21 Jan
2007
21 Jan
'07
8:27 p.m.
Another late night (early morning). Yet another tune that had to be
finished over the weekend ... ish!
I actually started working on it a few weeks before I started on East
To West but hit a creative block, so put it to one side for a while.
One problem I had was getting a soft drum sound. This was something I
couldn't find in any of the hydrogen kits, nor in the drumsets on THREE
different hardware synths. The drum I wanted to emulate is, I think,
Irish in origin. It is a hand held drum and the single stick is double
ended and leather padded, looking something like a dog bone. Eventually
I was able to create something like it in Zyn.
I also wanted a shaken tambourine and this seems just as hard to find.
I used a combination of effects in Zyn. to get somewhere near it, but
it isn't really right.
Anyway, the results so far are on:
http://www.musically.me.uk/music/Celtic_Dream.ogg
http://www.musically.me.uk/music/Celtic_Dream.mp3
--
Will J G
21 Jan
21 Jan
10:10 p.m.
Folderol <folderol(a)ukfsn.org> writes:
The drum I wanted to emulate is, I think, Irish in
origin. It is a
hand held drum and the single stick is double ended and leather
padded, looking something like a dog bone.
That's a bodhran -- have a look at:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bodhr%C3%A1n
--
Adam Sampson <ats(a)offog.org> <http://offog.org/>
22 Jan
22 Jan
4:59 p.m.
On Mon, 22 Jan 2007 02:10:34 +0000
Adam Sampson <ats(a)offog.org> wrote:
Folderol <folderol(a)ukfsn.org> writes:
Thanks for the info. It's very hard to look something up when you
don't know what it's called, isn't it?
--
Will J G
The drum I wanted to emulate is, I think, Irish
in origin. It is a
hand held drum and the single stick is double ended and leather
padded, looking something like a dog bone.
That's a bodhran -- have a look at:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bodhr%C3%A1n 
5:15 p.m.
On 1/22/07, Folderol <folderol(a)ukfsn.org> wrote:
On Mon, 22 Jan 2007 02:10:34 +0000
Adam Sampson <ats(a)offog.org> wrote:
;-) Nahh....it was easy. ;-)
I tried this in Google:
"Irish" "hand held drum""double ended" "leather
padded"
and got no links. Then I looked at the top of the page and I get one
commercial link that says"
"Huge Bodhran Sale"
http://store.harp-bagpipe.com/bodhrans.html
Interesting and fun stuff!
- Mark
Folderol <folderol(a)ukfsn.org> writes:
Thanks for the info. It's very hard to look something up when you
don't know what it's called, isn't it?
--
Will J G
The drum I wanted to emulate is, I think, Irish
in origin. It is a
hand held drum and the single stick is double ended and leather
padded, looking something like a dog bone.
That's a bodhran -- have a look at:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bodhr%C3%A1n 
25 Jan
25 Jan
1:54 a.m.
Folderol wrote:
Anyway, the results so far are on:
http://www.musically.me.uk/music/Celtic_Dream.ogg
http://www.musically.me.uk/music/Celtic_Dream.mp3
Hey, that's pretty good!
Needs a bit more tightening all around. The material is good but needs
to spend a bit more time in the mixing phase. The various tracks are not
100% "aligned" from a sound perspective.
E.g., the instrument that kicks in at 00:08 - you don't want a sound
that "shiny" in this kind of song. I see what you're trying to convey,
but it's a tad too sandpaper-ish. I wonder if a very gentle low-pass
will make it blend more naturally.
Anyway, that's just me picking nits. The song is good. My 5yr old son is
sitting nearby humming it. :-)
--
Florin Andrei
http://florin.myip.org/
5:29 a.m.
On Wed, Jan 24, 2007 at 09:54:49PM -0800, Florin Andrei wrote:
Folderol wrote:
I think it sounds like it was supposed to be bagpipes to me.. but
bagpipes are some of the worst midi voices ever.. Also it would need
a drone to be authentic. Also the bodhran doesn't sound too
authentic.
I like the song, but to my ears the midi soundcanvas sound is
horrible. I particularly hate that new-age synthy sound.. perhaps
that's just me though. I wonder if some of the FluidG3 soundfont
sounds would be better. It's a shame there isn't anything like
the Edirol orchestra vst for Linux.. Also I agree the note start
timings are a bit delayed in places..
Overall very nice composition though!
James
Anyway, the results so far are on:
http://www.musically.me.uk/music/Celtic_Dream.ogg
http://www.musically.me.uk/music/Celtic_Dream.mp3
Hey, that's pretty good!
Needs a bit more tightening all around. The material is good but needs
to spend a bit more time in the mixing phase. The various tracks are not
100% "aligned" from a sound perspective.
E.g., the instrument that kicks in at 00:08 - you don't want a sound
that "shiny" in this kind of song. I see what you're trying to convey,
but it's a tad too sandpaper-ish. I wonder if a very gentle low-pass
will make it blend more naturally. 
5:45 a.m.
James Stone wrote:
On Wed, Jan 24, 2007 at 09:54:49PM -0800, Florin
Andrei wrote:
Yes, it does! I always add a drone note when I have to play a "bagpipe"
sound ... Bagpipes, to me, strike me as voices that can never be
properly sampled ...
Folderol wrote:
I think it sounds like it was supposed to be bagpipes to me.. but
bagpipes are some of the worst midi voices ever.. Also it would need
a drone to be authentic. Anyway, the results so far are on:
http://www.musically.me.uk/music/Celtic_Dream.ogg
http://www.musically.me.uk/music/Celtic_Dream.mp3
Hey, that's pretty good!
Needs a bit more tightening all around. The material is good but needs
to spend a bit more time in the mixing phase. The various tracks are not
100% "aligned" from a sound perspective.
E.g., the instrument that kicks in at 00:08 - you don't want a sound
that "shiny" in this kind of song. I see what you're trying to convey,
but it's a tad too sandpaper-ish. I wonder if a very gentle low-pass
will make it blend more naturally. Also the bodhran doesn't sound too
authentic.
I like the song, but to my ears the midi soundcanvas sound is
horrible. I particularly hate that new-age synthy sound..
I think I'd prefer some fiddles instead, but it's OK.
perhaps
that's just me though. I wonder if some of the FluidG3 soundfont
sounds would be better. It's a shame there isn't anything like
the Edirol orchestra vst for Linux.. Also I agree the note start
timings are a bit delayed in places..
My wife and I both liked it.
--
David
gnome(a)hawaii.rr.com
authenticity, honesty, community
26 Jan
26 Jan
4:57 p.m.
On Wed, 24 Jan 2007 23:45:13 -1000
david <gnome(a)hawaii.rr.com> wrote:
I wanted to get a fiddle in there somewhere, and tried that sort of
sound on the descant part but the 'cheap' whistle sounds much better.
Thanks a lot.
--
Will J G
James Stone wrote:
I completely agree :(
On Wed, Jan 24, 2007 at 09:54:49PM -0800, Florin
Andrei wrote:
Yes, it does! I always add a drone note when I have to play a "bagpipe"
sound ... Bagpipes, to me, strike me as voices that can never be
properly sampled ... Folderol wrote:
I think it sounds like it was supposed to be bagpipes to me.. but
bagpipes are some of the worst midi voices ever.. Also it would need
a drone to be authentic. Anyway, the results so far are on:
http://www.musically.me.uk/music/Celtic_Dream.ogg
http://www.musically.me.uk/music/Celtic_Dream.mp3
Hey, that's pretty good!
Needs a bit more tightening all around. The material is good but needs
to spend a bit more time in the mixing phase. The various tracks are not
100% "aligned" from a sound perspective.
E.g., the instrument that kicks in at 00:08 - you don't want a sound
that "shiny" in this kind of song. I see what you're trying to convey,
but it's a tad too sandpaper-ish. I wonder if a very gentle low-pass
will make it blend more naturally. Also the
bodhran doesn't sound too
authentic.
I like the song, but to my ears the midi soundcanvas sound is
horrible. I particularly hate that new-age synthy sound..
I think I'd prefer some fiddles instead, but it's OK. perhaps
that's just me though. I wonder if some of the FluidG3 soundfont
sounds would be better. It's a shame there isn't anything like
the Edirol orchestra vst for Linux.. Also I agree the note start
timings are a bit delayed in places..
My wife and I both liked it.
28 Jan
28 Jan
7:40 p.m.
Folderol wrote:
I wanted to get a fiddle in there somewhere, and tried that sort of
sound on the descant part but the 'cheap' whistle sounds much better.
In the Celtic music world, that would be a tin whistle. ;-)
--
David
gnome(a)hawaii.rr.com
authenticity, honesty, community
I like the song, but to my ears the midi soundcanvas
sound is
horrible. I particularly hate that new-age synthy sound..
I think I'd prefer
some fiddles instead, but it's OK.
26 Jan
26 Jan
4:53 p.m.
On Thu, 25 Jan 2007 09:29:41 +0000
James Stone <jamesmstone(a)gmail.com> wrote:
On Wed, Jan 24, 2007 at 09:54:49PM -0800, Florin
Andrei wrote:
That's the main lead instrument. I think the other poster was referring
to the 'deep chimes' sound.
I was a bit undecided whether to go for a bagpipe like sound or a
flute. I tried a flute originally but it was too smooth and got buried
by the other instruments later on. I think it definitely has to be a
reed instrument of some sort, but bagpipes have a particular sort of
squeak or chirp that is never the same twice and virtually impossible
to emulate!
Folderol wrote:
I think it sounds like it was supposed to be bagpipes to me.. but
bagpipes are some of the worst midi voices ever.. Also it would need
a drone to be authentic. Also the bodhran doesn't sound too
authentic.
Anyway, the results so far are on:
http://www.musically.me.uk/music/Celtic_Dream.ogg
http://www.musically.me.uk/music/Celtic_Dream.mp3
Hey, that's pretty good!
Needs a bit more tightening all around. The material is good but needs
to spend a bit more time in the mixing phase. The various tracks are not
100% "aligned" from a sound perspective.
E.g., the instrument that kicks in at 00:08 - you don't want a sound
that "shiny" in this kind of song. I see what you're trying to convey,
but it's a tad too sandpaper-ish. I wonder if a very gentle low-pass
will make it blend more naturally. I like the song, but to my ears the midi soundcanvas
sound is
horrible. I particularly hate that new-age synthy sound.. perhaps
that's just me though. I wonder if some of the FluidG3 soundfont
sounds would be better. It's a shame there isn't anything like
the Edirol orchestra vst for Linux.. Also I agree the note start
timings are a bit delayed in places..
Again, I don't want to overwork the timings. Apart from the background,
all parts were played in real time and, although I will do more work, I
don't want to mechanicalise them - that's a good word :)
Overall very nice composition though!
James
Thanks
--
Will J G
27 Jan
27 Jan
5:32 a.m.
Folderol wrote:
I tried a flute originally but it was too smooth and
got buried
by the other instruments later on.
How are the different instruments panned? By placing instruments
different places in the stereo image, you can really make them come out
without turning everything up. In a way you could say they're not
fighting for the same space in the stereo image.
--
peace, love & harmony
Atte
http://www.atte.dk | quintet: http://www.anagrammer.dk
| compositions: http://www.atte.dk/compositions
28 Jan
28 Jan
5:32 p.m.
New subject: [linux-audio-user] Nmmm nmmm (yawn) - updated
On Sat, 27 Jan 2007 10:32:28 +0100
Atte André Jensen <atte.jensen(a)gmail.com> wrote:
Folderol wrote:
While I take your point about using stereo positioning to enhance the
music, I would never use it to assist instrument balance. Indeed I
make a point of listening in mono as a final check.
Our listeners may be using a small portable, or moving from room to
room while using our music as background, so it should sound good with
all instruments as clear as possible under these conditions.
I've made a few more adjustments to it, and think it is now in its final
form. While maybe not technically ideal, I think it works well. The deep
chimes have been softened and some timing errors in the 'choir' have
been put right, along with a general balancing of levels.
The melody can be heard clearly all the way through, and some descant
note clashes have been corrected.
As before:
http://www.musically.me.uk/music/Celtic_Dream.ogg
http://www.musically.me.uk/music/Celtic_Dream.mp3
--
Will J G
I tried a flute originally but it was too smooth
and got buried
by the other instruments later on.
How are the different instruments panned? By placing instruments
different places in the stereo image, you can really make them come out
without turning everything up. In a way you could say they're not
fighting for the same space in the stereo image.
29 Jan
29 Jan
11:53 p.m.
New subject: [linux-audio-user] Nmmm nmmm (yawn) - updated
Folderol wrote:
While I take your point about using stereo positioning to enhance the
music, I would never use it to assist instrument balance. Indeed I
make a point of listening in mono as a final check.
Our listeners may be using a small portable, or moving from room to
room while using our music as background, so it should sound good with
all instruments as clear as possible under these conditions.
That's pretty much the "best practice" recommendations that you can hear
from experienced professionals in the field.
I've made a few more adjustments to it, and think
it is now in its final
form. While maybe not technically ideal, I think it works well.
Sounds good.
--
Florin Andrei
http://florin.myip.org/
30 Jan
30 Jan
4:41 p.m.
New subject: [linux-audio-user] Nmmm nmmm (yawn) - updated
On Sunday 28 January 2007 22:31, Folderol wrote:
On Sat, 27 Jan 2007 10:32:28 +0100
Atte André Jensen <atte.jensen(a)gmail.com> wrote:
Hi Will. I think this is the best one yet, and sounds really nice. I'm not too
sure of the bodhran sound though. It sounds a bit soft to me. From watching
the Orangemen marching in Belfast on tv, the drums seemed to sound a lot
harder. I have a cdrom with celtic stuff on it, but sadly no bodhran. Perhaps
I'm thinking of a different drum here.
Anyway, all in all a nice tune. Well done.
Not having much success finding bodhran sounds on Google, but that's no
surprise.
Nigel.
Nigel.
Folderol wrote:
While I take your point about using stereo positioning to enhance the
music, I would never use it to assist instrument balance. Indeed I
make a point of listening in mono as a final check.
Our listeners may be using a small portable, or moving from room to
room while using our music as background, so it should sound good with
all instruments as clear as possible under these conditions.
I've made a few more adjustments to it, and think it is now in its final
form. While maybe not technically ideal, I think it works well. The deep
chimes have been softened and some timing errors in the 'choir' have
been put right, along with a general balancing of levels.
The melody can be heard clearly all the way through, and some descant
note clashes have been corrected.
As before:
http://www.musically.me.uk/music/Celtic_Dream.ogg
http://www.musically.me.uk/music/Celtic_Dream.mp3 I tried a flute originally but it was too smooth
and got buried
by the other instruments later on.
How are the different instruments panned? By placing instruments
different places in the stereo image, you can really make them come out
without turning everything up. In a way you could say they're not
fighting for the same space in the stereo image.
6:54 p.m.
New subject: [linux-audio-user] Nmmm nmmm (yawn) - updated
On 1/30/07, Nigel Henry <cave.dnb(a)tiscali.fr> wrote:
On Sunday 28 January 2007 22:31, Folderol wrote:
I didn't have much trouble finding it for GigaStudio. Probably would
work on LS if you have no issues with LS itself. Pricey, but Big Fish
always is.
http://www.bigfishaudio.com/4DCGI/detail.html?350
Here's a couple more. StormDrum is quite a good set. Again, both are pricey:
http://www.dolphinmusic.co.uk/page/shop/flypage/product_id/3540
http://www.zero-g.co.uk/index.cfm?articleid=383
Bodhran's are a pretty common drum for sound tracks. Resonant, deep,
they ring nicely if set up well. They get used a lot. Not sure I've
ever seen a free low end gig file but there might be one out there.
You should ask on one of the good GigaStudio forums like Northern
Sound Source:
http://www.northernsounds.com/forum/forumdisplay.php?f=15
Someone there will know for sure. Wizoo used to be good for this sort
of stuff but I guess they are gone now? (Acquired by DigiDesign?)
Good luck,
Mark
On Sat, 27 Jan 2007 10:32:28 +0100
Atte André Jensen <atte.jensen(a)gmail.com> wrote:
Hi Will. I think this is the best one yet, and sounds really nice. I'm not too
sure of the bodhran sound though. It sounds a bit soft to me. From watching
the Orangemen marching in Belfast on tv, the drums seemed to sound a lot
harder. I have a cdrom with celtic stuff on it, but sadly no bodhran. Perhaps
I'm thinking of a different drum here.
Anyway, all in all a nice tune. Well done.
Not having much success finding bodhran sounds on Google, but that's no
surprise.
Nigel. Folderol wrote:
While I take your point about using stereo positioning to enhance the
music, I would never use it to assist instrument balance. Indeed I
make a point of listening in mono as a final check.
Our listeners may be using a small portable, or moving from room to
room while using our music as background, so it should sound good with
all instruments as clear as possible under these conditions.
I've made a few more adjustments to it, and think it is now in its final
form. While maybe not technically ideal, I think it works well. The deep
chimes have been softened and some timing errors in the 'choir' have
been put right, along with a general balancing of levels.
The melody can be heard clearly all the way through, and some descant
note clashes have been corrected.
As before:
http://www.musically.me.uk/music/Celtic_Dream.ogg
http://www.musically.me.uk/music/Celtic_Dream.mp3 I tried a flute originally but it was too smooth
and got buried
by the other instruments later on.
How are the different instruments panned? By placing instruments
different places in the stereo image, you can really make them come out
without turning everything up. In a way you could say they're not
fighting for the same space in the stereo image.
26 Jan
26 Jan
4:45 p.m.
On Wed, 24 Jan 2007 21:54:49 -0800
Florin Andrei <florin(a)andrei.myip.org> wrote:
Folderol wrote:
Thanks very much :)
Anyway, the results so far are on:
http://www.musically.me.uk/music/Celtic_Dream.ogg
http://www.musically.me.uk/music/Celtic_Dream.mp3
Hey, that's pretty good! Needs a bit more tightening all around. The material
is good but needs
to spend a bit more time in the mixing phase. The various tracks are not
100% "aligned" from a sound perspective.
E.g., the instrument that kicks in at 00:08 - you don't want a sound
that "shiny" in this kind of song. I see what you're trying to convey,
but it's a tad too sandpaper-ish. I wonder if a very gentle low-pass
will make it blend more naturally.
Yes I have been thinking along those lines myself. I might do some
more work on it this weekend, but don't want to overwork it if you see
what I mean, so may just leave it a while and come back to it fresh.
Anyway, that's just me picking nits. The song is
good. My 5yr old son is
sitting nearby humming it. :-)
Someone humming along to a tune is the best I could ever wish for!
--
Will J G
27 Jan
27 Jan
8:03 p.m.
Folderol wrote:
On Wed, 24 Jan 2007 21:54:49 -0800
Florin Andrei <florin(a)andrei.myip.org> wrote:
Yup, it's the kind of tune that sounds much better if it's a little bit
spontaneous, sort of like anti-Kraftwerk if that makes sense.
--
Florin Andrei
http://florin.myip.org/
E.g., the instrument that kicks in at 00:08 - you
don't want a sound
that "shiny" in this kind of song. I see what you're trying to convey,
but it's a tad too sandpaper-ish. I wonder if a very gentle low-pass
will make it blend more naturally.
Yes I have been thinking along those lines myself. I might do some
more work on it this weekend, but don't want to overwork it if you see
what I mean, so may just leave it a while and come back to it fresh.
6307
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linux-audio-user@lists.linuxaudio.org
16 comments
8 participants
participants (8)
-
Adam Sampson -
Atte André Jensen -
david -
Florin Andrei -
Folderol -
James Stone -
Mark Knecht -
Nigel Henry