Hans Fugal wrote: >I'm interested in rendering some organ works electronically. The first >step of course is to get the music in the computer, e.g. in MIDI >format. > >The piece I'm working on you can see at >http://www.xmission.com/~fugalh/in_dulci_jubilo.pdf > >I can play this piece well enough. I don't have a MIDI pedalboard but >the pedal line is easy enough to add later. But as you can see the >music is in multiple voices, and I would like to instrument each voice >differently. I have tried recording them one at a time, in an ensemble >style, but even when I follow a metronome it ends up sounding like >trash. I have decided that either I need to work on my ensemble >playing or I am going about it the wrong way. Maybe I should just

Hans, This may not be too helpful with your particluar needs, but all complete compositions I've recorded with MIDI have been done by necessity one voice at a time. With Jazz, Blues, and Rock the key is putting down the timekeeping track(s) first. For example, drums and rhythm instruments over which melody and color instrumets are added. This approach allows both good timing and good expression for anyone at all comfortable with automated programs that provide accompaniment for either practice or for building up a complete recording. I assume your timing is working well but expressiveness is lacking with the pieces you're trying to build. If that is so, then it's not a simple matter of getting more used to following the metronome, or quantizing after recording. One possibility would be to record under a duet situation where you get someone to play a critical timekeeping part on a keyboard or other instrument (guitar) acoustically while you record your first parts digitally. That way you'd have the ensemble feel, and also the creative interplay with another live musician, both of which should help you get the feel down that you'd like to have. Others with more experience or even a technological solution to offer will be more helpful, so good luck. Frank

Thanks for the input, I think I'm moving in the right direction at least. On Wed, 22 Dec 2004 18:35:56 -0500, John Check <j4strngs(a)bitless.net> wrote: Not usually, and I think that is primarily what's going on with my having a hard time laying it down ensemble-style.

I did something like this and so far it's the closest I've come to what I want. Perhaps I'll continue finessing this approach.

On one try, I step-recorded the top voice. I soon realized how poor a choice as a guide track it is, and I'm not really interested in step recording one of the middle voices. No auto quantization. It's not that things sound different from what I lay down, it's just that what I lay down doesn't sound as coherent as when it is all played at the same time. I imagine this is just a skill to develop.

I don't need or particularly care about notation or keeping the bars aligned - I'd be perfectly happy ditching the metronome and working in pure time, if that works well.

On Wed, Dec 22, 2004 at 12:20:58PM -0700, Hans Fugal wrote: --- --- --- For myself as a pianist, I have tried to use a metronome, and then quantization later to move separately recorded parts into sync with each other in time, but the result sounds very mechanical and unsatisfactory. Now I don't use a metronome at all. Instead, I create my own personalized, flexible and variable "metronome" by first recording a "scratch" track via MIDI of the entire piece in at least skeletal, rudimentary form, that I will later mute and eventually dispose of once the other individual voices and tracks are recorded. For that first track I play the entire piece without concern for absolute note-perfect performance. Instead I'm just trying to get the rhythm and "groove," interpretation and expression, the tempo and volume variations of the piece established. I begin the track with a "count off," striking one key of the digital-piano as a drummer would tap his sticks together to get all the performers into the same tempo before everyone begins to play the piece. Later, after I have recorded this crude but expressive scratch track, I record each of its parts individually into separate tracks, one at a time, by accompanying myself as I listen to the first "master" scratch track. It becomes like playing along with another musician instead of trying to follow a metronome, and it is much easier to get comfortable and "in sync" with the tempo, beat and interpretive nuances of one's own master track than with a sterile, overbearing metronome. Then, after all voices and tracks are recorded separately, I mute the first master/scratch track, do a little editing of the MIDI data of the remaining tracks, then play back all of the tracks except the first/master/scratch track and mix and record the digital-audio output. -Steve D Portales, NM US -- ---------------------------------------------------------------- Suppose you were an idiot. And suppose you were a member of Congress. But I repeat myself. -Mark Twain ----------------------------------------------------------------