16 Apr
2017
16 Apr
'17
2:02 a.m.
Finally installed a new system, Linux Mint 18, based on Ubuntu. I am
not sure therefore I ask, it seems there are two parallel versions of
jack being developed or in the least,m there are two of them out there
which could, or could not be candidate for installation, possibly known
as jackd and jackd2. If there's only one, then all right. In any case,
which jackd should be installed on a 2017 brand new 64-bit system ?
Thanks.
16 Apr
16 Apr
3:20 a.m.
Hi,
Well you really can't go wrong either way, JACK2 has kind of been the
primary offering by big-name distros more out of the blind assumption
that jack '2' was a successor rather than a parallel version with
multiple processor support. The only caution really is that JACK1
offers built-in bridging between ALSA and JACK MIDI and if you need
this with JACK2 you will need to additionally install 'a2jmidid'. Hold
on...the only other thing I can think of is that if you use BitWIg
(which if I'm not mistaken you do) it's packaging for Linux improperly
specifies JACK2 as a dependency even though it really works with both,
it just won't install if JACK2 isn't present on the system... come to
think of it then I guess you'll be wanting JACK2 then...
----- Original Message -----
From: "jonetsu" <jonetsu(a)teksavvy.com>
To:"linux-audio-user" <linux-audio-user(a)lists.linuxaudio.org>
Cc:
Sent:Sat, 15 Apr 2017 20:01:58 -0400
Subject:[LAU] Which jackd to install on a new system ?
Finally installed a new system, Linux Mint 18, based on Ubuntu. I am
not sure therefore I ask, it seems there are two parallel versions of
jack being developed or in the least,m there are two of them out
there
which could, or could not be candidate for installation, possibly
known
as jackd and jackd2. If there's only one, then all right. In any
case,
which jackd should be installed on a 2017 brand new 64-bit system ?
Thanks.
_______________________________________________
Linux-audio-user mailing list
Linux-audio-user(a)lists.linuxaudio.org
http://lists.linuxaudio.org/listinfo/linux-audio-user
4 a.m.
On Sat, 15 Apr 2017 18:19:58 -0700
"Glen MacArthur" <info(a)bandshed.net> wrote:
Hi Glen,
Hold on...the only other thing I can think of is that
if you use
BitWIg (which if I'm not mistaken you do) it's packaging for Linux
improperly specifies JACK2 as a dependency even though it really
works with both, it just won't install if JACK2 isn't present on the
system... come to think of it then I guess you'll be wanting JACK2
then...
Great! That settles it then.
I will not ask why there are two, if not three versions of jackd, I
promise I will not ask.
Cheers.
4:14 a.m.
On Sat, 15 Apr 2017 18:19:58 -0700
"Glen MacArthur" <info(a)bandshed.net> wrote:
it just won't install if JACK2 isn't present
on the system... come to
think of it then I guess you'll be wanting JACK2 then...
While this is set and Bitwig installed all right, Mixbus32C gives a
warning that sounds not so good, so I declined the installation for
now:
"Mixbus32C was compiled with gcc4, your system uses a newer version of
the standard c++ library. Plugins on your system may not load or
plugin-UIs may cause crashes."
What is this about exactly and, is the net result at use time as
dramatic as it sounds ? Should I forget about using the new system
until an updated build of Mixbus32C is provided ?
5:05 a.m.
Hmmm OK,this is a little complicated for a layman to explain but here
goes...
If I'm not mistaken (I don't use Ubuntu or Mint) Linux Mint 18 is
based on Ubuntu 16.04, Ubuntu 16.04 uses gcc 5 as its default
compiler, that means all the graphical desktop stuff in Mint 18 was
compiled with gcc 5, The issue at hand is that gcc 5 introduced some
important ABI changes over it's predecessor gcc 4.9 and some of these
changes mean that a small number of plugins that have their UI's
graphical (and underlying related components) compiled with gcc 4.9
won't work in a DAW compiled with gcc 5 or a DAW compiled on a system
with gcc 5 as the default compiler. Ardour and Mixbus developers have
long known about this so they have created Ardour and Mixbus versions
for both gcc 4.9 and gcc 5 systems. Your warning is coming from the
fact that when you are installing Mixbus 32C it is the gcc 4 version
and it is detecting that Linux Mint 18 uses gcc 5 and therefore gives
you the warning. I also use Mixbus 32C and there should be a gcc 5
version on the download page, if not... I'm certain emailing
Harrison support will accomodate you with a gcc 5 build.
But you're not out of the woods yet... Now you have your OS and DAW
both using gcc 5 you are not immune from all potential problems.
Certain plugins within the Ubuntu repositories may be old and not
compiled with gcc 5 yet, these can also cause problems as well. For
the best experience with repository plugins in Ubuntu and Mint it is
recommended to use the KXStudio repositories which have have more up
to date versions of almost ALL repository plugins and a special gcc 5
repository for systems using Ubuntu 16.04 and up. As a final note it
seems most external commercial plugins (OverToneDSP, U-he,Illformed
etc.) are not affected by these problems.
KX Studio repositories are here:
http://kxstudio.linuxaudio.org/Repositories
Hope that helps, Glen
----- Original Message -----
From: "jonetsu" <jonetsu(a)teksavvy.com>
To:"linux-audio-user" <linux-audio-user(a)lists.linuxaudio.org>
Cc:
Sent:Sat, 15 Apr 2017 22:14:40 -0400
Subject:Re: [LAU] Which jackd to install on a new system ?
On Sat, 15 Apr 2017 18:19:58 -0700
"Glen MacArthur" <info(a)bandshed.net> wrote:
it just won't install if JACK2 isn't present
on the system... come
to
think of it then I guess you'll be wanting JACK2
then...
While this is set and Bitwig installed all right, Mixbus32C gives a
warning that sounds not so good, so I declined the installation for
now:
"Mixbus32C was compiled with gcc4, your system uses a newer version
of
the standard c++ library. Plugins on your system may not load or
plugin-UIs may cause crashes."
What is this about exactly and, is the net result at use time as
dramatic as it sounds ? Should I forget about using the new system
until an updated build of Mixbus32C is provided ?
_______________________________________________
Linux-audio-user mailing list
Linux-audio-user(a)lists.linuxaudio.org
http://lists.linuxaudio.org/listinfo/linux-audio-user
9:38 a.m.
To slightly expand/correct on what Glen said:
the gcc4/5 issue ONLY affects plugins written in C++ that use some specific
parts of the C++ standard libraries. The runtime interface for some of
these functions changed between g++ 4 and g++ 5, and both the host and the
plugin need to have been built with the same version of g++.
Plugins written in C (or other languages), and plugins written in C++ which
manage to avoid using these parts of the standard libraries are not
affected.
And yes, before you ask, there is effectively no way to determine whether a
plugin is affected without being the person who compiles the plugin.
On Sun, Apr 16, 2017 at 4:05 AM, Glen MacArthur <info(a)bandshed.net> wrote:
Hmmm OK,this is a little complicated for a layman to
explain but here
goes...
If I'm not mistaken (I don't use Ubuntu or Mint) Linux Mint 18 is based on
Ubuntu 16.04, Ubuntu 16.04 uses gcc 5 as its default compiler, that means
all the graphical desktop stuff in Mint 18 was compiled with gcc 5, The
issue at hand is that gcc 5 introduced some important ABI changes over it's
predecessor gcc 4.9 and some of these changes mean that a small number of
plugins that have their UI's graphical (and underlying related components)
compiled with gcc 4.9 won't work in a DAW compiled with gcc 5 or a DAW
compiled on a system with gcc 5 as the default compiler. Ardour and Mixbus
developers have long known about this so they have created Ardour and
Mixbus versions for both gcc 4.9 and gcc 5 systems. Your warning is coming
from the fact that when you are installing Mixbus 32C it is the gcc 4
version and it is detecting that Linux Mint 18 uses gcc 5 and therefore
gives you the warning. I also use Mixbus 32C and there should be a gcc 5
version on the download page, if not... I'm certain emailing Harrison
support will accomodate you with a gcc 5 build.
But you're not out of the woods yet... Now you have your OS and DAW both
using gcc 5 you are not immune from all potential problems. Certain plugins
within the Ubuntu repositories may be old and not compiled with gcc 5 yet,
these can also cause problems as well. For the best experience with
repository plugins in Ubuntu and Mint it is recommended to use the KXStudio
repositories which have have more up to date versions of almost ALL
repository plugins and a special gcc 5 repository for systems using Ubuntu
16.04 and up. As a final note it seems most external commercial plugins
(OverToneDSP, U-he,Illformed etc.) are not affected by these problems.
KX Studio repositories are here: http://kxstudio.linuxaudio.
org/Repositories
Hope that helps, Glen
----- Original Message -----
From:
"jonetsu" <jonetsu(a)teksavvy.com>
To:
"linux-audio-user" <linux-audio-user(a)lists.linuxaudio.org>
Cc:
Sent:
Sat, 15 Apr 2017 22:14:40 -0400
Subject:
Re: [LAU] Which jackd to install on a new system ?
On Sat, 15 Apr 2017 18:19:58 -0700
"Glen MacArthur" <info(a)bandshed.net> wrote:
it just won't install if JACK2 isn't
present on the system... come to
think of it then I guess you'll be wanting JACK2 then...
While this is set and Bitwig installed all right, Mixbus32C gives a
warning that sounds not so good, so I declined the installation for
now:
"Mixbus32C was compiled with gcc4, your system uses a newer version of
the standard c++ library. Plugins on your system may not load or
plugin-UIs may cause crashes."
What is this about exactly and, is the net result at use time as
dramatic as it sounds ? Should I forget about using the new system
until an updated build of Mixbus32C is provided ?
_______________________________________________
Linux-audio-user mailing list
Linux-audio-user(a)lists.linuxaudio.org
http://lists.linuxaudio.org/listinfo/linux-audio-user
_______________________________________________
Linux-audio-user mailing list
Linux-audio-user(a)lists.linuxaudio.org
http://lists.linuxaudio.org/listinfo/linux-audio-user
5:52 p.m.
On Sat, 15 Apr 2017 20:05:45 -0700
"Glen MacArthur" <info(a)bandshed.net> wrote:
you the warning. I also use Mixbus 32C and there
should be a gcc 5
version on the download page, if not... I'm certain emailing
Harrison support will accomodate you with a gcc 5 build.
All right. I plowed through the emails and found the one about
downloading Mixbus32C in which it offers the gcc5 version. So that got
installed. Mixbus32C starts fine now, I very briefly clicked on a
couple of plugins: they show up.
However, in the previous system there was a use of a ~/.jackdrc file
that 'some process' would read at boot and automatically start jackd
with the file in that .jackdrc file, which was:
/usr/bin/jackd --sync -T -P80 -ndefault -dalsa -dhw:M1010LT -r44100
-p256 -n4
This does not happen in the new system. No jackd is launched
automatically at boot. No init hook was seemingly installed as part of
the jackd2 installation (Linux Mint 18, so that would be Ubuntu-like).
Which process is responsible to checking this out and starting jackd
automatically ?
For the time being I start jackd manually using the line above. The I
start Mixbus32 and as soon as Mixbus32C starts, the following happens,
shown in the last few lines (the others provided for context)
[...]
JACK server starting in realtime mode with priority 80
self-connect-mode is "Don't restrict self connect requests"
audio_reservation_init
Acquire audio card Audio1
creating alsa driver ...
hw:M1010LT|hw:M1010LT|256|4|44100|0|0|nomon|swmeter|-|32bit
configuring for 44100Hz, period = 256 frames (5.8 ms), buffer = 4
periods
ALSA: final selected sample format for capture: 32bit integer
little-endian
ALSA: use 4 periods for capture
ALSA: final selected sample format for playback: 32bit integer
little-endian
ALSA: use 4 periods for playback
(Now starting Mixbus32C)
JackTemporaryException : now quits...
Jack main caught signal 2
Released audio card Audio1
audio_reservation_finish
Starting Mixbus32C kills jackd.
So basically, how to start jackd automatically and, what's this thing
with Mixbus32C provoking jackd to terminate ?
Thanks !
17 Apr
17 Apr
12:04 a.m.
On Sun, 16 Apr 2017, jonetsu wrote:
However, in the previous system there was a use of a
~/.jackdrc file
that 'some process' would read at boot and automatically start jackd
with the file in that .jackdrc file, which was:
That would not be stock. There are two ways you may have done that.
Set qjackctl to start at session start in your DE.
Install Cadence from kxstudio whic will set itself up to run at session
start. The second is probably the easiest road.
--
Len Ovens
www.ovenwerks.net
12:25 a.m.
On Sun, 16 Apr 2017 15:04:22 -0700 (PDT), Len Ovens wrote:
On Sun, 16 Apr 2017, jonetsu wrote:
To avoid misunderstandings. QjackCtl writes .jackdrc, but doesn't read
it to start jack. The values used to start jack are stored
in .config/rncbc.org/QjackCtl.conf.
Regards,
Ralf
However, in the previous system there was a use
of a ~/.jackdrc file
that 'some process' would read at boot and automatically start jackd
with the file in that .jackdrc file, which was:
That would not be stock. There are two ways you may have done that.
Set qjackctl to start at session start in your DE.
12:31 a.m.
PS: To use this file for auto-start, it's possible to launch
sh .jackdrc
instead of auto-starting QjackCtl, which is using another file to
configure jack.
1:46 a.m.
On Sun, 16 Apr 2017 15:04:22 -0700 (PDT)
Len Ovens <len(a)ovenwerks.net> wrote:
On Sun, 16 Apr 2017, jonetsu wrote:
Found it. I use the jack sink module in the original system so that
every audio just works with the 1010LT output, Bitwig, Mixbus, vlc,
firefox, opera, etc...
jackd is started by ricochet when pulseaudio loads module-jack-sink
and module-jack-source. It will then look at ~/.jackdrc. The
following lines are added to /etc/pulse/default.pa to enable the use of
the jack sink and source for pulseaudio:
load-module module-jack-sink
load-module module-jack-source
Removing those lines and rebooting will not have jackd automatically
running, I checked it.
However, in the previous system there was a use
of a ~/.jackdrc file
that 'some process' would read at boot and automatically start jackd
with the file in that .jackdrc file, which was:
That would not be stock. There are two ways you may have done that.
Set qjackctl to start at session start in your DE.
Install Cadence from kxstudio whic will set itself up to run at
session start. The second is probably the easiest road.
4:54 a.m.
On Sun, 16 Apr 2017, jonetsu wrote:
Found it. I use the jack sink module in the original
system so that
every audio just works with the 1010LT output, Bitwig, Mixbus, vlc,
firefox, opera, etc...
jackd is started by ricochet when pulseaudio loads module-jack-sink
and module-jack-source. It will then look at ~/.jackdrc. The
following lines are added to /etc/pulse/default.pa to enable the use of
the jack sink and source for pulseaudio:
load-module module-jack-sink
load-module module-jack-source
Removing those lines and rebooting will not have jackd automatically
running, I checked it.
I had not thought of that one. I normally think of pulse and jackdbus
rather than jackd, but this makes sense in the way you describe it. That
should work with jackd1 or 2 I think.
--
Len Ovens
www.ovenwerks.net
5:20 p.m.
On Sun, 16 Apr 2017 19:54:39 -0700 (PDT)
Len Ovens <len(a)ovenwerks.net> wrote:
I had not thought of that one. I normally think of
pulse and jackdbus
rather than jackd, but this makes sense in the way you describe it.
That should work with jackd1 or 2 I think.
For that matter, jackdbus is also launched by this configuration.
16 Apr
16 Apr
2:52 p.m.
On Sat, 15 Apr 2017 22:14:40 -0400
jonetsu <jonetsu(a)teksavvy.com> wrote:
On Sat, 15 Apr 2017 18:19:58 -0700
While this is set and Bitwig installed all right, Mixbus32C gives a
warning that sounds not so good, so I declined the installation for
now:
"Mixbus32C was compiled with gcc4, your system uses a newer version of
the standard c++ library. Plugins on your system may not load or
plugin-UIs may cause crashes."
What is this about exactly and, is the net result at use time as
dramatic as it sounds ? Should I forget about using the new system
until an updated build of Mixbus32C is provided ?
Mixbus offers a gcc5 build, which is what you want to download and install
for your particular installation.
--
======================================================================
Joe Hartley - UNIX/network Consultant - jh(a)brainiac.com
Without deviation from the norm, "progress" is not possible. - FZappa
5:15 p.m.
On Sat, 15 Apr 2017, jonetsu wrote:
On Sat, 15 Apr 2017 18:19:58 -0700
"Glen MacArthur" <info(a)bandshed.net> wrote:
You should be able to get mixbus32c in both gcc4 and gcc5+ versions
--
Len Ovens
www.ovenwerks.net
it just won't install if JACK2 isn't
present on the system... come to
think of it then I guess you'll be wanting JACK2 then...
While this is set and Bitwig installed all right, Mixbus32C gives a
warning that sounds not so good, so I declined the installation for
now:
"Mixbus32C was compiled with gcc4, your system uses a newer version of
the standard c++ library. Plugins on your system may not load or
plugin-UIs may cause crashes." 
10:32 a.m.
On 04/16/2017 03:19 AM, Glen MacArthur wrote:
The only caution really is that JACK1
offers built-in bridging between ALSA and JACK MIDI and if you need
this with JACK2 you will need to additionally install 'a2jmidid'.
Jack2 has this bridging too with the alsarawmidi driver. a2jmidid works
better though because it can export any MIDI endpoint, afaik the
alsarawmidi only exposes the hardware endpoints.
Jeremy
5:10 p.m.
On Sun, 16 Apr 2017 10:32:12 +0200, Jeremy Jongepier wrote:
Jack2 has this bridging too with the alsarawmidi
driver. a2jmidid works
better though because it can export any MIDI endpoint, afaik the
alsarawmidi only exposes the hardware endpoints.
In the past I used "-Xalsarawmidi" a lot to reduce MIDI jitter, when
sending MIDI events to external MIDI equipment. IIRC it required to run
"a2jmidid -e" in addition to be able to connect everything with anything
else.
I suspect at the moment this is stored by Ardour5:
[rocketmouse@archlinux ~]$ cat .jackdrc
/usr/bin/jackd -t 200 -p 2048 -R -T -X alsarawmidi -d alsa -n 2 -r 44100 -p 128 -d
hw:HDSPMx579bcc,0 -X alsarawmidi
I wonder what the "-Xalsarawmidi" behind "-d alsa" is good for, I
always used it just one time before "-d alsa". However, I don't know if
Ardour5 does launch a2jmidi, I'll check this next time I run Ardour5. I
didn't launch a2jmidi manually, but didn't notice an issue connecting
anything.
[rocketmouse@archlinux ~]$ man jackd | grep alsaraw
[rocketmouse@archlinux ~]$ jackd --help | grep alsaraw -B10
no message buffer overruns
no message buffer overruns
no message buffer overruns
-d master-backend-name [ ... master-backend args ... ]
jackdmp -d master-backend-name --help
to display options for each master backend
Available backends:
loopback (slave)
firewire (master)
netone (master)
net (master)
dummy (master)
alsarawmidi (slave)
[rocketmouse@archlinux ~]$ pacman -Q jack2
jack2 1.9.10.r261.g2d1d3235-1
Happy holidays!
Ralf
5:12 p.m.
On Sat, 15 Apr 2017, jonetsu wrote:
Finally installed a new system, Linux Mint 18, based
on Ubuntu. I am
not sure therefore I ask, it seems there are two parallel versions of
jack being developed or in the least,m there are two of them out there
which could, or could not be candidate for installation, possibly known
as jackd and jackd2. If there's only one, then all right. In any case,
which jackd should be installed on a 2017 brand new 64-bit system ?
There have been in the debian package setup (therefore in Ubuntu as well)
a large number of packages the depend on jackd 1.9 or higher making jackd2
the only real choice. I am not sure if this is still the case or if the
depends have been changed to jackd2 | jackd1. So it seems to depand on
which jackd aware packages you wish to install. The best way around this
that I have heard is to install everything with jackd2 and then manually,
without reference to depends, switch from one to the other (remove and
then install).
That does not address any of the differences between the two. There are
people who advocate very strongly for jackd1 and in fact development has
been more active there. Jackd2 is dbus aware so it can take an audio
device away from pulse and pulse can auto connect a pulse-jack bridge if
so configured. A pulse-jack bridge can be connected to jackd1 as well, but
it would have to be done manually (this can as easliy be a plus as a
minus).
In all, as you seem to have already figured out, it is a mess and there is
no firm answer. The easy way with any debian based distro is to just use
jackd2 and everything will work. jackd1 can be made to work there too, but
it takes more know how.
I am wishing for a jackd3 that makes jackd1 and 2 obsolete.
I personally use jackd2 because "thats what came in the box".
--
Len Ovens
www.ovenwerks.net
2780
days inactive
2781
days old
linux-audio-user@lists.linuxaudio.org
18 comments
7 participants
participants (7)
-
Glen MacArthur -
Jeremy Jongepier -
Joe Hartley -
jonetsu -
Len Ovens -
Paul Davis -
Ralf Mardorf