6 Oct
2006
6 Oct
'06
3:15 p.m.
Hi.
I'm becoming like a goat, as we say in French, when trying to
pilot a control path with a midi input in Om.
Let's say I take the osc provided in the CAPS suite, which has its
frequency available as a control parameter (in green). How can I control
this parameter with another thing, for example a MIDI input, as I can
find absolutely no module which has a frequency as a control (green)
output ? (there are the frequency modulators but again it raises the
problem to enter in this module a frequency, and find a frequency as
control signal at the ouput. None of the four frequency modulators seem to
permit this).
And if I want the (blue) output of a VCO to control another thing,
let's say the frequency, or depth, or whatever, of a LFO which has a
control (green) input, or the frequency of a filter, how can this be made
?
If I understand well what a synth is, I always believed that the
output of a module can be used either as an audio signal or a control
signal. What did I miss in Om ?
I have installed these plugins :
[I] media-plugins/caps-plugins (0.3.0-r1):
[I] media-plugins/fil-plugins (0.1.0):
[I] media-plugins/mcp-plugins (0.3.0):
[I] media-plugins/rev-plugins (0.3.1):
[I] media-plugins/swh-plugins (0.4.15):
[I] media-plugins/tap-plugins (0.7.0):
[I] media-plugins/vco-plugins (0.3.0):
[I] media-plugins/njl-plugins (0.2.1-r1):
[I] media-plugins/omins (0.2.0):
Thanks in advance for any help.
Best,
Y.
6 Oct
6 Oct
4:13 p.m.
On Fri, Oct 06, 2006 at 07:15:11PM +0200, Yves Potin wrote:
Hi.
I'm becoming like a goat, as we say in French, when trying to
pilot a control path with a midi input in Om.
Let's say I take the osc provided in the CAPS suite, which has its
frequency available as a control parameter (in green). How can I control
this parameter with another thing, for example a MIDI input, as I can
find absolutely no module which has a frequency as a control (green)
output ? (there are the frequency modulators but again it raises the
problem to enter in this module a frequency, and find a frequency as
control signal at the ouput. None of the four frequency modulators seem to
permit this).
And if I want the (blue) output of a VCO to control another thing,
let's say the frequency, or depth, or whatever, of a LFO which has a
control (green) input, or the frequency of a filter, how can this be made
?
You just have to use the right plugins. Control rates are good for static
parameters and you rarely will use them for something dynamic.
Use control rate frequency oscs only for fixed freq.
Use audio rate frequency oscs if you want to modulate it.
There's a control to audio rate plugin and there's some tracker plugin
for the other way (can't remember name and collection right now, sorry).
I hardly ever need them.
If I understand well what a synth is, I always
believed that the
output of a module can be used either as an audio signal or a control
signal. What did I miss in Om ?
That's classic modular synthesis, yes.
Audio rate is expensive, and that's why LADSPA has 2 rates and Om follows.
--
Thorsten Wilms
5:21 p.m.
Le 06 Oct à 20:13, Thorsten Wilms ecrivait:
You just have to use the right plugins. Control rates
are good for static
parameters and you rarely will use them for something dynamic.
Use control rate frequency oscs only for fixed freq.
Use audio rate frequency oscs if you want to modulate it.
There's a control to audio rate plugin and there's some tracker plugin
for the other way (can't remember name and collection right now, sorry).
I hardly ever need them.
Thanks for the answer, I'll take care of the advice.
But I've just found this :
http://atte.dk/om-wiki/AudioControlConversion which make me think that
what I try to do isn't completely weird, or maybe am I not alone :). The
plugin described in this page is exactly what I'm looking for, has it been
written as it's suggested ? Would anyone know what could be its name and in
what collection one could find it ?
All this is very curious, because for example various synths
emulations available in Bristol permit to do this immediately, the ARP
2600 especially. But I must have misunderstood the philosophy of Om about
that, I will take care of this.
Cheers,
Y.
7 Oct
7 Oct
6:22 a.m.
On Fri, 2006-10-06 at 21:21 +0200, Yves Potin wrote:
Le 06 Oct à 20:13, Thorsten Wilms ecrivait:
I wrote a trivial LADSPA plugin to do that a while ago. It's not
officially released, but I think I posted it on the old Om mailing lise.
--
Lars Luthman - please encrypt any email sent to me if possible
PGP key: http://pgp.mit.edu:11371/pks/lookup?op=get&search=0x04C77E2E
Fingerprint: FCA7 C790 19B9 322D EB7A E1B3 4371 4650 04C7 7E2E
You just have to use the right plugins. Control
rates are good for static
parameters and you rarely will use them for something dynamic.
Use control rate frequency oscs only for fixed freq.
Use audio rate frequency oscs if you want to modulate it.
There's a control to audio rate plugin and there's some tracker plugin
for the other way (can't remember name and collection right now, sorry).
I hardly ever need them.
Thanks for the answer, I'll take care of the advice.
But I've just found this :
http://atte.dk/om-wiki/AudioControlConversion which make me think that
what I try to do isn't completely weird, or maybe am I not alone :). The
plugin described in this page is exactly what I'm looking for, has it been
written as it's suggested ? Would anyone know what could be its name and in
what collection one could find it ?
9:45 a.m.
Le 07 Oct à 10:22, Lars Luthman ecrivait:
I wrote a trivial LADSPA plugin to do that a while
ago. It's not
officially released, but I think I posted it on the old Om mailing lise.
Thank you very much, that's exactly what I was searching for. I've
found your plugin there :
http://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/om-synth/2005-11/msg00032.html
The result is here :
http://www.jazzcomputer.org/om.jpg
http://www.jazzcomputer.org/noise.om
As, without your plugin, I've spent much more than three or four
hours to do what I wanted without success, and found the solution in 5
minutes with it, I'd be very curious and interested to know how this can
be achieved in the « traditional » way in Om, i.e. controlling in time the
evolution of a filter with an envelope, which seems a somewhat common
use of a synth to me :).
Thanks again,
Y.
10:13 a.m.
On Sat, 2006-10-07 at 13:44 +0200, Yves Potin wrote:
Le 07 Oct à 10:22, Lars Luthman ecrivait:
In the particular case that you show in your screenshot, wouldn't you
get the same result (or better, since you don't do any downsampling) if
you set "Resonance (CR)" to 0, "Resonance gain" to 1, and connect the
amp_mono_0 output directly to the "Resonance (AR)" port on the filter?
--
Lars Luthman - please encrypt any email sent to me if possible
PGP key: http://pgp.mit.edu:11371/pks/lookup?op=get&search=0x04C77E2E
Fingerprint: FCA7 C790 19B9 322D EB7A E1B3 4371 4650 04C7 7E2E
I wrote a trivial LADSPA plugin to do that a
while ago. It's not
officially released, but I think I posted it on the old Om mailing lise.
Thank you very much, that's exactly what I was searching for. I've
found your plugin there :
http://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/om-synth/2005-11/msg00032.html
The result is here :
http://www.jazzcomputer.org/om.jpg
http://www.jazzcomputer.org/noise.om
As, without your plugin, I've spent much more than three or four
hours to do what I wanted without success, and found the solution in 5
minutes with it, I'd be very curious and interested to know how this can
be achieved in the « traditional » way in Om, i.e. controlling in time the
evolution of a filter with an envelope, which seems a somewhat common
use of a synth to me :).
3:40 p.m.
Le 07 Oct à 14:12, Lars Luthman ecrivait:
In the particular case that you show in your
screenshot, wouldn't you
get the same result (or better, since you don't do any downsampling) if
you set "Resonance (CR)" to 0, "Resonance gain" to 1, and connect
the
amp_mono_0 output directly to the "Resonance (AR)" port on the filter?
In this particular case indeed, yes :). I've missed to set
Resonance (CR) to 0, as it was the parameter I was trying to modulate,
thanks.
Y.
10:13 a.m.
On Sat, Oct 07, 2006 at 01:44:48PM +0200, Yves Potin wrote:
Thank you very much, that's exactly what I was searching for. I've
found your plugin there :
http://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/om-synth/2005-11/msg00032.html
The result is here :
http://www.jazzcomputer.org/om.jpg
http://www.jazzcomputer.org/noise.om
As, without your plugin, I've spent much more than three or four
hours to do what I wanted without success, and found the solution in 5
minutes with it, I'd be very curious and interested to know how this can
be achieved in the « traditional » way in Om, i.e. controlling in time the
evolution of a filter with an envelope, which seems a somewhat common
use of a synth to me :).
Ehm, just put Resonance (CR) to 0 and use Resonance (AR)?
Lars was so nice to check this works out, even :)
Otherwise use the 4 Pole Low-Pass Filter with Resonance (FARAIA).
I would guess that you can get away with dynamic CR on resonance
if the envelope isn't very fast / the change not that drastic.
Otherwise artefacts can be expected.
It would be great if the rate of ports could be switched, but
LADSPA doesn't allow for this and LV2 might only with an
extension.
--
Thorsten Wilms
18 Oct
18 Oct
9:27 p.m.
On Sat, 2006-10-07 at 14:12 +0200, Thorsten Wilms wrote:
On Sat, Oct 07, 2006 at 01:44:48PM +0200, Yves Potin
wrote:
Well, eliminating control ports (however much I would like to do so)
isn't realistic, however the LV2 spec does explicitly state that the
LADSPA phenomenon of "audio rate control ports" (eg CV) that break most
anything /except/ modulars (e.g. Ardour, Jack Rack) are NOT comformant.
In less confusing wording: audio ports MUST be.. audio!
So, these kind of ports will need to use a CV port extension, which
could (noone's written one yet) allow for both control or audio rate use
of the same port. This means all hosts will be able to use these
plugins and actually know what the (rough) purpose of the ports are.
Not ideal for a modular since those plugins with CR ports will still
exist, but a decent compromise, and surely a LOT better than the current
random situation that results in plugins that just mysteriously don't
work in certain hosts anyway.
It's a half solution to an only somewhat related problem, but at least
it's sane in LV2 instead of the complete mess of LADSPA in this dept.
At the end of the day the only solution to the old audio rate vs control
rate problem is writing more plugins.
-DR-
Thank you very much, that's exactly what I was searching for. I've
found your plugin there :
http://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/om-synth/2005-11/msg00032.html
The result is here :
http://www.jazzcomputer.org/om.jpg
http://www.jazzcomputer.org/noise.om
As, without your plugin, I've spent much more than three or four
hours to do what I wanted without success, and found the solution in 5
minutes with it, I'd be very curious and interested to know how this can
be achieved in the « traditional » way in Om, i.e. controlling in time the
evolution of a filter with an envelope, which seems a somewhat common
use of a synth to me :).
Ehm, just put Resonance (CR) to 0 and use Resonance (AR)?
Lars was so nice to check this works out, even :)
Otherwise use the 4 Pole Low-Pass Filter with Resonance (FARAIA).
I would guess that you can get away with dynamic CR on resonance
if the envelope isn't very fast / the change not that drastic.
Otherwise artefacts can be expected.
It would be great if the rate of ports could be switched, but
LADSPA doesn't allow for this and LV2 might only with an
extension.
6426
days inactive
6438
days old
linux-audio-user@lists.linuxaudio.org
8 comments
4 participants
participants (4)
-
Dave Robillard -
Lars Luthman -
Thorsten Wilms -
yves＠jazzcomputer.org