Dave Phillips:
> >
> >The programs is nearly five years old, and was originally only an amiga
> >program. Dave Phillips knows about it, but I guess he hasn't been listed
> >it yet, because I haven't made any official releases of it for linux yet.
> >
> >
> >
> That is indeed why it isn't listed. So when will CVS be updated ? I'll
> gladly test Radium again anytime... :)
>
I don't know about CVS, there has been so many changes since last
update. But I'll try to release a tarball quite soon. An alpa-nearly-beta
release. Like its now, all newere sources are only placed on my private
machine with no backup, so something needs to be done.
--
Dave Robillard:
> > > (Random thought) A MIDI sequencer where you can draw control curves over
> > the
> > > tracks (like ardour volume and whatnot) would be very cool.. esp. for
> > > electronic music (like, say, trance) when the control parameters are as
> > > important as the notes themselves
> > >
> >
> > Perhaps you would be interested in working on my music-editor Radium then?
> > http://www.notam02.no/radium/
> > Its about 98% functional for linux now, but I haven't released or updated
> > cvs for a very long time. I really should do that.
>
> I'll check it out when I find some time. Screenshot is a little confusing..
> is it something like a tracker interface, with time moving vertically (from
> top to bottm)?
>
Yes, time moves from top to bottom. But its not very much like tracker
otherwise.
> You should get yourself listed on Dave Phillip's page (linux-sound.org). If
> it's not on there it might as well not exist! :)
>
The programs is nearly five years old, and was originally only an amiga
program. Dave Phillips knows about it, but I guess he hasn't been listed
it yet, because I haven't made any official releases of it for linux yet.
--
Samuel Abels:
> On Sat, 2004-04-10 at 16:36, Kjetil Svalastog Matheussen wrote:
> > > So, in essence, gtkmm does it in a more C++ way. :-) (But please let us
> > > not make this a flame; may everyone be free to choose whatever toolkit
> > > he likes best. ;) )
> >
> > Then my question becomes:
> >
> > Why on earth use C++? Use a desent high-level non-crippled language like
> > lisp, python or ruby.
>
> You mentioned Python in the same sentence with "non-crippled language",
> which clearly proofs your good sense of humor. ;)
>
> That set aside, here are some of my reasons:
>
> * Audio applications are usually very CPU intensive. Having a complete
> screen full of different canvases updated all the time *is* CPU
> intensive. I am not saying that it is impossible to create a GUI fast
> enough with higher level languages, I am just saying that the difference
> is significant enough that many users may suffer from it.
>
> * Often, there are great advantages in having the whole application use
> only one language. This has advantages in both, maintainance and
> performance as well (converting data types is expencive).
>
> > Yes, this might start a flame-war, but I really think people
> > should be aware of the C/C++-stupidness.
>
> This is simply wrong. C++ is way faster in many cases. Also, writing a
> GTK2 GUI in C++ is not slower than using a high level language. In fact,
> the API is almost identical in most cases. And this is from someone who
> has created several GTK2 based projects using Perl OOP with GTK2.
>
Okey, these are good points. However, I should just wish everyone knew
lisp, then the world would be a better place. :)
--
Hi, just back from Musikmesse in Frankfurt.
FYI:
Videos of Mediastation X-76 and Lionstracs - Thomas Organ Musicstation
VKX-76
(basically the mediastation with 2 manuals, pedals, speakers in a wooden
case)
on the right side of the page, scroll down to VIDEO OF MUSIKMESSE,
you will find 4 videos
(under Linux you can play them with xine or mplayer if you have the
win32 codecs installed)
http://www.lionstracs.com/index.php?module=Static_Docs&func=view&f=/demos.h…
read these two links too:
http://www.synthzone.com/ubbs/Forum37/HTML/008798.htmlhttp://www.synthzone.com/ubbs/Forum37/HTML/008794.html
(in the organ videos Bernd Wurzenrainer plays the NI B4 under VST server
with a jazz base (.wav) :-) )
Some LADers that were at Musikmesse: Marek Peteraj, Frank Neumann,
Matthias Nagoni, Fons A. (aeolus).
Companies using Linux in musical gear besides Lionstracs: Plugzilla (a
rack that can play VSTs), Muse Receptor (similar concept), Hartman
Neuron (a synth). Unfortunately the others are based on pretty
closed design and most don't even tell you that's based on Linux.
Perhaps their attitude will change
in future.
As always thanks to everyone that contributes to Linux and Linux audio,
without these people these
musical instruments would not be a reality today.
cheers,
Benno
Dave Robillard:
>
> (Random thought) A MIDI sequencer where you can draw control curves over the
> tracks (like ardour volume and whatnot) would be very cool.. esp. for
> electronic music (like, say, trance) when the control parameters are as
> important as the notes themselves
>
Perhaps you would be interested in working on my music-editor Radium then?
http://www.notam02.no/radium/
Its about 98% functional for linux now, but I haven't released or updated
cvs for a very long time. I really should do that.
--
Samuel Abels:
> > > As nice as Ardour may be, I personaly still prefer the interfaces of
> > > modern UI toolkits, in combination with a nice Object Oriented language
> > > (aka C++ :) ).
> >
> > If you want to write C++, why do you want GTK??? Use a C++-toolkit like Qt.
>
> Despite the fact that this is often discussed as a matter of religion, I
> prefer gtkmm because it fits better into the GNOME environment.
>
> Also, this is from the gtkmm-documentation:
>
> http://www.murrayc.com/murray/talks/2002/GUADEC3/notes/html/index.html#id27…
>
> "QT originates from a time when C++ was not standardised or well
> supported by compilers. Its design today is still based upon the choices
> available at that time, so it does not play well with more up-to-date
> code. Development of QT is still effectively closed - There is still no
> public development mailing list, and TrollTech have the normal corporate
> conservatism. As an open-source project, its design would have been
> improved through public debate, and it would have been possible to
> jettison the baggage.
>
<snip>
> So, in essence, gtkmm does it in a more C++ way. :-) (But please let us
> not make this a flame; may everyone be free to choose whatever toolkit
> he likes best. ;) )
Then my question becomes:
Why on earth use C++? Use a desent high-level non-crippled language like
lisp, python or ruby. The lowlevel stuff must of course be written in
c/c++ or something, but only a very small amount of multitracker-code is
that low-level. Yes, I have made _huge_ programs in C myself, but that was
only because I was so damned inexperienced and had so damned slow machine
to work on at the time.
Today, where there are so many descent libraries for
lisp/python/ruby/ada(?)/etc(?), and the machines are so fast,
as good as no one should use c++ for high-level things. You'll
waste time.
Yes, this might start a flame-war, but I really think people
should be aware of the C/C++-stupidness.
--
Jan Depner:
> > Why on earth use C++? Use a desent high-level non-crippled language like
> > lisp, python or ruby. The lowlevel stuff must of course be written in
> > c/c++ or something, but only a very small amount of multitracker-code is
> > that low-level. Yes, I have made _huge_ programs in C myself, but that was
> > only because I was so damned inexperienced and had so damned slow machine
> > to work on at the time.
> >
> > Today, where there are so many descent libraries for
> > lisp/python/ruby/ada(?)/etc(?), and the machines are so fast,
> > as good as no one should use c++ for high-level things. You'll
> > waste time.
> >
> > Yes, this might start a flame-war, but I really think people
> > should be aware of the C/C++-stupidness.
> >
>
>
> Audio is inherently computationally intensive. So your answer to those
> who have slower machines is "buy better hardware because I don't want to
> bother writing in a language that is fast enough to work on your
> system"? This isn't a flame it's just that I don't understand why you
> consider C/C++ stupid. They have their place. I work on scientific
> applications and I guess I could use Perl or Python or (shudder) MATLAB
> (if you can consider that a language) but I don't because they're too
> slow. Where I work we have a supercomputer (currently at #18 on the top
> 500) and we have applications coded in (again, shudder) FORTRAN. Why?
> Because it's faster than C or C++ on supercomputers. It's better at
> parallel processing. I did FORTRAN programming for 14 years before I
> switched to C (yes, I'm _that_ old). I've also programmed in COBOL,
> BASIC, three or four different assembly languages, Pascal, Java, you
> name it. They all have their place. I just don't get this "my language
> is better than your language" stuff (with the possible exception of ADA
> ;-)
>
Thats not what I said. Or ment at least. I said; use a high-level language
for high-level operations. I'm not saying: Do computer-intensive/realtime
critical operations with lisp/python/ruby/etc. Ardour consist of about
90% GUI code, if I have understood correctly. Those 90% of code could
have been written in a more high-level language with garbage collectors,
proper list-functions, dynamic typing and other helpful things c++ does
not provide because C++ is supposed to be extremely fast, allways.
Or in case not, why not?
--
hi everyone !
it seems our friend dave has been very active again. in case you
haven't seen it yet, here is a nice teaser for the 2nd linux audio
conference in karlsruhe at the end of april:
http://www.linuxjournal.com//article.php?sid=7514
best,
jörn
--
The handles of a craftsman's tools bespeak an absolute simplicity,
the plainest forms affording the greatest range of possibilities for
the user's hand.
That which is overdesigned, too highly specific, anticipates
outcome; the anticipation of outcome guarantees, if not failure, the
absence of grace.
- William Gibson, "All Tomorrow's Parties"
Jörn Nettingsmeier
Kurfürstenstr 49, 45138 Essen, Germany
http://spunk.dnsalias.org (my server)
http://www.linuxaudiodev.org (Linux Audio Developers)
will:
>
> Should people have to upgrade to the latest and greatest hardware all
> the time because programmers want to use the new slow-ass
> resource-hogging Scripting Language Of The Day to write their apps?
> Because they didn't want to "waste time?"
>
Not at all. Modern (6-7 year old or newer) PCes should be fast enough
for common scripting applications.
--
hi steve and list...
i've experiencing some problems with the delayorama plugin ...
if the (feedback * taps) is bigger than 100, there is a big possibility
of clipping / sound getting louder and lounder / the plugin getting
unstable (???)...
i'd suggest to post a warning to stdout or stderr that the plugin will
get unstable when using these values ...
cheers...
Tim mailto:TimBlechmann@gmx.de
ICQ: 96771783
--
The only people for me are the mad ones, the ones who are mad to live,
mad to talk, mad to be saved, desirous of everything at the same time,
the ones who never yawn or say a commonplace thing, but burn, burn,
burn, like fabulous yellow roman candles exploding like spiders across
the stars and in the middle you see the blue centerlight pop and
everybody goes "Awww!"
Jack Kerouac
--
Tim mailto:TimBlechmann@gmx.de
ICQ: 96771783
--
The only people for me are the mad ones, the ones who are mad to live,
mad to talk, mad to be saved, desirous of everything at the same time,
the ones who never yawn or say a commonplace thing, but burn, burn,
burn, like fabulous yellow roman candles exploding like spiders across
the stars and in the middle you see the blue centerlight pop and
everybody goes "Awww!"
Jack Kerouac