2 Mar
2010
2 Mar
'10
6:11 p.m.
Hello, from users' perspective, what are currently the options for
minimum session handling? I'd just like for a starter to have multiple
sets of connections and be able to save and load them.
Is there any documentation on at least one way of doing this? Couldn't
find any
Is patchage capable of doing this? What exactly does the "save
positions" menu entry do?
In second order, what may we expect from the near future in terms of
more advanced session handling (lash, ladi)? Are they
(lash/ladi) currently usable and used? (Certainly they lack
documentation)
Renato
2 Mar
2 Mar
7:06 p.m.
Hi list,
To be more precise than Renato, and just for my little use if you please
(maybe someone else should benefit ?) :
I use Rosegarden to play & edit MIDI files,
thru this cheap USB keyboard,
with almost the same sounds from Fluidsynth,
drums goes to Tapeutape,
Linuxsampler for piano,
Brixton for keyboards,
--and always search for digital horns and strings,
everything is recorded in Ardour,
with real sounds from bass, guits and voices,
and of course you've understood Jack is making all this possible. (Hum,
hope you have, or please tell what you're doin' here baby)))
That said, how can WE (Renato & I, & everyone of us) be able to save
time on patching all this greats apps together ?
Please, please, please (hey, that remembers a wonderful pop song, ain't
it ?)
don't take this words as a blame, and consider the most important part is
"all this greats apps", and the most hoping part is sharing YOUR knowledge,
when you reply to this Renato's mail.
Many thanks for all of us searching like Renato and me, cause I know that
you surely know what is loosing feeling between patchcords....
Of course, there's a great probability than someone answer "xxxx", that was
just under our eyes since ages, but we never seen it, AND YOU KNOW WHAT ?
Once again we will be proud to be idiots in the past, and to became less
idiots
just because of community sharing. So, thank you Folks !
Fred
Renato a écrit :
Hello, from users' perspective, what are currently
the options for
minimum session handling? I'd just like for a starter to have multiple
sets of connections and be able to save and load them.
Is there any documentation on at least one way of doing this? Couldn't
find any
Is patchage capable of doing this? What exactly does the "save
positions" menu entry do?
In second order, what may we expect from the near future in terms of
more advanced session handling (lash, ladi)? Are they
(lash/ladi) currently usable and used? (Certainly they lack
documentation)
Renato
_______________________________________________
Linux-audio-user mailing list
Linux-audio-user(a)lists.linuxaudio.org
http://lists.linuxaudio.org/listinfo/linux-audio-user
7:46 p.m.
I use the patchbay functionality in qjackctl to automatically connect
my (different, but equally complex) set of apps. It handles both JACK
audio and ALSA MIDI connections flawlessly.
On 3/2/10, fred <f.rech(a)yahoo.fr> wrote:
Hi list,
To be more precise than Renato, and just for my little use if you please
(maybe someone else should benefit ?) :
I use Rosegarden to play & edit MIDI files,
thru this cheap USB keyboard,
with almost the same sounds from Fluidsynth,
drums goes to Tapeutape,
Linuxsampler for piano,
Brixton for keyboards,
--and always search for digital horns and strings,
everything is recorded in Ardour,
with real sounds from bass, guits and voices,
and of course you've understood Jack is making all this possible. (Hum,
hope you have, or please tell what you're doin' here baby)))
That said, how can WE (Renato & I, & everyone of us) be able to save
time on patching all this greats apps together ?
Please, please, please (hey, that remembers a wonderful pop song, ain't
it ?)
don't take this words as a blame, and consider the most important part is
"all this greats apps", and the most hoping part is sharing YOUR knowledge,
when you reply to this Renato's mail.
Many thanks for all of us searching like Renato and me, cause I know that
you surely know what is loosing feeling between patchcords....
Of course, there's a great probability than someone answer "xxxx", that
was
just under our eyes since ages, but we never seen it, AND YOU KNOW WHAT ?
Once again we will be proud to be idiots in the past, and to became less
idiots
just because of community sharing. So, thank you Folks !
Fred
Renato a écrit :
Hello, from users' perspective, what are
currently the options for
minimum session handling? I'd just like for a starter to have multiple
sets of connections and be able to save and load them.
Is there any documentation on at least one way of doing this? Couldn't
find any
Is patchage capable of doing this? What exactly does the "save
positions" menu entry do?
In second order, what may we expect from the near future in terms of
more advanced session handling (lash, ladi)? Are they
(lash/ladi) currently usable and used? (Certainly they lack
documentation)
Renato
_______________________________________________
Linux-audio-user mailing list
Linux-audio-user(a)lists.linuxaudio.org
http://lists.linuxaudio.org/listinfo/linux-audio-user
3 Mar
3 Mar
4:58 a.m.
The Musix 2.0 distro includes a number of demos that you can select from
the desktop menu. The demos start up JACK, Zyn with various instrument
settings, Hydrogen with various settings, etc, followed by RG. When you
hit play in RG's transport, everything plays.
How they set it up, I don't know. But it demonstrates some power to
automate session handling.
fred wrote:
Hi list,
To be more precise than Renato, and just for my little use if you please
(maybe someone else should benefit ?) :
I use Rosegarden to play & edit MIDI files,
thru this cheap USB keyboard,
with almost the same sounds from Fluidsynth,
drums goes to Tapeutape,
Linuxsampler for piano,
Brixton for keyboards,
--and always search for digital horns and strings,
everything is recorded in Ardour,
with real sounds from bass, guits and voices,
and of course you've understood Jack is making all this possible. (Hum,
hope you have, or please tell what you're doin' here baby)))
That said, how can WE (Renato & I, & everyone of us) be able to save
time on patching all this greats apps together ?
Please, please, please (hey, that remembers a wonderful pop song, ain't
it ?)
don't take this words as a blame, and consider the most important part is
"all this greats apps", and the most hoping part is sharing YOUR knowledge,
when you reply to this Renato's mail.
Many thanks for all of us searching like Renato and me, cause I know that
you surely know what is loosing feeling between patchcords....
Of course, there's a great probability than someone answer "xxxx", that
was
just under our eyes since ages, but we never seen it, AND YOU KNOW WHAT ?
Once again we will be proud to be idiots in the past, and to became less
idiots
just because of community sharing. So, thank you Folks !
Fred
Renato a écrit :
> Hello, from users' perspective, what are currently the options for
> minimum session handling? I'd just like for a starter to have multiple
> sets of connections and be able to save and load them.
> Is there any documentation on at least one way of doing this? Couldn't
> find any
> Is patchage capable of doing this? What exactly does the "save
> positions" menu entry do?
>
> In second order, what may we expect from the near future in terms of
> more advanced session handling (lash, ladi)? Are they
> (lash/ladi) currently usable and used? (Certainly they lack
> documentation)
--
David
gnome(a)hawaii.rr.com
authenticity, honesty, community
2 Mar
2 Mar
7:52 p.m.
On Tue, 2 Mar 2010, Renato wrote:
Hello, from users' perspective, what are currently
the options for
minimum session handling? I'd just like for a starter to have multiple
LASH is considered obsolete. LADI is under active
development and has seen limited adoption. There are
current talks of adding a session management infrastructure
to the JACK API. This is currently in the "heated
discussion" phase. :-)
Currently, for guys that need to get work done, the major
methods are:
1. custom-written bash scripts for your setup.
2. LADI
3. qjackctl has a cool patchbay feature that
handles most of my needs. You set up some
basic connections/rules, and whenever some
ports appear that match your rules it
will connect them.
In second order, what may we expect from the near
future in terms of
more advanced session handling (lash, ladi)? Are they
(lash/ladi) currently usable and used? (Certainly they lack
documentation)
Future:
LASH is dead. Other than that, it still remains to be seen.
LADI is popular with quite a few devs, but because it uses
DBUS for IPC it has met with a lot of criticism from other
devs. At the moment, it looks favorable that JACK will
provide some basic infrastructure... but that's still
pending. There are also some other independent efforts here
and there. :-)
Hope this helps!
-gabriel
10:14 p.m.
Just some notes:
1. custom-written bash scripts for your setup.
a good beginner tutorial that covers this can be found here:
http://digitaldub.wordpress.com/2009/12/16/linux-audio-session-scripting/
for more advanced examples, the folks at openoctave have kindly made
their scripts available here:
http://www.openoctave.org/downloads/ooscripts
2. LADI
Personal experience from having installed the 0.2 preview release is
mixed. Certainly the functionality is great, and having a complex
setup load at a couple of clicks and populate the gladish graph is a
buzz. It takes some initial setting up in terms of having to specify
the full commands for apps with their respective file arguments, but
once that's done the session loads fine. I've found that jack-dbus
stops responding sometimes, though. That is, if I boot the machine,
but don't run a studio, then attempt to load a studio and run it after
the machine has been on for an extended period, the dbus doesn't seem
to respond. I have to kill the process and restart it. It may be just
my setup.
At the moment , ladish is my preferred session management. That might
change soon, as I'm heading more toward a headless networked approach
for which dbus is not suited it seems. I'll probably move towards
scripting in this case.
3. qjackctl has a cool patchbay feature that
handles most of my needs. You set up some
basic connections/rules, and whenever some
ports appear that match your rules it
will connect them.
Admittedly I gave up a couple of major versions ago, but I could never
seem to get this to do anything meaningful. It seemed a convoluted
process of creating ports only to create a snapshot that would never
match up to the way I had my session arranged. I suspect it has
improved.
As a general note and question, does anyone know if there is a general
way to disable autoconnection? I know some apps have this as a
setting, like Ardour, but many do not. It seems that session
management and autoconnection are not necessarily synergistic. I
recall reading somewhere there was a CLI option to disable client
autoconnect clients in JACK2 but I can't seem to find where I read
that. Any ideas?
-m
3 Mar
3 Mar
1:59 p.m.
On Tue, 2 Mar 2010 23:12:42 +0100
Renato <rennabh(a)gmail.com> wrote:
Hello, from users' perspective, what are currently
the options for
minimum session handling? I'd just like for a starter to have multiple
sets of connections and be able to save and load them.
Is there any documentation on at least one way of doing this? Couldn't
find any
Is patchage capable of doing this? What exactly does the "save
positions" menu entry do?
In second order, what may we expect from the near future in terms of
more advanced session handling (lash, ladi)? Are they
(lash/ladi) currently usable and used? (Certainly they lack
documentation)
Renato
Thanks to all who have responded, I now have qjackctl's patchbay and
jack_snapshot + bash scripts to look into. Didn't know of any of them,
so it's been useful asking.
I read the discussion on LAD from some months ago on LADI and I
understand the problem is still hot. In now way I want to start a flame
war, I just want to shed some light on this subject, especially from
user's perspective. Especially I'd like to understand where and how
would our feedback be most valuable.
As far as I can understand LADI is, for technical reasons, not
"approved" by all devs, i.e. many think it's design is sort of rushed
and not as efficient/elegant/good as it could/should be, and because of
this it will never be rock solid.
It seems that a more definitive solution would need a partial rewriting
of JACK itself.
OTOH the only active development that is being made to solve this whole
session management problem is on LADI. It seems that there is no one
with enough knowledge, time and interest to work out the more
definitive solution.
As i wrote them, these two paragraphs above seem pretty incongruent to
me (couldn't people working on LADI invest their time in a more
definitive and "approved by all" solution?) so either I missed some
points (situation which I'd be happy to acknowledge), either the
incongruence is really there (less happy).
I realize no one has definitive answers, but at least I'd like to
understand if LADI has at least the possibility of a future and if it's
worth my time to test, report bugs etc.
waiting for some light
Renato
2:40 p.m.
On Tue, 2 Mar 2010 23:12:42 +0100
Renato<rennabh(a)gmail.com> wrote:
The problem is not a lack of knowledge. Nedko and the other LADI
contributors have written over 60,000 lines of code and counting.
However, the solution they are working does not fit everyones vision for
the best way to handle the requirements for session management.
That by itself is not a problem for everyone as the people whose
requirements are not being met by LADI are more than capable of creating
their own session management systems.
IMO the real problem is that we have too many options for session
management. That means normal users are left scratching their heads to
figure out the best way to manage their sessions. From a desktop Linux
POV this is a big drawback but from a Linux Audio POV it is just
business as usual.
Patrick Shirkey
Boost Hardware Ltd
Hello, from users' perspective, what are
currently the options for
minimum session handling? I'd just like for a starter to have multiple
sets of connections and be able to save and load them.
Is there any documentation on at least one way of doing this? Couldn't
find any
Is patchage capable of doing this? What exactly does the "save
positions" menu entry do?
In second order, what may we expect from the near future in terms of
more advanced session handling (lash, ladi)? Are they
(lash/ladi) currently usable and used? (Certainly they lack
documentation)
Renato
Thanks to all who have responded, I now have qjackctl's patchbay and
jack_snapshot + bash scripts to look into. Didn't know of any of them,
so it's been useful asking.
I read the discussion on LAD from some months ago on LADI and I
understand the problem is still hot. In now way I want to start a flame
war, I just want to shed some light on this subject, especially from
user's perspective. Especially I'd like to understand where and how
would our feedback be most valuable.
As far as I can understand LADI is, for technical reasons, not
"approved" by all devs, i.e. many think it's design is sort of rushed
and not as efficient/elegant/good as it could/should be, and because of
this it will never be rock solid.
It seems that a more definitive solution would need a partial rewriting
of JACK itself.
OTOH the only active development that is being made to solve this whole
session management problem is on LADI. It seems that there is no one
with enough knowledge, time and interest to work out the more
definitive solution.
As i wrote them, these two paragraphs above seem
pretty incongruent to
me (couldn't people working on LADI invest their time in a more
definitive and "approved by all" solution?) so either I missed some
points (situation which I'd be happy to acknowledge), either the
incongruence is really there (less happy).
I realize no one has definitive answers, but at least I'd like to
understand if LADI has at least the possibility of a future and if it's
worth my time to test, report bugs etc.
waiting for some light
Renato
_______________________________________________
Linux-audio-user mailing list
Linux-audio-user(a)lists.linuxaudio.org
http://lists.linuxaudio.org/listinfo/linux-audio-user
4:27 p.m.
On Thu, 04 Mar 2010 05:40:38 +1100
Patrick Shirkey <pshirkey(a)boosthardware.com> wrote:
The problem is not a lack of knowledge. Nedko and the
other LADI
contributors have written over 60,000 lines of code and counting.
However, the solution they are working does not fit everyones vision
for the best way to handle the requirements for session management.
The fact that they need more then 60k sloc is imho a signal that it's
going in the wrong direction. (yes, even counting the gui etc)
Much of this is personal preference, but in cases like this I take a
simple textbased application over a (bloated) GUI-tool.
Anyway i'm as new to the subject as the threadstarters, but something
like jack_snapshot appeals much more to me. (you can edit the textfiles
afterwards, you can "inspect" them, you can craft your own, etc)
how does ladish save it's session files? are they as easy to hack as
those of jack_snapshot?
Dieter
4 Mar
4 Mar
4:01 a.m.
On 04/03/2010, Dieter Plaetinck <dieter(a)plaetinck.be> wrote:
The fact that they need more then 60k sloc is imho a
signal that it's
going in the wrong direction. (yes, even counting the gui etc)
Much of this is personal preference, but in cases like this I take a
simple textbased application over a (bloated) GUI-tool.
That should not be a problem if and when the session manager is
working seamlessly behind the scenes.
--
GPG/PGP ID: B42DDCAD
4:05 a.m.
On 04/03/2010, Dieter Plaetinck<dieter(a)plaetinck.be> wrote:
60k is hardly bloat when you look at the amount of work and
functionality that has been achieved with LADI so far.
Patrick Shirkey
Boost Hardware Ltd
The fact that they need more then 60k sloc is
imho a signal that it's
going in the wrong direction. (yes, even counting the gui etc)
Much of this is personal preference, but in cases like this I take a
simple textbased application over a (bloated) GUI-tool.
That should not be a problem if and when the session manager is
working seamlessly behind the scenes.
3 Mar
3 Mar
6:16 p.m.
On Wed, Mar 3, 2010 at 1:01 PM, Renato <rennabh(a)gmail.com> wrote:
It seems that a more definitive solution would need a
partial rewriting
of JACK itself.
you're on the wrong mailing list :)
OTOH the only active development that is being made to
solve this whole
session management problem is on LADI.
not so. the has been very active discussion and even more active
coding in the jack community, particularly by torben, in the very
recent past (right up until now, in fact).
--p
5 Mar
5 Mar
2:39 a.m.
On Wed, Mar 03, 2010 at 05:16:38PM -0500, Paul Davis wrote:
On Wed, Mar 3, 2010 at 1:01 PM, Renato
<rennabh(a)gmail.com> wrote:
the patch for jack1 and tschack is mostly done.
maybe a few small kinks.
working on jack2 fries my brain a bit, so this patch
might take a little longer.
patches for seq24 and jack-rack are functional.
but dont have conditional compilation yet.
i have patches for the ardours, oom and fst which use an old version
of the API but i can change them to the current one within minutes.
there is a python session manager which can be used as a commandline
tool, or as daemon with a very simple dbus api.
jsweeper is the only app that has support for this api yet.
building a tray app should be no problem.
--
torben Hohn
It seems that a more definitive solution would
need a partial rewriting
of JACK itself.
you're on the wrong mailing list :)
OTOH the only active development that is being
made to solve this whole
session management problem is on LADI.
not so. the has been very active discussion and even more active
coding in the jack community, particularly by torben, in the very
recent past (right up until now, in fact).
5191
days inactive
5194
days old
linux-audio-user@lists.linuxaudio.org
12 comments
11 participants
participants (11)
-
david -
Dieter Plaetinck -
fred -
Gabriel M. Beddingfield -
michael noble -
micromoog -
Patrick Shirkey -
Paul Davis -
Ray Rashif -
Renato -
torbenh