[LAD] Dumb Idea #27: LV2 host as kernel?

Justin Smith noisesmith at gmail.com
Mon Feb 23 02:51:36 UTC 2009

Just to be pedantic for a moment, every audio plugin needs to be
intimately familiar with time, because sound is a time bound
phenomena, you almost always need to have an incremental (even if
looped) index into an array somewhere, or some concept of a phase, and
also frequency usually plays a role as well, and frequency is a
measurement in the domain of time. Actually almost everything an audio
plugin does is time dependent.

On Sun, Feb 22, 2009 at 6:40 PM, Jens M Andreasen
<jens.andreasen at comhem.se> wrote:
> Do plugins have any more sense of time than your average herd of cows?
> In goes sunlight and green grass, and out comes a healthy amount of milk
> and fresh manure ..
> The only kinds of "plugins" that has a sense of time in our world are
> those who are recording either audio or midi, and these are those we
> would normally prefer to define as our toplevel hosts.
> /j
> On Sun, 2009-02-22 at 15:46 -0500, David Robillard wrote:
>> On Sat, 2009-02-21 at 14:55 -0500, Paul Davis wrote:
>> > On Sat, Feb 21, 2009 at 2:37 PM, Darren Landrum
>> > <darren.landrum at sbcglobal.net> wrote:
>> >         If one were to build a "kernel" to a digital audio workstation
>> >         that was
>> >         itself a bare-bones LV2 host, could things like audio tracks,
>> >         midi
>> >         tracks, and mixer channels and the like be built as LV2
>> >         plug-ins?
>> > if you want to understand why this is hard (not impossible, just
>> > hard), go read the ardour source code and find all the places where
>> > *unexpected* inter-object dependencies appear. then figure out how to
>> > remove them. if you can do that, you'll be able to make a modular
>> > system work. if not, you'll at least understand why nobody has else
>> > has been able to do it so far.
>> Exactly as hard as Jack doing transport...
>> Anyway, just because the signal flow aspect of things is patching
>> doesn't mean transport has to be.  There's no fundamental reason this is
>> any harder than it is to solve in Ardour.  Objects are objects at the
>> end of the day.  You could even do it by controlling the transport over
>> wires if you wanted to (messages are messages at the end of the day) but
>> it would be a huge mess you would want to hide from the user anyway, so
>> not a lot of point.
>> There's no technological reason this is infeasible or particularly
>> difficult, it's just a lot of work.
>> -dr
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