25 Oct
2005
25 Oct
'05
9:12 p.m.
I stand by my assertion that the RIAA record curve attenuates the low
frequencies and amplifies the high frequencies. The physical effects on
the record are such that the attenuated low frequencies do not cause the
cutting head trace to take up so much room on the master, and by the
same reasoning, the normally low amplitudes at high frequencies are
given more (physical) headroom. Of course the reverse filter would
flatten the frequency response and the use of the record filter
optimizes the use of the master "real estate".
-----Original Message-----
From: linux-audio-dev-bounces(a)music.columbia.edu
[mailto:linux-audio-dev-bounces@music.columbia.edu] On Behalf Of fons
adriaensen
Sent: Tuesday, October 25, 2005 5:00 PM
To: The Linux Audio Developers' Mailing List
Subject: Re: [linux-audio-dev] Re: applying RIAA curves in software
On Tue, Oct 25, 2005 at 04:10:12PM -0500, Richard Smith wrote:
>
> > The RIAA record curve reduces bass and increases treble, and the
> > reverse RIAA curve for playback does the opposite.
>
> Sorry, but this is plain wrong. The RIAA filter used when cutting a
> disk master will boost bass (below 50 Hz), and reduce high
> frequencies. This actually leads to a worse S/N ratio on playback.
It looks
like this:
I'm confused then.
This page:
http://www.bonavolta.ch/hobby/en/audio/riaa.htm
Has a spread sheet that runs the math on the equation presented.
Unless I'm just backwards for RIAA reproduction it yeilds roughly 20dB
of gain for 20Hz and -21dB for 21kHz. Which seems
backward from what
you are saying.
That curve, the same as (3) in my previous post, is often called 'the
RIAA curve' but it isn't. It is the combination two things:
* a 1/F (or -6dB/oct) filter that is required to compensate for the
+6dB/oct response of a magnetic cartridge,
* and the real RIAA playback curve, (2) in my previous post, which
boosts high frequencies.
In other words, the general downward slope of the filter you refer to
has nothing to do with RIAA equalisation, it's there only because that
filter is designed for use in a preamp for a magnetic cartridge.
If you would have a flat frequency response from the cartridge, then the
filtering required needs to boost high frequencies, as in (2).
If you take (2), and turn it 45 degrees clockwise (that adds the
-6dB/oct slope for the transducer), you get the curve you refer to.
So the idea that the RIAA curve was introduced to improve the S/N ratio
at high frequencies is just wrong, it does the opposite.
--
FA
25 Oct
25 Oct
10:27 p.m.
New subject: [linux-audio-dev] Re: applying RIAA curves in software
On Tue, Oct 25, 2005 at 06:12:41PM -0500, Cornell III, Howard M wrote:
I stand by my assertion that the RIAA record curve
attenuates the low
frequencies and amplifies the high frequencies. The physical effects on
the record are such that the attenuated low frequencies do not cause the
cutting head trace to take up so much room on the master, and by the
same reasoning, the normally low amplitudes at high frequencies are
given more (physical) headroom. Of course the reverse filter would
flatten the frequency response and the use of the record filter
optimizes the use of the master "real estate".
It depends on how you look at it.
Suppose you want the same amplitude on the disc (i.e. the same mechanical
displacement of the spiral track) for all frequencies. Then you need to
feed a typical disc cutter head with a signal that rises 6db per octave.
This is because the driving voltage controls its velocity (in the same
way really as with a DC motor), and not its amplitude.
If you play such a disc with a magnetic cartridge without any equaliser,
you willl get a response that again rises 6dB per octave, not because
of the EQ applied in the cutter, but because the cartride delivers a
voltage that is again proportional to velocity rather than amplitude.
To compensate for this, you apply -6dB/oct in the preamp.
So to have a flat frequency response _on disc_, we need to amplify the
HF when recording and attenuate it when playing back. That equalisation
is there purely because of the transducers used at either end.
Compared to such a flat system, the RIAA curve attenuates HF when
recording and amplifies them on playback. The correction applied is
small compared to the filtering that was already required to have
a flat 'on disc' response, so the net result is still boosting HF
on record, and attenuating it at playback. But relative to the
flat response, it's not preemphasis, but rather the opposite.
The confusion arises because the 'official' RIAA curves include the
transducer equalisation, or in other words, they are defined in terms
of voltages required to drive the cutter or obtained from the playback
cartridge, and not in terms of mechanical signal amplitude on the disc.
Hope this clears up the matter.
--
FA
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