[linux-audio-dev] Tracktion, JUCE and Linux

Julian Storer jules at rawmaterialsoftware.com
Wed Apr 27 10:33:02 UTC 2005

Thanks Rui,

And hello to all the LADs, as I've just joined the list. Thought I'd 
better make an appearance, as I've been getting discussed on here for a 
while now... (I'm the author of Tracktion and Juce).

Right.. introductions over, a quick rant:

Alfons: I expect an apology for your comment. I'm very rarely annoyed by 
things that people post on forums, but you've misunderstood a passing 
comment I made, and extrapolated it to suggest that I'm some kind of thief.

All I meant was that on the couple of occasions when people (friends of 
mine, in fact) have *voluntarily* contributed code to my project, I 
ended up restructuring it because I didn't like the their coding style. 
I don't steal code, and don't expect to be randomly accused of doing so 
by people who know nothing about me.

..right.. I'll calm down now..

Anyway, as far as collaboration on Juce goes - let me try to sum up my 
feelings on the matter:

- Yes, I'd love to get some help from you linuxy people on this - I know 
nothing about jack/alsa, and I'm very busy with many other projects, so 
it'd be a long time before I could get round to researching it myself.

- Yes, it's a dual-license project. So if you want to contribute, you'd 
need to be happy about me taking over the copyright of any stuff you 
send me. Obviously that's your personal decision, and please, I don't 
have time to get drawn into endless boring discussions about the 
morality of dual-licensing! My views on the dual-license is that it 
keeps everything free for you GPL guys, and I get to make a (very small) 
bit of cash in return for my 5 years hard work.

- Ok, I admit it, I'm a control freak about the code in Juce, so you'd 
also have to be willing to let me rip your stuff to shreds and butcher 
it to suit my sensibilities! (In fact, I think I'd probably prefer 
messy, sketchy code that I can tidy up, rather than immaculate code that 
isn't quite the way I like it!).

If anyone is interested in helping, there are already stubs in the 
linux-specific codebase for audio and midi, though there's no proper 
test app for it (I was obviously using tracktion as my test app..). I'd 
probably need to enhance the jucedemo project to include more audio and 
midi test stuff. Best thing would be to contact me and we could discuss 
it a bit - I've a million other things to do, but it'd be cool to get 
this going!



Rui Nuno Capela wrote:

>Andreas Kuckartz wrote:
>>Alfons Adriaensen wrote:
>>>Julian Storer wrote:
>>>>... - I've only taken a few bits from other people, and it's
>>>>generally involved them sending me something they've written, and then
>>>>me re-writing it because it's not done in quite the way I like it!
>>>2. The quote above is quite informative IMHO. This type accepts
>>>   possibly GPL-ed code from others, rewrites it completely so he
>>>   can claim it is his own work, and then sells it.
>>This mailing list should not be used to distribute unfounded insinuations
>>or slanders.
>>Have a look at the development process used for the Linux kernel. There
>>are pretty strict rules for the code and many non-regular contributors
>>are not aware of them. Sometimes the code is changed so that it follows
>>the rules and in other cases it simply is rejected.
>>BTW: I agree that dual licensing can lead to problems.
>Speaking for myself, as I was the one who were explicitly willing to write
>some code, I don't have much of a problem to spend some time in filling in
>the ALSA and JACK pieces that are missing in JUCE.
>Comparably, the coding/testing effort that I'm proposing is a whole lot
>lesser significant than the one Julian has already done and offered as GPL
>to all our benefit. Sincerely I do praise and thank very much Jules for
>putting such a remarkable code framework into the OSS community. Please,
>don't get him wrong. I think its way far better to have him on our side
>than against, even if dual-licensing maybe considered evil to some, erm...
>zealots? I personally find it just fair enough. But that might be just me.
>OTOH, I don't really care if he changes the (my?) code to his liking or
>not. To tell the truth, sometimes, I find myself doing the same, let alone
>what happens on Linux kernel development, as Andreas mentioned. IMNSHO the
>main issue is all about giving the right credit and attribution, not about
>actual coding style ;)
>I'm just talking about helping in filling the gap of the interface to
>JACK/ALSA into JUCE, to make it ultimately useful on our Audio/MIDI
>platform of choice. And who else has a better expertise on this, other
>than the LAD community ?
>Hope I get understood, and advised too :)

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