Hello Dan! Thanks. Glad you mentioned the portamento, because that brings me onto one of the brilliant features of the Oddysey, that I used extensively over all the time I was there. It's duophonic. It has two oscillators and if you only play one note, it sounds like your average monophonic synth. But if you play two notes, the oscillators are split. So brilliant, because with one other mono synth - and there was a choice :-) - I could play full chords, moving melodies from one instrument to another, wile doing so. Sorry for the hardware rambling, but it was the only time, I ever came across such a feature. Warm regards Julien ---------------------------------------- http://juliencoder.de/nama/music.html

On Wed, 2013-02-13 at 11:34 -0500, Al Thompson wrote: I'm very comfortable even with the Oberheim Matrix-1000. When I used Atari's Cubase, with an integrated editor for the Matrix-1000, it was similar to an "original" old Oberheim with pots and knobs. Using the Matrix-1000 with Linux isn't very useful. OTOH, IIRC some presets already can be controlled without SysEx, but unfortunately the Linux app for the KORG nanoKONTROL isn't able to save and load settings, so IMO we've got a lack to use external gear with Linux. Might be something for Dave's request. My nanoKONTROL is set up to be used with some Yoshimi sounds, I guess I still have got some empty scenes. If I would buy an Oberheim, even another Matrix-1000, would depend to research for survival kits!

Folderol <folderol@...> writes: Umm... wow. "Pedestrian" ranks among one of the last words I would ever use for Bach's music. In grad school, I had a full-semester seminar on Bach's cantatas. I thought I knew Bach before that. I was wrong. I know, people have different tastes. I won't impose a taste in anyone else, but I will say, if I couldn't hear and understand what Bach was doing, my life would be poorer. hjh

Ralf Mardorf <ralf.mardorf@...> writes: Bach doesn't reach the heart? Are you mad? "Erbarme dich" from the St. Matthew's Passion? Well, what I was trying to say is that I deeply loved Bach's music before taking the seminar. After the seminar, I had inhaled the style much more deeply and my understanding of it jumped to a new level. Add to that the extra dimensions of baroque genres, their stylistic norms and the ways Bach toys with them, and it's like the hypothetical flatlander, living in two-dimensional space, suddenly experiencing three dimensions for the first time. Or like seeing Monet only in grayscale reproductions, and then seeing the paintings in color. This idea that knowledge of music -- its history, context, vocabulary, technique -- inevitably destroys the music -- it's pure nonsense, in the way physicists' awe of nature is qualitatively different from that of someone who doesn't know how completely insane matter is. When Bach pulls out a Neapolitan 6th, I feel it *more intensely* (not less) by knowing it's a Neapolitan 6th and further by knowing how N6 is commonly used in the genre. But I'm just lucky, I guess. hjh

On Thu, 2013-02-14 at 10:58 +0000, James Harkins wrote: "Things" are reaching the heart, that are close to own live experiences or close to a similar world view. You perhaps know more about Bach than I do ;), however http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Johann_Sebastian_Bach , he was had a sheltered, privileged life, something everybody should have, but the fewest have got that luck ;). He perhaps anyway likes the same flowers I like ;), but seemingly does share less of my world view. Without having knowledge of the biographies I noticed I like music, when my biography does share something with the composers biography, that has deep impact to my heart. I for example share something with Horowitz's psychopathology and his own compositions, or at least the way he's playing his ow compositions are close to my heart. There was a doko about Horowitz and he played some own compositions. Some people around him, I guess audio engineers, asked him what he was playing, because they didn't know this compositions. _I loudly replied to the television set_ "Can't you hear it? He's playing his own music!" Without knowing that it was his own music, without knowing that I share something of Horowitz's psychopathology. Horowitz replied _after_ I shouted to the television, that it's his own music, he not only is a pianist, but besides a musician. Our hearts are able to hear, if we really listen with our hearts. What is able to reach your heart and what not, has nothing to do with having a harder or less hard life, being a more or less ethical human please don't misinterpret it like this. It has to do with a balance of similarities and differences. It's not a topic about better or less good abilities, ethics etc.. You e.g. likely have a girlfriend that has some very special similarities and some very special differences to your biography, personality and for music it's the same. Hopefully music was your first love ;) and hopefully it will be your last ;). Regards, Ralf

On Thu, 2013-02-14 at 14:54 +0000, James Harkins wrote: I suspect that musicians are nearly unable to listen to music without being aware what each instrument plays individually and how they fit together. We lose the ability to listen to it as a whole, in the sense of two lines become one line. "The whole" in the sense of all instruments become one instrument still works. I've heard music from Bach, played by a few musicians, that I like, but I heard that some musicians supposedly should play Bach by very free interpretations on very special instruments.

Hello James! I do so agree with you, even without really taking the music apart. It is wonderful and at least one reason to go on living. :-) Warm regards Julien ---------------------------------------- http://juliencoder.de/nama/music.html

Hola Carlos! Thanks a lot, but the compliment about the playing is underserved. perhaps if you consider the awkward position I was in, arms stretched out to both sides, but even then... :-) Still glad you liked it. Let's see, if we can't get some more of this. :-) Warmly yours Julien ---------------------------------------- http://juliencoder.de/nama/music.html

On Thu, Feb 14, 2013 at 7:39 AM, Rustom Mody &lt;rustompmody(a)gmail.com&gt; wrote: as much of a lover of Bach's non-vocal works as I am, I'd like to point out that most definitions of music involve at least 3 components: rhythm melody harmony one might also timbre if you were in the right mood. Bach, like more or less everyone who is a part of the "western tradition", did some incredible things with harmony, and had some modest accomplishments in the melodic area (*), but did essentially nothing with rhythm. It is entirely possible to fully respect the incredible work of western composers while also acknowledging that "music" begins and ends in places far outside anywhere that they (or any other single musical culture) have ever explored. (*) contrast western notions of melody with that found in carnatic music, for example. one could argue that this is a matter of listener interpretation rather than compositional form, but since in practice these two are tightly bound together, it doesn't make a lot of difference when it comes to actual music.

On Thu, Feb 14, 2013 at 9:20 AM, Dave Phillips &lt;dlphillips(a)woh.rr.com&gt;wrote;wrote: it would be hard to play less :) Rhythm in Western music is not only the moment-to-moment movement of certainly. but then we probably need a different term for that, or some clear qualifiers. western music rarely uses polyrhythm, and even i have read that (even) bach rarely departs from a fairly monotonous grid, even on those odd occasions when things are not in 4. the fact that there can be a sweeping sense of time caused by varying tempo and emphasizing beat structure versus not doing so is wonderful, but you can do those things when playing polyrhythms and so forth too. i always thought of counterpoint as where harmony and melody collided and gave birth to beauty. no doubt, but does the left hand ever play in a non-integral relationship to the right hand? :) keeps me in touch with the common man ... precisely my point. nobody would listen to carnatic or african music for stunning displays of harmonic invention either, and celtic folk traditions, despite the incredible melodic ornamentation that it can display, is hardly known for rhythmic wizardry :)

Hmmm. It seems I poked a stick into a hornets nest. Possibly 'pedestrian' was the wrong word, maybe 'rigid' would be better (then again maybe not). For me, *personally*, the limited range of Bach I've heard, while sounding very impressive, doesn't flow or drift in a way that I would enjoy. I especially like loose timing (as much of my own music demonstrates) where you can hold a note, chord, expression almost to breaking point. If anyone is interested, I think a fair example of this is the introduction to the last part of "Ride With Yoshimi" from 4:48 to 6:03. From here to the end of the track is nominally in 6/8 timing, which this section totally ignores! -- Will J Godfrey http://www.musically.me.uk Say you have a poem and I have a tune. Exchange them and we can both have a poem, a tune, and a song.

On Thu, 14 Feb 2013 10:31:14 -0500 Dave Phillips &lt;dlphillips(a)woh.rr.com&gt; wrote: Well that was interesting. Much better than other pieces I've heard, but even so, hopping around YouTube I found that, almost without exception, I preferred her playing of work from other composers. -- Will J Godfrey http://www.musically.me.uk Say you have a poem and I have a tune. Exchange them and we can both have a poem, a tune, and a song.

Paul Davis <paul@...> writes: grid, even on those odd occasions when things are not in 4. I'm about to turn in for the night after a few glasses of Malbec (vacation is wonderful and necessary, no?) so I'm not up for a full treatise. But I do want to point out that vast amounts of Bach's output derive from the rhythms of Baroque court dances (same for most late Baroque composers, actually), and a good many of those dances are not in 4. Triple divisions of the beat and triple meters are not "odd occasions" in Bach, by any means. It is true that syncopation appears in baroque music in ways that are less flexible than 20th-century classical music, or jazz, not to mention the great breakbeat wizards from d'n'b and its offshoots. hjh

On Thu, Feb 14, 2013 at 10:20 AM, Dave Phillips &lt;dlphillips(a)woh.rr.com&gt;wrote;wrote: if line 1 and line 2 do not intersect in a harmonious way, is it still counterpoint? would anyone call it that?

On Thu, Feb 14, 2013 at 10:39 AM, Dave Phillips &lt;dlphillips(a)woh.rr.com&gt;wrote;wrote: i definitely meant the vertical sonority. it seems to me that two (or more) melodic lines that have no harmonic (vertical sonority-sense) relationship to each other do not form what people would call "counterpoint". and that is independent of whatever definition of "harmony" you might prefer. this is why i tend to think of it as the collision of the two disciplines, or more poetically, the entanglement.

On 02/14/2013 03:32 PM, Paul Davis wrote: except for the odd hemiola :) but if you listen to historically informed cembalo performances (or other instruments of the era, to various degrees, such as recorders), it's evident that the lack of dynamic range has led to a quite intricate timing of the music. if you can't accentuate stuff with loudness, you have to do so with tempo fluctuations, and that's where it gets interesting. so yes, looking at the score, you will see a fairly rigid grid of sixteenth notes mostly, but there is a lot in that music which is not evident in the score, partly because everybody assumed certain things to be too obvious to commit to paper. which is a problem if people keep playing your stuff after hundreds of years. -- Jörn Nettingsmeier Lortzingstr. 11, 45128 Essen, Tel. +49 177 7937487 Meister für Veranstaltungstechnik (Bühne/Studio) Tonmeister VDT http://stackingdwarves.net

On Thu, Feb 14, 2013 at 04:32:17PM +0100, Lorenzo Sutton wrote: Exactly the example I wanted to mention - but it has to be played right. For example <http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x1uFnc45wAE> which is also my preferred version (no chauvinism even if Herreweghe is Belgian :-) (and it's 3/4) Ciao, -- FA A world of exhaustive, reliable metadata would be an utopia. It's also a pipe-dream, founded on self-delusion, nerd hubris and hysterically inflated market opportunities. (Cory Doctorow)

On Thu, Feb 14, 2013 at 10:15 PM, Folderol &lt;folderol(a)ukfsn.org&gt; wrote: I wonder how much is the performer and how much the original composer-intention? eg Which do you think is more in tune(!) with Beethoven's intention? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zucBfXpCA6s or http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MZuSaudKc68

On 14/02/13 19:35, Fons Adriaensen wrote: I agree. Same goes for Mozart, especially symphonies - I simply can't stand it when conductors (voluntarily or not) can't keep the tempo. As for 'Romantic' music (but also 'Baroque') I think there is space for intelligent agogics - again what I think is important is the concept of 'beat' (more in the way ethnomusicologists intend it), that is.. the tempo may locally fluctuate, but the listener should have the sensation of a steady beat/flow... simple in theory hard to achieve in practice. Although not perfect this is one of my favourite interpretations of the Fifth (not to mention I love the conducting in general, the facial expressions, the way he addresses instruments..) - in my humble opinion tempo here is managed very well (and notice he is conducting by heart): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N6K_IuBsRM4 [...] When I listen to the Magnificat (but Bach in general) I can't stop myself from rhythmically fidgeting, sometimes with some 'armchair conducting', not to mention humming - which probably makes me look quite weird when on the metro :) Lorenzo.

Hi! YUes Rustom, thanks for the links, I enjoyed that. Warm regards Julien ---------------------------------------- http://juliencoder.de/nama/music.html

On Thu, 14 Feb 2013 13:40:53 -0500 drew Roberts &lt;zotz(a)100jamz.com&gt; wrote: Very enjoyable as a live performance, not so much as a recording. -- Will J Godfrey http://www.musically.me.uk Say you have a poem and I have a tune. Exchange them and we can both have a poem, a tune, and a song.

On Thu, 2013-02-14 at 18:09 +0530, Rustom Mody wrote: How does this happen? Did Mozart include some magic code that affects the brain or does the music cause some physical effects that train the ear? And what happens when listening to AC/DC? Does it activate something that makes people wearing shorts? And it's equal all over the planet, even for the Eastern world? Perhaps Beethoven lost hearing, regarding to the voodoo in his music? What is the dose to listen to Mozart, to cure learning disabilities? Music for sure is good to help people with learning disabilities, because making music is a good exercise for the brain. Listening to what music ever, is also good for most people, while learning, but this claims for sure are nonsense. The effect of different compositions depends to your personality.

Hello! I once heard, that the changes between loud and quiet sections in Mozart's music generally correspond to some rhythm in brain wave patterns. the timing is supposed to be right. But that was years and years ago, so I couldn't quote you an article. but I'm almost sure it was in connection with one of those experiments, where they took three groups, folding paper, cutting shapes into it and then have them imagine, what the final result would look like. I think they were tested on Mozart, Philip Glas and no music. Coming to the conclusion, that the Mozart group had the best results. I can't remember, how the remaining two groups were ranked. - Oh yes, they were all started together with no music, so that there was a way to compare them. Warmly yours Julien ---------------------------------------- http://juliencoder.de/nama/music.html

Hello Rustom! first thanks for your feedback, it's appreciated. But to your comment to Ralf's answer: it is sometimes better to make oneself love what one knows, should be loved. And this is the blind man talking: it seems to blind to me. You said sometimes, but still. There's is nothing absolute, we define things. and even in the goodness we define, there are differences. Bach - most of it - is not good for dancing. Old school rock 'n' roll might be good for dancing, but I don't see that much musical about it. No offense, I do sometimes listen to it. As to mozart: Pfui! :-) Warm regards Julien ---------------------------------------- http://juliencoder.de/nama/music.html