[LAU] Pro Audio? OT rant.

Thomas Vecchione seablaede at gmail.com
Wed Dec 26 16:19:52 UTC 2012

On Wed, Dec 26, 2012 at 6:22 AM, Patrick Shirkey <pshirkey at boosthardware.com
> wrote:

> Yes, over ten years ago Behringer's large mixing consoles had marginal or
> inadequate power supplies.  Smart audio engineers bought them anyway and
> first thing ripped out the power supplies, put in a socket, and added an
> external supply to feed the necessary DC power to the mixer.  The last two
> generations of Behringer mixers have been flawless.  Quantum theoretical
> levels of self-noise, no measurable distortion (on very high end test
> equipment), and rock solid reliability even in educational settings.
Again I repeat.  You haven't tested enough then.  All of the equipment I
mentioned have been sold in the last 10 years, and extends far beyond just
their mixers.  Yes some of their equipment is good, much more in my
experience is bad.

> Behringer products, from the past six years or so, have little if any
> internal
> resemblance to the competition.  Different chips, different circuits, and
> very clever original internal layouts.  On the other hand, the internals
> of most of their competitors looks pretty much the same - standard
> off-the-shelf IC's, pots built into the circuit boards, capacitors of the
> day, etc.

Yes they are better lately, but it does not, in my opinion, excuse past
missteps of that magnitude.  Of course the line you were replying to had
nothing to do with internal board layout and was in response to your
comment about marketing.

And no, producets from other manufacturers don't all look the same
internally in my experience.  For example there is a huge difference
between a Mackie console at 24 channels and A&H, easily replaceable channel
strips for one thing.  Similar for a Soundcraft, etc.  Even those other
manufacturers that go for single board construction looks different in my

> I'm not actually a fan but I think a lot of people round here make a big
> deal out of Behringer products which doesn't meet the experience we have
> on this side of the pond of using them. However it may just be that we get
> better quality Behringer products on our side of the pond.  Maybe it's a
> supply chain issue or maybe it's something to do with the stockists.
I think it is just you are either exceedingly lucky, or very limited
selection of their hardware honestly. My experience has been mirrored by
many professional audio engineers with a large selection of their
products.  Again not all their products are horrible, some have very good
sound for instance, but in all cases if I buy one I am buying two for when
it breaks, and also in all cases I would much rather spend a little more to
get something I don't have to worry about that on.

> Anyway I don't sell mass manufactured audio hardware in a chain of stores
> so I don't have the stats to say if Behringer products have a higher
> failure rate or return rate than other manufacturers.
I know of some of the larger professional audio distributors in the US that
used to carry Behringer, and stopped (In at least the case of one which is
one of the largest in the past 5 years) due to the amount of support
requests and returns they had on them.  Mind you most of the places I go
through also end up providing at least limited support on whatever they
sell as well because they develop relationships with the people they deal
with, and want to make sure they sell what is going to fit their needs.  In
the case of that distributor it looks like they are starting to try them
again, this is a very recent development for them, within the past year or
so.  I would be curious to have a conversation with one of the reps I deal
with there (Depending on whether I am buying for myself, or one of the
several companies I buy for determines which rep I deal with) to see what
the reasoning is there.

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