[LAU] So what do you think sucks about Linux audio ?

[Gerald Mwangi]

On 02/10/2013 02:37 PM, Ralf Mardorf wrote:
> On Sun, 2013-02-10 at 12:17 +0100, Jörn Nettingsmeier wrote:
>> On 02/10/2013 01:59 AM, gerald.mwangi at gmx.de wrote:
>>
>> hi gerald!
>>
>>
>> <strong disagreement next 5 miles, and likely some alligators crossing>
>>
>>> What sucks: the workflow does not feel organic! Can you say that
>>> bringing down an idea alone with multiple instruments (sequentially
>>> recording all instruments, including synths) to disk is as easy as
>>> recording it with a band on an 8track machine? No!
>>
>> as someone who has done his share of 8track reel-to-reel recording:
>> BWAHAHAHAHAAAHAAAA.
>>
>> compare:
>> * clean and degauss tape heads
>> * find some empty tape (at something like 90 € per half hour)
>> * thread the tape
>> * lay down test tones
>> * (optional) wrestle with your noise reduction
>> * level, arm, roll
>> to:
>> * start jack
>> * start ardour with 8-track template
>> * level, arm, roll
>>
>> when it comes to editing and mixing, the whole comparison becomes
>> ridiculously unbalanced. and i'm not even talking sound quality yet.
>>
>> and if you want to include the setup and configuration of a bare-bones
>> machine, then please also include the soldering iron and oscilloscope :)
>>
>> don't get me wrong, gerald, this isn't meant as personal criticism, and
>> your input is certainly appreciated, but this statement just doesn't
>> hold water.
>
> It does at least hold water for naive musicians. They buy a 8 track
> machine and a tape. To thread the tape is a real manually event, so they
> understand how to do it. They don't need to set up and to use a Computer
> with Linux (or any other OS), no need to learn anything, to handle any
> issues.
>
> Cleaning and degaussing indeed is a PITA. Fortunately I can't remember
> when I last time used my demagnetizing device to degauss heads.
>
> Noise reduction quality and sound quality depend to calibration,
> something that usually can't be done at home and it only will fit to one
> spread of one type of tape from one vendor. If the calibration is ok,
> the sound isn't less good than a digital recording.
>
> Usually you can't use the tape directly, but you have to record SMPTE
> first. However, for some musicians a 8-track analog tape recorder or any
> very simple _digital_ HD recorder is much, much easier to use than a
> computer.
>
>>> And just saying that
>>> it is not possible with other OS's is no excuse. The linux audio
>>> experience has to feel like just picking up an instrument (complex
>>> synths included) and a band to jam in the idea.
>> <snip>
>>> But, and this a big but: as I don't need nor want documentation to get a
>>> tone out of my guitar/ my voice, I don't want documentation to handle
>>> linux audio!
>>
>> dude. you have practised your guitar for years. at some point, that
>> surely involved reading documentation, or at least very thorough and
>> systematic exploration on your part.
>> if you were to claim that guitars are needlessly complex and you are
>> entitled to just grab one and go, hard-working guitarists would be
>> rightfully offended and laugh at you.
>
> Jörn, you seemingly don't care about a wide spread variety of humans
> with completely different traits, abilities and weaknesses.
>
>> a studio workflow is no different. it takes practice and respect to
>> master. why does everybody and their grandma just assume that when they
>> suck at recording, it must be the studio's fault? that is kind of
>> offending to hard-working recording engineers. ;)
>>
>>> The whole ecosystem has to be integrated and simple to be
>>> operated at the ease of a few clicks with no prior knowledge! To the
>>> same extent as it is open to all.
>>
>> no. no. no. i don't want to be limited to a three-stringed guitar
>> because people can only count "one, two, many".
>>
>> stuff that works without prior knowledge or some will to study is
>> usually boring, and ineffective. it's cool for a week, and then you
>> outgrow it.
>>
>> now i'm all ears when it comes to discussing workflow and how to
>> streamline stuff - after all, professional studio work is all about
>> workflow. but i don't like blanket statements that threaten to make
>> software too simplistic for more demanding work.
>
> A guitar player don't need to be able to build a guitar. A hobby audio
> engineer don't need to know how the gear does work, assumed the hobby
> engineer does use stand alone devices and isn't interested in
> maintaining the gear, because sound quality isn't that important.
>
> Using Linux, keeping the workflow can become a PITA, just by updating
> the DE ;), there are no updates for a 8 track analog recorder.
>
> IMO the issue is "stand alone" vs "computer".
>
> Regards,
> Ralf
>
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>

Hi, Thumbs up for this reply. And I finally found the "plain text" 
Button, oh stupid me ;-)
Although  I said before, I'm a PhD student and a SW Dev in computer 
vision (for those interested: 
http://sourceforge.net/apps/trac/charon-suite, 
http://sourceforge.net/apps/trac/charon-suite/wiki/Developer-Update), I 
deliberately switch to "user-mode" turning off all my dev-knowledge to 
think about the problems of Linux audio from a (hopefully) radical 
different point of view.
I'm an avid guitar player for 20 years now, but my first aha experience 
was approx 10 min after holding the instrument in my hands for the first 
time in my life: my first 2 finger power-accord. After 30 min I had a 
rough version of smoke on the water (tr,tr,trrr,..,tr,tr,t,trrr).
Hell I've got that in mind as if it was yesterday.
And I didn't need a manual for that.
I have deep respect for all that you, the linux audio devs have 
achieved. It's just that sometimes I wish that I could approach linux 
audio with the naiveness and intuition of a kid, and still get those 
impressive results I get now.
If my ideas seem childish, non professional, let me know, so I wont bug 
you anymore
Ciao,
Gerald