25 Apr
2003
25 Apr
'03
5:27 p.m.
Hi,
I have some Acid loops that I want to change the tempo and pitch on
fairly radically. Acid does this itself, but only does a good job over
fairly small ranges.
Is there any non-realtime Linux app that can take a Acid wave file and
change it's length and pitch, write its output to a new wave file, and do a
high quality job of it?
Thanks in advance,
Mark
25 Apr
25 Apr
6:33 p.m.
sox?
On Fri 25/04/2003 14:17:31, Mark Knecht wrote:
Hi,
I have some Acid loops that I want to change the tempo and pitch on
fairly radically. Acid does this itself, but only does a good job over
fairly small ranges.
Is there any non-realtime Linux app that can take a Acid wave file and
change it's length and pitch, write its output to a new wave file, and do a
high quality job of it?
Thanks in advance,
Mark
7:17 p.m.
You could try soundstretch, im not sure how easy it is to build though
http://www.sunpoint.net/~oparviai/soundtouch/soundstretch.html
- Steve
On Fri, Apr 25, 2003 at 02:17:31 -0700, Mark Knecht wrote:
Hi,
I have some Acid loops that I want to change the tempo and pitch on
fairly radically. Acid does this itself, but only does a good job over
fairly small ranges.
Is there any non-realtime Linux app that can take a Acid wave file and
change it's length and pitch, write its output to a new wave file, and do a
high quality job of it?
Thanks in advance,
Mark
7:48 p.m.
Steve and Eric,
Thanks for the ideas. Sound Stretch looks quite interesting, but I'm
not sure if it handles the file format part of the problem. I certainly
need 24-bit capabilities. The page says 'wave' and '16-bit PCM'. The
program looks like a good starting point though. (And I'm running
Mandrake this evening, so I think it might be easier to build. We'll
see...)
Sox looks interesting. Quite a lot of capabilities there also.
Maybe I need to do something to take advantage of the 'Acidized'
feature of the loops also? Acid loops have tempo and root note info in
the files. It would be nice to somehow be able to use that to get a
better result.
I wonder if Swami might have some of the capabilities I'm looking
for?
Again, thanks for the ideas!
Cheers,
Mark
On Fri, 2003-04-25 at 19:07, Steve Harris wrote:
You could try soundstretch, im not sure how easy it is
to build though
http://www.sunpoint.net/~oparviai/soundtouch/soundstretch.html
- Steve
On Fri, Apr 25, 2003 at 02:17:31 -0700, Mark Knecht wrote:
> Hi,
> I have some Acid loops that I want to change the tempo and pitch on
> fairly radically. Acid does this itself, but only does a good job over
> fairly small ranges.
>
> Is there any non-realtime Linux app that can take a Acid wave file and
> change it's length and pitch, write its output to a new wave file, and do a
> high quality job of it?
>
> Thanks in advance,
> Mark
>
8:04 p.m.
On Fri, Apr 25, 2003 at 04:39:07 -0400, Mark Knecht wrote:
Steve and Eric,
Thanks for the ideas. Sound Stretch looks quite interesting, but I'm
not sure if it handles the file format part of the problem. I certainly
need 24-bit capabilities. The page says 'wave' and '16-bit PCM'. The
program looks like a good starting point though. (And I'm running
Mandrake this evening, so I think it might be easier to build. We'll
see...)
Paul D. made a float version of the library behind Sound Stretch and I
think he might have ported Sound Stretch too, but i'mn not sure, you
could ask him.
- Steve
8:09 p.m.
On 25 Apr 2003 16:39:07 -0400
Mark Knecht <markknecht(a)attbi.com> wrote:
Steve and Eric,
Thanks for the ideas. Sound Stretch looks quite interesting, but I'm
not sure if it handles the file format part of the problem. I certainly
need 24-bit capabilities. The page says 'wave' and '16-bit PCM'. The
program looks like a good starting point though. (And I'm running
Mandrake this evening, so I think it might be easier to build. We'll
see...)
I had a look at that program. The time streching is done in the time
domain so its only ever going to be any good on certain signals and
over small stretch/pitch factors. The interpolator is also limited
to linear interpolation.
However, I do not think it would be too hard to drop libsndfile into
the SoundStretch code to do the file I/O and you could probably also
replace the existing linear interpolator with Secret Rabbit Code.
See:
http://www.zip.com.au/~erikd/libsndfile/
http://www.mega-nerd.com/SRC/
Maybe I need to do something to take advantage of
the 'Acidized'
feature of the loops also?
That final part I have no answers for (yet).
Erik
--
+-----------------------------------------------------------+
Erik de Castro Lopo nospam(a)mega-nerd.com (Yes it's valid)
+-----------------------------------------------------------+
The Earth is around 70% water. Fish rule the seas.
Humans are over 90% water. It's only a matter of time.
26 Apr
26 Apr
7:25 a.m.
Hallo,
Mark Knecht hat gesagt: // Mark Knecht wrote:
Sox looks interesting. Quite a lot of capabilities
there also.
Maybe I need to do something to take advantage of the 'Acidized'
feature of the loops also? Acid loops have tempo and root note info in
the files. It would be nice to somehow be able to use that to get a
better result.
In my understanding (which may well be much out of date) the Acid-info
is just meta-data to let Acid show things like bpm and such quckly.
So it's useless for time stretching or shifting (I use these terms
interchangably, which is technically not correct, I guess)
Normally stretching is done in one of these ways:
a) Resampling by changing the sample rate. This also changes pitch and
has artifacts, unless you do counter measures. Vinyl DJs do it a
lot in the analog realm.
b) rotating-tapehead delay pitch shifting. I think, Steve made a
plugin that works this way. You might use it for example with
ecasound. This is an old-fashioned effect and can be heard. Itself,
it only changes pitch and thus can undo the resampling
side-effects.
c) FFT-based pitch shifting. I think, Steve also made a plugin with
this approach (of course ;) It gives good results.
d) Granular resynthesis. This is used increasingly in commercial
software, for example Ableton Live is somehow a granular sample
player. The SndObj-library has a cool granulator called syncgrain
that I ported to a Pd external. As usual with granular synthesis,
you need to control a lot of paramenters, which can be difficult.
But simple loop-speed changing is rather easy with that.
ciao
--
Frank Barknecht _ ______footils.org__
10:22 a.m.
On Sat, 2003-04-26 at 04:14, Frank Barknecht wrote:
Hallo,
Mark Knecht hat gesagt: // Mark Knecht wrote:
Frank,
I had heard the same thing, but ran into some interesting things when
I imported a few specific Acid loops into Pro Tools.
If you are familiar with Acid, then you know that as you extend the
loop across a track in Acid, when you go beyond the 'end' of the loop,
then Acid repeats the loop.
However, when I take some of these loops into Pro Tools, I find that
the loop is longer than what Acid shows. Essentially, the loop is not
'trimmed' to the length that Acid is showing. Now, Acid also supports
'One Shots', which have nothing to do with tempo, so I think the
meta-data is tied up with all of that also. I suspect that this
meta-data must inform Acid which part of the loop file to use.
Also, 'tempo' must be related to how many audio samples are in a
loop, correct? A 1 measure loop at 144BPM would have fewer samples than
a 1 measure loop at 91BPM. Granted, if all loops were trimmed to a known
length, then tempo could be calculated, but some loops are 4 measures,
while others are 16, so there are difficulties without knowing how long
the loop is supposed to be musically.
The last thing about tempo, and really the one that seems to cause
the most problems with the audio, is that it is difficult in Acid to mix
loops that were recorded at radically different tempos. If I combine a
144BMP loop with a 91BMP loop, and the song is at 94BPM, Acid does a
fine job of adjusting the 91BMP loop to the new tempo, but it does a far
worse job of adjusting the 144BPM loop. (This applies to pitch shifting
also. It's pretty good over about 5-6 half steps, but goes pretty sour
much beyond that.
Anyway, I was hoping there are some ideas or experiences out there
that could do a better job than Acid does on the fly.
Thanks,
Mark
Sox looks interesting. Quite a lot of
capabilities there also.
Maybe I need to do something to take advantage of the 'Acidized'
feature of the loops also? Acid loops have tempo and root note info in
the files. It would be nice to somehow be able to use that to get a
better result.
In my understanding (which may well be much out of date) the Acid-info
is just meta-data to let Acid show things like bpm and such quckly.
So it's useless for time stretching or shifting (I use these terms
interchangably, which is technically not correct, I guess)
28 Apr
28 Apr
3:21 a.m.
On Fri, 25 Apr 2003 14:17:31 -0700
"Mark Knecht" <mknecht(a)controlnet.com> wrote:
Hi,
I have some Acid loops that I want to change the tempo and
pitch on
fairly radically. Acid does this itself, but only does a good job
over fairly small ranges.
Is there any non-realtime Linux app that can take a Acid wave
file and
change it's length and pitch, write its output to a new wave file,
and do a high quality job of it?
Audacity from CVS
--
Alexandre Prokoudine
ALT Linux Documentation Team
JID: avp(a)altlinux.org
4:15 a.m.
On Mon, 28 Apr 2003 11:10:51 +0400
Alexandre Prokoudine <avp(a)altlinux.ru> wrote:
www.lrn.ru/~avp/files/audacity-change-tempo.png
Is it what you desired? :-)
--
Alexandre Prokoudine
ALT Linux Documentation Team
JID: avp(a)altlinux.org
Is there
any non-realtime Linux app that can take a Acid wave
file and
change it's length and pitch, write its output to a new wave
file, and do a high quality job of it?
Audacity from CVS 
10:12 a.m.
Alexandre,
Yes, this is the idea.
Thanks,
Mark
-----Original Message-----
From: linux-audio-user-admin(a)music.columbia.edu
[mailto:linux-audio-user-admin@music.columbia.edu]On Behalf Of Alexandre
Prokoudine
Sent: Monday, April 28, 2003 1:05 AM
To: linux-audio-user(a)music.columbia.edu
Subject: Re: [linux-audio-user] Resampling loop libraries
On Mon, 28 Apr 2003 11:10:51 +0400
Alexandre Prokoudine <avp(a)altlinux.ru> wrote:
www.lrn.ru/~avp/files/audacity-change-tempo.png
Is it what you desired? :-)
--
Alexandre Prokoudine
ALT Linux Documentation Team
JID: avp(a)altlinux.org
Is
there any non-realtime Linux app that can take a Acid wave
file and
change it's length and pitch, write its output to a new wave
file, and do a high quality job of it?
Audacity from CVS
11:05 a.m.
On Mon, 28 Apr 2003 07:02:10 -0700
"Mark Knecht" <mknecht(a)controlnet.com> wrote:
Alexandre,
Yes, this is the idea.
Okky :)
Just keep in mind that CVS version of Audacity is 40 MB large :-)
But I can tar.bz2 it for you
--
Alexandre Prokoudine
ALT Linux Documentation Team
JID: avp(a)altlinux.org
12:08 p.m.
Alexandre,
I cannot run Alsa. Can I use Audacity in any form of batch mode? Possibly
even on a machine with no sound card?
Thanks,
Mark
-----Original Message-----
From: linux-audio-user-admin(a)music.columbia.edu
[mailto:linux-audio-user-admin@music.columbia.edu]On Behalf Of Alexandre
Prokoudine
Sent: Monday, April 28, 2003 7:55 AM
To: linux-audio-user(a)music.columbia.edu
Subject: Re: [linux-audio-user] Resampling loop libraries
On Mon, 28 Apr 2003 07:02:10 -0700
"Mark Knecht" <mknecht(a)controlnet.com> wrote:
Alexandre,
Yes, this is the idea.
Okky :)
Just keep in mind that CVS version of Audacity is 40 MB large :-)
But I can tar.bz2 it for you
--
Alexandre Prokoudine
ALT Linux Documentation Team
JID: avp(a)altlinux.org
29 Apr
29 Apr
4:08 a.m.
On Mon, 28 Apr 2003 08:58:13 -0700
"Mark Knecht" <mknecht(a)controlnet.com> wrote:
Alexandre,
I cannot run Alsa. Can I use Audacity in any form of batch
mode? Possibly
even on a machine with no sound card?
Audacity doesn't support ALSA at the moment, because it's
build at top of PortAudio v18, which doesn't support ALSA.
If you can run OSS -- that will be fine
--
Alexandre Prokoudine
ALT Linux Documentation Team
JID: avp(a)altlinux.org
7699
days inactive
7703
days old
linux-audio-user@lists.linuxaudio.org
13 comments
7 participants
participants (7)
-
Alexandre Prokoudine -
Eric Dantan Rzewnicki -
Erik de Castro Lopo -
Frank Barknecht -
Mark Knecht -
Mark Knecht -
Steve Harris