7 Jul
2013
7 Jul
'13
9:50 p.m.
As many of you already know, Non Mixer (http://non.tuxfamily.org) has
since its inception provided some cushy features for dealing with
Ambisonics mixes.
Lately I've been working on extending these features to the next level.
This is a quick demonstration of the new Spatializer module and the
associated Spatialization Console. What this does is provide synthetic
distance cues as well as a cushy interface for placing sounds in
virtual space.
http://youtu.be/GVm5Jd1WDWw
I'm hoping to have these new features ready for testing soon--but my
free time is very limited.
As always, donations are welcome and very much appreciated.
(http://non.tuxfamily.org/wiki/Donations)
A note about the video:
Every time I try to make one of these screencasts, I run into the same
problem: nothing works. Thus, I had to aim my video camera at the
screen and record audio from my computer via line-out. This is
problematic for a number of reasons. 1) I can only record stereo this
way 2) my camera only samples audio at 32KHz and 3) When youtube
transcodes the video it adds an annoying click about once per second
(I believe this is due to a mismatch between the camera's framerate
and youtube's expectations. I would love to provide a theora/vorbis
screencapture video instead, but, alas, I cannot find any tools that
can capture screen activity and record audio via JACK in sync. Anyway,
the poor quality of the video is not due to a lack of effort.
7 Jul
7 Jul
10 p.m.
On Sun, 2013-07-07 at 14:50 -0700, J. Liles wrote:
Can't be played with Firefox 22.0. Google Chrome can play it, but IMO
the need for Adobe Flash Player should be dropped by videos done by the
Linux community.
I won't install Adobe Flash Player anymore and usually I don't have
Chrome installed either.
"NOTE: Adobe Flash Player 11.2 will be the last version to target Linux
as a supported platform. Adobe will continue to provide security
backports to Flash Player 11.2 for Linux."
10:08 p.m.
On Sun, Jul 7, 2013 at 3:00 PM, Ralf Mardorf <ralf.mardorf(a)alice-dsl.net> wrote:
On Sun, 2013-07-07 at 14:50 -0700, J. Liles wrote:
Can't be played with Firefox 22.0. Google Chrome can play it, but IMO
the need for Adobe Flash Player should be dropped by videos done by the
Linux community.
I won't install Adobe Flash Player anymore and usually I don't have
Chrome installed either.
"NOTE: Adobe Flash Player 11.2 will be the last version to target Linux
as a supported platform. Adobe will continue to provide security
backports to Flash Player 11.2 for Linux."
Ralf, please, by all means help by fixing recordmydesktop or one of
the other tools so that I and others can record such demos using only
free-software and open codecs. Or point me at some solution that
works. I have very limited options in this regard. I have no desire to
use youtube.
10:25 p.m.
New subject: Flash Player - Was: Non Mixer Spatializer Demo
Fixing the desktop recording issues is beyond my scope.
However, Firefox is able to play many YouTube videos, so it seems to be
an issue regarding to a used codec or similar.
There's no need to avoid YouTube, you "only" need to convert your camera
recordings in a way, that the videos can be played with HTML 5 capable
browsers.
I don't know how much work the "only" to do would cause, since I have
given up Linux video a long, long time ago. I already have more than
enough issues with Linux audio, still couldn't get the RME card working
as it should work ;).
10:36 p.m.
New subject: Flash Player - Was: Non Mixer Spatializer Demo
On Sun, Jul 7, 2013 at 3:25 PM, Ralf Mardorf <ralf.mardorf(a)alice-dsl.net> wrote:
Fixing the desktop recording issues is beyond my
scope.
However, Firefox is able to play many YouTube videos, so it seems to be
an issue regarding to a used codec or similar.
There's no need to avoid YouTube, you "only" need to convert your camera
recordings in a way, that the videos can be played with HTML 5 capable
browsers.
I don't know how much work the "only" to do would cause, since I have
given up Linux video a long, long time ago. I already have more than
enough issues with Linux audio, still couldn't get the RME card working
as it should work ;).
Youtube transcodes all uploads to suit their architecture. The codec
of the uploaded video makes no difference.
10:50 p.m.
New subject: Flash Player - Was: Non Mixer Spatializer Demo
On Sun, 2013-07-07 at 15:36 -0700, J. Liles wrote:
Youtube transcodes all uploads to suit their
architecture. The codec
of the uploaded video makes no difference.
Some days ago, a video from another thread on this list and there was a
discussion about Flash Player vs HTML 5 issues too:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gSedE5sU3uc
This video can be played with Firefox, without Flash Player and it's on
YouTube.
8 Jul
8 Jul
10:30 a.m.
New subject: Flash Player - Was: Non Mixer Spatializer Demo
On 8/07/13 8:50 AM, Ralf Mardorf wrote:
On Sun, 2013-07-07 at 15:36 -0700, J. Liles wrote:
That's just due to the fact that Youtube has transcoded that particular
video to WebM; it has nothing to do with the format it was uploaded in.
Thanks
Leigh
Youtube transcodes all uploads to suit their
architecture. The codec
of the uploaded video makes no difference.
Some days ago, a video from another thread on this list and there was a
discussion about Flash Player vs HTML 5 issues too:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gSedE5sU3uc
This video can be played with Firefox, without Flash Player and it's on
YouTube.
7 Jul
7 Jul
10:40 p.m.
New subject: Flash Player - Was: Non Mixer Spatializer Demo
Hi Louigi,
the reason that now relatively many people don't want Flash Player
anymore is that it's not maintained for Linux anymore and even on other
platforms it's not available. In the past I used Adobe Flash Player on
Linux myself and I still use proprietary software with Linux.
So at least for me the reason isn't Linux operating system religion,
it's simply that Flash Player is a Windows only thing, not only an issue
for Linux.
Regards,
Ralf
10:45 p.m.
New subject: Flash Player - Was: Non Mixer Spatializer Demo
On Mon, 2013-07-08 at 00:40 +0200, Ralf Mardorf wrote:
So at least for me the reason isn't Linux
operating system religion,
it's simply that Flash Player is a Windows only thing, not only an issue
for Linux.
Sure, it's available for Mac too, but I guess you know what I mean.
10:50 p.m.
New subject: Flash Player - Was: Non Mixer Spatializer Demo
On Sun, Jul 7, 2013 at 3:45 PM, Ralf Mardorf <ralf.mardorf(a)alice-dsl.net> wrote:
On Mon, 2013-07-08 at 00:40 +0200, Ralf Mardorf
wrote:
Ralf, respectfully, if you can't offer any solutions, then your
comments offer nothing of value. They simply serve to distract the
members of this list.
So at least for me the reason isn't Linux
operating system religion,
it's simply that Flash Player is a Windows only thing, not only an issue
for Linux.
Sure, it's available for Mac too, but I guess you know what I mean.
11:31 p.m.
New subject: Flash Player - Was: Non Mixer Spatializer Demo
On Sun, 2013-07-07 at 15:50 -0700, J. Liles wrote:
Ralf, respectfully, if you can't offer any
solutions, then your
comments offer nothing of value. They simply serve to distract the
members of this list.
Perhaps this
http://lists.linuxaudio.org/pipermail/linux-audio-user/2013-July/093553.html
+ this
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/YouTube#Quality_and_codecs
does help?!
User often can't support solutions ;), but we experience that things
don't work and IMO this should be reported.
The Flash Player issue leads to discussions on Linux and FreeBSD lists,
often people are unable to get Flash Player working and soon or later it
definitive won't work anymore.
8 Jul
8 Jul
9:28 a.m.
New subject: Flash Player - Was: Non Mixer Spatializer Demo
Ralf:
the reason that now relatively many people don't
want Flash Player
anymore is that it's not maintained for Linux anymore and even on other
platforms it's not available. In the past I used Adobe Flash Player on
Linux myself and I still use proprietary software with Linux.
...
Interesting, here in Sweden, the former state television company
is "broadcasting" tv over Internet. They are using flash and their
sister company (the one collectiong the tv-licence fees) wants every-
body with a computer and an internet connection to pay.
If one can show that flash is non-linux, perhaps linux users could
go free.
Do you have any proof that would hold at a court ?
Regards,
/Karl Hammar
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
Aspö Data
Lilla Aspö 148
S-742 94 Östhammar
Sweden
+46 173 140 57
10:42 a.m.
New subject: Flash Player - Was: Non Mixer Spatializer Demo
On 8/07/13 7:28 PM, Karl Hammar wrote:
Ralf:
Here's the official announcement from Adobe -- they haven't dropped
Linux support as such, but they've certainly cut back on it:
http://blogs.adobe.com/flashplayer/2012/02/adobe-and-google-partnering-for-…
In short, Adobe has stopped releasing new versions of Flash as a plugin
for Firefox, etc. -- it will receive security fixes for the next five
years, but no new features. Adobe will continue to make new versions of
Flash available within Google Chrome, though.
Thans
Leigh
the reason that now relatively many people
don't want Flash Player
anymore is that it's not maintained for Linux anymore and even on other
platforms it's not available. In the past I used Adobe Flash Player on
Linux myself and I still use proprietary software with Linux.
...
Interesting, here in Sweden, the former state television company
is "broadcasting" tv over Internet. They are using flash and their
sister company (the one collectiong the tv-licence fees) wants every-
body with a computer and an internet connection to pay.
If one can show that flash is non-linux, perhaps linux users could
go free.
Do you have any proof that would hold at a court ?
10:55 a.m.
New subject: Flash Player - Was: Non Mixer Spatializer Demo
On Mon, 2013-07-08 at 11:28 +0200, Karl Hammar wrote:
Ralf:
That's another issue we had in Germany too. The issue now is solved in
Germany, everybody who has got a residence is forced to pay for
television, even if s/he won't and/or can't watch. Exceptions are rare,
e.g. some handicapped persons don't need to pay. Before the law was
changed they tried to get money from computer users too, but many
people, including me, successfully fight against this, so they didn't
get money from us.
I really don't watch scripted realty and all that high-class crap.
One assumption of the former administration was, that everybody does own
a mobile pone with media players. They didn't believe me, that I even
don't own a mobile phone without a media player.
The evidence you want to know, doesn't help you.
"NOTE: Adobe Flash Player 11.2 will be the last version to target Linux
as a supported platform. Adobe will continue to provide security
backports to Flash Player 11.2 for Linux." -
http://get.adobe.com/flashplayer/?promoid=JZEFT
"latest versions are 11.7.700.224 (Win), 11.7.700.225 (Mac) and
11.2.202.291 (Linux)" -
http://www.adobe.com/support/flashplayer/downloads.html
The day when Flash Player for Linux will be too outdated is near.
Regards,
Ralf
the reason that now relatively many people
don't want Flash Player
anymore is that it's not maintained for Linux anymore and even on other
platforms it's not available. In the past I used Adobe Flash Player on
Linux myself and I still use proprietary software with Linux.
...
Interesting, here in Sweden, the former state television company
is "broadcasting" tv over Internet. They are using flash and their
sister company (the one collectiong the tv-licence fees) wants every-
body with a computer and an internet connection to pay.
If one can show that flash is non-linux, perhaps linux users could
go free.
Do you have any proof that would hold at a court 
7 Jul
7 Jul
10:18 p.m.
Slightly OT:
I am usually very liberal when it comes to people's worldview and this is
sincere behavior, I really do respect other people's beliefs and ideals and
I do not need to make any special effort to politely leave my opinions to
myself.
However, sometimes I think it is helpful to point out certain things, so
that people at the very least are aware that an opposing opinion exists.
I'll be brief.
1. I think this is frustrating when you post a link to YouTube and someone
writes a long letter, explaining how they dislike proprietary Flash and how
it does not work on their system or on their browser.
Please, this is YouTube, one of the most used services in the world. If you
cannot watch it - get a plugin to download videos.
There is no need to tell us for the hundredth time that you cannot be
bothered to find a working technical solution to a problem that is simpler
than anything else going on in your command line. Seriously.
2. Adobe Flash is proprietary and we all know it. Period.
Thus, it is really not necessary to use every situation you can to push
your free software fundamentalism on other people. If I use Linux, it does
not mean that I agree with Richard Stallman on everything.
This is not specifically to Ralf, since I have read other people doing this
as well.
I apologize for going OT and would please ask to not take this personally
as this is not meant to be.
Sincerely,
Louigi Verona.
http://www.louigiverona.ru/
8 Jul
8 Jul
10:28 a.m.
On 8/07/13 8:00 AM, Ralf Mardorf wrote:
On Sun, 2013-07-07 at 14:50 -0700, J. Liles wrote:
Can't be played with Firefox 22.0. Google Chrome can play it, but IMO
the need for Adobe Flash Player should be dropped by videos done by the
Linux community.
Youtube usually does transcode videos to WebM format for playback on
Firefox, etc. using only free codecs. I can't say why Youtube hasn't
done that yet for this video; it could just be that it takes a while for
the WebM transcodes to happen, and not enough time has elapsed yet.
Perhaps within a few days the WebM version will be available and you'll
be able to watch the video in Firefox.
As far as major video sites go, Youtube is way ahead of the curve in its
support for free codecs -- there's no alternative video sharing that I
know of that offers such (relatively) comprehensive WebM support.
The alternative is for people posting videos to host them themselves,
but that's non-trivial, since you also have to also provide a h.264/AAC
version to have the video work on IE, Safari, and most mobile devices.
It'd be a shame if users of those platforms were unable to see some of
the cool things happening in the free software world.
So... it's not an easy problem to solve, and currently, there's not
really a better solution than Youtube.
Thanks
Leigh
8:55 p.m.
There are more free software-friendly alternatives to YT. I uploaded my
Ardour 3 MIDI tutorial to archive.org, for example:
http://archive.org/details/movies
On Mon, Jul 8, 2013 at 11:28 AM, Leigh Dyer <lsd(a)wootangent.net> wrote:
On 8/07/13 8:00 AM, Ralf Mardorf wrote:
On Sun, 2013-07-07 at 14:50 -0700, J. Liles
wrote:
Can't be played with Firefox 22.0. Google Chrome can play it, but IMO
the need for Adobe Flash Player should be dropped by videos done by the
Linux community.
Youtube usually does transcode videos to WebM format for playback on
Firefox, etc. using only free codecs. I can't say why Youtube hasn't done
that yet for this video; it could just be that it takes a while for the
WebM transcodes to happen, and not enough time has elapsed yet. Perhaps
within a few days the WebM version will be available and you'll be able to
watch the video in Firefox.
As far as major video sites go, Youtube is way ahead of the curve in its
support for free codecs -- there's no alternative video sharing that I know
of that offers such (relatively) comprehensive WebM support.
The alternative is for people posting videos to host them themselves, but
that's non-trivial, since you also have to also provide a h.264/AAC version
to have the video work on IE, Safari, and most mobile devices. It'd be a
shame if users of those platforms were unable to see some of the cool
things happening in the free software world.
So... it's not an easy problem to solve, and currently, there's not really
a better solution than Youtube.
Thanks
Leigh
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Linux-audio-user mailing list
Linux-audio-user@lists.**linuxaudio.org<Linux-audio-user@lists.linuxaudio.org>
http://lists.linuxaudio.org/**listinfo/linux-audio-user<http://lists.lin…
9:30 p.m.
On Mon, Jul 8, 2013 at 1:54 PM, Dan MacDonald <allcoms(a)gmail.com> wrote:
There are more free software-friendly alternatives to
YT. I uploaded my
Ardour 3 MIDI tutorial to archive.org, for example:
http://archive.org/details/movies
I'm aware of archive.org and would have preferred to use it (had I been
able to generate an ogg/theora movie) However, since I imagine
archive.orgis using the same tools that are available to me for
transcoding, then I
fail to see how they could transcode the output of this particular video
camera without the audio going out of sync--as I tried literally every
piece of free-software in myriad combinations on it. I suppose it's worth a
shot, but considering that it took me some 2 and a half hours to upload the
enormous mjpeg encoded video to youtube--I wasn't anxious to repeat the
process.
10:59 p.m.
I have used RecordItNow (under KXStudio) to create screencasts painlessly
recently. I then used KDEnlive to normalize the audio - done!
It works fine in RMD mode but I had issues (no sound nor stop) when using
its ffmpeg recording backend instead - natch.
On Mon, Jul 8, 2013 at 10:30 PM, J. Liles <malnourite(a)gmail.com> wrote:
On Mon, Jul 8, 2013 at 1:54 PM, Dan MacDonald <allcoms(a)gmail.com> wrote:
There are more free software-friendly
alternatives to YT. I uploaded my
Ardour 3 MIDI tutorial to archive.org, for example:
http://archive.org/details/movies
I'm aware of archive.org and would have preferred to use it (had I been
able to generate an ogg/theora movie) However, since I imagine archive.orgis using the
same tools that are available to me for transcoding, then I
fail to see how they could transcode the output of this particular video
camera without the audio going out of sync--as I tried literally every
piece of free-software in myriad combinations on it. I suppose it's worth a
shot, but considering that it took me some 2 and a half hours to upload the
enormous mjpeg encoded video to youtube--I wasn't anxious to repeat the
process.
11:18 p.m.
On 09/07/13 06:54, Dan MacDonald wrote:
There are more free software-friendly alternatives to
YT. I uploaded my
Ardour 3 MIDI tutorial to archive.org <http://archive.org>, for example:
http://archive.org/details/movies
Does archive.org automatically transcode videos to WebM and H.264/AAC
for playback across all platforms/devices? I've been trying to find
information about that on the website, but I haven't find it yet.
Thanks
Leigh
On Mon, Jul 8, 2013 at 11:28 AM, Leigh Dyer <lsd(a)wootangent.net
<mailto:lsd@wootangent.net>> wrote:
On 8/07/13 8:00 AM, Ralf Mardorf wrote:
On Sun, 2013-07-07 at 14:50 -0700, J. Liles wrote:
http://youtu.be/GVm5Jd1WDWw
Can't be played with Firefox 22.0. Google Chrome can play it,
but IMO
the need for Adobe Flash Player should be dropped by videos done
by the
Linux community.
Youtube usually does transcode videos to WebM format for playback on
Firefox, etc. using only free codecs. I can't say why Youtube hasn't
done that yet for this video; it could just be that it takes a while
for the WebM transcodes to happen, and not enough time has elapsed
yet. Perhaps within a few days the WebM version will be available
and you'll be able to watch the video in Firefox.
As far as major video sites go, Youtube is way ahead of the curve in
its support for free codecs -- there's no alternative video sharing
that I know of that offers such (relatively) comprehensive WebM support.
The alternative is for people posting videos to host them
themselves, but that's non-trivial, since you also have to also
provide a h.264/AAC version to have the video work on IE, Safari,
and most mobile devices. It'd be a shame if users of those platforms
were unable to see some of the cool things happening in the free
software world.
So... it's not an easy problem to solve, and currently, there's not
really a better solution than Youtube.
Thanks
Leigh
_________________________________________________
Linux-audio-user mailing list
Linux-audio-user(a)lists.__linuxaudio.org
<mailto:Linux-audio-user@lists.linuxaudio.org>
http://lists.linuxaudio.org/__listinfo/linux-audio-user
<http://lists.linuxaudio.org/listinfo/linux-audio-user>
9 Jul
9 Jul
6:15 a.m.
On Mon, 2013-07-08 at 20:28 +1000, Leigh Dyer wrote:
On 8/07/13 8:00 AM, Ralf Mardorf wrote:
And you're right. Now Firefox is able to play it too.
On Sun, 2013-07-07 at 14:50 -0700, J. Liles
wrote:
Can't be played with Firefox 22.0.
Youtube usually does transcode videos to WebM format for playback on
Firefox, etc. using only free codecs. I can't say why Youtube hasn't
done that yet for this video; it could just be that it takes a while for
the WebM transcodes to happen 
8 Jul
8 Jul
9:21 a.m.
looks great! waiting for being able to test those.
i realized that you set the maximum channel count per track to 16 in
non-mixer.
apart from being easily changed in the source, is there a reason to do that?
do you intend to support lv2 at some point?
thanks for the great work,
matthias
On 7/8/13 12:50 AM, J. Liles wrote:
As many of you already know, Non Mixer
(http://non.tuxfamily.org) has
since its inception provided some cushy features for dealing with
Ambisonics mixes.
Lately I've been working on extending these features to the next level.
This is a quick demonstration of the new Spatializer module and the
associated Spatialization Console. What this does is provide synthetic
distance cues as well as a cushy interface for placing sounds in
virtual space.
http://youtu.be/GVm5Jd1WDWw
I'm hoping to have these new features ready for testing soon--but my
free time is very limited.
As always, donations are welcome and very much appreciated.
(http://non.tuxfamily.org/wiki/Donations)
A note about the video:
Every time I try to make one of these screencasts, I run into the same
problem: nothing works. Thus, I had to aim my video camera at the
screen and record audio from my computer via line-out. This is
problematic for a number of reasons. 1) I can only record stereo this
way 2) my camera only samples audio at 32KHz and 3) When youtube
transcodes the video it adds an annoying click about once per second
(I believe this is due to a mismatch between the camera's framerate
and youtube's expectations. I would love to provide a theora/vorbis
screencapture video instead, but, alas, I cannot find any tools that
can capture screen activity and record audio via JACK in sync. Anyway,
the poor quality of the video is not due to a lack of effort.
_______________________________________________
Linux-audio-user mailing list
Linux-audio-user(a)lists.linuxaudio.org
http://lists.linuxaudio.org/listinfo/linux-audio-user
9 Jul
9 Jul
12:53 p.m.
Ignoring the flash non-flash conversation....
This is an impressive demo, I do like what I am seeing. Thanks!
Seablade
On Sun, Jul 7, 2013 at 5:50 PM, J. Liles <malnourite(a)gmail.com> wrote:
As many of you already know, Non Mixer
(http://non.tuxfamily.org) has
since its inception provided some cushy features for dealing with
Ambisonics mixes.
Lately I've been working on extending these features to the next level.
This is a quick demonstration of the new Spatializer module and the
associated Spatialization Console. What this does is provide synthetic
distance cues as well as a cushy interface for placing sounds in
virtual space.
http://youtu.be/GVm5Jd1WDWw
I'm hoping to have these new features ready for testing soon--but my
free time is very limited.
As always, donations are welcome and very much appreciated.
(http://non.tuxfamily.org/wiki/Donations)
A note about the video:
Every time I try to make one of these screencasts, I run into the same
problem: nothing works. Thus, I had to aim my video camera at the
screen and record audio from my computer via line-out. This is
problematic for a number of reasons. 1) I can only record stereo this
way 2) my camera only samples audio at 32KHz and 3) When youtube
transcodes the video it adds an annoying click about once per second
(I believe this is due to a mismatch between the camera's framerate
and youtube's expectations. I would love to provide a theora/vorbis
screencapture video instead, but, alas, I cannot find any tools that
can capture screen activity and record audio via JACK in sync. Anyway,
the poor quality of the video is not due to a lack of effort.
_______________________________________________
Linux-audio-user mailing list
Linux-audio-user(a)lists.linuxaudio.org
http://lists.linuxaudio.org/listinfo/linux-audio-user
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days inactive
3951
days old
linux-audio-user@lists.linuxaudio.org
22 comments
8 participants
participants (8)
-
Dan MacDonald -
J. Liles -
karl＠aspodata.se -
Leigh Dyer -
Louigi Verona -
Matthias Kronlachner -
Ralf Mardorf -
Thomas Vecchione