Hello all, I was a Smartmusic (http://www.smartmusic.com) user until that program stopped working with wine. For those of you who don't know it, it is a program that basically downloads finale files (score + accompaniment) from a centralized server for musical instrument practice. When you play along it uses either MIDI input or a microphone to rate your perfomance (which notes you played in tune, and so on). As far as I know, there is no native Linux or open source alternative. My questions are: Do you think it would be hard to code a plugin for musescore (http://www.musescore.org) to do the same pitch detection and comparison with the score? Or maybe would it be better to fork the code and make a stand-alone app, keeping it as compatible as posible? Any experience with pitch to midi? aubio (http://www.aubio.org) could be an option, but I haven't tried it. I think the music repository part could be addressed later... I don't have much time right now, but I'd like to ponder the posibility of working on it in the future. Maybe start experimenting in the meanwhile.

Just an idea, Greetigs, Camilo _______________________________________________ Linux-audio-dev mailing list Linux-audio-dev(a)lists.linuxaudio.org http://lists.linuxaudio.org/listinfo/linux-audio-dev

maybe http://pianobooster.sourceforge.net/ is what you want ?

Le Wed, 10 Nov 2010 13:36:21 -0300, Camilo Polymeris <cpolymeris(a)gmail.com> a écrit : For me, a stand alone pitch detection application would be better : audio in -> pitch detect -> midi out You plug the instrument into the audio in, connect the midi out to any midi in in qjackctl, and it is just to play some melody. Ciao, Dominique

On November 10, 2010 03:40:01 pm Dominique Michel wrote: I too am interested in pitch detection -> midi. I want to make a polyphonic guitar to midi converter plugin. I've done it before as a standalone app in Windows. But my question is which linux plugin architectures support audio in + midi out? I'm thinking DSSI, but the midi out would have to be an OSC control stream, am I correct? Tim.

>> For me, a stand alone pitch detection application would be better : >> >> audio in -> pitch detect -> midi out >> >> You plug the instrument into the audio in, connect the midi out to >> any midi in in qjackctl, and it is just to play some melody. >> >> Ciao, >> Dominique >> > > There is aubionotes (http://aubio.org/aubionotes.html), which claims > to do exactly what you want. Don't know how well, though. I am > trying to connect it to PianoBooster, to see if that could be a > solution. WaoN could also be an option, I'll try that next. > Eventually, I'd like an integrated app. > > Greetings, > Camilo >

Ok. If someone is interested: I can report that aubionotes works quite well for the samples I tried (brass mostly, all monophonic). WaoN is similar, maybe even better, but doesn't work realtime, it handles pre-recorded samples, only.

On November 11, 2010 11:06:10 pm Dominique Michel wrote: Exactly. I was going to start a thread asking about this. Mind if I pitch in? Difference between lowest note on a guitar and next note is very small, requiring large number of FFT bins. (If you play a flute, you're lucky.) You can put a crappy time domain style pitch shifter ahead of the converter to reduce this. (A good freq domain PS may have more latency.) It's fun. With practice a normal guitar becomes a piano etc... I've seen polyphonic products advertised claiming zero or near zero latency. How do they do it?

I've used FFT, but when told of this delay problem, my friend keeps telling me no, use Laplace transforms. When I studied them (looong ago), I could not fully understand how to apply the knowledge. Is there a Laplace library out there?

Wavelets? I studied those as well, but my meagre brain could not cement.

To catch the higher notes first, how about n FFTs with n samplers driven by n separate even-tempered clocks, where n is the desired number of notes? For ex. 3 octaves, 36 FFTs. I forget why, but I think that didn't work out. I think the pesky relation giving the delay kept getting in the way. You increase the sample rate and you just end up increasing the delay because you need more freq bins for the same given resolution. The delay is really governed by the smallest difference in notes you want to detect. In guitar's case, I found it just passes as acceptable. Tim.

On Fri, 2010-11-12 at 18:32 +0100, Dominique Michel wrote: > Le Fri, 12 Nov 2010 00:54:58 -0500, > > "Tim E. Real" <termtech(a)rogers.com> a écrit : > > On November 11, 2010 11:06:10 pm Dominique Michel wrote: > > > Le Thu, 11 Nov 2010 16:43:41 -0300, > > > > > > Camilo Polymeris <cpolymeris(a)gmail.com> a écrit : > > > > >> For me, a stand alone pitch detection application would be > > > > >> better : > > > > >> > > > > >> audio in -> pitch detect -> midi out > > > > >> > > > > >> You plug the instrument into the audio in, connect the midi > > > > >> out to any midi in in qjackctl, and it is just to play some > > > > >> melody. > > > > >> > > > > >> Ciao, > > > > >> Dominique > > > > > > > > > > There is aubionotes (http://aubio.org/aubionotes.html), which > > > > > claims to do exactly what you want. Don't know how well, > > > > > though. I am trying to connect it to PianoBooster, to see if > > > > > that could be a solution. WaoN could also be an option, I'll > > > > > try that next. Eventually, I'd like an integrated app. > > > > > > > > > > Greetings, > > > > > Camilo > > > > > > Thanks for the tip ! > > > > > > > Ok. If someone is interested: I can report that aubionotes works > > > > quite well for the samples I tried (brass mostly, all > > > > monophonic). WaoN is similar, maybe even better, but doesn't work > > > > realtime, it handles pre-recorded samples, only. > > > > > > Same thing here. I think that it must use some kind of fft. The > > > problem with fft and realtime is not the processing power but the > > > time it take before you get a sufficient amount of samples in order > > > to be able to run the fft. > > > > > > Ciao, > > > Dominique > > > > Exactly. I was going to start a thread asking about this. Mind if I > > pitch in? Difference between lowest note on a guitar and next note is > > very small, requiring large number of FFT bins. (If you play a flute, > > you're lucky.) You can put a crappy time domain style pitch shifter > > ahead of the converter to reduce this. (A good freq domain PS may > > have more latency.) It's fun. With practice a normal guitar becomes a > > piano etc... > > > > I've seen polyphonic products advertised claiming zero or near zero > > latency. How do they do it? > > I don't know. If you take a guitar synthesizer, it have a polyphonic > mic, that is one mic per cord (similar to a simple humbucking per note). > They certainly make 6 monophonic note extractions.

> > Guitar mics take in account only the vertical movements of the cords, > the output signal is the derivative of this movement. > > Also, the harmonic content of a guitar note is not constant. During the > attack, the value of the fundamental is the most important signal in > the note, but during the sustain, the value of the fundamental decrease > very fast and the second harmonic become the highest tone in the note. > It is even more complicated when the cord touch the frets because you > will get false maximums of the signal. You can also get hum with a > simple humbucking, and you will get saturation with a double humbucking. > > > I've used FFT, but when told of this delay problem, my friend keeps > > telling me no, use Laplace transforms. When I studied them (looong > > ago), I could not fully understand how to apply the knowledge. > > Is there a Laplace library out there? > > I am not sure, but the FFT is a particular case of the bipolar Laplace > transformation,

> so I don't think than the necessary time to get enough > samples in order to get a reliable result would be better. The worst > case scenario depend on the lowest note you will able take in account. > > > Wavelets? I studied those as well, but my meagre brain could not > > cement. > > If it is what I call "filtre en peigne" in French (comb filter), it can > be an alternative. It is DSP algorythms for them, but I don't know if it > is something for a PC processor.

Pardon, I didn't read the whole thread, but just this email and I'm a guitarist. Imagine a Jimi Hendrix common E7#9 chord or something similar. Translation from the guitar strings to a piano isn't easy for automation! It's easy for a jazz musician ;), but nearly impossible to "translate" by a computer from an instrument like the guitar, to an instrument, like the piano. Again, I don't know what this thread is about, but at least some chords can't be taken from the guitar, to the piano, without some human imagination about the wanted effect. 2 Cents, Ralf