[LAU] [PlanetCCRMA] Mixer Wowes

Dave Phillips dlphillips at woh.rr.com
Sun May 17 07:45:30 EDT 2009

Hi Esben,

Before I respond to your suggestions and observations I want to 
emphasize again that I am in now way opposed to Pulseaudio per se, and I 
understand clearly the job it's trying to do. I also understand the need 
for a sound server for any given distro. However, I also understand and 
do not like the fact that there are at least half a dozen competing 
sound servers for the Linux desktop, which is ridiculous (and points to 
the disconnect between the LA* groups and the groups that comprise the 
decision-making teams for the distros).

> Dave Phillips <dlphillips at woh.rr.com> writes:
>> I do in any Ubuntu system is to disable Pulseaudio (along with a
>> raft of other stuff).
> Well, if you enter the configuration file, you can set it up as a JACK
> client.

What config file ? Where ? What if I don't know what is a config file ? 
What does it mean if something is a "JACK client" ? The newbies coming 
to us from Win/Mac environments (or not) aren't newbies when it comes to 
sound & music software, but this stuff will be terra incognita for most 
of them.

For me, the advice is useful, and I will try it when I next wrestle with 
Ubuntu (which seems welded to Pulseaudio).

>> This is major pain, because Ubuntu (GNOME?) has coupled its desktop
>> to the server.
> And rightly so. It would be a major design fault to not abstract this
> from the desktop environment.
Well, desktops seemed to do okay for my purposes for a long time without 
standardized sound servers. Actually the point is rather mitigated by 
the fact that I usually scrap the GNOME/KDE desktops in favor of Fluxbox 
or similar.

Having said that, I again emphasize that I do understand the situation. 
I don't blame Pulseaudio for anything except being in my way, and as I 
said in my first message, that's unfortunate. Pulseaudio winds up taking 
heat for decisions made by distro maintainters, a very poor outcome.

>> I can't safely remove Pulseaudio, but I can disable it according to
>> a set of instructions I found with a Google search.
> Well, or just set it up as a JACK client and be done with it. 
>> Btw, 'killall pulseaudio' doesn't work. The server is set up for
>> persistence, so the daemon simply relaunches itself, staying in the
>> way of a successful JACK start.
> As you and I and all of us run JACK all the time, pulseaudio is set up
> as a JACK client, so.. problem solved.
IMO a far better solution would be a one-click setup configuration 
option between a system based on Pulseaudio or one based on raw ALSA. 
The newbies can proceed with the normal Pulseaudio setup until they find 
reason to switch, and the advanced users are quiet and happy.

Setting up Pulseaudio as a JACK client is something that should be done 
without the the user's intervention. Again, it's a distro problem, but 
if the distro presents itself as an audio production system then a 
number of config options should be handled by the 
installer/configurator, not by the end user.

>> My needs are professional, ergo I do not need or want Pulseaudio. 
> I just can't see this as an issue, cause it's not;). Pulse runs as a
> JACK client. End of story;). 

Once more, I understand your POV. I agree with Fons, though, that it 
ought to be a non-issue by not being there at all. If your suggestion 
resolves the problem without creating other problems, then good on it. 
But whatever it does it should do so tranparently, without the user's 
intervention, and in such a way that it could be easily and cleanly 
disabled and/or removed. EOF. ;)

Best regards,


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