16 Mar
2003
16 Mar
'03
9:26 p.m.
Hi all,
I've been messing with Csound recently in order to see whether csound can be used well
in real-time settings. The problem is that I tried icsound and the other csound (forget
the source) and neither were able to output anything in real-time.
I've used -o devaudio flag, also -W (for wave) output, and while my scorefile finished
without any errors, I got no sound out.
If I try to do <csound call> > /dev/dsp I get garbage sound since the header is
all screwed up by the verbose output of the csound process.
I am using latest ALSA and I compiled csound from scratch and still no luck.
So, I was wondering if anyone had any luck running it in real-time.
P.S. I've been also having a terrible time trying to compile externals in the icsound
(i.e. OSCext and others). I get a huge number of errors and am not sure where the problems
is stemming from.
Any help is greatly appreciated!
Ico
16 Mar
16 Mar
10:01 p.m.
New subject: [linux-audio-user] Anyone able to run Csound in Linux in real-time?
If you really want to run iCsound please report specific information
about the problems (core dumps, make file logs or whatever).
Have a look at Istvan's version. I don't know what is the status of it
but I've been told it is just fine.
I'm not working on iCsound and I don't know when/if I'll get back on
that but I have reports of people using it.
Maurizio Umberto Puxeddu.
On Mon, 2003-03-17 at 03:17, ico(a)fuse.net wrote:
Hi all,
I've been messing with Csound recently in order to see whether csound can be used
well in real-time settings. The problem is that I tried icsound and the other csound
(forget the source) and neither were able to output anything in real-time.
I've used -o devaudio flag, also -W (for wave) output, and while my scorefile
finished without any errors, I got no sound out.
If I try to do <csound call> > /dev/dsp I get garbage sound since the header is
all screwed up by the verbose output of the csound process.
I am using latest ALSA and I compiled csound from scratch and still no luck.
So, I was wondering if anyone had any luck running it in real-time.
P.S. I've been also having a terrible time trying to compile externals in the icsound
(i.e. OSCext and others). I get a huge number of errors and am not sure where the problems
is stemming from.
Any help is greatly appreciated!
Ico
17 Mar
17 Mar
2:25 p.m.
On Monday 17 March 2003 04:17, ico(a)fuse.net wrote:
Hi all,
I've been messing with Csound recently in order to see whether csound can
be used well in real-time settings. The problem is that I tried icsound and
the other csound (forget the source) and neither were able to output
anything in real-time.
Mine works realtime with --ossout=/dev/dsp
It's the unofficial version that is no longer maintained.
You can still get it from
ftp://mustec.bgsu.edu/pub/linux/csound-linux-4.16.tar.gz
--
Jaakko Prättälä
Jaakko.Prattala(a)Helsinki.FI
18 Mar
18 Mar
6:07 a.m.
On Mon, 17 Mar 2003 21:17:29 +0200
Jaakko PrДttДlД <Jaakko.Prattala(a)helsinki.fi> wrote:
On Monday 17 March 2003 04:17, ico(a)fuse.net wrote:
BTW, what is the license of Csound? Can it be legally included in
GNU/*/Linux distributions? I' ve read its text, but it doesn't seem
to enlighten me... ;-(
--
Alexandre Prokoudine
ALT Linux Documentation Team
JID: avp(a)altlinux.org
Hi all,
I've been messing with Csound recently in order to see whether
csound can be used well in real-time settings. The problem is
that I tried icsound and the other csound (forget the source)
and neither were able to output anything in real-time.
Mine works realtime with --ossout=/dev/dsp
It's the unofficial version that is no longer maintained.
You can still get it from
ftp://mustec.bgsu.edu/pub/linux/csound-linux-4.16.tar.gz 
9:08 a.m.
Hallo,
Alexandre Prokoudine hat gesagt: // Alexandre Prokoudine wrote:
BTW, what is the license of Csound? Can it be legally
included in
GNU/*/Linux distributions? I' ve read its text, but it doesn't seem
to enlighten me... ;-(
It cannot be legally included. The license of Csound is non-free in
the Debian/Open Source (tm) sense, because it prohibits distribution
if it's not for "educational purposes". As distributions are either
commercial (Redhat, Suse,...) or require free licenses (Debian) they
cannot legally include Csound.
You can use iCsound, though, which is like Csound stripped of the
freedom-offending parts.
ciao
--
Frank Barknecht _ ______footils.org__
9:24 a.m.
Frank Barknecht wrote:
Alexandre Prokoudine hat gesagt: // Alexandre
Prokoudine wrote:
Here's the license in its entirety:
Copyright 1986, 1992 by the Massachusetts Institute of Technology. All
rights reserved.
Developed by Barry L. Vercoe at the Experimental Music Studio, Media
Laboratory, M.I.T., Cambridge, Massachusetts, with partial support from
the System Development Foundation and from National Science Foundation
Grant # IRI-8704665.
Permission to use, copy, or modify these programs and their
documentation for educational and research purposes only and without fee
is hereby granted, provided that this copyright and permission notice
appear on all copies and supporting documentation. For any other
uses of this software, in original or modified form, including but not
limited to distribution in whole or in part, specific prior
permission from M.I.T. must be obtained. M.I.T. makes no
representations about the suitability of this software for any purpose.
It is
provided "as is" without express or implied warranty.
Frank, as you can see, this license prohibits *any* redistribution
unless specifically contracted via MIT. The MIT Techology Licensing
department has been notoriously inaccessible, leaving stranded anyone
wanting to distribute Csound even legally. It's a very poor license in
today's world of free software.
However, Rick Boulanger recently met with Barry Vercoe to ask
specifically about a change in the license. Apparently Barry is
sympathetic but he may not have the real power to change it, i.e., it
might be more MIT's decision than his (as you can see above, Barry does
not hold the copyright, it belongs to MIT). At any rate, Rick spoke with
Barry a few weeks ago and nothing of substance has been reported yet.
Rick is a good fellow, I know he wants to help resolve this rather
important issue, but don't hold your breath waiting for a change.
== Dave Phillips
The Book Of Linux Music & Sound at http://www.nostarch.com/lms.htm
The Linux Soundapps Site at http://linux-sound.org
BTW, what is the license of Csound? Can it be
legally included in
GNU/*/Linux distributions? I' ve read its text, but it doesn't seem
to enlighten me... ;-(
It cannot be legally included. The license of Csound is non-free in
the Debian/Open Source (tm) sense, because it prohibits distribution
if it's not for "educational purposes". As distributions are either
commercial (Redhat, Suse,...) or require free licenses (Debian) they
cannot legally include Csound.
9:50 a.m.
Hallo,
Dave Phillips hat gesagt: // Dave Phillips wrote:
Frank, as you can see, this license prohibits *any*
redistribution
unless specifically contracted via MIT.
I didn't understand it this way, but it seems to be even worse than I
thought...
However, Rick Boulanger recently met with Barry Vercoe
to ask
specifically about a change in the license. Apparently Barry is
sympathetic but he may not have the real power to change it, i.e., it
might be more MIT's decision than his (as you can see above, Barry does
not hold the copyright, it belongs to MIT). At any rate, Rick spoke with
Barry a few weeks ago and nothing of substance has been reported yet.
Rick is a good fellow, I know he wants to help resolve this rather
important issue, but don't hold your breath waiting for a change.
Yes, this license discussion is so old but it is also so sad. MIT
could make available a good software, but they need to face the fact,
that it is several *decades* old. I see no way they could make any
money from such an "old-fashioned" software, and also Csound is *only*
still useful today because of the work, non-MIT people like j. ffitch
are doing for it.
So MIT isn't just holding back a piece of software they own, but a
whole community, that they don't own, but they behave like the did.
There lies the real tragic of the whole affair and that is the point,
why every 6 months or so an important developer is leaving the Csound
community.
I really hope, Dr. Boulanger can persuade the MIT to make Csound open
source. I learned a lot from the Csound book, but I'm forced to use
this knowledge in Pd now. (Which I would have done anyway, I guess ;)
ciao
--
Frank Barknecht _ ______footils.org__
12:31 p.m.
Hi
This whole issue is dacades old, isnt that why the whole FSF fiasco
started.
On Tue, 18 Mar 2003, Frank Barknecht wrote:
Hallo,
Dave Phillips hat gesagt: // Dave Phillips wrote:
Frank, as you can see, this license prohibits
*any* redistribution
unless specifically contracted via MIT.
I didn't understand it this way, but it seems to be even worse than I
thought...
However, Rick Boulanger recently met with Barry
Vercoe to ask
specifically about a change in the license. Apparently Barry is
sympathetic but he may not have the real power to change it, i.e., it
might be more MIT's decision than his (as you can see above, Barry does
not hold the copyright, it belongs to MIT). At any rate, Rick spoke with
Barry a few weeks ago and nothing of substance has been reported yet.
Rick is a good fellow, I know he wants to help resolve this rather
important issue, but don't hold your breath waiting for a change.
Yes, this license discussion is so old but it is also so sad. MIT
could make available a good software, but they need to face the fact,
that it is several *decades* old. I see no way they could make any
money from such an "old-fashioned" software, and also Csound is *only*
still useful today because of the work, non-MIT people like j. ffitch
are doing for it.
So MIT isn't just holding back a piece of software they own, but a
whole community, that they don't own, but they behave like the did.
There lies the real tragic of the whole affair and that is the point,
why every 6 months or so an important developer is leaving the Csound
community.
I really hope, Dr. Boulanger can persuade the MIT to make Csound open
source. I learned a lot from the Csound book, but I'm forced to use
this knowledge in Pd now. (Which I would have done anyway, I guess ;)
ciao
8:17 p.m.
Its not true that its totally old, new opcodes get added all the time,
there's almost twice as many opcodes for instruments now (with a whole
bunch of new physical modelling instruments added) as there were in '95. I
would use pd for doing realtime stuff, what I like Csound for is genrating
really whacked out synthesis that would be impossible (even on really good
hardware) to generate in realtime.
The biggest problem with csound is the fact that its very hard to build
under a standard redhat 8.0 setup, I don't think you have the same problem
using say debian potatoe, but it seems like the csound developers are
using a really old linux distro for development, the
"unnofficial" version builds very easily on redhat 8.0, but its no longer
supported, so I think csound would definitely improve if it could be dual
liscensed like mysql where you can get a gpl copy to use the code for
free, but if you want to build a commercial product to sell with csound
embedded, then you pay MIT a fee (like you do when you create a product
with mysql embbedded).
http://www.brianredfern.org
On Tue, 18 Mar 2003, Frank Barknecht wrote:
Hallo,
Dave Phillips hat gesagt: // Dave Phillips wrote:
Frank, as you can see, this license prohibits
*any* redistribution
unless specifically contracted via MIT.
I didn't understand it this way, but it seems to be even worse than I
thought...
However, Rick Boulanger recently met with Barry
Vercoe to ask
specifically about a change in the license. Apparently Barry is
sympathetic but he may not have the real power to change it, i.e., it
might be more MIT's decision than his (as you can see above, Barry does
not hold the copyright, it belongs to MIT). At any rate, Rick spoke with
Barry a few weeks ago and nothing of substance has been reported yet.
Rick is a good fellow, I know he wants to help resolve this rather
important issue, but don't hold your breath waiting for a change.
Yes, this license discussion is so old but it is also so sad. MIT
could make available a good software, but they need to face the fact,
that it is several *decades* old. I see no way they could make any
money from such an "old-fashioned" software, and also Csound is *only*
still useful today because of the work, non-MIT people like j. ffitch
are doing for it.
So MIT isn't just holding back a piece of software they own, but a
whole community, that they don't own, but they behave like the did.
There lies the real tragic of the whole affair and that is the point,
why every 6 months or so an important developer is leaving the Csound
community.
I really hope, Dr. Boulanger can persuade the MIT to make Csound open
source. I learned a lot from the Csound book, but I'm forced to use
this knowledge in Pd now. (Which I would have done anyway, I guess ;)
ciao
--
Frank Barknecht _ ______footils.org__
7743
days inactive
7745
days old
linux-audio-user@lists.linuxaudio.org
8 comments
8 participants
participants (8)
-
Alexandre Prokoudine -
Brian Redfern -
Dave Phillips -
Frank Barknecht -
ico＠fuse.net -
Jaakko Prättälä -
Maurizio Umberto Puxeddu -
mawali＠news.icns.com