Well Dave P, what should I say ?
I think the attitude of certain LAD-ers is one of the reasons why linux audio will
remain an irrelevant niche for a long time to come.
How can you you create a standard like LV2 and then make statements like
"reaper is the enemy" ?
I think LV2 devs did not do their math correctly, since it seems that every non GPLed app
is labeled as the enemy, they should change the LV2 license to GPL and it will
avoid pollution by proprietary apps.
So LV2 devs, what was the true reason to release LV2 under LGPL ? (which allows the API
being used by proprietary apps too)
Pieter summed it up well, LV2 devs should speak out whether they want to create
a true standard or an open-source application standard only.
But given their attitude regardless of LGPL or GPL I don't see a great future for LV2,
it will probably be used by a few open source niche apps and it was about it.
after all VST 2.4 is quite limited (only 1 MIDI input port, only MIDI and audio data types)
yet it is the industry standard and probably for a long time to come.
So creating a new, open standard for both open source and commercial apps
only takes a few interested parties (let's say a bunch of smaller proprietary and open source application developers and spec it out.
The success of an API is influenced more by its adoption by various players rather than
technical excellence. We have many examples in the industry.
For example having an open standard and a sequencer like Reaper which uses it could be a big
driver to speed up its adoption.
But it seems that people here simply don't care, what counts is one's religious belief. Different
religions are not accepted.
I will not insist trying to change anyone's mind, it makes no sense.
If the need arises, other groups will be formed and they will put into practice their ideas.
We of LinuxSampler do not have problems with various plugin standards as LS provides
a flexible audio,midi driver API so adding so supporting a new plugin standard is only a matter
of writing a small wrapper.
We recently ported LinuxSampler to Windows (for now only standalone ASIO and MME MIDI)
and it had very positive effects for the project, we tripled our userbase overnight, discovered and
fixed bugs, made the code more portable and gained lots of new enthusiastic users which
did not even know that LS existed. They now want to try out Linux and run LS on the opensource platform as the OS works better.
So far about the theory "porting an open source application from Linux to Windows will prevent users to
switch to Linux as they are lazy".
We are adding VST support to LS and it will benefit LS even more as you can use it for professional productions
fully integrated within your favourite VST sequencer.
If we were such close minded like certain LADers here LS would not enjoy this kind of success.
Politeness, openess and dialogue is the key.
Do you really think that Dave P, I and others would not be happy to see open source audio taking over the world ?
Unfortunately theory and practice are two different things and to achieve one's goal one has to make lots of friends
and go through a transition stage (like porting LS to Windows), even if they are in some ways your implicit enemy. It's called diplomacy over war.
As I only tried to build a bridge between parties and start a dialogue which could be beneficial for both but after reading the answers here
I see it makes no sense to continue discussing.
cheers,
Benno
2008/1/22, Dave Phillips <dlphillips@woh.rr.com>:
t_w_@freenet.de wrote:
> Dave Phillips wrote:
>
>
>> So responding with sarcasm, "We'll do it my way or not at all"
>> conditions, and a confrontive attitude qualifies as "the spirit of
>> collaboration" ? Geez, you guys are really winning me over.
>>
>
> It's the good right of Dave and Lars to not care or even outright
> reject closed software. They could have said it more diplomatic
> terms ... but now you make a drama of it.
Do I ?
Well, maybe it's because I have the good right to do so. :)
Look, I'm trying to remind people here that what they say here can make
or break involvement with Linux audio (which is in fact a much larger
world than the one represented here). As a point, let me ask: How many
new developers have joined the Ardour team in the past two years ? How
many projects represented here have found an adequate supply of talent
to cover all their development bases ? Can we really afford to sour
*anyone* on the possibilities of Linux audio ? Is it really too much to
ask that we remain civil even to those who seem to represent the
opposite side ?
Best,
dp
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