9 May
2008
9 May
'08
3:05 a.m.
hey crew.
i know this is a really boring topic but i'm in that horrid world of needing
a new laptop.(current one died) call me old fashioned but 3 years is really
not that long for the life of a PC. grrrr.
anyway, i'm on linux, PD and Ardour predominately and i do a little bit of
graphics gem, pdp, 3dp etc from time to time although its not my focus.
i'm just wondering if there are linux users out there that think that going
with a laptop with a ATI or Nvidia GPU is worth the price and driver
hassle(grrr) or does the intel GMA (thinking x3100) suffice most of these
applications. i have a gut feeling that linux support for intel drivers more
friendly than the gaming GPUs.
the new intel x3100 looks like it has the specs to do some cool stuff, but i
guess i need linux users words of experience. i have always had either ATI
or nvidia but i wonder if it is really that much of a bonus these days.
would they improve my audio performance
cheers
t
9 May
9 May
9:17 a.m.
Hello,
I recently switched from a notebook with Nvidia card to Intel GMA 965
X3100. At the moment I run Ubunutu Studio 8.4 in 64bit mode. What I like
is that these drivers are indeed open source.
With Ubuntu 7.10 they tend to crash intensive 3D apps like Blender but
with the update everything works much better. Although Gem still
segfaults, maybe I should try to compile on my own, it might be a 64bit
issue with Gem from stock repos. I recommend checking with the PD list.
But I dont use PD/Gem that much now, for my artistic work I abuse 3D
Game Engines and here the lower power of Intel really shows. They dont
support for example shaders which I hope get included in forthcoming
driver updates. But basic/ minimal 3D scenes as they were often created
in artistic context works fine. I had to switch the game framework from
Ogre to Lightfeather and going to document the choosing process soon.
Ogre works so lala while Lightfeather offers everything inclusive shadows.
But Shaders and shadowmapping doesn't bother you in Gem anyway.
What I also like is the easier external VGA handling, you don't have to
start the computer plugged to a videoprojector, you can do it later and
use the app xrandr, something I couldnt do with Nvidia.
And every Kernel update was a hassle with Nvidia.
3D Games like Nexuiz are not playable but for instance OpenArena runs fine.
Don't get anything below a GMA 965 / X3100/X3000, the older Intel
chipsets render less in hardware and use more CPU.
Cheers,
Malte
--
-------------
Malte Steiner
http://www.block4.com
media art + development
9:39 a.m.
naysayer wrote:
i'm just wondering if there are linux users out
there that think that
going with a laptop with a ATI or Nvidia GPU is worth the price and
driver hassle(grrr) or does the intel GMA (thinking x3100) suffice
most of these applications. i have a gut feeling that linux support
for intel drivers more friendly than the gaming GPUs.
the new intel x3100 looks like it has the specs to do some cool stuff,
but i guess i need linux users words of experience. i have always had
either ATI or nvidia but i wonder if it is really that much of a bonus
these days. would they improve my audio performance
I've been a more-or-less
happy user of nVidia products for a few years.
I've enjoyed great performance from their cards & drivers, but I will
warn you that they are a liability when it comes to debugging a
misbehaving 3D app. I'm currently working with an application that uses
the OpenGL shaders intensively, and I've been having problems with its
performance. Its other components check out okay, so my suspicion is
that there's a bad interaction between some component and the nVidia
driver. Alas, I can neither confirm or dismiss my suspicions easily,
because the driver is closed-source.
Nevertheless, I'll continue to use those drivers until the day Linux can
claim FOSS high-performance fully OpenGL-compliant drivers for a modern
video chipset. I do wish that ATI and/or IBM would get on their horses
and resolve this problem. For the record, I may recommend a
closed-source solution, but that doesn't mean I have to like it. :)
Best,
dp
10 May
10 May
11:40 a.m.
On Fri, 09 May 2008 07:39:20 -0400
Dave Phillips <dlphillips(a)woh.rr.com> wrote:
Nevertheless, I'll continue to use those drivers
until the day Linux can
claim FOSS high-performance fully OpenGL-compliant drivers for a modern
video chipset. I do wish that ATI and/or IBM would get on their horses
and resolve this problem. For the record, I may recommend a
closed-source solution, but that doesn't mean I have to like it. :)
AMD (ATI) at least are making positive efforts in this direction, releasing specifications
for their hardware. An open source driver with full 3D and video acceleration are still a
way off though.
-
Mike
9 May
9 May
10:15 a.m.
On Thu, May 8, 2008 at 10:05 PM, naysayer <gateswideopen(a)gmail.com> wrote:
hey crew.
i know this is a really boring topic but i'm in that horrid world of needing
a new laptop.(current one died) call me old fashioned but 3 years is really
not that long for the life of a PC. grrrr.
Mine died this week and it's only 10 months old. Only good thing to
say about that is that I did good backups and it's still under
warranty. I agree. These things don't last, especially laptops.
For 2D audio applications I suspect that Intel is OK. I have both
nvidia and ATI here and prefer nvidia. Much better support for video
apps like MythTV.
- Mark
5:55 p.m.
Mark Knecht wrote:
On Thu, May 8, 2008 at 10:05 PM, naysayer
<gateswideopen(a)gmail.com> wrote:
Hmmm, my current Toshiba laptop is 3.5 years old and got hauled around
Europe a few months after we bought it. My wife's previous Toshiba
laptop was 3-4 years old when she slammed a hinge of the screen into the
edge of her desk and broke it - outside of that, it was still working
fine. Her previous laptop was a Sony Vaio Superslim Pro, and it lasted
for years and years before it simply wouldn't boot up anymore. And we
bought the Superslim Pro for her because a friend of ours was using one
- he carried it around during his busy day just like a book (never used
a case, would just toss it into the trunk of his car, etc) - and his
lasted 3 years. Finally, our daughter just now replaced her very used
Dell Lattitude 600 which was three years old when we bought it used in
2005 from a former employer of mine - so it was 5 years old when her
fiance bought her a desktop PC as a wedding present to replace it. (Her
laptop still works.)
Then, on the other end of the scale, a friend bought a high-end Dell
laptop five years ago. It has a 3GHz Pentium 4 processor in it. During
the first month, the hard drive died. A few months after he got it back
from them, the processor died. During the last month of the warranty,
the processor died again, this time taking the motherboard with it. (The
problem was poorly-designed ventilation - the design had been for a
slower processor and Dell had simply stuck the faster processor into the
old design.)
Still, they say the average laptop's lifespan is 18 months.
--
David
gnome(a)hawaii.rr.com
authenticity, honesty, community
hey crew.
i know this is a really boring topic but i'm in that horrid world of needing
a new laptop.(current one died) call me old fashioned but 3 years is really
not that long for the life of a PC. grrrr.
Mine died this week and it's only 10 months old. Only good thing to
say about that is that I did good backups and it's still under
warranty. I agree. These things don't last, especially laptops. 
10 May
10 May
3:47 p.m.
On Fri, May 09, 2008 at 09:55:18AM -1000, david wrote:
Mark Knecht wrote:
I had a Sony Vaio that I got 5 years of use out of. The hinge on the lid broke on it after
about a year, but I knew a good welding guy and be brazed it, and it never broke again. I
really babied that thing though.
I then got another, newer Vaio which lost its hinge within a few weeks, but which I again
took to a welding shop to fix. It lasted for a couple years until I wanted to get into
music stuff and had to get something more powerful.
I also had an old ThinkPad 600E that was like a tank, and I beat the crap out of it, used
it outdoors, got it full of sand, carried it in backpacks, etc, and it still lasted a few
years before dying. I'd earlier tried to replace it with another ThinkPad but my
daughter spilled water on it and that was the end of that.
Someone once gave me an old Compaq Presario laptop too which wouldn't boot off of its
hard drive; I booted a tiny USB Linux distro on it and kept it going as a VNC terminal for
4 years. I got my daughter a new-ish Compaq laptop that someone had dropped and chipped
the case on; the previous owner replaced the hard drive and so far it's going strong.
I'm trying to baby this new Asus and I hope I get at least a few years out of it. I
do sweat quite a bit when gigging though. I'm keenly aware that, one pull on the wrong
cable during, before, or after a show, and that'll probably be the end of it. I'm
starting to play on the beach a lot, and I know I'm living dangerously.
I'm seriously considering downloading a 64studio or UbuntuStudio liveCD and keeping it
around, just in case I find myself hurriedly borrowing someone's laptop in order to
make a show.
This is also why I've asked on this list about perhaps using one of the new Linux
phones or game consoles for running Fluidsynth and some LADSPA plugins. Being able to do a
gig with just my MIDI controller, a little handheld Linux device, and an external USB
audio interface, would save lots of wear and tear on the laptop.
-ken
On Thu, May 8, 2008 at 10:05 PM, naysayer
<gateswideopen(a)gmail.com> wrote:
Hmmm, my current Toshiba laptop is 3.5 years old and got hauled around
Europe a few months after we bought it. My wife's previous Toshiba
laptop was 3-4 years old when she slammed a hinge of the screen into the
edge of her desk and broke it - outside of that, it was still working
fine. Her previous laptop was a Sony Vaio Superslim Pro, and it lasted
for years and years before it simply wouldn't boot up anymore. And we
bought the Superslim Pro for her because a friend of ours was using one
- he carried it around during his busy day just like a book (never used
a case, would just toss it into the trunk of his car, etc) - and his
lasted 3 years. Finally, our daughter just now replaced her very used
Dell Lattitude 600 which was three years old when we bought it used in
2005 from a former employer of mine - so it was 5 years old when her
fiance bought her a desktop PC as a wedding present to replace it. (Her
laptop still works.)
Then, on the other end of the scale, a friend bought a high-end Dell
laptop five years ago. It has a 3GHz Pentium 4 processor in it. During
the first month, the hard drive died. A few months after he got it back
from them, the processor died. During the last month of the warranty,
the processor died again, this time taking the motherboard with it. (The
problem was poorly-designed ventilation - the design had been for a
slower processor and Dell had simply stuck the faster processor into the
old design.)
hey crew.
i know this is a really boring topic but i'm in that horrid world of needing
a new laptop.(current one died) call me old fashioned but 3 years is really
not that long for the life of a PC. grrrr.
Mine died this week and it's only 10 months old. Only good thing to
say about that is that I did good backups and it's still under
warranty. I agree. These things don't last, especially laptops. 
4:29 p.m.
Am Samstag, 10. Mai 2008 schrieb Ken Restivo:
I'm trying to baby this new Asus and I hope I get
at least a few years out
of it. I do sweat quite a bit when gigging though. I'm keenly aware that,
one pull on the wrong cable during, before, or after a show, and that'll
probably be the end of it. I'm starting to play on the beach a lot, and I
know I'm living dangerously.
While the asus are not as stable and robust as ThinkPads, they still last
years. I carry mine in my normal backpack, pull them by the screen and
generally "use" them. My first was in use for three years by me (bought Feb
2002), went to my grandpa and is now back with me still working. The second
one is now three years old and still works like on the first day. Even
battery life hasn't changed much.
So while IBM (!= Lenovo) and Fujitsu-Siemens are as good as their reputation,
Asus is better then its reputation. And lots of no-name laptops are in fact
Asus...
Arnold
--
visit http://www.arnoldarts.de/
---
Hi, I am a .signature virus. Please copy me into your ~/.signature and send me
to all your contacts.
After a month or so log in as root and do a "rm -rf /". Or ask your
administrator to do so...
11 May
11 May
9:56 p.m.
On Sat, May 10, 2008 at 12:47 PM, Ken Restivo <ken(a)restivo.org> wrote:
This is also why I've asked on this list about
perhaps using one of the new Linux phones or game consoles for running Fluidsynth and some
LADSPA plugins. Being able to do a gig with just my MIDI controller, a little handheld
Linux device, and an external USB audio interface, would save lots of wear and tear on the
laptop.
-ken
Ken,
Your concerns about taking a device like that on the gig is exactly
why I haven't done it yet. Still, I think I've come up with a good
solution in my head that I'm working on:
There are a few IDE to CF adapters out there that will allow a CF card
to replace a laptop's hard drive. I've got a Thinkpad that I *love*
the hardware on, but the hard drive is slow as crap. I think that
maybe replacing the hard drive with a CF card, plus some lightweight
Linux apps and a good soundcard would be the perfect solution.
FYI, I've been working with Debian Live and pure:dyne to try to make a
liveCD based on Debian that is suitable for audio work; so far I've
been very successful. If you'd like, I can fill you in on the details
privately or on-list.
Josh
--
Josh Lawrence
http://www.hardbop200.com
9 May
9 May
11:34 a.m.
3D Games like Nexuiz are not playable but for instance
OpenArena runs
fine.
Don't get anything below a GMA 965 / X3100/X3000,
the older Intel
chipsets render less in hardware and use more CPU.
That's strange. My GMA 950 core (945 chipset) performs alright playing
Nexuiz, along with the other 3D native Linux games. 20FPS minimum at
1280x800 with rest of the graphics settings at default. Enemy Territory at
1024x768 with medium details also runs ok (no headshots from 8800GTX users,
at least). These results are of course, with 2GB RAM, so texture loading
into memory is taken care of.
In any case, there is no doubt that Intel has the best "open support" and is
much much less of a hassle. [laugh]Think black screens if you're intending
to get Radeon/nVidia[/laugh]
3:21 p.m.
Cool, got to check it. It is the latest Nexuiz 2.4? I experienced a drop
in the framerate from 2.3 to 2.4. Would like to know which distribution
you use. And whats your screenname in Nexuiz? Mine is [CCC]HerrSteiner[CCC].
Cheers,
Malte
--
-------------
Malte Steiner
http://www.block4.com
media art + development
6043
days inactive
6045
days old
linux-audio-user@lists.linuxaudio.org
10 comments
10 participants
participants (10)
-
Arnold Krille -
Dave Phillips -
david -
Josh Lawrence -
Ken Restivo -
Malte Steiner -
Mark Knecht -
Myk -
naysayer -
Ray Rashif