28 Nov
2011
28 Nov
'11
1:31 a.m.
Following recent emails on list about documentation and learning "Linux
Audio Programming", I've been thinking about an effort to help people get
started with Linux Audio Coding.
I think some "beginner" coding documentation on Linux Audio would be a
great asset to the community, and I'm willing to contribute to such an
effort. As Robin Gareus mentioned in another thread, a "FLOSS" manual is
probably the best way to go for a community effort on documenting.
I've been doing some "tutorial" style programming articles on my blog
harryhaaren.blogspot.com and I'd have no problem sharing the examples there
(some basic GTK stuff, some small JACK apps, combining the GUI / JACK stuff
). Problem is that I was learning as I was going along, and there are some
*fundamental* issues with some of the tutorials (especially with regards to
thread safe code & more advanced programming concepts)
Personally I'd be even more enthusiastic about such an effort if some of
the veteran Linux audio guys were to get on board and ensure the content is
of a high quality. (As I'm a self though programmer, there are some big
gaps in my knowledge, and I'd not like to provide bad sample code, or share
bad concepts.)
Of course some issues will arise in choosing how to document Linux Audio,
and some typical "flame" topics like GUI toolkits, libraries etc will
arise. I have no idea how we can best avoid that issue, except by following
the "if you think it should be thought that way write the tutorial"... the
downside of this is that if one tutorial uses toolkit <X> and the next
toolkit <Y>, the average beginning coder is going to get lost in
implementation details and that defeats the purpose of documentation :D
-Harry
28 Nov
28 Nov
1:44 a.m.
Hiya Harry,
On Mon, Nov 28, 2011 at 12:31 AM, Harry van Haaren
<harryhaaren(a)gmail.com> wrote:
I think some "beginner" coding documentation
on Linux Audio would be a great
asset to the community, and I'm willing to contribute to such an effort. As
Robin Gareus mentioned in another thread, a "FLOSS" manual is probably the
best way to go for a community effort on documenting.
I rather like this idea, for what it's worth.
"if
you think it should be thought that way write the tutorial"... the downside
of this is that if one tutorial uses toolkit <X> and the next toolkit <Y>,
the average beginning coder is going to get lost in implementation details
and that defeats the purpose of documentation :D
Easier said than done, but why not use the most popular toolkits for
each tutorial, that way you can follow each tutorial using whichever
toolkit you want.
Andrew.
(hurray for me ignoring the amount of work the above statement would
involve, but it's an idea.)
3:46 a.m.
I also think it's a much needed idea. I'd be happy to do some contributing
too, but like Harry, will need my contributions looked over by experts!
iain
On Sun, Nov 27, 2011 at 4:44 PM, Andrew C <countfuzzball(a)gmail.com> wrote:
Hiya Harry,
On Mon, Nov 28, 2011 at 12:31 AM, Harry van Haaren
<harryhaaren(a)gmail.com> wrote:
I think some "beginner" coding
documentation on Linux Audio would be a
great
asset to the community, and I'm willing to
contribute to such an effort.
As
Robin Gareus mentioned in another thread, a
"FLOSS" manual is probably
the
best way to go for a community effort on
documenting.
I rather like this idea, for what it's worth.
"if
you think it should be thought that way write the tutorial"... the
downside
of this is that if one tutorial uses toolkit
<X> and the next toolkit
<Y>,
the average beginning coder is going to get lost
in implementation
details
and that defeats the purpose of documentation :D
Easier said than done, but why not use the most popular toolkits for
each tutorial, that way you can follow each tutorial using whichever
toolkit you want.
Andrew.
(hurray for me ignoring the amount of work the above statement would
involve, but it's an idea.)
_______________________________________________
Linux-audio-dev mailing list
Linux-audio-dev(a)lists.linuxaudio.org
http://lists.linuxaudio.org/listinfo/linux-audio-dev
11:19 a.m.
Am 28.11.2011 03:46, schrieb Iain Duncan:
I also think it's a much needed idea. I'd be
happy to do some
contributing too, but like Harry, will need my contributions looked
over by experts!
Hi,
a great idea! I'm sure that you will see valuable feedback from this
list if you publish your tutorial, imho this ensures a good quality.
Do not discuss to long over question like the correct toolkit. Those can
lead away too easily from the core problem. Take the one your familiar with!
- Sebastian
6:19 p.m.
On Mon, Nov 28, 2011 at 10:19 AM, Sebastian Moors <mauser(a)smoors.de> wrote:
Do not discuss to long over question like the correct
toolkit. Those can
lead away too easily from the core problem. Take the one your familiar with!
You're right there I think... Although I concidered writing in multiple UI
kits, its not practical, not efficeint, and I don't actually use QT, so I
don't know how to either...
-H
7:45 p.m.
Le Mon, 28 Nov 2011 00:31:50 +0000,
Harry van Haaren <harryhaaren(a)gmail.com> a écrit :
I think some "beginner" coding documentation
on Linux Audio would be a
great asset to the community, and I'm willing to contribute to such an
effort. As Robin Gareus mentioned in another thread, a "FLOSS" manual
is probably the best way to go for a community effort on documenting.
It is a very good idea.
Personally I'd be even more enthusiastic about such an effort if some
of the veteran Linux audio guys were to get on board and ensure the
content is of a high quality. (As I'm a self though programmer, there
are some big gaps in my knowledge, and I'd not like to provide bad
sample code, or share bad concepts.)
I will be very interested because I have some basic skills (basic,
assembler, bash) but never get enough time to learn the C/C++ and the
other needed skills in order to become an audio programmer on a modern
system. I have a working note recognition software (monophonic
realtime Audio to MIDI conversion) on a dsp56k, and would like to port
it to C/C++ on linux. It will need a GUI in order to be easily usable
with so many sound sources (musical instruments) than possible.
It is so many things to learn for me (C/C++, JACK, some toolkit,
threading, ...) than I never was able to see how to process to learn
all that in the little amount of free time I have. A good audio
tutorial will be definitely a great asset, not only for me, but
also for the whole community.
Of course some issues will arise in choosing how to document Linux
Audio, and some typical "flame" topics like GUI toolkits, libraries
etc will arise. I have no idea how we can best avoid that issue,
except by following the "if you think it should be thought that way
write the tutorial"... the downside of this is that if one tutorial
uses toolkit <X> and the next toolkit <Y>, the average beginning
coder is going to get lost in implementation details and that defeats
the purpose of documentation :D
A toolkit is about visual presentation and interaction with the core
of the software. Whichever toolkit you choose, you will have to learn
the same things, but in a different manner. So, I think that you need
first to focus on the core and only after look on its interactions with
the toolkit. Also, depending to the goal of a given program, the
interactions between the core and the toolkit will be more or less
deep, and they will interfere on the core more or less deeply. I think
that deeper those interactions are, more it will be important to have
good coding skills. But the problem to solve will always be the same:
a goal to reach, a core and its interactions with a toolkit.
Dominique
-Harry
--
"We have the heroes we deserve."
8:36 p.m.
Excerpts from Harry van Haaren's message of 2011-11-28 01:31:50 +0100:
Following recent emails on list about documentation
and learning "Linux
Audio Programming", I've been thinking about an effort to help people get
started with Linux Audio Coding.
I think some "beginner" coding documentation on Linux Audio would be a
great asset to the community, and I'm willing to contribute to such an
effort. As Robin Gareus mentioned in another thread, a "FLOSS" manual is
probably the best way to go for a community effort on documenting.
I've been doing some "tutorial" style programming articles on my blog
harryhaaren.blogspot.com and I'd have no problem sharing the examples there
(some basic GTK stuff, some small JACK apps, combining the GUI / JACK stuff
). Problem is that I was learning as I was going along, and there are some
*fundamental* issues with some of the tutorials (especially with regards to
thread safe code & more advanced programming concepts)
Personally I'd be even more enthusiastic about such an effort if some of
the veteran Linux audio guys were to get on board and ensure the content is
of a high quality. (As I'm a self though programmer, there are some big
gaps in my knowledge, and I'd not like to provide bad sample code, or share
bad concepts.)
Of course some issues will arise in choosing how to document Linux Audio,
and some typical "flame" topics like GUI toolkits, libraries etc will
arise. I have no idea how we can best avoid that issue, except by following
the "if you think it should be thought that way write the tutorial"... the
downside of this is that if one tutorial uses toolkit <X> and the next
toolkit <Y>, the average beginning coder is going to get lost in
implementation details and that defeats the purpose of documentation :D
-Harry
It's a good idea, I hope it will work out.
A few thoughts:
- An easy way for those following the tutorial to give feedback or
improve the tutorial.
- An easy way for the experts to improve the tutorial.
- On the less technical side, I hope that experts will look it over and
improve it.
- I hope those using it will be able to show their appreciation so the
thing as a whole stays alive and keeps developing.
Personally, I'm looking forward to it. I do take a C/C++ course this
semester so I deal with the necessary languages at least once a week.
More importantly I've started to learn how to just write the code, if
you know what I mean.
I guess I have enough knowledge for simple audio coding now, but I've
yet to find/take the time to try it. I'm looking forward to it though.
Thanks for your effort,
Regards, Philipp
4739
days inactive
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linux-audio-dev@lists.linuxaudio.org
6 comments
6 participants
participants (6)
-
Andrew C -
Dominique Michel -
Harry van Haaren -
Iain Duncan -
Philipp Überbacher -
Sebastian Moors