8 Mar
2004
8 Mar
'04
5:40 p.m.
How should a host deal with a port that is MOMENTARY, but not TOGGLED? What would the UI
be?
Taybin
-----Original Message-----
From: Tim Goetze <tim(a)quitte.de>
Sent: Mar 8, 2004 1:06 PM
To:
The Linux Audio Developers' Mailing List <linux-audio-dev(a)music.columbia.edu>
Subject: Re: [linux-audio-dev] +momentary, consolidated (ladspa.h.diff)
ok, suppose we say only MOMENTARY, and one-shot triggering is always
rising edge. now we have another problem: Taybin is pretty adamant in
requiring MOMENTARY to imply TOGGLED. this means we'll always need
another port to transmit the velocity value for note-on and similar
events. fine, no problem? apart from this meaning a waste of
resources, how do we transmit two such impulses in successive run()
calls? simply split the run() call in two? at what a waste of
resources do we arrive then, for the doubtful pleasure of having
a 'simple' model. beats the intention of simplicity if you ask me.
8 Mar
8 Mar
6:02 p.m.
New subject: [linux-audio-dev] +momentary, consolidated (ladspa.h.diff)
[Taybin Rutkin]
How should a host deal with a port that is MOMENTARY,
but not
TOGGLED? What would the UI be?
a pushbutton emitting the default value for the port is a possibility.
another is a pushbutton and a slider/knob for setting the value to be
transmitted when pushed. yet another is a sensitive peak meter-like
object transmitting the amplitude at which the user clicked the
object.
people will come up with more imaginative controls over time i'm sure.
amicalement,
tim
6:14 p.m.
New subject: [linux-audio-dev] +momentary, consolidated (ladspa.h.diff)
Tim Goetze wrote on Mon, 08-Mar-2004:
[Taybin Rutkin]
Also, to take an example from sooperlooper, its multicontrol port
would be a MOMENTARY and ENUMERATED port. An ideal UI in its case would
likely be a bunch of buttons, one for each enumeration.... but
a generic host might make it a combobox and single button.
I believe Taybin's concern is what would a generic host be
expected to do? A very good question, but whichever host comes
up with the best answer wins :)
jlc
How should a host deal with a port that is
MOMENTARY, but not
TOGGLED? What would the UI be?
a pushbutton emitting the default value for the port is a possibility.
another is a pushbutton and a slider/knob for setting the value to be
transmitted when pushed. yet another is a sensitive peak meter-like
object transmitting the amplitude at which the user clicked the
object. 
9 Mar
9 Mar
4:58 a.m.
New subject: [linux-audio-dev] +momentary, consolidated (ladspa.h.diff)
On Mon, Mar 08, 2004 at 05:09:21 -0500, Jesse Chappell wrote:
Tim Goetze wrote on Mon, 08-Mar-2004:
Thats just a bad reflection of the controls - I would expect a set of
MOMENTARY controls for that situatuation (like on a hardware box).
No host has any chance of correctly interpreting that situation - someone
else could declare the same thing and reasonably expect it to be something
completely different (e.g. a slider that resets back to its default
position when released, like a pitchwheel).
I also dont like overloading the behviour of default to mean "not the
defualt" if the control is MOMENTARY hinted.
- Steve
[Taybin Rutkin]
Also, to take an example from sooperlooper, its multicontrol port
would be a MOMENTARY and ENUMERATED port. An ideal UI in its case would
likely be a bunch of buttons, one for each enumeration.... but
a generic host might make it a combobox and single button. How should a host deal with a port that is
MOMENTARY, but not
TOGGLED? What would the UI be?
a pushbutton emitting the default value for the port is a possibility.
another is a pushbutton and a slider/knob for setting the value to be
transmitted when pushed. yet another is a sensitive peak meter-like
object transmitting the amplitude at which the user clicked the
object.
9:16 a.m.
New subject: [linux-audio-dev] +momentary, consolidated (ladspa.h.diff)
[Steve Harris]
On Mon, Mar 08, 2004 at 05:09:21 -0500, Jesse Chappell
wrote:
> Tim Goetze wrote on Mon, 08-Mar-2004:
> > a pushbutton emitting the default value for the port is a possibility.
[...]
> Also, to take an example from sooperlooper, its
multicontrol port
> would be a MOMENTARY and ENUMERATED port. An ideal UI in its case would
> likely be a bunch of buttons, one for each enumeration.... but
> a generic host might make it a combobox and single button.
[...]
I also dont like overloading the behviour of default to
mean "not the
defualt" if the control is MOMENTARY hinted.
specifying 0 as the default value for a MOMENTARY or TRIGGER port is
redundant.
amicalement,
tim
10:03 a.m.
New subject: [linux-audio-dev] +momentary, consolidated (ladspa.h.diff)
On Tue, Mar 09, 2004 at 02:06:16 +0100, Tim Goetze wrote:
[Steve Harris]
You said "a pushbutton emitting the default value for the port is a
possibility", I was responding to that.
- Steve
On Mon, Mar 08, 2004 at 05:09:21 -0500, Jesse
Chappell wrote:
> Tim Goetze wrote on Mon, 08-Mar-2004:
> > a pushbutton emitting the default value for the port is a possibility.
[...]
> Also, to take an example from sooperlooper,
its multicontrol port
> would be a MOMENTARY and ENUMERATED port. An ideal UI in its case would
> likely be a bunch of buttons, one for each enumeration.... but
> a generic host might make it a combobox and single button.
[...]
I also dont like overloading the behviour of
default to mean "not the
defualt" if the control is MOMENTARY hinted.
specifying 0 as the default value for a MOMENTARY or TRIGGER port is
redundant.
10:25 a.m.
New subject: [linux-audio-dev] +momentary, consolidated (ladspa.h.diff)
[Steve Harris]
On Tue, Mar 09, 2004 at 02:06:16 +0100, Tim Goetze
wrote:
in that case, sorry for being vague. i'm trying to say that removing
the redundant default=0 constraint frees the default value to do
something useful.
amicalement,
tim
[Steve Harris]
You said "a pushbutton emitting the default value for the port is a
possibility", I was responding to that. On Mon, Mar 08, 2004 at 05:09:21 -0500, Jesse
Chappell wrote:
> Tim Goetze wrote on Mon, 08-Mar-2004:
> > a pushbutton emitting the default value for the port is a possibility.
[...]
> Also, to take an example from sooperlooper,
its multicontrol port
> would be a MOMENTARY and ENUMERATED port. An ideal UI in its case would
> likely be a bunch of buttons, one for each enumeration.... but
> a generic host might make it a combobox and single button.
[...]
I also dont like overloading the behviour of
default to mean "not the
defualt" if the control is MOMENTARY hinted.
specifying 0 as the default value for a MOMENTARY or TRIGGER port is
redundant.
11:12 a.m.
New subject: [linux-audio-dev] +momentary, consolidated (ladspa.h.diff)
On Tue, Mar 09, 2004 at 03:15:13 +0100, Tim Goetze wrote:
Yes, thats what I was objecting to, overloading the semantics of "default"
to exactly the opposite is not a good idea IMHO.
- Steve
You said
"a pushbutton emitting the default value for the port is a
possibility", I was responding to that.
in that case, sorry for being vague. i'm trying to say that removing
the redundant default=0 constraint frees the default value to do
something useful.
11:32 a.m.
New subject: [linux-audio-dev] +momentary, consolidated (ladspa.h.diff)
[Steve Harris]
On Tue, Mar 09, 2004 at 03:15:13 +0100, Tim Goetze
wrote:
Yes, thats what I was objecting to, overloading the semantics of "default"
to exactly the opposite is not a good idea IMHO.
agreed, it's a matter of taste, probably.
there's another sensible solution that removes the redundancy from the
default value: if we remove the references to 'zero' as the low signal
in the spec and replace it with 'the default value', the plugin can
choose what value to indicate 'low' itself.
in any case, a redundant default value gives room for
misinterpretation through expectation: "ok, so the low signal is zero,
surely i need not specify it as the default value as well."
amicalement,
tim
You said
"a pushbutton emitting the default value for the port is a
possibility", I was responding to that.
in that case, sorry for being vague. i'm trying to say that removing
the redundant default=0 constraint frees the default value to do
something useful. 
8:10 p.m.
New subject: [linux-audio-dev] +momentary, consolidated (ladspa.h.diff)
[Jens M Andreasen]
Tim, for several days you have been posting in lower
case. Some of us
believe you need a few hours of sleep, no?
thanks, i'm moved by your concern. to tell the truth, the shift keys
on this keyboard are broken. :)
vÃĪnligt,
tim
7361
days inactive
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linux-audio-dev@lists.linuxaudio.org
10 comments
5 participants
participants (5)
-
Jens M Andreasen -
Jesse Chappell -
Steve Harris -
Taybin Rutkin -
Tim Goetze