3 Jun
2003
3 Jun
'03
4:44 a.m.
<<< You were right about the number of faders with the Delta 1010 - I
<<< checked in the studio, and I only see HW In 1-8, PCM Out 1-8 and
the
<<< two S/PDIF faders. Two rows would do, or maybe three if you put the
<<< S/PDIF faders in line with channels 1 and 2. Then you could specify
<<< how many rows and how many channels you wanted...
Many thanks to Ross for his excellent work here. On the topic of space
and functions on the envy24control panel, I had some questions and
ideas. I appologize for the length!
First on space, could you not cut the number of graphical channel pairs
in half? In other words, why are there "stereo" linked fader pairs for
each individual mono PCM 1-10? I noticed that on the Mac/PC version of
the delta mixer...
http://www.midiman.net/products/m-audio/images/delta-pane3.jpg
...these actually represent stereo pairs. 1 is the left channel of the
first pair (PCM 1), 2 the right (PCM 2), etc. Channels can then be
paired/unpaired as desired ("stereo linked").
This setup saves alot of real-estate meaning only 5 pairs on the panel
for outputs and 5 for inputs even on the 1010 (though it does mean a
split vu meter for each). The first 4 are analog PCM pairs, the last
two are the stereo pair for SPDIF.
Outputs:
| 1 | 2 | 3 | 4 | 5 |
PCM 1/2 PCM 3/4 PCM 5/6 PCM 7/8 SPDIF L/R (9/10)
...likewise for Inputs.
As it stands now, not only is there duplication, but it is also
impossible to link stereo-pair levels on the panel.
As to the additional hardware output control, this is absolutely
necessary when, as in my case, the analog outputs go directly to
powered monitors. Without them, levels must be controlled by exterenal
harware. But couldn't this functionality be built into to the PCM
out's already there?
Right now on my Delta 1010 (ALSA 0.93 in PlanetCCRMA) these PCM-out
faders/mutes do nothing to the signal level at all unless I route it
somewhere internally, like to the "Digital Mix". Shouldn't these
faders control the hardware-out level when routed directly from PCM
Outs in the Patchbay (as they all are by default on my machine)?
Thanks again for everything. Your work is much appreciated.
Very best,
Kevin
=====
"I should prefer this note not be read or, if skimmed, that it should be
forgotten." - Mallarme
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3 Jun
3 Jun
7:13 a.m.
First on space, could you not cut the number of
graphical channel
pairs in half? In other words, why are there "stereo" linked fader
pairs for each individual mono PCM 1-10?
I assumed this was because you could pan a mono track in the master
stereo out, as you can in Audacity, or on a real mixing desk. I
haven't actually tested this theory though...
It might be simpler to represent this as one vertical fader for level
and one horizontal fader for pan. Currently, it's a bit like the old
DJ mixers before crossfaders were invented - harder to get the level
consistent.
This setup saves alot of real-estate meaning only 5
pairs on the
panel for outputs and 5 for inputs even on the 1010 (though it does
mean a split vu meter for each).
I actually like the visuals on envy24control - the VU meters are bold,
and easy to read even when you're standing on the other side of the
studio. In the Mac version, there's still a lot of horizontal
scrolling to do, and input channels don't line up with outputs - no
reason why we have to copy other platforms.
I suspect the original M Audio mixer was designed this way because
Mac/Windows didn't (doesn't?) have switchable virtual desktops. In
something like Reason, you are forever shrinking and resizing windows
or scrolling, and screen real estate is very scarce.
Shouldn't
these faders control the hardware-out level when routed directly
from PCM Outs in the Patchbay
That would make sense - but then envy24control still has a relatively
low version number, so maybe this just wasn't implemented yet.
Cheers
Daniel
1:36 p.m.
On Mon, Jun 02, 2003 at 11:33:03PM -0700, kevin ernste wrote:
First on space, could you not cut the number of
graphical channel pairs
in half? In other words, why are there "stereo" linked fader pairs for
each individual mono PCM 1-10?
I've actually been wondering this myself. Like you comment, the M-Audio
mixer presents linked channels as stereo pairs, so the setup makes
sense.
As it stands now, not only is there duplication, but
it is also
impossible to link stereo-pair levels on the panel.
Yes, I've been mulling around the idea of making channels have mono
volume sliders and making options to link them up. However, I haven't
used GTK+ since the 1.0 days, so I've got a bit of relearning to do -
everything up to know I've been able to do without any GTK+ knowledge.
Right now on my Delta 1010 (ALSA 0.93 in PlanetCCRMA)
these PCM-out
faders/mutes do nothing to the signal level at all unless I route it
somewhere internally, like to the "Digital Mix". Shouldn't these
faders control the hardware-out level when routed directly from PCM
Outs in the Patchbay (as they all are by default on my machine)?
You sound like you're confused about the different volume sliders, just
as I was ::-)
The PCM Out sliders control the levels on the card's hardware mixer.
Like you said, you only hear these changes if you route Digital Mix to
the hardware outs.
However, the hardware outs have volume control in the Analog Volume tab.
You want the DAC 0-n sliders to control the hardware levels, regardless
of what you've routed there.
Thanks again for everything. Your work is much
appreciated.
Thanks - glad someone else is getting use out of it.
--
Ross Vandegrift
ross(a)willow.seitz.com
A Pope has a Water Cannon. It is a Water Cannon.
He fires Holy-Water from it. It is a Holy-Water Cannon.
He Blesses it. It is a Holy Holy-Water Cannon.
He Blesses the Hell out of it. It is a Wholly Holy Holy-Water Cannon.
He has it pierced. It is a Holey Wholly Holy Holy-Water Cannon.
He makes it official. It is a Canon Holey Wholly Holy Holy-Water Cannon.
Batman and Robin arrive. He shoots them.
5:19 p.m.
No Analog Volume tab here either. Boy, I'd love it if it were there.
Right now I'm going out to an old submixer before the speakers. It
feels rather pointless having 114db coming out of the 1010 and then
sending it though a noisy old Mackie ;->
Kevin
--- Daniel James <daniel(a)mondodesigno.com> wrote:
=====
"I should prefer this note not be read or, if skimmed, that it should be
forgotten." - Mallarme
__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Calendar - Free online calendar with sync to Outlook(TM).
http://calendar.yahoo.com
the hardware
outs have volume control in the Analog Volume tab.
I don't think I've seen that tab yet when using our Delta 1010. I'll
have a look - I've been proved wrong before...
Cheers
Daniel
1:29 p.m.
On Wed, Jun 04, 2003 at 08:58:51AM +0100, Daniel James wrote:
I checked, and it doesn't appear on the Delta
1010. Maybe the
interface is specific to your card, Ross.
Whoa, that's very bizarre. I have a Delta 44 - so I'd assume anything
I get, you should. What version of envy24control are you using?
--
Ross Vandegrift
ross(a)willow.seitz.com
A Pope has a Water Cannon. It is a Water Cannon.
He fires Holy-Water from it. It is a Holy-Water Cannon.
He Blesses it. It is a Holy Holy-Water Cannon.
He Blesses the Hell out of it. It is a Wholly Holy Holy-Water Cannon.
He has it pierced. It is a Holey Wholly Holy Holy-Water Cannon.
He makes it official. It is a Canon Holey Wholly Holy Holy-Water Cannon.
Batman and Robin arrive. He shoots them.
3:05 p.m.
I checked, and
it doesn't appear on the Delta 1010. Maybe the
interface is specific to your card, Ross.
Whoa, that's very bizarre. I have a Delta 44 - so I'd assume
anything I get, you should. What version of envy24control are you
using?
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participants (3)
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Daniel James -
kevin ernste -
Ross Vandegrift