5 Mar
2004
5 Mar
'04
11:49 a.m.
TRIGGER, or MOMENTARY in my patch
(http://www.mail-archive.com/linux-audio-dev@music.columbia.edu/msg11074.html), should
really be 804, because it implies TOGGLED.
-----Original Message-----
From: Tim Goetze <tim(a)quitte.de>
Sent: Mar 5, 2004 10:40 AM
To:
The Linux Audio Developers' Mailing List <linux-audio-dev(a)music.columbia.edu>
Subject: +trigger, Re: [linux-audio-dev] ladspa.h.diff
the attached patch proves that LADSPA can be extended
without breaking
binary compatibility. i've compiled plugins against a patched ladspa.h
and run them in hosts compiled against ladspa.h version 1.1 without
experiencing any problems.
attached is the same patch extended to define a TRIGGER hint.
amicalement,
tim
5 Mar
5 Mar
12:10 p.m.
New subject: +trigger, Re: [linux-audio-dev] ladspa.h.diff
[Taybin Rutkin]
TRIGGER, or MOMENTARY in my patch
(http://www.mail-archive.com/linux-audio-dev@music.columbia.edu/msg11074.html),
should really be 804, because it implies TOGGLED.
yes, i thought about this, but came to the conclusion that
variable-amplitude triggers are useful to have.
vriendelijk,
tim
1:15 p.m.
New subject: +trigger, Re: [linux-audio-dev] ladspa.h.diff
On Fri, Mar 05, 2004 at 05:54:52PM +0100, Tim Goetze wrote:
[Taybin Rutkin]
Momentary controls are boolean by definition.
- Steve
TRIGGER, or MOMENTARY in my patch
(http://www.mail-archive.com/linux-audio-dev@music.columbia.edu/msg11074.html),
should really be 804, because it implies TOGGLED.
yes, i thought about this, but came to the conclusion that
variable-amplitude triggers are useful to have. 
6:06 p.m.
New subject: +trigger, Re: [linux-audio-dev] ladspa.h.diff
On Fri, 2004-03-05 at 13:10, Steve Harris wrote:
On Fri, Mar 05, 2004 at 05:54:52PM +0100, Tim Goetze
wrote:
Variable-amplitude triggers would be really cool though. You could,
say, make a synthed snare generator plugin that is velocity-sensitive.
Actually, something like that would be out of the LADSPA domain I
suppose. An idea anyway.
-Dave
[Taybin Rutkin]
Momentary controls are boolean by definition. TRIGGER, or MOMENTARY in my patch
(http://www.mail-archive.com/linux-audio-dev@music.columbia.edu/msg11074.html),
should really be 804, because it implies TOGGLED.
yes, i thought about this, but came to the conclusion that
variable-amplitude triggers are useful to have. 
6:24 p.m.
New subject: +trigger, Re: [linux-audio-dev] ladspa.h.diff
Dave Robillard wrote on Fri, 05-Mar-2004:
On Fri, 2004-03-05 at 13:10, Steve Harris wrote:
You just use a regular control port to specify
your threshold/amplitude. The trigger port just does the "triggering".
jlc
On Fri, Mar 05, 2004 at 05:54:52PM +0100, Tim
Goetze wrote:
Variable-amplitude triggers would be really cool though. You could,
say, make a synthed snare generator plugin that is velocity-sensitive.
Actually, something like that would be out of the LADSPA domain I
suppose. An idea anyway. [Taybin Rutkin]
Momentary controls are boolean by definition. TRIGGER, or MOMENTARY in my patch
(http://www.mail-archive.com/linux-audio-dev@music.columbia.edu/msg11074.html),
should really be 804, because it implies TOGGLED.
yes, i thought about this, but came to the conclusion that
variable-amplitude triggers are useful to have.
7:01 p.m.
New subject: +trigger, Re: [linux-audio-dev] ladspa.h.diff
On Fri, Mar 05, 2004 at 06:19:42 -0500, Jesse Chappell wrote:
Yes, the point of MOMENTARY is a UI think, it tells the host that it
should reset the value back as soon as the user releasses the control.
- Steve
Variable-amplitude triggers would be really cool though. You could,
say, make a synthed snare generator plugin that is velocity-sensitive.
Actually, something like that would be out of the LADSPA domain I
suppose. An idea anyway.
You just use a regular control port to specify
your threshold/amplitude. The trigger port just does the "triggering".
9:03 p.m.
New subject: +trigger, Re: [linux-audio-dev] ladspa.h.diff
[Jesse Chappell]
Dave Robillard wrote on Fri, 05-Mar-2004:
the proposed patch fits this model well: a plugin need only specify
TOGGLED in addition to TRIGGER.
at the same time, connecting a 'velocity'-enhanced trigger source to a
port defining TRIGGER without TOGGLED is possible with the minimum
need of transmission logic (conditionals, ports) in the host as well
as in the plugin.
amicalement,
tim
On Fri, 2004-03-05 at 13:10, Steve Harris wrote:
You just use a regular control port to specify
your threshold/amplitude. The trigger port just does the "triggering". On Fri, Mar 05, 2004 at 05:54:52PM +0100, Tim
Goetze wrote:
Variable-amplitude triggers would be really cool though. You could,
say, make a synthed snare generator plugin that is velocity-sensitive.
Actually, something like that would be out of the LADSPA domain I
suppose. An idea anyway. [Taybin Rutkin]
>TRIGGER, or MOMENTARY in my patch
>(http://www.mail-archive.com/linux-audio-dev@music.columbia.edu/msg11074.html),
>should really be 804, because it implies TOGGLED.
yes, i thought about this, but came to the conclusion that
variable-amplitude triggers are useful to have.
Momentary controls are boolean by definition.
6 Mar
6 Mar
6:27 a.m.
New subject: +trigger, Re: [linux-audio-dev] ladspa.h.diff
On Sat, Mar 06, 2004 at 02:52:43 +0100, Tim Goetze wrote:
So what does the TRIGGER hint mean? For a normal gate CV signal (which I
think is what youre talking about) there is no need for a hint.
I dont see how you can have a momentary control which is anything other
than boolean, you press it, the signal goes high, you release it, it goes
low. I dont see hoe you can fit a variable amplitude in there, something
like a slider or knob has no momentary action.
- Steve
You just use a
regular control port to specify
your threshold/amplitude. The trigger port just does the "triggering".
the proposed patch fits this model well: a plugin need only specify
TOGGLED in addition to TRIGGER.
at the same time, connecting a 'velocity'-enhanced trigger source to a
port defining TRIGGER without TOGGLED is possible with the minimum
need of transmission logic (conditionals, ports) in the host as well
as in the plugin.
8:35 a.m.
New subject: +trigger, Re: [linux-audio-dev] ladspa.h.diff
[Steve Harris]
On Sat, Mar 06, 2004 at 02:52:43 +0100, Tim Goetze
wrote:
So what does the TRIGGER hint mean? For a normal gate CV signal (which I
think is what youre talking about) there is no need for a hint.
a gate CV signal is already covered by TOGGLED: states are binary 0 or
1, transition is possible at any time. no need to use another hint
bit.
You just
use a regular control port to specify
your threshold/amplitude. The trigger port just does the "triggering".
the proposed patch fits this model well: a plugin need only specify
TOGGLED in addition to TRIGGER.
at the same time, connecting a 'velocity'-enhanced trigger source to a
port defining TRIGGER without TOGGLED is possible with the minimum
need of transmission logic (conditionals, ports) in the host as well
as in the plugin. I dont see how you can have a momentary control which
is anything other
than boolean, you press it, the signal goes high, you release it, it goes
low. I dont see hoe you can fit a variable amplitude in there, something
like a slider or knob has no momentary action.
the second paragraph above is intended to cover MIDI input from a
keyboard, drumpad or the likes. as you will recall, the trigger
signals emitted from such sources are one-shot and not binary.
-
it seems we haven't even covered what you describe here: connecting
both rising and falling edge of a control signal to a port. your
intention seems to use 'TRIGGER | TOGGLED' for this purpose. but i
doubt this is really useful: it forces the signal edge detection on
the plugin, which requires another memory location and control logic
to do that. while this procedure may be true to analog circuitry, in
the digital domain this is not practical because we do not deal with
continuous signals, but rather with events already expressing the
derivative: rising edge, falling edge.
-
i conclude that your understanding of TRIGGER is better described by
MOMENTARY, which, incidentally, is the word you used first iirc. if i
understand correctly, your intention is to connect an ordinary button
(of the return-to-zero-on-release kind) to a port indicating TOGGLED
| MOMENTARY. does that do your idea justice?
amicalement,
tim
5 Mar
5 Mar
1:15 p.m.
New subject: +trigger, Re: [linux-audio-dev] ladspa.h.diff
On Fri, Mar 05, 2004 at 11:44:24AM -0500, Taybin Rutkin wrote:
TRIGGER, or MOMENTARY in my patch
(http://www.mail-archive.com/linux-audio-dev@music.columbia.edu/msg11074.html), should
really be 804, because it implies TOGGLED.
And also RANDOMIZABLE, which is also important.
- Steve
2:28 p.m.
New subject: +rand, Re: +trigger, Re: [linux-audio-dev] ladspa.h.diff
[Steve Harris]
On Fri, Mar 05, 2004 at 11:44:24AM -0500, Taybin Rutkin
wrote:
attached is a patch against ladspa.h 1.1 that extends the previous two
patches to include RANDOMIZABLE, and discusses further implications of
the TRIGGER hint bit.
i fail to see why TRIGGER should imply TOGGLED. the TRIGGER
description already dictates resetting the value to zero after
run() or run_adding().
extending it to imply TOGGLED would preclude variable amplitude
triggering once and for all. if a plugin wants to receive unit-valued
triggers only, it can always set TOGGLED itself.
amicalement,
tim
TRIGGER, or MOMENTARY in my patch
(http://www.mail-archive.com/linux-audio-dev@music.columbia.edu/msg11074.html),
should really be 804, because it implies TOGGLED.
And also RANDOMIZABLE, which is also important.
7362
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7363
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linux-audio-dev@lists.linuxaudio.org
10 comments
5 participants
participants (5)
-
Dave Robillard -
Jesse Chappell -
Steve Harris -
Taybin Rutkin -
Tim Goetze