10 Dec
2010
10 Dec
'10
11:02 a.m.
Hi,
I was talking to a friend this morning about a project I thought we
could do together. He plays free improv piano/keyboard music - dense
patterns and textures improvised in live time. I was saying that in
principle it would be possible to record a piece of his music on a
keyboard as a midi stream, then feed it through a softsynth in a studio
and tweak the synth parameters as it's playing to produce the final piece.
He liked the idea, but I'm not sure if there's a linux softsynth that
would work like this. What it needs to do is:
- produce sounds from a midi stream in real time, with the sound altered
by tweaking various parameters (knobs and buttons).
- the tweaks should be recordable so that you can play them back and
re-tweak them until you get the result you want.
- the feature I really want is to be able to set presets for the
parameters and then fade between presets in real time. E.g. if there are
two presets which both use a resonant low pass filter, I want to be able
to move a single slider that moves the filter value from one to the
other continuously to create a filter sweep. This is different from a
fade at the audio stream level.
Does anyone know of anything like this?
cheers,
andy
10 Dec
10 Dec
11:25 a.m.
Hello Andy!
What kind of sound are you looking for in general? More of an analogue synth
sound, a real piano or what?
In general you can record a piece with rosegarden or any other of the big
MIDI sequencers. They would record knob and slider movements from a MIDI
keyboard, while it is played. You might also record some controller movements
in a seperate track and use them to control some kind of effect plugin, so
this would be in the audio domain, in the sense, that the effect (filter or
whateve) is an audio plugin and not part of the MIDI synth you use to generate
the sound.
For good pianos you might use LinuxSampler with one of the free grandpianos
(or a bought one). I think LinuxSampler also has a simple filter. For some of
the basic "effects" like filter, volume and portamento there are standard
controls. I think even for a simple volume ADSR, but I'm not sure LinuxSampler
reacts to them.
If you want to go synth, then the field is big. You have some DSSI plugins,
you have Bristol, which is nice, because you can attach a certain controller
on your keyboard to a certain parameter of the synth. There's Yoshimi which is
a purely waveform based synth. It specialises in lovely pads, choirs and the
like.
I think if your MIDI controls, used during the original performance, don't
correspond to the MIDI controls needed for your final synth tweaking, you
might be able to map them in a good MIDI sequencer or using some kind of MIDI
filter/mapper.
You really should be able to find the software you need on Linux. It only
depends on what you need exactly.
Kind regards
Julien
--------
Music was my first love and it will be my last (John Miles)
======== FIND MY WEB-PROJECT AT: ========
http://ltsb.sourceforge.net
the Linux TextBased Studio guide
======= AND MY PERSONAL PAGES AT: =======
http://www.juliencoder.de
2:09 p.m.
On 10/12/10 10:25, Julien Claassen wrote:
Hello Andy!
What kind of sound are you looking for in general? More of an
analogue synth sound, a real piano or what?
In general you can record a piece with rosegarden or any other of
the big MIDI sequencers. They would record knob and slider movements
from a MIDI keyboard, while it is played. You might also record some
controller movements in a seperate track and use them to control some
kind of effect plugin, so this would be in the audio domain, in the
sense, that the effect (filter or whateve) is an audio plugin and not
part of the MIDI synth you use to generate the sound.
For good pianos you might use LinuxSampler with one of the free
grandpianos (or a bought one). I think LinuxSampler also has a simple
filter. For some of the basic "effects" like filter, volume and
portamento there are standard controls. I think even for a simple
volume ADSR, but I'm not sure LinuxSampler reacts to them.
If you want to go synth, then the field is big. You have some DSSI
plugins, you have Bristol, which is nice, because you can attach a
certain controller on your keyboard to a certain parameter of the
synth. There's Yoshimi which is a purely waveform based synth. It
specialises in lovely pads, choirs and the like.
I think if your MIDI controls, used during the original performance,
don't correspond to the MIDI controls needed for your final synth
tweaking, you might be able to map them in a good MIDI sequencer or
using some kind of MIDI filter/mapper.
You really should be able to find the software you need on Linux. It
only depends on what you need exactly.
Kind regards
Julien
Hi julien,
Thanks for the advice.
I was thinking of a synthy sound, where the sound is generated from
oscillators and filters, rather than a wavetable based synth.
andy
2:23 p.m.
Em sexta-feira 10 dezembro 2010, às 11:09:10, andy baxter escreveu:
I was thinking of a synthy sound, where the sound is
generated from
oscillators and filters
i like htat one:
http://code.google.com/p/amsynth/
3:30 p.m.
On Fri, Dec 10, 2010 at 7:23 AM, Fabio <capoeirista(a)arcor.de> wrote:
i like htat one:
http://code.google.com/p/amsynth/
I had no idea that amsynth was still around! good to see that it is.
--
Josh Lawrence
"Highly esteem the Old, but take also a warm interest in the New. Be
not prejudiced against names unknown to you."
~Robert Schumann
3:34 p.m.
On 12/10/2010 03:30 PM, Josh Lawrence wrote:
I had no idea that amsynth was still around! good to
see that it is.
1.2.3 wasn't released that long ago and there's a 1.3 beta available
too. I like amSynth, simple, MIDI controllable and it can produce some
real dirty sounds.
Best,
Jeremy
3:47 p.m.
On Fri, Dec 10, 2010 at 5:34 PM, Jeremy Jongepier <jeremy(a)autostatic.com> wrote:
On 12/10/2010 03:30 PM, Josh Lawrence wrote:
And Jackmidi too. Impressive.
Alex.
--
www.openoctave.org
midi-subscribe(a)openoctave.org
development-subscribe(a)openoctave.org
I had no idea that amsynth was still around!
good to see that it is.
1.2.3 wasn't released that long ago and there's a 1.3 beta available
too. I like amSynth, simple, MIDI controllable and it can produce some
real dirty sounds.
Best,
Jeremy
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4:09 p.m.
lets not forget Bristol: http://bristol.sourceforge.net/
it was kinf of dificult (buggy?) to handel last time i used it though (long time)
Em sexta-feira 10 dezembro 2010, às 12:34:09, Jeremy Jongepier escreveu:
On 12/10/2010 03:30 PM, Josh Lawrence wrote:
I had no idea that amsynth was still around!
good to see that it is.
1.2.3 wasn't released that long ago and there's a 1.3 beta available
too. I like amSynth, simple, MIDI controllable and it can produce some
real dirty sounds.
Best,
Jeremy
_______________________________________________
Linux-audio-user mailing list
Linux-audio-user(a)lists.linuxaudio.org
http://lists.linuxaudio.org/listinfo/linux-audio-user
4:15 p.m.
I've just been checking out bristol and it looks really cool so far
apart from there are some glitches in the sound (which might not be
there if i used jackd and a real time kernel?)
'
On 10/12/10 15:09, Fabio wrote:
lets not forget Bristol:
http://bristol.sourceforge.net/
it was kinf of dificult (buggy?) to handel last time i used it though (long time)
Em sexta-feira 10 dezembro 2010, às 12:34:09, Jeremy Jongepier escreveu:
On 12/10/2010 03:30 PM, Josh Lawrence wrote:
_______________________________________________
Linux-audio-user mailing list
Linux-audio-user(a)lists.linuxaudio.org
http://lists.linuxaudio.org/listinfo/linux-audio-user
I had no idea that amsynth was still around!
good to see that it is.
1.2.3 wasn't released that long ago and there's a
1.3 beta available
too. I like amSynth, simple, MIDI controllable and it can produce some
real dirty sounds.
Best,
Jeremy
_______________________________________________
Linux-audio-user mailing list
Linux-audio-user(a)lists.linuxaudio.org
http://lists.linuxaudio.org/listinfo/linux-audio-user
4:23 p.m.
it always had some performance-issues. can't help though since its been a long time
ago i last used it
Em sexta-feira 10 dezembro 2010, às 13:15:00, andy baxter escreveu:
I've just been checking out bristol and it looks
really cool so far
apart from there are some glitches in the sound (which might not be
there if i used jackd and a real time kernel?)
'
On 10/12/10 15:09, Fabio wrote:
lets not forget Bristol:
http://bristol.sourceforge.net/
it was kinf of dificult (buggy?) to handel last time i used it though (long time)
Em sexta-feira 10 dezembro 2010, às 12:34:09, Jeremy Jongepier escreveu:
_______________________________________________
Linux-audio-user mailing list
Linux-audio-user(a)lists.linuxaudio.org
http://lists.linuxaudio.org/listinfo/linux-audio-user
On 12/10/2010 03:30 PM, Josh Lawrence wrote:
_______________________________________________
Linux-audio-user mailing list
Linux-audio-user(a)lists.linuxaudio.org
http://lists.linuxaudio.org/listinfo/linux-audio-user
I had no idea that amsynth was still around!
good to see that it is.
1.2.3 wasn't released that long ago and there's a
1.3 beta available
too. I like amSynth, simple, MIDI controllable and it can produce some
real dirty sounds.
Best,
Jeremy
_______________________________________________
Linux-audio-user mailing list
Linux-audio-user(a)lists.linuxaudio.org
http://lists.linuxaudio.org/listinfo/linux-audio-user
4:16 p.m.
On 10/12/10 13:23, Fabio wrote:
Em sexta-feira 10 dezembro 2010, às 11:09:10, andy
baxter escreveu:
Thanks - this one might be good to start with at least.
I was thinking of a synthy sound, where the sound
is generated from
oscillators and filters
i like htat one:
http://code.google.com/p/amsynth/
_ 
1:02 p.m.
On Fri, 2010-12-10 at 10:02 +0000, andy baxter wrote:
Hi,
I was talking to a friend this morning about a project I thought we
could do together. He plays free improv piano/keyboard music - dense
patterns and textures improvised in live time. I was saying that in
principle it would be possible to record a piece of his music on a
keyboard as a midi stream, then feed it through a softsynth in a studio
and tweak the synth parameters as it's playing to produce the final piece.
Hi Andy,
You probably want two separate programs: something to record the MIDI,
and a softsynth.
I'd probably use ardour 3 (beware of dragons) to record the MIDI data,
and any mix of synths to get the required sound.
Only problem might be if you used the synth's GUI to tweak sound
parameters; they wouldn't be recorded.
Peter.
1:08 p.m.
On Fri, Dec 10, 2010 at 7:02 AM, Peter Nelson <peter(a)fuzzle.org> wrote:
I'd probably use ardour 3 (beware of dragons) to
record the MIDI data,
and any mix of synths to get the required sound.
not sure this a great suggestion for a newcomer to "all this", but anyway ...
QTractor would probably be a better idea for the next couple of months.
Only problem might be if you used the synth's GUI
to tweak sound
parameters; they wouldn't be recorded.
not true in ardour3, which has full automation of all MIDI CC controls.
2:32 p.m.
On Fri, 2010-12-10 at 07:08 -0500, Paul Davis wrote:
On Fri, Dec 10, 2010 at 7:02 AM, Peter Nelson
<peter(a)fuzzle.org> wrote:
Yep, Qtractor should work just fine for the MIDI recording part of this.
For the synth part, I'd look at PHASEX (or the updated phasex-dev fork),
which has been discussed recently on the list. It can make some nice
sounds, but more importantly, it's very MIDI controllable -- you can
right-click on any control to map it to a MIDI CC very easily. If you
can send CC messages from knobs on your controller, and record them in
to Qtractor, you can program PHASEX to respond to them.
Thanks
Leigh
I'd probably use ardour 3 (beware of dragons)
to record the MIDI data,
and any mix of synths to get the required sound.
not sure this a great suggestion for a newcomer to "all this", but anyway ...
QTractor would probably be a better idea for the next couple of months. _______________________________________________
Linux-audio-user mailing list
Linux-audio-user(a)lists.linuxaudio.org
http://lists.linuxaudio.org/listinfo/linux-audio-user
5:13 p.m.
On 10/12/10 10:02, andy baxter wrote:
Hi,
I was talking to a friend this morning about a project I thought we
could do together. He plays free improv piano/keyboard music - dense
patterns and textures improvised in live time. I was saying that in
principle it would be possible to record a piece of his music on a
keyboard as a midi stream, then feed it through a softsynth in a
studio and tweak the synth parameters as it's playing to produce the
final piece.
He liked the idea, but I'm not sure if there's a linux softsynth that
would work like this. What it needs to do is:
- produce sounds from a midi stream in real time, with the sound
altered by tweaking various parameters (knobs and buttons).
- the tweaks should be recordable so that you can play them back and
re-tweak them until you get the result you want.
- the feature I really want is to be able to set presets for the
parameters and then fade between presets in real time. E.g. if there
are two presets which both use a resonant low pass filter, I want to
be able to move a single slider that moves the filter value from one
to the other continuously to create a filter sweep. This is different
from a fade at the audio stream level.
Thanks for all the replies so far.
Has anyone seen a program which does anything like what I've described
in the last item above? If not, I might have a go at writing my own in
supercollider or python. The idea would be that you could play with all
the parameters of a synth to get a sound you liked, tell the program to
record those settings as midi CC values, do the same again to get a
different sound, record those settings, and then be able to morph
between the two with a crossfade slider. Then for live performance you
would have a DJ like interface where you could load different patch
settings into either end of the crossfade, start with one and morph to
the other whilst playing, with the controllers all varying smoothly at
the same time to take you from one sound to the other.
thanks,
andy
6:17 p.m.
On Fri, Dec 10, 2010 at 04:12:56PM +0000, andy baxter wrote:
On 10/12/10 10:02, andy baxter wrote:
I used to use Seq24 for this. I'd record a part, just the notes, then I'd on a
separate track, overdub in my messing around with all the knobs and buttons, recorded via
MIDI CC's.
Was kind of useful for improv, since I'd have a few tracks of performance (notes) and
a few tracks of various parameter tweakages, and I could mix and match them
pseudo-randomly by muting/unmuting.
I also have had good luck with PHASEX for doing crazy synthy experimental sounding stuff.
I think with Seq224 and an array of linux softsynths with good MIDI control capabilities
(PHASEX, Amsynth, AMS, whatever), and a good MIDI controller with lots of buttons and
knobs, you could really get out there with experimental improv stuff.
-ken
Hi,
I was talking to a friend this morning about a project I thought we
could do together. He plays free improv piano/keyboard music - dense
patterns and textures improvised in live time. I was saying that in
principle it would be possible to record a piece of his music on a
keyboard as a midi stream, then feed it through a softsynth in a
studio and tweak the synth parameters as it's playing to produce the
final piece.
He liked the idea, but I'm not sure if there's a linux softsynth that
would work like this. What it needs to do is:
- produce sounds from a midi stream in real time, with the sound
altered by tweaking various parameters (knobs and buttons).
- the tweaks should be recordable so that you can play them back and
re-tweak them until you get the result you want.
- the feature I really want is to be able to set presets for the
parameters and then fade between presets in real time. E.g. if there
are two presets which both use a resonant low pass filter, I want to
be able to move a single slider that moves the filter value from one
to the other continuously to create a filter sweep. This is different
from a fade at the audio stream level.
Thanks for all the replies so far.
Has anyone seen a program which does anything like what I've described
in the last item above? If not, I might have a go at writing my own in
supercollider or python. The idea would be that you could play with all
the parameters of a synth to get a sound you liked, tell the program to
record those settings as midi CC values, do the same again to get a
different sound, record those settings, and then be able to morph
between the two with a crossfade slider. Then for live performance you
would have a DJ like interface where you could load different patch
settings into either end of the crossfade, start with one and morph to
the other whilst playing, with the controllers all varying smoothly at
the same time to take you from one sound to the other.
5050
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15 comments
10 participants
participants (10)
-
alex stone -
andy baxter -
Fabio -
Jeremy Jongepier -
Josh Lawrence -
Julien Claassen -
Ken Restivo -
Leigh Dyer -
Paul Davis -
Peter Nelson