[LAU] 48k vs. 44.1k

[Alf Haakon Lund]

On 07. jan. 2013 05:37, Len Ovens wrote:
>
> On Sun, January 6, 2013 5:55 pm, Ralph Bluecoat wrote:
>>>
>>> Having decided that, what other issues cross my
>>> path if I default my audio rate to 48k?
>>
>>
>> Mainly, clocking issues. If for some reason an application thinks it is
>> running in 44.1 but the system is at 48, there will be playback issues
>> like
>> pops and the likes.. I know I ran into this working with Reaper using
>> Wine.
>
> So wine was not told the correct clock speed. Funny, I ran into the same
> problem... My laptop has a mic that is 48k only and it makes clicks and
> pop when pulse is set to default at 44.1k.
>
>> Perhaps not much of a 21st century issue, but if you are making projects
>> that you intend to put onto CD, you will have to downsample to 44.1hz at
>> 16-bit, as this is the Red Book specification for CD quality audio. A
>> trivial task, but still time consuming and an extra step to think about.
>
> Apparently not. Again that has been discussed in the last few weeks on
> this list. It is just an export option during mixdown which has to be done
> anyway.
>>
>> Speaking as one of the devs for the Ubuntu Studio distro, I'm wondering
>>> how much trouble I'm going to get for asking for 48k default sample rate
>>> in audio.
>>
>>
>> It really depends on what the target audience for the audio software. In
>> the pro audio-music world, 44.1khz is still more widely used because it
>> has
>> been a standard for years in digital audio for CD, and I honestly don't
>> see
>> it changing to 48khz anytime soon (96/24 would be the next "level" you
>> would typically find.) A 48khz sample rate is used (almost exclusively) in
>> the film industry for synching audio to visual media rather than pure
>> audio. Games, movie, and television audio are in a 48khz format at
>> minimal.
>
> The pro audio world as represented by this list seems to disagree at least
> to some extent. 96k sounds nice and is used in live work like mixing and
> such mostly because of it's lower latency. While things are changing there
> are a lot of ADAT IFs that are 48/44.1k only, Those that handle 96k, do so
> only with the loss of two channels. So 48k is very much still alive. The
> semipro world is more likely to choose more inputs over 96k unless their
> outboard gear can show the difference.
>
> The internal sound IFs these days are designed around a bus/clocking
> system that runs at 48k (actually a multiple there of) and making 44.1k
> work requires lots of extra work. In the old ac97 series it seems inputs
> and outputs are all 48K with a firmware layer in the onboard DSP for
> pretending to work at other rates (read resampling). The newer intel HDA
> systems will accept 44.1k raw, but with the bit clock they send out the
> extra component cost to derive the right clock to do so is high
> (expensive). There is no guarantee it is done with any quality. That is
> not even dealing with the higher filtering costs (4x as high if I remember
> right) already mentioned in the last two weeks.
>
> Also, as happens, Ubuntu Studio does have a video production audience as
> well. 48K would be correct for them too.
>
>>
>> >From a recording standpoint, it would be much more beneficial to change
>>> the
>> bitrate at 24 bits instead of the default 16, as you get more dynamic
>> range
>> and headroom in the recording process.
>
> What comes from the card is what comes from the card. We can't change
> that. We'll take 24bit by default if we get it already. However, from the
> time it hits jack it is 32 bit (floating) and all 24 bits are preserved.
> 16 bit has not been the default for pro or even semipro (or consumer for
> that matter) for 10 years or more. (I've had my D66, 24bit/44.1k to 96k
> that long and it has never been "top of the pile")
>
> Yup, CDs are 44.1k/16bit. But why record that way? 48k (or 96k if you can
> afford it) is better than 44.1k on almost all computer IFs by design.
>
> A week or two ago I would have said use 44.1k if that is what you want to
> end up with. but there have been many convincing reasons for me to change
> my default to 48K related on this mailing list (at least with the older HW
> I have)... and as it doesn't seem to degrade normal desktop performance,
> 48K seems a good place to default to. Someone who has the gear is already
> looking for how they have to change things to use 96K, but  default of 48K
> should work with any non-broken SW. I have gone through all my audio
> related SW on my system with no problems so far.
>

Slightly OT, sorry: I recently installed Ubuntu Studio 12.10. At once I 
stumbled, failing to start jack or run ardour.

In the meantime I spent some time tweaking office and multimedia 
consumption stuff to my likings, so I just let the subject rest for a 
while. Then after following this discussion it dawned on me that the 
sample rate might be the culprit. And, yes.

For some reason I had put 44.1K. Change to 48k and everything Just 
Works. And from what I've learned here I'll stick with that :-)

Alf