrel@boosthardware.com> <20130919094210.GA9491@linuxaudio.org> Message-ID: <39846.86.127.135.98.1379585044.squirrel@boosthardware.com> On Thu, September 19, 2013 7:42 pm, Fons Adriaensen wrote: > On Thu, Sep 19, 2013 at 06:46:11PM +1000, Patrick Shirkey wrote: > >> jack_system (in) -> pa_source (in) -> audacity (in) -> audacity (out) -> >> pa sink (out) -> jack_system (out) >> >> Audacity is run in pass through mode with internal latency set to 0. >> >> I would like to measure the round trip latency from jack_system (in) to >> jack_system (out) > > Easy using jack_delay. > > 1. Measure the round-trip latency of your sound card (with an > external analog loop). > Can I use jack_delay running on a second computer connected to the external i/o of the first computer to get this value? > 2. Measure > > jack_delay -> pa_source -> audacity -> pa_sink -> jack_delay. > Does this look reasonable? 1023.978 frames 21.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 1023 frames use 511 for the backend arguments -I and -O 1023.976 frames 21.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 1023 frames use 511 for the backend arguments -I and -O 1023.977 frames 21.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 1023 frames use 511 for the backend arguments -I and -O > 3. If pa_source and pa_sink are a single Jack client (probably not), > subtract one period from the result of (2). > Can you explain that with the data above? > 4. Add the two values. > I would like to provide an app for this task. Do you think it would be worthwhile to extend jack_iodelay for this purpose? -- Patrick Shirkey Boost Hardware Ltd From pshirkey at boosthardware.com Thu Sep 19 10:26:27 2013 From: pshirkey at boosthardware.com (Patrick Shirkey) Date: Thu, 19 Sep 2013 20:26:27 +1000 (EST) Subject: [LAU] Testing JACK and PA latency In-Reply-To: <39846.86.127.135.98.1379585044.squirrel@boosthardware.com> References: <48937.86.127.135.98.1379486981.squirrel@boosthardware.com> <52796.86.127.135.98.1379501724.squirrel@boosthardware.com> <57026.86.127.135.98.1379518182.squirrel@boosthardware.com> <36869.86.127.135.98.1379572479.squirrel@boosthardware.com> <39035.86.127.135.98.1379580371.squirrel@boosthardware.com> <20130919094210.GA9491@linuxaudio.org> <39846.86.127.135.98.1379585044.squirrel@boosthardware.com> Message-ID: <40174.86.127.135.98.1379586387.squirrel@boosthardware.com> On Thu, September 19, 2013 8:04 pm, Patrick Shirkey wrote: > > On Thu, September 19, 2013 7:42 pm, Fons Adriaensen wrote: >> On Thu, Sep 19, 2013 at 06:46:11PM +1000, Patrick Shirkey wrote: >> >>> jack_system (in) -> pa_source (in) -> audacity (in) -> audacity (out) >>> -> >>> pa sink (out) -> jack_system (out) >>> >>> Audacity is run in pass through mode with internal latency set to 0. >>> >>> I would like to measure the round trip latency from jack_system (in) to >>> jack_system (out) >> >> Easy using jack_delay. >> >> 1. Measure the round-trip latency of your sound card (with an >> external analog loop). >> > > Can I use jack_delay running on a second computer connected to the > external i/o of the first computer to get this value? > > >> 2. Measure >> >> jack_delay -> pa_source -> audacity -> pa_sink -> jack_delay. >> > > > Does this look reasonable? > > 1023.978 frames 21.333 ms total roundtrip latency > extra loopback latency: 1023 frames > use 511 for the backend arguments -I and -O > 1023.976 frames 21.333 ms total roundtrip latency > extra loopback latency: 1023 frames > use 511 for the backend arguments -I and -O > 1023.977 frames 21.333 ms total roundtrip latency > extra loopback latency: 1023 frames > use 511 for the backend arguments -I and -O > If I use ecasound instead of audacity: ecasound -f:32,2,48000 -b:32 -i alsa -o alsa 8095.992 frames 168.667 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 8095 frames use 4047 for the backend arguments -I and -O 8095.992 frames 168.667 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 8095 frames use 4047 for the backend arguments -I and -O 8095.992 frames 168.667 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 8095 frames use 4047 for the backend arguments -I and -O 8095.994 frames 168.667 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 8095 frames use 4047 for the backend arguments -I and -O ecasound -f:32,2,48000 -b:64 -i alsa -o alsa 9280.000 frames 193.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 9280 frames use 4640 for the backend arguments -I and -O 9280.000 frames 193.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 9280 frames use 4640 for the backend arguments -I and -O 9279.999 frames 193.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 9279 frames use 4639 for the backend arguments -I and -O > > >> 3. If pa_source and pa_sink are a single Jack client (probably not), >> subtract one period from the result of (2). >> > > Can you explain that with the data above? > > >> 4. Add the two values. >> > > I would like to provide an app for this task. Do you think it would be > worthwhile to extend jack_iodelay for this purpose? > > -- Patrick Shirkey Boost Hardware Ltd From fons at linuxaudio.org Thu Sep 19 10:46:05 2013 From: fons at linuxaudio.org (Fons Adriaensen) Date: Thu, 19 Sep 2013 10:46:05 +0000 Subject: [LAU] Testing JACK and PA latency In-Reply-To: <39846.86.127.135.98.1379585044.squirrel@boosthardware.com> References: <48937.86.127.135.98.1379486981.squirrel@boosthardware.com> <52796.86.127.135.98.1379501724.squirrel@boosthardware.com> <57026.86.127.135.98.1379518182.squirrel@boosthardware.com> <36869.86.127.135.98.1379572479.squirrel@boosthardware.com> <39035.86.127.135.98.1379580371.squirrel@boosthardware.com> <20130919094210.GA9491@linuxaudio.org> <39846.86.127.135.98.1379585044.squirrel@boosthardware.com> Message-ID: <20130919104605.GC9491@linuxaudio.org> On Thu, Sep 19, 2013 at 08:04:04PM +1000, Patrick Shirkey wrote: > > 1. Measure the round-trip latency of your sound card (with an > > external analog loop). > > > > Can I use jack_delay running on a second computer connected to the > external i/o of the first computer to get this value? You'd measure something different... But you could use two computers as follows: A = computer with jack, PA, audacity B = second computer with sound card, jack and jack_delay. 1. Measure the round-trip latency on B, with an external analog loop. 2. Connect B -> A, A -> B, run complete chain on A. 3. Measure again on B, subtract the value from (1). > > jack_delay -> pa_source -> audacity -> pa_sink -> jack_delay. > > > > Does this look reasonable? > > 1023.978 frames 21.333 ms total roundtrip latency > extra loopback latency: 1023 frames > use 511 for the backend arguments -I and -O > 1023.976 frames 21.333 ms total roundtrip latency > extra loopback latency: 1023 frames > use 511 for the backend arguments -I and -O > 1023.977 frames 21.333 ms total roundtrip latency > extra loopback latency: 1023 frames > use 511 for the backend arguments -I and -O Don't know - I'm by no means a PA expert... and I don't know your Jack period size. Given PA's reputation I'd expect more: 1024 samples would mean that PA imposes almost the same RT- requirements on apps as Jack does, and it was designed *not* to do that... But maybe the jack <-> PA interface doesn't use the same amount of buffering that PA normally adds. Note that the value measured is modulo 2^16 samples, but I wouldn't expect anything more than a second, so this probably irrelevant. > > 3. If pa_source and pa_sink are a single Jack client (probably not), > > subtract one period from the result of (2). > > Can you explain that with the data above? If they are a single Jack client you create a loop in Jack's processing graph, this adds one period to the measurement. > > 4. Add the two values. > > > > I would like to provide an app for this task. Do you think it would be > worthwhile to extend jack_iodelay for this purpose? Don't see how. You need to do two measurements anyway, no matter how it's done, then add or substract. Ciao, -- FA A world of exhaustive, reliable metadata would be an utopia. It's also a pipe-dream, founded on self-delusion, nerd hubris and hysterically inflated market opportunities. (Cory Doctorow) From fons at linuxaudio.org Thu Sep 19 12:31:01 2013 From: fons at linuxaudio.org (Fons Adriaensen) Date: Thu, 19 Sep 2013 12:31:01 +0000 Subject: [LAU] Testing JACK and PA latency In-Reply-To: <20130919104605.GC9491@linuxaudio.org> References: <48937.86.127.135.98.1379486981.squirrel@boosthardware.com> <52796.86.127.135.98.1379501724.squirrel@boosthardware.com> <57026.86.127.135.98.1379518182.squirrel@boosthardware.com> <36869.86.127.135.98.1379572479.squirrel@boosthardware.com> <39035.86.127.135.98.1379580371.squirrel@boosthardware.com> <20130919094210.GA9491@linuxaudio.org> <39846.86.127.135.98.1379585044.squirrel@boosthardware.com> <20130919104605.GC9491@linuxaudio.org> Message-ID: <20130919123101.GA27421@linuxaudio.org> On Thu, Sep 19, 2013 at 10:46:05AM +0000, Fons Adriaensen wrote: > Don't see how. You need to do two measurements anyway, no matter > how it's done, then add or substract. Thinking again, you only need one measurement: jack_delay -> pa_source -> audacity -> pa_sink -> system:playback -> analog cable -> system_capture -> jack_delay Ciao, -- FA A world of exhaustive, reliable metadata would be an utopia. It's also a pipe-dream, founded on self-delusion, nerd hubris and hysterically inflated market opportunities. (Cory Doctorow) From pshirkey at boosthardware.com Thu Sep 19 12:32:22 2013 From: pshirkey at boosthardware.com (Patrick Shirkey) Date: Thu, 19 Sep 2013 22:32:22 +1000 (EST) Subject: [LAU] Testing JACK and PA latency Message-ID: <42276.86.127.135.98.1379593942.squirrel@boosthardware.com> Resending as the first one appears to have been blocked. On Thu, September 19, 2013 8:46 pm, Fons Adriaensen wrote: > On Thu, Sep 19, 2013 at 08:04:04PM +1000, Patrick Shirkey wrote: > >> > 1. Measure the round-trip latency of your sound card (with an external analog loop). >> > >> >> Can I use jack_delay running on a second computer connected to the external i/o of the first computer to get this value? > > You'd measure something different... > > But you could use two computers as follows: > > A = computer with jack, PA, audacity > B = second computer with sound card, jack and jack_delay. > > 1. Measure the round-trip latency on B, with an external > analog loop. > > 2. Connect B -> A, A -> B, run complete chain on A. > > 3. Measure again on B, subtract the value from (1). > >> > jack_delay -> pa_source -> audacity -> pa_sink -> jack_delay. >> > >> >> Does this look reasonable? >> >> 1023.978 frames 21.333 ms total roundtrip latency >> extra loopback latency: 1023 frames >> use 511 for the backend arguments -I and -O >> 1023.976 frames 21.333 ms total roundtrip latency >> extra loopback latency: 1023 frames >> use 511 for the backend arguments -I and -O >> 1023.977 frames 21.333 ms total roundtrip latency >> extra loopback latency: 1023 frames >> use 511 for the backend arguments -I and -O > > Don't know - I'm by no means a PA expert... and I don't know > your Jack period size. Given PA's reputation I'd expect more: > 1024 samples would mean that PA imposes almost the same RT- > requirements on apps as Jack does, and it was designed *not* > to do that... But maybe the jack <-> PA interface doesn't > use the same amount of buffering that PA normally adds. > > Note that the value measured is modulo 2^16 samples, but I > wouldn't expect anything more than a second, so this probably > irrelevant. > Here's a bit more detail for discussion before I send this over to the PA guys for feedback. I am seeing the time period returned by jack_delay regularly increase during the measurement process. Do you have any thoughts on why that would be happening? I would like to rule out jack_delay because this is most likely a bug in PA that I have come across now. I'm using this method: jack is now set to 64/48000/2 This is the graph: jack_delay -> pa_source -> audacity -> pa_sink -> jack_delay Using audacity with 0 internal latency and in pass through mode I see the following results. It starts out as 10.667ms and after a few seconds it climbs up to 70.667 ms. I see similar results with ecasound instead of audacity using the following graph and ecachain: jack_delay -> pa_source -> ecasound -> pa_sink -> jack_delay ecasound -f:32,2,48000 -b:64 -i alsa -o alsa In that case it starts at 60.000 ms and climbs upto 572.000 ms after a few seconds of running the test. Console logs here: http://boosthardware.com/pa-jack-latency.txt > >> > 3. If pa_source and pa_sink are a single Jack client (probably not), >> > subtract one period from the result of (2). >> >> Can you explain that with the data above? > > If they are a single Jack client you create a loop in Jack's > processing graph, this adds one period to the measurement. > > >> > 4. Add the two values. >> > >> >> I would like to provide an app for this task. Do you think it would be worthwhile to extend jack_iodelay for this purpose? > > Don't see how. You need to do two measurements anyway, no matter how it's done, then add or substract. > -- Patrick Shirkey Boost Hardware Ltd From pshirkey at boosthardware.com Thu Sep 19 12:35:10 2013 From: pshirkey at boosthardware.com (Patrick Shirkey) Date: Thu, 19 Sep 2013 22:35:10 +1000 (EST) Subject: [LAU] Testing JACK and PA latency In-Reply-To: <20130919123101.GA27421@linuxaudio.org> References: <48937.86.127.135.98.1379486981.squirrel@boosthardware.com> <52796.86.127.135.98.1379501724.squirrel@boosthardware.com> <57026.86.127.135.98.1379518182.squirrel@boosthardware.com> <36869.86.127.135.98.1379572479.squirrel@boosthardware.com> <39035.86.127.135.98.1379580371.squirrel@boosthardware.com> <20130919094210.GA9491@linuxaudio.org> <39846.86.127.135.98.1379585044.squirrel@boosthardware.com> <20130919104605.GC9491@linuxaudio.org> <20130919123101.GA27421@linuxaudio.org> Message-ID: <42289.86.127.135.98.1379594110.squirrel@boosthardware.com> On Thu, September 19, 2013 10:31 pm, Fons Adriaensen wrote: > On Thu, Sep 19, 2013 at 10:46:05AM +0000, Fons Adriaensen wrote: > >> Don't see how. You need to do two measurements anyway, no matter >> how it's done, then add or substract. > > Thinking again, you only need one measurement: > > jack_delay -> pa_source -> audacity -> pa_sink -> system:playback -> > analog cable -> system_capture -> jack_delay > Fons on da Remix!!! -- Patrick Shirkey Boost Hardware Ltd From fons at linuxaudio.org Thu Sep 19 12:48:33 2013 From: fons at linuxaudio.org (Fons Adriaensen) Date: Thu, 19 Sep 2013 12:48:33 +0000 Subject: [LAU] Aeolus In-Reply-To: <523A3AFA.4000701@kudla.org> References: <20130918211638.GB26599@linuxaudio.org> <523A3AFA.4000701@kudla.org> Message-ID: <20130919124833.GB27421@linuxaudio.org> On Wed, Sep 18, 2013 at 07:44:58PM -0400, Rob Kudla wrote: > This may even all be a misunderstanding, as I found a bug report on the > Musescore bug tracker from a year ago in which someone posted a link to > your old skynet.be page I don't buy that. I post at least once a week on LAU or LAD, everybody who reads those list knows my email address and where to find my website. If the musescore people or Gavioli don't know those, they are the ones out of touch with the community. As it appears, their main interest is Windows. Ciao, -- FA A world of exhaustive, reliable metadata would be an utopia. It's also a pipe-dream, founded on self-delusion, nerd hubris and hysterically inflated market opportunities. (Cory Doctorow) From fons at linuxaudio.org Thu Sep 19 12:56:53 2013 From: fons at linuxaudio.org (Fons Adriaensen) Date: Thu, 19 Sep 2013 12:56:53 +0000 Subject: [LAU] Testing JACK and PA latency In-Reply-To: <42276.86.127.135.98.1379593942.squirrel@boosthardware.com> References: <42276.86.127.135.98.1379593942.squirrel@boosthardware.com> Message-ID: <20130919125653.GC27421@linuxaudio.org> On Thu, Sep 19, 2013 at 10:32:22PM +1000, Patrick Shirkey wrote: > I am seeing the time period returned by jack_delay regularly increase > during the measurement process. Do you have any thoughts on why that would > be happening? I would like to rule out jack_delay because this is most > likely a bug in PA that I have come across now. Apparently PA is inserting more and more buffering... Ciao, -- FA A world of exhaustive, reliable metadata would be an utopia. It's also a pipe-dream, founded on self-delusion, nerd hubris and hysterically inflated market opportunities. (Cory Doctorow) From jamesmstone at gmail.com Thu Sep 19 13:17:54 2013 From: jamesmstone at gmail.com (James Stone) Date: Thu, 19 Sep 2013 14:17:54 +0100 Subject: [LAU] Music with Linux - Nepali Dub Message-ID: Hi All, Just finished a dub version of "Mayalu Mayalu" by my friend Manoj. Recorded in Ardour and mixed in Mixbus. Here is the original version: https://soundcloud.com/jmstone/mayalu-mayalu-manoj download link: https://soundcloud.com/jmstone/mayalu-mayalu-manoj/download Here is the (new) Dub version: https://soundcloud.com/jmstone/mayalu-dub/s-Tr8ic download link: https://soundcloud.com/jmstone/mayalu-dub/download/s-Tr8ic/ Enjoy! James From len at ovenwerks.net Thu Sep 19 13:48:54 2013 From: len at ovenwerks.net (Len Ovens) Date: Thu, 19 Sep 2013 06:48:54 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [LAU] Testing JACK and PA latency In-Reply-To: <39579.86.127.135.98.1379583540.squirrel@boosthardware.com> References: <48937.86.127.135.98.1379486981.squirrel@boosthardware.com> <52796.86.127.135.98.1379501724.squirrel@boosthardware.com> <57026.86.127.135.98.1379518182.squirrel@boosthardware.com> <36869.86.127.135.98.1379572479.squirrel@boosthardware.com> <39035.86.127.135.98.1379580371.squirrel@boosthardware.com> <523AC1B9.8010102@linuxuse.de> <39579.86.127.135.98.1379583540.squirrel@boosthardware.com> Message-ID: On Thu, 19 Sep 2013, Patrick Shirkey wrote: > On Thu, September 19, 2013 7:19 pm, Hartmut Noack wrote: >> Am 19.09.2013 10:46, schrieb Patrick Shirkey: >>> Moving this thread to LAU as it seems to be a more generic issue now: >>> >>> I am testing the round trip latency when using PA and JACK together. I >>> have the following connection graph: >>> >>> jack_system (in) -> pa_source (in) -> audacity (in) -> audacity (out) -> >>> pa sink (out) -> jack_system (out) >>> >> >> Unless your research is completely academic I do not see a practical use >> for its results on the user-side. > > This is entirely professionally motivated and will also have major > benefits to academia too. I'm seeking suggestion on how to go about it not > arguments for why or if this is a useful thing to do... ;-) > >> For Audacity latency is not a big >> issue. > > You can replace audacity with *any* application that can provide (near) 0 > internal latency and full duplex pass through. I expect the sample rate is to remain the same from one end to the other? With pulse (or at least some of the apps that work with pulse) that is not a given. My first thought would be an analog solution, scope the sound going in and coming out. Send short pulses of sound through. Anything that is purely with in the computer would require two measurements, both starting and ending in jack. So the length of time from jack-alsa-cable-alsa-jack would be added to jack-pulse-app-pulse-jack. I don't know If you would be measuring jack twice when you shouldn't but that part of the journey is probably the best known. just a thought, jack-alsa-cable-alsa-jack-pulse-app-pulse-jack might give valid results. There are some things that could be removed to figure out just parts of the path. Jack-pulse-pulse-jack for example. I don't know if pulse deals differently time wise with it's internal routing than with a app though. -- Len Ovens www.ovenwerks.net From len at ovenwerks.net Thu Sep 19 14:00:47 2013 From: len at ovenwerks.net (Len Ovens) Date: Thu, 19 Sep 2013 07:00:47 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [LAU] Testing JACK and PA latency In-Reply-To: <20130919104605.GC9491@linuxaudio.org> References: <48937.86.127.135.98.1379486981.squirrel@boosthardware.com> <52796.86.127.135.98.1379501724.squirrel@boosthardware.com> <57026.86.127.135.98.1379518182.squirrel@boosthardware.com> <36869.86.127.135.98.1379572479.squirrel@boosthardware.com> <39035.86.127.135.98.1379580371.squirrel@boosthardware.com> <20130919094210.GA9491@linuxaudio.org> <39846.86.127.135.98.1379585044.squirrel@boosthardware.com> <20130919104605.GC9491@linuxaudio.org> Message-ID: On Thu, 19 Sep 2013, Fons Adriaensen wrote: > Don't know - I'm by no means a PA expert... and I don't know > your Jack period size. Given PA's reputation I'd expect more: > 1024 samples would mean that PA imposes almost the same RT- > requirements on apps as Jack does, and it was designed *not* > to do that... But maybe the jack <-> PA interface doesn't > use the same amount of buffering that PA normally adds. I am no expert either, but, if pa has access to an audio device that jack can get best latency of -p128 and jack is working with a device that can work with -p64... add pa-jack to the mix and jack will only work at -p128 even with a device it could normally work at -p64 with. Add to that the same -p128 device has problems with the wifi giving xruns forces those xruns across the pa-jack IF. If I turn that device off in pa tha problems go away. Also the amount of CPU time used by PA rises a lot when connected to jack. Just my personal observations. -- Len Ovens www.ovenwerks.net From pshirkey at boosthardware.com Thu Sep 19 14:04:02 2013 From: pshirkey at boosthardware.com (Patrick Shirkey) Date: Fri, 20 Sep 2013 00:04:02 +1000 (EST) Subject: [LAU] Testing JACK and PA latency In-Reply-To: References: <48937.86.127.135.98.1379486981.squirrel@boosthardware.com> <52796.86.127.135.98.1379501724.squirrel@boosthardware.com> <57026.86.127.135.98.1379518182.squirrel@boosthardware.com> <36869.86.127.135.98.1379572479.squirrel@boosthardware.com> <39035.86.127.135.98.1379580371.squirrel@boosthardware.com> <523AC1B9.8010102@linuxuse.de> <39579.86.127.135.98.1379583540.squirrel@boosthardware.com> Message-ID: <43321.86.127.135.98.1379599442.squirrel@boosthardware.com> On Thu, September 19, 2013 11:48 pm, Len Ovens wrote: > On Thu, 19 Sep 2013, Patrick Shirkey wrote: > >> On Thu, September 19, 2013 7:19 pm, Hartmut Noack wrote: >>> Am 19.09.2013 10:46, schrieb Patrick Shirkey: >>>> Moving this thread to LAU as it seems to be a more generic issue now: >>>> >>>> I am testing the round trip latency when using PA and JACK together. I >>>> have the following connection graph: >>>> >>>> jack_system (in) -> pa_source (in) -> audacity (in) -> audacity (out) >>>> -> >>>> pa sink (out) -> jack_system (out) >>>> >>> >>> Unless your research is completely academic I do not see a practical >>> use >>> for its results on the user-side. >> >> This is entirely professionally motivated and will also have major >> benefits to academia too. I'm seeking suggestion on how to go about it >> not >> arguments for why or if this is a useful thing to do... ;-) >> >>> For Audacity latency is not a big >>> issue. >> >> You can replace audacity with *any* application that can provide (near) >> 0 >> internal latency and full duplex pass through. > > I expect the sample rate is to remain the same from one end to the other? > With pulse (or at least some of the apps that work with pulse) that is not > a given. > > My first thought would be an analog solution, scope the sound going in and > coming out. Send short pulses of sound through. Anything that is purely > with in the computer would require two measurements, both starting and > ending in jack. So the length of time from jack-alsa-cable-alsa-jack would > be added to jack-pulse-app-pulse-jack. I don't know If you would be > measuring jack twice when you shouldn't but that part of the journey is > probably the best known. > > just a thought, jack-alsa-cable-alsa-jack-pulse-app-pulse-jack might give > valid results. > > There are some things that could be removed to figure out just parts of > the path. Jack-pulse-pulse-jack for example. I don't know if pulse deals > differently time wise with it's internal routing than with a app though. > I'm wondering if this might work: 1: initiate signal pulse (500hz) in jack_delay (out) -> pa source (in) -> custom app (in) 2: trigger *new* response signal at different frequency (400 hz) from custom app (out) -> pa sink (out) -> jack_system (out) -> jack_system (in) -> jack_delay (in) The frequency of the signal could be modified at various points in the graph to provide more timing information? Could the custom app communicate with jack_delay or maybe they could pass a time stamp in the signal or write it to a log? It starting to sound a lot like mtc now. Surely we are not the first to have encountered this issue? -- Patrick Shirkey Boost Hardware Ltd From pshirkey at boosthardware.com Thu Sep 19 14:21:47 2013 From: pshirkey at boosthardware.com (Patrick Shirkey) Date: Fri, 20 Sep 2013 00:21:47 +1000 (EST) Subject: [LAU] Testing JACK and PA latency In-Reply-To: References: <48937.86.127.135.98.1379486981.squirrel@boosthardware.com> <52796.86.127.135.98.1379501724.squirrel@boosthardware.com> <57026.86.127.135.98.1379518182.squirrel@boosthardware.com> <36869.86.127.135.98.1379572479.squirrel@boosthardware.com> <39035.86.127.135.98.1379580371.squirrel@boosthardware.com> <20130919094210.GA9491@linuxaudio.org> <39846.86.127.135.98.1379585044.squirrel@boosthardware.com> <20130919104605.GC9491@linuxaudio.org> Message-ID: <43796.86.127.135.98.1379600507.squirrel@boosthardware.com> On Fri, September 20, 2013 12:00 am, Len Ovens wrote: > > > On Thu, 19 Sep 2013, Fons Adriaensen wrote: > >> Don't know - I'm by no means a PA expert... and I don't know >> your Jack period size. Given PA's reputation I'd expect more: >> 1024 samples would mean that PA imposes almost the same RT- >> requirements on apps as Jack does, and it was designed *not* >> to do that... But maybe the jack <-> PA interface doesn't >> use the same amount of buffering that PA normally adds. > > I am no expert either, but, if pa has access to an audio device that jack > can get best latency of -p128 and jack is working with a device that can > work with -p64... add pa-jack to the mix and jack will only work at -p128 > even with a device it could normally work at -p64 with. > > Add to that the same -p128 device has problems with the wifi giving xruns > forces those xruns across the pa-jack IF. If I turn that device off in pa > tha problems go away. Also the amount of CPU time used by PA rises a lot > when connected to jack. > > Just my personal observations. > PA CPU time is quite heavily dependant on the amount of latency. Smaller period sizes require PA to query the graph more frequently which pushes up CPU load. http://www.freedesktop.org/wiki/Software/PulseAudio/Documentation/Developer/Clients/LactencyControl/ Yes, this is another metric I am testing for so it would be nice to have a single app for both measurements. With the graph that Fons has suggested it seems like it should be possible to do it all in one go even while modifying the period size and other system configuration settings. An automated method for all of the above would be very useful for a lot of professional use cases. Something along the lines of "JackPulse Latency Test" (JPLT). -- Patrick Shirkey Boost Hardware Ltd From paul at linuxaudiosystems.com Thu Sep 19 14:37:28 2013 From: paul at linuxaudiosystems.com (Paul Davis) Date: Thu, 19 Sep 2013 10:37:28 -0400 Subject: [LAU] Aeolus In-Reply-To: <20130919124833.GB27421@linuxaudio.org> References: <20130918211638.GB26599@linuxaudio.org> <523A3AFA.4000701@kudla.org> <20130919124833.GB27421@linuxaudio.org> Message-ID: I don't know, Fons. There's an entire "modular DAW" called ayyi that is a fork of ardour's codebase. The author has never spoken to me once (at least not with an acknowledgement of what s/he was up to). Whoever is doing is is still active (recent releases on September 2nd). They distribute the ardour libraries as part of their source tree. They clearly want to produce something that operates in the same space as Ardour, although they have changed the name and have a very different architectural concept in mind (which over time seems to be converging back towards Ardour's own ... quelle surprise!) I'm not wild about it, but it is also somewhat in line with my original goals when I started writing Ardour - nobody in the open source world knew how to write a DAW (*) and an example would be handy. --p (*) some would argue that this situation is unchanged On Thu, Sep 19, 2013 at 8:48 AM, Fons Adriaensen wrote: > On Wed, Sep 18, 2013 at 07:44:58PM -0400, Rob Kudla wrote: > > > This may even all be a misunderstanding, as I found a bug report on the > > Musescore bug tracker from a year ago in which someone posted a link to > > your old skynet.be page > > I don't buy that. I post at least once a week on LAU or LAD, everybody > who reads those list knows my email address and where to find my website. > If the musescore people or Gavioli don't know those, they are the ones > out of touch with the community. As it appears, their main interest is > Windows. > > Ciao, > > -- > FA > > A world of exhaustive, reliable metadata would be an utopia. > It's also a pipe-dream, founded on self-delusion, nerd hubris > and hysterically inflated market opportunities. (Cory Doctorow) > > _______________________________________________ > Linux-audio-user mailing list > Linux-audio-user at lists.linuxaudio.org > http://lists.linuxaudio.org/listinfo/linux-audio-user > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From bjb-linux-audio-user at deus.net Thu Sep 19 14:55:17 2013 From: bjb-linux-audio-user at deus.net (bjb-linux-audio-user at deus.net) Date: Thu, 19 Sep 2013 15:55:17 +0100 Subject: [LAU] [LAD] Aeolus In-Reply-To: References: <20130918211638.GB26599@linuxaudio.org> Message-ID: <20130919145517.GP7687@deus.net> On Wed, Sep 18, 2013 at 02:29:02PM -0700, J. Liles wrote: > On Wed, Sep 18, 2013 at 2:16 PM, Fons Adriaensen wrote: >> It has come to my attention that there are ATM at least two >> 'forks' of Aeolus. The first by the MuseScore team, the second >> by one Maurizio Gavioli. > Respectfully, you granted people the right to fork your code in the first > place. Respect is indeed the key word here. Speaking personally, I feel that the rights granted by Open Source users are there to protect users against developers who are not acting in their best interets. There is, I would say, at least a moral obligation that you try to work with those developers before simply taking their work without any consideration for them. Developers of Open Source software are doing their users a huge favour, and some level of respect and courtesy is the least they ought to be able to expect. This is not intended as a comment on this specific case or any other as I don't know the details, merely on the implication that just because you have the Right to do something if you need to, it's OK to go ahead and do it without any further consideration. bjb From fero.kiraly at gmail.com Thu Sep 19 15:31:15 2013 From: fero.kiraly at gmail.com (Fero Kiraly) Date: Thu, 19 Sep 2013 17:31:15 +0200 Subject: [LAU] jack - ardour - CPU Message-ID: hi list, when I start Jack, there is in transport RT 2%, then when I start ardour the percentage rise up to 34% - is that ok ? (i am asking becaouse i have some problems & I am trying to resolve them) thak you, fero -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From pshirkey at boosthardware.com Thu Sep 19 15:40:17 2013 From: pshirkey at boosthardware.com (Patrick Shirkey) Date: Fri, 20 Sep 2013 01:40:17 +1000 (EST) Subject: [LAU] Testing JACK and PA latency In-Reply-To: <43796.86.127.135.98.1379600507.squirrel@boosthardware.com> References: <48937.86.127.135.98.1379486981.squirrel@boosthardware.com> <52796.86.127.135.98.1379501724.squirrel@boosthardware.com> <57026.86.127.135.98.1379518182.squirrel@boosthardware.com> <36869.86.127.135.98.1379572479.squirrel@boosthardware.com> <39035.86.127.135.98.1379580371.squirrel@boosthardware.com> <20130919094210.GA9491@linuxaudio.org> <39846.86.127.135.98.1379585044.squirrel@boosthardware.com> <20130919104605.GC9491@linuxaudio.org> <43796.86.127.135.98.1379600507.squirrel@boosthardware.com> Message-ID: <33075.86.127.135.98.1379605217.squirrel@boosthardware.com> Here's some basic results for those who might be interested in this process. ---------- SETUP ---------- Using this graph: jack_delay (out) -> pa_source -> ecasound -> pa_sink -> system:playback -> analog cable -> system_capture -> jack_delay (in) Running ecasound with this chain setup: ecasound -f:32,2,48000 -b:64 -i alsa -o alsa JACK is running with 48k/64/2 in realtime mode. Gkrellm is running for quick reference to CPU load. Dual core Intel(R) Core(TM)2 CPU T5600 @ 1.83GHz with 4GB DDR2 667.0 MHz / PC2-5300. Kernel 3.2.0-3-amd64 cat /proc/asound/cards 0 [Intel ]: HDA-Intel - HDA Intel HDA Intel at 0xd2000000 irq 46 Granted this is not a modern PC system or even a professional grade sound card but it is similar to modern mobile hardware which is my target platform. I see the following results: With just jack, PA , jack_iodelay running I see CPU pegged at around 30% on both cores. With ecasound running but without connecting jack_iodelay to pulse_source (in), I see CPU Load pegged at between 32% to 55%. With jack_iodelay connected to pulse_source (in), I see CPU load hovering around 40% to 65% and generally on the higher side. ---------- RESULTS ---------- - With a clean start from boot and no previous audio apps running at initialisation of the connection between jack_delay and pa_source 23ms latency After a second or two things start to go funny. The latency jumps up to 800 ms and then down to 140 ms up again to 480 ms down to 350 ms up to 1067 ms down to 670 ms... In other words it's all over the place. Granted this is on a consumer grade audio device but a lot of mobile devices have similar if not exactly the same chipset/driver. I would like to trace the bottle neck but without running the whole graph it might not be possible. Maybe an app that incrementally adds to the signal tone and timestamps against the summed frequency could be used to trace the location of the bottle neck? Suggestions for other things that could be done to minimise the erratic behaviour are also welcome. Maybe I am missing a crucial tweak to PA for example? -- Patrick Shirkey Boost Hardware Ltd From josh at joshlawrence.me Thu Sep 19 16:04:34 2013 From: josh at joshlawrence.me (Josh Lawrence) Date: Thu, 19 Sep 2013 11:04:34 -0500 Subject: [LAU] [LAD] Aeolus In-Reply-To: <20130918222841.GD26599@linuxaudio.org> References: <20130918211638.GB26599@linuxaudio.org> <20130918222841.GD26599@linuxaudio.org> Message-ID: On Wed, Sep 18, 2013 at 5:28 PM, Fons Adriaensen wrote: > Yes, and now I know that was a mistake. Freedom is always tons of fun as a subject for intellectual masturbation until it becomes inconvenient. -- Josh Lawrence -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From xiphmont at gmail.com Thu Sep 19 16:34:13 2013 From: xiphmont at gmail.com (Monty Montgomery) Date: Thu, 19 Sep 2013 12:34:13 -0400 Subject: [LAU] [LAD] Aeolus In-Reply-To: References: <20130918211638.GB26599@linuxaudio.org> <20130918222841.GD26599@linuxaudio.org> Message-ID: .... I'm a bit mystified. Fons, you explicitly granted other developers the right to do... exactly what they did. And now you're miffed about it? I'm.... missing something. There is not and never was any expectation in free / open source that you, as a developer, are owed anything whatsoever by those who use your code (outside of stipulations of the license). And you, similarly, don't owe them anything either. Perfect symmetry. That's where it starts from. Letting go of the need to control everything, to enforce being the smartest guy in the room. Sometimes a nice little community of mutual cooperation springs up... It happens often, but that's still the exception, not the most common case. Now, if others play dirty, strip off your copyright attribution for example, claim they wrote it not you, that's different. I'll join you on the warpath. Did that happen in this case? (95% or more of the folks who use my code fork it and I never hear about it. That has always been true. I didn't even know Spotify was using Vorbis until somone spotted the symbols. The freaking iPhone ships a fork of Speex, again, found by dumping a Siri stream. AoTuV. A hundred other examples that I'm perfectly fine with...) If you want a community, you have to build it. No one owes it to you, no one will do it for you. Writing the code is the easiest part of building an ecosystem. Ecosystem dynamics are hard. Closing the source will probably make it harder. Monty From brent at keycorner.org Thu Sep 19 18:24:02 2013 From: brent at keycorner.org (Brent Busby) Date: Thu, 19 Sep 2013 13:24:02 -0500 (CDT) Subject: [LAU] jack - ardour - CPU In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Thu, 19 Sep 2013, Fero Kiraly wrote: > when I start Jack, there is in transport RT 2%, > then when I start ardour the percentage rise up to 34% - is that ok ? > > (i am asking becaouse i have some problems & I am trying to resolve > them) For a fresh Ardour 3 session, that seems awfully high. If you load a session that uses lots of plugins, it might be more normal. (I have a session I'm working on now that has a load about like that.) It all depends also on how fast your CPU is. -- + Brent A. Busby + "We've all heard that a million monkeys + Sr. UNIX Systems Admin + banging on a million typewriters will + University of Chicago + eventually reproduce the entire works of + James Franck Institute + Shakespeare. Now, thanks to the Internet, + Materials Research Ctr + we know this is not true." -Robert Wilensky From fero.kiraly at gmail.com Thu Sep 19 18:54:47 2013 From: fero.kiraly at gmail.com (Fero Kiraly) Date: Thu, 19 Sep 2013 20:54:47 +0200 Subject: [LAU] jack - ardour - CPU Message-ID: yes, it is fresh ardour session. my cpu is intel i3 2.xGHz, so i think spomething is wrong... ;( fero -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From lists at quirq.net Thu Sep 19 19:12:38 2013 From: lists at quirq.net (Q) Date: Thu, 19 Sep 2013 20:12:38 +0100 Subject: [LAU] jack - ardour - CPU In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <523B4CA6.6090109@quirq.net> On 19/09/13 16:31, Fero Kiraly wrote: > hi list, > > when I start Jack, there is in transport RT 2%, > then when I start ardour the percentage rise up to 34% - is that ok ? > > (i am asking becaouse i have some problems & I am trying to resolve them) > > > thak you, > > fero Hi Have you checked to see whether you have CPU scaling switched on, and if so, have you turned it off? I have a couple of launchers alongside all my music app shortcuts on one of my pop-up panels to turn it off/on before/after a session. Q From willgodfrey at musically.me.uk Thu Sep 19 20:00:57 2013 From: willgodfrey at musically.me.uk (Will Godfrey) Date: Thu, 19 Sep 2013 21:00:57 +0100 Subject: [LAU] Music with Linux - Nepali Dub In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20130919210057.38c4b093@debian> On Thu, 19 Sep 2013 14:17:54 +0100 James Stone wrote: > Hi All, > > Just finished a dub version of "Mayalu Mayalu" by my friend Manoj. > Recorded in Ardour and mixed in Mixbus. > > Here is the original version: > > https://soundcloud.com/jmstone/mayalu-mayalu-manoj > > download link: > > https://soundcloud.com/jmstone/mayalu-mayalu-manoj/download > > Here is the (new) Dub version: > > https://soundcloud.com/jmstone/mayalu-dub/s-Tr8ic > > download link: > > https://soundcloud.com/jmstone/mayalu-dub/download/s-Tr8ic/ > > Enjoy! > > James Not really into Dub, but I enjoyed your work anyway. However, on then listening to the original, I found I preferred that - which I guess isn't all that surprising. -- Will J Godfrey http://www.musically.me.uk Say you have a poem and I have a tune. Exchange them and we can both have a poem, a tune, and a song. From tim at orford.org Thu Sep 19 21:42:41 2013 From: tim at orford.org (Tim Orford) Date: Thu, 19 Sep 2013 22:42:41 +0100 Subject: [LAU] Aeolus In-Reply-To: References: <20130918211638.GB26599@linuxaudio.org> <523A3AFA.4000701@kudla.org> <20130919124833.GB27421@linuxaudio.org> Message-ID: <20130919214241.GX14358@orford.org> On Thu, Sep 19, 2013 at 10:37:28AM -0400, Paul Davis wrote: > [...] > There's an entire "modular DAW" called ayyi that is a fork of ardour's > codebase. The author has never spoken to me once (at least not with an > acknowledgement of what s/he was up to). Whoever is doing is is still > active (recent releases on September 2nd). They distribute the ardour > libraries as part of their source tree. They clearly want to produce > something that operates in the same space as Ardour, although they have > changed the name and have a very different architectural concept in mind > [...] Hi Paul I am the main Ayyi Project developer. I sincerely hope that the use of your code hasn't caused any offence. The project is not intended to be competitive with Ardour and is likely to remain merely a proof-of-concept. If I you have any objections, please let me know as I would be very keen to accommodate you. For example if you dislike the use of the name "ardourd", I will change that. Perhaps an academic distinction but I prefer to think of the current Ayyi Project server as a libardour application rather than being a fork. There are no changes other than to facilitate IPC, and as libardour is not packaged separately including it in the Ayyi tree is the only option. We have had conversations on LAD and IRC but we just have very different ideas about what a DAW should be. I have a great deal of respect for Ardour and all the great work you and others have done and ideally I would very much like to contribute, something that a more modular approach would help with. Who knows one day I may write a re-usable component that Ardour can use. A lot of my recent work has gone into libwaveform https://github.com/ayyi/libwaveform which is a small step for me in the direction of re-usable code. But to get the conversation back to Fons original topic, I think that many coders find talking unproductive and prefer to let their code do the talking. Forking is a natural and healthy part of that. Github has the right idea, in encouraging forking as part of the process of contributing to the original codebase. Regards -- Tim From paul at linuxaudiosystems.com Thu Sep 19 21:55:36 2013 From: paul at linuxaudiosystems.com (Paul Davis) Date: Thu, 19 Sep 2013 17:55:36 -0400 Subject: [LAU] Aeolus In-Reply-To: <20130919214241.GX14358@orford.org> References: <20130918211638.GB26599@linuxaudio.org> <523A3AFA.4000701@kudla.org> <20130919124833.GB27421@linuxaudio.org> <20130919214241.GX14358@orford.org> Message-ID: On Thu, Sep 19, 2013 at 5:42 PM, Tim Orford wrote: > On Thu, Sep 19, 2013 at 10:37:28AM -0400, Paul Davis wrote: > > [...] > > There's an entire "modular DAW" called ayyi that is a fork of ardour's > > codebase. The author has never spoken to me once (at least not with an > > acknowledgement of what s/he was up to). Whoever is doing is is still > > active (recent releases on September 2nd). They distribute the ardour > > libraries as part of their source tree. They clearly want to produce > > something that operates in the same space as Ardour, although they have > > changed the name and have a very different architectural concept in mind > > [...] > > Hi Paul > > I am the main Ayyi Project developer. > > I sincerely hope that the use of your code hasn't caused any offence. > Not at all! > The project is not intended to be competitive with Ardour and is likely > to remain merely a proof-of-concept. If I you have any objections, please > let me know as I would be very keen to accommodate you. For example if you > dislike the use of the name "ardourd", I will change that. > No issues here. > We have had conversations on LAD and IRC but we just have very different > ideas about what a DAW should be. I have a great deal of respect for > Ardour and all the great work you and others have done and ideally I would > very much like to contribute, something that a more modular approach would > help with. Good luck with that! Mr Liles adn the Non project might appreciate your efforts more directly though :) My apologies for forgetting that we had, in fact spoken about this stuff. --p -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jmckernon at gmail.com Thu Sep 19 22:46:32 2013 From: jmckernon at gmail.com (James Mckernon) Date: Thu, 19 Sep 2013 23:46:32 +0100 Subject: [LAU] Music with Linux - Nepali Dub In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Hi James, A really nice dub - really enjoyed it. Quite unusual. Ta, J On Thu, Sep 19, 2013 at 2:17 PM, James Stone wrote: > Hi All, > > Just finished a dub version of "Mayalu Mayalu" by my friend Manoj. > Recorded in Ardour and mixed in Mixbus. > > Here is the original version: > > https://soundcloud.com/jmstone/mayalu-mayalu-manoj > > download link: > > https://soundcloud.com/jmstone/mayalu-mayalu-manoj/download > > Here is the (new) Dub version: > > https://soundcloud.com/jmstone/mayalu-dub/s-Tr8ic > > download link: > > https://soundcloud.com/jmstone/mayalu-dub/download/s-Tr8ic/ > > Enjoy! > > James > _______________________________________________ > Linux-audio-user mailing list > Linux-audio-user at lists.linuxaudio.org > http://lists.linuxaudio.org/listinfo/linux-audio-user From erik at zasran.com Thu Sep 19 23:20:40 2013 From: erik at zasran.com (Erik Steffl) Date: Thu, 19 Sep 2013 16:20:40 -0700 Subject: [LAU] Jack does not see USB sound card Boss Micro BR-80 In-Reply-To: <523AC7F3.1090401@ladisch.de> References: <523AB721.3080501@zasran.com> <523AC7F3.1090401@ladisch.de> Message-ID: <523B86C8.2010505@zasran.com> On 09/19/2013 02:46 AM, Clemens Ladisch wrote: > Erik Steffl wrote: >> aplay -l >> card 2: BR80AUDIO [BR-80(AUDIO)], device 0: USB Audio [USB Audio] > >> Boss Micro BR-80 seems to be recognized properly but qjackctl does not >> list it in Set under any of Interface, Input Device, Output Device >> choices, I only see /dev/dsp, /dev/audio, plughw:0 and hw:0. > > "hw:2" should appear in those lists. Did you start QjackCtl before > plugging the device in? Can you start Jack manually with > "jackd -d alsa -d hw:2"? started qjackctl after the device was plugged in, starting jack manually seems to be working (also tested wiuth ardour2, both recording and playback works). Does that mean there is a bug in qjackctl? Using the version in Ubuntu 13.04 which is qjackctl 0.3.9-2 Here's what jackd prints out when started manually: erik at jojda:~$ jackd -d alsa -d hw:2 jackdmp 1.9.10 Copyright 2001-2005 Paul Davis and others. Copyright 2004-2013 Grame. jackdmp comes with ABSOLUTELY NO WARRANTY This is free software, and you are welcome to redistribute it under certain conditions; see the file COPYING for details no message buffer overruns no message buffer overruns no message buffer overruns JACK server starting in realtime mode with priority 10 audio_reservation_init Acquire audio card Audio2 creating alsa driver ... hw:2|hw:2|1024|2|48000|0|0|nomon|swmeter|-|32bit configuring for 48000Hz, period = 1024 frames (21.3 ms), buffer = 2 periods ALSA: final selected sample format for capture: 32bit integer little-endian ALSA: use 2 periods for capture ALSA: final selected sample format for playback: 32bit integer little-endian ALSA: use 2 periods for playback thanks! erik From len at ovenwerks.net Thu Sep 19 23:47:56 2013 From: len at ovenwerks.net (Len Ovens) Date: Thu, 19 Sep 2013 16:47:56 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [LAU] Testing JACK and PA latency In-Reply-To: <43796.86.127.135.98.1379600507.squirrel@boosthardware.com> References: <48937.86.127.135.98.1379486981.squirrel@boosthardware.com> <52796.86.127.135.98.1379501724.squirrel@boosthardware.com> <57026.86.127.135.98.1379518182.squirrel@boosthardware.com> <36869.86.127.135.98.1379572479.squirrel@boosthardware.com> <39035.86.127.135.98.1379580371.squirrel@boosthardware.com> <20130919094210.GA9491@linuxaudio.org> <39846.86.127.135.98.1379585044.squirrel@boosthardware.com> <20130919104605.GC9491@linuxaudio.org> <43796.86.127.135.98.1379600507.squirrel@boosthardware.com> Message-ID: On Fri, 20 Sep 2013, Patrick Shirkey wrote: > On Fri, September 20, 2013 12:00 am, Len Ovens wrote: >> I am no expert either, but, if pa has access to an audio device that jack >> can get best latency of -p128 and jack is working with a device that can >> work with -p64... add pa-jack to the mix and jack will only work at -p128 >> even with a device it could normally work at -p64 with. >> >> Add to that the same -p128 device has problems with the wifi giving xruns >> forces those xruns across the pa-jack IF. If I turn that device off in pa >> tha problems go away. Also the amount of CPU time used by PA rises a lot >> when connected to jack. >> >> Just my personal observations. >> > > PA CPU time is quite heavily dependant on the amount of latency. Smaller > period sizes require PA to query the graph more frequently which pushes up > CPU load. Yes, I found that too. Really, it has only been since the end of 2012 that pa-jack bridging has been usable without too much fiddling. So there are a lot of things no-one knows. Bridging pa to jack changes the way pa works significantly. PA makes some default assumptions. 44.1k (I changed mine to 48k, both default and backup). Pa will do on the fly sample rate change if needed to mix two streams or to match an input stream to a sink. This will affect cpu use as well as latency even if latency is locked to jack. PA is built to hide differences between source and sink from the user, both levels an rate. Latency comes after that... To get the best out of pa or pa-jack, the user needs to follow some rules... the ones I know of are: - turn off (in the pa config) all audio devices not being used. The one jack uses can be left on because as soon as jack grabs it pa can't really see it anyway. - set the sample rate the same in jack, pa, and any app pa talks to. - in the case of playing back files... try ( :P ) to use files with the same rate too. (pretty hard to do... and not worth recoding to achieve, put up with the extra cpu load) - Try to find tools that deal directly with jack (better than audacity does please!) - Set jackd-sink/source to only two channels (or minimum needed) and no auto-connect (probably) Cpu use goes up with number of channels of course. - Other things I have yet to find. I can think of only two normal uses for pa-jack (I am sure there are more, but I tend to tunnel vision in these things :) 1) for running desktop apps through jack for simplicity of setup. This is something a firewire user might do for sure, but it is handy in other cases as well. 2) remote audio transport as in broadcast use. This requires more thought because latency becomes more important. It is often better to use more than one machine for this. A standard use may have a number of code/decode steps at the same time. Think two audio files being decoded, two more for a skype line (one decode and one encode), some audio processing to sweeten the output and then encode the stream for output. I found 20ms (as per qjackctl) was hard to get without trouble (xruns, or runaway stutter from pa). Older P4 machine at 2.4Ghz, ice1712 audio, using idjc on the jack side no sweetening. The one person I have worked with on this runs his phone app on a second computer (teamspeak I think) and runs an audio line into his mixer from that. So no PA :) I would really like to try netjack with opus encoding as a method providing remote content. I may have to "roll my own" to try it any time soon though. But I don't know how well netjack deals with systems behind routers. -- Len Ovens www.ovenwerks.net From ken at restivo.org Fri Sep 20 00:50:32 2013 From: ken at restivo.org (Ken Restivo) Date: Thu, 19 Sep 2013 17:50:32 -0700 Subject: [LAU] Some linux keyboard and bass jamming Message-ID: <20130920005032.GA5557@q400a.mobile.restivo.org> I'm in the mix playing my linux netbook keyboard rig live from around 03:30:00 after the Sun Ra tracks, through until the bitter end when it transitions into the Zardoz soundtrack. http://spazradio.bamfic.com/2013-09-18-all.ogg (warning: 5 hours of music). Most of the linux synth work is between 03:55:00 or so until 04:41:00. The MPC drums and loops (on Ableton, sorry) is Spukkin Faceship. The rapper at 03:35:00 or so is Letter D from Guadalajara http://letterd.net/ The bass is me (fluidsynth) pretty much throughout. Lots of bass in this jam. You can hear fluidsynth clavinet with Fons's autowah at various points. Also Rhodes fluidsynth with JACK RACK, and plenty of Monosynth too. The echo I use excessively throughout is a LADSPA plugin too. -ken From pshirkey at boosthardware.com Fri Sep 20 00:57:48 2013 From: pshirkey at boosthardware.com (Patrick Shirkey) Date: Fri, 20 Sep 2013 10:57:48 +1000 (EST) Subject: [LAU] Testing JACK and PA latency In-Reply-To: References: <48937.86.127.135.98.1379486981.squirrel@boosthardware.com> <52796.86.127.135.98.1379501724.squirrel@boosthardware.com> <57026.86.127.135.98.1379518182.squirrel@boosthardware.com> <36869.86.127.135.98.1379572479.squirrel@boosthardware.com> <39035.86.127.135.98.1379580371.squirrel@boosthardware.com> <20130919094210.GA9491@linuxaudio.org> <39846.86.127.135.98.1379585044.squirrel@boosthardware.com> <20130919104605.GC9491@linuxaudio.org> <43796.86.127.135.98.1379600507.squirrel@boosthardware.com> Message-ID: <41971.86.127.135.98.1379638668.squirrel@boosthardware.com> On Fri, September 20, 2013 9:47 am, Len Ovens wrote: > > On Fri, 20 Sep 2013, Patrick Shirkey wrote: > >> On Fri, September 20, 2013 12:00 am, Len Ovens wrote: >>> I am no expert either, but, if pa has access to an audio device that >>> jack >>> can get best latency of -p128 and jack is working with a device that >>> can >>> work with -p64... add pa-jack to the mix and jack will only work at >>> -p128 >>> even with a device it could normally work at -p64 with. >>> >>> Add to that the same -p128 device has problems with the wifi giving >>> xruns >>> forces those xruns across the pa-jack IF. If I turn that device off in >>> pa >>> tha problems go away. Also the amount of CPU time used by PA rises a >>> lot >>> when connected to jack. >>> >>> Just my personal observations. >>> >> >> PA CPU time is quite heavily dependant on the amount of latency. Smaller >> period sizes require PA to query the graph more frequently which pushes >> up >> CPU load. > > Yes, I found that too. Really, it has only been since the end of 2012 that > pa-jack bridging has been usable without too much fiddling. It's been working for me on fedora and debian since 2009 at least (apart from that nasty bug that slipped in mid last year). Maybe you are running ubuntu? > So there are a > lot of things no-one knows. Bridging pa to jack changes the way pa works > significantly. PA makes some default assumptions. 44.1k (I changed mine to > 48k, both default and backup). Pa will do on the fly sample rate change if > needed to mix two streams or to match an input stream to a sink. This will > affect cpu use as well as latency even if latency is locked to jack. PA is > built to hide differences between source and sink from the user, both > levels an rate. Latency comes after that... To get the best out of pa or > pa-jack, the user needs to follow some rules... the ones I know of are: > > - turn off (in the pa config) all audio devices not being used. The one > jack uses can be left on because as soon as jack grabs it pa can't really > see it anyway. > > - set the sample rate the same in jack, pa, and any app pa talks to. > > - in the case of playing back files... try ( :P ) to use files with > the > same rate too. (pretty hard to do... and not worth recoding to achieve, > put up with the extra cpu load) > > - Try to find tools that deal directly with jack (better than audacity > does please!) > > - Set jackd-sink/source to only two channels (or minimum needed) and no > auto-connect (probably) Cpu use goes up with number of channels of course. > > - Other things I have yet to find. > > I can think of only two normal uses for pa-jack (I am sure there are more, > but I tend to tunnel vision in these things :) Pulse Audio is the official sound management tool/layer for at least 4 high profile mobile operating systems. The PA developers have invested a lot of time and effort on making it functional and useful in both desktop and mobile environments. In addition there is a lot of Policy Kit functionality that is extremely unlikely to find it's way into JACK. There are certain members of LAD who would likely give up FLOSS altogether than accept the policy kit functionality of PA in JACK. In addition PA and JACK teams have different development priorities that require contradictory trade offs to be made. I don't see this as a major issue as long as PA and JACK coexist peacefully and things are getting pretty good in that regard. As you rightly note things are more stable now that they have ever been. Myself and some other professional audio devs working for large multinational companies that have a vested interest in high performance mobile operating systems are seeking to isolate performance bugs with the combination so that JACK and PA can be run in unison at low latency on systems that currently do not have ootb support for JACK. If that turns out to be an unattainable goal then we will find a way to at least make it possible so that JACK and PA can be used interchangeably. I have been running the latency test now for a few hours straight and I have seen varying numbers reported down to as low as 5ms and as high as 1300ms. I would like to find the cause of the erratic behaviour. After carefully monitoring jack_delay and top it appears to be PA that is at fault but I am not yet able to pinpoint the cause. Changing the sample rate from 44100 to 48000 in /etc/pulse/daemon.conf did not fix the problem. This device is an onboard hda_intel 2 channel card. Surprisingly for me it is performing well at 64 frames/period. Given that I saw similar results at 1024 frames/period my suspicions are with PA. Still the erratic behaviour might be a priority issue, kernel/driver issue that is causing the problem and not related at all to PA. At the moment I am just guessing as to the real cause of the observed behaviour. It would be useful if other people have the time to run the test procedure on their systems too to get a better overview of how widespread the problem is. Here's what I am doing: Preliminary step: vi ~/.pulse/client.conf add the following line: autospawn = no TEST PROCEDURE 1: Connect the headphone/speaker output to the mic input with a physical cable. You could use the sytem mic directly but then you have to listen to an annoying signal tone at approx 600hz so the cable is a more pleasant experience. 2: console: pulseaudio -k 3: start jack with the following settings or as low as you can go 64/48000/2 4: console: pulseaudio -D 5: console: jack_iodelay 6: console: ecasound -f:32,2,48000 -b:64 -i alsa -o alsa 7: disconnect system_capture (in) from pa_source (in) 8: connect system_capture (in) to jack_delay (in) 9: connect jack_delay (out) to pa_source (in) open up gkrellm so you can monitor the system load open up a console with top to monitor system load and application load check the output from top against the console messages from jack_delay Do you get wildly fluctuating results too or is your system stable at a specific latency measurement? This is a real issue not an academic theoretical exercise. Anyone who has the time to provide feedback will be making a useful contribution to the progress of Linux Audio Development. If you do feel inclined to participate please also report your system stats: PA/kernel/sound device/jack/cpu/mem/video/etc... If for any reason you do not see any value in this process I will appreciate if you start a new thread for that discussion. > 1) for running desktop apps through jack for simplicity of setup. This > is > something a firewire user might do for sure, but it is handy in other > cases as well. > > 2) remote audio transport as in broadcast use. This requires more > thought because latency becomes more important. It is often better to use > more than one machine for this. A standard use may have a number of > code/decode steps at the same time. Think two audio files being decoded, > two more for a skype line (one decode and one encode), some audio > processing to sweeten the output and then encode the stream for output. I > found 20ms (as per qjackctl) was hard to get without trouble (xruns, or > runaway stutter from pa). Older P4 machine at 2.4Ghz, ice1712 audio, using > idjc on the jack side no sweetening. The one person I have worked with on > this runs his phone app on a second computer (teamspeak I think) and runs > an audio line into his mixer from that. So no PA :) > > I would really like to try netjack with opus encoding as a method > providing remote content. I may have to "roll my own" to try it any time > soon though. But I don't know how well netjack deals with systems behind > routers. > In our tests we have found netjack to be incredibly useful for a large range of high performance/high bandwidth processes. In general I prefer to use JACK but there are also completely valid business and corporate uses for PA that cannot be ignored if we want to see wider adoption of JACK. -- Patrick Shirkey Boost Hardware Ltd From ralf.mardorf at alice-dsl.net Fri Sep 20 01:01:05 2013 From: ralf.mardorf at alice-dsl.net (Ralf Mardorf) Date: Fri, 20 Sep 2013 03:01:05 +0200 Subject: [LAU] Aeolus In-Reply-To: References: <20130918211638.GB26599@linuxaudio.org> <523A3AFA.4000701@kudla.org> <20130919124833.GB27421@linuxaudio.org> <20130919214241.GX14358@orford.org> Message-ID: <1379638865.4368.56.camel@archlinux> On Thu, 2013-09-19 at 15:36 +0100, James Morris wrote to LAD: > On 18/09/13 Fons Adriaensen wrote: > ... > > >If this is typical for the attitude taken by the Linux Audio > >community then my motivation to contribute to it will take > >a serious blow. > > > Well you've been a member of the Linux Audio community as long as > anyone, you should know if this is the typical attitude taken by the > "Community"... I wonder that there is such a long discussion on two mailing lists, but seemingly the coder/coders never were contacted. Assumed "Maurizio M. Gavioli" or anybody else should do something wrong, then why not simply contact him/them and ask him/them not to continue to do something wrong? Perhaps this does help: https://github.com/mgavioli/oscAeolus/issues/1 IMO Maurizio M. Gavioli and Fons should talk to each other. Regards, Ralf From clemens at ladisch.de Fri Sep 20 06:39:59 2013 From: clemens at ladisch.de (Clemens Ladisch) Date: Fri, 20 Sep 2013 08:39:59 +0200 Subject: [LAU] Jack does not see USB sound card Boss Micro BR-80 In-Reply-To: <523B86C8.2010505@zasran.com> References: <523AB721.3080501@zasran.com> <523AC7F3.1090401@ladisch.de> <523B86C8.2010505@zasran.com> Message-ID: <523BEDBF.3020805@ladisch.de> Erik Steffl wrote: >> Erik Steffl wrote: >>> Boss Micro BR-80 seems to be recognized properly but qjackctl does not >>> list it > > starting jack manually seems to be working. > > Does that mean there is a bug in qjackctl? QjackCtl's purpose is to start Jack with the parameters you want, so this indeed appears to be a bug. Regards, Clemens From zettberlin at linuxuse.de Fri Sep 20 07:25:27 2013 From: zettberlin at linuxuse.de (Hartmut Noack) Date: Fri, 20 Sep 2013 09:25:27 +0200 Subject: [LAU] end-user oriented info on OSC Message-ID: <523BF867.9040906@linuxuse.de> Hello, I am searching for information, especially manuals and howtos on OSC that address the end-user side. Imagine a musician, that uses Ardour and wants to use its OSC-capabilities. Do you know any howtos for people, who want to use a MIDI-controller to send OSC to software under Linux? Especially I would be interested in informations how to use OSC *without* using PD-patches. Or, if that is not available, anything to download and simply open with PD that allows end-users without any programming-skills to use OSC under Linux. best regards From pshirkey at boosthardware.com Fri Sep 20 08:59:06 2013 From: pshirkey at boosthardware.com (Patrick Shirkey) Date: Fri, 20 Sep 2013 18:59:06 +1000 (EST) Subject: [LAU] Testing JACK and PA latency In-Reply-To: <41971.86.127.135.98.1379638668.squirrel@boosthardware.com> References: <48937.86.127.135.98.1379486981.squirrel@boosthardware.com> <52796.86.127.135.98.1379501724.squirrel@boosthardware.com> <57026.86.127.135.98.1379518182.squirrel@boosthardware.com> <36869.86.127.135.98.1379572479.squirrel@boosthardware.com> <39035.86.127.135.98.1379580371.squirrel@boosthardware.com> <20130919094210.GA9491@linuxaudio.org> <39846.86.127.135.98.1379585044.squirrel@boosthardware.com> <20130919104605.GC9491@linuxaudio.org> <43796.86.127.135.98.1379600507.squirrel@boosthardware.com> <41971.86.127.135.98.1379638668.squirrel@boosthardware.com> Message-ID: <46374.86.127.135.155.1379667546.squirrel@boosthardware.com> For comparison taking PA out of the graph: jack_iodelay (out) -> ecasound (in) -> ecasound (out) -> system (out) -> system (in) -> jack_iodelay (in) I see stable performance with the following result after a few seconds of "burn in". 218.905 frames 4.561 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 26 frames use 13 for the backend arguments -I and -O ?? Inv However after switching to the browser and writing this email then switching back again I see the following data: 33114.906 frames 689.894 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 32922 frames use 16461 for the backend arguments -I and -O ?? Switching back to the browser to write some more I see the a stable 4.561ms again and that has stayed stable after a couple of switches between browser/console. After more test the latency is definitely being affected by xorg and switching between apps but not every time. With only jack_iodelay running I see the cpu load hovering between 30 to 40%. With ecasound added to the graph I see cpu load hovering between 30 to 50%. Ecasound has not reported any underruns during this test. With PA included I had 32 underruns over night (approx 6 hours of running). The things I am now trying to rule out or trace: - Potential priority conflicts between jack and xorg (I'm running gnome3) - What causes erratic results with PA in the graph Suggestions welcome. -- Patrick Shirkey Boost Hardware Ltd From dlphillips at woh.rr.com Fri Sep 20 09:37:59 2013 From: dlphillips at woh.rr.com (Dave Phillips) Date: Fri, 20 Sep 2013 05:37:59 -0400 Subject: [LAU] end-user oriented info on OSC In-Reply-To: <523BF867.9040906@linuxuse.de> References: <523BF867.9040906@linuxuse.de> Message-ID: <523C1777.2070700@woh.rr.com> On 09/20/2013 03:25 AM, Hartmut Noack wrote: > Hello, > > I am searching for information, especially manuals and howtos on OSC > that address the end-user side. > > Imagine a musician, that uses Ardour and wants to use its OSC-capabilities. > > Do you know any howtos for people, who want to use a MIDI-controller to > send OSC to software under Linux? > > Especially I would be interested in informations how to use OSC > *without* using PD-patches. Or, if that is not available, anything to > download and simply open with PD that allows end-users without any > programming-skills to use OSC under Linux. Hi Hartmut, Old article but maybe helpful : http://www.linuxjournal.com/content/introduction-osc Best, dp > > best regards > _______________________________________________ > Linux-audio-user mailing list > Linux-audio-user at lists.linuxaudio.org > http://lists.linuxaudio.org/listinfo/linux-audio-user > From julien at mail.upb.de Fri Sep 20 09:50:12 2013 From: julien at mail.upb.de (Julien Claassen) Date: Fri, 20 Sep 2013 11:50:12 +0200 (CEST) Subject: [LAU] Music with Linux - Nepali Dub In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Hello James! I've listened to both versions. I'm not sure, which one I like better. there is a slight tendency towards yours. :-) I would have expected a little more delay on the snare. Occasionally you appeared to have foreseen this wish and granted it. :-) Well done. It has a very airy feeling. You really went with the song and its original atmosphere. Warm regards Julien ---------------------------------------- http://juliencoder.de/nama/music.html From harryhaaren at gmail.com Fri Sep 20 10:11:28 2013 From: harryhaaren at gmail.com (Harry van Haaren) Date: Fri, 20 Sep 2013 11:11:28 +0100 Subject: [LAU] Community Interaction and Working Together Message-ID: Hello all Users & Devs of linux-audio-land, Moving forward from the topic on Aeolus and forking projects, perhaps it is wise to look at how the community as a whole can grow from this situation: 1) It seems the frustration of forks is mainly due to lack of communication. 2) Had appropriate communication been in place, patches could have been merged. 3) If 1) and 2), then the community flourishes as a whole. In the Aeolus thread on LAD, Michel Dominique wrote (and I feel its relevant here): "That imply we must communicate more with each other" "I think this is a big problem, and not only related to Fons work, or the LAD, but to the whole community." The mailing list you're reading from now is one of the central hubs for the community: The -developers list is the perfect place to announce projects, forks, patches etc. The -users list is good for asking users and interested parties questions. I will try to announce more patches / code, to contribute upstream, and hopefully benefit the community. Cheers, -Harry -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From fons at linuxaudio.org Fri Sep 20 10:31:29 2013 From: fons at linuxaudio.org (Fons Adriaensen) Date: Fri, 20 Sep 2013 10:31:29 +0000 Subject: [LAU] Testing JACK and PA latency In-Reply-To: <46374.86.127.135.155.1379667546.squirrel@boosthardware.com> References: <36869.86.127.135.98.1379572479.squirrel@boosthardware.com> <39035.86.127.135.98.1379580371.squirrel@boosthardware.com> <20130919094210.GA9491@linuxaudio.org> <39846.86.127.135.98.1379585044.squirrel@boosthardware.com> <20130919104605.GC9491@linuxaudio.org> <43796.86.127.135.98.1379600507.squirrel@boosthardware.com> <41971.86.127.135.98.1379638668.squirrel@boosthardware.com> <46374.86.127.135.155.1379667546.squirrel@boosthardware.com> Message-ID: <20130920103129.GA19952@linuxaudio.org> On Fri, Sep 20, 2013 at 06:59:06PM +1000, Patrick Shirkey wrote: > 33114.906 frames 689.894 ms total roundtrip latency > extra loopback latency: 32922 frames > use 16461 for the backend arguments -I and -O ?? Note the '??', it means the measurement is not reliable, probably due to skipped cycles (i.e. phase discontinuity). Ciao, -- FA A world of exhaustive, reliable metadata would be an utopia. It's also a pipe-dream, founded on self-delusion, nerd hubris and hysterically inflated market opportunities. (Cory Doctorow) From ralf.mardorf at alice-dsl.net Fri Sep 20 10:38:25 2013 From: ralf.mardorf at alice-dsl.net (Ralf Mardorf) Date: Fri, 20 Sep 2013 12:38:25 +0200 Subject: [LAU] [LAD] Community Interaction and Working Together In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <1379673505.4368.144.camel@archlinux> On Fri, 2013-09-20 at 11:11 +0100, Harry van Haaren wrote: > 1) It seems the frustration of forks is mainly due to lack of > communication. IMO several people have got another impression, than you've got. Just one example from several mails, from different authors with seemingly another point of view: On Fri, 2013-09-20 at 10:40 +0100, Gordon JC Pearce wrote: On Thu, Sep 19, 2013 at 09:05:19PM +0000, Fons Adriaensen wrote: > > > > And that is entirely intentional. What do you expect ? Try > > and go to your whatever - baker, sports team, bar keeper... > > and tell them you can instantly improve what they do. Maybe > > they'll listen. But chances are 99.9% that they will tell you > > to learn your trade first and then come back. > > That's the height of arrogance right there, Fons. Are you really > *that* good? Harry, could you please post some links, when you have seen the frustration you're talking about? IMO two lists get spammed with a topic about a problem that doesn't exist. IMO the original thread and all it's sub-threads should be closed. 2 Cents, Ralf From jamesmstone at gmail.com Fri Sep 20 10:39:10 2013 From: jamesmstone at gmail.com (James Stone) Date: Fri, 20 Sep 2013 11:39:10 +0100 Subject: [LAU] Music with Linux - Nepali Dub In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Sep 20, 2013 10:50 AM, "Julien Claassen" wrote: > > Hello James! > I've listened to both versions. I'm not sure, which one I like better. there is a slight tendency towards yours. :-) I would have expected a little more delay on the snare. Occasionally you appeared to have foreseen this wish and granted it. :-) Well done. It has a very airy feeling. You really went with the song and its original atmosphere. Thanks Julien! Actually, both versions are "mine". The dub one is just the more recent. I know what you mean about the drums. They need more work in both versions. However, I found a lot of classic dub has surprisingly little delay on them. I thought they needed it in this track tho, and the changing delay times was intentional (and painstaking! ), although theystill not completely how I wanted them. The thing about the dub version is it really highlights how flat the drums sound in the original tho... more work needed there! James -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From pshirkey at boosthardware.com Fri Sep 20 10:41:10 2013 From: pshirkey at boosthardware.com (Patrick Shirkey) Date: Fri, 20 Sep 2013 20:41:10 +1000 (EST) Subject: [LAU] Testing JACK and PA latency In-Reply-To: <20130920103129.GA19952@linuxaudio.org> References: <36869.86.127.135.98.1379572479.squirrel@boosthardware.com> <39035.86.127.135.98.1379580371.squirrel@boosthardware.com> <20130919094210.GA9491@linuxaudio.org> <39846.86.127.135.98.1379585044.squirrel@boosthardware.com> <20130919104605.GC9491@linuxaudio.org> <43796.86.127.135.98.1379600507.squirrel@boosthardware.com> <41971.86.127.135.98.1379638668.squirrel@boosthardware.com> <46374.86.127.135.155.1379667546.squirrel@boosthardware.com> <20130920103129.GA19952@linuxaudio.org> Message-ID: <58990.86.127.135.155.1379673670.squirrel@boosthardware.com> On Fri, September 20, 2013 8:31 pm, Fons Adriaensen wrote: > On Fri, Sep 20, 2013 at 06:59:06PM +1000, Patrick Shirkey wrote: > >> 33114.906 frames 689.894 ms total roundtrip latency >> extra loopback latency: 32922 frames >> use 16461 for the backend arguments -I and -O ?? > > Note the '??', it means the measurement is not reliable, > probably due to skipped cycles (i.e. phase discontinuity). > xruns? -- Patrick Shirkey Boost Hardware Ltd From julien at mail.upb.de Fri Sep 20 11:08:40 2013 From: julien at mail.upb.de (Julien Claassen) Date: Fri, 20 Sep 2013 13:08:40 +0200 (CEST) Subject: [LAU] Some linux keyboard and bass jamming In-Reply-To: <20130920005032.GA5557@q400a.mobile.restivo.org> References: <20130920005032.GA5557@q400a.mobile.restivo.org> Message-ID: Hello Ken! I've been listening to the portion between 3:55 and 4:50. Interesting. I like the funk influence there. From the mean basslines to the cool clav and everything. The drums are interesting, but especially the bassdrum is very flat part of the time. It sounds like like a sneaker kicking a rotten salad. But the loops/rhythms and variations were good. What exactly was the context of this session? Clav-infectedly yours Julien ---------------------------------------- http://juliencoder.de/nama/music.html From harryhaaren at gmail.com Fri Sep 20 11:50:41 2013 From: harryhaaren at gmail.com (Harry van Haaren) Date: Fri, 20 Sep 2013 12:50:41 +0100 Subject: [LAU] [LAD] Community Interaction and Working Together In-Reply-To: <1379673505.4368.144.camel@archlinux> References: <1379673505.4368.144.camel@archlinux> Message-ID: On Fri, Sep 20, 2013 at 11:38 AM, Ralf Mardorf wrote: > Harry, could you please post some links, when you have seen the > frustration you're talking about? > I'd much prefer focus on improving from where we are: not highlighting where communication may have broken down. I'd also like to get feedback from users, about what tools are needed most: plugins, synths, effects? Yet-Another-DAW? If any of the above, please provide details / intended use-case. Cheers from a sunny Ireland, -Harry -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From linux at alextone.info Fri Sep 20 12:14:20 2013 From: linux at alextone.info (Alex) Date: Fri, 20 Sep 2013 14:14:20 +0200 Subject: [LAU] [LAD] Community Interaction and Working Together In-Reply-To: References: <1379673505.4368.144.camel@archlinux> Message-ID: <523C3C1C.9010807@alextone.info> On 09/20/2013 01:50 PM, Harry van Haaren wrote: > On Fri, Sep 20, 2013 at 11:38 AM, Ralf Mardorf > > wrote: > > Harry, could you please post some links, when you have seen the > frustration you're talking about? > > I'd much prefer focus on improving from where we are: not highlighting > where communication may have broken down. > > I'd also like to get feedback from users, about what tools are needed > most: plugins, synths, effects? Yet-Another-DAW? > If any of the above, please provide details / intended use-case. > > Cheers from a sunny Ireland, -Harry > > > _______________________________________________ > Linux-audio-dev mailing list > Linux-audio-dev at lists.linuxaudio.org > http://lists.linuxaudio.org/listinfo/linux-audio-dev I'm glad you asked! :) A fully functional, comprehensively tooled up (including keybinding functionality for as much as possible) jack midi sequencer, that doesn't do audio or plugins (we have decent apps for those already), but does midi......comprehensively. (and including properly functioning MMC, MTC, bank and patch management, a full set of keybinding functions for as much as possible, including navigation, folder tracks (containers) for handling a lot of tracks, a complete pianoroll toolset for input/edit/remove including bindings for things like toggle step input, just to name a few.....) And a gui that works, and saves position, size and midi clip values like CC lanes assigned per track that display in the pianoroll (1st violins track might have velocity/volume/pitchbend/modulation CC lanes, and tubas might only have volume and velocity, as an example) Did i mention keybinding functionality for as much as possible? And complete non-session-manager and OSC functionality? That should keep you busy for a while. :) Regards, Alex. From ralf.mardorf at alice-dsl.net Fri Sep 20 12:26:28 2013 From: ralf.mardorf at alice-dsl.net (Ralf Mardorf) Date: Fri, 20 Sep 2013 14:26:28 +0200 Subject: [LAU] [LAD] Community Interaction and Working Together In-Reply-To: References: <1379673505.4368.144.camel@archlinux> Message-ID: <1379679988.4368.170.camel@archlinux> On Fri, 2013-09-20 at 12:50 +0100, Harry van Haaren wrote: > I'd also like to get feedback from users, about what tools are needed > most: plugins, synths, effects? Yet-Another-DAW? IMO: New drivers for audio hardware and more often updates for some existing drivers. Kernel-rt longtime versions packages for all major distros that don't cause issues, such as graphic driver troubles. When reading musician forums: Seemingly many people are missing fashion software, such as auto-tune and all the stuff that Live FX does provide. Not a fashion, but for understandable reasons missing, but wanted by many musicians are orchestras and choirs like those EastWest stuff, synth like Alchemy etc. pp.. Especially for me: A new DAW, Qtractor with the precision and comfort of Ardour2, regarding to latency compensation and storing and restoring an audio session on what machine, from what directory ever, not to forget a cancel option for the editors. Ardour3 isn't what I'm looking for, it should provide a Qtractor like workflow, but I want exact enough latency compensation and even if Qtractor would be exact enough (it isn't yet), in addition it should be possible to switch between different latencies, also impossible when using Qtractor, the compensation is keept for the recorded latency when changing the latency. The way things are saved and restored for Qtracor is a real PITA and that it seems to be impossible to cancel changes, when leaving an editor. From harryhaaren at gmail.com Fri Sep 20 12:34:16 2013 From: harryhaaren at gmail.com (Harry van Haaren) Date: Fri, 20 Sep 2013 13:34:16 +0100 Subject: [LAU] [LAD] Community Interaction and Working Together In-Reply-To: <523C3C1C.9010807@alextone.info> References: <1379673505.4368.144.camel@archlinux> <523C3C1C.9010807@alextone.info> Message-ID: On Fri, Sep 20, 2013 at 1:14 PM, Alex wrote: > A jack midi sequencer comprehensively. > And a gui > Focusing on the whole: yes I also feel this is a tool that is needed. Request noted, -Harry -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From ralf.mardorf at alice-dsl.net Fri Sep 20 12:35:31 2013 From: ralf.mardorf at alice-dsl.net (Ralf Mardorf) Date: Fri, 20 Sep 2013 14:35:31 +0200 Subject: [LAU] [LAD] Community Interaction and Working Together In-Reply-To: <523C3C1C.9010807@alextone.info> References: <1379673505.4368.144.camel@archlinux> <523C3C1C.9010807@alextone.info> Message-ID: <1379680531.4368.174.camel@archlinux> On Fri, 2013-09-20 at 14:14 +0200, Alex wrote: > I'm glad you asked! :) > > A fully functional, comprehensively tooled up (including keybinding > functionality for as much as possible) jack midi sequencer, that doesn't > do audio or plugins (we have decent apps for those already), but does > midi......comprehensively. (and including properly functioning MMC, MTC, > bank and patch management, a full set of keybinding functions for as > much as possible, including navigation, folder tracks (containers) for > handling a lot of tracks, a complete pianoroll toolset for > input/edit/remove including bindings for things like toggle step input, > just to name a few.....) > > And a gui that works, and saves position, size and midi clip values like > CC lanes assigned per track that display in the pianoroll (1st violins > track might have velocity/volume/pitchbend/modulation CC lanes, and > tubas might only have volume and velocity, as an example) > > Did i mention keybinding functionality for as much as possible? > > And complete non-session-manager and OSC functionality? > > That should keep you busy for a while. :) I would like to get this too, but + audio recording ;). Especially a mute and unmute clip function, the most missing thing for Qtractor, the sequencer I'm using. And this mixer thingy Cubase for the Atari does provide, to set up real time hardware synth editors, that can be used by a sequencer track. Turning of running status send to hardware synth would be nice too. From harryhaaren at gmail.com Fri Sep 20 12:37:15 2013 From: harryhaaren at gmail.com (Harry van Haaren) Date: Fri, 20 Sep 2013 13:37:15 +0100 Subject: [LAU] [LAD] Community Interaction and Working Together In-Reply-To: <1379679988.4368.170.camel@archlinux> References: <1379673505.4368.144.camel@archlinux> <1379679988.4368.170.camel@archlinux> Message-ID: On Fri, Sep 20, 2013 at 1:26 PM, Ralf Mardorf wrote: > The way things are saved and restored for Qtracor is a real PITA and that > it seems to be impossible to cancel changes, when leaving an editor. > I see a QTractor feature request / bug report coming... -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From linux at alextone.info Fri Sep 20 12:41:46 2013 From: linux at alextone.info (Alex) Date: Fri, 20 Sep 2013 14:41:46 +0200 Subject: [LAU] [LAD] Community Interaction and Working Together In-Reply-To: <1379680531.4368.174.camel@archlinux> References: <1379673505.4368.144.camel@archlinux> <523C3C1C.9010807@alextone.info> <1379680531.4368.174.camel@archlinux> Message-ID: <523C428A.8020404@alextone.info> On 09/20/2013 02:35 PM, Ralf Mardorf wrote: > On Fri, 2013-09-20 at 14:14 +0200, Alex wrote: >> I'm glad you asked! :) >> >> A fully functional, comprehensively tooled up (including keybinding >> functionality for as much as possible) jack midi sequencer, that doesn't >> do audio or plugins (we have decent apps for those already), but does >> midi......comprehensively. (and including properly functioning MMC, MTC, >> bank and patch management, a full set of keybinding functions for as >> much as possible, including navigation, folder tracks (containers) for >> handling a lot of tracks, a complete pianoroll toolset for >> input/edit/remove including bindings for things like toggle step input, >> just to name a few.....) >> >> And a gui that works, and saves position, size and midi clip values like >> CC lanes assigned per track that display in the pianoroll (1st violins >> track might have velocity/volume/pitchbend/modulation CC lanes, and >> tubas might only have volume and velocity, as an example) >> >> Did i mention keybinding functionality for as much as possible? >> >> And complete non-session-manager and OSC functionality? >> >> That should keep you busy for a while. :) > I would like to get this too, but + audio recording ;). > > Especially a mute and unmute clip function, the most missing thing for > Qtractor, the sequencer I'm using. > > And this mixer thingy Cubase for the Atari does provide, to set up real > time hardware synth editors, that can be used by a sequencer track. > Turning of running status send to hardware synth would be nice too. > > _______________________________________________ > Linux-audio-user mailing list > Linux-audio-user at lists.linuxaudio.org > http://lists.linuxaudio.org/listinfo/linux-audio-user Ralf, we already have good audio apps (non-timeline, etc), and it's easy to port one to the other. Qtractor doesn't do jackmidi. Alex. From ralf.mardorf at alice-dsl.net Fri Sep 20 12:48:30 2013 From: ralf.mardorf at alice-dsl.net (Ralf Mardorf) Date: Fri, 20 Sep 2013 14:48:30 +0200 Subject: [LAU] [LAD] Community Interaction and Working Together In-Reply-To: References: <1379673505.4368.144.camel@archlinux> <1379679988.4368.170.camel@archlinux> Message-ID: <1379681310.4368.182.camel@archlinux> On Fri, 2013-09-20 at 13:37 +0100, Harry van Haaren wrote: > On Fri, Sep 20, 2013 at 1:26 PM, Ralf Mardorf > wrote: > The way things are saved and restored for Qtracor is a real > PITA and that it seems to be impossible to cancel changes, > when leaving an editor. > I see a QTractor feature request / bug report coming... No, I contributed for a long time as Qtractor tester and this request is years old, Rui is aware about it and explained that he focus other things, such as automation first. So there's no need to do it, because it's already done. That's why I neither Cc'ed to Rui, nor to qtractor-devel at lists.sourceforge.net . I really was very active with testing Qtractor, but when started and never finished a translation, my life situation changed. Fortunately somebody else did the translation. I don't have the time to do as much testing as in the past, so usually I stay with the packages provided by the distos I'm using and don't build it from SVN anymore, or at least do it very seldom. From ralf.mardorf at alice-dsl.net Fri Sep 20 13:18:02 2013 From: ralf.mardorf at alice-dsl.net (Ralf Mardorf) Date: Fri, 20 Sep 2013 15:18:02 +0200 Subject: [LAU] [LAD] Community Interaction and Working Together In-Reply-To: <60750.1379682694@vtx.ch> References: <60750.1379682694@vtx.ch> Message-ID: <1379683082.4368.192.camel@archlinux> On Fri, 2013-09-20 at 15:11 +0200, michel dominique wrote: > A monophonic real time note to MIDI converter. Rackarrak From rncbc at rncbc.org Fri Sep 20 14:25:07 2013 From: rncbc at rncbc.org (Rui Nuno Capela) Date: Fri, 20 Sep 2013 15:25:07 +0100 Subject: [LAU] [LAD] Community Interaction and Working Together In-Reply-To: <1379680531.4368.174.camel@archlinux> References: <1379673505.4368.144.camel@archlinux> <523C3C1C.9010807@alextone.info> <1379680531.4368.174.camel@archlinux> Message-ID: <523C5AC3.7050701@rncbc.org> On 09/20/2013 01:35 PM, Ralf Mardorf wrote: > On Fri, 2013-09-20 at 14:14 +0200, Alex wrote: >> I'm glad you asked! :) >> >> A fully functional, comprehensively tooled up (including keybinding >> functionality for as much as possible) jack midi sequencer, that doesn't >> do audio or plugins (we have decent apps for those already), but does >> midi......comprehensively. (and including properly functioning MMC, MTC, >> bank and patch management, a full set of keybinding functions for as >> much as possible, including navigation, folder tracks (containers) for >> handling a lot of tracks, a complete pianoroll toolset for >> input/edit/remove including bindings for things like toggle step input, >> just to name a few.....) >> >> And a gui that works, and saves position, size and midi clip values like >> CC lanes assigned per track that display in the pianoroll (1st violins >> track might have velocity/volume/pitchbend/modulation CC lanes, and >> tubas might only have volume and velocity, as an example) >> >> Did i mention keybinding functionality for as much as possible? >> >> And complete non-session-manager and OSC functionality? >> >> That should keep you busy for a while. :) > > I would like to get this too, but + audio recording ;). > > Especially a mute and unmute clip function, the most missing thing for > Qtractor, the sequencer I'm using. > yes i'm overly busy with some other things, now and then... discrete clip muting is still in the mighty qtractor backlog, as are many other exquisite features that could be addressed in a week-end or so... alas, i'm not in my old geekiest-teens anymore :) cheers -- rncbc aka Rui Nuno Capela rncbc at rncbc.org From ralf.mardorf at alice-dsl.net Fri Sep 20 15:09:35 2013 From: ralf.mardorf at alice-dsl.net (Ralf Mardorf) Date: Fri, 20 Sep 2013 17:09:35 +0200 Subject: [LAU] [LAD] Community Interaction and Working Together In-Reply-To: <523C5AC3.7050701@rncbc.org> References: <1379673505.4368.144.camel@archlinux> <523C3C1C.9010807@alextone.info> <1379680531.4368.174.camel@archlinux> <523C5AC3.7050701@rncbc.org> Message-ID: <1379689775.4368.199.camel@archlinux> On Fri, 2013-09-20 at 15:25 +0100, Rui Nuno Capela wrote: > i'm not in my old geekiest-teens anymore :) :D From fons at linuxaudio.org Fri Sep 20 15:12:59 2013 From: fons at linuxaudio.org (Fons Adriaensen) Date: Fri, 20 Sep 2013 15:12:59 +0000 Subject: [LAU] Testing JACK and PA latency In-Reply-To: <58990.86.127.135.155.1379673670.squirrel@boosthardware.com> References: <20130919094210.GA9491@linuxaudio.org> <39846.86.127.135.98.1379585044.squirrel@boosthardware.com> <20130919104605.GC9491@linuxaudio.org> <43796.86.127.135.98.1379600507.squirrel@boosthardware.com> <41971.86.127.135.98.1379638668.squirrel@boosthardware.com> <46374.86.127.135.155.1379667546.squirrel@boosthardware.com> <20130920103129.GA19952@linuxaudio.org> <58990.86.127.135.155.1379673670.squirrel@boosthardware.com> Message-ID: <20130920151259.GB19952@linuxaudio.org> On Fri, Sep 20, 2013 at 08:41:10PM +1000, Patrick Shirkey wrote: > > On Fri, September 20, 2013 8:31 pm, Fons Adriaensen wrote: > > On Fri, Sep 20, 2013 at 06:59:06PM +1000, Patrick Shirkey wrote: > > > >> 33114.906 frames 689.894 ms total roundtrip latency > >> extra loopback latency: 32922 frames > >> use 16461 for the backend arguments -I and -O ?? > > > > Note the '??', it means the measurement is not reliable, > > probably due to skipped cycles (i.e. phase discontinuity). > > > > > xruns? Assuming you're measuring a 'clean' channel, the ?? most probably mean a discontinuity in the signal seen by jack_delay. In the sense that part of signal was 'jumped over' - a short gap that preserves the timing would not have any effect. This happens when Jack skips one or more cycles, and this in turn can be the result of an xrun (also of other things, but not in this case). Is your Jack running RT ? Ciao, -- FA A world of exhaustive, reliable metadata would be an utopia. It's also a pipe-dream, founded on self-delusion, nerd hubris and hysterically inflated market opportunities. (Cory Doctorow) From harryhaaren at gmail.com Fri Sep 20 15:26:45 2013 From: harryhaaren at gmail.com (Harry van Haaren) Date: Fri, 20 Sep 2013 16:26:45 +0100 Subject: [LAU] [LAD] Community Interaction and Working Together In-Reply-To: References: <1379673505.4368.144.camel@archlinux> Message-ID: On Fri, Sep 20, 2013 at 4:18 PM, Brian Sorahan wrote: > I've been wishing for a free Reason-killer ever since starting to use > linux. I actually haven't used Reason since version 4-ish so that is my > reference point (I'm sure it is much more [powerful|bloated] now) > I've never had a proper go at Reason, but I know that Carla is a "rack" type plugin-host: perhaps combining that with Seq24 might get you quite far along? Anyway, noted! -Harry -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From ken at restivo.org Fri Sep 20 16:00:38 2013 From: ken at restivo.org (Ken Restivo) Date: Fri, 20 Sep 2013 09:00:38 -0700 Subject: [LAU] Some linux keyboard and bass jamming In-Reply-To: References: <20130920005032.GA5557@q400a.mobile.restivo.org> Message-ID: <20130920160038.GA20414@q400a.mobile.restivo.org> On Fri, Sep 20, 2013 at 01:08:40PM +0200, Julien Claassen wrote: > Hello Ken! > I've been listening to the portion between 3:55 and 4:50. > Interesting. I like the funk influence there. From the mean > basslines to the cool clav and everything. The drums are > interesting, but especially the bassdrum is very flat part of the > time. It sounds like like a sneaker kicking a rotten salad. But the > loops/rhythms and variations were good. > What exactly was the context of this session? > Clav-infectedly yours > Julien Glad you're enjoying it. This was part of a weekly live streaming radio broadcast which usually features DJ's, MC's, producers, and occasionally some live musicians. Spukkin goes light on the bass drum, I noticed, that's part of his sound, lots of complex percussion and drums and not a heavy kick. That makes it easy to do the kind of "winsheild wipers" polyrhythms I like to do (i.e. playing basslines and/or melodies in 5/4 or 6/4 over a 4/4 loops), though I'm pretty sure I kept it straight 4/4for most of this show. -ken From pshirkey at boosthardware.com Fri Sep 20 18:07:32 2013 From: pshirkey at boosthardware.com (Patrick Shirkey) Date: Sat, 21 Sep 2013 04:07:32 +1000 (EST) Subject: [LAU] Testing JACK and PA latency In-Reply-To: <20130920151259.GB19952@linuxaudio.org> References: <20130919094210.GA9491@linuxaudio.org> <39846.86.127.135.98.1379585044.squirrel@boosthardware.com> <20130919104605.GC9491@linuxaudio.org> <43796.86.127.135.98.1379600507.squirrel@boosthardware.com> <41971.86.127.135.98.1379638668.squirrel@boosthardware.com> <46374.86.127.135.155.1379667546.squirrel@boosthardware.com> <20130920103129.GA19952@linuxaudio.org> <58990.86.127.135.155.1379673670.squirrel@boosthardware.com> <20130920151259.GB19952@linuxaudio.org> Message-ID: <62502.86.127.135.155.1379700452.squirrel@boosthardware.com> On Sat, September 21, 2013 1:12 am, Fons Adriaensen wrote: > On Fri, Sep 20, 2013 at 08:41:10PM +1000, Patrick Shirkey wrote: >> >> On Fri, September 20, 2013 8:31 pm, Fons Adriaensen wrote: >> > On Fri, Sep 20, 2013 at 06:59:06PM +1000, Patrick Shirkey wrote: >> > >> >> 33114.906 frames 689.894 ms total roundtrip latency >> >> extra loopback latency: 32922 frames >> >> use 16461 for the backend arguments -I and -O ?? >> > >> > Note the '??', it means the measurement is not reliable, >> > probably due to skipped cycles (i.e. phase discontinuity). >> > >> >> >> xruns? > > Assuming you're measuring a 'clean' channel, the ?? most probably > mean a discontinuity in the signal seen by jack_delay. In the > sense that part of signal was 'jumped over' - a short gap that > preserves the timing would not have any effect. This happens > when Jack skips one or more cycles, and this in turn can be > the result of an xrun (also of other things, but not in this > case). Is your Jack running RT ? > I can hear the signal fine but I cannot hear or see the result of the signal after it comes back in the mic input. I could attempt to capture that part of the signal too for reference sake. If there are significant dropouts will that be the likely cause of the "??" I'm running jack with realtime capabilities but not a realtime kernel. It's just a standard debian install at this point. If anyone else has a fully tuned system that they know can do low latency with jack and can provide test results for jack+pa that would be very useful. -- Patrick Shirkey Boost Hardware Ltd From fons at linuxaudio.org Fri Sep 20 19:08:37 2013 From: fons at linuxaudio.org (Fons Adriaensen) Date: Fri, 20 Sep 2013 19:08:37 +0000 Subject: [LAU] Testing JACK and PA latency In-Reply-To: <62502.86.127.135.155.1379700452.squirrel@boosthardware.com> References: <20130919104605.GC9491@linuxaudio.org> <43796.86.127.135.98.1379600507.squirrel@boosthardware.com> <41971.86.127.135.98.1379638668.squirrel@boosthardware.com> <46374.86.127.135.155.1379667546.squirrel@boosthardware.com> <20130920103129.GA19952@linuxaudio.org> <58990.86.127.135.155.1379673670.squirrel@boosthardware.com> <20130920151259.GB19952@linuxaudio.org> <62502.86.127.135.155.1379700452.squirrel@boosthardware.com> Message-ID: <20130920190836.GA13127@linuxaudio.org> On Sat, Sep 21, 2013 at 04:07:32AM +1000, Patrick Shirkey wrote: > I can hear the signal fine but I cannot hear or see the result of the > signal after it comes back in the mic input. I could attempt to capture > that part of the signal too for reference sake. > > If there are significant dropouts will that be the likely cause of the "??" Depends on what you mean by 'dropouts' :-) > I'm running jack with realtime capabilities but not a realtime kernel. That should be fine. I haven't used a RT-patched kernel for years. The loop via system:playback -> cable -> system:capture is only there to give you the real round-trip latency, it doesn't have any importance for examining this problem. You could just send the signal from PA-sink directly to jack_delay. Try to record the signal coming back from the PA-sink, e.g. using timemachine. I'm pretty sure there will be discontinuities in the recorded waveform. Ciao, -- FA A world of exhaustive, reliable metadata would be an utopia. It's also a pipe-dream, founded on self-delusion, nerd hubris and hysterically inflated market opportunities. (Cory Doctorow) From zettberlin at linuxuse.de Fri Sep 20 20:20:35 2013 From: zettberlin at linuxuse.de (Hartmut Noack) Date: Fri, 20 Sep 2013 22:20:35 +0200 Subject: [LAU] end-user oriented info on OSC In-Reply-To: <523C1777.2070700@woh.rr.com> References: <523BF867.9040906@linuxuse.de> <523C1777.2070700@woh.rr.com> Message-ID: <523CAE13.2030301@linuxuse.de> Am 20.09.2013 11:37, schrieb Dave Phillips: > On 09/20/2013 03:25 AM, Hartmut Noack wrote: >> Hello, >> >> I am searching for information, especially manuals and howtos on OSC >> that address the end-user side. >> >> Imagine a musician, that uses Ardour and wants to use its OSC-capabilities. >> >> Do you know any howtos for people, who want to use a MIDI-controller to >> send OSC to software under Linux? >> >> Especially I would be interested in informations how to use OSC >> *without* using PD-patches. Or, if that is not available, anything to >> download and simply open with PD that allows end-users without any >> programming-skills to use OSC under Linux. > > Hi Hartmut, > > Old article but maybe helpful : > > http://www.linuxjournal.com/content/introduction-osc Thanks for the link, I have read it some time ago (like many of your articles ;-)) It gives a good explanation of OSC basics and has some interesting info for devs(and quite dev-like users) as well. But I search for manuals for end-users, that just want to follow a step by step howto to use their OSC-app on their Android device to control software like Ardour or AMS in Linux... For TouchOSC one can write custom setups, basically in some XML-dialect. I think I can do that but I do not know, how to make such a setup connect to, say Ardour or a DSSI-Synth... > > Best, > > dp > > > > >> >> best regards >> _______________________________________________ >> Linux-audio-user mailing list >> Linux-audio-user at lists.linuxaudio.org >> http://lists.linuxaudio.org/listinfo/linux-audio-user >> > > _______________________________________________ > Linux-audio-user mailing list > Linux-audio-user at lists.linuxaudio.org > http://lists.linuxaudio.org/listinfo/linux-audio-user > > From diego.simak at gmail.com Fri Sep 20 23:00:45 2013 From: diego.simak at gmail.com (Diego Simak) Date: Fri, 20 Sep 2013 20:00:45 -0300 Subject: [LAU] end-user oriented info on OSC In-Reply-To: <523CAE13.2030301@linuxuse.de> References: <523BF867.9040906@linuxuse.de> <523C1777.2070700@woh.rr.com> <523CAE13.2030301@linuxuse.de> Message-ID: > > For TouchOSC one can write custom setups, basically in some XML-dialect. > I think I can do that but I do not know, how to make such a setup > connect to, say Ardour or a DSSI-Synth... > maybe this can help you in some way http://lodediego.blogspot.com/2013/01/controlling-linux-plugins-using.html sorry for the bad english and the rough tech steps From ralf.mardorf at alice-dsl.net Sat Sep 21 05:53:16 2013 From: ralf.mardorf at alice-dsl.net (Ralf Mardorf) Date: Sat, 21 Sep 2013 07:53:16 +0200 Subject: [LAU] [Fwd: Re: [LAD] forking (was Re: Aeolus)] Message-ID: <1379742796.742.13.camel@archlinux> -------- Forwarded Message -------- From: Ralf To: linux-audio-dev at lists.linuxaudio.org Subject: Re: [LAD] forking (was Re: Aeolus) Date: Sat, 21 Sep 2013 07:40:42 +0200 Here is a statement of Maurizio M. Gavioli: https://github.com/mgavioli/oscAeolus/issues/1 My impression is that he didn't do something bad, that he has got no evil intention and that he is pleasant-natured, IOW what he seems to be a win for the community. However, I didn't read the mails from yesterday 21:35 to today. Perhaps I'll win new insights when reading them now and understand whats bad with Maurizio M. Gavioli and his fork. At the moment my impression is, that it's Fons fault to chose the wrong license and he tries to blame another man for his own mistake. Just an impression. I'll start reading now. From ralf.mardorf at alice-dsl.net Sat Sep 21 06:39:40 2013 From: ralf.mardorf at alice-dsl.net (Ralf Mardorf) Date: Sat, 21 Sep 2013 08:39:40 +0200 Subject: [LAU] [LAD] forking (was Re: Aeolus) In-Reply-To: <523D3857.3010703@web.de> References: <523B19D1.1070607@iem.at> <20130919154114.M14894@mh-freiburg.de> <20130919210519.GA24594@linuxaudio.org> <20130920195655.GC13127@linuxaudio.org> <20130920202412.GA3002@linuxaudio.org> <20130920212838.GB3002@linuxaudio.org> <1379743243.742.19.camel@archlinux> <523D3857.3010703@web.de> Message-ID: <1379745580.742.38.camel@archlinux> Thank you Hermann that I should shut up ;) while I'm right regarding to the link you posted: On Sat, 2013-09-21 at 08:10 +0200, hermann meyer wrote: > Ralf, please stop this. You seems to have no Idea about what the blame > is here. Read here, > > Why, When, and How to Fork an Open Source Project >From your link above: "Why Fork? Answer ? Because you cannot get the software to meet your needs any other way. There are different reasons that this might be the case. If the core developers, who have write-access to the source code, don?t accept your features or patches. If the core developers reject use cases or a direction that community members want." And now read what Fons Adriaensen wrote on Fri, 2013-09-20 at 19:35 +0000: > * A request to have a 'volume' control on each stop. > > * A request to make Aeolus start up with the stops etc. that > were in use the last time. > > Both are no-go. Aeolus is meant to emulate a pipe organ, including > the limits of a real one. It's not meant to be a backend to some > sequencer or notation software, or a general-purpose additive > synthesiser. Fons called others simple-minded if they don't respect his intention, while Maurizio M. Gavioli is sorry and not aware about offending the GPL: https://github.com/mgavioli/oscAeolus/issues/1 So you expect that Maurizio M. Gavioli should talk to Fons, after being called simple-minded? It's a shame and it should be forwarded to the FSF or Fons simply should stop contributing GPL'ed software. From ralf.mardorf at alice-dsl.net Sat Sep 21 07:17:58 2013 From: ralf.mardorf at alice-dsl.net (Ralf Mardorf) Date: Sat, 21 Sep 2013 09:17:58 +0200 Subject: [LAU] GPL under pressure Message-ID: <1379747878.742.59.camel@archlinux> My last words to and perhaps reading of the threads about the evil that someone forked a project from Fons, that was GPL'ed by Fons and nobody else. Nobody showed a violation of the GPL by Maurizio M. Gavioli, just a mistake he seemingly is willing to correct after I contacted him, something Fons could have done too. Humans tend to make mistakes. If Fons makes a mistake it's ok, if somebody else makes a mistake she/he is bad, should shut up, should stop forking a project, should be fired. Fons made a mistake, he chose the GPL, while he disagrees with the GPL. And now I read to often "please, please Fons, continue writing GPL'ed software, we will reinterpret the GPL for you". Fons is free to stop contributing or to continue contributing by using another license, but if he chose the GPL, he's the only one to blame and not Maurizio M. Gavioli. Calling him simple-minded (because he is one of those Fons was talking about, even while he didn't use Maurizio's name) is offending netiquette, not forking the project is offending netiquette. "Aeolus is meant to emulate a pipe organ, including the limits of a real one. It's not meant to be a backend to some sequencer or notation software, or a general-purpose additive synthesiser." - Fons Maurizio M. Gavioli seems to fork it, for usage with notation software. Any discussion about something that should be wrong with doing this, is a shame and does harm the GPL. Regards, Ralf From danmbox at gmail.com Sat Sep 21 07:26:10 2013 From: danmbox at gmail.com (Dan Muresan) Date: Sat, 21 Sep 2013 10:26:10 +0300 Subject: [LAU] [LAD] GPL under pressure In-Reply-To: <1379747878.742.59.camel@archlinux> References: <1379747878.742.59.camel@archlinux> Message-ID: If you provide a summary (even with your spin on it) please provide full quotes for everything you refer to. In particular provide the context for the "simple-minded" quote. Don't provide context only selectively. On 9/21/13, Ralf Mardorf wrote: > My last words to and perhaps reading of the threads about the evil that > someone forked a project from Fons, that was GPL'ed by Fons and nobody > else. > > Nobody showed a violation of the GPL by Maurizio M. Gavioli, just a > mistake he seemingly is willing to correct after I contacted him, > something Fons could have done too. Humans tend to make mistakes. If > Fons makes a mistake it's ok, if somebody else makes a mistake she/he is > bad, should shut up, should stop forking a project, should be fired. > > Fons made a mistake, he chose the GPL, while he disagrees with the GPL. > And now I read to often "please, please Fons, continue writing GPL'ed > software, we will reinterpret the GPL for you". > > Fons is free to stop contributing or to continue contributing by using > another license, but if he chose the GPL, he's the only one to blame and > not Maurizio M. Gavioli. Calling him simple-minded (because he is one of > those Fons was talking about, even while he didn't use Maurizio's name) > is offending netiquette, not forking the project is offending > netiquette. > > "Aeolus is meant to emulate a pipe organ, including the limits of a real > one. It's not meant to be a backend to some sequencer or notation > software, or a general-purpose additive synthesiser." - Fons > > Maurizio M. Gavioli seems to fork it, for usage with notation software. > Any discussion about something that should be wrong with doing this, is > a shame and does harm the GPL. > > Regards, > Ralf > > _______________________________________________ > Linux-audio-dev mailing list > Linux-audio-dev at lists.linuxaudio.org > http://lists.linuxaudio.org/listinfo/linux-audio-dev > From linuxaudio at showlabor.de Sat Sep 21 07:38:13 2013 From: linuxaudio at showlabor.de (Felix Homann) Date: Sat, 21 Sep 2013 09:38:13 +0200 Subject: [LAU] [LAD] GPL under pressure In-Reply-To: <1379747878.742.59.camel@archlinux> References: <1379747878.742.59.camel@archlinux> Message-ID: Am 21.09.2013 09:18 schrieb "Ralf Mardorf" : > > And now I read to often "please, please Fons, continue writing GPL'ed > software, we will reinterpret the GPL for you". > I can't remember having seen such comments in the original threads. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From ralf.mardorf at alice-dsl.net Sat Sep 21 07:40:08 2013 From: ralf.mardorf at alice-dsl.net (Ralf Mardorf) Date: Sat, 21 Sep 2013 09:40:08 +0200 Subject: [LAU] [LAD] GPL under pressure In-Reply-To: References: <1379747878.742.59.camel@archlinux> Message-ID: <1379749208.742.67.camel@archlinux> On Sat, 2013-09-21 at 10:26 +0300, Dan Muresan wrote: > If you provide a summary (even with your spin on it) please provide > full quotes for everything you refer to. In particular provide the > context for the "simple-minded" quote. Don't provide context only > selectively. My apologies, good that I still did read the mails regarding to this thread. I don't like to continue the discussion, but I will correct my mistake. The full quote is here: http://lists.linuxaudio.org/pipermail/linux-audio-dev/2013-September/034216.html The context still is the context, is the context, is the context and I guess that people followed the thread. Sorry again! All shorten quotes IMO were not shamming another content, but I might be wrong. All quotes in full length can be found in those archives: http://lists.linuxaudio.org/pipermail/linux-audio-user/ http://lists.linuxaudio.org/pipermail/linux-audio-dev/ and on github https://github.com/mgavioli/oscAeolus/issues/1 Regards, Ralf From ralf.mardorf at alice-dsl.net Sat Sep 21 07:45:37 2013 From: ralf.mardorf at alice-dsl.net (Ralf Mardorf) Date: Sat, 21 Sep 2013 09:45:37 +0200 Subject: [LAU] [LAD] GPL under pressure In-Reply-To: References: <1379747878.742.59.camel@archlinux> Message-ID: <1379749537.742.70.camel@archlinux> On Sat, 2013-09-21 at 09:38 +0200, Felix Homann wrote: > > Am 21.09.2013 09:18 schrieb "Ralf Mardorf" > : > > > > And now I read to often "please, please Fons, continue writing > GPL'ed > > software, we will reinterpret the GPL for you". > > > > I can't remember having seen such comments in the original threads. This isn't a quote, but it's my interpretation of some replies. Please, now I like to stop this discussion. Regards, Ralf From danmbox at gmail.com Sat Sep 21 07:47:20 2013 From: danmbox at gmail.com (Dan Muresan) Date: Sat, 21 Sep 2013 10:47:20 +0300 Subject: [LAU] [LAD] GPL under pressure In-Reply-To: <1379749208.742.67.camel@archlinux> References: <1379747878.742.59.camel@archlinux> <1379749208.742.67.camel@archlinux> Message-ID: As I said, when providing a **summary**, i.e. a text that people can read without interruption to make up their minds, please provide the quotations **in-text**, with full context (and, yes, perhaps with URLs). Do not provide in-text quotations selectively. You've included selected quotations in-text to support your points, while only alluding to other quotations without posting them. No, obvious reference links do not help. You're already making a case that few people will support. You might as least quote fairly instead of selectively, even if you put your spin on the whole exchange. On 9/21/13, Ralf Mardorf wrote: > On Sat, 2013-09-21 at 10:26 +0300, Dan Muresan wrote: >> If you provide a summary (even with your spin on it) please provide >> full quotes for everything you refer to. In particular provide the >> context for the "simple-minded" quote. Don't provide context only >> selectively. > > My apologies, good that I still did read the mails regarding to this > thread. I don't like to continue the discussion, but I will correct my > mistake. > > The full quote is here: > http://lists.linuxaudio.org/pipermail/linux-audio-dev/2013-September/034216.html > > The context still is the context, is the context, is the context and I > guess that people followed the thread. Sorry again! > > All shorten quotes IMO were not shamming another content, but I might be > wrong. All quotes in full length can be found in those archives: > > http://lists.linuxaudio.org/pipermail/linux-audio-user/ > http://lists.linuxaudio.org/pipermail/linux-audio-dev/ > > and on github > > https://github.com/mgavioli/oscAeolus/issues/1 > > Regards, > Ralf > > From ralf.mardorf at alice-dsl.net Sat Sep 21 07:52:11 2013 From: ralf.mardorf at alice-dsl.net (Ralf Mardorf) Date: Sat, 21 Sep 2013 09:52:11 +0200 Subject: [LAU] [LAD] GPL under pressure In-Reply-To: References: <1379747878.742.59.camel@archlinux> <1379749208.742.67.camel@archlinux> Message-ID: <1379749931.742.72.camel@archlinux> On Sat, 2013-09-21 at 10:47 +0300, Dan Muresan wrote: > As I said, when providing a **summary**, i.e. a text that people can > read without interruption to make up their minds, please provide the > quotations **in-text**, with full context (and, yes, perhaps with > URLs). Do not provide in-text quotations selectively. You've included > selected quotations in-text to support your points, while only > alluding to other quotations without posting them. > > No, obvious reference links do not help. > > You're already making a case that few people will support. You might > as least quote fairly instead of selectively, even if you put your > spin on the whole exchange. > > On 9/21/13, Ralf Mardorf wrote: > > On Sat, 2013-09-21 at 10:26 +0300, Dan Muresan wrote: > >> If you provide a summary (even with your spin on it) please provide > >> full quotes for everything you refer to. In particular provide the > >> context for the "simple-minded" quote. Don't provide context only > >> selectively. > > > > My apologies, good that I still did read the mails regarding to this > > thread. I don't like to continue the discussion, but I will correct my > > mistake. > > > > The full quote is here: > > http://lists.linuxaudio.org/pipermail/linux-audio-dev/2013-September/034216.html ^^^^^^^^^^^ ^^^^^^^^^^^ This is the text: [LAD] forking (was Re: Aeolus) Fons Adriaensen fons at linuxaudio.org Fri Sep 20 20:24:12 UTC 2013 Previous message: [LAD] forking (was Re: Aeolus) Next message: [LAD] forking (was Re: Aeolus) Messages sorted by: [ date ] [ thread ] [ subject ] [ author ] On Fri, Sep 20, 2013 at 10:04:57PM +0200, Felix Homann wrote: > Am 20.09.2013 21:56 schrieb "Fons Adriaensen" : > > > > On Fri, Sep 20, 2013 at 09:52:06PM +0200, Felix Homann wrote: > > > > > Would you mind Maurizio Gavioli to play around with your code in > private? > > > > No. > > > > > don't think so. So why do you mind him sharing his 'playground'? > > > > Why do you think I should feel the same about both ? > > > > Because of the things I have written and you didn't comment on :-) You mean this: > You might argue that he better not published his toying around. But then > again you possibly forced him to do so: Just imagine he gave a binary to > someone. Then by the license *you* have chosen for your code *he* is > *obliged* to share his code - no matter how good or worth publishing it is. I did not force him to anything. Giving a binary to anyone is *his* decision, not mine. And all that the original license obliges him to do in that case is to give the sources the same person. > A 'fork' on github is a convenient way to comply with GPL licenses. 'Convenient' is the key word here. Some people only think of what's 'convenient' to them, everything else is too much for their simple minds. Ciao, -- FA A world of exhaustive, reliable metadata would be an utopia. It's also a pipe-dream, founded on self-delusion, nerd hubris and hysterically inflated market opportunities. (Cory Doctorow) > > > > The context still is the context, is the context, is the context and I > > guess that people followed the thread. Sorry again! > > > > All shorten quotes IMO were not shamming another content, but I might be > > wrong. All quotes in full length can be found in those archives: > > > > http://lists.linuxaudio.org/pipermail/linux-audio-user/ > > http://lists.linuxaudio.org/pipermail/linux-audio-dev/ > > > > and on github > > > > https://github.com/mgavioli/oscAeolus/issues/1 > > > > Regards, > > Ralf > > > > > From ralf.mardorf at alice-dsl.net Sat Sep 21 10:00:08 2013 From: ralf.mardorf at alice-dsl.net (Ralf Mardorf) Date: Sat, 21 Sep 2013 12:00:08 +0200 Subject: [LAU] [Fwd: Re: [LAD] forking (was Re: Aeolus)] Message-ID: <1379757608.742.100.camel@archlinux> I want to chime in a last time. See the forwarded message. Please, talk to "mgavioli" and try to find a consensus. I've got the impression that this is possible. It's completely irrelevant what opinions we have got. _Neither anybodies opinion, nor mine is relevant and nothing more I wanted to say_! As so often: English isn't my native language, my English is completely broken. Is this understandable(?): "mgavioli" claims something and a presumption of innocence is good etiquette too. Isn't it? Or is it common sense to think the most worse first? Have a nice weekend! Ralf -------- Forwarded Message -------- From: Ralf Mardorf To: linux-audio-dev at lists.linuxaudio.org Subject: Re: [LAD] forking (was Re: Aeolus) Date: Sat, 21 Sep 2013 11:52:05 +0200 On Sat, 2013-09-21 at 08:52 +0000, John Rigg wrote: > On Sat, Sep 21, 2013 at 07:52:02AM +0200, Ralf Mardorf wrote: > > It's completely impossible to be on Fons site. When Fons has such a > > super-mind, why did he chose the GPL? Those simple-minded guy who forked > > Aeolus might have made a little mistake, but doesn't offend the licence. > > Ralf, please stop this straw man argument about the GPL. Fons is understandably > irritated by someone forking his project without prior discussion. It's a > question of etiquette, not licence terms, as has been pointed out repeatedly > in this thread. > > It isn't difficult to find out that Aeolus is currently maintained; all it > takes is a look at the README in the sources, which contains release dates. > The 2007 copyright date which I think was mentioned earlier (I'm not going to > re-read this whole sorry thread to confirm that) is the copyright date for > GPL 3, not Aeolus. Again, this stuff is not difficult to check. > > Another point: copyright and licence are separate things. It is possible to > violate a copyright while still complying with the GPL. Adding one's own > copyright notice to someone else's original work without making substantive > changes to the work may be such a violation (IANAL, so that's speculation). > > John Hi John, I won't discuss this anymore, even while I've got arguments for forgiving mistakes and finding a solution. Don't talk to me, talk to "mgavioli" at https://github.com/mgavioli/oscAeolus/issues/1 , explain him his mistake and see if he does offended/offences etiquette because he's evil, or because he made a mistake and what's his opinion about the "issue". All those threads perhaps are completely useless, when just talking to "mgavioli". He made a mistake? Ok! And now? Making it a drama while it might be easy to solve, by just talking to him? He might think he didn't made a mistake, so he perhaps won't contact somebody, but he perhaps will reply if Fons or you send a request. Why all this discussion with speculations instead of talking to the right person? "mgavioli" claims something and a presumption of innocence is good etiquette too. Isn't it? Or is it common sense to think the most worse first? Please, talk to "mgavioli" and try to find a consensus. Regards, Ralf From zettberlin at linuxuse.de Sat Sep 21 10:37:53 2013 From: zettberlin at linuxuse.de (Hartmut Noack) Date: Sat, 21 Sep 2013 12:37:53 +0200 Subject: [LAU] end-user oriented info on OSC In-Reply-To: References: <523BF867.9040906@linuxuse.de> <523C1777.2070700@woh.rr.com> <523CAE13.2030301@linuxuse.de> Message-ID: <523D7701.6020807@linuxuse.de> Am 21.09.2013 01:00, schrieb Diego Simak: >> >> For TouchOSC one can write custom setups, basically in some XML-dialect. >> I think I can do that but I do not know, how to make such a setup >> connect to, say Ardour or a DSSI-Synth... >> > > maybe this can help you in some way > > http://lodediego.blogspot.com/2013/01/controlling-linux-plugins-using.html Thanks a lot! This is exactly what I am out for. Even though I think, we can agree, that it is not so end-user oriented anyway ;-) So my impression lasts, that OSC my be implemented in many apps under Linux but to be of use for the average musician is still some way to go.... best regards HZN > > sorry for the bad english and the rough tech steps > > From zettberlin at linuxuse.de Sat Sep 21 11:17:53 2013 From: zettberlin at linuxuse.de (Hartmut Noack) Date: Sat, 21 Sep 2013 13:17:53 +0200 Subject: [LAU] [LAD] Community Interaction and Working Together In-Reply-To: References: <1379673505.4368.144.camel@archlinux> Message-ID: <523D8061.80607@linuxuse.de> Am 20.09.2013 13:50, schrieb Harry van Haaren: > On Fri, Sep 20, 2013 at 11:38 AM, Ralf Mardorf > wrote: > >> Harry, could you please post some links, when you have seen the >> frustration you're talking about? >> > I'd much prefer focus on improving from where we are: not highlighting > where communication may have broken down. > > I'd also like to get feedback from users, about what tools are needed most: > plugins, synths, effects? Yet-Another-DAW? To be perfectly honest: I am fine with what is available. Anyway in most of the available gems there is room for improvement: 1.) Stability, everything should be rock solid 2.) Consistency such as: a preset stored in Ardour for a Calf-Synth should be available also when I run that synth as a standalone or in Qtractor and of course it should be restored reliably whenever I open a session in which I had set up this preset before. And there should be bridging plugins to connect any LV2, LinuxVST, DSSI or any other thinkable plug in to any host(that is: to use a DSSI-synth in Ardour, there should be some LV2-meta host plugin, that can load DSSI and provide a connection to Ardours LV2-interface. This may be on the expense of performance but I wuld not care for some more cycles or MB RAM when I could run Whysynth in Ardour. 3.) Better connection to the outside world, especially to controllers like TouchOSC and good tools to set up and store such connections consistently. I think, these things would be interesting for many, now pleas let me utter a little wish of my own ;-) I'd really like to see a new Wav-Editor that: - works in real time like Ardour but offers some offline-stuff like Audacity too(especially for noise-reduction and the like) - offers time stretching at least in the quality of SND but with a nice interface as Rezound used to have it. - offers real time seamless looping with the ability to change the loop while it is being played, as Rezound once offered - offers drawing tools for waveforms as Audacity has - maybe has some of the virtues to analyse material as Sonic Visualiser has (especially note-recognition and wave to MIDI capabilities). And if such a beast would have some interface to Ardour, that allows to manipulate regions while Ardour is running, it would upgrade from "just great" to "absolutely awsome" ;-) just my 2c... Ohhhh before I forgot! Please keep maintaining Alsa Modular. I think, it is one of the most capable application in the field of make your own instrument that I ever have seen and in contrast to some others it really works... > If any of the above, please provide details / intended use-case. > > Cheers from a sunny Ireland, -Harry Thanks for asking, Harry from the ill weathered nether of saxony ;-) > > > > _______________________________________________ > Linux-audio-user mailing list > Linux-audio-user at lists.linuxaudio.org > http://lists.linuxaudio.org/listinfo/linux-audio-user > From pshirkey at boosthardware.com Sat Sep 21 11:26:58 2013 From: pshirkey at boosthardware.com (Patrick Shirkey) Date: Sat, 21 Sep 2013 21:26:58 +1000 (EST) Subject: [LAU] Testing JACK and PA latency In-Reply-To: <20130920190836.GA13127@linuxaudio.org> References: <20130919104605.GC9491@linuxaudio.org> <43796.86.127.135.98.1379600507.squirrel@boosthardware.com> <41971.86.127.135.98.1379638668.squirrel@boosthardware.com> <46374.86.127.135.155.1379667546.squirrel@boosthardware.com> <20130920103129.GA19952@linuxaudio.org> <58990.86.127.135.155.1379673670.squirrel@boosthardware.com> <20130920151259.GB19952@linuxaudio.org> <62502.86.127.135.155.1379700452.squirrel@boosthardware.com> <20130920190836.GA13127@linuxaudio.org> Message-ID: <64489.86.127.135.155.1379762818.squirrel@boosthardware.com> On Sat, September 21, 2013 5:08 am, Fons Adriaensen wrote: > On Sat, Sep 21, 2013 at 04:07:32AM +1000, Patrick Shirkey wrote: > >> I can hear the signal fine but I cannot hear or see the result of the >> signal after it comes back in the mic input. I could attempt to capture >> that part of the signal too for reference sake. >> >> If there are significant dropouts will that be the likely cause of the >> "??" > > Depends on what you mean by 'dropouts' :-) > Are there competing definitions these days? >> I'm running jack with realtime capabilities but not a realtime kernel. > > That should be fine. I haven't used a RT-patched kernel for years. > > The loop via system:playback -> cable -> system:capture is only > there to give you the real round-trip latency, it doesn't have > any importance for examining this problem. You could just send > the signal from PA-sink directly to jack_delay. > In this case PA is not in the loop. However I am running the system at 64 frames/period and it is an onboard hda_intel chipset so I am not expecting miracles. > Try to record the signal coming back from the PA-sink, e.g. using > timemachine. I'm pretty sure there will be discontinuities in the > recorded waveform. > I can hear the signal coming out of the speakers. I can't hear or see it easily once it has been returned into the system again via the mic. My ears could be deceiving me though. Does anyone have another suggestion for how to accurately monitor audio discontinuities in realtime so I can rule them out or tweak the system until they are no longer occurring? zita-scope perhaps? Regarding scripting the test procedure. Basically start up jack at varying period sizes and run the test system for x amount of time (minimum of 10 mins). Collate the details returned by the console logs and parse them into a report. Number of nodes in the graph Average latency Number of xruns Number of changes to the latency Total number of x latency recorded Number of xruns during x latency CPU load during x latency Processes running during x latency and CPU load for each process What I am missing from the report is latency between each node in the graph. I think jack_iodelay could be extended to provide a passthrough for an input signal pulse and send a response at another frequency using the input pulse as a trigger then timestamp the signals and report the individual latencies. Maybe this could be done with a single instance so that they all share the same clock and logging mechanism? ex. jack_delay --ports=4 The graph would then look like this: jack_delay (out1) -> pa_source (in) -> jack_delay(in2) -> jack_delay (out2) -> ecasound (in) -> ecasound (out) -> jack_delay (in3) -> jack_delay (out3) -> pa_sink (out) -> jack_delay (in4) -> jack_delay (out4) -> system_out -> system_in -> jack_delay (in1) Obviously sharing a port of jack_delay between JACK and PA is going to be a mother trucker to implement and is probably the most painful method, so if there are other more effective and simpler methods to get the data out of the system it would be very helpful to know about them. -- Patrick Shirkey Boost Hardware Ltd From diego.simak at gmail.com Sat Sep 21 11:55:20 2013 From: diego.simak at gmail.com (Diego Simak) Date: Sat, 21 Sep 2013 08:55:20 -0300 Subject: [LAU] end-user oriented info on OSC In-Reply-To: <523D7701.6020807@linuxuse.de> References: <523BF867.9040906@linuxuse.de> <523C1777.2070700@woh.rr.com> <523CAE13.2030301@linuxuse.de> <523D7701.6020807@linuxuse.de> Message-ID: > Thanks a lot! This is exactly what I am out for. Even though I think, we > can agree, that it is not so end-user oriented anyway ;-) good to know that this helped you > > So my impression lasts, that OSC my be implemented in many apps under > Linux but to be of use for the average musician is still some way to go.... > I think it will depend if you know the OSC syntax and commands that are actually implemented in the host (Carla/DSSI/Non*/Ingen/etc,etc,etc,) and the flexibility to create customized messages in the application. Good documentation for OSC syntax and commands is a must in this case. I know that touchOSC for example now allows to create custom layouts for Android. you can create a custom layout to send OSC commands with the required commands, for example. From ralf.mardorf at alice-dsl.net Sat Sep 21 13:27:17 2013 From: ralf.mardorf at alice-dsl.net (Ralf Mardorf) Date: Sat, 21 Sep 2013 15:27:17 +0200 Subject: [LAU] Just an information about the state of affairs - Re: [LAD] forking (was Re: Aeolus) In-Reply-To: References: <523B19D1.1070607@iem.at> <20130919154114.M14894@mh-freiburg.de> <20130919210519.GA24594@linuxaudio.org> <20130920195655.GC13127@linuxaudio.org> <20130920202412.GA3002@linuxaudio.org> <20130920212838.GB3002@linuxaudio.org> <20130920220606.GC3002@linuxaudio.org> Message-ID: <1379770037.742.168.camel@archlinux> On Sat, 2013-09-21 at 14:42 +0300, Dan Muresan wrote: > Fons, one big problem is that the Muse page > (http://www.muse-sequencer.org/index.php/Aeolus) shows in Google > results above your page for various relevant searches ("aeolus organ", > "aeolus synth" and several). > > The second big problem is that the Muse page links to a non-existent > domain for its "official Aeolus" page > (http://www.kokkinizita.net/linuxaudio/aeolus) > > I see that the actual page is > http://kokkinizita.linuxaudio.org/linuxaudio/aeolus/index.html > > Did you use to host Aeolus at a domain that was subsequently lost? It > would help everybody to go around and update the various links around > the intertubes to a domain in existence; I'm sure Google will give the > "true" homepage appropriate link juice soon enough. The fork now is deleted by Maurizio M. Gavioli from github. He sent me a private mail and explained that it was experimental and rather collateral to his interests, so it is not a great loss neither for him nor, obviously, for the community. So this "issue" is "solved". Regards, Ralf PS: I'm sorry to hear that it ended like this. From danmbox at gmail.com Sat Sep 21 13:36:45 2013 From: danmbox at gmail.com (Dan Muresan) Date: Sat, 21 Sep 2013 16:36:45 +0300 Subject: [LAU] [LAD] Just an information about the state of affairs - Re: forking (was Re: Aeolus) In-Reply-To: <1379770037.742.168.camel@archlinux> References: <523B19D1.1070607@iem.at> <20130919154114.M14894@mh-freiburg.de> <20130919210519.GA24594@linuxaudio.org> <20130920195655.GC13127@linuxaudio.org> <20130920202412.GA3002@linuxaudio.org> <20130920212838.GB3002@linuxaudio.org> <20130920220606.GC3002@linuxaudio.org> <1379770037.742.168.camel@archlinux> Message-ID: M. Gavioli also sent me a private e-mail. He sounded like he was worried about the community going after him (possibly legally I guess). This is not a good outcome, regardless of intentions. But no, the issue of link placement and of bad links from Muse is not solved. Only Fons can solve it (he can also enlighten us as to the history of the Aeolus homepage). On 9/21/13, Ralf Mardorf wrote: > On Sat, 2013-09-21 at 14:42 +0300, Dan Muresan wrote: >> Fons, one big problem is that the Muse page >> (http://www.muse-sequencer.org/index.php/Aeolus) shows in Google >> results above your page for various relevant searches ("aeolus organ", >> "aeolus synth" and several). >> >> The second big problem is that the Muse page links to a non-existent >> domain for its "official Aeolus" page >> (http://www.kokkinizita.net/linuxaudio/aeolus) >> >> I see that the actual page is >> http://kokkinizita.linuxaudio.org/linuxaudio/aeolus/index.html >> >> Did you use to host Aeolus at a domain that was subsequently lost? It >> would help everybody to go around and update the various links around >> the intertubes to a domain in existence; I'm sure Google will give the >> "true" homepage appropriate link juice soon enough. > > The fork now is deleted by Maurizio M. Gavioli from github. He sent me a > private mail and explained that it was experimental and rather > collateral to his interests, so it is not a great loss neither for him > nor, obviously, for the community. > > So this "issue" is "solved". > > Regards, > Ralf > > PS: I'm sorry to hear that it ended like this. > > _______________________________________________ > Linux-audio-dev mailing list > Linux-audio-dev at lists.linuxaudio.org > http://lists.linuxaudio.org/listinfo/linux-audio-dev > From pianolivier at gmail.com Sat Sep 21 14:54:11 2013 From: pianolivier at gmail.com (olivier) Date: Sat, 21 Sep 2013 16:54:11 +0200 Subject: [LAU] [LAD] Just an information about the state of affairs - Re: forking (was Re: Aeolus) In-Reply-To: References: <523B19D1.1070607@iem.at> <20130919154114.M14894@mh-freiburg.de> <20130919210519.GA24594@linuxaudio.org> <20130920195655.GC13127@linuxaudio.org> <20130920202412.GA3002@linuxaudio.org> <20130920212838.GB3002@linuxaudio.org> <20130920220606.GC3002@linuxaudio.org> <1379770037.742.168.camel@archlinux> Message-ID: His website moved in april 2011 if I recall correctly. I'm pretty sure Fons announced it here. oliv' On 21 September 2013 15:36, Dan Muresan wrote: > M. Gavioli also sent me a private e-mail. He sounded like he was > worried about the community going after him (possibly legally I > guess). This is not a good outcome, regardless of intentions. > > But no, the issue of link placement and of bad links from Muse is not > solved. Only Fons can solve it (he can also enlighten us as to the > history of the Aeolus homepage). > > On 9/21/13, Ralf Mardorf wrote: > > On Sat, 2013-09-21 at 14:42 +0300, Dan Muresan wrote: > >> Fons, one big problem is that the Muse page > >> (http://www.muse-sequencer.org/index.php/Aeolus) shows in Google > >> results above your page for various relevant searches ("aeolus organ", > >> "aeolus synth" and several). > >> > >> The second big problem is that the Muse page links to a non-existent > >> domain for its "official Aeolus" page > >> (http://www.kokkinizita.net/linuxaudio/aeolus) > >> > >> I see that the actual page is > >> http://kokkinizita.linuxaudio.org/linuxaudio/aeolus/index.html > >> > >> Did you use to host Aeolus at a domain that was subsequently lost? It > >> would help everybody to go around and update the various links around > >> the intertubes to a domain in existence; I'm sure Google will give the > >> "true" homepage appropriate link juice soon enough. > > > > The fork now is deleted by Maurizio M. Gavioli from github. He sent me a > > private mail and explained that it was experimental and rather > > collateral to his interests, so it is not a great loss neither for him > > nor, obviously, for the community. > > > > So this "issue" is "solved". > > > > Regards, > > Ralf > > > > PS: I'm sorry to hear that it ended like this. > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Linux-audio-dev mailing list > > Linux-audio-dev at lists.linuxaudio.org > > http://lists.linuxaudio.org/listinfo/linux-audio-dev > > > _______________________________________________ > Linux-audio-dev mailing list > Linux-audio-dev at lists.linuxaudio.org > http://lists.linuxaudio.org/listinfo/linux-audio-dev > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From ralf.mardorf at alice-dsl.net Sat Sep 21 14:57:46 2013 From: ralf.mardorf at alice-dsl.net (Ralf Mardorf) Date: Sat, 21 Sep 2013 16:57:46 +0200 Subject: [LAU] [LAD] Just an information about the state of affairs - Re: forking (was Re: Aeolus) In-Reply-To: References: <523B19D1.1070607@iem.at> <20130919154114.M14894@mh-freiburg.de> <20130919210519.GA24594@linuxaudio.org> <20130920195655.GC13127@linuxaudio.org> <20130920202412.GA3002@linuxaudio.org> <20130920212838.GB3002@linuxaudio.org> <20130920220606.GC3002@linuxaudio.org> <1379770037.742.168.camel@archlinux> Message-ID: <1379775466.742.186.camel@archlinux> On Sat, 2013-09-21 at 16:36 +0300, Dan Muresan wrote: > M. Gavioli also sent me a private e-mail. He sounded like he was > worried about the community going after him (possibly legally I > guess). This is not a good outcome, regardless of intentions. > > But no, the issue of link placement and of bad links from Muse is not > solved. Only Fons can solve it (he can also enlighten us as to the > history of the Aeolus homepage). "Aeolus is a pipe organ emulator written by Fons Adriaensen. It was released as free software (GPL license). This page mainly tries to be a central place to concentrate resources related to Aeolus. It is a wiki, but for spamming reasons you need an account to log in. Ask for an account on the mailing list if you want to contribute." - http://www.muse-sequencer.org/index.php/Aeolus Are there other links that need a fix, or is it just this page? Dead links can happen and can be fixed by those who are lamenting about the broken links. But indeed, I also won the impression that it's wanted to discourage people to make forks. "The community" seem to be a few heads who seem to prefer to blame people for mistakes and then never forgive a single mistake and the next will be wining about to less developers and about nobody contributing. But the real community is larger than just LAU and LAD and ALSA and some people who are not welcome here, are welcome on other lists. Mailing lists can be found here: http://www.muse-sequencer.org/index.php/Muse_ml If somebody should dislike the outdated link/s and knows the good links, then why doesn't this person fix the link/s? In theory I would be willing to do it, but I won't do it, because I don't want to make a mistake. It's much too precarious and in addition I'm not aware about all the broken links. When the links are fixed, than this fork would be ok for the community or would there still be one and another issue? _Again_ I don't want to discuss this, but help to solve it. Links can be fixed. Other issues perhaps can be solved too, even if somebody should have done something wrong in the first place, like not reading the correct README. From fons at linuxaudio.org Sat Sep 21 19:32:56 2013 From: fons at linuxaudio.org (Fons Adriaensen) Date: Sat, 21 Sep 2013 19:32:56 +0000 Subject: [LAU] [LAD] Just an information about the state of affairs - Re: forking (was Re: Aeolus) In-Reply-To: References: <20130920195655.GC13127@linuxaudio.org> <20130920202412.GA3002@linuxaudio.org> <20130920212838.GB3002@linuxaudio.org> <20130920220606.GC3002@linuxaudio.org> <1379770037.742.168.camel@archlinux> Message-ID: <20130921193255.GA17886@linuxaudio.org> On Sat, Sep 21, 2013 at 04:36:45PM +0300, Dan Muresan wrote: > M. Gavioli also sent me a private e-mail. He sounded like he was > worried about the community going after him (possibly legally I > guess). This is not a good outcome, regardless of intentions. Indeed not. I'll take care of this. Maurizio Gavioli has nothing to fear, at least not from me. Nor do I consider him to be be 'simple minded' as was suggested, on the contrary. Meanhwile I have removed all references to the mailing lists hosted by muse-sequencer, to the wiki (which resulted in a 404 when I tried it yesterday), and some other dead links from my website. For any enquiries, discussions, or whatever issues regarding Aeolus please just use the LAU or LAD mailing list which I read (almost) daily. Ciao, -- FA A world of exhaustive, reliable metadata would be an utopia. It's also a pipe-dream, founded on self-delusion, nerd hubris and hysterically inflated market opportunities. (Cory Doctorow) From ralf.mardorf at alice-dsl.net Sat Sep 21 19:57:00 2013 From: ralf.mardorf at alice-dsl.net (Ralf Mardorf) Date: Sat, 21 Sep 2013 21:57:00 +0200 Subject: [LAU] [LAD] Just an information about the state of affairs - Re: forking (was Re: Aeolus) In-Reply-To: <20130921193255.GA17886@linuxaudio.org> References: <20130920195655.GC13127@linuxaudio.org> <20130920202412.GA3002@linuxaudio.org> <20130920212838.GB3002@linuxaudio.org> <20130920220606.GC3002@linuxaudio.org> <1379770037.742.168.camel@archlinux> <20130921193255.GA17886@linuxaudio.org> Message-ID: <1379793420.742.245.camel@archlinux> On Sat, 2013-09-21 at 19:32 +0000, Fons Adriaensen wrote: > On Sat, Sep 21, 2013 at 04:36:45PM +0300, Dan Muresan wrote: > > > M. Gavioli also sent me a private e-mail. He sounded like he was > > worried about the community going after him (possibly legally I > > guess). This is not a good outcome, regardless of intentions. > > Indeed not. I'll take care of this. Maurizio Gavioli has nothing > to fear, at least not from me. Nor do I consider him to be be > 'simple minded' as was suggested, on the contrary. He read all mails by himself, nobody commented the mails in the archive for him or sent him manipulative, incomplete quoted mails. As a result he removes his fork from github. There is clear hostility against him, when reading all the mails. Sure, now it is misinterpretation of the content of all those mails. You the OP, Fons, didn't contact him, but started with reproaches [1]. Now that the fork is dead, it's unfair to claim there never was hostility. Btw. not all mails are hostile against him, but terrifying many mails. [1] "Hello all, It has come to my attention that there are ATM at least two 'forks' of Aeolus. The first by the MuseScore team, the second by one Maurizio Gavioli. Neither of them even had the decency to let me know of their work, and both are taking Aeolus in a direction I do not approve of. Gavioli has even added his 'copyright' to the sources of the libraries that Aeolus depends on but which are not part of its source distribution. Apparently the intention is to release incompatible versions of those as well. If this is typical for the attitude taken by the Linux Audio community then my motivation to contribute to it will take a serious blow. As announced previously, there will be a fully reworked release of Aeolus next year (on the occasion of its 10th birthday). Apart from major improvements to the audio code it will be completely OSC controlled. None of this will be compatible with the forks of course, they'll find themselves instantly obsolete. And I will make sure that this sort of thing won't happen again, even if that means a more restrictive license. Ciao, -- FA A world of exhaustive, reliable metadata would be an utopia. It's also a pipe-dream, founded on self-delusion, nerd hubris and hysterically inflated market opportunities. (Cory Doctorow)" - http://lists.linuxaudio.org/pipermail/linux-audio-user/2013-September/094484.html From linuxaudio at showlabor.de Sun Sep 22 09:14:25 2013 From: linuxaudio at showlabor.de (Felix Homann) Date: Sun, 22 Sep 2013 11:14:25 +0200 Subject: [LAU] [LAD] Just an information about the state of affairs - Re: forking (was Re: Aeolus) In-Reply-To: <20130921193255.GA17886@linuxaudio.org> References: <20130920195655.GC13127@linuxaudio.org> <20130920202412.GA3002@linuxaudio.org> <20130920212838.GB3002@linuxaudio.org> <20130920220606.GC3002@linuxaudio.org> <1379770037.742.168.camel@archlinux> <20130921193255.GA17886@linuxaudio.org> Message-ID: Am 21.09.2013 21:33 schrieb "Fons Adriaensen" : > > On Sat, Sep 21, 2013 at 04:36:45PM +0300, Dan Muresan wrote: > > > M. Gavioli also sent me a private e-mail. He sounded like he was > > worried about the community going after him (possibly legally I > > guess). This is not a good outcome, regardless of intentions. > > Indeed not. I'll take care of this. Maurizio Gavioli has nothing > to fear, at least not from me. Nor do I consider him to be be > 'simple minded' as was suggested, on the contrary. > Fons, I think you should still clarify your position on using your code under the terms of the GPL you have chosen. If you don't want your code to be used under those terms, please change the license. I got the impression that your intentions might be better represented by something like the Microsoft Reference License. To clarify: I'm fine with whatever license you choose. It is your code! I would just like to prevent another storm like this just because the license you chose does not match your intentions. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From ralf.mardorf at alice-dsl.net Sun Sep 22 10:30:53 2013 From: ralf.mardorf at alice-dsl.net (Ralf Mardorf) Date: Sun, 22 Sep 2013 12:30:53 +0200 Subject: [LAU] ayyi Message-ID: <1379845853.742.318.camel@archlinux> Hi :) there seems to be no info about possible conflicts between ardourd and an already existing Ardour install. Before I install ayyi I want to know if it could cause issues. Regarding to no output for [rocketmouse at archlinux ayyi]$ pacman -Ql ardour | grep ardourd I suspect at least no issues for a parallel Ardour2 install. [rocketmouse at archlinux ayyi]$ pacman -Q ardour ardour 2.8.16-1 [rocketmouse at archlinux ayyi]$ cat ardourd-0.1.10/README Please see the Ardour web site at http://ardour.org/ for all documentation.. For information on building ardour: http://ardour.org/building. Regards, Ralf PS: When using http://www.ayyi.org/contact I get: warning: mail() has been disabled for security reasons in /home/orfordo/public_html/ayyi.org/includes/mail.inc on line 193. Unable to send e-mail. Please contact the site admin, if the problem persists. Your message has been sent. From ralf.mardorf at alice-dsl.net Sun Sep 22 11:13:56 2013 From: ralf.mardorf at alice-dsl.net (Ralf Mardorf) Date: Sun, 22 Sep 2013 13:13:56 +0200 Subject: [LAU] ayyi In-Reply-To: <1379845853.742.318.camel@archlinux> References: <1379845853.742.318.camel@archlinux> Message-ID: <1379848436.742.323.camel@archlinux> [rocketmouse at archlinux ardourd-0.1.10]$ ./waf clear Waf: The wscript in '/usr/src/ayyi/ardourd-0.1.10' is unreadable Traceback (most recent call last): File "/usr/src/ayyi/ardourd-0.1.10/.waf3-1.6.7-7ac5ae1e6f7d23162cddca5e95609c76/waflib/Scripting.py", line 85, in waf_entry_point set_main_module(Context.run_dir+os.sep+Context.WSCRIPT_FILE) File "/usr/src/ayyi/ardourd-0.1.10/.waf3-1.6.7-7ac5ae1e6f7d23162cddca5e95609c76/waflib/Scripting.py", line 109, in set_main_module Context.g_module=Context.load_module(file_path) File "/usr/src/ayyi/ardourd-0.1.10/.waf3-1.6.7-7ac5ae1e6f7d23162cddca5e95609c76/waflib/Context.py", line 269, in load_module exec(compile(code,path,'exec'),module.__dict__) File "/usr/src/ayyi/ardourd-0.1.10/wscript", line 138 print 'config=' + str(config) ^ SyntaxError: invalid syntax [rocketmouse at archlinux ardourd-0.1.10]$ ./waf configure Waf: The wscript in '/usr/src/ayyi/ardourd-0.1.10' is unreadable Traceback (most recent call last): File "/usr/src/ayyi/ardourd-0.1.10/.waf3-1.6.7-7ac5ae1e6f7d23162cddca5e95609c76/waflib/Scripting.py", line 85, in waf_entry_point set_main_module(Context.run_dir+os.sep+Context.WSCRIPT_FILE) File "/usr/src/ayyi/ardourd-0.1.10/.waf3-1.6.7-7ac5ae1e6f7d23162cddca5e95609c76/waflib/Scripting.py", line 109, in set_main_module Context.g_module=Context.load_module(file_path) File "/usr/src/ayyi/ardourd-0.1.10/.waf3-1.6.7-7ac5ae1e6f7d23162cddca5e95609c76/waflib/Context.py", line 269, in load_module exec(compile(code,path,'exec'),module.__dict__) File "/usr/src/ayyi/ardourd-0.1.10/wscript", line 138 print 'config=' + str(config) ^ SyntaxError: invalid syntax From cbannister at slingshot.co.nz Sun Sep 22 14:12:08 2013 From: cbannister at slingshot.co.nz (Chris Bannister) Date: Mon, 23 Sep 2013 02:12:08 +1200 Subject: [LAU] [OT] Reelin' in the years: Tracking the history of magnetic tape Message-ID: <20130922141208.GA23041@tal> Hi, Someone might be interested in this: http://www.theregister.co.uk/2013/09/09/history_of_magnetic_tape_part_one/ -- "If you're not careful, the newspapers will have you hating the people who are being oppressed, and loving the people who are doing the oppressing." --- Malcolm X From ralf.mardorf at alice-dsl.net Sun Sep 22 14:56:57 2013 From: ralf.mardorf at alice-dsl.net (Ralf Mardorf) Date: Sun, 22 Sep 2013 16:56:57 +0200 Subject: [LAU] [OT] Reelin' in the years: Tracking the history of magnetic tape In-Reply-To: <20130922141208.GA23041@tal> References: <20130922141208.GA23041@tal> Message-ID: <1379861817.742.332.camel@archlinux> On Mon, 2013-09-23 at 02:12 +1200, Chris Bannister wrote: > http://www.theregister.co.uk/2013/09/09/history_of_magnetic_tape_part_one/ Nice reading and wonderful pictures. From len at ovenwerks.net Mon Sep 23 00:04:52 2013 From: len at ovenwerks.net (Len Ovens) Date: Sun, 22 Sep 2013 17:04:52 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [LAU] [OT] Reelin' in the years: Tracking the history of magnetic tape In-Reply-To: <20130922141208.GA23041@tal> References: <20130922141208.GA23041@tal> Message-ID: On Mon, 23 Sep 2013, Chris Bannister wrote: > Someone might be interested in this: > http://www.theregister.co.uk/2013/09/09/history_of_magnetic_tape_part_one/ Interesting, with all I had read about various raid setups, it had not occured to me that tape backup was still pretty standard, nor the evolution that has happened in the field. Part 1 and 2 are there... waiting for part 3. -- Len Ovens www.ovenwerks.net From nettings at stackingdwarves.net Mon Sep 23 10:10:18 2013 From: nettings at stackingdwarves.net (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?J=F6rn_Nettingsmeier?=) Date: Mon, 23 Sep 2013 12:10:18 +0200 Subject: [LAU] [OT] Reelin' in the years: Tracking the history of magnetic tape In-Reply-To: <20130922141208.GA23041@tal> References: <20130922141208.GA23041@tal> Message-ID: <5240138A.9050001@stackingdwarves.net> On 09/22/2013 04:12 PM, Chris Bannister wrote: > Hi, > > Someone might be interested in this: > http://www.theregister.co.uk/2013/09/09/history_of_magnetic_tape_part_one/ > priceless. i'd never have expected to see the term "spot welder" in conjunction with tape editing (http://www.theregister.co.uk/2013/09/09/history_of_magnetic_tape_part_one/?page=3 , scroll down to grey inset). -- J?rn Nettingsmeier Lortzingstr. 11, 45128 Essen, Tel. +49 177 7937487 Meister f?r Veranstaltungstechnik (B?hne/Studio) Tonmeister VDT http://stackingdwarves.net From izlemg at gmail.com Mon Sep 23 19:12:28 2013 From: izlemg at gmail.com (=?UTF-8?B?xLB6bGVtIEfDtnrDvGtlbGXFnw==?=) Date: Mon, 23 Sep 2013 22:12:28 +0300 Subject: [LAU] Pulse Problem Message-ID: Hi, We use Debian Wheezy (3.2.0-4-amd64) with Digigram Lola 881. In our application we use FMOD library and we get the below error. While audio is playing, the sound is lost and player continued reading audio file but very very fast. The player that we developed runs almost 20 hours a day. Interestingly, we had this problem: Mon Sep 23 21:26 (error time) Wed Sep 18 16:10 (reboot system for another reason) Sun Sep 15 10:48 (error time) Tue Sep 10 08:22 (error time) Thu Sep 5 16:01 (install date) As it is seen, we have this problem almost 5 days after system boot. What may be the cause of this problem? Memory? ********************************************************************************************* syslog "Sep 23 21:08:58 ank-yay7-30 pulseaudio[25025]: [pulseaudio] main.c: User-configured server at {d25201022b82858589f672715226f35f}unix:/tmp/pu lse-hQ0f0Qxjni5j/native, which appears to be local. Probing deeper. Sep 23 21:08:58 ank-yay7-30 pulseaudio[25026]: [pulseaudio] main.c: User-configured server at {d25201022b82858589f672715226f35f}unix:/tmp/pu lse-hQ0f0Qxjni5j/native, which appears to be local. Probing deeper. Sep 23 21:08:58 ank-yay7-30 rtkit-daemon[4003]: Successfully made thread 25029 of process 25029 (/usr/bin/pulseaudio) owned by '1001' high p riority at nice level -11. Sep 23 21:08:58 ank-yay7-30 rtkit-daemon[4003]: Supervising 1 threads of 1 processes of 1 users. Sep 23 21:08:58 ank-yay7-30 pulseaudio[25029]: [pulseaudio] pid.c: Stale PID file, overwriting. Sep 23 21:08:58 ank-yay7-30 rtkit-daemon[4003]: Successfully made thread 25031 of process 25029 (/usr/bin/pulseaudio) owned by '1001' RT at priority 5. Sep 23 21:08:58 ank-yay7-30 rtkit-daemon[4003]: Supervising 2 threads of 1 processes of 1 users. Sep 23 21:08:58 ank-yay7-30 rtkit-daemon[4003]: Successfully made thread 25032 of process 25029 (/usr/bin/pulseaudio) owned by '1001' RT at priority 5. Sep 23 21:08:58 ank-yay7-30 rtkit-daemon[4003]: Supervising 3 threads of 1 processes of 1 users. Sep 23 21:08:58 ank-yay7-30 rtkit-daemon[4003]: Successfully made thread 25033 of process 25029 (/usr/bin/pulseaudio) owned by '1001' RT at priority 5. Sep 23 21:08:58 ank-yay7-30 rtkit-daemon[4003]: Supervising 4 threads of 1 processes of 1 users. Sep 23 21:08:58 ank-yay7-30 rtkit-daemon[4003]: Successfully made thread 25034 of process 25029 (/usr/bin/pulseaudio) owned by '1001' RT at priority 5. Sep 23 21:08:58 ank-yay7-30 rtkit-daemon[4003]: Supervising 5 threads of 1 processes of 1 users. Sep 23 21:08:58 ank-yay7-30 pulseaudio[25029]: [pulseaudio] module.c: module-combine is deprecated: Please use module-combine-sink instead o f module-combine! Sep 23 21:08:58 ank-yay7-30 pulseaudio[25029]: [pulseaudio] module-combine.c: We will now load module-combine-sink. Please make sure to remo ve module-combine from your configuration. Sep 23 21:08:58 ank-yay7-30 rtkit-daemon[4003]: Successfully made thread 25037 of process 25029 (/usr/bin/pulseaudio) owned by '1001' RT at priority 6. Sep 23 21:08:58 ank-yay7-30 rtkit-daemon[4003]: Supervising 6 threads of 1 processes of 1 users. Sep 23 21:08:58 ank-yay7-30 rtkit-daemon[4003]: Successfully made thread 25039 of process 25039 (/usr/bin/pulseaudio) owned by '1001' high priority at nice level -11. Sep 23 21:08:58 ank-yay7-30 rtkit-daemon[4003]: Supervising 7 threads of 2 processes of 1 users. Sep 23 21:08:58 ank-yay7-30 pulseaudio[25039]: [pulseaudio] pid.c: Daemon already running. Sep 23 21:13:07 ank-yay7-30 pulseaudio[25029]: [alsa-sink] alsa-sink.c: ALSA woke us up to write new data to the device, but there was actually nothing to write! Sep 23 21:13:07 ank-yay7-30 pulseaudio[25029]: [alsa-sink] alsa-sink.c: Most likely this is a bug in the ALSA driver 'snd_lola'. Please report this issue to the ALSA developers. Sep 23 21:13:07 ank-yay7-30 pulseaudio[25029]: [alsa-sink] alsa-sink.c: We were woken up with POLLOUT set -- however a subsequent snd_pcm_avail() returned 0 or another value < min_avail." -- ibrahim izlem G?Z?KELE? -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From paul at linuxaudiosystems.com Mon Sep 23 19:39:55 2013 From: paul at linuxaudiosystems.com (Paul Davis) Date: Mon, 23 Sep 2013 15:39:55 -0400 Subject: [LAU] Pulse Problem In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Mon, Sep 23, 2013 at 3:12 PM, ?zlem G?z?kele? wrote: > Hi, > We use Debian Wheezy (3.2.0-4-amd64) with Digigram Lola 881. > In our application we use FMOD library and we get the below error. > While audio is playing, the sound is lost and player continued reading > audio file but very very fast. > > The player that we developed runs almost 20 hours a day. Interestingly, we > had this problem: > Mon Sep 23 21:26 (error time) > Wed Sep 18 16:10 (reboot system for another reason) > Sun Sep 15 10:48 (error time) > Tue Sep 10 08:22 (error time) > Thu Sep 5 16:01 (install date) > > As it is seen, we have this problem almost 5 days after system boot. > > What may be the cause of this problem? Memory? > the message you pasted seems likely to be relevant: Sep 23 21:13:07 ank-yay7-30 pulseaudio[25029]: [alsa-sink] alsa-sink.c: ALSA woke us up to write new data to the device, but there was actually nothing to write! Sep 23 21:13:07 ank-yay7-30 pulseaudio[25029]: [alsa-sink] alsa-sink.c: Most likely this is a bug in the ALSA driver 'snd_lola'. Please report this issue to the ALSA developers. Sep 23 21:13:07 ank-yay7-30 pulseaudio[25029]: [alsa-sink] alsa-sink.c: We were woken up with POLLOUT set -- however a subsequent snd_pcm_avail() returned 0 or another value < min_avail." why not start there? -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From izlemg at gmail.com Mon Sep 23 20:21:44 2013 From: izlemg at gmail.com (=?UTF-8?B?xLB6bGVtIEfDtnrDvGtlbGXFnw==?=) Date: Mon, 23 Sep 2013 23:21:44 +0300 Subject: [LAU] Pulse Problem In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Mon, Sep 23, 2013 at 10:39 PM, Paul Davis wrote: > > > > On Mon, Sep 23, 2013 at 3:12 PM, ?zlem G?z?kele? wrote: > the message you pasted seems likely to be relevant: > > Sep 23 21:13:07 ank-yay7-30 pulseaudio[25029]: [alsa-sink] alsa-sink.c: > ALSA woke us up to write new data to the device, but there was actually > nothing to write! > Sep 23 21:13:07 ank-yay7-30 pulseaudio[25029]: [alsa-sink] alsa-sink.c: > Most likely this is a bug in the ALSA driver 'snd_lola'. Please report this > issue to the ALSA developers. > Sep 23 21:13:07 ank-yay7-30 pulseaudio[25029]: [alsa-sink] alsa-sink.c: > We were woken up with POLLOUT set -- however a subsequent snd_pcm_avail() > returned 0 or another value < min_avail." > > why not start there? > First, error logs always start with the lines as "Sep 23 21:08:58 ank-yay7-30 pulseaudio[25025]: [pulseaudio] main.c: User-configured server at {d25201022b82858589f672715226f35f}unix:/tmp/pu lse-hQ0f0Qxjni5j/native, which appears to be local. Probing deeper." And in this example, we got error message about snd_lola 4 minutes after this message (Sound is lost during 21:08). Second, this alsa error message appears rarely. For example, we didn't have this problem on the previous system error. Yet. we always see this message after system is started without any apparent problem. Furthermore, we get the same error message with layla 3g againg without any apparent problem on the playing sound after boot. As a result, the above sound problem message seems as a consequence of another problem. Maybe I am wrong. But I cannot debug a problem that happens after 5 days (~5 x 17 hours of playing music). Where should I start? -- ibrahim izlem G?Z?KELE? -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From paul at linuxaudiosystems.com Mon Sep 23 20:32:34 2013 From: paul at linuxaudiosystems.com (Paul Davis) Date: Mon, 23 Sep 2013 16:32:34 -0400 Subject: [LAU] Pulse Problem In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Mon, Sep 23, 2013 at 4:21 PM, ?zlem G?z?kele? wrote: > > On Mon, Sep 23, 2013 at 10:39 PM, Paul Davis wrote: > >> >> >> >> On Mon, Sep 23, 2013 at 3:12 PM, ?zlem G?z?kele? wrote: >> the message you pasted seems likely to be relevant: >> >> Sep 23 21:13:07 ank-yay7-30 pulseaudio[25029]: [alsa-sink] >> alsa-sink.c: ALSA woke us up to write new data to the device, but there was >> actually nothing to write! >> Sep 23 21:13:07 ank-yay7-30 pulseaudio[25029]: [alsa-sink] >> alsa-sink.c: Most likely this is a bug in the ALSA driver 'snd_lola'. >> Please report this issue to the ALSA developers. >> Sep 23 21:13:07 ank-yay7-30 pulseaudio[25029]: [alsa-sink] >> alsa-sink.c: We were woken up with POLLOUT set -- however a subsequent >> snd_pcm_avail() returned 0 or another value < min_avail." >> >> why not start there? >> > First, error logs always start with the lines as "Sep 23 21:08:58 > ank-yay7-30 pulseaudio[25025]: [pulseaudio] main.c: User-configured server > at {d25201022b82858589f672715226f35f}unix:/tmp/pu > lse-hQ0f0Qxjni5j/native, which appears to be local. Probing deeper." > > And in this example, we got error message about snd_lola 4 minutes after > this message (Sound is lost during 21:08). > > Second, this alsa error message appears rarely. For example, we didn't > have this problem on the previous system error. Yet. we always see this > message after system is started without any apparent problem. Furthermore, > we get the same error message with layla 3g againg without any apparent > problem on the playing sound after boot. > > As a result, the above sound problem message seems as a consequence of > another problem. > > Maybe I am wrong. But I cannot debug a problem that happens after 5 days > (~5 x 17 hours of playing music). > Where should I start? > unfortunately nothing that you've said here invalidates the idea that it could be an issue with the ALSA driver - an issue that only shows up after many hours of continuous playback. you would have to add debugging output to the ALSA driver to track what it thinks is happening. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From ken at restivo.org Mon Sep 23 21:06:52 2013 From: ken at restivo.org (Ken Restivo) Date: Mon, 23 Sep 2013 14:06:52 -0700 Subject: [LAU] Some music made with linux, from the vaults Message-ID: <20130923210652.GA15681@q400a.mobile.restivo.org> Found these cleaning an old hard drive, all made with Linux, Fluidsynth, Ardour, PHASEX, JACKRACK, seq24, jace, and probably others. Techno-ish and featuring PHASEX heavily: http://storage.restivo.org/music/krmusic/semipublished/breakfast-at-one-0.1.1.ogg Funky in 9/4 and with enough shifting patterns that the 1 is pretty much arbitrary (the way I like it), and also using PHASEX in the background: http://storage.restivo.org/music/krmusic/semipublished/allure-oddmeter-0.1.ogg These are both from August 2007, according to the git history. Enjoy. -ken From fons at linuxaudio.org Mon Sep 23 21:20:37 2013 From: fons at linuxaudio.org (Fons Adriaensen) Date: Mon, 23 Sep 2013 21:20:37 +0000 Subject: [LAU] Some music recorded with Linux Message-ID: <20130923212037.GC1870@linuxaudio.org> Yesterday I made one of the most rewarding concert recordings I ever did. The opening concert of the 'Traiettorie' festival here in Parma, with violinist Hae-Sun Kang and five of her twenty-something students of the chamber music class in Paris. One of the pieces they played was Arnold Schoenberg's 'Verklaerte Nacht', the original version for string sextet. I've known it for at least thirty years and recorded it many times. It's IMHO one of the most beautiful pieces of music ever written. It's also quite a difficult one to get right - a string quartet already requires a lot of very intimate coordination, and with six players this only gets much more complex. I'd been present at the rehearsals the days before the concert, and seen those young musicians work on it - passionately and without compromise. The recording has all the defects of a live one - background noises of all sorts - but I think they played wonderfully. Equipment used was two Neumann KM184 mics, an RME Micstasy and Ardour3. I can't make it available publicly, but if the rare birds who like this type of music give me a hint there may be some chance. Not that I want to show off my work, which is insignificant, but just to share what some talented and motivated young musicians are capable of. Ciao, -- FA A world of exhaustive, reliable metadata would be an utopia. It's also a pipe-dream, founded on self-delusion, nerd hubris and hysterically inflated market opportunities. (Cory Doctorow) From julien at mail.upb.de Mon Sep 23 22:23:30 2013 From: julien at mail.upb.de (Julien Claassen) Date: Tue, 24 Sep 2013 00:23:30 +0200 (CEST) Subject: [LAU] Some music made with linux, from the vaults In-Reply-To: <20130923210652.GA15681@q400a.mobile.restivo.org> References: <20130923210652.GA15681@q400a.mobile.restivo.org> Message-ID: Hello Ken! Nice tracks. Not my top five out of your tracks, but definitely nice. :-) I like both titles very much though. They convey something eccentric and slightly nerdy. :-) I didn't start on the right foot with breakfast at 1. I thought: why 808, why not 909? This question however was answered quickly, when the Rhodes joined the funfair. Nice touch that! In combination with the Rhodes, the 808 made much more sense to me. It left the piano more space to breathe and roominate. I love those funky/jazzy reminiscences. Something I can never pull off, as well as you can. No rock 'n' role and no funk. :-) Nice little track! Allure oddmeter, did hold a slight allure. Unfortunately something had to be steady in this song and the poor old drumtrack had to suffer that dubious pleasure. :-( If that had been replaced with a real drummer or a drumkit of any sort played live or programmed in interesting and twisted ways, this would have been on its way to a smash-hit. :-) Oddly though, I didn't find the 9/4 too confusing. Perhaps I didn't always follow the twists and turns of the bassline, but it felt comfrotable to listen to. Enough so, tht I could enjoy the mean basslines. Not as predominant and pregnant, as I've heard them in some of your other songs, but it was there. While listening and discovering the acoustic piano, I started thinking, that one could probably have fun with this piece, writing an analysis of the composer's intentions. So many events and twists, for such a small arrangement and that style of music, that one could assign to underlying themes, desires and messages of the author. :-) Coming back into the non-fictional world, those ongoings are, what makes this piece interesting, in spite of the looped drums. May I finish this with a wish: do more housekeeping and cleaning, perhaps you'll find more. :-) I will hope for the best and leave you to being prepared for the worst. - Honestly: both of them nice, sturdy tracks, not catchy, but catching. Warm regards Julien ---------------------------------------- http://juliencoder.de/nama/music.html From bearcat at feline-soul.com Mon Sep 23 22:22:50 2013 From: bearcat at feline-soul.com (=?UTF-8?B?QmVhcmNhdCBNLiDFnsOhbmRvcg==?=) Date: Mon, 23 Sep 2013 16:22:50 -0600 Subject: [LAU] Some music recorded with Linux In-Reply-To: <20130923212037.GC1870@linuxaudio.org> References: <20130923212037.GC1870@linuxaudio.org> Message-ID: Here's one insignificant bird...er.. cat giving you a hint. It would be great to hear. If you share it, i promise not bother the birds. Thanks, On Mon, Sep 23, 2013 at 3:20 PM, Fons Adriaensen wrote: > Yesterday I made one of the most rewarding concert recordings > I ever did. The opening concert of the 'Traiettorie' festival > here in Parma, with violinist Hae-Sun Kang and five of her > twenty-something students of the chamber music class in Paris. > One of the pieces they played was Arnold Schoenberg's 'Verklaerte > Nacht', the original version for string sextet. I've known it for > at least thirty years and recorded it many times. It's IMHO one > of the most beautiful pieces of music ever written. It's also > quite a difficult one to get right - a string quartet already > requires a lot of very intimate coordination, and with six > players this only gets much more complex. > I'd been present at the rehearsals the days before the concert, > and seen those young musicians work on it - passionately and > without compromise. The recording has all the defects of a live > one - background noises of all sorts - but I think they played > wonderfully. Equipment used was two Neumann KM184 mics, an RME > Micstasy and Ardour3. I can't make it available publicly, but > if the rare birds who like this type of music give me a hint > there may be some chance. Not that I want to show off my work, > which is insignificant, but just to share what some talented > and motivated young musicians are capable of. > > Ciao, > > -- > FA > > A world of exhaustive, reliable metadata would be an utopia. > It's also a pipe-dream, founded on self-delusion, nerd hubris > and hysterically inflated market opportunities. (Cory Doctorow) > > _______________________________________________ > Linux-audio-user mailing list > Linux-audio-user at lists.linuxaudio.org > http://lists.linuxaudio.org/listinfo/linux-audio-user > -- Bearcat M. ??ndor Feline Soul Systems LLC Voice: 872.CAT.SOUL (872.228.7685) Fax: 406.235.7070 Jabber/xmpp/gtalk/email: bearcat at feline-soul.net MSN: bearcatsandor at hotmail.com Yahoo: bearcatsandor AIM: bearcatmsandor My public pgp key is included for verification of my identity -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From bearcat at feline-soul.com Mon Sep 23 22:22:50 2013 From: bearcat at feline-soul.com (=?UTF-8?B?QmVhcmNhdCBNLiDFnsOhbmRvcg==?=) Date: Mon, 23 Sep 2013 16:22:50 -0600 Subject: [LAU] Some music recorded with Linux In-Reply-To: <20130923212037.GC1870@linuxaudio.org> References: <20130923212037.GC1870@linuxaudio.org> Message-ID: Here's one insignificant bird...er.. cat giving you a hint. It would be great to hear. If you share it, i promise not bother the birds. Thanks, On Mon, Sep 23, 2013 at 3:20 PM, Fons Adriaensen wrote: > Yesterday I made one of the most rewarding concert recordings > I ever did. The opening concert of the 'Traiettorie' festival > here in Parma, with violinist Hae-Sun Kang and five of her > twenty-something students of the chamber music class in Paris. > One of the pieces they played was Arnold Schoenberg's 'Verklaerte > Nacht', the original version for string sextet. I've known it for > at least thirty years and recorded it many times. It's IMHO one > of the most beautiful pieces of music ever written. It's also > quite a difficult one to get right - a string quartet already > requires a lot of very intimate coordination, and with six > players this only gets much more complex. > I'd been present at the rehearsals the days before the concert, > and seen those young musicians work on it - passionately and > without compromise. The recording has all the defects of a live > one - background noises of all sorts - but I think they played > wonderfully. Equipment used was two Neumann KM184 mics, an RME > Micstasy and Ardour3. I can't make it available publicly, but > if the rare birds who like this type of music give me a hint > there may be some chance. Not that I want to show off my work, > which is insignificant, but just to share what some talented > and motivated young musicians are capable of. > > Ciao, > > -- > FA > > A world of exhaustive, reliable metadata would be an utopia. > It's also a pipe-dream, founded on self-delusion, nerd hubris > and hysterically inflated market opportunities. (Cory Doctorow) > > _______________________________________________ > Linux-audio-user mailing list > Linux-audio-user at lists.linuxaudio.org > http://lists.linuxaudio.org/listinfo/linux-audio-user > -- Bearcat M. ??ndor Feline Soul Systems LLC Voice: 872.CAT.SOUL (872.228.7685) Fax: 406.235.7070 Jabber/xmpp/gtalk/email: bearcat at feline-soul.net MSN: bearcatsandor at hotmail.com Yahoo: bearcatsandor AIM: bearcatmsandor My public pgp key is included for verification of my identity -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From gheskett at wdtv.com Mon Sep 23 22:49:38 2013 From: gheskett at wdtv.com (Gene Heskett) Date: Mon, 23 Sep 2013 18:49:38 -0400 Subject: [LAU] Some music recorded with Linux In-Reply-To: <20130923212037.GC1870@linuxaudio.org> References: <20130923212037.GC1870@linuxaudio.org> Message-ID: <201309231849.38267.gheskett@wdtv.com> On Monday 23 September 2013 18:37:53 Fons Adriaensen did opine: > Yesterday I made one of the most rewarding concert recordings > I ever did. The opening concert of the 'Traiettorie' festival > here in Parma, with violinist Hae-Sun Kang and five of her > twenty-something students of the chamber music class in Paris. > One of the pieces they played was Arnold Schoenberg's 'Verklaerte > Nacht', the original version for string sextet. I've known it for > at least thirty years and recorded it many times. It's IMHO one > of the most beautiful pieces of music ever written. It's also > quite a difficult one to get right - a string quartet already > requires a lot of very intimate coordination, and with six > players this only gets much more complex. > I'd been present at the rehearsals the days before the concert, > and seen those young musicians work on it - passionately and > without compromise. The recording has all the defects of a live > one - background noises of all sorts - but I think they played > wonderfully. Equipment used was two Neumann KM184 mics, an RME > Micstasy and Ardour3. I can't make it available publicly, but > if the rare birds who like this type of music give me a hint > there may be some chance. Not that I want to show off my work, > which is insignificant, but just to share what some talented > and motivated young musicians are capable of. > > Ciao, Fons, thanks for sharing the announcement. And I encourage you to make use of the no news is bad news theory in terms of their notoriety / reputation that gets them invited to preform again, perhaps even for scale or better if they become well enough known. But if they hide their talent that you just waxed so poetically about, under a basket woven of the fear of giving away a performance, they are not going to find that road an easy one to travel. My own musical tastes run from some of the more famous operas, clear to a story told in country-western. But if I can't hear them then I, being half way around the planet, will never be able to judge for myself. So please exert whatever influence you might have. Cheers, Gene -- "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author) You must realize that the computer has it in for you. The irrefutable proof of this is that the computer always does what you tell it to do. A pen in the hand of this president is far more dangerous than 200 million guns in the hands of law-abiding citizens. From dlphillips at woh.rr.com Mon Sep 23 23:18:08 2013 From: dlphillips at woh.rr.com (Dave Phillips) Date: Mon, 23 Sep 2013 19:18:08 -0400 Subject: [LAU] Some music recorded with Linux In-Reply-To: <20130923212037.GC1870@linuxaudio.org> References: <20130923212037.GC1870@linuxaudio.org> Message-ID: <5240CC30.7000100@woh.rr.com> On 09/23/2013 05:20 PM, Fons Adriaensen wrote: > Yesterday I made one of the most rewarding concert recordings > I ever did... Arnold Schoenberg's 'Verklaerte > Nacht', the original version for string sextet. I've known it for > at least thirty years and recorded it many times. It's IMHO one > of the most beautiful pieces of music ever written. Agree++ (though I'm always amazed by Erwartung). I'd love to hear them, so count me in as one of the birds. Best, dp From ken at restivo.org Tue Sep 24 02:16:30 2013 From: ken at restivo.org (Ken Restivo) Date: Mon, 23 Sep 2013 19:16:30 -0700 Subject: [LAU] Some music made with linux, from the vaults In-Reply-To: References: <20130923210652.GA15681@q400a.mobile.restivo.org> Message-ID: <34d02e70-ee79-4c82-8b82-69fdcf2e0fa7@email.android.com> Thanks. Yeah there was a reason I didn't release them years ago; they didn't feel "done" to me. Oh well. -ken Julien Claassen wrote: >Hello Ken! >Nice tracks. Not my top five out of your tracks, but definitely nice. >:-) I >like both titles very much though. They convey something eccentric and >slightly nerdy. :-) >I didn't start on the right foot with breakfast at 1. I thought: why >808, >why not 909? This question however was answered quickly, when the >Rhodes >joined the funfair. Nice touch that! In combination with the Rhodes, >the 808 >made much more sense to me. It left the piano more space to breathe and > >roominate. I love those funky/jazzy reminiscences. Something I can >never pull >off, as well as you can. No rock 'n' role and no funk. :-) Nice little >track! >Allure oddmeter, did hold a slight allure. Unfortunately something had >to be >steady in this song and the poor old drumtrack had to suffer that >dubious >pleasure. :-( If that had been replaced with a real drummer or a >drumkit of >any sort played live or programmed in interesting and twisted ways, >this would >have been on its way to a smash-hit. :-) Oddly though, I didn't find >the 9/4 >too confusing. Perhaps I didn't always follow the twists and turns of >the >bassline, but it felt comfrotable to listen to. Enough so, tht I could >enjoy >the mean basslines. Not as predominant and pregnant, as I've heard them >in >some of your other songs, but it was there. While listening and >discovering >the acoustic piano, I started thinking, that one could probably have >fun with >this piece, writing an analysis of the composer's intentions. So many >events >and twists, for such a small arrangement and that style of music, that >one >could assign to underlying themes, desires and messages of the author. >:-) >Coming back into the non-fictional world, those ongoings are, what >makes this >piece interesting, in spite of the looped drums. >May I finish this with a wish: do more housekeeping and cleaning, >perhaps >you'll find more. :-) I will hope for the best and leave you to being >prepared >for the worst. - Honestly: both of them nice, sturdy tracks, not >catchy, but >catching. > Warm regards > Julien > >---------------------------------------- >http://juliencoder.de/nama/music.html From julien at mail.upb.de Tue Sep 24 07:42:36 2013 From: julien at mail.upb.de (Julien Claassen) Date: Tue, 24 Sep 2013 09:42:36 +0200 (CEST) Subject: [LAU] Some music made with linux, from the vaults In-Reply-To: <34d02e70-ee79-4c82-8b82-69fdcf2e0fa7@email.android.com> References: <20130923210652.GA15681@q400a.mobile.restivo.org> <34d02e70-ee79-4c82-8b82-69fdcf2e0fa7@email.android.com> Message-ID: Hello Ken! Oh please, don't get me wrong. This is whining about luxury problems. It's overall good, that you did release them. Best wishes Julien ---------------------------------------- http://juliencoder.de/nama/music.html From jostein at vait.se Tue Sep 24 08:30:47 2013 From: jostein at vait.se (Jostein Chr. Andersen) Date: Tue, 24 Sep 2013 10:30:47 +0200 Subject: [LAU] Some music recorded with Linux In-Reply-To: <20130923212037.GC1870@linuxaudio.org> References: <20130923212037.GC1870@linuxaudio.org> Message-ID: <52414DB7.5060004@vait.se> On 09/23/2013 11:20 PM, Fons Adriaensen wrote: > Yesterday I made one of the most rewarding concert recordings ... I can't make it available publicly, but > if the rare birds who like this type of music give me a hint > there may be some chance. Not that I want to show off my work, > which is insignificant, but just to share what some talented > and motivated young musicians are capable of. Cool, I would love to hear it! :-) Jostein From edogawa at aon.at Tue Sep 24 08:49:31 2013 From: edogawa at aon.at (Edgar Aichinger) Date: Tue, 24 Sep 2013 10:49:31 +0200 Subject: [LAU] Some music recorded with Linux In-Reply-To: <20130923212037.GC1870@linuxaudio.org> References: <20130923212037.GC1870@linuxaudio.org> Message-ID: <2647189.NiavVDppWu@edhp> Am Montag, 23. September 2013, 21:20:37 schrieb Fons Adriaensen: > if the rare birds who like this type of music give me a hint > there may be some chance. Not that I want to show off my work, > which is insignificant, but just to share what some talented > and motivated young musicians are capable of. > > Ciao, > > That made me curious too... I'm not so much a fan of late romantic music, usually, but now that I listened to the string sextet version by Boulez that I found on YT, I have to say I like it a lot, and I'd really appreciate to hear your recording.... chilp chilp... Edgar From pshirkey at boosthardware.com Tue Sep 24 14:08:10 2013 From: pshirkey at boosthardware.com (Patrick Shirkey) Date: Wed, 25 Sep 2013 00:08:10 +1000 (EST) Subject: [LAU] steamOS Message-ID: <58948.86.127.135.155.1380031690.squirrel@boosthardware.com> Some of you might be interested in this "new" OS in relation to Linux Audio Development. http://store.steampowered.com/livingroom/SteamOS/ They say they are working on audio latency issues but I haven't seen them pop up anywhere so I hope they are not going down the same path as the Android and ChromeOS dev teams. -- Patrick Shirkey Boost Hardware Ltd From zettberlin at linuxuse.de Wed Sep 25 08:20:24 2013 From: zettberlin at linuxuse.de (Hartmut Noack) Date: Wed, 25 Sep 2013 10:20:24 +0200 Subject: [LAU] FingerPlayServer in Ubuntu Message-ID: <52429CC8.6090703@linuxuse.de> Hello, FingerPlayMIDI is a very nice App for Android, that turns the touchscreen of a device into a MIDI-Controller with sliders, matrix and pads. http://code.google.com/p/fingerplaymidi I used it without any problem in Fedora 17 using its FingerPlayServer-component on the Linux-Box to connect the stream from the phone. It is a Java-Program, that is supposed to create a port like this: FingerPlayServer v0.8.0 Listening on 127.0.1.1:4444 Waiting for connection from phone.. Phone connected. Set MIDI Device: VirMIDI [hw:3,3,11] As said before, this worked perfectly OK in Fedora 17 but alas! In Ubuntu 13.04 with KXStudio Layer the server starts as expected but there is no port in Alsa-MIDI to be found. The server gets the signals OK and reports no errors. Does someone know, what could have changed in ALSA-MIDI and/or Jack-MIDI that this port from a Java-app is not accepted anymore? best regards HZN From email.rafa at gmail.com Wed Sep 25 12:17:53 2013 From: email.rafa at gmail.com (Rafael Vega) Date: Wed, 25 Sep 2013 07:17:53 -0500 Subject: [LAU] FingerPlayServer in Ubuntu In-Reply-To: <52429CC8.6090703@linuxuse.de> References: <52429CC8.6090703@linuxuse.de> Message-ID: Maybe you need to start the a2j (alsa to jack) midi bridge? It's in the KX repos and you can start it / stop it from the cadence GUI or from a terminal. On Wed, Sep 25, 2013 at 3:20 AM, Hartmut Noack wrote: > Hello, > > FingerPlayMIDI is a very nice App for Android, that turns the > touchscreen of a device into a MIDI-Controller with sliders, matrix and > pads. > > http://code.google.com/p/fingerplaymidi > > I used it without any problem in Fedora 17 using its > FingerPlayServer-component on the Linux-Box to connect the stream from > the phone. It is a Java-Program, that is supposed to create a port like > this: > > FingerPlayServer v0.8.0 > > Listening on 127.0.1.1:4444 > Waiting for connection from phone.. > Phone connected. > Set MIDI Device: VirMIDI [hw:3,3,11] > > > As said before, this worked perfectly OK in Fedora 17 but alas! In > Ubuntu 13.04 with KXStudio Layer the server starts as expected but there > is no port in Alsa-MIDI to be found. > > The server gets the signals OK and reports no errors. > > Does someone know, what could have changed in ALSA-MIDI and/or Jack-MIDI > that this port from a Java-app is not accepted anymore? > > best regards > > HZN > _______________________________________________ > Linux-audio-user mailing list > Linux-audio-user at lists.linuxaudio.org > http://lists.linuxaudio.org/listinfo/linux-audio-user > -- Rafael Vega email.rafa at gmail.com -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From ico at vt.edu Wed Sep 25 13:10:36 2013 From: ico at vt.edu (Ivica Bukvic) Date: Wed, 25 Sep 2013 09:10:36 -0400 Subject: [LAU] Test please ignore Message-ID: -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From pshirkey at boosthardware.com Thu Sep 19 11:04:03 2013 From: pshirkey at boosthardware.com (Patrick Shirkey) Date: Thu, 19 Sep 2013 21:04:03 +1000 (EST) Subject: [LAU] Testing JACK and PA latency In-Reply-To: <20130919104605.GC9491@linuxaudio.org> References: <48937.86.127.135.98.1379486981.squirrel@boosthardware.com> <52796.86.127.135.98.1379501724.squirrel@boosthardware.com> <57026.86.127.135.98.1379518182.squirrel@boosthardware.com> <36869.86.127.135.98.1379572479.squirrel@boosthardware.com> <39035.86.127.135.98.1379580371.squirrel@boosthardware.com> <20130919094210.GA9491@linuxaudio.org> <39846.86.127.135.98.1379585044.squirrel@boosthardware.com> <20130919104605.GC9491@linuxaudio.org> Message-ID: <40764.86.127.135.98.1379588643.squirrel@boosthardware.com> On Thu, September 19, 2013 8:46 pm, Fons Adriaensen wrote: > On Thu, Sep 19, 2013 at 08:04:04PM +1000, Patrick Shirkey wrote: > >> > 1. Measure the round-trip latency of your sound card (with an >> > external analog loop). >> > >> >> Can I use jack_delay running on a second computer connected to the >> external i/o of the first computer to get this value? > > You'd measure something different... > > But you could use two computers as follows: > > A = computer with jack, PA, audacity > B = second computer with sound card, jack and jack_delay. > > 1. Measure the round-trip latency on B, with an external > analog loop. > > 2. Connect B -> A, A -> B, run complete chain on A. > > 3. Measure again on B, subtract the value from (1). > >> > jack_delay -> pa_source -> audacity -> pa_sink -> jack_delay. >> > >> >> Does this look reasonable? >> >> 1023.978 frames 21.333 ms total roundtrip latency >> extra loopback latency: 1023 frames >> use 511 for the backend arguments -I and -O >> 1023.976 frames 21.333 ms total roundtrip latency >> extra loopback latency: 1023 frames >> use 511 for the backend arguments -I and -O >> 1023.977 frames 21.333 ms total roundtrip latency >> extra loopback latency: 1023 frames >> use 511 for the backend arguments -I and -O > > Don't know - I'm by no means a PA expert... and I don't know > your Jack period size. Given PA's reputation I'd expect more: > 1024 samples would mean that PA imposes almost the same RT- > requirements on apps as Jack does, and it was designed *not* > to do that... But maybe the jack <-> PA interface doesn't > use the same amount of buffering that PA normally adds. > > Note that the value measured is modulo 2^16 samples, but I > wouldn't expect anything more than a second, so this probably > irrelevant. > A bit more detail before I send this over to the PA guys for feedback. I am seeing the time period returned by jack_delay regularly increase during the measurement process. Do you have any thoughts on why that would be happening? I would like to rule out jack_delay because this is most likely a bug in PA that I have found. I'm using this method: jack is now set to 64/48000/2 This is the graph: jack_delay -> pa_source -> audacity -> pa_sink -> jack_delay Using audacity with 0 internal latency and in pass through mode I see the following results. It starts out as 10.667ms and after a few seconds it climbs up to 70.667 ms. I see similar results with ecasound instead of audacity using the following graph and ecachain: jack_delay -> pa_source -> ecasound -> pa_sink -> jack_delay ecasound -f:32,2,48000 -b:64 -i alsa -o alsa In that case it starts at 60.000 ms and climbs upto 572.000 ms after a few seconds of running the test. Audacity : ------------------ 512.003 frames 10.667 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 512 frames use 256 for the backend arguments -I and -O 512.008 frames 10.667 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 512 frames use 256 for the backend arguments -I and -O 512.006 frames 10.667 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 512 frames use 256 for the backend arguments -I and -O 1600.006 frames 33.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 1600 frames use 800 for the backend arguments -I and -O 1600.007 frames 33.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 1600 frames use 800 for the backend arguments -I and -O 1600.008 frames 33.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 1600 frames use 800 for the backend arguments -I and -O 1600.007 frames 33.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 1600 frames use 800 for the backend arguments -I and -O 1600.007 frames 33.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 1600 frames use 800 for the backend arguments -I and -O 1600.006 frames 33.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 1600 frames use 800 for the backend arguments -I and -O 1600.007 frames 33.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 1600 frames use 800 for the backend arguments -I and -O 1600.007 frames 33.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 1600 frames use 800 for the backend arguments -I and -O 1600.007 frames 33.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 1600 frames use 800 for the backend arguments -I and -O 1600.007 frames 33.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 1600 frames use 800 for the backend arguments -I and -O 1600.008 frames 33.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 1600 frames use 800 for the backend arguments -I and -O 1600.007 frames 33.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 1600 frames use 800 for the backend arguments -I and -O 1600.007 frames 33.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 1600 frames use 800 for the backend arguments -I and -O 1600.006 frames 33.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 1600 frames use 800 for the backend arguments -I and -O 1600.008 frames 33.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 1600 frames use 800 for the backend arguments -I and -O 1600.008 frames 33.334 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 1600 frames use 800 for the backend arguments -I and -O 1600.008 frames 33.334 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 1600 frames use 800 for the backend arguments -I and -O 1600.008 frames 33.334 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 1600 frames use 800 for the backend arguments -I and -O 1600.008 frames 33.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 1600 frames use 800 for the backend arguments -I and -O 1600.008 frames 33.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 1600 frames use 800 for the backend arguments -I and -O 1600.008 frames 33.334 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 1600 frames use 800 for the backend arguments -I and -O 1600.007 frames 33.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 1600 frames use 800 for the backend arguments -I and -O 1600.007 frames 33.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 1600 frames use 800 for the backend arguments -I and -O 1600.008 frames 33.334 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 1600 frames use 800 for the backend arguments -I and -O 1600.008 frames 33.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 1600 frames use 800 for the backend arguments -I and -O 1600.008 frames 33.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 1600 frames use 800 for the backend arguments -I and -O 1600.008 frames 33.334 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 1600 frames use 800 for the backend arguments -I and -O 1600.008 frames 33.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 1600 frames use 800 for the backend arguments -I and -O 1600.008 frames 33.334 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 1600 frames use 800 for the backend arguments -I and -O 1600.008 frames 33.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 1600 frames use 800 for the backend arguments -I and -O 1600.008 frames 33.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 1600 frames use 800 for the backend arguments -I and -O 1600.008 frames 33.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 1600 frames use 800 for the backend arguments -I and -O 1600.007 frames 33.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 1600 frames use 800 for the backend arguments -I and -O 1600.007 frames 33.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 1600 frames use 800 for the backend arguments -I and -O 1600.007 frames 33.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 1600 frames use 800 for the backend arguments -I and -O 1600.008 frames 33.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 1600 frames use 800 for the backend arguments -I and -O 1600.007 frames 33.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 1600 frames use 800 for the backend arguments -I and -O 1600.007 frames 33.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 1600 frames use 800 for the backend arguments -I and -O 1600.008 frames 33.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 1600 frames use 800 for the backend arguments -I and -O 1600.007 frames 33.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 1600 frames use 800 for the backend arguments -I and -O 2368.007 frames 49.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 2368 frames use 1184 for the backend arguments -I and -O 2368.007 frames 49.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 2368 frames use 1184 for the backend arguments -I and -O 2368.008 frames 49.334 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 2368 frames use 1184 for the backend arguments -I and -O 2368.007 frames 49.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 2368 frames use 1184 for the backend arguments -I and -O 2368.008 frames 49.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 2368 frames use 1184 for the backend arguments -I and -O 2368.007 frames 49.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 2368 frames use 1184 for the backend arguments -I and -O 2368.007 frames 49.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 2368 frames use 1184 for the backend arguments -I and -O 2368.007 frames 49.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 2368 frames use 1184 for the backend arguments -I and -O 2368.007 frames 49.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 2368 frames use 1184 for the backend arguments -I and -O 2432.008 frames 50.667 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 2432 frames use 1216 for the backend arguments -I and -O 2432.008 frames 50.667 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 2432 frames use 1216 for the backend arguments -I and -O 2432.008 frames 50.667 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 2432 frames use 1216 for the backend arguments -I and -O 2560.008 frames 53.334 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 2560 frames use 1280 for the backend arguments -I and -O 2560.008 frames 53.334 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 2560 frames use 1280 for the backend arguments -I and -O 2560.008 frames 53.334 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 2560 frames use 1280 for the backend arguments -I and -O 2560.007 frames 53.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 2560 frames use 1280 for the backend arguments -I and -O 2560.009 frames 53.334 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 2560 frames use 1280 for the backend arguments -I and -O 2560.008 frames 53.334 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 2560 frames use 1280 for the backend arguments -I and -O 2560.007 frames 53.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 2560 frames use 1280 for the backend arguments -I and -O 2560.008 frames 53.334 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 2560 frames use 1280 for the backend arguments -I and -O 2560.008 frames 53.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 2560 frames use 1280 for the backend arguments -I and -O 2560.008 frames 53.334 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 2560 frames use 1280 for the backend arguments -I and -O 2560.008 frames 53.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 2560 frames use 1280 for the backend arguments -I and -O 2560.007 frames 53.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 2560 frames use 1280 for the backend arguments -I and -O 2560.008 frames 53.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 2560 frames use 1280 for the backend arguments -I and -O 2560.007 frames 53.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 2560 frames use 1280 for the backend arguments -I and -O 2560.008 frames 53.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 2560 frames use 1280 for the backend arguments -I and -O 2560.008 frames 53.334 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 2560 frames use 1280 for the backend arguments -I and -O 2560.007 frames 53.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 2560 frames use 1280 for the backend arguments -I and -O 3136.008 frames 65.334 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 3136 frames use 1568 for the backend arguments -I and -O 3136.008 frames 65.334 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 3136 frames use 1568 for the backend arguments -I and -O 3136.009 frames 65.334 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 3136 frames use 1568 for the backend arguments -I and -O 3136.009 frames 65.334 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 3136 frames use 1568 for the backend arguments -I and -O 3136.007 frames 65.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 3136 frames use 1568 for the backend arguments -I and -O 3136.007 frames 65.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 3136 frames use 1568 for the backend arguments -I and -O 3136.008 frames 65.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 3136 frames use 1568 for the backend arguments -I and -O 3136.007 frames 65.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 3136 frames use 1568 for the backend arguments -I and -O 3136.008 frames 65.334 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 3136 frames use 1568 for the backend arguments -I and -O 3136.008 frames 65.334 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 3136 frames use 1568 for the backend arguments -I and -O 3136.007 frames 65.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 3136 frames use 1568 for the backend arguments -I and -O 3136.009 frames 65.334 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 3136 frames use 1568 for the backend arguments -I and -O 3136.009 frames 65.334 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 3136 frames use 1568 for the backend arguments -I and -O 3136.009 frames 65.334 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 3136 frames use 1568 for the backend arguments -I and -O 3136.007 frames 65.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 3136 frames use 1568 for the backend arguments -I and -O 3136.008 frames 65.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 3136 frames use 1568 for the backend arguments -I and -O 3136.009 frames 65.334 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 3136 frames use 1568 for the backend arguments -I and -O 3136.008 frames 65.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 3136 frames use 1568 for the backend arguments -I and -O 3136.008 frames 65.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 3136 frames use 1568 for the backend arguments -I and -O 3136.008 frames 65.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 3136 frames use 1568 for the backend arguments -I and -O 3136.008 frames 65.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 3136 frames use 1568 for the backend arguments -I and -O 3136.007 frames 65.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 3136 frames use 1568 for the backend arguments -I and -O 3136.008 frames 65.334 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 3136 frames use 1568 for the backend arguments -I and -O 3136.009 frames 65.334 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 3136 frames use 1568 for the backend arguments -I and -O 3136.009 frames 65.334 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 3136 frames use 1568 for the backend arguments -I and -O 3136.008 frames 65.334 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 3136 frames use 1568 for the backend arguments -I and -O 3136.009 frames 65.334 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 3136 frames use 1568 for the backend arguments -I and -O 3136.009 frames 65.334 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 3136 frames use 1568 for the backend arguments -I and -O 3392.008 frames 70.667 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 3392 frames use 1696 for the backend arguments -I and -O 3392.008 frames 70.667 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 3392 frames use 1696 for the backend arguments -I and -O 3392.008 frames 70.667 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 3392 frames use 1696 for the backend arguments -I and -O 3392.008 frames 70.667 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 3392 frames use 1696 for the backend arguments -I and -O 3392.008 frames 70.667 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 3392 frames use 1696 for the backend arguments -I and -O 3392.008 frames 70.667 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 3392 frames use 1696 for the backend arguments -I and -O 3392.009 frames 70.667 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 3392 frames use 1696 for the backend arguments -I and -O 3392.007 frames 70.667 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 3392 frames use 1696 for the backend arguments -I and -O 3392.007 frames 70.667 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 3392 frames use 1696 for the backend arguments -I and -O 3392.008 frames 70.667 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 3392 frames use 1696 for the backend arguments -I and -O 3392.009 frames 70.667 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 3392 frames use 1696 for the backend arguments -I and -O 3392.009 frames 70.667 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 3392 frames use 1696 for the backend arguments -I and -O 3392.009 frames 70.667 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 3392 frames use 1696 for the backend arguments -I and -O ------------------ Ecasound ecasound -f:32,2,48000 -b:64 -i alsa -o alsa ------------------ 2880.006 frames 60.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 2880 frames use 1440 for the backend arguments -I and -O 2879.998 frames 60.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 2879 frames use 1439 for the backend arguments -I and -O 2879.998 frames 60.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 2879 frames use 1439 for the backend arguments -I and -O 2879.998 frames 60.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 2879 frames use 1439 for the backend arguments -I and -O 3135.997 frames 65.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 3135 frames use 1567 for the backend arguments -I and -O ?? 3135.995 frames 65.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 3135 frames use 1567 for the backend arguments -I and -O 6847.998 frames 142.667 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 6847 frames use 3423 for the backend arguments -I and -O 7167.996 frames 149.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 7167 frames use 3583 for the backend arguments -I and -O 7167.999 frames 149.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 7167 frames use 3583 for the backend arguments -I and -O 7167.997 frames 149.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 7167 frames use 3583 for the backend arguments -I and -O 7167.998 frames 149.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 7167 frames use 3583 for the backend arguments -I and -O 7167.998 frames 149.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 7167 frames use 3583 for the backend arguments -I and -O 7231.998 frames 150.667 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 7231 frames use 3615 for the backend arguments -I and -O 7231.998 frames 150.667 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 7231 frames use 3615 for the backend arguments -I and -O 8575.996 frames 178.667 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 8575 frames use 4287 for the backend arguments -I and -O 8575.998 frames 178.667 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 8575 frames use 4287 for the backend arguments -I and -O 8575.997 frames 178.667 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 8575 frames use 4287 for the backend arguments -I and -O 8575.998 frames 178.667 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 8575 frames use 4287 for the backend arguments -I and -O 8959.996 frames 186.667 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 8959 frames use 4479 for the backend arguments -I and -O ?? 8959.996 frames 186.667 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 8959 frames use 4479 for the backend arguments -I and -O 13760.002 frames 286.667 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 13760 frames use 6880 for the backend arguments -I and -O 14592.000 frames 304.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 14592 frames use 7296 for the backend arguments -I and -O 14591.999 frames 304.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 14591 frames use 7295 for the backend arguments -I and -O 14591.998 frames 304.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 14591 frames use 7295 for the backend arguments -I and -O 14591.998 frames 304.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 14591 frames use 7295 for the backend arguments -I and -O 14591.998 frames 304.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 14591 frames use 7295 for the backend arguments -I and -O 14592.000 frames 304.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 14591 frames use 7295 for the backend arguments -I and -O 16191.999 frames 337.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 16191 frames use 8095 for the backend arguments -I and -O 16191.998 frames 337.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 16191 frames use 8095 for the backend arguments -I and -O 16191.998 frames 337.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 16191 frames use 8095 for the backend arguments -I and -O 16191.998 frames 337.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 16191 frames use 8095 for the backend arguments -I and -O 16255.998 frames 338.667 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 16255 frames use 8127 for the backend arguments -I and -O 16255.998 frames 338.667 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 16255 frames use 8127 for the backend arguments -I and -O 16255.998 frames 338.667 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 16255 frames use 8127 for the backend arguments -I and -O 16255.999 frames 338.667 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 16255 frames use 8127 for the backend arguments -I and -O 16319.998 frames 340.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 16319 frames use 8159 for the backend arguments -I and -O 16319.998 frames 340.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 16319 frames use 8159 for the backend arguments -I and -O 16319.999 frames 340.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 16319 frames use 8159 for the backend arguments -I and -O 16319.998 frames 340.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 16319 frames use 8159 for the backend arguments -I and -O 16319.998 frames 340.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 16319 frames use 8159 for the backend arguments -I and -O 16319.998 frames 340.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 16319 frames use 8159 for the backend arguments -I and -O 16319.997 frames 340.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 16319 frames use 8159 for the backend arguments -I and -O 16319.999 frames 340.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 16319 frames use 8159 for the backend arguments -I and -O 16319.998 frames 340.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 16319 frames use 8159 for the backend arguments -I and -O 16319.998 frames 340.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 16319 frames use 8159 for the backend arguments -I and -O 16447.998 frames 342.667 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 16447 frames use 8223 for the backend arguments -I and -O 16447.997 frames 342.667 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 16447 frames use 8223 for the backend arguments -I and -O 16447.998 frames 342.667 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 16447 frames use 8223 for the backend arguments -I and -O 16447.999 frames 342.667 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 16447 frames use 8223 for the backend arguments -I and -O 16447.999 frames 342.667 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 16447 frames use 8223 for the backend arguments -I and -O 16575.998 frames 345.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 16575 frames use 8287 for the backend arguments -I and -O 16575.998 frames 345.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 16575 frames use 8287 for the backend arguments -I and -O 16575.998 frames 345.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 16575 frames use 8287 for the backend arguments -I and -O 16575.998 frames 345.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 16575 frames use 8287 for the backend arguments -I and -O 16639.999 frames 346.667 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 16639 frames use 8319 for the backend arguments -I and -O 16639.998 frames 346.667 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 16639 frames use 8319 for the backend arguments -I and -O 16639.998 frames 346.667 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 16639 frames use 8319 for the backend arguments -I and -O 16703.999 frames 348.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 16703 frames use 8351 for the backend arguments -I and -O 16703.998 frames 348.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 16703 frames use 8351 for the backend arguments -I and -O 16703.999 frames 348.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 16703 frames use 8351 for the backend arguments -I and -O 16703.997 frames 348.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 16703 frames use 8351 for the backend arguments -I and -O 16703.997 frames 348.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 16703 frames use 8351 for the backend arguments -I and -O 16703.998 frames 348.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 16703 frames use 8351 for the backend arguments -I and -O 16703.998 frames 348.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 16703 frames use 8351 for the backend arguments -I and -O 16767.997 frames 349.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 16767 frames use 8383 for the backend arguments -I and -O 16767.998 frames 349.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 16767 frames use 8383 for the backend arguments -I and -O 16767.998 frames 349.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 16767 frames use 8383 for the backend arguments -I and -O 16767.998 frames 349.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 16767 frames use 8383 for the backend arguments -I and -O 16767.998 frames 349.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 16767 frames use 8383 for the backend arguments -I and -O 16767.998 frames 349.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 16767 frames use 8383 for the backend arguments -I and -O 16767.998 frames 349.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 16767 frames use 8383 for the backend arguments -I and -O 16767.998 frames 349.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 16767 frames use 8383 for the backend arguments -I and -O 16767.997 frames 349.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 16767 frames use 8383 for the backend arguments -I and -O 16767.998 frames 349.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 16767 frames use 8383 for the backend arguments -I and -O 16767.998 frames 349.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 16767 frames use 8383 for the backend arguments -I and -O 16767.997 frames 349.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 16767 frames use 8383 for the backend arguments -I and -O 16895.997 frames 352.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 16895 frames use 8447 for the backend arguments -I and -O 16895.998 frames 352.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 16895 frames use 8447 for the backend arguments -I and -O 16895.997 frames 352.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 16895 frames use 8447 for the backend arguments -I and -O 16895.997 frames 352.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 16895 frames use 8447 for the backend arguments -I and -O 16895.998 frames 352.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 16895 frames use 8447 for the backend arguments -I and -O 16895.998 frames 352.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 16895 frames use 8447 for the backend arguments -I and -O 16895.998 frames 352.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 16895 frames use 8447 for the backend arguments -I and -O 16895.997 frames 352.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 16895 frames use 8447 for the backend arguments -I and -O 16895.998 frames 352.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 16895 frames use 8447 for the backend arguments -I and -O 16895.998 frames 352.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 16895 frames use 8447 for the backend arguments -I and -O 16895.998 frames 352.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 16895 frames use 8447 for the backend arguments -I and -O 16895.998 frames 352.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 16895 frames use 8447 for the backend arguments -I and -O 16895.998 frames 352.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 16895 frames use 8447 for the backend arguments -I and -O 16895.998 frames 352.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 16895 frames use 8447 for the backend arguments -I and -O 16895.999 frames 352.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 16895 frames use 8447 for the backend arguments -I and -O 16895.999 frames 352.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 16895 frames use 8447 for the backend arguments -I and -O 16895.998 frames 352.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 16895 frames use 8447 for the backend arguments -I and -O 16895.997 frames 352.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 16895 frames use 8447 for the backend arguments -I and -O 16959.998 frames 353.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 16959 frames use 8479 for the backend arguments -I and -O 16959.997 frames 353.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 16959 frames use 8479 for the backend arguments -I and -O 16959.998 frames 353.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 16959 frames use 8479 for the backend arguments -I and -O 16959.998 frames 353.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 16959 frames use 8479 for the backend arguments -I and -O 16959.997 frames 353.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 16959 frames use 8479 for the backend arguments -I and -O 16959.998 frames 353.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 16959 frames use 8479 for the backend arguments -I and -O 16959.999 frames 353.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 16959 frames use 8479 for the backend arguments -I and -O 16959.999 frames 353.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 16959 frames use 8479 for the backend arguments -I and -O 16959.998 frames 353.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 16959 frames use 8479 for the backend arguments -I and -O 16959.997 frames 353.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 16959 frames use 8479 for the backend arguments -I and -O 16959.997 frames 353.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 16959 frames use 8479 for the backend arguments -I and -O 17087.998 frames 356.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 17087 frames use 8543 for the backend arguments -I and -O 17087.998 frames 356.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 17087 frames use 8543 for the backend arguments -I and -O 17087.997 frames 356.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 17087 frames use 8543 for the backend arguments -I and -O 17087.997 frames 356.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 17087 frames use 8543 for the backend arguments -I and -O 17087.997 frames 356.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 17087 frames use 8543 for the backend arguments -I and -O 17087.998 frames 356.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 17087 frames use 8543 for the backend arguments -I and -O 17087.998 frames 356.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 17087 frames use 8543 for the backend arguments -I and -O 17151.999 frames 357.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 17151 frames use 8575 for the backend arguments -I and -O 17151.997 frames 357.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 17151 frames use 8575 for the backend arguments -I and -O 17151.997 frames 357.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 17151 frames use 8575 for the backend arguments -I and -O 17151.997 frames 357.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 17151 frames use 8575 for the backend arguments -I and -O 17151.998 frames 357.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 17151 frames use 8575 for the backend arguments -I and -O 17151.998 frames 357.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 17151 frames use 8575 for the backend arguments -I and -O 17151.998 frames 357.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 17151 frames use 8575 for the backend arguments -I and -O 17151.999 frames 357.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 17151 frames use 8575 for the backend arguments -I and -O 17151.999 frames 357.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 17151 frames use 8575 for the backend arguments -I and -O 17151.999 frames 357.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 17151 frames use 8575 for the backend arguments -I and -O 17151.999 frames 357.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 17151 frames use 8575 for the backend arguments -I and -O 17151.999 frames 357.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 17151 frames use 8575 for the backend arguments -I and -O 17151.999 frames 357.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 17151 frames use 8575 for the backend arguments -I and -O 17151.999 frames 357.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 17151 frames use 8575 for the backend arguments -I and -O 17151.999 frames 357.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 17151 frames use 8575 for the backend arguments -I and -O 17151.998 frames 357.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 17151 frames use 8575 for the backend arguments -I and -O 17151.998 frames 357.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 17151 frames use 8575 for the backend arguments -I and -O 17151.998 frames 357.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 17151 frames use 8575 for the backend arguments -I and -O 17151.998 frames 357.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 17151 frames use 8575 for the backend arguments -I and -O 17151.997 frames 357.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 17151 frames use 8575 for the backend arguments -I and -O 17151.998 frames 357.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 17151 frames use 8575 for the backend arguments -I and -O 17151.999 frames 357.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 17151 frames use 8575 for the backend arguments -I and -O 17151.998 frames 357.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 17151 frames use 8575 for the backend arguments -I and -O 17215.999 frames 358.667 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 17215 frames use 8607 for the backend arguments -I and -O 17215.999 frames 358.667 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 17215 frames use 8607 for the backend arguments -I and -O 17215.998 frames 358.667 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 17215 frames use 8607 for the backend arguments -I and -O 17215.998 frames 358.667 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 17215 frames use 8607 for the backend arguments -I and -O 17215.997 frames 358.667 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 17215 frames use 8607 for the backend arguments -I and -O 17215.997 frames 358.667 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 17215 frames use 8607 for the backend arguments -I and -O 17215.998 frames 358.667 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 17215 frames use 8607 for the backend arguments -I and -O 17215.998 frames 358.667 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 17215 frames use 8607 for the backend arguments -I and -O 17343.998 frames 361.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 17343 frames use 8671 for the backend arguments -I and -O 17343.998 frames 361.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 17343 frames use 8671 for the backend arguments -I and -O 17407.998 frames 362.667 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 17407 frames use 8703 for the backend arguments -I and -O 17407.998 frames 362.667 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 17407 frames use 8703 for the backend arguments -I and -O 17471.999 frames 364.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 17471 frames use 8735 for the backend arguments -I and -O 17471.997 frames 364.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 17471 frames use 8735 for the backend arguments -I and -O 17471.998 frames 364.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 17471 frames use 8735 for the backend arguments -I and -O 17471.998 frames 364.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 17471 frames use 8735 for the backend arguments -I and -O 17471.998 frames 364.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 17471 frames use 8735 for the backend arguments -I and -O 17471.998 frames 364.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 17471 frames use 8735 for the backend arguments -I and -O 17471.997 frames 364.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 17471 frames use 8735 for the backend arguments -I and -O 17471.998 frames 364.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 17471 frames use 8735 for the backend arguments -I and -O 17471.999 frames 364.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 17471 frames use 8735 for the backend arguments -I and -O 17599.998 frames 366.667 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 17599 frames use 8799 for the backend arguments -I and -O 17663.998 frames 368.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 17663 frames use 8831 for the backend arguments -I and -O 17663.997 frames 368.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 17663 frames use 8831 for the backend arguments -I and -O 17663.997 frames 368.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 17663 frames use 8831 for the backend arguments -I and -O 17663.998 frames 368.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 17663 frames use 8831 for the backend arguments -I and -O 17663.998 frames 368.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 17663 frames use 8831 for the backend arguments -I and -O 17663.998 frames 368.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 17663 frames use 8831 for the backend arguments -I and -O 17663.998 frames 368.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 17663 frames use 8831 for the backend arguments -I and -O 17663.997 frames 368.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 17663 frames use 8831 for the backend arguments -I and -O 17663.998 frames 368.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 17663 frames use 8831 for the backend arguments -I and -O 17663.998 frames 368.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 17663 frames use 8831 for the backend arguments -I and -O 17663.999 frames 368.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 17663 frames use 8831 for the backend arguments -I and -O 17663.999 frames 368.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 17663 frames use 8831 for the backend arguments -I and -O 17663.998 frames 368.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 17663 frames use 8831 for the backend arguments -I and -O 17663.998 frames 368.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 17663 frames use 8831 for the backend arguments -I and -O 17663.999 frames 368.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 17663 frames use 8831 for the backend arguments -I and -O 17663.998 frames 368.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 17663 frames use 8831 for the backend arguments -I and -O 17663.997 frames 368.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 17663 frames use 8831 for the backend arguments -I and -O 17663.998 frames 368.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 17663 frames use 8831 for the backend arguments -I and -O 17663.998 frames 368.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 17663 frames use 8831 for the backend arguments -I and -O 17791.999 frames 370.667 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 17791 frames use 8895 for the backend arguments -I and -O 17791.999 frames 370.667 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 17791 frames use 8895 for the backend arguments -I and -O 17791.999 frames 370.667 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 17791 frames use 8895 for the backend arguments -I and -O 17791.997 frames 370.667 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 17791 frames use 8895 for the backend arguments -I and -O 17791.998 frames 370.667 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 17791 frames use 8895 for the backend arguments -I and -O 17791.997 frames 370.667 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 17791 frames use 8895 for the backend arguments -I and -O 17791.998 frames 370.667 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 17791 frames use 8895 for the backend arguments -I and -O 17791.997 frames 370.667 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 17791 frames use 8895 for the backend arguments -I and -O 17791.997 frames 370.667 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 17791 frames use 8895 for the backend arguments -I and -O 17791.998 frames 370.667 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 17791 frames use 8895 for the backend arguments -I and -O 17791.998 frames 370.667 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 17791 frames use 8895 for the backend arguments -I and -O 17791.997 frames 370.667 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 17791 frames use 8895 for the backend arguments -I and -O 17791.998 frames 370.667 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 17791 frames use 8895 for the backend arguments -I and -O 17791.998 frames 370.667 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 17791 frames use 8895 for the backend arguments -I and -O 17791.998 frames 370.667 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 17791 frames use 8895 for the backend arguments -I and -O 17791.997 frames 370.667 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 17791 frames use 8895 for the backend arguments -I and -O 17791.998 frames 370.667 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 17791 frames use 8895 for the backend arguments -I and -O 17791.998 frames 370.667 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 17791 frames use 8895 for the backend arguments -I and -O 17791.998 frames 370.667 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 17791 frames use 8895 for the backend arguments -I and -O 17791.998 frames 370.667 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 17791 frames use 8895 for the backend arguments -I and -O 17791.998 frames 370.667 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 17791 frames use 8895 for the backend arguments -I and -O 17791.998 frames 370.667 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 17791 frames use 8895 for the backend arguments -I and -O 17791.998 frames 370.667 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 17791 frames use 8895 for the backend arguments -I and -O 17791.998 frames 370.667 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 17791 frames use 8895 for the backend arguments -I and -O 17791.999 frames 370.667 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 17791 frames use 8895 for the backend arguments -I and -O 17855.998 frames 372.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 17855 frames use 8927 for the backend arguments -I and -O 17855.998 frames 372.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 17855 frames use 8927 for the backend arguments -I and -O 17855.999 frames 372.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 17855 frames use 8927 for the backend arguments -I and -O 17855.999 frames 372.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 17855 frames use 8927 for the backend arguments -I and -O 17855.999 frames 372.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 17855 frames use 8927 for the backend arguments -I and -O 17855.999 frames 372.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 17855 frames use 8927 for the backend arguments -I and -O 17856.000 frames 372.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 17855 frames use 8927 for the backend arguments -I and -O 17856.001 frames 372.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 17856 frames use 8928 for the backend arguments -I and -O 17856.001 frames 372.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 17856 frames use 8928 for the backend arguments -I and -O 17856.001 frames 372.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 17856 frames use 8928 for the backend arguments -I and -O 17984.003 frames 374.667 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 17984 frames use 8992 for the backend arguments -I and -O 18112.005 frames 377.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 18112 frames use 9056 for the backend arguments -I and -O 18112.003 frames 377.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 18112 frames use 9056 for the backend arguments -I and -O 18112.001 frames 377.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 18112 frames use 9056 for the backend arguments -I and -O 18176.003 frames 378.667 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 18176 frames use 9088 for the backend arguments -I and -O 18176.006 frames 378.667 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 18176 frames use 9088 for the backend arguments -I and -O 18176.005 frames 378.667 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 18176 frames use 9088 for the backend arguments -I and -O 18176.005 frames 378.667 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 18176 frames use 9088 for the backend arguments -I and -O 18176.006 frames 378.667 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 18176 frames use 9088 for the backend arguments -I and -O 18176.007 frames 378.667 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 18176 frames use 9088 for the backend arguments -I and -O 18176.003 frames 378.667 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 18176 frames use 9088 for the backend arguments -I and -O 18175.999 frames 378.667 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 18175 frames use 9087 for the backend arguments -I and -O 18175.993 frames 378.667 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 18175 frames use 9087 for the backend arguments -I and -O 18175.991 frames 378.666 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 18175 frames use 9087 for the backend arguments -I and -O 18175.992 frames 378.667 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 18175 frames use 9087 for the backend arguments -I and -O 18175.992 frames 378.667 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 18175 frames use 9087 for the backend arguments -I and -O 18175.990 frames 378.666 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 18175 frames use 9087 for the backend arguments -I and -O 18175.988 frames 378.666 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 18175 frames use 9087 for the backend arguments -I and -O 18175.987 frames 378.666 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 18175 frames use 9087 for the backend arguments -I and -O 18175.985 frames 378.666 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 18175 frames use 9087 for the backend arguments -I and -O 18175.987 frames 378.666 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 18175 frames use 9087 for the backend arguments -I and -O 18175.987 frames 378.666 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 18175 frames use 9087 for the backend arguments -I and -O 18175.988 frames 378.666 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 18175 frames use 9087 for the backend arguments -I and -O 18175.988 frames 378.666 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 18175 frames use 9087 for the backend arguments -I and -O 18175.988 frames 378.666 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 18175 frames use 9087 for the backend arguments -I and -O 18175.988 frames 378.666 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 18175 frames use 9087 for the backend arguments -I and -O 18175.987 frames 378.666 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 18175 frames use 9087 for the backend arguments -I and -O 18239.989 frames 380.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 18239 frames use 9119 for the backend arguments -I and -O 18239.989 frames 380.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 18239 frames use 9119 for the backend arguments -I and -O 18303.987 frames 381.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 18303 frames use 9151 for the backend arguments -I and -O 18303.989 frames 381.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 18303 frames use 9151 for the backend arguments -I and -O 18303.988 frames 381.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 18303 frames use 9151 for the backend arguments -I and -O 18303.987 frames 381.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 18303 frames use 9151 for the backend arguments -I and -O 18303.987 frames 381.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 18303 frames use 9151 for the backend arguments -I and -O 18303.988 frames 381.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 18303 frames use 9151 for the backend arguments -I and -O 18303.989 frames 381.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 18303 frames use 9151 for the backend arguments -I and -O 18303.988 frames 381.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 18303 frames use 9151 for the backend arguments -I and -O 18303.990 frames 381.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 18303 frames use 9151 for the backend arguments -I and -O 18303.989 frames 381.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 18303 frames use 9151 for the backend arguments -I and -O 18303.989 frames 381.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 18303 frames use 9151 for the backend arguments -I and -O 18303.989 frames 381.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 18303 frames use 9151 for the backend arguments -I and -O 18431.989 frames 384.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 18431 frames use 9215 for the backend arguments -I and -O 18431.987 frames 384.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 18431 frames use 9215 for the backend arguments -I and -O 18431.989 frames 384.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 18431 frames use 9215 for the backend arguments -I and -O 18431.987 frames 384.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 18431 frames use 9215 for the backend arguments -I and -O 18431.987 frames 384.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 18431 frames use 9215 for the backend arguments -I and -O 18431.987 frames 384.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 18431 frames use 9215 for the backend arguments -I and -O 18431.988 frames 384.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 18431 frames use 9215 for the backend arguments -I and -O 18431.988 frames 384.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 18431 frames use 9215 for the backend arguments -I and -O 18431.988 frames 384.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 18431 frames use 9215 for the backend arguments -I and -O 18431.988 frames 384.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 18431 frames use 9215 for the backend arguments -I and -O 18431.988 frames 384.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 18431 frames use 9215 for the backend arguments -I and -O 18815.988 frames 392.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 18815 frames use 9407 for the backend arguments -I and -O ?? 18815.989 frames 392.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 18815 frames use 9407 for the backend arguments -I and -O 18815.988 frames 392.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 18815 frames use 9407 for the backend arguments -I and -O 18815.987 frames 392.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 18815 frames use 9407 for the backend arguments -I and -O 18815.988 frames 392.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 18815 frames use 9407 for the backend arguments -I and -O 18815.988 frames 392.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 18815 frames use 9407 for the backend arguments -I and -O 18815.990 frames 392.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 18815 frames use 9407 for the backend arguments -I and -O 18815.990 frames 392.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 18815 frames use 9407 for the backend arguments -I and -O 18815.990 frames 392.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 18815 frames use 9407 for the backend arguments -I and -O 18815.992 frames 392.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 18815 frames use 9407 for the backend arguments -I and -O 18815.992 frames 392.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 18815 frames use 9407 for the backend arguments -I and -O 18815.990 frames 392.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 18815 frames use 9407 for the backend arguments -I and -O 18815.987 frames 392.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 18815 frames use 9407 for the backend arguments -I and -O 18815.986 frames 392.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 18815 frames use 9407 for the backend arguments -I and -O 18815.988 frames 392.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 18815 frames use 9407 for the backend arguments -I and -O 18943.988 frames 394.666 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 18943 frames use 9471 for the backend arguments -I and -O 18943.989 frames 394.666 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 18943 frames use 9471 for the backend arguments -I and -O 18943.988 frames 394.666 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 18943 frames use 9471 for the backend arguments -I and -O 18943.985 frames 394.666 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 18943 frames use 9471 for the backend arguments -I and -O 18943.989 frames 394.666 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 18943 frames use 9471 for the backend arguments -I and -O 18943.988 frames 394.666 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 18943 frames use 9471 for the backend arguments -I and -O 19007.987 frames 396.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 19007 frames use 9503 for the backend arguments -I and -O 19007.988 frames 396.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 19007 frames use 9503 for the backend arguments -I and -O 19007.989 frames 396.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 19007 frames use 9503 for the backend arguments -I and -O 19007.989 frames 396.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 19007 frames use 9503 for the backend arguments -I and -O 19007.993 frames 396.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 19007 frames use 9503 for the backend arguments -I and -O 19007.989 frames 396.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 19007 frames use 9503 for the backend arguments -I and -O 19071.986 frames 397.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 19071 frames use 9535 for the backend arguments -I and -O 19071.988 frames 397.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 19071 frames use 9535 for the backend arguments -I and -O 19199.985 frames 400.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 19199 frames use 9599 for the backend arguments -I and -O 19199.988 frames 400.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 19199 frames use 9599 for the backend arguments -I and -O 19199.987 frames 400.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 19199 frames use 9599 for the backend arguments -I and -O 19199.987 frames 400.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 19199 frames use 9599 for the backend arguments -I and -O 19199.987 frames 400.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 19199 frames use 9599 for the backend arguments -I and -O 19199.988 frames 400.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 19199 frames use 9599 for the backend arguments -I and -O 19199.988 frames 400.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 19199 frames use 9599 for the backend arguments -I and -O 19199.988 frames 400.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 19199 frames use 9599 for the backend arguments -I and -O 19199.987 frames 400.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 19199 frames use 9599 for the backend arguments -I and -O 19199.988 frames 400.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 19199 frames use 9599 for the backend arguments -I and -O 19199.987 frames 400.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 19199 frames use 9599 for the backend arguments -I and -O 19199.987 frames 400.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 19199 frames use 9599 for the backend arguments -I and -O 19199.985 frames 400.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 19199 frames use 9599 for the backend arguments -I and -O 19199.984 frames 400.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 19199 frames use 9599 for the backend arguments -I and -O 19199.987 frames 400.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 19199 frames use 9599 for the backend arguments -I and -O 19519.986 frames 406.666 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 19519 frames use 9759 for the backend arguments -I and -O 19519.988 frames 406.666 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 19519 frames use 9759 for the backend arguments -I and -O 19519.988 frames 406.666 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 19519 frames use 9759 for the backend arguments -I and -O 19519.990 frames 406.666 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 19519 frames use 9759 for the backend arguments -I and -O 19519.991 frames 406.666 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 19519 frames use 9759 for the backend arguments -I and -O 19839.989 frames 413.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 19839 frames use 9919 for the backend arguments -I and -O 19839.987 frames 413.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 19839 frames use 9919 for the backend arguments -I and -O 21823.985 frames 454.666 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 21823 frames use 10911 for the backend arguments -I and -O 22655.986 frames 472.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 22655 frames use 11327 for the backend arguments -I and -O 22655.984 frames 472.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 22655 frames use 11327 for the backend arguments -I and -O 22655.987 frames 472.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 22655 frames use 11327 for the backend arguments -I and -O 22655.987 frames 472.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 22655 frames use 11327 for the backend arguments -I and -O 22655.987 frames 472.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 22655 frames use 11327 for the backend arguments -I and -O 22655.987 frames 472.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 22655 frames use 11327 for the backend arguments -I and -O 22655.989 frames 472.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 22655 frames use 11327 for the backend arguments -I and -O 22655.988 frames 472.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 22655 frames use 11327 for the backend arguments -I and -O 22655.991 frames 472.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 22655 frames use 11327 for the backend arguments -I and -O 22719.989 frames 473.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 22719 frames use 11359 for the backend arguments -I and -O 22783.988 frames 474.666 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 22783 frames use 11391 for the backend arguments -I and -O 22783.987 frames 474.666 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 22783 frames use 11391 for the backend arguments -I and -O 22783.987 frames 474.666 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 22783 frames use 11391 for the backend arguments -I and -O 23039.987 frames 480.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 23039 frames use 11519 for the backend arguments -I and -O 23039.987 frames 480.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 23039 frames use 11519 for the backend arguments -I and -O 23039.987 frames 480.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 23039 frames use 11519 for the backend arguments -I and -O 23103.988 frames 481.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 23103 frames use 11551 for the backend arguments -I and -O 23103.989 frames 481.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 23103 frames use 11551 for the backend arguments -I and -O 23103.989 frames 481.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 23103 frames use 11551 for the backend arguments -I and -O 23231.988 frames 484.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 23231 frames use 11615 for the backend arguments -I and -O 23231.987 frames 484.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 23231 frames use 11615 for the backend arguments -I and -O 23231.987 frames 484.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 23231 frames use 11615 for the backend arguments -I and -O 23359.986 frames 486.666 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 23359 frames use 11679 for the backend arguments -I and -O 23423.986 frames 488.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 23423 frames use 11711 for the backend arguments -I and -O 23423.986 frames 488.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 23423 frames use 11711 for the backend arguments -I and -O 23423.986 frames 488.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 23423 frames use 11711 for the backend arguments -I and -O 23423.986 frames 488.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 23423 frames use 11711 for the backend arguments -I and -O 23423.988 frames 488.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 23423 frames use 11711 for the backend arguments -I and -O 23423.988 frames 488.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 23423 frames use 11711 for the backend arguments -I and -O 23423.989 frames 488.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 23423 frames use 11711 for the backend arguments -I and -O 23423.988 frames 488.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 23423 frames use 11711 for the backend arguments -I and -O 23423.988 frames 488.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 23423 frames use 11711 for the backend arguments -I and -O 23423.988 frames 488.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 23423 frames use 11711 for the backend arguments -I and -O 23423.987 frames 488.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 23423 frames use 11711 for the backend arguments -I and -O 23423.986 frames 488.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 23423 frames use 11711 for the backend arguments -I and -O 23423.986 frames 488.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 23423 frames use 11711 for the backend arguments -I and -O 23423.986 frames 488.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 23423 frames use 11711 for the backend arguments -I and -O 23423.986 frames 488.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 23423 frames use 11711 for the backend arguments -I and -O 23423.987 frames 488.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 23423 frames use 11711 for the backend arguments -I and -O 23423.987 frames 488.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 23423 frames use 11711 for the backend arguments -I and -O 23423.988 frames 488.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 23423 frames use 11711 for the backend arguments -I and -O 23423.988 frames 488.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 23423 frames use 11711 for the backend arguments -I and -O 23423.988 frames 488.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 23423 frames use 11711 for the backend arguments -I and -O 23423.988 frames 488.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 23423 frames use 11711 for the backend arguments -I and -O 23423.988 frames 488.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 23423 frames use 11711 for the backend arguments -I and -O 23423.987 frames 488.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 23423 frames use 11711 for the backend arguments -I and -O 23423.987 frames 488.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 23423 frames use 11711 for the backend arguments -I and -O 23423.986 frames 488.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 23423 frames use 11711 for the backend arguments -I and -O 23423.987 frames 488.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 23423 frames use 11711 for the backend arguments -I and -O 23423.988 frames 488.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 23423 frames use 11711 for the backend arguments -I and -O 23423.988 frames 488.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 23423 frames use 11711 for the backend arguments -I and -O 23423.988 frames 488.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 23423 frames use 11711 for the backend arguments -I and -O 23423.988 frames 488.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 23423 frames use 11711 for the backend arguments -I and -O 23487.988 frames 489.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 23487 frames use 11743 for the backend arguments -I and -O 23487.989 frames 489.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 23487 frames use 11743 for the backend arguments -I and -O 23487.988 frames 489.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 23487 frames use 11743 for the backend arguments -I and -O 23487.988 frames 489.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 23487 frames use 11743 for the backend arguments -I and -O 23615.987 frames 492.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 23615 frames use 11807 for the backend arguments -I and -O 23615.987 frames 492.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 23615 frames use 11807 for the backend arguments -I and -O 23615.986 frames 492.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 23615 frames use 11807 for the backend arguments -I and -O 23679.986 frames 493.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 23679 frames use 11839 for the backend arguments -I and -O 23679.987 frames 493.333 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 23679 frames use 11839 for the backend arguments -I and -O 23743.987 frames 494.666 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 23743 frames use 11871 for the backend arguments -I and -O 23743.987 frames 494.666 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 23743 frames use 11871 for the backend arguments -I and -O 23743.988 frames 494.666 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 23743 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frames use 13151 for the backend arguments -I and -O 26431.992 frames 550.667 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 26431 frames use 13215 for the backend arguments -I and -O 26431.990 frames 550.666 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 26431 frames use 13215 for the backend arguments -I and -O 26431.992 frames 550.667 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 26431 frames use 13215 for the backend arguments -I and -O 26431.992 frames 550.667 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 26431 frames use 13215 for the backend arguments -I and -O 26431.992 frames 550.667 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 26431 frames use 13215 for the backend arguments -I and -O 26431.992 frames 550.667 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 26431 frames use 13215 for the backend arguments -I and -O 26431.992 frames 550.667 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 26431 frames use 13215 for the backend arguments -I and -O 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extra loopback latency: 26623 frames use 13311 for the backend arguments -I and -O 26623.991 frames 554.666 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 26623 frames use 13311 for the backend arguments -I and -O 27455.991 frames 572.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 27455 frames use 13727 for the backend arguments -I and -O 27455.991 frames 572.000 ms total roundtrip latency extra loopback latency: 27455 frames use 13727 for the backend arguments -I and -O ------------------ > >> > 3. If pa_source and pa_sink are a single Jack client (probably not), >> > subtract one period from the result of (2). >> >> Can you explain that with the data above? > > If they are a single Jack client you create a loop in Jack's > processing graph, this adds one period to the measurement. > > >> > 4. Add the two values. >> > >> >> I would like to provide an app for this task. Do you think it would be >> worthwhile to extend jack_iodelay for this purpose? > > Don't see how. You need to do two measurements anyway, no matter > how it's done, then add or substract. > > Ciao, > > -- > FA > > A world of exhaustive, reliable metadata would be an utopia. > It's also a pipe-dream, founded on self-delusion, nerd hubris > and hysterically inflated market opportunities. (Cory Doctorow) > > _______________________________________________ > Linux-audio-user mailing list > Linux-audio-user at lists.linuxaudio.org > http://lists.linuxaudio.org/listinfo/linux-audio-user > -- Patrick Shirkey Boost Hardware Ltd From ico at vt.edu Wed Sep 25 01:56:47 2013 From: ico at vt.edu (Ivica Ico Bukvic) Date: Tue, 24 Sep 2013 21:56:47 -0400 Subject: [LAU] pd-l2ork v.20130920 released Message-ID: <06fb01ceb992$7f03c3c0$7d0b4b40$@vt.edu> Apologies for x-posting... (given that this never made it through LAA, which may be just me being silly, here it is via the LAU list) It is my pleasure to announce the latest release of pd-l2ork free open-source visual programming language for interactive media, and supporting K12 educational module for the 32-bit and 64-bit Linux, as well as Raspberry Pi (Arm) platforms. pd-l2ork is the infrastructural backbone of Virginia Tech DISIS Linux Laptop Orchestra (http://l2ork.music.vt.edu). Highlights include: *Ported all vanilla GUI objects and events to cairo-based SVG-like tkpath canvas providing antialiased drawing capabilities, bezier patch cords, and setting stage for a zoomable canvas *Implemented a new scrollbar system using semi-transparent objects right on the canvas *Implemented filtering of autorepeat keyboard events for key, keyup, keyname objects *Expanded K12 library with numerous improvements and added a couple demo files *Backported resizable objects and recent files *Improved GUI appearance *Began porting 3rd party objects to new cairo-based canvas (non-accelerated 3rd-party objects can be recognized by having a blue selection box and their considerably slower redraw) *Cleaned-up extended pddp documentation and added comprehensive cyclone documentation *Began filtering (disabling) building of redundant externals within the cyclone and other 3rd-party libraries *Proper visual reordering without the potentially cpu-expensive canvas_redraw for all accelerated objects (non-accelerated 3rd-party objects can be recognized by having a blue selection box and their considerably slower redraw) *Disabled drawing of redundant nlets for objects embedded inside a GOP object (for Max users, equivalent to a bpatcher) *Embedded tkdnd and tkpath libs directly into source for a monolithic build; made several improvements to the tkpath lib fork *Many other minor bugfixes and improvements (see Changelog for more info) A screenshot of the K12 module is attached. Alternatively, it can be found at: http://puredata.info/downloads/Pd-L2Ork/releases/20130920/screenshot/image_v iew_fullscreen Complete Changelog: http://puredata.info/downloads/Pd-L2Ork/releases/20130920/ Download Links: Binary Builds & Documentation: http://l2ork.music.vt.edu/main/?page_id=56 Source: http:///github.com/pd-l2ork/ Best wishes, -- Ivica Ico Bukvic, D.M.A Composition, Music Technology Director, DISIS Interactive Sound & Intermedia Studio Director, L2Ork Linux Laptop Orchestra Head, ICAT IMPACT Studio Virginia Tech Department of Music Blacksburg, VA 24061-0240 (540) 231-6139 (540) 231-5034 (fax) disis.music.vt.edu l2ork.music.vt.edu ico.bukvic.net -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: pd-l2ork K12.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 98086 bytes Desc: not available URL: From zettberlin at linuxuse.de Wed Sep 25 14:08:32 2013 From: zettberlin at linuxuse.de (Hartmut Noack) Date: Wed, 25 Sep 2013 16:08:32 +0200 Subject: [LAU] FingerPlayServer in Ubuntu In-Reply-To: References: <52429CC8.6090703@linuxuse.de> Message-ID: <5242EE60.9090209@linuxuse.de> Am 25.09.2013 14:17, schrieb Rafael Vega: > Maybe you need to start the a2j (alsa to jack) midi bridge? It's in the KX > repos and you can start it / stop it from the cadence GUI or from a > terminal. a2jmidi_bridge and a2jmidid is running as always ;-) > > > On Wed, Sep 25, 2013 at 3:20 AM, Hartmut Noack wrote: > >> Hello, >> >> FingerPlayMIDI is a very nice App for Android, that turns the >> touchscreen of a device into a MIDI-Controller with sliders, matrix and >> pads. >> >> http://code.google.com/p/fingerplaymidi >> >> I used it without any problem in Fedora 17 using its >> FingerPlayServer-component on the Linux-Box to connect the stream from >> the phone. It is a Java-Program, that is supposed to create a port like >> this: >> >> FingerPlayServer v0.8.0 >> >> Listening on 127.0.1.1:4444 >> Waiting for connection from phone.. >> Phone connected. >> Set MIDI Device: VirMIDI [hw:3,3,11] >> >> >> As said before, this worked perfectly OK in Fedora 17 but alas! In >> Ubuntu 13.04 with KXStudio Layer the server starts as expected but there >> is no port in Alsa-MIDI to be found. >> >> The server gets the signals OK and reports no errors. >> >> Does someone know, what could have changed in ALSA-MIDI and/or Jack-MIDI >> that this port from a Java-app is not accepted anymore? >> >> best regards >> >> HZN >> _______________________________________________ >> Linux-audio-user mailing list >> Linux-audio-user at lists.linuxaudio.org >> http://lists.linuxaudio.org/listinfo/linux-audio-user >> > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > Linux-audio-user mailing list > Linux-audio-user at lists.linuxaudio.org > http://lists.linuxaudio.org/listinfo/linux-audio-user > From mnegrao.lists at gmail.com Wed Sep 25 16:36:20 2013 From: mnegrao.lists at gmail.com (Miguel Negrao) Date: Wed, 25 Sep 2013 17:36:20 +0100 Subject: [LAU] jack firewire + built in audio Message-ID: Hi Just wanted to check if there's an official approach to my situation: I have a macbook pro, sometimes I use the built in sound card (jack with alsa backend) and sometimes I use a MOTU soundcard (jack with firewire backend from ffado). I switch from one to other all the time, multiple times per day. I have several issues with that: - For each sound card I need to boot jack with different settings (basically just different backend ). - The names for the connections are different, for alsa they appear as 'system_0', etc. for firewire they are 'firewire_pcm'. - Going from one config to the other I need to stop jack and restart it with the new settings. In OSX to switch from one sound card to another, it's as simple as removing the firewire cable and sound will migrate to the internal sound card, plugging it back again migrates again to firewire ( I had firewire as default). I would like to mimick the OSX behaviour as close as possible. Currently I have a script at startime that checks for the existence of /dev/fw1 and boots with the right parameters [1] Also in supercollider I have to run this code [2] at startup to connect to right inputs/outputs. I was just wondering if there is a simpler solution to this, or if there is some plan to make it easier to switch soundcard with jack in the future ? Would there be any way to monitor firewire appearing and disappearing and running an appropriate script ? thanks, Miguel Negr?o [1] The script is written in Haskell: #!/usr/bin/env runhaskell {-# LANGUAGE QuasiQuotes, OverloadedStrings #-} import Shelly import Shelly.Background import Prelude hiding (FilePath) import qualified Data.Text.Lazy as T import qualified Data.ByteString.Char8 as B import Control.Concurrent import Data.List (isInfixOf, sort) import Text.Shakespeare.Text (lt) import Filesystem.Path.CurrentOS hiding (fromText, (<.>)) import Text.ShellEscape import System.Environment runC x xs = catchany_sh (run x xs) (\_ -> return "x" ) main = shelly.verbosely $ do runC "killall" ["-9", "jackdbus" ] runC "killall" ["-9", "jackd"] runC "killall" ["-9", "qjackctl.real"] fwExists <- test_e "/dev/fw1" echo [lt|Firewire detected: #{show fwExists} |] if fwExists then do run "ffado-test" ["BusReset"] run "sleep" ["5"]; run "sh" ["-c", "qjackctl -s -p firewire" ] else do run "sleep" ["5"]; run "sh" ["-c", "qjackctl -s -p alsa" ] exit 0 [2] var jack_device = if("jack_lsp | grep firewire".systemCmd == 0){ "firewire_pcm" }{ "system" }; "SC_JACK_DEFAULT_INPUTS".setenv(jack_device); "SC_JACK_DEFAULT_OUTPUTS".setenv(jack_device); -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From pedro.lopez.cabanillas at gmail.com Wed Sep 25 16:45:20 2013 From: pedro.lopez.cabanillas at gmail.com (Pedro Lopez-Cabanillas) Date: Wed, 25 Sep 2013 18:45:20 +0200 Subject: [LAU] FingerPlayServer in Ubuntu In-Reply-To: <52429CC8.6090703@linuxuse.de> References: <52429CC8.6090703@linuxuse.de> Message-ID: <7584760.ZVEfEhyLek@boccanegra.localdomain> On Wednesday 25 September 2013 10:20:24 Hartmut Noack wrote: > Hello, > > FingerPlayMIDI is a very nice App for Android, that turns the > touchscreen of a device into a MIDI-Controller with sliders, matrix and > pads. > > http://code.google.com/p/fingerplaymidi > > I used it without any problem in Fedora 17 using its > FingerPlayServer-component on the Linux-Box to connect the stream from > the phone. It is a Java-Program, that is supposed to create a port like > this: > > FingerPlayServer v0.8.0 > > Listening on 127.0.1.1:4444 > Waiting for connection from phone.. > Phone connected. > Set MIDI Device: VirMIDI [hw:3,3,11] > > > As said before, this worked perfectly OK in Fedora 17 but alas! In > Ubuntu 13.04 with KXStudio Layer the server starts as expected but there > is no port in Alsa-MIDI to be found. > > The server gets the signals OK and reports no errors. > > Does someone know, what could have changed in ALSA-MIDI and/or Jack-MIDI > that this port from a Java-app is not accepted anymore? Try loading the ALSA virmidi module: $ sudo modprobe snd-virmidi If you need this module automagically loaded on boot, then add a line to /etc/modules: $ sudo echo "snd-virmidi" >> /etc/modules Regards, Pedro From paul at linuxaudiosystems.com Wed Sep 25 17:04:23 2013 From: paul at linuxaudiosystems.com (Paul Davis) Date: Wed, 25 Sep 2013 13:04:23 -0400 Subject: [LAU] jack firewire + built in audio In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Wed, Sep 25, 2013 at 12:36 PM, Miguel Negrao wrote: > > > I was just wondering if there is a simpler solution to this, or if there > is some plan to make it easier to switch soundcard with jack in the future ? > such plans do exist. nothing has been done about them thus far. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From brummer- at web.de Wed Sep 25 17:13:08 2013 From: brummer- at web.de (hermann meyer) Date: Wed, 25 Sep 2013 19:13:08 +0200 Subject: [LAU] FingerPlayServer in Ubuntu In-Reply-To: <7584760.ZVEfEhyLek@boccanegra.localdomain> References: <52429CC8.6090703@linuxuse.de> <7584760.ZVEfEhyLek@boccanegra.localdomain> Message-ID: <524319A4.9090104@web.de> Am 25.09.2013 18:45, schrieb Pedro Lopez-Cabanillas: > On Wednesday 25 September 2013 10:20:24 Hartmut Noack wrote: >> Hello, >> >> FingerPlayMIDI is a very nice App for Android, that turns the >> touchscreen of a device into a MIDI-Controller with sliders, matrix and >> pads. >> >> http://code.google.com/p/fingerplaymidi >> >> I used it without any problem in Fedora 17 using its >> FingerPlayServer-component on the Linux-Box to connect the stream from >> the phone. It is a Java-Program, that is supposed to create a port like >> this: >> > Try loading the ALSA virmidi module: > > $ sudo modprobe snd-virmidi > > If you need this module automagically loaded on boot, then add a line to > /etc/modules: > > $ sudo echo "snd-virmidi" >> /etc/modules > > > Regards, > Pedro > > I'm using Wireless Mixer https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.bti.wirelessMixer&hl=de it comes with a server for linux which create his own port under the alsa tab. I've tried fingerplaymidi before, but it crashed here when I try to connect it with the server. Wireless Mixer do auto connect as soon the server run and works out of the box. Here you get the server https://code.google.com/p/dsmi/ (you need to run "qmake ." to create the make file, then make and run it) greets hermann From ico at vt.edu Wed Sep 25 20:20:40 2013 From: ico at vt.edu (Ivica Ico Bukvic) Date: Wed, 25 Sep 2013 16:20:40 -0400 Subject: [LAU] did anyone hear anything new regarding dante protocol support under linux? Message-ID: <00de01ceba2c$b575b2c0$20611840$@vt.edu> I guess title says it all... I saw posts from last year that suggest Audiante had no interest in supporting Linux. Has anyone heard of any progress on this one? Ivica Ico Bukvic, D.M.A. Composition, Music Technology Director, DISIS Interactive Sound & Intermedia Studio Director, L2Ork Linux Laptop Orchestra Head, ICAT IMPACT Studio Virginia Tech Dept. of Music - 0240 Blacksburg, VA 24061 (540) 231-6139 (540) 231-5034 (fax) ico at vt.edu http://www.music.vt.edu/faculty/bukvic/ From jeremy at autostatic.com Wed Sep 25 21:54:33 2013 From: jeremy at autostatic.com (Jeremy Jongepier) Date: Wed, 25 Sep 2013 23:54:33 +0200 Subject: [LAU] jack firewire + built in audio In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <52435B99.70204@autostatic.com> On 09/25/2013 07:04 PM, Paul Davis wrote: > On Wed, Sep 25, 2013 at 12:36 PM, Miguel Negrao wrote: > >> >> >> I was just wondering if there is a simpler solution to this, or if there >> is some plan to make it easier to switch soundcard with jack in the future ? >> > > such plans do exist. nothing has been done about them thus far. > http://www.gareus.org/blog/jack2dbus But I'm not sure if this also allows you to switch driver backends. Best, Jeremy -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 836 bytes Desc: OpenPGP digital signature URL: From zettberlin at linuxuse.de Thu Sep 26 08:03:40 2013 From: zettberlin at linuxuse.de (Hartmut Noack) Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2013 10:03:40 +0200 Subject: [LAU] FingerPlayServer in Ubuntu In-Reply-To: <7584760.ZVEfEhyLek@boccanegra.localdomain> References: <52429CC8.6090703@linuxuse.de> <7584760.ZVEfEhyLek@boccanegra.localdomain> Message-ID: <5243EA5C.60603@linuxuse.de> Am 25.09.2013 18:45, schrieb Pedro Lopez-Cabanillas: > $ sudo modprobe snd-virmidi Just great! Thanks a lot! To be perfectly honest: it looks, like I had simply forgotten to remember that step.... ;-) Now it works perfectly Thanks again and best regards. HZN From louigi.verona at gmail.com Thu Sep 26 08:46:58 2013 From: louigi.verona at gmail.com (Louigi Verona) Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2013 12:46:58 +0400 Subject: [LAU] droning219 - droning232 Message-ID: Slowly, but adamantly I continue to work on my "droning" project. 14 new tunes released, for your pleasure. Enjoy! http://www.louigiverona.ru/?page=projects&s=music&t=droning -- Louigi Verona http://www.louigiverona.ru/ -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From nettings at stackingdwarves.net Thu Sep 26 12:05:30 2013 From: nettings at stackingdwarves.net (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?J=F6rn_Nettingsmeier?=) Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2013 14:05:30 +0200 Subject: [LAU] did anyone hear anything new regarding dante protocol support under linux? In-Reply-To: <00de01ceba2c$b575b2c0$20611840$@vt.edu> References: <00de01ceba2c$b575b2c0$20611840$@vt.edu> Message-ID: <5244230A.5050702@stackingdwarves.net> On 09/25/2013 10:20 PM, Ivica Ico Bukvic wrote: > I guess title says it all... I saw posts from last year that suggest > Audiante had no interest in supporting Linux. Has anyone heard of any > progress on this one? no, i guess that statement still stands. we could lobby alcnetworx to provide a virtual soundcard driver for ravenna, or wait for the aes x192 working group to come up with a reference implementation for linux... under the hood, all these protocols are similar enough that basic signal exchange should be possible, unless vendors sabotage it actively for strategic reasons. -- J?rn Nettingsmeier Lortzingstr. 11, 45128 Essen, Tel. +49 177 7937487 Meister f?r Veranstaltungstechnik (B?hne/Studio) Tonmeister VDT http://stackingdwarves.net From thomas.janu at gmail.com Thu Sep 26 12:30:09 2013 From: thomas.janu at gmail.com (Thomas Janu) Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2013 14:30:09 +0200 Subject: [LAU] did anyone hear anything new regarding dante protocol support under linux? In-Reply-To: <00de01ceba2c$b575b2c0$20611840$@vt.edu> References: <00de01ceba2c$b575b2c0$20611840$@vt.edu> Message-ID: On Wed, Sep 25, 2013 at 10:20 PM, Ivica Ico Bukvic wrote: > I guess title says it all... I saw posts from last year that suggest > Audiante had no interest in supporting Linux. Has anyone heard of any > progress on this one? > I personally don't have anything to do with that, but for one commercial project here at my company we are using Dante on linux with the driver being supplied by 4Audio (http://www.fouraudio.com, the German reseller for dante products and support contact within Germany). Therefore I can say that drivers _are_ available, but you have to specifically ask and pay for them. Regards, Thomas -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From ico at vt.edu Thu Sep 26 12:50:06 2013 From: ico at vt.edu (Ivica Bukvic) Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2013 08:50:06 -0400 Subject: [LAU] did anyone hear anything new regarding dante protocol support under linux? In-Reply-To: References: <00de01ceba2c$b575b2c0$20611840$@vt.edu> Message-ID: Interesting... Many thanks all for your replies! On Sep 26, 2013 8:30 AM, "Thomas Janu" wrote: > On Wed, Sep 25, 2013 at 10:20 PM, Ivica Ico Bukvic wrote: > >> I guess title says it all... I saw posts from last year that suggest >> Audiante had no interest in supporting Linux. Has anyone heard of any >> progress on this one? >> > > I personally don't have anything to do with that, but for one commercial > project here at my company we are using Dante on linux with the driver > being supplied by 4Audio (http://www.fouraudio.com, the German reseller > for dante products and support contact within Germany). Therefore I can say > that drivers _are_ available, but you have to specifically ask and pay for > them. > > Regards, > Thomas > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From nettings at stackingdwarves.net Thu Sep 26 18:44:48 2013 From: nettings at stackingdwarves.net (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?J=F6rn_Nettingsmeier?=) Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2013 20:44:48 +0200 Subject: [LAU] did anyone hear anything new regarding dante protocol support under linux? In-Reply-To: References: <00de01ceba2c$b575b2c0$20611840$@vt.edu> Message-ID: <524480A0.4060703@stackingdwarves.net> On 09/26/2013 02:30 PM, Thomas Janu wrote: > On Wed, Sep 25, 2013 at 10:20 PM, Ivica Ico Bukvic > wrote: > > I guess title says it all... I saw posts from last year that suggest > Audiante had no interest in supporting Linux. Has anyone heard of any > progress on this one? > > > I personally don't have anything to do with that, but for one commercial > project here at my company we are using Dante on linux with the driver > being supplied by 4Audio (http://www.fouraudio.com, the German reseller > for dante products and support contact within Germany). Therefore I can > say that drivers _are_ available, but you have to specifically ask and > pay for them. very interesting. thanks for the pointer! -- J?rn Nettingsmeier Lortzingstr. 11, 45128 Essen, Tel. +49 177 7937487 Meister f?r Veranstaltungstechnik (B?hne/Studio) Tonmeister VDT http://stackingdwarves.net From grekimj at acousticrefuge.com Fri Sep 27 13:37:00 2013 From: grekimj at acousticrefuge.com (Grekim Jennings) Date: Fri, 27 Sep 2013 09:37:00 -0400 Subject: [LAU] sample rate converter? Message-ID: <524589FC.2080108@acousticrefuge.com> Hi, I need to convert 24-bit 48000 .wav to 44100 .wav. What's your go-to converter for this? Quality would be my first consideration, 2nd would be ease of install or build, 3rd would be I have a preference for command line. This would be for off-line use. Thanks! Grekim From fons at linuxaudio.org Fri Sep 27 13:49:57 2013 From: fons at linuxaudio.org (Fons Adriaensen) Date: Fri, 27 Sep 2013 13:49:57 +0000 Subject: [LAU] sample rate converter? In-Reply-To: <524589FC.2080108@acousticrefuge.com> References: <524589FC.2080108@acousticrefuge.com> Message-ID: <20130927134957.GC30592@linuxaudio.org> On Fri, Sep 27, 2013 at 09:37:00AM -0400, Grekim Jennings wrote: > I need to convert 24-bit 48000 .wav to 44100 .wav. > What's your go-to converter for this? > Quality would be my first consideration, > 2nd would be ease of install or build, > 3rd would be I have a preference for command line. > This would be for off-line use. I use zresample wich comes as an example app with the zita-resampler library. Apart from resampling it can also change the sample format, and add dither if the output is 16-bit. It handles any number of channels. > zresample --help zresample 1.4.0 (C) 2007-2012 Fons Adriaensen Usage: zresample . Options: Display this text: --help Output file type: --caf, --wav, --amb Output sample rate: --rate Output sample format: --16bit, --24bit, --float Dither type (16 bit): --rec, --tri, --lips Add zero padding : --pad The default output file format is wav, 24-bit, no dithering. Integer output formats are clipped, float output is not. Ciao, -- FA A world of exhaustive, reliable metadata would be an utopia. It's also a pipe-dream, founded on self-delusion, nerd hubris and hysterically inflated market opportunities. (Cory Doctorow) From grekimj at acousticrefuge.com Fri Sep 27 14:10:00 2013 From: grekimj at acousticrefuge.com (Grekim Jennings) Date: Fri, 27 Sep 2013 10:10:00 -0400 Subject: [LAU] sample rate converter? Message-ID: <524591B8.4070000@acousticrefuge.com> On Fri, Sep 27, 2013 at 09:37:00AM -0400, Grekim Jennings wrote: >/ I need to convert 24-bit 48000 .wav to 44100 .wav. />/ What's your go-to converter for this? />/ Quality would be my first consideration, />/ 2nd would be ease of install or build, />/ 3rd would be I have a preference for command line. />/ This would be for off-line use. / I use zresample wich comes as an example app with the zita-resampler library. Apart from resampling it can also change the sample format, and add dither if the output is 16-bit. It handles any number of channels. >/ zresample --help / zresample 1.4.0 (C) 2007-2012 Fons Adriaensen > Usage: zresample . Options: Display this text: --help Output file type: --caf, --wav, --amb Output sample rate: --rate Output sample format: --16bit, --24bit, --float Dither type (16 bit): --rec, --tri, --lips Add zero padding : --pad The default output file format is wav, 24-bit, no dithering. Integer output formats are clipped, float output is not. Ciao, -- FA Thanks Fons. Do you have a recommendation for how much headroom to leave before the conversion, and if you do clip during the conversion is there any sort of warning? I used to leave around 1.5 dB. The way I used to go about this was to apply all limiting to the 24-bit 48000 kHz track, then SR convert, then normalize (to ~ -0.3 dB) or set a final level, and finally dither/quantize. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From peter at peterlutek.com Fri Sep 27 14:15:14 2013 From: peter at peterlutek.com (peter at peterlutek.com) Date: Fri, 27 Sep 2013 10:15:14 -0400 Subject: [LAU] sample rate converter? In-Reply-To: <20130927134957.GC30592@linuxaudio.org> References: <524589FC.2080108@acousticrefuge.com> <20130927134957.GC30592@linuxaudio.org> Message-ID: <29b4b01e6f675d1548040c95ebb98c08.squirrel@webmail.dreamhost.com> > On Fri, Sep 27, 2013 at 09:37:00AM -0400, Grekim Jennings wrote: > >> I need to convert 24-bit 48000 .wav to 44100 .wav. >> What's your go-to converter for this? >> Quality would be my first consideration, >> 2nd would be ease of install or build, >> 3rd would be I have a preference for command line. >> This would be for off-line use. > > I use zresample wich comes as an example app with the zita-resampler > library. Apart from resampling it can also change the sample format, > and add dither if the output is 16-bit. It handles any number of > channels. also, of course, sox (which has a larger selection of dithers if you need that). and there's sndfile-convert (in the suite of libsamplerate tools). there have been some debates over the years about respective quality of these various tools... i'd be interested if anyone has recent test results! cheers! .pltk. From rustys.lists at gmail.com Fri Sep 27 15:29:44 2013 From: rustys.lists at gmail.com (Rusty Perez) Date: Fri, 27 Sep 2013 08:29:44 -0700 Subject: [LAU] small pops during crossfade Message-ID: Hi folks, I'm performing some edits on an audio track. I have two versions of a track, side by side, and am cross fading between the tracks to produce one good version. But, I'm hearing what sounds like a small pop or click at the fade point. The crossfade is set to be about 0.02 seconds long because this is a rhythm guitar track. Anyway, would longer fades illiminate the sound I'm hearing? I'm wondering if this has to do with the digital domain, samples and stuff, which I don't fully understand. :-) It's quite subtle, and in the mix probably inaudible, but I would like not to have it. Thanks! Rusty From fons at linuxaudio.org Fri Sep 27 15:33:52 2013 From: fons at linuxaudio.org (Fons Adriaensen) Date: Fri, 27 Sep 2013 15:33:52 +0000 Subject: [LAU] small pops during crossfade In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20130927153352.GE30592@linuxaudio.org> On Fri, Sep 27, 2013 at 08:29:44AM -0700, Rusty Perez wrote: > But, I'm hearing what sounds like a small pop or click at the fade point. > The crossfade is set to be about 0.02 seconds long because this is a > rhythm guitar track. > Anyway, would longer fades illiminate the sound I'm hearing? Why don't you try ??? > I'm wondering if this has to do with the digital domain, samples and > stuff, which I don't fully understand. :-) No. It's difficult to say more, you don't even name the SW you are using and how the xfade is done. Ciao, -- FA A world of exhaustive, reliable metadata would be an utopia. It's also a pipe-dream, founded on self-delusion, nerd hubris and hysterically inflated market opportunities. (Cory Doctorow) From ralf.mardorf at alice-dsl.net Fri Sep 27 15:39:34 2013 From: ralf.mardorf at alice-dsl.net (Ralf Mardorf) Date: Fri, 27 Sep 2013 17:39:34 +0200 Subject: [LAU] small pops during crossfade In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <1380296374.742.2.camel@archlinux> One track ends or the other track starts or one track ends and the other track starts with the click ;). Move the end and start points of the tracks to get rid of it. Take a look at the end and start points of the waveform using an editor. From linuxaudio at showlabor.de Fri Sep 27 16:57:24 2013 From: linuxaudio at showlabor.de (Felix Homann) Date: Fri, 27 Sep 2013 18:57:24 +0200 Subject: [LAU] sample rate converter? In-Reply-To: <524591B8.4070000@acousticrefuge.com> References: <524591B8.4070000@acousticrefuge.com> Message-ID: 2013/9/27 Grekim Jennings > > Thanks Fons. Do you have a recommendation for how much headroom to leave > before the conversion, and if you do clip during the conversion is there > any sort of warning? I used to leave around 1.5 dB. The way I used to > go about this was to apply all limiting to the 24-bit 48000 kHz track, > then SR convert, then normalize (to ~ -0.3 dB) or set a final level, and > finally dither/quantize. > > I don't know about zresample but (if my memory doesn't fail me) sndfile-resample automatically restarts in case of clipping and adds some headroom. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From nettings at stackingdwarves.net Fri Sep 27 20:00:25 2013 From: nettings at stackingdwarves.net (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?J=F6rn_Nettingsmeier?=) Date: Fri, 27 Sep 2013 22:00:25 +0200 Subject: [LAU] sample rate converter? In-Reply-To: <29b4b01e6f675d1548040c95ebb98c08.squirrel@webmail.dreamhost.com> References: <524589FC.2080108@acousticrefuge.com> <20130927134957.GC30592@linuxaudio.org> <29b4b01e6f675d1548040c95ebb98c08.squirrel@webmail.dreamhost.com> Message-ID: <5245E3D9.30408@stackingdwarves.net> On 09/27/2013 04:15 PM, peter at peterlutek.com wrote: >> On Fri, Sep 27, 2013 at 09:37:00AM -0400, Grekim Jennings wrote: >> >>> I need to convert 24-bit 48000 .wav to 44100 .wav. >>> What's your go-to converter for this? >>> Quality would be my first consideration, >>> 2nd would be ease of install or build, >>> 3rd would be I have a preference for command line. >>> This would be for off-line use. >> >> I use zresample wich comes as an example app with the zita-resampler >> library. Apart from resampling it can also change the sample format, >> and add dither if the output is 16-bit. It handles any number of >> channels. > > also, of course, sox (which has a larger selection of dithers if you need > that). and there's sndfile-convert (in the suite of libsamplerate tools). > > there have been some debates over the years about respective quality of > these various tools... i'd be interested if anyone has recent test > results! http://src.infinitewave.ca/ zita has been in there for a while, and it looks good. :) note: before anyone gets their panties all in a knot about aliasing, look at the color scale. even if it looks scary, it's probably at -120dB. if you want to see bad, check out the wavosaur. :) -- J?rn Nettingsmeier Lortzingstr. 11, 45128 Essen, Tel. +49 177 7937487 Meister f?r Veranstaltungstechnik (B?hne/Studio) Tonmeister VDT http://stackingdwarves.net From blablack at gmail.com Fri Sep 27 20:21:05 2013 From: blablack at gmail.com (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Aur=E9lien_Leblond?=) Date: Fri, 27 Sep 2013 21:21:05 +0100 Subject: [LAU] Launchpad S and Linux In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Hi all, I'm thinking of getting the Launchpad S and I was wondering if anybody had any go at them with our favourite operating system: - the Novation website says the S version of the Launchpad doesn't need a driver ans is therfore compatible with Linux. Is it simply seen as a MIDI device? - Would Hydrogen or SooperLooper be compatible with it? I know it might be a stupid question if it is a midi device, I'm just curious how it would interact with the tools we have. - It might be a misconception on my part, but from the videos available online it looks like software can control the device to change colors of the pads... I would be curious to know if say SooperLooper can control the Launchpad a light up the corresponding pad if the loop is muted or not Thanks for any information you guys and girls might have, I'd really love to be able to use it! Aur?lien -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From fons at linuxaudio.org Fri Sep 27 21:15:43 2013 From: fons at linuxaudio.org (Fons Adriaensen) Date: Fri, 27 Sep 2013 21:15:43 +0000 Subject: [LAU] sample rate converter? In-Reply-To: <524591B8.4070000@acousticrefuge.com> References: <524591B8.4070000@acousticrefuge.com> Message-ID: <20130927211543.GB4574@linuxaudio.org> On Fri, Sep 27, 2013 at 10:10:00AM -0400, Grekim Jennings wrote: > Thanks Fons. Do you have a recommendation for how much headroom to leave > before the conversion, and if you do clip during the conversion is there > any sort of warning? I used to leave around 1.5 dB. The way I used to > go about this was to apply all limiting to the 24-bit 48000 kHz track, > then SR convert, then normalize (to ~ -0.3 dB) or set a final level, and > finally dither/quantize. In theory there is no limit to the inter-sample peak level. It *could* matter for some technical test signals etc. For normal music signals even 0.5 dB should be enough, and even if it clips you very probably won't notice. Ciao, -- FA A world of exhaustive, reliable metadata would be an utopia. It's also a pipe-dream, founded on self-delusion, nerd hubris and hysterically inflated market opportunities. (Cory Doctorow) From len at ovenwerks.net Fri Sep 27 21:59:54 2013 From: len at ovenwerks.net (Len Ovens) Date: Fri, 27 Sep 2013 14:59:54 -0700 Subject: [LAU] Launchpad S and Linux In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <22da7771f0489af6a9394ae962d304a9.squirrel@ssl.ovenwerks.net> On Fri, September 27, 2013 1:21 pm, Aur?lien Leblond wrote: > I'm thinking of getting the Launchpad S and I was wondering if anybody had > any go at them with our favourite operating system: > - the Novation website says the S version of the Launchpad doesn't need a > driver ans is therfore compatible with Linux. Is it simply seen as a MIDI > device? If you go to the website, select support->downloads and run a search for "launchpad s" (which does not mean saucy on launchpad :) It will give a list of things you can download. There are 3 of them that are pdf docs. I grabbed them al, but it appears the one you want is launchpad-s-prm.pdf. The programmers reference manual. The very first line says: "Launchpad S communicates using MIDI over USB in both directions. This is the only interface that the device supports. By describing the MIDI communication format, this manual contains all the information you need to be able to write software that is customised for Launchpad S." So, You are being told that the Launchpad S appears to linux like a MIDI device just the same as any keyboard would. The rest of the manual tells you what the midi commands are that it sends and knows how to receive. Compatibility with sw would depend on what you wish it to do. It may require a program to send midi strings to it to set it up to send what the sw you want to control needs to make it do what you want. The unit comes with some setups that work with Ableton, but not any other windows sw. however, because it is open, it should not be hard to set it up to work with other things too. -- Len Ovens www.OvenWerks.net From grekimj at acousticrefuge.com Sat Sep 28 00:21:47 2013 From: grekimj at acousticrefuge.com (Grekim Jennings) Date: Fri, 27 Sep 2013 20:21:47 -0400 Subject: [LAU] sample rate converter? Message-ID: <5246211B.6090904@acousticrefuge.com> In theory there is no limit to the inter-sample peak level. It *could* matter for some technical test signals etc. For normal music signals even 0.5 dB should be enough, and even if it clips you very probably won't notice. Ciao, -- FA Interesting. Well, I would catch any overs anyway when doing the dithering. So, I compiled zresample without a hitch and it worked wonderfully. FYI, in this case the input and output files differed by about 0.01 dB. Thanks for the other suggestions (Hi Peter!). From atte at youmail.dk Sat Sep 28 11:35:26 2013 From: atte at youmail.dk (Atte) Date: Sat, 28 Sep 2013 13:35:26 +0200 Subject: [LAU] Launchpad S and Linux In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <5246BEFE.9070301@youmail.dk> On 09/27/2013 10:21 PM, Aur?lien Leblond wrote: > Thanks for any information you guys and girls might have, I'd really > love to be able to use it! I have the regular, old launchpad. It works well, although I have to jumps some hoops to work around running status: http://linux-audio.4202.n7.nabble.com/strange-behaviour-with-novation-launchpad-td57888.html -- Atte http://atte.dk http://modlys.dk From ralf.mardorf at alice-dsl.net Sat Sep 28 12:16:58 2013 From: ralf.mardorf at alice-dsl.net (Ralf Mardorf) Date: Sat, 28 Sep 2013 14:16:58 +0200 Subject: [LAU] Launchpad S and Linux In-Reply-To: <5246BEFE.9070301@youmail.dk> References: <5246BEFE.9070301@youmail.dk> Message-ID: <1380370618.6343.4.camel@archlinux> On Sat, 2013-09-28 at 13:35 +0200, Atte wrote: > I have to jumps some hoops to work around running status Years ago I ask to include an option to turn off running status for Linux software, since old external hardware very seldom has got a broken MIDI implementation. However, that new software has got issues with running status is ridiculous, you should file a bug, the coders should implement running status. From kaspar.bumke at gmail.com Sat Sep 28 18:19:11 2013 From: kaspar.bumke at gmail.com (Kaspar Bumke) Date: Sat, 28 Sep 2013 19:19:11 +0100 Subject: [LAU] Launchpad S and Linux In-Reply-To: <1380370618.6343.4.camel@archlinux> References: <5246BEFE.9070301@youmail.dk> <1380370618.6343.4.camel@archlinux> Message-ID: On 28 September 2013 13:16, Ralf Mardorf wrote: > However, that new software has got issues with > running status is ridiculous, > The problem is in the alsa driver, thought the Launchpad's use of running status is particularly retarded. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From kaspar.bumke at gmail.com Sat Sep 28 18:25:00 2013 From: kaspar.bumke at gmail.com (Kaspar Bumke) Date: Sat, 28 Sep 2013 19:25:00 +0100 Subject: [LAU] Launchpad S and Linux In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On 27 September 2013 21:21, Aur?lien Leblond wrote: > - It might be a misconception on my part, but from the videos available > online it looks like software can control the device to change colors of > the pads... I would be curious to know if say SooperLooper can control the > Launchpad a light up the corresponding pad if the loop is muted or not I actually was writing something I called "Soopadoopad" over a year ago to use the old Launchpad with SL. It connected to SL via OSC and then translated that to MIDI messages to control the Launchpad LEDs. It is a wxPython app but I never got it to a release state. The code is on an external hard drive at work I, I will grab it soon and put it up on github. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From fons at linuxaudio.org Sat Sep 28 21:01:49 2013 From: fons at linuxaudio.org (Fons Adriaensen) Date: Sat, 28 Sep 2013 21:01:49 +0000 Subject: [LAU] Launchpad S and Linux In-Reply-To: References: <5246BEFE.9070301@youmail.dk> <1380370618.6343.4.camel@archlinux> Message-ID: <20130928210149.GA8820@linuxaudio.org> On Sat, Sep 28, 2013 at 07:19:11PM +0100, Kaspar Bumke wrote: > On 28 September 2013 13:16, Ralf Mardorf wrote: > > > However, that new software has got issues with > > running status is ridiculous, > > > > The problem is in the alsa driver, thought the Launchpad's use of running > status is particularly retarded. If the problem is the same as with the original LP, then the ALSA driver can't do anything about it, unless it would contain LP-specific code. Ciao, -- FA A world of exhaustive, reliable metadata would be an utopia. It's also a pipe-dream, founded on self-delusion, nerd hubris and hysterically inflated market opportunities. (Cory Doctorow) From atte at youmail.dk Sun Sep 29 01:34:22 2013 From: atte at youmail.dk (Atte) Date: Sun, 29 Sep 2013 03:34:22 +0200 Subject: [LAU] Launchpad S and Linux In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <5247839E.9070806@youmail.dk> On 09/28/2013 08:25 PM, Kaspar Bumke wrote: > I actually was writing something I called "Soopadoopad" over a year ago > to use the old Launchpad with SL. It connected to SL via OSC and then > translated that to MIDI messages to control the Launchpad LEDs. It is a > wxPython app but I never got it to a release state. The code is on an > external hard drive at work I, I will grab it soon and put it up on github. I did exactly the same today in chuck. It already on github, but I need to polish it a bit... It's part of a bigger whole that I'm hopefully gonna show off here soonish :-) -- Atte http://atte.dk http://modlys.dk From nescivi at gmail.com Mon Sep 30 09:44:02 2013 From: nescivi at gmail.com (Marije Baalman) Date: Mon, 30 Sep 2013 11:44:02 +0200 Subject: [LAU] Creative Music Coding Lab #6 - October 1st at STEIM Message-ID: <20130930114402.6d16652d@exometheus.fritz.box> Hi all, tomorrow it is time again for Creative Music Coding at STEIM, please join us! First episode of the new season! Calling all ChucK?ers, SuperColliders, Max and PureData patchers, CSounders, Fluxites, Overtoners, and all other tongues of creative coders. We welcome you to attend the fifth edition of the Creative Music Coding lab at STEIM. The CMC lab is an autonomous zone to try out sonic experiments as a group. And an opportunity to leverage the expertise of the group in realizing new artistic tools and processes through the medium of code. Many of the founding members of the group are indeed experts in their favorite languages, but we come from all technical levels of proficiency and enjoy helping one-another out. http://steim.org/event/creative-music-coding-lab-6/ Date: Tuesday, October 1st Time: 19:00 h Venue: Steim, Utrechtsedwarsstraat 134, Amsterdam Entry: Free There will be free coffee and tea to fuel the creativity. Let me know if you plan to attend! sincerely, Marije From fero.kiraly at gmail.com Mon Sep 30 11:22:53 2013 From: fero.kiraly at gmail.com (Fero Kiraly) Date: Mon, 30 Sep 2013 13:22:53 +0200 Subject: [LAU] MIDI glitches Message-ID: hi all, my problem: two MIDI keyboards -> 1.with MIDI cable to presonus VSL1818 - zynaddsubfx 2.with MIDI2USB - setBfree everything goes fine, but sometimes (often after a one hour of playing ) the sound is suddenly distiorded or glitched ( i dont know the right word..) no xruns... in everything.log I 've found hundres lines of: Sep 30 09:04:41 bookes slim[322]: Info, other non-handled midi event, type: 36 my limits.conf * - rtprio 0 * - nice 0 @audio - rtprio 65 @audio - nice -10 @audio - memlock 40000 what has SLIM - login manager - to do with MIDI msgs ? thankyou all fero -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From ralf.mardorf at alice-dsl.net Mon Sep 30 15:12:52 2013 From: ralf.mardorf at alice-dsl.net (Ralf Mardorf) Date: Mon, 30 Sep 2013 17:12:52 +0200 Subject: [LAU] MIDI glitches In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <1380553972.1078.6.camel@archlinux> Hi Fero, I don't know what's going wrong on your system, but I would start with a correct limits.conf. On Mon, 2013-09-30 at 13:22 +0200, Fero Kiraly wrote: > my limits.conf > * - rtprio 0 > * - nice 0 > @audio - rtprio 65 > @audio - nice -10 > @audio - memlock 40000 If this are defaults from a package of your distro, then drop this disro. The nice value is "discussed" for years. If maintainers aren't aware about it, who knows what mistakes else they made. "@realtime - rtprio 99 @realtime - memlock unlimited Contrary to a lot of misinformation on the web, there is no reason to include a line here that provides enhanced "niceness" control, which is completely irrelevant for realtime scheduling and low latency audio applications." - http://jackaudio.org/linux_rt_config resp. @audio - rtprio 99 @audio - memlock unlimited Hth, Ralf From brummer- at web.de Mon Sep 30 15:26:03 2013 From: brummer- at web.de (hermann meyer) Date: Mon, 30 Sep 2013 17:26:03 +0200 Subject: [LAU] MIDI glitches In-Reply-To: <1380553972.1078.6.camel@archlinux> References: <1380553972.1078.6.camel@archlinux> Message-ID: <5249980B.5000302@web.de> Am 30.09.2013 17:12, schrieb Ralf Mardorf: > Hi Fero, > > I don't know what's going wrong on your system, but I would start with a > correct limits.conf. > > On Mon, 2013-09-30 at 13:22 +0200, Fero Kiraly wrote: >> my limits.conf >> * - rtprio 0 >> * - nice 0 >> @audio - rtprio 65 >> @audio - nice -10 >> @audio - memlock 40000 > If this are defaults from a package of your distro, then drop this > disro. The nice value is "discussed" for years. If maintainers aren't > aware about it, who knows what mistakes else they made. > > > "@realtime - rtprio 99 > @realtime - memlock unlimited > > Contrary to a lot of misinformation on the web, there is no reason to > include a line here that provides enhanced "niceness" control, which is > completely irrelevant for realtime scheduling and low latency audio > applications." - http://jackaudio.org/linux_rt_config > > resp. > > @audio - rtprio 99 > @audio - memlock unlimited > > Hth, > Ralf > be aware that jack_capture use nice to prioritize it's disc-thread, which didn't run in rt, but still is relevant. True, jack_capture will work as well without nice settings. From clemens at ladisch.de Mon Sep 30 15:29:12 2013 From: clemens at ladisch.de (Clemens Ladisch) Date: Mon, 30 Sep 2013 17:29:12 +0200 Subject: [LAU] MIDI glitches In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <524998C8.80005@ladisch.de> Fero Kiraly wrote: > in everything.log I 've found hundres lines of: > Sep 30 09:04:41 bookes slim[322]: Info, other non-handled midi event, type: 36 Google says this comes from ZynAddSubFX. 36 would be SND_SEQ_EVENT_CLOCK, but regardless of what event type it ignores, it should just shut up. Regards, Clemens From ralf.mardorf at alice-dsl.net Mon Sep 30 15:44:59 2013 From: ralf.mardorf at alice-dsl.net (Ralf Mardorf) Date: Mon, 30 Sep 2013 17:44:59 +0200 Subject: [LAU] MIDI glitches In-Reply-To: <5249980B.5000302@web.de> References: <1380553972.1078.6.camel@archlinux> <5249980B.5000302@web.de> Message-ID: <1380555899.1078.9.camel@archlinux> On Mon, 2013-09-30 at 17:26 +0200, hermann meyer wrote: > be aware that jack_capture use nice to prioritize it's disc-thread, > which didn't run in rt, but still is relevant. True, jack_capture will > work as well without nice settings. Then somebody with access to http://jackaudio.org/linux_rt_config should please correct the misinformation given there. TIA, Ralf From rncbc at rncbc.org Mon Sep 30 16:25:44 2013 From: rncbc at rncbc.org (Rui Nuno Capela) Date: Mon, 30 Sep 2013 17:25:44 +0100 Subject: [LAU] [ANN] Vee One Suite 0.3.5 - Fall greetings released! Message-ID: <5249A608.80307@rncbc.org> yet again, a new batch the Vee One Suite of old-school software instruments is out: synthv1 [1] polyphonic synthesizer, samplv1 [2] polyphonic sampler and drumkv1 [3] drum-kit sampler. as usual, all three are made available in dual form: - a pure stand-alone JACK client with JACK-session, NSM (Non Session management) and both JACK MIDI and ALSA MIDI input support; - a LV2 instrument plugin. as for this release changes: - First attempt on separating the DSP code from UI as runtime objects, effective for the LV2 plugin deploy. - MIDI channel filter switch is now introduced. - Fixed uninstall target make rule. - Mono(phonic) mode switch is now being introduced. - Another minor fix to note-off fast-release. all free and open-source Linux Audio software, distributed under the terms of the GNU General Public License (GPL) version 2 or later. so, here they go again: [1] synthv1 - an old-school polyphonic synthesizer synthv1 is an old-school all-digital 4-oscillator subtractive polyphonic synthesizer with stereo fx. LV2 URI: http://synthv1.sourceforge.net/lv2 website: http://synthv1.sourceforge.net downloads: http://sourceforge.net/projects/synthv1/files - source tarball: http://download.sourceforge.net/synthv1/synthv1-0.3.5.tar.gz - source package: http://download.sourceforge.net/synthv1/synthv1-0.3.5-12.rncbc.suse123.src.rpm - binary packages: http://download.sourceforge.net/synthv1/synthv1-0.3.5-12.rncbc.suse123.i586.rpm http://download.sourceforge.net/synthv1/synthv1-0.3.5-12.rncbc.suse123.x86_84.rpm [2] samplv1 - an old-school polyphonic sampler samplv1 is an(other) old-school all-digital polyphonic sampler synthesizer with stereo fx. LV2 URI: http://samplv1.sourceforge.net/lv2 website: http://samplv1.sourceforge.net downloads: http://sourceforge.net/projects/samplv1/files - source tarball: http://download.sourceforge.net/samplv1/samplv1-0.3.5.tar.gz - source package: http://download.sourceforge.net/samplv1/samplv1-0.3.5-12.rncbc.suse123.src.rpm - binary packages: http://download.sourceforge.net/samplv1/samplv1-0.3.5-12.rncbc.suse123.i586.rpm http://download.sourceforge.net/samplv1/samplv1-0.3.5-12.rncbc.suse123.x86_84.rpm [3] drumkv1 - an old-school drum-kit sampler drumkv1 is (yet) an(other) old-school all-digital drum-kit sampler synthesizer with stereo fx. LV2 URI: http://drumkv1.sourceforge.net/lv2 website: http://drumkv1.sourceforge.net downloads: http://sourceforge.net/projects/drumkv1/files - source tarball: http://download.sourceforge.net/drumkv1/drumkv1-0.3.5.tar.gz - source package: http://download.sourceforge.net/drumkv1/drumkv1-0.3.5-8.rncbc.suse123.src.rpm - binary packages: http://download.sourceforge.net/drumkv1/drumkv1-0.3.5-8.rncbc.suse123.i586.rpm http://download.sourceforge.net/drumkv1/drumkv1-0.3.5-8.rncbc.suse123.x86_84.rpm see also: http://www.rncbc.org/drupal/node/709 enjoy && have fun! -- rncbc aka Rui Nuno Capela rncbc at rncbc.org From kaspar.bumke at gmail.com Mon Sep 30 18:09:06 2013 From: kaspar.bumke at gmail.com (Kaspar Bumke) Date: Mon, 30 Sep 2013 19:09:06 +0100 Subject: [LAU] Launchpad S and Linux In-Reply-To: <5247839E.9070806@youmail.dk> References: <5247839E.9070806@youmail.dk> Message-ID: Here is mine anyway: https://github.com/kasbah/soopadoopad I haven't tested it at all, I think if I were to start again I would take the stuff in LaunchPad.pyand go from there. This was a bit of a learning experience for me back in the day. On 29 September 2013 02:34, Atte wrote: > On 09/28/2013 08:25 PM, Kaspar Bumke wrote: > > I actually was writing something I called "Soopadoopad" over a year ago >> to use the old Launchpad with SL. It connected to SL via OSC and then >> translated that to MIDI messages to control the Launchpad LEDs. It is a >> wxPython app but I never got it to a release state. The code is on an >> external hard drive at work I, I will grab it soon and put it up on >> github. >> > > I did exactly the same today in chuck. It already on github, but I need to > polish it a bit... > > It's part of a bigger whole that I'm hopefully gonna show off here soonish > :-) > > > -- > Atte > > http://atte.dk http://modlys.dk > ______________________________**_________________ > Linux-audio-user mailing list > Linux-audio-user at lists.**linuxaudio.org > http://lists.linuxaudio.org/**listinfo/linux-audio-user > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: