19 Mar
2009
19 Mar
'09
1:59 p.m.
Folk seeking notation alternatives my check this out!
http://www.noteflight.com
19 Mar
19 Mar
6:14 p.m.
David Baron wrote:
Folk seeking notation alternatives my check this out!
http://www.noteflight.com
Does it have a midi import feature? I am trying to help out a friend who
wants to be able to print out music that he has played on the keyboard
in notation form, partly as a way of learning notation for himself, and
partly as a way of communicating with other musicians who like to see
things in this form. (He is a good pianist but mostly self taught and
doesn't work in this way normally).
I've tried most of the programs available for linux, and none of them
really do what he wants. The main problems are that:
- he wants the scores in piano stave notation, with two staves, not just
on a single stave. This is quite difficult to get working from what I've
tried so far.
- the stuff he plays is quite dense and poly/multi/non/rhythmical, and
programs like lilypond that I've tried seem to get indigestion with it.
This might be a problem with rosegarden's lilypond export feature though.
Any help with this from you or anyone else on the list would be much
appreciated, as I've been trying to find something that works for over a
month now with no luck.
Cheers,
andy
6:32 p.m.
On Thursday 19 March 2009 23:13:33 andy baxter wrote:
David Baron wrote:
Go there and check it out. It apparently does MusixML and such. I do not know
its hard print capabilities. I just signed up, have not actually used it as of
yet.
Lilypond should work but try also mscore--can do the job but a bit unstable,
nted--upandcoming!, and newer frontend for lilipond if you want to markup for
that yourself, such as frescobaldi.
Folk seeking notation alternatives my check this
out!
http://www.noteflight.com
Does it have a midi import feature? I am trying to help out a friend who
wants to be able to print out music that he has played on the keyboard
in notation form, partly as a way of learning notation for himself, and
partly as a way of communicating with other musicians who like to see
things in this form. (He is a good pianist but mostly self taught and
doesn't work in this way normally).
I've tried most of the programs available for linux, and none of them
really do what he wants. The main problems are that:
- he wants the scores in piano stave notation, with two staves, not just
on a single stave. This is quite difficult to get working from what I've
tried so far.
- the stuff he plays is quite dense and poly/multi/non/rhythmical, and
programs like lilypond that I've tried seem to get indigestion with it.
This might be a problem with rosegarden's lilypond export feature though.
Any help with this from you or anyone else on the list would be much
appreciated, as I've been trying to find something that works for over a
month now with no luck.
7:23 p.m.
Lilypond should work but try also mscore--can do the job but a bit unstable,
nted--upandcoming!, and newer frontend for lilipond if you want to markup for
that yourself, such as frescobaldi.
Don't forget denemo.
Jeremiah
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8:06 p.m.
David Baron wrote:
On Thursday 19 March 2009 23:13:33 andy baxter wrote:
OK, I'll check it out.
I've tried various combinations of rosegarden (for recording the midi
file) and other programs, and not yet found one that works:
- mscore came close but didn't do piano staves and was very unstable.
- exporting to lilypond from rosegarden doesn't do piano staves (though
I worked out a hack to make it do so), but also truncated the file after
about 2 pages of score. This may be because the music was too complex
for it to recognise properly?
- noteedit didn't work (can't remember why)
- rosegarden plus nted was the best so far - the first two midi files we
tried worked perfectly on my computer with piano scores and everything,
but then when we tried it on his computer it didn't work (no piano
score). This might be fixable though.
- denemo just hung (for over 10 mins before I killed it) when I tried to
import the midi file.
andy
David Baron wrote:
Go there and check it out. It apparently does MusixML and such. I do not know
its hard print capabilities. I just signed up, have not actually used it as of
yet.
Lilypond should work but try also mscore--can do the job but a bit unstable,
nted--upandcoming!, and newer frontend for lilipond if you want to markup for
that yourself, such as frescobaldi.
Folk seeking notation alternatives my check this
out!
http://www.noteflight.com
Does it have a midi import feature? I am trying to help out a friend who
wants to be able to print out music that he has played on the keyboard
in notation form, partly as a way of learning notation for himself, and
partly as a way of communicating with other musicians who like to see
things in this form. (He is a good pianist but mostly self taught and
doesn't work in this way normally).
I've tried most of the programs available for linux, and none of them
really do what he wants. The main problems are that:
- he wants the scores in piano stave notation, with two staves, not just
on a single stave. This is quite difficult to get working from what I've
tried so far.
- the stuff he plays is quite dense and poly/multi/non/rhythmical, and
programs like lilypond that I've tried seem to get indigestion with it.
This might be a problem with rosegarden's lilypond export feature though.
Any help with this from you or anyone else on the list would be much
appreciated, as I've been trying to find something that works for over a
month now with no luck.
8:06 p.m.
On Thu, Mar 19, 2009 at 2:13 PM, andy baxter
<andy(a)earthsong.free-online.co.uk> wrote:
David Baron wrote:
For dense / polyrythmic / nonrythmic stuff, automatically generated
notation is going to be extremely unhelpful. Unless there have been
huge improvements in midi to score AI, the results are just going to
be messy.
Think about how much work the program would have to do, figuring out
if you are playing shorter notes, of if the tempo is increasing,
whether you just changed key signitures or are throwing in a bunch of
accidentals, etc. etc. Just like with image recognition, there are
many things that are immediately obvious to a human listener that
computers historically have much trouble with.
Folk seeking notation alternatives my check this
out!
http://www.noteflight.com
Does it have a midi import feature? I am trying to help out a friend who
wants to be able to print out music that he has played on the keyboard
in notation form, partly as a way of learning notation for himself, and
partly as a way of communicating with other musicians who like to see
things in this form. (He is a good pianist but mostly self taught and
doesn't work in this way normally).
I've tried most of the programs available for linux, and none of them
really do what he wants. The main problems are that:
- he wants the scores in piano stave notation, with two staves, not just
on a single stave. This is quite difficult to get working from what I've
tried so far.
- the stuff he plays is quite dense and poly/multi/non/rhythmical, and
programs like lilypond that I've tried seem to get indigestion with it.
This might be a problem with rosegarden's lilypond export feature though.
Any help with this from you or anyone else on the list would be much
appreciated, as I've been trying to find something that works for over a
month now with no luck.
Cheers,
andy
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Linux-audio-user mailing list
Linux-audio-user(a)lists.linuxaudio.org
http://lists.linuxaudio.org/mailman/listinfo/linux-audio-user
8:23 p.m.
Justin Smith wrote:
For dense / polyrythmic / nonrythmic stuff, automatically generated
notation is going to be extremely unhelpful. Unless there have been
huge improvements in midi to score AI, the results are just going to
be messy.
Think about how much work the program would have to do, figuring out
if you are playing shorter notes, of if the tempo is increasing,
whether you just changed key signitures or are throwing in a bunch of
accidentals, etc. etc. Just like with image recognition, there are
many things that are immediately obvious to a human listener that
computers historically have much trouble with.
_______________________________________________
Well I have warned him about this
but he seems to want to go ahead with
it anyway. His problem is as I've said he's self taught and doesn't
really like that way of working - I.e. composing stuff as score first
and then playing it - he prefers to do it all by ear, and the music he
plays is mostly improvised from session to session. He's managed fine so
far like this, but is finding that to get work and to work with other
musicians he needs to be able to write notation.
I did warn him at the start that the kind of notation produced by a
program wouldn't really represent his music properly, but even if he
just used it as a way of learning to write notation himself, it would
still be a help to him I think.
andy
20 Mar
20 Mar
3:22 a.m.
andy baxter wrote:
He's managed fine so
far like this, but is finding that to get work and to work with other
musicians he needs to be able to write notation.
Then he should learn to write notation.
The solution is surely not to have a program printing what he played,
esp as he can't even verify that it did it right.
There are many other benefits from learning to read:
* a new world of dynamics, articulations etc might open up.
* you can easily check out styles that are far from what you're used to
* you'll experience music theory as you play
Although many composition teachers tell you compositions should sound
improvised, I firmly believe that working a bit on the improvised
composition might make it work better as a composition.
--
Atte
http://atte.dk http://modlys.dk
3:40 a.m.
Atte André Jensen wrote:
andy baxter wrote:
OK, I'll pass on what you've said.
andy
He's managed fine so far like this, but is
finding that to get work
and to work with other musicians he needs to be able to write notation.
Then he should learn to write notation.
The solution is surely not to have a program printing what he played,
esp as he can't even verify that it did it right.
There are many other benefits from learning to read:
* a new world of dynamics, articulations etc might open up.
* you can easily check out styles that are far from what you're used to
* you'll experience music theory as you play
Although many composition teachers tell you compositions should sound
improvised, I firmly believe that working a bit on the improvised
composition might make it work better as a composition.
1:34 p.m.
>>>> "andy" == andy baxter
<andy(a)earthsong.free-online.co.uk> writes:
andy> David Baron wrote:
> Folk seeking notation alternatives my check this
out!
>
> http://www.noteflight.com
>
andy> Does it have a midi import feature?
I don't see one. Only xml input. Which will be fine when there start
being lots of programs that output it, and people figure out how to do
it. Right now, I don't know anyone who's sharing MusicXML
transcriptions.
Does anyone know a way to get MIDI into MusicXML?
Right now Lilypond has people working actively on MusicXML input, but
as far as I know, people are only talking about MusicXML output.
Everybody knows how bad MIDI is as a notation exchange format, but the
number of people really working on getting anything better is really
small.
--
Laura (mailto:lconrad@laymusic.org http://www.laymusic.org/ )
(617) 661-8097 233 Broadway, Cambridge, MA 02139
I suppose it can be said I'm an absent-minded driver. It's true that
I've driven through a number of red lights on occasion, but on the
other hand I've stopped at a lot of green ones but never gotten credit
for it.
Glenn Gould, quoted in "A Romance on Three Legs" by Katie Hafner
23 Mar
23 Mar
6:06 p.m.
Might I suggest the following: using KeyKit or some other midi monitor that
can capture without quantization, then take the intermediate step of parsing
the midi data by eye, and converting that to notation? I've found this to
work for me, when I'm woodshedding or improvising and really getting into it
and chance upon something I want to keep.
On Fri, Mar 20, 2009 at 9:30 AM, Laura Conrad <sunny(a)laymusic.org> wrote:
>>>> "andy" == andy baxter <andy(a)earthsong.free-online.co.uk>
writes:
andy> David Baron wrote:
> Folk seeking notation alternatives my check
this out!
>
> http://www.noteflight.com
>
andy> Does it have a midi import feature?
I don't see one. Only xml input. Which will be fine when there start
being lots of programs that output it, and people figure out how to do
it. Right now, I don't know anyone who's sharing MusicXML
transcriptions.
Does anyone know a way to get MIDI into MusicXML?
Right now Lilypond has people working actively on MusicXML input, but
as far as I know, people are only talking about MusicXML output.
Everybody knows how bad MIDI is as a notation exchange format, but the
number of people really working on getting anything better is really
small.
--
Laura (mailto:lconrad@laymusic.org http://www.laymusic.org/ )
(617) 661-8097 233 Broadway, Cambridge, MA 02139
I suppose it can be said I'm an absent-minded driver. It's true that
I've driven through a number of red lights on occasion, but on the
other hand I've stopped at a lot of green ones but never gotten credit
for it.
Glenn Gould, quoted in "A Romance on Three Legs" by Katie Hafner
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10 comments
7 participants
participants (7)
-
andy baxter -
Atte André Jensen -
David Baron -
Eric Steinberg -
Jeremiah Benham -
Justin Smith -
Laura Conrad