7 Sep
2007
7 Sep
'07
9:16 a.m.
You're not specifying the price range. However,
I'm very happy with my
KRK Rokit 6 active speakers, and I've heard that many others are happy
with them too. They're about £450 in Norway.
That's way too much for me right now, and probably a whole lot
more than I actually need (both the number of speakers and probably
the quality, too). 400 EUR is the **hard** upper limit for me.
To me I prefer active speakers because:
[...]
Thanks for pointing that out, that would have been my next question.
The Alesis speakers mentioned by Arnold do already hit my budget hard,
but I think 333 EUR is still pretty cheap for them, considering the
exclusively positive reviews I found.
So maybe I'll go for them, although I'm still unsure because an external
amp seems more flexible to me.
In any case, I'd still like to collect some more opinions.
Do I really need an amp? Doesn't the signal level of the sound card suffice?
Consider that I don't want to crank up the volume substantially.
Leslie
7 Sep
7 Sep
9:45 a.m.
New subject: Advice for buying speakers
Hi,
Am Freitag, 7. September 2007 schrieb Leslie P. Polzer:
The Alesis speakers mentioned by Arnold do already hit
my budget hard,
but I think 333 EUR is still pretty cheap for them, considering the
exclusively positive reviews I found.
So maybe I'll go for them, although I'm still unsure because an external
amp seems more flexible to me.
In any case, I'd still like to collect some more opinions.
Actually the internal amps are _way_ better:
- With external amps you need the cross-over in the high-power path which
needs far better (and pricier) parts than in the low-power path of the input
signals.
- You get (at least) two independent amps optimized for their frequency-range
and not interfering with the other freqs.
- Not another device played on your desk/cup-board.
- Most active speakers in the studio-sense have XLR- (ie. symmetric) inputs
which means no interference on the signal path. Normal speaker cable from the
external amp to the speakers is not shielded and picks up (and causes) noise
and cross-talk.
Do I really need an amp? Doesn't the signal level
of the sound card
suffice? Consider that I don't want to crank up the volume substantially.
"If" the soundcard has an amped output (I remember an old soundblaster16 with
two switches on the board), the output is maximum 5W which is far to low to
do any work. And normal line-level might be good to drive headphones but not
any kind of speaker (in the meaning of _loud_ speaker)(*). Yes, you need some
amping!
If you want something cheaper than the Alesis (which are pretty good and even
superb in the price/benefit-scale), you can take a look at Edirols speakers.
And even cheaper (and worse) is the stuff from behringer(.de/.com). But if
you want quality you might be disappointed by behringers products. While our
church has almost all its equipment from them for monetary reasons, I don't
own anything behringer for quality reasons (well, currently I am thinking
about getting their smallest midi-controller).
Back to programming neuronal networks, have fun,
Arnold
(*) Loud is here not defined as
so-loud-the-neighbors-three-blocks-away-send-for-the-police but
loud-enough-to-hear-something-in-the-whole-room.
--
visit http://www.arnoldarts.de/
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10:14 a.m.
New subject: Advice for buying speakers
Actually the internal amps are _way_ better:
[...]
Alright, I'm _so_ convinced now of the benefits of internal amps. ;)
If you want something cheaper than the Alesis (which
are pretty good and even
superb in the price/benefit-scale), you can take a look at Edirols speakers.
The Edirols *look* good. Do you know how they differ from Alesis' speakers?
I guess their behaviour is not that strictly linear, but I could live with that.
Anything else?
Are the M-Audio ones any good?
Leslie
11:24 a.m.
New subject: Advice for buying speakers
Hallo,
Leslie P. Polzer hat gesagt: // Leslie P. Polzer wrote:
No. ;)
Actually no idea, I've never heard them, and that's exactly what you
should try to do: Listen to some speakers in your price range, if
possible. Samson also makes some nice cheap ones (Resolv) and never
forget, duh, Behringer. Personally I'm very fond of my Tapco S-8
monitors.
One thing to keep in mind with active speakers budgetwise is, that you
also need something to control their volume. Either use a small mixing
desk like the Samson MDR6 or the Soundcraft Compact4 (which is very
nice!) or one of the smaller "volume knob" thingies like the C-control
by (again, sorry) Samson.
Ciao
--
Frank Barknecht _ ______footils.org_ __goto10.org__
Actually the
internal amps are _way_ better:
[...]
Alright, I'm _so_ convinced now of the benefits of internal amps. ;)
If you want something cheaper than the Alesis
(which are pretty good and even
superb in the price/benefit-scale), you can take a look at Edirols speakers.
The Edirols *look* good. Do you know how they differ from Alesis' speakers?
I guess their behaviour is not that strictly linear, but I could live with that.
Anything else?
Are the M-Audio ones any good?
12:10 p.m.
New subject: Advice for buying speakers
Hello Frank,
Actually no idea, I've never heard them, and
that's exactly what you
should try to do: Listen to some speakers in your price range, if
possible.
Sure, listening is good, but gathering information from a bunch of
most likely competent people helps, too.
Even more so when there's no at least semi-professional audio store
nearby :)
Leslie
2:44 p.m.
New subject: Advice for buying speakers
On Fri, Sep 07, 2007 at 04:10:30PM +0200, Leslie P. Polzer wrote:
Hello Frank,
In that case, make sure everything you try can be easily returned :-)
You don't want to buy something and discover you hate it.
--
Paul Winkler
http://www.slinkp.com
Actually no idea, I've never heard them, and
that's exactly what you
should try to do: Listen to some speakers in your price range, if
possible.
Sure, listening is good, but gathering information from a bunch of
most likely competent people helps, too.
Even more so when there's no at least semi-professional audio store
nearby :)
1:24 p.m.
New subject: Advice for buying speakers
Am Freitag, 7. September 2007 schrieb Frank Barknecht:
Leslie P. Polzer hat gesagt: // Leslie P. Polzer
wrote:
> > Actually the internal amps are _way_ better:
> Alright, I'm _so_ convinced now of the benefits of internal amps. ;)
> > If you want something cheaper than the Alesis (which are pretty good
> > and even superb in the price/benefit-scale), you can take a look at
> > Edirols speakers.
> The Edirols *look* good. Do you know how they differ from Alesis'
> speakers? I guess their behaviour is not that strictly linear, but I
> could live with that. Anything else?
I only know one guy who has them and he lives far away and I didn't hear them.
But the ones I saw with him are rather small and for low frequencies you need
big membranes and lots of air to be moved. So the bigger the speaker the
lower the frequencies supported. And with some small speakers half the height
of your 17" screen you can't expect much...
One thing to keep in mind with active speakers
budgetwise is, that you
also need something to control their volume. Either use a small mixing
desk like the Samson MDR6 or the Soundcraft Compact4 (which is very
nice!) or one of the smaller "volume knob" thingies like the C-control
by (again, sorry) Samson.
I had a look at the C-Control too and would have bought it (on ebay) but there
also was an auction where I got a MAM-line-mixer for <25€ and that is doing
its duty here now. Even my wife got used to it. :-)
But such a thing is important. One could argue that you don't need one with an
external (hifi-)amp but a small mixer lets you use different sources at the
same time or offers ways of monitoring, talk-back and the like (in the case
of the C-Control or its behringer-pendant).
Arnold
--
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1:40 p.m.
New subject: Advice for buying speakers
Hallo,
Arnold Krille hat gesagt: // Arnold Krille wrote:
But such a thing is important. One could argue that
you don't need one with an
external (hifi-)amp but a small mixer lets you use different sources at the
same time or offers ways of monitoring, talk-back and the like (in the case
of the C-Control or its behringer-pendant).
With small mixers one should to be careful to choose a model that has
additional independent outputs to connect your soundcard's inputs to
("Sub mix" or "ALT 3-4"). Otherwise you're bound to get feedback
loops
when recording. Many small mixers lack these outputs. The Compact4 and
the HDR6 are example for mixers, that do have them, though.
A more indepth explanation is on:
http://www.tweakheadz.com/how_to_hookup_a_mixer.htm Tweakheadz also
has a page on monitors.
Ciao
--
Frank Barknecht _ ______footils.org_ __goto10.org__
2:58 p.m.
New subject: Advice for buying speakers
Am Freitag, 7. September 2007 schrieb Frank Barknecht:
Arnold Krille hat gesagt: // Arnold Krille wrote:
Hmm, I am not recording from that mixer. Its just for the last stage before
something hits my speakers. Even the monitoring for the musicians is before
that mixer (got enough outputs on my firepod to feed an 4-stereo headphone
amp :-P ).
My line-mixer here to mix my pc (normal background music) and cd-player and
the firepod and its more a convenience to not replug cables everytime.
And during recording (real instruments, not "frank_barknecht_pd_style" ;) I
turn off the speakers because of the feedback and noise. That is what
headphones are for.
You should not record from a mixer but connect the sources as direct to the
A/D-converters as possible. Unless your mixer has better preamps than your
card of course.
Arnold
--
visit http://www.arnoldarts.de/
---
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to all your contacts.
After a month or so log in as root and do a rm / -rf. Or ask your
administrator to do so...
But such a thing is important. One could argue
that you don't need one
with an external (hifi-)amp but a small mixer lets you use different
sources at the same time or offers ways of monitoring, talk-back and the
like (in the case of the C-Control or its behringer-pendant).
With small mixers
one should to be careful to choose a model that has
additional independent outputs to connect your soundcard's inputs to
("Sub mix" or "ALT 3-4"). Otherwise you're bound to get feedback
loops
when recording. Many small mixers lack these outputs. The Compact4 and
the HDR6 are example for mixers, that do have them, though.
4:18 p.m.
New subject: Advice for buying speakers
Hallo,
Arnold Krille hat gesagt: // Arnold Krille wrote:
And during recording (real instruments, not
"frank_barknecht_pd_style" ;) I
turn off the speakers because of the feedback and noise. That is what
headphones are for.
If it has seperate headphone outs, then it already has some kind of
"ALT"-bus. My previous mixer was a simple stereo mixer and didn't have
them - ironically it was exactly the Yamaha MG102 shown as "bad"
example on Tweakheadz. Everything that was sent to the speakers also
went to the headphones and worse: Everything that was output by the
speaker also went to the soundcard input. This makes live monitoring
while recording completely impossible. I replaced it with Compact4
recently, and now I can listen to myself singing to a recorded track
on headphones while recording my voice. Well, I could: I don't sing. ;)
You should not record from a mixer but connect the
sources as direct to the
A/D-converters as possible. Unless your mixer has better preamps than your
card of course.
Hm, I thought recording from a mixer is quite common practice?
My card is a M-Audio Audiophile and to connect a mic to it, I need a
seperate preamp anyway. Both the Yamaha and the Soundcraft preamps
sound fine enough for me.
Ciao
--
Frank Barknecht _ ______footils.org_ __goto10.org__
12:53 p.m.
New subject: Advice for buying speakers
On Fri, Sep 07, 2007 at 01:16:21PM +0200, Leslie P. Polzer wrote:
the quality, too). 400 EUR is the **hard** upper limit
for me.
Do I really need an amp?
Yes, unless you get active speakers.
Doesn't the signal level of the sound card
suffice?
No. Typical consumer soundcards can drive a pair of headphones, but
that's all.
If you end up going with passive speakers, I think one of the best
bargains around is the PSB Alpha B. I have a pair in my living room
and I love them. The sound is well balanced and pretty neutral. You
can get flatter speakers, but probably not without spending a lot
more. It'll handle everything you mentioned just fine. In europe I
think they go for about 250 EUR. They have dealers all over the
place: http://www.psbspeakers.com/distributors
But you'd also need to buy an amp, of course, so keep that in mind
when comparing active speakers to passive. I'm still using an ancient
home-stereo amp that works OK but is nothing special. The standard
recommendation from rec.audio.pro for a new low-cost amp used to be
Hafler, but they're not made any more. Nobody on that board had much
good to say about Samson, Behringer, or Alesis amps.
Last time I went monitor-shopping (5 years ago?), I checked out a
bunch of actives but I didn't really like anything cheaper than the
Mackie HR624 (900 USD for a pair, active). I thought the Event powered
monitors were OK, but not really any better than the PSB so I opted to
stick with the PSB until I really feel the need for something
significantly better.
--
Paul Winkler
http://www.slinkp.com
2:36 p.m.
New subject: Advice for buying speakers
Leslie P. Polzer wrote:
Now I recall my uncle recommending me some Alesis active speakers, some
model in the price range you describe. I generally trust him when it
comes to things like these, but I haven't listened to them myself. He
got the best quality when the speakers was lying rather than standing.
He also told me that the left and the right speaker had different
(mirrored) placement of high-freq element (left and right speaker is
different). This is generally also a quality sign for speakers.
Perhaps you should also check for the pricing of the KRK's. Norway is
generally expensive on things like these, and if you go to the store and
talk with them yourself, you might be able to get them to shave off the
price a little (I was).
--
Ringheims Auto - Fri musikk for bilstereo!
http://ringheimsauto.org
You're not
specifying the price range. However, I'm very happy with my
KRK Rokit 6 active speakers, and I've heard that many others are happy
with them too. They're about £450 in Norway.
That's way too much for me right now, and probably a whole lot
more than I actually need (both the number of speakers and probably
the quality, too). 400 EUR is the **hard** upper limit for me.
To me I prefer active speakers because:
[...]
Thanks for pointing that out, that would have been my next question.
The Alesis speakers mentioned by Arnold do already hit my budget hard,
but I think 333 EUR is still pretty cheap for them, considering the
exclusively positive reviews I found.
So maybe I'll go for them, although I'm still unsure because an external
amp seems more flexible to me.
6340
days inactive
6340
days old
linux-audio-user@lists.linuxaudio.org
11 comments
5 participants
participants (5)
-
Arnold Krille -
Frank Barknecht -
Johannes Mario Ringheim -
Leslie P. Polzer -
Paul Winkler