21 Oct
2015
21 Oct
'15
11:17 a.m.
Hi
Old problem here, decided to try to get to the bottom of this.
Normally I start jack from qjackctl and mostly everythings fine. However
sometimes "something" makes jack hang and I cannot kill it, so I have to
reboot :-(
When started proberly from qjackctl the process is called jackd. If I
forget to start jack before renoise and renoise is configured to use
jack, renoise starts its own jack. This is called jackdbus. It seems I
have both "jackd", "jackd2" and "jackd2-firewire" installed,
probably
because I was testing which one worked better with my new kernel.
1) How can I kill-kill jack when it's hanging?
2) What's the prober way of having two versions of jack installed,
making sure I'm *always* using one version as default (specifically, how
to make qjackctl and renoise use the same version)?
Sorry if this is all too obvious...
NB: Running debian jessie + liquorix sid
Cheers
--
Atte
http://atte.dk http://a773.dk
22 Oct
22 Oct
11:42 a.m.
On 10/21/2015 11:23 AM, Christopher Arndt wrote:
If it's jackdbus that's hanging (or causing
jackd manually started
afterwards to hang) try "jack_control exit".
Thanks, that works!
--
Atte
http://atte.dk http://a773.dk
21 Oct
21 Oct
3:30 p.m.
On Wed, October 21, 2015 4:17 am, Atte wrote:
2) What's the prober way of having two versions of
jack installed,
making sure I'm *always* using one version as default (specifically, how
to make qjackctl and renoise use the same version)?
The jack developers have always been very insistent that two versions of
jack can never be installed simultaneously.
Note that having jackd and jackdbus installed does not necessarily imply
two version of jack, because the jack2 installation will create both jackd
and jackdbus binaries if dbus support is configured during compilation.
One thing to try may be checking the dbus enabled selection in the
qjackctl advanced setup tab, that way the same executable is started by
qjackctl and by renoise, so if jackdbus is already running when qjackctl
starts it should be able to display the current status, and not try to
start a new instance.
I run fedora, so there is only one jack package available in the official
repositories (jack2, with an optional dbus support package which can be
installed). If your debian repositories contain packages for both jack
and jack2, only one should be installed, not both. If there is a
possibility that the jack binary is from jack (ver 1), if you decide to
keep the jack2 package you should probably re-install to be sure that any
shared libraries which have the same name in both packages come from the
correct package (jackd, libjack.so, etc.).
--
Chris Caudle
22 Oct
22 Oct
11:47 a.m.
On 10/21/2015 03:30 PM, Chris Caudle wrote:
On Wed, October 21, 2015 4:17 am, Atte wrote:
> 2) What's the prober way of having two versions of jack installed,
> making sure I'm *always* using one version as default (specifically, how
> to make qjackctl and renoise use the same version)?
The jack developers have always been very insistent
that two versions of
jack can never be installed simultaneously.
I removed jackd1, which took qjackctl with it. Installed qjackctl from
source, problem persists. Before someone suggests: In fact I did
"apt-get remove --purge" on everything jack, and then reinstalled
jackd2-firewire (which took jackd2 with it).
I have no idea what jackdbus is, which package it belongs to or why
renoise thinks that's the proper way to start jack...
Cheers
--
Atte
http://atte.dk http://a773.dk
12:09 p.m.
On 10/21/2015 11:47 PM, Atte wrote:
On 10/21/2015 03:30 PM, Chris Caudle wrote:
Odd. I have qjackctl here with jackd2, without a trace of jackd1 on the
system.
On Wed, October 21, 2015 4:17 am, Atte wrote:
> 2) What's the prober way of having two versions of jack installed,
> making sure I'm *always* using one version as default (specifically, how
> to make qjackctl and renoise use the same version)?
The jack developers have always been very
insistent that two versions of
jack can never be installed simultaneously.
I removed jackd1, which took qjackctl with it. Installed qjackctl from
source, problem persists. Before someone suggests: In fact I did
"apt-get remove --purge" on everything jack, and then reinstalled
jackd2-firewire (which took jackd2 with it).
I have no idea what jackdbus is, which package it belongs to or why
renoise thinks that's the proper way to start jack...
Don't know nothing about Renoise. I've also heard of people having
problems getting jackd2 working with jackdbus (I don't use jackdbus,
anyway) so glad it's working out for you?
--
David W. Jones
gnome(a)hawaii.rr.com
authenticity, honesty, community
http://dancingtreefrog.com
12:58 p.m.
I have no idea what jackdbus is, which package it belongs to or why
renoise thinks that's the proper way to start jack...
Cheers
--
Atte
Jackdbus is one of the two methods jack2 can run in. Jack1 does not have a dbus version.
dbus is required for certain operations, including to use the Pulseaudio sync modules,
hence why it seems to be often the one used as default these days. qjackctl also install
and defaults to starting the dbus version although this can be changed in the settings.
This page has differences between jack1 and jack2 and very very lightly touches on dbus.
https://github.com/jackaudio/jackaudio.github.com/wiki/Q_difference_jack1_j…
Dale.
1:04 p.m.
From: dj_kaza(a)hotmail.com
To: atte(a)youmail.dk; linux-audio-user(a)lists.linuxaudio.org
Date: Thu, 22 Oct 2015 10:58:15 +0000
Subject: Re: [LAU] killling zombie jack
I have no idea what jackdbus is, which package it belongs to or why
renoise thinks that's the proper way to start jack...
Cheers
--
Atte
Jackdbus is one of the two methods jack2 can run in. Jack1 does not have a dbus version.
dbus is required for certain operations, including to use the Pulseaudio sync modules,
hence why it seems to be often the one used as default these days. qjackctl also install
and defaults to starting the dbus version although this can be changed in the settings.
This page has differences between jack1 and jack2 and very very lightly touches on dbus.
https://github.com/jackaudio/jackaudio.github.com/wiki/Q_difference_jack1_j…
Dale.
---
And then this page explains why Renoise would start Jack with the dbus version if Jack is
not already running at start.
https://github.com/jackaudio/jackaudio.github.com/wiki/JackDbusPackaging
1:23 p.m.
Am 22.10.2015 um 12:58 schrieb Kaza Kore:
This page has differences between jack1 and jack2 and
very very lightly
touches on dbus.
https://github.com/jackaudio/jackaudio.github.com/wiki/Q_difference_jack1_j…
Indeed, that wiki gives answers to most of the questions about jack
raised in this thread.
The table of jack 1/2 differences leaves me with one question, though:
What is meant by "Has builtin integration with Linux MIDI"?
Does that mean that with jack 2 I have to use a2j or a similar tool to
have access to ALSA MIDI clients via jack MIDI, but not with jack 1?
Chris
2:07 p.m.
To: linux-audio-user(a)lists.linuxaudio.org
From: chris(a)chrisarndt.de
Date: Thu, 22 Oct 2015 13:23:09 +0200
Subject: Re: [LAU] killling zombie jack
Am 22.10.2015 um 12:58 schrieb Kaza Kore:
This page has differences between jack1 and jack2 and
very very lightly
touches on dbus.
https://github.com/jackaudio/jackaudio.github.com/wiki/Q_difference_jack1_j…
Indeed, that wiki gives answers to most of the questions about jack
raised in this thread.
The table of jack 1/2 differences leaves me with one question, though:
What is meant by "Has builtin integration with Linux MIDI"?
Does that mean that with jack 2 I have to use a2j or a similar tool to
have access to ALSA MIDI clients via jack MIDI, but not with jack 1?
Chris
The thing that surprised me the most was seeing the note at the very bottom about Jack2
using a default, fixed larger MIDI buffer size whereas Jack1's is smaller by default
and configurable. I had thought from previous conversations on this list (I think mainly
investigations done by Ralph??) that MIDI buffer/delay/jitter appeared to be affected by
Jack's audio buffer size. No idea if tests were done with Jack1 or Jack2 or how
conclusive they were though. Also didn't want to take the subject too far way from the
original point of conversation...
Dale.
2:21 p.m.
On Thu, 22 Oct 2015 12:07:50 +0000, Kaza Kore wrote:
The thing that surprised me the most was seeing the
note at the very
bottom about Jack2 using a default, fixed larger MIDI buffer size
whereas Jack1's is smaller by default and configurable. I had thought
from previous conversations on this list (I think mainly
investigations done by Ralph??) that MIDI buffer/delay/jitter appeared
to be affected by Jack's audio buffer size. No idea if tests were done
with Jack1 or Jack2 or how conclusive they were though. Also didn't
want to take the subject too far way from the original point of
conversation...
This are apples and bananas ;). I only talked about accuracy of
sync between MIDI events and audio recordings and shift of that sync.
The audio latency indeed has impact to this sync. So yes, in this
context there is a relation between audio latency and MIDI jitter.
More important, Paul Davis several times claimed that I was
mistaken, when 1. he was mistaken or 2. he was to stupid to read quotes
correctly and thought the claim of somebody else was a claim made by
me. Several people just believed his claims and blamed me too. IIRC Len
once was mistaken regarding such a jack thingy.
I never said anything about how long e.g. SysEx data is allowed to be
when using Jack 1 or Jack 2 or to what ever the MIDI buffer is related
or not related.
Regards,
Ralf
4:13 p.m.
On 2015-10-22 13:07, Kaza Kore wrote:
To: linux-audio-user(a)lists.linuxaudio.org
From: chris(a)chrisarndt.de
Date: Thu, 22 Oct 2015 13:23:09 +0200
Subject: Re: [LAU] killling zombie jack
Am 22.10.2015 um 12:58 schrieb Kaza Kore:
it means that jack1 (>= 0.123.3) has a2jmidid functionality fully
integrated (via -Xalsa_midi, which supercedes -Xseq).
iow.: when using jack1 (v0.123.3+) and setting midi driver to "seq" (cf.
qjackctl) you won't need to run `a2jmidid -e` as an
ALSA-MIDI-to-JACK-MIDI bridge whatsoever anymore.
hth.
cheers
--
rncbc aka. Rui Nuno Capela
This page has differences between jack1 and jack2
and very very
lightly
touches on dbus.
https://github.com/jackaudio/jackaudio.github.com/wiki/Q_difference_jack1_j…
[1]
Indeed, that wiki gives answers to most of the questions about jack
raised in this thread.
The table of jack 1/2 differences leaves me with one question, though:
What is meant by "Has builtin integration with Linux MIDI"?
Does that mean that with jack 2 I have to use a2j or a similar tool to
have access to ALSA MIDI clients via jack MIDI, but not with jack 1?
4:24 p.m.
On 10/22/2015 04:16 PM, Christopher Arndt wrote:
Am 22.10.2015 um 16:13 schrieb Rui Nuno Capela:
Yeah, and meta-data?
And other functions like jackclient to pid?
And how about getting rid of either jack1 or jack2 already?
Nils, on the passive-aggressive day
it means that jack1 (>= 0.123.3) has a2jmidid
functionality
fully integrated (via -Xalsa_midi, which supercedes -Xseq).
Ok, thanks for the clarification.
Any plans to add this to jack 2 as well? 
9:31 a.m.
Am 23.10.2015 um 09:10 schrieb Jeremy Jongepier
<jeremy(a)autostatic.com>om>:
So ist that entry in that wiki table about missing ALSA MIDI integration in Jack 2 wrong?
--
Christopher Arndt <info(a)chrisarndt.de>
On 10/22/2015 04:16 PM, Christopher Arndt wrote:
Any plans to add this to jack 2 as well?
This was already in Jack2 before it got added to Jack1. The
corresponding Jack2 driver name is -Xalsarawmidi.
12:47 p.m.
On Fri, 23 Oct 2015 09:30:50 +0200, Christopher Arndt wrote:
We seem to get a lot of apples and oranges confusion.
Actually I don't know what you mean, so perhaps running commands does
explain differences.
The Xalsarawmidi switch is useful to reduce MIDI jitter for
communication with hardware MIDI, IOW when using external synth, not
when using virtual synth. Jack 1 didn't have this years ago, I don't
know if jack 1 provides something like this nowadays. However, Jack 2
already provided it years ago.
To get a usable bridge between ALSA and Jack MIDI, there is the need to
use a2jmidi, even if you use the Xalsarawmidi switch.
E.g. run
jackd -Xalsarawmidi -dalsa -dhw:0 -r48000 -p256 -n2
a2jmidid -e
qjackctl
qsynth
and take a look at QjackCtl's MIDI and ALSA tabs.
Killall and run the same without the Xalsarawmidi switch, then again
take a look at the ALSA and MIDI tabs.
Linux audio confusion for newbies increased within the last years.
The biggest PITA is that a few by default start jackdbus in combination
with pulseaudio, something completely insane, if you want a tuned audio
production machine. Because it's stupid, not because it's new, most
websites explaining pro-audio with Linux, explain how to use jackd.
Another PITA is that the most provided default GUI for Jackd, QjackCtl
changed for no good reasons. Some brand new released distros still ship
with the old GUI, while some other distros provide the current GUI, so
newbies have no chance to find the correct howto.
It's idiotic, while Linux audio became better in a lot of domains, it
became more confusing for newbies regarding the approach to simplify
some domains, that do not need simplification, especially because it
just cause confusion.
1 radio station might need to use the computer as a telephone at the
same time while doing an audio production on this computer, but 1000
musicians more likely don't telephone at the same time they make an
audio production.
For power users it became harder to help beginners, even if providing a
solution sometimes could be very easy by removing pulseaudio, disabling
jackdbus and using jackd. To explain how this works nowadays is
unwanted.
Release date of Ubuntu Wily was/is yesterday/today and it ships with the
old QjackCtl GUI. (The Release Wiki needs to be edited, but I've got no
time to do it now, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Releases.)
FWIW building the current version of qjackctl even with Qt5 works, I
did it a while back before it was released.
IMO the audio community should focus to provide common features,
instead of enforcing to get one new feature after the other and then,
when it's provided, to ignore it.
Writing a help page for Ubuntu flavour is wanted, but makes no sense,
let alone writing howtos that are independent to a distro.
There are no clear goal setting within our community.
Is there any website that explains the usage of QjackCtl, for both, the
current and the old GUI?
Regards,
Ralf
Am 23.10.2015
um 09:10 schrieb Jeremy Jongepier
<jeremy(a)autostatic.com>om>:
So ist that entry in that wiki table about missing ALSA MIDI
integration in Jack 2 wrong? On 10/22/2015 04:16 PM, Christopher Arndt wrote:
Any plans to add this to jack 2 as well?
This was already in Jack2 before it got added to Jack1. The
corresponding Jack2 driver name is -Xalsarawmidi.
1 p.m.
Am 23.10.2015 um 12:47 schrieb Ralf Mardorf:
On Fri, 23 Oct 2015 09:30:50 +0200, Christopher Arndt
wrote:
The comparision table here:
https://github.com/jackaudio/jackaudio.github.com/wiki/Q_difference_jack1_j…
says:
"Has builtin integration with Linux MIDI" Jack 2 = no
Then Rui said:
So ist that entry in that wiki table about
missing ALSA MIDI
integration in Jack 2 wrong?
Actually I don't know what you mean, so perhaps running commands does
explain differences. it means that jack1 (>= 0.123.3) has a2jmidid
functionality fully
integrated (via -Xalsa_midi, which supercedes -Xseq)."
Then Jeremy said:
This was already in Jack2 before it got added to
Jack1. The
corresponding Jack2 driver name is -Xalsarawmidi.
Now you are saying:
The Xalsarawmidi switch [...] Jack 2
already provided it years ago.
Then why isn't it mentioned in the man page? Or did you both (Jeremy,
Ralf) mean to say '-Xraw'?
And:
To get a usable bridge between ALSA and Jack MIDI,
there is the need to
use a2jmidi, even if you use the Xalsarawmidi switch.
WTF?
Chris
1:30 p.m.
On Fri, 23 Oct 2015 12:59:58 +0200, Christopher Arndt wrote:
WTF?
Run jackd 2 with and without Xalsarawmidi in combination with and
without a2jmidid -e and test it. This is the easiest way to clear up
misunderstandings.
On Fri, 23 Oct 2015 09:26:47 +0000, Kaza Kore wrote:
Jack in no way ever starts itself in my experience.
There's ~/.jackdrc, but at least there is the need to launch an app to
trigger launching jackd.
2:14 p.m.
On 23 October 2015 at 12:30, Ralf Mardorf <ralf.mardorf(a)alice-dsl.net> wrote:
On Fri, 23 Oct 2015 09:26:47 +0000, Kaza Kore wrote:
IIRC .jackdrc is ignored by jackdbus when it's auto-started - the
configuration is read from ~/.config/jack/conf.xml
Neil
--
Neil C Smith
Artist : Technologist : Adviser
http://neilcsmith.net
Praxis LIVE - hybrid visual IDE for creative coding - www.praxislive.org
Digital Prisoners - interactive spaces and projections -
www.digitalprisoners.co.uk
Jack in no way ever starts itself in my
experience.
There's ~/.jackdrc, but at least there is the need to launch an app to
trigger launching jackd.
7:37 p.m.
On 23.10.2015, at 14:14, Neil C Smith
<neilcsmith.net(a)googlemail.com> wrote:
jackd can be auto-started too
www.rncbc.org/drupal/node/820
On 23 October 2015 at 12:30, Ralf Mardorf
<ralf.mardorf(a)alice-dsl.net> wrote:
IIRC .jackdrc is ignored by jackdbus when it's auto-started - the
configuration is read from ~/.config/jack/conf.xml On Fri, 23 Oct 2015 09:26:47 +0000, Kaza Kore
wrote:
Jack in no way ever starts itself in my experience.
There's ~/.jackdrc, but at least there is the need to launch an app to
trigger launching jackd.
8:12 p.m.
On 23 October 2015 at 18:37, Ralf Mardorf <ralf.mardorf(a)alice-dsl.net> wrote:
Not sure you've read what you pointed to! :-P
Yes of course jackd can be auto-started. However, unless I'm missing
something in the code I linked to above, the mechanism used to
auto-start is hardwired into Jack2 at compile time?
eg. "the --dbus flag must be defined at configure time to compile the
jackdbus executable. If the "automatic start server option" is used by
clients, jackd server will be started using the dbus service."
from https://github.com/jackaudio/jack2
So any system that includes jackdbus will auto-start through dbus.
Neil
--
Neil C Smith
Artist : Technologist : Adviser
http://neilcsmith.net
Praxis LIVE - hybrid visual IDE for creative coding - www.praxislive.org
Digital Prisoners - interactive spaces and projections -
www.digitalprisoners.co.uk
IIRC .jackdrc
is ignored by jackdbus when it's auto-started - the
configuration is read from ~/.config/jack/conf.xml
jackd can be auto-started too
www.rncbc.org/drupal/node/820
24 Oct
24 Oct
8:31 a.m.
On 23.10.2015, at 20:11, Neil C Smith
<neilcsmith.net(a)googlemail.com> wrote:
On 23 October 2015 at 18:37, Ralf Mardorf <ralf.mardorf(a)alice-dsl.net> wrote:
Not sure you've read what you pointed to! :-P
Yes of course jackd can be auto-started. However, unless I'm missing
something in the code I linked to above, the mechanism used to
auto-start is hardwired into Jack2 at compile time?
eg. "the --dbus flag must be defined at configure time to compile the
jackdbus executable. If the "automatic start server option" is used by
clients, jackd server will be started using the dbus service."
from https://github.com/jackaudio/jack2
So any system that includes jackdbus will auto-start through dbus.
I've got /bin/jackd and /bin/jackdbus on my Arch Linux. If neither jackd nor jackdbus
is running and I launch Qtractor, then jackd gets started, not jackdbus.
IIRC
.jackdrc is ignored by jackdbus when it's auto-started - the
configuration is read from ~/.config/jack/conf.xml
jackd can be auto-started too
www.rncbc.org/drupal/node/820
12:56 p.m.
On 24 October 2015 at 07:31, Ralf Mardorf <ralf.mardorf(a)alice-dsl.net> wrote:
Yes, ignore that bit - same behaviour here. Sorry, the quote from the
readme seems to ignore the fact that if both jackd (classic) and
jackdbus are set to build, the classic auto-start mechanism will be
used by default (though that can be overridden)
Doesn't, AFAIK, change the fact that the auto-start behaviour is baked
in at compile time. Does make me slightly more surprised that Atte is
seeing jackdbus auto-start.
Neil
--
Neil C Smith
Artist : Technologist : Adviser
http://neilcsmith.net
Praxis LIVE - hybrid visual IDE for creative coding - www.praxislive.org
Digital Prisoners - interactive spaces and projections -
www.digitalprisoners.co.uk
On 23.10.2015,
at 20:11, Neil C Smith <neilcsmith.net(a)googlemail.com> wrote:
So any system that includes jackdbus will auto-start through dbus.
I've got /bin/jackd and /bin/jackdbus on my Arch Linux. If neither jackd nor jackdbus
is running and I launch Qtractor, then jackd gets started, not jackdbus.
1:22 p.m.
Am 24.10.2015 um 12:56 schrieb Neil C Smith:
Doesn't, AFAIK, change the fact that the
auto-start behaviour is baked
in at compile time. Does make me slightly more surprised that Atte is
seeing jackdbus auto-start.
Yeah, should be easy to change that to depend on an environment
variable. Somebody wants to write a patch?
Chris
22 Oct
22 Oct
7:03 p.m.
On Thu, October 22, 2015 4:47 am, Atte wrote:
I removed jackd1, which took qjackctl with it.
I would call that a mistake in the debian package for qjackctl.
reinstalled jackd2-firewire (which took jackd2 with
it).
Do you mean that installing jackd2-firewire also installed jackd2, or that
when you re-installed jackd2-firewire it forced jackd2 to un-install?
The debian packages seem really strange. I just have experience with
Fedora on my computer used for audio, and the jack package there installs
the firewire and net backends with the main package, there is just an
additional package to add the dbus support (which only adds two more
files, jackdbus and jack_control, all the shared libraries were already
installed by the main jack package).
Installed qjackctl from source, problem persists.
But did you change the qjackctl option so that it starts jackdbus? I
think the option is in the advanced tab, and has a name something like
"use dbus" or "dbus integration." I am away from my linux machine at
the
moment, so I can't check the exact name.
I have no idea what jackdbus is, which package it
belongs to or why
renoise thinks that's the proper way to start jack...
dbus allows message passing between apps, and allows apps to be notified
for example if a new application wants to take over control of an ALSA
device. It is what allows graceful control change of the ALSA device from
PulseAudio to jackd back to PulseAudio.
--
Chris Caudle
23 Oct
23 Oct
8:25 a.m.
On 10/22/2015 07:02 PM, Chris Caudle wrote:
I mean that when clean for things jack, installing jackd2-firewire also
installed jackd2. This makes sense to me, since AFAIK jackd2-firewire
simply adds firewire support to jackd2.
I played with it, but couldn't make it start jackdbus. The advanced
dialog has a "Server prefix"/Server path (command line prefix) where it
currently says "jackd". It's a list that also contains "jackdmp"
and
"jackstart" none of which works (I get an error "could not start jack,
sorry"). I tried typing "jackdbus" here which also didn't work, with
the
error "Could not connect to the jack server as client".
Renoise main dev, taktik, replied on the renoise forum:
"It's not Renoise which starts Jack in case it's not running. Jack does
so by its own, as soon as the first client uses jack an no jack server
is running."
Cheers
--
Atte
http://atte.dk http://a773.dk
On Thu, October 22, 2015 4:47 am, Atte wrote:
Agreed!
I removed jackd1, which took qjackctl with it.
I would call that a mistake in the debian package for qjackctl. reinstalled
jackd2-firewire (which took jackd2 with it).
Do you mean that installing jackd2-firewire also installed jackd2, or that
when you re-installed jackd2-firewire it forced jackd2 to un-install? The debian packages seem really strange. I just have
experience with
Fedora on my computer used for audio, and the jack package there installs
the firewire and net backends with the main package, there is just an
additional package to add the dbus support (which only adds two more
files, jackdbus and jack_control, all the shared libraries were already
installed by the main jack package).
It seems the same things is happening on debian.
Installed
qjackctl from source, problem persists.
But did you change the qjackctl option so that it starts jackdbus? I
think the option is in the advanced tab, and has a name something like
"use dbus" or "dbus integration." I am away from my linux machine at
the
moment, so I can't check the exact name.
11:22 a.m.
I played with it, but couldn't make it start
jackdbus. The advanced
dialog has a "Server prefix"/Server path (command line prefix) where it
currently says "jackd". It's a list that also contains "jackdmp"
and
"jackstart" none of which works (I get an error "could not start jack,
sorry"). I tried typing "jackdbus" here which also didn't work, with
the
error "Could not connect to the jack server as client".
Settings > Misc > Enable D-Bus Interface.
Not my screenshot, found through Googling. Strangely the screenshot on the official page
for the Misc options doesn't have it and seems rather old/lacking....
http://alien.slackbook.org/blog/wp-content/uploads/2014/01/qjackctl_setup_m…
11:26 a.m.
Date: Fri, 23 Oct 2015 08:25:02 +0200
From: atte(a)youmail.dk
To: linux-audio-user(a)lists.linuxaudio.org
Subject: Re: [LAU] killling zombie jack
Renoise main dev, taktik, replied on the renoise forum:
"It's not Renoise which starts Jack in case it's not running. Jack does
so by its own, as soon as the first client uses jack an no jack server
is running."
And that doesn't seem right! I start any other Jack application I have without the
Jack server running and I just get no playback! Jack in no way ever starts itself in my
experience. (Mind I haven't played with Renoise since 2.x) but it definitely seems
Renoise must be asking it to start, which sounds possibly like part of the dbus protocol
but I'm in no way sure and obviously it could be written to do either (otherwise the
likes of qjackctl wouldn't be able to do either.) But if Renoise gives you options to
adjust buffers etc while connected to the Jack server I believe from these conversations
that relies on the dbus connectivity.
Regards, Dale.
11:49 a.m.
Hi,
On 23 October 2015 at 10:26, Kaza Kore <dj_kaza(a)hotmail.com> wrote:
And that doesn't seem right! I start any other
Jack application I have
without the Jack server running and I just get no playback! Jack in no way
ever starts itself in my experience. (Mind I haven't played with Renoise
since 2.x) but it definitely seems Renoise must be asking it to start, which
sounds possibly like part of the dbus protocol but I'm in no way sure
There's a flag in the Jack API that an application can pass to control
automatic starting of the server if it isn't running. It's not
related to dbus at all. I remember experimenting with this a while
ago and having difficulty getting it to pick the right configuration.
http://jackaudio.org/api/group__ClientFunctions.html#gabbd2041bca191943b6ef…
http://jackaudio.org/api/types_8h.html#a396617de2ef101891c51346f408a375e
From the docs it looks like there's an environment
variable that can
override Renoise's default behaviour.
Best wishes,
Neil
--
Neil C Smith
Artist : Technologist : Adviser
http://neilcsmith.net
Praxis LIVE - hybrid visual IDE for creative coding - www.praxislive.org
Digital Prisoners - interactive spaces and projections -
www.digitalprisoners.co.uk
12:05 p.m.
On 23 October 2015 at 10:49, Neil C Smith <neilcsmith.net(a)googlemail.com> wrote:
Hi,
On 23 October 2015 at 10:26, Kaza Kore <dj_kaza(a)hotmail.com> wrote:
To clarify that, I mean that it's highly unlikely that Renoise is
using dbus directly - code here would suggest why jackdbus is used
when the auto launch behaviour is used.
https://github.com/jackaudio/jack2/blob/master/posix/JackPosixServerLaunch.…
Best wishes,
Neil
--
Neil C Smith
Artist : Technologist : Adviser
http://neilcsmith.net
Praxis LIVE - hybrid visual IDE for creative coding - www.praxislive.org
Digital Prisoners - interactive spaces and projections -
www.digitalprisoners.co.uk
And that doesn't seem right! I start any
other Jack application I have
without the Jack server running and I just get no playback! Jack in no way
ever starts itself in my experience. (Mind I haven't played with Renoise
since 2.x) but it definitely seems Renoise must be asking it to start, which
sounds possibly like part of the dbus protocol but I'm in no way sure
There's a flag in the Jack API that an application can pass to control
automatic starting of the server if it isn't running. It's not
related to dbus at all.
12:11 p.m.
From: neilcsmith.net(a)googlemail.com
Date: Fri, 23 Oct 2015 11:05:11 +0100
Subject: Re: [LAU] killling zombie jack
To: dj_kaza(a)hotmail.com
CC: atte(a)youmail.dk; linux-audio-user(a)lists.linuxaudio.org
On 23 October 2015 at 10:49, Neil C Smith <neilcsmith.net(a)googlemail.com> wrote:
Agreed. Although I would still call that Renoise asking Jack to start, not Jack starting
automagically (which would require Jack knowing it needs to start and thus be running some
way in the first place??) So there should be a configuration file to select between modes
and all other settings. Pretty sure from the commandline you use "jackd [args]"
to start non-dbus version and "jack-control start" to start the dbus version,
both of which already have separate configuration files for default behaviour I believe...
(And obviously that all already assumes it's Jack2 in use.)
Does this API exist and work with both Jack1 and Jack2? This seems a total minefield for
anybody writing Jack-compliant software from all I've read!
Dale.
Hi,
On 23 October 2015 at 10:26, Kaza Kore <dj_kaza(a)hotmail.com> wrote:
To clarify that, I mean that it's highly unlikely that Renoise is
using dbus directly - code here would suggest why jackdbus is used
when the auto launch behaviour is used.
https://github.com/jackaudio/jack2/blob/master/posix/JackPosixServerLaunch.…
Best wishes,
Neil
And that doesn't seem right! I start any
other Jack application I have
without the Jack server running and I just get no playback! Jack in no way
ever starts itself in my experience. (Mind I haven't played with Renoise
since 2.x) but it definitely seems Renoise must be asking it to start, which
sounds possibly like part of the dbus protocol but I'm in no way sure
There's a flag in the Jack API that an application can pass to control
automatic starting of the server if it isn't running. It's not
related to dbus at all.
12:24 p.m.
On 23 October 2015 at 11:11, Kaza Kore <dj_kaza(a)hotmail.com> wrote:
. Although I would still call that Renoise asking Jack
to start, not
Jack starting automagically (which would require Jack knowing it needs to
start and thus be running some way in the first place??)
Not really. That flag means if there isn't a server running, start
one. It doesn't start another Jack server if one is already running.
So yes, it is Jack "automagically" knowing whether it should run a
server or not. It doesn't need to be running anything beforehand
though - the check is made when the software registers a new client.
both of which already
have separate configuration files for default behaviour I believe... (And
obviously that all already assumes it's Jack2 in use.)
Yes, that's the fun of this with the launch behaviour hard-wired in at
compile time. I now remember that the bit that confused me was why
the settings file created by QJackCtl was being ignored - because I
wasn't using dbus in normal use.
Does this API exist and work with both Jack1 and
Jack2? This seems a total
minefield for anybody writing Jack-compliant software from all I've read!
Yes, and (kind of) yes. ;-)
Neil
--
Neil C Smith
Artist : Technologist : Adviser
http://neilcsmith.net
Praxis LIVE - hybrid visual IDE for creative coding - www.praxislive.org
Digital Prisoners - interactive spaces and projections -
www.digitalprisoners.co.uk
21 Oct
21 Oct
7:18 p.m.
Atte, Oct 21 2015:
...
1) How can I kill-kill jack when it's hanging?
Write a script, if you want to make sure, that all JACKs are killed;
killall -16 jackd
killall -9 jackd
killall -15 jackdbus
...
If it doesn't work for you user, try to run that script as root, using sudo, or
whatever the GUI offers you. I've always been able to kill JACK with that, if it was
necessary.
2) What's the prober way of having two versions of
jack installed,
making sure I'm *always* using one version as default (specifically, how
to make qjackctl and renoise use the same version)?
I think you shouldn't have
jack1 and jack2 on one system, but I may be mistaken. Programs, that linked against jack1
usually work with jack2. So you might remove jack1, if that's what you want. I'm
not sure, if this works the other way round, i.e. removing jack2 to only use jack1.
...
Ta-ta
----
Ffanci
* Homepage: https://freeshell.de/~silvain
* Twitter: http://twitter.com/ffanci_silvain
* GitHub: https://github.com/fsilvain
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linux-audio-user@lists.linuxaudio.org
33 comments
11 participants
participants (11)
-
Atte -
Chris Caudle -
Christopher Arndt -
david -
F. Silvain -
Jeremy Jongepier -
Kaza Kore -
Neil C Smith -
Nils Gey -
Ralf Mardorf -
Rui Nuno Capela