26 May
2009
26 May
'09
8:34 a.m.
Hi,
Ingen seems to be nice software and there are also other, let's say LV2
focusing, applications like zynadd and zynjacku.
They are in a way comparable with AMS, zynaddsubfx and Jack-Rack. The
nice thing about these (old) apps is that there are a lot of patches,
instruments, sound settings available, which makes it nice tools for the
Linux audio user.
My suggestion is to gather patches for Ingen (and maybe for the other
apps) from start, so this new software could also be user friendly as
possible, and I think sound/instrument patches are important for that.
Drobilla could you gather Ingen patches on your website? Or is there
another good way to share patches? Is someone interested in making some
nice sound/instrument patches?
Regards,
\r
26 May
26 May
8:54 a.m.
On Tue, 26 May 2009 12:34:05 +0200
Grammostola Rosea <rosea.grammostola(a)gmail.com> wrote:
Hi,
Ingen seems to be nice software and there are also other, let's say
LV2 focusing, applications like zynadd and zynjacku.
They are in a way comparable with AMS, zynaddsubfx and Jack-Rack.
The nice thing about these (old) apps is that there are a lot of
patches, instruments, sound settings available, which makes it nice
tools for the Linux audio user.
My suggestion is to gather patches for Ingen (and maybe for the other
apps) from start, so this new software could also be user friendly as
possible, and I think sound/instrument patches are important for that.
Drobilla could you gather Ingen patches on your website? Or is there
another good way to share patches? Is someone interested in making
some nice sound/instrument patches?
Regards,
\r
IMHO there'd need to be a release of ingen before any of this makes
sense. No, in general opinion public svn is not a release, most
distributions won't package it and I won't blame them, especially in
this case.
--PUE
8:58 a.m.
hollunder(a)gmx.at wrote:
On Tue, 26 May 2009 12:34:05 +0200
Grammostola Rosea <rosea.grammostola(a)gmail.com> wrote:
Ok, but then you have an release without patches... Wouldn't be an
release with patches much better?
\r
Hi,
Ingen seems to be nice software and there are also other, let's say
LV2 focusing, applications like zynadd and zynjacku.
They are in a way comparable with AMS, zynaddsubfx and Jack-Rack.
The nice thing about these (old) apps is that there are a lot of
patches, instruments, sound settings available, which makes it nice
tools for the Linux audio user.
My suggestion is to gather patches for Ingen (and maybe for the other
apps) from start, so this new software could also be user friendly as
possible, and I think sound/instrument patches are important for that.
Drobilla could you gather Ingen patches on your website? Or is there
another good way to share patches? Is someone interested in making
some nice sound/instrument patches?
Regards,
\r
IMHO there'd need to be a release of ingen before any of this makes
sense. No, in general opinion public svn is not a release, most
distributions won't package it and I won't blame them, especially in
this case.
9:13 a.m.
Hallo,
Grammostola Rosea hat gesagt: // Grammostola Rosea wrote:
Ok, but then you have an release without patches...
Wouldn't be an
release with patches much better?
It depends. With Pure Data I prefer app releases without the thousands of
patches and externals available, as I already have these and just need the new
Pd version. I like that e.g. pure:dyne packages patches and the main Pd
software separately. That could be a model for Ingen, too.
Ciao
--
Frank
9:09 a.m.
On Tue, 2009-05-26 at 12:34 +0200, Grammostola Rosea wrote:
My suggestion is to gather patches for Ingen (and
maybe for the other
apps) from start, so this new software could also be user friendly as
possible, and I think sound/instrument patches are important for that.
What Ingen needs most right now is testing, I guess. If useful example
patches are created while doing so, fine, but it shouldn't be the focus.
For building a serious collection of patches, there should be a stable
base, first. In other words, a release.
--
Thorsten Wilms
thorwil's design for free software:
http://thorwil.wordpress.com/
27 May
27 May
12:27 a.m.
On Tue, May 26, 2009 at 01:09:02PM +0200, Thorsten Wilms wrote:
On Tue, 2009-05-26 at 12:34 +0200, Grammostola Rosea
wrote:
Maybe ask Dave?
I've gotten the impression from reading Dave's comments on IRC over the past few
years that he really doesn't want to make releases at all, or to have users, even.
Ingen/Patchage seems more to me like a personal fun project than a user-friendly
"product" and packaging it up for people to install via RPM's or DEB's.
All that said, I've been using GIT lately and I love it. It's very natural to do
distributed development with it. It apparently is possible for GIT to pull from an SVN
feed and create a GIT repository, and sync up with it. Perhaps someone would like to
create a "fork" (I use that word with great caution, but I don't want to use
euphemisms either), of Ingen/Patchage, via a Git repository available online, where people
can create patches to make the thing more packageable and do testing on it and bugfixes
and such, then of course Dave can pick and choose what changes/patches he'd want to
include in his SVN branch.
I'd willing to host such a repo, if it would be helpful. Ingen/Patchage is very cool
software with a great UI, and shows lots of promise. But for Ingen to be more widely used
it'd need a maintainer (or group of maintainers) who wants it to be widely used and
has the time/interest to do the work required to make it that way (i.e. making releases,
dealing with distro maintainers, keeping up the documentation, etc.).
Again, sorry about the flame-bait factor, but I hope that some kind of compromise can be
found to package and finish Ingen/Patchage without doing any violence to Dave's vision
(or his code!), or making too many demands on his time.
-ken
My suggestion is to gather patches for Ingen (and
maybe for the other
apps) from start, so this new software could also be user friendly as
possible, and I think sound/instrument patches are important for that.
What Ingen needs most right now is testing, I guess. If useful example
patches are created while doing so, fine, but it shouldn't be the focus.
For building a serious collection of patches, there should be a stable
base, first. In other words, a release.
6 a.m.
On Tue, 2009-05-26 at 19:26 -0700, Ken Restivo wrote:
I've gotten the impression from reading Dave's
comments on IRC over the
past few years that he really doesn't want to make releases at all, or
to have users, even. Ingen/Patchage seems more to me like a personal
fun project than a user-friendly "product" and packaging it up for
people to install via RPM's or DEB's.
Well, making releases is no fun. Especially not if you are a
perfectionist and always find issues that you don't want to push on
users.
There have been many deep changes, entire rewrites, each pushing Ingen
away from a releasable state for a while.
Add to that the huge time cost for working on Ardour MIDI and LV2.
I can tell you from work on the GUI that Dave does care about users
other than himself.
Perhaps someone would like to create a
"fork" (I
use that word with great caution, but I don't want to use euphemisms
either), of Ingen/Patchage, via a Git repository available online,
where people can create patches to make the thing more packageable and
do testing on it and bugfixes and such, then of course Dave can pick
and choose what changes/patches he'd want to include in his SVN
branch.
I'd willing to host such a repo, if it would be helpful. Ingen/Patchage
is very cool software with a great UI, and shows lots of promise. But
for Ingen to be more widely used it'd need a maintainer (or group of
maintainers) who wants it to be widely used and has the time/interest
to do the work required to make it that way (i.e. making releases,
dealing with distro maintainers, keeping up the documentation, etc.).
A fork is not a good approach. Having a release manager and packagers
and people who can do some user support to take all that off Dave's
shoulders would be great, I think. Branch yes, fork no.
--
Thorsten Wilms
thorwil's design for free software:
http://thorwil.wordpress.com/
2:08 p.m.
On Tue, 2009-05-26 at 19:26 -0700, Ken Restivo wrote:
Maybe ask Dave?
So I had a chat with Dave.
Note that he's not subscribed to this list!
He asked me to paste the following:
"The file format is not necessarily stable right now, which is why there
is no release. It is not wise to put a lot of effort into patch
creation right now. This is my top priority, and as soon as it is, a
release will happen (this summer some time)"
What /is/ definitely needed is TESTING, and bug reports:
http://dev.drobilla.net/newticket?component=ingen
--
Thorsten Wilms
thorwil's design for free software:
http://thorwil.wordpress.com/
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linux-audio-user@lists.linuxaudio.org
7 comments
5 participants
participants (5)
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Frank Barknecht -
Grammostola Rosea -
hollunder＠gmx.at -
Ken Restivo -
Thorsten Wilms