28 Jun
2009
28 Jun
'09
7:49 a.m.
Howdi,
New to list, relatively new to audio stuff, long time GNU/Linux user.
Backtraced the lists and saw some talk of KDE4. I got lumped with
this when Debian unstable pushed it out (4.2.2) a couple of months
back. I'd be wary of recommending anyone - with a working 3.5.x
system - to upgrade unless they really need something on 4.x I've
just found it a bit too unstable for comfort, even with the 4.2.4
upgrade. Even leaving aside the audio-complications you'll get with
phonon and gstreamer stuff.
My first question to the list is pretty easy. I think I want an
application that lets me 'pause' an audio track but holds onto
whatever it was playing at that time - in order to try to reverse
engineer the notes. I'm sure this isn't an uncommon thing, but
no idea what magic words to search for in feature lists. I could
possibly do it by zooming into a waveform and making my own
mini-loops, but this seems a very arduous approach.
cheers,
Jedd.
28 Jun
28 Jun
8:06 a.m.
On Sun, Jun 28, 2009 at 7:49 PM, jedd <jedd(a)progsoc.org> wrote:
Howdi,
New to list, relatively new to audio stuff, long time GNU/Linux user.
Backtraced the lists and saw some talk of KDE4. I got lumped with
this when Debian unstable pushed it out (4.2.2) a couple of months
back. I'd be wary of recommending anyone - with a working 3.5.x
system - to upgrade unless they really need something on 4.x I've
just found it a bit too unstable for comfort, even with the 4.2.4
upgrade. Even leaving aside the audio-complications you'll get with
phonon and gstreamer stuff.
Phonon generaly works better on top of libxine than gstreamer.... I am on
Kubuntu here and KDE4 Is working quite well - though amarok can be a bit of
a pig on the realtime kernel.
My first question to the list is pretty easy. I think
I want an
application that lets me 'pause' an audio track but holds onto
whatever it was playing at that time - in order to try to reverse
engineer the notes. I'm sure this isn't an uncommon thing, but
no idea what magic words to search for in feature lists. I could
possibly do it by zooming into a waveform and making my own
mini-loops, but this seems a very arduous approach.
The best tool of for doing that sort of thing that I can think of is sonic
visualizer.
You won't get your exact feature request (you do have have to set up your
own mini loop, but you can move the beginning and end of the loop in
realtime. You can also slow down the playback (without changing pitch). And
the melodic spectra overlay pretty much plots the interesting notes on a
pianoroll style scale for you.
cheers,
Jedd.
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8:29 a.m.
Hi Danny,
Phonon generaly works better on top of libxine than
gstreamer.... I
am on Kubuntu here and KDE4 Is working quite well - though amarok can
be a bit of a pig on the realtime kernel.
Ah, yeah - forgot to mention that I'd gotten a hint about using
the xine backend from a guy on the Debian-KDE list - it cured a bunch
of problems for me. I think a lot of distros give you gstreamer
backend by default, which is odd given the upstream problems are
seemingly well known.
I'm still not sure what I'm doing with alsa/jack/phonon (if I use
jack, I have to start it early, and reconfig amarok away from
alsa, but then I get pauses in audio playback - about 0.3s every
4s or so - and this is on a 2GB quad-core that's not doing a
heck of a lot!)
The best tool of for doing that sort of thing that I
can think of is
sonic visualizer.
Looks great - and GPL too (I'm always initially dubious if apt-cache
doesn't know about an application ;) Downloading it now - thanks
for the pointer.
Jedd.
8:29 a.m.
2009/6/28 jedd <jedd(a)progsoc.org>
Howdi,
New to list, relatively new to audio stuff, long time GNU/Linux user.
Backtraced the lists and saw some talk of KDE4. I got lumped with
this when Debian unstable pushed it out (4.2.2) a couple of months
back. I'd be wary of recommending anyone - with a working 3.5.x
system - to upgrade unless they really need something on 4.x I've
just found it a bit too unstable for comfort, even with the 4.2.4
upgrade. Even leaving aside the audio-complications you'll get with
phonon and gstreamer stuff.
My first question to the list is pretty easy. I think I want an
application that lets me 'pause' an audio track but holds onto
whatever it was playing at that time - in order to try to reverse
engineer the notes. I'm sure this isn't an uncommon thing, but
no idea what magic words to search for in feature lists. I could
possibly do it by zooming into a waveform and making my own
mini-loops, but this seems a very arduous approach.
cheers,
Jedd.
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Linux-audio-user(a)lists.linuxaudio.org
http://lists.linuxaudio.org/mailman/listinfo/linux-audio-user
KDE 4 is superior. Phonon + Xine (default) let's you use Jack as primary
device.
And aren't you looking for a variation of "repeat A-B()"?
8:40 a.m.
Hi Ray,
KDE 4 is superior. Phonon + Xine (default) let's
you use Jack as
primary device.
Yeah, it looks nicer (unless you're on a netbook) but I've simply
found it significantly less stable, with too many irritating bugs
hanging around in core apps.
I do understand that the direction they're heading means it's
going to be better - one day - and that the audio fundamentals
being re-engineered now are going to make a vast improvement
too.
As I mentioned in another post I just made, I'm still getting
weird performance issues using jack as my primary device,
and this is on a very grunty, and quite relaxed, machine.
And aren't you looking for a variation of
"repeat A-B()"?
Probably - though I'm not hip with the nomenclature yet. ;)
An interface where I could press a || style button that paused
advancement of the track but didn't pause the audio output, is
what I'm really after. In my old age I've become much more of
a 'give me a button' rather than 'give me a mechanism' kind of guy.
cheers,
Jedd.
8:50 a.m.
On Sun, Jun 28, 2009 at 3:40 AM, jedd<jedd(a)progsoc.org> wrote:
Hi Ray,
Audio is fundamentally incapable of freeze-framing the way a video
would. The characteristics of a sound are tied very strongly to
transients and overtones that get altered or created artificially by
looping. An fft based approach like sonic visualizer suggested above
is probably your best bet, but it still will have problems and will
have distortions / artifacts that could get in the way of
transcription.
KDE 4 is superior. Phonon + Xine (default)
let's you use Jack as
primary device.
Yeah, it looks nicer (unless you're on a netbook) but I've simply
found it significantly less stable, with too many irritating bugs
hanging around in core apps.
I do understand that the direction they're heading means it's
going to be better - one day - and that the audio fundamentals
being re-engineered now are going to make a vast improvement
too.
As I mentioned in another post I just made, I'm still getting
weird performance issues using jack as my primary device,
and this is on a very grunty, and quite relaxed, machine.
And aren't you looking for a variation of
"repeat A-B()"?
Probably - though I'm not hip with the nomenclature yet. ;)
An interface where I could press a || style button that paused
advancement of the track but didn't pause the audio output, is
what I'm really after. In my old age I've become much more of
a 'give me a button' rather than 'give me a mechanism' kind of guy.
cheers,
Jedd.
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Linux-audio-user mailing list
Linux-audio-user(a)lists.linuxaudio.org
http://lists.linuxaudio.org/mailman/listinfo/linux-audio-user
8:58 a.m.
2009/6/28 jedd <jedd(a)progsoc.org>
Hi Ray,
Free software works in strange ways..here on a 1.6GHz Core Duo (not even
Core 2 Duo) laptop the Phonon-JACK setup is rock-stable, such that I even
have JACK start with my non-realtime kernel and let it (together with ALSA
JACK plug) handle all sounds. I'm guessing it's a multicore issue. But if
that's really how it is on your setup, it's not very stable. Hard to
pinpoint, since hardware is a huge factor too.
Ahh, I was just making sure I understood your requirement. There isn't such
an app, but it's a worthwhile project to look into for anyone interested.
Let me just check again, you want to be able to pause a track which upon
that action will continue to play back the last sound it was playing?
KDE 4 is superior. Phonon + Xine (default)
let's you use Jack as
primary device.
Yeah, it looks nicer (unless you're on a netbook) but I've simply
found it significantly less stable, with too many irritating bugs
hanging around in core apps.
I do understand that the direction they're heading means it's
going to be better - one day - and that the audio fundamentals
being re-engineered now are going to make a vast improvement
too.
As I mentioned in another post I just made, I'm still getting
weird performance issues using jack as my primary device,
and this is on a very grunty, and quite relaxed, machine.
And aren't you looking for a variation of
"repeat A-B()"?
Probably - though I'm not hip with the nomenclature yet. ;)
An interface where I could press a || style button that paused
advancement of the track but didn't pause the audio output, is
what I'm really after. In my old age I've become much more of
a 'give me a button' rather than 'give me a mechanism' kind of guy.
cheers,
Jedd.
_______________________________________________
Linux-audio-user mailing list
Linux-audio-user(a)lists.linuxaudio.org
http://lists.linuxaudio.org/mailman/listinfo/linux-audio-user
9:46 a.m.
On Sun 2009-06-28, Ray Rashif wrote:
even Core 2 Duo) laptop the Phonon-JACK setup is
rock-stable, such
that I even have JACK start with my non-realtime kernel and let it
(together with ALSA JACK plug) handle all sounds. I'm guessing it's a
multicore issue.
Maybe I should start using my similarly powered laptop instead ;)
Ahh, I was just making sure I understood your
requirement. There
isn't such an app, but it's a worthwhile project to look into for
anyone interested. Let me just check again, you want to be able to
pause a track which upon that action will continue to play back the
last sound it was playing?
Yup - that's pretty much it. I've just been playing with sonic-
visualiser - looks like an astonishingly powerful bit of software, but
haven't quite got comfy with its interface yet. Its note-detector is
about as effective as every other note detector I played with on
that other OS.
But yes - basically it'd be a very mini-loop - presumably you'd have
that customisable, but default in the range of somewhere under 0.1s
Jedd.
11:30 a.m.
Mini Tutorial....
1) Open Sonic Visualizer
2) import audio file.
3) Layer->Melodic Range Spectrogram ->All Channels Mixed
( you should now be able see the notes quite clearly )
4) Click the "Constrain playback to selection" and "loop playback
buttons"
(top toolbar just after the main play/stop etc buttons.
5) choose the "select tool" (towards the end of the top toolbar.
6) you should now be able to visually select a note by dragging over it and
sonic visualiser will continually play that loop. If you want to listen to a
new set of notes - just select them... playback will automatically detect
the new loop.
you can use CTRL + page up and CTRL + page down to change the playback
speed.
Hope that helps.
12:17 p.m.
Perhaps a little handy tool with Pd? =p
load file
play file
while file plays, if paused, go to a userdefined time in the past, eg. 1 sec
set loop range from 1 sec in the past to last sample played back
play loop
resume playback of file when unpaused
12:18 p.m.
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1
jedd wrote:
http://rg42.org/_media/oss/jplay2/jplay2-20090628.tar.gz
It's a piece of code that I use(d) for various sound experiments.
After being partly merged into openmovieeditor it got lost in some
drawer.. but it can do 'scrubbing' and I just rolled a new release.
jplay2 -t -s -S 4800 <sound-file>
You can specify the scrub-loop-length in samples
(-S 4800 is 0.1s @ 48000)
With "-t" it plays sync to jack-transport. So you use qjackctl,
gjacktransport or even ardour, etc to control the play position and
play/pause the transport.
If you're looking for a graphical interface - try openmovieeditor with
JACK support. However the scrub-length there is not configurable.
robin
On Sun 2009-06-28, Ray Rashif wrote:
Ahh, I was
just making sure I understood your requirement. There
isn't such an app, but it's a worthwhile project to look into for
anyone interested. Let me just check again, you want to be able to
pause a track which upon that action will continue to play back the
last sound it was playing?
Yup - that's pretty much it. I've just been playing with sonic-
visualiser - looks like an astonishingly powerful bit of software, but
haven't quite got comfy with its interface yet. Its note-detector is
about as effective as every other note detector I played with on
that other OS.
But yes - basically it'd be a very mini-loop - presumably you'd have
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10 comments
5 participants
participants (5)
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jedd -
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Ray Rashif -
Robin Gareus