hi fernando, thomas, list, thanks very much for your help, i feel like i may be getting close now but am still having problems... i did an apt get install on the new kernel set it asd default with GRUB when i do alsaconf i no longer get the insmod errrors but i do still get: [root@localhost robcanning]# /usr/sbin/alsaconf /usr/sbin/alsaconf: line 120: modinfo: command not found /usr/sbin/alsaconf: line 127: modinfo: command not found /usr/sbin/alsaconf: line 135: modinfo: command not found when i start alsasound [robcanning@localhost robcanning]$ /etc/rc.d/init.d/alsasound start ALSA driver already running Sound driver snd-hdsp is already loaded when i start alsamixer Card: Intel ICH5 ││ Chip: Analog Devices AD1985 ││ Item: Master and with the -c 1 argument [robcanning@localhost robcanning]$ /usr/bin/alsamixer -c 1 No mixer elems found my modules.conf file looks like this (i have commented out the oss stuff): # --- BEGIN: Generated by ALSACONF, do not edit. --- # --- ALSACONF verion 1.0.1 --- alias char-major-116 snd alias char-major-14 soundcore #alias sound-service-0-0 snd-mixer-oss #alias sound-service-0-1 snd-seq-oss #alias sound-service-0-3 snd-pcm-oss #alias sound-service-0-8 snd-seq-oss #alias sound-service-0-12 snd-pcm-oss alias snd-card-0ntitlntitled 1ntitled 1ed 1 snd-hdsp alias sound-slot-0 snd-intel8x0 # --- END: Generated by ALSACONF, do not edit. --- post-install sound-slot-0 /bin/aumix-minimal -f /etc/.aumixrc -L >/dev/null 2>&1 || : pre-remove sound-slot-0 /bin/aumix-minimal -f /etc/.aumixrc -S >/dev/null 2>&1 || : alias sound-slot-1 snd-hdsp post-install sound-slot-1 /bin/aumix-minimal -f /etc/.aumixrc -L >/dev/null 2>&1 || : pre-remove sound-slot-1 /bin/aumix-minimal -f /etc/.aumixrc -S >/dev/null 2>&1 || : # -- Keep modules from being autocleaned add options -k snd-card-0 when i run the audio software pd the Hamerfall is listed in its audio devices but when i change to it from the default (intel) it crashes with: input channels = 2, output channels = 2 alsa: changing output device to agree with input device device name hw:1; channels in 2, out 2 audio buffer set to 50 ALSA lib pcm_hw.c:1055:(snd_pcm_hw_open) open /dev/snd/pcmC1D0c failed: No such device snd_pcm_open (input): No such device ALSA lib pcm_hw.c:1055:(snd_pcm_hw_open) open /dev/snd/pcmC1D0p failed: No such device snd_pcm_open (output): No such device ALSA lib pcm_hw.c:494:(snd_pcm_hw_start) SNDRV_PCM_IOCTL_START failed: Bad file descriptor audio I/O stuck... closing audio ALSA lib pcm_hw.c:751:(snd_pcm_hw_close) close failed : Bad file descriptor snd_pcm_close (input): Bad file descriptor Segmentation fault [robcanning@localhost robcanning]$ pd_gui: pd process exited when i do a dmesg i see the lines ALSA ../../alsa-kernel/pci/rme9652/hdsp.c:5054: card initialization pending : waiting for firmware PCI: Setting latency timer of device 00:1f.5 to 64 intel8x0: clocking to 48000 the red Host light is permanantly on on the front of the card - it was never like this with a pcmcia card on windows - should that light turn off on linux with a pci card? thanks again, rob www.robcanning.utvinternet.com