28 Oct
2013
28 Oct
'13
10:48 a.m.
Must be that time of year again when slashdotters get a bee in their bonnet
about how useless Linux is for audio production. Enter at your own risk...
http://ask.slashdot.org/story/13/10/27/0534248/ask-slashdot-best-cross-plat…
28 Oct
28 Oct
10:56 a.m.
On Mon, Oct 28, 2013 at 5:48 PM, michael noble <looplog(a)gmail.com> wrote:
Must be that time of year again when slashdotters get
a bee in their
bonnet about how useless Linux is for audio production. Enter at your own
risk...
http://ask.slashdot.org/story/13/10/27/0534248/ask-slashdot-best-cross-plat…
Some choice quotes:
Even an ancient copy of Cool Edit Pro running on Widows XP is more usable,
useful, and powerful than any audio software available
natively on Linux.
I love Linux and open source, but it really isn't ready for audio recording
and MIDI processing, let alone the myriad of other
apps and plugins
required for effects processing and mastering. I would be extremely
surprised if there are any serious audio professionals using Linux as a DAW.
If you're serious at all about your music, you use OS X or Windows. That's
where the action is. Full stop. That's where the
the real music software
will be found; nowhere else. Swallow your pride, choose one of those 2
OS's, and get on with making music.
I'm sorry, but Ardour is not "great". I believe in Linux and OSS, but if
you need to make a living in music or sound, you are
not going to be using
Ardour. The music production community is always open to new technologies,
and if Ardour were anything like a professional-quality application, it
would be used... If you're a database programmer and want to play like
Jonathan Coulton in your spare time, then fine. You can make Ardour work
the same way you can use a folding camping shovel to dig a foundation. But
if you want to dig a lot of foundations, you're going to want to invest in
a back-hoe. And there is no Linux back-hoe for music.
11:01 a.m.
On Mon, Oct 28, 2013 at 1:48 PM, michael noble wrote:
Must be that time of year again when slashdotters get
a bee in their bonnet
about how useless Linux is for audio production. Enter at your own risk...
http://ask.slashdot.org/story/13/10/27/0534248/ask-slashdot-best-cross-plat…
As any reputation management consultant will tell you, you can only
deal with this sort of stuff by producing tons of amazing content. So
the only way to deal with this is using your time wisely (read: stay
away from /.) and being bloody awesome :)
Alexandre
11:10 a.m.
On Mon, Oct 28, 2013 at 6:01 PM, Alexandre Prokoudine <
alexandre.prokoudine(a)gmail.com> wrote:
As any reputation management consultant will tell you, you can only
deal with this sort of stuff by producing tons of amazing content. So
the only way to deal with this is using your time wisely (read: stay
away from /.) and being bloody awesome :)
Alexandre
I do try to stay away for just that reason, but every now and then I check
in. When will I learn...
3:43 p.m.
On Monday 28 October 2013 10:22:21 michael noble did opine:
On Mon, Oct 28, 2013 at 6:01 PM, Alexandre Prokoudine
<
alexandre.prokoudine(a)gmail.com> wrote:
I think I need to throw out that I do read /., and even post occasionally.
But one of my goto guys when I have a problem also plays a pretty mean axe
or guitar, and is fluent in both linux and windows. His
management/editing/live session software when he is doing the majority of
such himself, like for some background for a commercial being produced
inhouse at the tv station, is Symphony.
I am not personally all that musically inclined, so I don't have an
opinion. What little I've done, and none in the last 5 years, such as
clipping a pop out of a digitized record, has been done with the linux
tools available at the time. The only windows allowed on the premises here
are made of glass or delrin.
But that thread on /. is best countered by quoting what you used, and a URL
to the best of what you've done. I have found some right ear pleasing
stuff that way, and the underlying os really is a never mind. Because
IMNSHO, the os doesn't matter, its the talent and knowledge of the tool
that counts. And linux seems to be blessed with more than enough of that
to win most of these fan boy shootouts.
So don't run for the exits, play your best stuff instead. In other words,
bring enough gun. IMO we do have enough gun.
Cheers, Gene
--
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
Chemicals, n.:
Noxious substances from which modern foods are made.
A pen in the hand of this president is far more
dangerous than 200 million guns in the hands of
law-abiding citizens.
As any reputation management consultant will tell
you, you can only
deal with this sort of stuff by producing tons of amazing content. So
the only way to deal with this is using your time wisely (read: stay
away from /.) and being bloody awesome :)
Alexandre
I do try to stay away for just that reason, but every now and then I
check in. When will I learn... 
4:07 p.m.
On Mon, 28 Oct 2013 10:42:55 -0400
Gene Heskett <gheskett(a)wdtv.com> wrote:
On Monday 28 October 2013 10:22:21 michael noble did
opine:
> On Mon, Oct 28, 2013 at 6:01 PM, Alexandre Prokoudine <
>
> alexandre.prokoudine(a)gmail.com> wrote:
> > As any reputation management consultant will tell you, you can only
> > deal with this sort of stuff by producing tons of amazing content. So
> > the only way to deal with this is using your time wisely (read: stay
> > away from /.) and being bloody awesome :)
> >
> > Alexandre
>
> I do try to stay away for just that reason, but every now and then I
> check in. When will I learn...
The derp is definitely flying there. I saw a guy's ProTools rig under
windows go down in flames last week at a live show. Didn't affect the
show, but it definitely hosed the recording of a couple of songs while he
did a hard boot and reloaded the environment.
The fact is that all systems and platforms are fallible, and the people
*screaming* about how bad Linux is seem to have blinders on about everything
except their chosen platform.
There's more derp about how Ardour isn't free unless you build it from
source, completely ignoring all the distros that include a package for it.
Even more derp about how Ardour sucks and can't possibly be used by
serious professionals, and how you can't exchange sessions with other DAWs.
I don't see a great deal of exchange between big players like ProTools and
Cubase or Reaper or Ableton or.. or... that's why people do stem exports, and
oh, hey, look over here under the File menu - there's an option for stem
exports. I just sent tracks I recorded with Ardour to another engineer for
mixing, and the stem export did just what we needed it to.
Sadly, the screaming derpers drown out the people who are there to say
it's working for them. Slashdot never changes, does it?
--
======================================================================
Joe Hartley - UNIX/network Consultant - jh(a)brainiac.com
Without deviation from the norm, "progress" is not possible. - FZappa
4:10 p.m.
On Mon, Oct 28, 2013 at 11:07 AM, Joe Hartley <jh(a)brainiac.com> wrote:
Even more derp about how Ardour sucks and can't
possibly be used by
serious professionals, and how you can't exchange sessions with other DAWs.
I don't see a great deal of exchange between big players like ProTools and
Cubase or Reaper or Ableton or.. or... that's why people do stem exports, and
oh, hey, look over here under the File menu - there's an option for stem
exports. I just sent tracks I recorded with Ardour to another engineer for
mixing, and the stem export did just what we needed it to.
If exchanging sessions between different were that painless, why is
there stuff like AATranslator? Oh hey look, it supports Ardour and
Mixbus!
--
Brett W. McCoy -- http://www.brettwmccoy.com
------------------------------------------------------------------------
"In the rhythm of music a secret is hidden; If I were to divulge it,
it would overturn the world."
-- Jelaleddin Rumi
8:13 p.m.
I wonder if any of the people flaming Linux pro audio have even tried it
any time in the last four years -- the improvements just recently have
been amazing. Regarding Ardour, I wouldn't be that surprised if they
hadn't tried it since Ardour 2.x and Jack 1. I really couldn't ask for
more in a DAW than its current state.
Where I do get envious of the Mac/Windows world sometimes is some of
their plugins for simulating certain colorations. Universal Audio has
very intersting plugins for emulating tape saturation, classic mixer
console channel strips, and the Roland Dimension D rackmount chorus.
They require hardware acceleration from a special DSP (available either
in a PCI card or an external firewire box), and thus probably a special
driver -- an even bigger barrier to Linux compatibility than the
programs themselves. But these UA plugins really do get me drooling...
Izotope Ozone's mastering suite is something else we don't have anything
in the ballpark of. I don't know if it would be possible to run
something that big under Wine with WineASIO or not. It's quite a large
set of applications.
Anyway, despite all this, I'm not planning on leaving Linux. It's
currently giving me far more than I had when I started (in the era of
tape and hardware sequencing), and it's getting better every year.
--
+ Brent A. Busby + "We've all heard that a million monkeys
+ Sr. UNIX Systems Admin + banging on a million typewriters will
+ University of Chicago + eventually reproduce the entire works of
+ James Franck Institute + Shakespeare. Now, thanks to the Internet,
+ Materials Research Ctr + we know this is not true." -Robert Wilensky
8:36 p.m.
On Mon, Oct 28, 2013 at 08:19:11PM +0100, Ralf Mardorf wrote:
A real tape has got real tape saturation.
Good point! Unfortunately, while I do tend to record hardware effects
when I'm tracking (and put the effects outputs on separate tracks so
they can be blended freely later), the problem is that if I need to do
more afterward, it gets hard to make myself bounce out to the hardware
world again. Once it's in the computer, I'm in a world of plugins...so
lazy I am. :)
But yes, I suppose you can get that from a real tape deck. I might
mention though that the UA plugins emulate a Studer deck...something I
certainly will never own or want to take care of.
Next you're going to tell me that if I want to write messages to people,
I can do that with paper and pencil! (omg...I can! I really can!)
--
+ Brent A. Busby + "We've all heard that a million monkeys
+ Sr. UNIX Systems Admin + banging on a million typewriters will
+ University of Chicago + eventually reproduce the entire works of
+ James Franck Institute + Shakespeare. Now, thanks to the Internet,
+ Materials Research Ctr + we know this is not true." -Robert Wilensky
8:41 p.m.
On 2013-10-28 20:36, Brent Busby wrote:
Next you're going to tell me that if I want to
write messages to people,
I can do that with paper and pencil! (omg...I can! I really can!)
Pardon me sliding off topic and injecting a little love story in this
thread :D
Do not underestimate the power of pencil and paper in letters. :) If you
ever fall in love with someone born in the 90's, try it out and add a
drop of perfume on it ;) The effect is no garantee for a happy love
affair. But you will be remembered!!! Big time!!! <3
99% of all 1990's kids have never recieved a love letter on paper. :)
--
Set Hallstrom
AKA Sakrecoer
http://sakrecoer.com
WARNING: Remember clear-text email is subject to mass surveillance
systems. Alone this information is useless. Our summed communications
are worth humanity.
Please keep in mind Internet is a boulevard in a crowded virtual city.
Privacy is found under the cloaks.
8:47 p.m.
To bring it back ON-topic.
Do not underestimate the power of pencil and paper in
letters. :)
This can also be very true when looking for a record deal... but have a
little research about the targeted-company before adding the perfume
drop :D ;)
On 2013-10-28 20:41, Set Hallstrom wrote:
On 2013-10-28 20:36, Brent Busby wrote:
--
Set Hallstrom
AKA Sakrecoer
http://sakrecoer.com
WARNING: Remember clear-text email is subject to mass surveillance
systems. Alone this information is useless. Our summed communications
are worth humanity.
Please keep in mind Internet is a boulevard in a crowded virtual city.
Privacy is found under the cloaks.
Next you're going to tell me that if I want
to write messages to people,
I can do that with paper and pencil! (omg...I can! I really can!)
Pardon me sliding off topic and injecting a little love story in this
thread :D
Do not underestimate the power of pencil and paper in letters. :) If you
ever fall in love with someone born in the 90's, try it out and add a
drop of perfume on it ;) The effect is no garantee for a happy love
affair. But you will be remembered!!! Big time!!! <3
99% of all 1990's kids have never recieved a love letter on paper. :)
8:50 p.m.
On Mon, 2013-10-28 at 20:47 +0100, Set Hallstrom wrote:
To bring it back ON-topic.
:D
Btw. compare the lettering for a comic by an artist, with the lettering
done by somebody using a computer.
Do not underestimate the power of pencil and
paper in letters. :)
This can also be very true when looking for a record deal... but have a
little research about the targeted-company before adding the perfume
drop :D ;)
28 Oct
28 Oct
8:36 p.m.
right on! actualy, record to a simple and cheap-o cassette tape
sliiiiiighlty in the red, and then record it back to digital, compress
it with a nice calf plugin and voila: you have now your own unique and
really good UA-sound-a-like tape-dirt. <3
On 2013-10-28 20:19, Ralf Mardorf wrote:
On Mon, 2013-10-28 at 14:13 -0500, Brent Busby wrote:
--
Set Hallstrom
AKA Sakrecoer
http://sakrecoer.com
WARNING: Remember clear-text email is subject to mass surveillance
systems. Alone this information is useless. Our summed communications
are worth humanity.
Please keep in mind Internet is a boulevard in a crowded virtual city.
Privacy is found under the cloaks.
Universal Audio has very intersting plugins for
emulating tape
saturation
A real tape has got real tape saturation.
_______________________________________________
Linux-audio-user mailing list
Linux-audio-user(a)lists.linuxaudio.org
http://lists.linuxaudio.org/listinfo/linux-audio-user
8:39 p.m.
On Mon, Oct 28, 2013 at 2:36 PM, Set Hallstrom <sakrecoer(a)gmail.com> wrote:
right on! actualy, record to a simple and cheap-o
cassette tape
sliiiiiighlty in the red, and then record it back to digital, compress
it with a nice calf plugin and voila: you have now your own unique and
really good UA-sound-a-like tape-dirt. <3
I remember reading somewhere that KMFDM treated their vocals this way.
8:41 p.m.
On Mon, 2013-10-28 at 20:36 +0100, Set Hallstrom wrote:
right on! actualy, record to a simple and cheap-o
cassette tape
sliiiiiighlty in the red, and then record it back to digital, compress
it with a nice calf plugin and voila: you have now your own unique and
really good UA-sound-a-like tape-dirt. <3
+ the low sound quality of a cassette recorder + a process that is time
consuming and can't be done if you make a living from music.
There are really god reasons why those musicians and engineers prefer
old faithful analog studios.
On 2013-10-28 20:19, Ralf Mardorf wrote:
On Mon, 2013-10-28 at 14:13 -0500, Brent Busby
wrote:
Universal Audio has very intersting plugins for
emulating tape
saturation
A real tape has got real tape saturation.
_______________________________________________
Linux-audio-user mailing list
Linux-audio-user(a)lists.linuxaudio.org
http://lists.linuxaudio.org/listinfo/linux-audio-user
8:53 p.m.
Agreed, backed-up and fully understood.
Althought, for honesty's sake, i have a very different philosophical
approach to the corelation between: money, time, energy and quality
products.
*Set
On 2013-10-28 20:41, Ralf Mardorf wrote:
On Mon, 2013-10-28 at 20:36 +0100, Set Hallstrom
wrote:
--
Set Hallstrom
AKA Sakrecoer
http://sakrecoer.com
WARNING: Remember clear-text email is subject to mass surveillance
systems. Alone this information is useless. Our summed communications
are worth humanity.
Please keep in mind Internet is a boulevard in a crowded virtual city.
Privacy is found under the cloaks.
right on! actualy, record to a simple and cheap-o
cassette tape
sliiiiiighlty in the red, and then record it back to digital, compress
it with a nice calf plugin and voila: you have now your own unique and
really good UA-sound-a-like tape-dirt. <3
+ the low sound quality of a cassette recorder + a process that is time
consuming and can't be done if you make a living from music.
There are really god reasons why those musicians and engineers prefer
old faithful analog studios.
On 2013-10-28 20:19, Ralf Mardorf wrote:
_______________________________________________
Linux-audio-user mailing list
Linux-audio-user(a)lists.linuxaudio.org
http://lists.linuxaudio.org/listinfo/linux-audio-user
On Mon, 2013-10-28 at 14:13 -0500, Brent Busby
wrote:
Universal Audio has very intersting plugins for
emulating tape
saturation
A real tape has got real tape saturation.
_______________________________________________
Linux-audio-user mailing list
Linux-audio-user(a)lists.linuxaudio.org
http://lists.linuxaudio.org/listinfo/linux-audio-user
9:01 p.m.
On Mon, 2013-10-28 at 20:53 +0100, Set Hallstrom wrote:
Althought, for honesty's sake, i have a very
different philosophical
approach to the corelation between: money, time, energy and quality
products.
I _allow_ myself not to work as audio and video engineer and not to work
as musician anymore. For good reasons I made it a spare time job some
years ago. ;)
9:07 p.m.
On Mon, 28 Oct 2013 21:01:06 +0100
Ralf Mardorf <ralf.mardorf(a)alice-dsl.net> wrote:
On Mon, 2013-10-28 at 20:53 +0100, Set Hallstrom
wrote:
I remember something my father said when I was very small. "If you *really*
enjoy something, never do it as a job". He was right.
--
Will J Godfrey
http://www.musically.me.uk
Say you have a poem and I have a tune.
Exchange them and we can both have a poem, a tune, and a song.
Althought, for honesty's sake, i have a very
different philosophical
approach to the corelation between: money, time, energy and quality
products.
I _allow_ myself not to work as audio and video engineer and not to work
as musician anymore. For good reasons I made it a spare time job some
years ago. ;)
9:47 p.m.
Those guys should check out my album, this is exactly why I made it - to
promote Linux Audio and to show that you can do this kind of music on it:
http://www.louigiverona.ru/?page=projects&s=music&t=another_reality
29 Oct
29 Oct
7:18 p.m.
Quoting Louigi Verona <louigi.verona(a)gmail.com>om>:
Those guys should check out my album, this is exactly
why I made it - to
promote Linux Audio and to show that you can do this kind of music on it:
http://www.louigiverona.ru/?page=projects&s=music&t=another_reality
Hello. This is great ! Reminds me of my copy of "trancentral four a
trip to goa. In the mix with Tsuyoshi Suzuki", Doof, Bass Chakra, etc
...
http://www.discogs.com/Tsuyoshi-Suzuki-Trancentral-Four-A-Trip-To-Goa/maste…
I notice music productions rarely contain logo's of services and/or
applications used to produce them, but films and video games do ...
Nvidia and Avid logo's !
Here is my "review" of your album keeping Linux audio use in mind.
Note I was listening to this with an ear attuned to the production
techniques and mastering heard on places like Proton Radio -
http://protonradio.com/ - and recent mixes such as The Konstrukt by
Danny Oliveira a talented Miami/Brazilian DJ/Producer -
https://soundcloud.com/dnyo/sets/the-konstrukt
Elementary Waves ... problem with intro. not as high quality as later
on in the track, but gets good ~3:30 minutes where you start using the
sample.
A note here. 303 and Distortion ? Distortion filter can make a massive
difference to the 303 sound. The 303 in Rebirth could do some REALLY
strange things, don't know how that compares to a real 303 because
I've never used one, but plan to get a 303 clone -
http://greatsynthesizers.com/en/general-en/2013/03/bass-bot-tt-303-the-new-…
Another reality. Nice use of synth !
Production in this one - this is gonna be honest, but please remember
I'm taking something in isolation here, and only this track.
Percussion sounds are too regimented (think of those bad MIDI demo's
that come with some software) and need to be made more dynamic, richer
and randomised - see blog post -
http://djbarney.wordpress.com/2013/10/27/generating-synthesised-drums-and-p…
Incredible Things - hey breakbeat ! Again there's some fine detail and
depth missing in the breakbeat. But this track sounds nicely upbeat
with good use of sample and composition.
Solar Traveller - hang on, this break beat is MUCH better. You should
probably look into exactly why that is, and keep on doing it. Rolling !
Seaside - sorry got distracted when listening to this one. I'll go
back to this later.
North Pole - I can hear this one being played on Proton Radio -
http://protonradio.com/ - and it would stand up nicely amongst all the
other tracks.
Acid Astronautic - love the 303 in this, very spacey. Goa Trance. the
drum/percussion could maybe be a bit more dynamic or randomised but
that may just be my own personal listening tastes.
Uranium - this is a good rich sounding 303 line that starts this. This
is the best one. This should be first track on your album if you ask
me. It really sounds like it could have been produced on Mac, Windows
or Linux, or a recording studio.
Was thinking some more about this. I think in a lot of track
production the trick is the final mix down and mastering that gives
everything that "silky smooth" sound. It's a work of art like a
painting, a well designed building or a cordon blue/Gourmet meal -
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gourmet
Thanks for your album ! This is exactly where I am heading at the
moment. I want to produce quality dance music that will enhance
people's life's and help them. I started thinking of producing music
to be much like starting a good bakery. If it tastes and smells good
then it will sell. If I start putting the Linux logo on my releases,
well I don't know yet ;) You have also inspired me to look at modular
synths (Linux of course) for modelling the 303 sounds, and building
the PCF filter in Propellerhead Rebirth which I've never seen anything
else do. There are circuit diagrams available for the 303 which can be
worked from. I'll also check out Nekobee :)
DJ Barney
30 Oct
30 Oct
9:07 p.m.
Barney, thanks for the review! It was very interesting to read, I rarely
get feedback on my music, especially that detailed ;)
Two things to comment. One - I am not a very good sound engineer so while I
do learn and my productions become better and better, overall I do need
services of a sound engineer or a tutor. I do get that sometimes from my
friend who is a sound engineer. He did specifically help me out with
Uranium, however, fixed version did not make it to the album since the eq
plugin we used crashes on project reopen and I had to release the tune as
it is.
Two. This album aimed for the 1990-1994 trance feel. That explains 303
without distortion. I actually like 303 without distortion. So I guess no
use comparing it to mixing techniques of today as I specifically listened
to 1990s trance music collections when preparing for the album.
Cheers and super thanks again for the review!
L.V.
On Oct 29, 2013 10:19 PM, "Barney Holmes" <djbarney(a)djbarney.org> wrote:
Quoting Louigi Verona
<louigi.verona(a)gmail.com>om>:
Those guys should check out my album, this is exactly why I made it - to
promote Linux Audio and to show that you can do
this kind of music on it:
http://www.louigiverona.ru/?**page=projects&s=music&t=**another_rea…
Hello. This is great ! Reminds me of my copy of "trancentral four a trip
to goa. In the mix with Tsuyoshi Suzuki", Doof, Bass Chakra, etc ...
http://www.discogs.com/**Tsuyoshi-Suzuki-Trancentral-**
Four-A-Trip-To-Goa/master/**45007<http://www.discogs.com/Tsuyoshi-Suzuki…
I notice music productions rarely contain logo's of services and/or
applications used to produce them, but films and video games do ... Nvidia
and Avid logo's !
Here is my "review" of your album keeping Linux audio use in mind.
Note I was listening to this with an ear attuned to the production
techniques and mastering heard on places like Proton Radio -
http://protonradio.com/ - and recent mixes such as The Konstrukt by Danny
Oliveira a talented Miami/Brazilian DJ/Producer -
https://soundcloud.com/dnyo/**sets/the-konstrukt<https://soundcloud.com/…
Elementary Waves ... problem with intro. not as high quality as later on
in the track, but gets good ~3:30 minutes where you start using the sample.
A note here. 303 and Distortion ? Distortion filter can make a massive
difference to the 303 sound. The 303 in Rebirth could do some REALLY
strange things, don't know how that compares to a real 303 because I've
never used one, but plan to get a 303 clone -
http://greatsynthesizers.com/**en/general-en/2013/03/bass-**
bot-tt-303-the-new-roland-tb-**303/<http://greatsynthesizers.com/en/gene…
Another reality. Nice use of synth !
Production in this one - this is gonna be honest, but please remember I'm
taking something in isolation here, and only this track. Percussion sounds
are too regimented (think of those bad MIDI demo's that come with some
software) and need to be made more dynamic, richer and randomised - see
blog post - http://djbarney.wordpress.com/**2013/10/27/generating-**
synthesised-drums-and-**percussion-in-linux-using-**yoshimi/<http://djba…
Incredible Things - hey breakbeat ! Again there's some fine detail and
depth missing in the breakbeat. But this track sounds nicely upbeat with
good use of sample and composition.
Solar Traveller - hang on, this break beat is MUCH better. You should
probably look into exactly why that is, and keep on doing it. Rolling !
Seaside - sorry got distracted when listening to this one. I'll go back to
this later.
North Pole - I can hear this one being played on Proton Radio -
http://protonradio.com/ - and it would stand up nicely amongst all the
other tracks.
Acid Astronautic - love the 303 in this, very spacey. Goa Trance. the
drum/percussion could maybe be a bit more dynamic or randomised but that
may just be my own personal listening tastes.
Uranium - this is a good rich sounding 303 line that starts this. This is
the best one. This should be first track on your album if you ask me. It
really sounds like it could have been produced on Mac, Windows or Linux, or
a recording studio.
Was thinking some more about this. I think in a lot of track production
the trick is the final mix down and mastering that gives everything that
"silky smooth" sound. It's a work of art like a painting, a well designed
building or a cordon blue/Gourmet meal - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/**
Gourmet <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gourmet>
Thanks for your album ! This is exactly where I am heading at the moment.
I want to produce quality dance music that will enhance people's life's and
help them. I started thinking of producing music to be much like starting a
good bakery. If it tastes and smells good then it will sell. If I start
putting the Linux logo on my releases, well I don't know yet ;) You have
also inspired me to look at modular synths (Linux of course) for modelling
the 303 sounds, and building the PCF filter in Propellerhead Rebirth which
I've never seen anything else do. There are circuit diagrams available for
the 303 which can be worked from. I'll also check out Nekobee :)
DJ Barney
______________________________**_________________
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9:49 p.m.
I would certainly be safe from putting my foot in my mouth if I wrote with
pencil and paper.
Nobody could read it! (Including me, a day or two later.)
Talk about plausible deniability...
Now back to the regular program...uh...what was it again?
cheers
Pete
On Wed, Oct 30, 2013 at 1:07 PM, Louigi Verona <louigi.verona(a)gmail.com>wrote;wrote:
Barney, thanks for the review! It was very interesting
to read, I rarely
get feedback on my music, especially that detailed ;)
Two things to comment. One - I am not a very good sound engineer so while
I do learn and my productions become better and better, overall I do need
services of a sound engineer or a tutor. I do get that sometimes from my
friend who is a sound engineer. He did specifically help me out with
Uranium, however, fixed version did not make it to the album since the eq
plugin we used crashes on project reopen and I had to release the tune as
it is.
Two. This album aimed for the 1990-1994 trance feel. That explains 303
without distortion. I actually like 303 without distortion. So I guess no
use comparing it to mixing techniques of today as I specifically listened
to 1990s trance music collections when preparing for the album.
Cheers and super thanks again for the review!
L.V.
On Oct 29, 2013 10:19 PM, "Barney Holmes" <djbarney(a)djbarney.org> wrote:
Quoting Louigi Verona
<louigi.verona(a)gmail.com>om>:
Those guys should check out my album, this is exactly why I made it - to
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promote Linux Audio and to show that you can do
this kind of music on it:
http://www.louigiverona.ru/?**page=projects&s=music&t=**another_rea…
Hello. This is great ! Reminds me of my copy of "trancentral four a trip
to goa. In the mix with Tsuyoshi Suzuki", Doof, Bass Chakra, etc ...
http://www.discogs.com/**Tsuyoshi-Suzuki-Trancentral-**
Four-A-Trip-To-Goa/master/**45007<http://www.discogs.com/Tsuyoshi-Suzuki…
I notice music productions rarely contain logo's of services and/or
applications used to produce them, but films and video games do ... Nvidia
and Avid logo's !
Here is my "review" of your album keeping Linux audio use in mind.
Note I was listening to this with an ear attuned to the production
techniques and mastering heard on places like Proton Radio -
http://protonradio.com/ - and recent mixes such as The Konstrukt by
Danny Oliveira a talented Miami/Brazilian DJ/Producer -
https://soundcloud.com/dnyo/**sets/the-konstrukt<https://soundcloud.com/…
Elementary Waves ... problem with intro. not as high quality as later on
in the track, but gets good ~3:30 minutes where you start using the sample.
A note here. 303 and Distortion ? Distortion filter can make a massive
difference to the 303 sound. The 303 in Rebirth could do some REALLY
strange things, don't know how that compares to a real 303 because I've
never used one, but plan to get a 303 clone -
http://greatsynthesizers.com/**en/general-en/2013/03/bass-**
bot-tt-303-the-new-roland-tb-**303/<http://greatsynthesizers.com/en/gene…
Another reality. Nice use of synth !
Production in this one - this is gonna be honest, but please remember I'm
taking something in isolation here, and only this track. Percussion sounds
are too regimented (think of those bad MIDI demo's that come with some
software) and need to be made more dynamic, richer and randomised - see
blog post - http://djbarney.wordpress.com/**2013/10/27/generating-**
synthesised-drums-and-**percussion-in-linux-using-**yoshimi/<http://djba…
Incredible Things - hey breakbeat ! Again there's some fine detail and
depth missing in the breakbeat. But this track sounds nicely upbeat with
good use of sample and composition.
Solar Traveller - hang on, this break beat is MUCH better. You should
probably look into exactly why that is, and keep on doing it. Rolling !
Seaside - sorry got distracted when listening to this one. I'll go back
to this later.
North Pole - I can hear this one being played on Proton Radio -
http://protonradio.com/ - and it would stand up nicely amongst all the
other tracks.
Acid Astronautic - love the 303 in this, very spacey. Goa Trance. the
drum/percussion could maybe be a bit more dynamic or randomised but that
may just be my own personal listening tastes.
Uranium - this is a good rich sounding 303 line that starts this. This is
the best one. This should be first track on your album if you ask me. It
really sounds like it could have been produced on Mac, Windows or Linux, or
a recording studio.
Was thinking some more about this. I think in a lot of track production
the trick is the final mix down and mastering that gives everything that
"silky smooth" sound. It's a work of art like a painting, a well designed
building or a cordon blue/Gourmet meal - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/**
Gourmet <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gourmet>
Thanks for your album ! This is exactly where I am heading at the moment.
I want to produce quality dance music that will enhance people's life's and
help them. I started thinking of producing music to be much like starting a
good bakery. If it tastes and smells good then it will sell. If I start
putting the Linux logo on my releases, well I don't know yet ;) You have
also inspired me to look at modular synths (Linux of course) for modelling
the 303 sounds, and building the PCF filter in Propellerhead Rebirth which
I've never seen anything else do. There are circuit diagrams available for
the 303 which can be worked from. I'll also check out Nekobee :)
DJ Barney
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7 Nov
7 Nov
10:54 a.m.
On 10/28/2013 09:47 PM, Louigi Verona wrote:
Those guys should check out my album, this is exactly
why I made it - to
promote Linux Audio and to show that you can do this kind of music on it:
http://www.louigiverona.ru/?page=projects&s=music&t=another_reality
Thanks, will give it a listen!
--
Atte
http://atte.dk http://modlys.dk
28 Oct
28 Oct
9:24 p.m.
New subject: OT: another linux audio bashing thread on slashdot
On Mon, 2013-10-28 at 20:07 +0000, Will Godfrey wrote:
On Mon, 28 Oct 2013 21:01:06 +0100
Ralf Mardorf <ralf.mardorf(a)alice-dsl.net> wrote:
Hopefully he is mistaken. Today I try to work for child care, making
music, drawing etc.. Nobody who dislike it, should care for children.
However, I fear ... and I really fear it ... your father is right.
But what job should sensitive humans do to own some money for a living?
Should we work as war lords?
On Mon, 2013-10-28 at 20:53 +0100, Set Hallstrom
wrote:
I remember something my father said when I was very small. "If you *really*
enjoy something, never do it as a job". He was right. Althought, for honesty's sake, i have a very
different philosophical
approach to the corelation between: money, time, energy and quality
products.
I _allow_ myself not to work as audio and video engineer and not to work
as musician anymore. For good reasons I made it a spare time job some
years ago. ;)
9:30 p.m.
New subject: OT: another linux audio bashing thread on slashdot
On 2013-10-28 21:24, Ralf Mardorf wrote:
On Mon, 2013-10-28 at 20:07 +0000, Will Godfrey
wrote:
I think any work that is somewhat ethic, and allow a _lot_ of
spare-time. That's how i roll: max 60 h/week for food and shelter + tools.
Spend the spare-time on a creative passion or outlet can considerably
reduce expenses. <3
On Mon, 28 Oct 2013 21:01:06 +0100
Ralf Mardorf <ralf.mardorf(a)alice-dsl.net> wrote:
Hopefully he is mistaken. Today I try to work for child care, making
music, drawing etc.. Nobody who dislike it, should care for children.
However, I fear ... and I really fear it ... your father is right.
But what job should sensitive humans do to own some money for a living?
Should we work as war lords?
On Mon, 2013-10-28 at 20:53 +0100, Set Hallstrom
wrote:
I remember something my father said when I was very small. "If you *really*
enjoy something, never do it as a job". He was right. Althought, for honesty's sake, i have a very
different philosophical
approach to the corelation between: money, time, energy and quality
products.
I _allow_ myself not to work as audio and video engineer and not to work
as musician anymore. For good reasons I made it a spare time job some
years ago. ;)
_______________________________________________
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--
Set Hallstrom
AKA Sakrecoer
http://sakrecoer.com
WARNING: Remember clear-text email is subject to mass surveillance
systems. Alone this information is useless. Our summed communications
are worth humanity.
Please keep in mind Internet is a boulevard in a crowded virtual city.
Privacy is found under the cloaks.
9:34 p.m.
New subject: OT: another linux audio bashing thread on slashdot
hrm... yeah sure 60 h/week :D
no... more like 60% of 40hours weeks :D
On 2013-10-28 21:30, Set Hallstrom wrote:
On 2013-10-28 21:24, Ralf Mardorf wrote:
--
Set Hallstrom
AKA Sakrecoer
http://sakrecoer.com
WARNING: Remember clear-text email is subject to mass surveillance
systems. Alone this information is useless. Our summed communications
are worth humanity.
Please keep in mind Internet is a boulevard in a crowded virtual city.
Privacy is found under the cloaks.
On Mon, 2013-10-28 at 20:07 +0000, Will Godfrey
wrote:
I think any work that is somewhat ethic, and allow a _lot_ of
spare-time. That's how i roll: max 60 h/week for food and shelter + tools.
Spend the spare-time on a creative passion or outlet can considerably
reduce expenses. <3
On Mon, 28 Oct 2013 21:01:06 +0100
Ralf Mardorf <ralf.mardorf(a)alice-dsl.net> wrote:
Hopefully he is mistaken. Today I try to work for child care, making
music, drawing etc.. Nobody who dislike it, should care for children.
However, I fear ... and I really fear it ... your father is right.
But what job should sensitive humans do to own some money for a living?
Should we work as war lords?
On Mon, 2013-10-28 at 20:53 +0100, Set Hallstrom
wrote:
> Althought, for honesty's sake, i have a very different philosophical
> approach to the corelation between: money, time, energy and quality
> products.
I _allow_ myself not to work as audio and video engineer and not to work
as musician anymore. For good reasons I made it a spare time job some
years ago. ;)
I remember something my father said when I was very small. "If you *really*
enjoy something, never do it as a job". He was right. _______________________________________________
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Linux-audio-user(a)lists.linuxaudio.org
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9:49 p.m.
New subject: OT: another linux audio bashing thread on slashdot
On Mon, 2013-10-28 at 21:30 +0100, Set Hallstrom wrote:
I think any work that is somewhat ethic [snip]
It's not only ethic, but also about emotions.
If you want to work as audio engineer in Germany you need to be
Tonmeister VDT. It's easy for me to be a Tonmeister VDT and it
works/worked for me without becoming a member, but that's much harder.
You only need two bailsmen to become VDT and many acquaintances I know
like to be bailsmen for me. For me it's a no-go, I can't live
rock'n'roll and become member of a club, this is ridiculous.
No offence Jörn, don't get me wrong, friends of me are VDT, it's ok, but
those friends aren't rock'n'rollers.
Don't care about ethics, this is theory, but listen to your heart.
You can't love music and at the same time make your money by working for
an industry that gives us the loudness-war, _even_ if you have the good
luck to ignore the loudness war, you still will work for the same evil
people. It's not ethic, it's emotion!
9:48 p.m.
New subject: OT: another linux audio bashing thread on slashdot
On Mon, 28 Oct 2013, Ralf Mardorf wrote:
I work as a "Letter carrier" (aka mailman, postman, whatever) and been
surprised at how many of my peers also make music. I think part of what
makes it atractive is the amount of time outside and away from any boss.
Also a willingness to experience the world even when the sun is not
shinning.
As for music as a hobby vs. job... I think in the late 70s when I was
making the choice to do music or get a steady job (so I could own a house
instead of rent one), it was already obvious, that to make it big you had
to be willing to give up any ideals or belief... and make someone else
rich. The time of being able to make your own music and do well had
already ended (pretty much). There has been good music made since then,
but it is hard to find in stores or on the radio.
--
Len Ovens
www.ovenwerks.net
I remember
something my father said when I was very small. "If you *really*
enjoy something, never do it as a job". He was right.
Hopefully he is mistaken. Today I try to work for child care, making
music, drawing etc.. Nobody who dislike it, should care for children.
However, I fear ... and I really fear it ... your father is right.
But what job should sensitive humans do to own some money for a living?
Should we work as war lords?
10:10 p.m.
New subject: OT: another linux audio bashing thread on slashdot
On Mon, 2013-10-28 at 13:42 -0700, Len Ovens wrote:
I work as a "Letter carrier" (aka mailman,
postman, whatever) and been
surprised at how many of my peers also make music. I think part of what
makes it atractive is the amount of time outside and away from any boss.
Also a willingness to experience the world even when the sun is not
shinning.
As for music as a hobby vs. job... I think in the late 70s when I was
making the choice to do music or get a steady job (so I could own a house
instead of rent one), it was already obvious, that to make it big you had
to be willing to give up any ideals or belief... and make someone else
rich. The time of being able to make your own music and do well had
already ended (pretty much). There has been good music made since then,
but it is hard to find in stores or on the radio.
"Mister postman look and see
If there's a letter in your bag for me
I been waiting such a long time
Since I heard from that girl of mine"
Rock'n'Roll, Punk Rock, IOW real live.
I Love it, I prefer to carry brigs on a building lot, than to give a
lecture on audio engineering or rock music at an academy.
And again, this is my rock'n'roller _emotion_. I don't condemn anybody
being VDT, being an academic teaching music or what ever.
Everybody has to decide what is important for her/him. Don't care about
ethics! Listen to your heart!
29 Oct
29 Oct
9:47 p.m.
New subject: OT: another linux audio bashing thread on slashdot
Ethic, emotional, moral, wealth... LOVE! :D very abstract words. Their
definitions is bound to your first experience of the feelings behind them :)
But you are right, at least, i understand your point and relate to it. I
chose the same path as you. I don't want to deal with the music industry.
(It's dying anyway :D) And I despise everything that is related to
"idolatry". I am basically not so compatible with the
"rock'n'roll" as you
mention it i guess. Althought i must say there is quite a lot of
rock'n'roll in my life. Just not so shiny or glamorous... LOL (
http://sakrecoer.com/assets/mu/files/Sakrecoer-Pa_Manen_007_01-Dumb_Bumm.mp3)
I work part time in a powerplant. I have the same task as Homer Simpson:
looking after a machine that looks after itself, alone in a control room
with infinite knowledge: internet.
But in my powerplant we burn trash instead of atoms. It pays good enough to
have 3 saturdays and a sunday each week.
Living according to my own definitions is what makes me happy. Doing music
in genres i fancy, instead of the ones that are expectef from me.
But then again, i can afford happyness since i have absolutley 0 debts.
*Set
On Mon, Oct 28, 2013 at 10:10 PM, Ralf Mardorf
<ralf.mardorf(a)alice-dsl.net>wrote;wrote:
On Mon, 2013-10-28 at 13:42 -0700, Len Ovens wrote:
--
Set Hallström
AKA
reSet Sakrecoer
http://sakrecoer.com
I work as a "Letter carrier" (aka
mailman, postman, whatever) and been
surprised at how many of my peers also make music. I think part of what
makes it atractive is the amount of time outside and away from any boss.
Also a willingness to experience the world even when the sun is not
shinning.
As for music as a hobby vs. job... I think in the late 70s when I was
making the choice to do music or get a steady job (so I could own a house
instead of rent one), it was already obvious, that to make it big you had
to be willing to give up any ideals or belief... and make someone else
rich. The time of being able to make your own music and do well had
already ended (pretty much). There has been good music made since then,
but it is hard to find in stores or on the radio.
"Mister postman look and see
If there's a letter in your bag for me
I been waiting such a long time
Since I heard from that girl of mine"
Rock'n'Roll, Punk Rock, IOW real live.
I Love it, I prefer to carry brigs on a building lot, than to give a
lecture on audio engineering or rock music at an academy.
And again, this is my rock'n'roller _emotion_. I don't condemn anybody
being VDT, being an academic teaching music or what ever.
Everybody has to decide what is important for her/him. Don't care about
ethics! Listen to your heart!
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9:54 p.m.
New subject: OT: another linux audio bashing thread on slashdot
On Tue, Oct 29, 2013 at 09:46:56PM +0100, Set Hallström wrote:
I work part time in a powerplant. I have the same task
as Homer Simpson:
looking after a machine that looks after itself, alone in a control room
So your job starts when the machine stops looking after itself.
I hope they give you some training / simulations of such an event...
Ciao,
--
FA
A world of exhaustive, reliable metadata would be an utopia.
It's also a pipe-dream, founded on self-delusion, nerd hubris
and hysterically inflated market opportunities. (Cory Doctorow)
10:02 p.m.
New subject: OT: another linux audio bashing thread on slashdot
Haha! It already does, but it has too much human interraction leading to errors it cannot
handle. LOLDon't worry about me however, i have a few trix in my bag.
Fons Adriaensen <fons(a)linuxaudio.org> wrote:
On Tue, Oct 29, 2013 at 09:46:56PM +0100, Set Hallström
wrote:
--
Sent from my Android device with K-9 Mail. Please excuse my brevity.
I work part time in a powerplant. I have the same
task as Homer
Simpson:
looking after a machine that looks after itself,
alone in a control
room
So your job starts when the machine stops looking after itself.
I hope they give you some training / simulations of such an event...
Ciao,
--
FA
A world of exhaustive, reliable metadata would be an utopia.
It's also a pipe-dream, founded on self-delusion, nerd hubris
and hysterically inflated market opportunities. (Cory Doctorow)
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10:13 p.m.
New subject: OT: another linux audio bashing thread on slashdot
On Tue, Oct 29, 2013 at 10:01:49PM +0100, Set Hallstrom wrote:
Haha! It already does, but it has too much human
interraction
leading to errors it cannot handle. LOL Don't worry about me
however, i have a few trix in my bag.
Let's hope they work...
I once did a consultancy for a firm that builds simulators of
nuclear power plants - used for training the operators. They
simulate everything, down to ageing of fuses and corrosion on
connector contacts. IIRC, one of the programs they used simulated
8 Megaitems in real time. Just touching that kind of SW is scary...
Ciao,
--
FA
A world of exhaustive, reliable metadata would be an utopia.
It's also a pipe-dream, founded on self-delusion, nerd hubris
and hysterically inflated market opportunities. (Cory Doctorow)
1 Nov
1 Nov
9:48 a.m.
New subject: OT: another linux audio bashing thread on slashdot
On Mon, Oct 28, 2013 at 09:24:41PM +0100, Ralf Mardorf wrote:
Hopefully he is mistaken. Today I try to work for
child care, making
music, drawing etc.. Nobody who dislike it, should care for children.
However, I fear ... and I really fear it ... your father is right.
Have you heard of the term: "Dream Job"? That is where you get paid for
something you love doing.
I wonder if the original statement has been taken out of context. For
example, I've heard of a phrase saying something like "don't treat your
job as a hobby", or something along those lines.
--
"If you're not careful, the newspapers will have you hating the people
who are being oppressed, and loving the people who are doing the
oppressing." --- Malcolm X
10:11 a.m.
New subject: OT: another linux audio bashing thread on slashdot
On 10/31/2013 10:48 PM, Chris Bannister wrote:
On Mon, Oct 28, 2013 at 09:24:41PM +0100, Ralf Mardorf
wrote:
Here's a variation on the quote mentioned above: "Don't treat your
*life* as a hobby." At one place we lived, we used to have a letter
carrier who trudged. Every bit of his body language said he *hated* his
job. He was maybe 5 years away from retirement age. We think what
happened to him is that he had dreams of doing something else, and
someone had convinced him "Get a post office job, you'll get a great
pension to support you in pursuing your dreams when you retire." But
over the years, his resentment about his job had poisoned him so much
that we very much doubt that any trace of his old dreams survived ... :-(
--
David
gnome(a)hawaii.rr.com
authenticity, honesty, community
http://dancingtreefrog.com
Hopefully he is mistaken. Today I try to work for
child care, making
music, drawing etc.. Nobody who dislike it, should care for children.
However, I fear ... and I really fear it ... your father is right.
Have you heard of the term: "Dream Job"? That is where you get paid for
something you love doing.
I wonder if the original statement has been taken out of context. For
example, I've heard of a phrase saying something like "don't treat your
job as a hobby", or something along those lines.
10:11 a.m.
New subject: OT: another linux audio bashing thread on slashdot
On Fri, Nov 1, 2013 at 4:48 PM, Chris Bannister
<cbannister(a)slingshot.co.nz>wrote;wrote:
I wonder if the original statement has been taken out
of context.
I suspect so. The statement was: "If you *really* enjoy something, never do
it as a job"
The *really* part is important I think. If you are very passionate about
something, turning it into work is not often the best thing for that
passion. That being said, "work" is probably a state of mind more than
anything. I know Robert Fripp has said something similar about music, that
if you really love music, don't try to make a living out of it.
28 Oct
28 Oct
10:23 p.m.
Am 28.10.2013 21:08 schrieb "Will Godfrey" <willgodfrey(a)musically.me.uk>uk>:
I remember something my father said when I was very small. "If you
*really*
enjoy something, never do it as a job". He was
right.
No, he wasn't. Because if you *really* enjoy something and can make a
living out of it it won't necessarily feel like a job.
10:27 p.m.
On Mon, Oct 28, 2013 at 5:23 PM, Felix Homann <linuxaudio(a)showlabor.de> wrote:
Am 28.10.2013 21:08 schrieb "Will Godfrey"
<willgodfrey(a)musically.me.uk>uk>:
I enjoy my job. I get paid to use Linux all day. This does not suck in
the least.
--
Brett W. McCoy -- http://www.brettwmccoy.com
------------------------------------------------------------------------
"In the rhythm of music a secret is hidden; If I were to divulge it,
it would overturn the world."
-- Jelaleddin Rumi
I remember something my father said when I was very small. "If you
*really*
enjoy something, never do it as a job". He was right.
No, he wasn't. Because if you *really* enjoy something and can make a living
out of it it won't necessarily feel like a job. 
10:36 p.m.
I love to fix computers, even enjoy fixing friends windozee's pc, but when
they tray to pay, I allways refuse to accept any.
And tell them that I did because I like to do it, not for money, I feel
like if they pay for it, I would no enjoy it anymore.
That's my mind state.
Leo
On Mon, Oct 28, 2013 at 2:23 PM, Felix Homann <linuxaudio(a)showlabor.de>wrote;wrote:
Am 28.10.2013 21:08 schrieb "Will Godfrey"
<willgodfrey(a)musically.me.uk>uk>:
I remember something my father said when I was very small. "If you
*really*
enjoy something, never do it as a job". He
was right.
No, he wasn't. Because if you *really* enjoy something and can make a
living out of it it won't necessarily feel like a job.
_______________________________________________
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29 Oct
29 Oct
12:38 p.m.
On Monday 28 October 2013 17:36:11 Leonardo Palomares wrote:
I love to fix computers, even enjoy fixing friends
windozee's pc, but when
they tray to pay, I allways refuse to accept any.
And tell them that I did because I like to do it, not for money, I feel
like if they pay for it, I would no enjoy it anymore.
It is possible for money to serve as a demotivator in this way but it is not a
100% thing in my books.
That's my mind state.
For myself, I think some of it comes down to the *demands* placed on me and
the interesting aspects of the work.
1. No demands, interesting work, - money = fine.
2. No demands, interesting work, + money = fine.
...
N-1. Demands, boring (or other nasty) work, + money = possible at times.
N. Demands, boring (or other nasty) work, - money = you're kidding right.
It also depends on what I am missing out on while I am doing whatever work I
am doing.
[The above is not vetted and comes with no warranty of correctness. I may
change my tune on further reflection.]
Leo
all the best,
drew
1:19 p.m.
On 10/29/2013 07:40 AM, drew Roberts wrote:
...
For myself, I think some of it comes down to the *demands* placed on me and
the interesting aspects of the work.
1. No demands, interesting work, - money = fine.
2. No demands, interesting work, + money = fine.
...
N-1. Demands, boring (or other nasty) work, + money = possible at times.
N. Demands, boring (or other nasty) work, - money = you're kidding right.
I have two meters running all the time. One is the Fun-O-Meter and the
other is the Cash-O-Meter. One had better be 'way higher than the other
for me to even consider the job.
Ideally both would be pegged to the right.
Best,
dp
1:32 p.m.
On Tuesday 29 October 2013 08:19:47 Dave Phillips wrote:
On 10/29/2013 07:40 AM, drew Roberts wrote:
Reworded:
One had better be high if the other is low... [That is what I take it you are
saying by what you wrote below. - I know, I am being pedantic again...
although I have no intention to annoy ~-;) ]
...
For myself, I think some of it comes down to the *demands* placed on me
and the interesting aspects of the work.
1. No demands, interesting work, - money = fine.
2. No demands, interesting work, + money = fine.
...
N-1. Demands, boring (or other nasty) work, + money = possible at times.
N. Demands, boring (or other nasty) work, - money = you're kidding right.
I have two meters running all the time. One is the Fun-O-Meter and the
other is the Cash-O-Meter. One had better be 'way higher than the other
for me to even consider the job.
Ideally both would be pegged to the right.
~;-)
Best,
dp
drew
28 Oct
28 Oct
11:04 p.m.
On Mon, 2013-10-28 at 22:23 +0100, Felix Homann wrote:
Am 28.10.2013 21:08 schrieb "Will Godfrey"
<willgodfrey(a)musically.me.uk>uk>:
Words are words, but there is the emotion.
Chico, Harpo, Groucho and Zeppo.
Chico, Harpo, Groucho is what we like to be, nobody want's to be Zeppo.
It's possible to become an astronaut or crane driver if you like it, but
it might have less to do with your emotions to become an astronaut or
crane driver, only if you have very good luck it does fit to your
emotions. Yes, a view people have good luck.
I remember something my father said when I was very small. "If you
*really*
enjoy something, never do it as a job". He
was right.
No, he wasn't. Because if you *really* enjoy something and can make a
living out of it it won't necessarily feel like a job.
11:19 p.m.
On Mon, 2013-10-28 at 23:04 +0100, Ralf Mardorf wrote:
On Mon, 2013-10-28 at 22:23 +0100, Felix Homann
wrote:
^^^^ few :D
Am 28.10.2013 21:08 schrieb "Will Godfrey"
<willgodfrey(a)musically.me.uk>uk>:
Words are words, but there is the emotion.
Chico, Harpo, Groucho and Zeppo.
Chico, Harpo, Groucho is what we like to be, nobody want's to be Zeppo.
It's possible to become an astronaut or crane driver if you like it, but
it might have less to do with your emotions to become an astronaut or
crane driver, only if you have very good luck it does fit to your
emotions. Yes, a view people have good luck.
I remember something my father said when I was very small. "If you
*really*
enjoy something, never do it as a job". He
was right.
No, he wasn't. Because if you *really* enjoy something and can make a
living out of it it won't necessarily feel like a job. 
5 Nov
5 Nov
6:55 p.m.
On Mon, Oct 28, 2013 at 08:36:37PM +0100, Set Hallstrom wrote:
right on! actualy, record to a simple and cheap-o
cassette tape
sliiiiiighlty in the red, and then record it back to digital, compress
it with a nice calf plugin and voila: you have now your own unique and
really good UA-sound-a-like tape-dirt. <3
I saw a mastering video with a guy who charges US$1k/song or something, and his
"secret weapon" was a 2-track 1/4" deck. He'd dump the master mix from
ProTools to the 1/4" deck at like 30ips, resample it back, and that got him the sweet
lucrative loving he wanted from his customers.
I thought, wow. You take a medium in which even cheap consumer crap has effectively
perfect resolution, and dump it to a medium with basically 12-bits resolution (analog
tape), and then A/D it back, and that's "the sound" they wanted.
Humans are weird.
-ken
7:57 p.m.
On Tue, 5 Nov 2013 09:55:49 -0800
Ken Restivo <ken(a)restivo.org> wrote:
I saw a mastering video with a guy who charges
US$1k/song or something, and his "secret weapon" was a 2-track 1/4" deck.
He'd dump the master mix from ProTools to the 1/4" deck at like 30ips, resample
it back, and that got him the sweet lucrative loving he wanted from his customers.
Because mmmmm, tape compression. You can fake it in digital, but it's not
the same.
I thought, wow. You take a medium in which even cheap
consumer crap has effectively perfect resolution, and dump it to a medium with basically
12-bits resolution (analog tape), and then A/D it back, and that's "the
sound" they wanted.
Bob Katz begs to differ:
"I believe that a finely-tuned 30 IPS 1/2" tape recorder is more accurate,
better resolved, has better space, depth, purity of tone and transparency
than many digital systems available today. Empirical observations have
shown that you need a nominal "24-bit" A/D to capture the low-level
resolution of 1/2" 30 IPS (if truth be told, the best converters only
approach about 19-20 bit resolution in practice). It can also be argued
that 1/2" tape has a greater bandwidth than 44.1 KHz or 48 KHz digital
audio, requiring even higher sample rates to properly convert to digital.
Listening tests corroborate this. 30 IPS analog tape has useable frequency
response to beyond 30 KHz and a gentle (gradual) filter rolls off the
frequency response. This translates to more open, transparent sound
than any 44.1 kHz/16 bit digital recording I've heard. 1/2" 30 IPS
analog tape has lots of information, like high resolution 35 mm film.
16-bit 44.1 KHz digital is like low-resolution video."
(http://www.digido.com/articles-and-demos12/13-bob-katz/27-back-to-analog.ht…)
Assuming the mastering guy's gear is well-maintained, his price may well
be worth what he charges.
--
======================================================================
Joe Hartley - UNIX/network Consultant - jh(a)brainiac.com
Without deviation from the norm, "progress" is not possible. - FZappa
9:27 p.m.
On Tue, 5 Nov 2013 13:57:16 -0500
Joe Hartley <jh(a)brainiac.com> wrote:
On Tue, 5 Nov 2013 09:55:49 -0800
Ken Restivo <ken(a)restivo.org> wrote:
Reading his comments I get the strong feeling he will say whatever gets him the
most money. I've worked with 30ips machines. They are a total nightmare, and
while a wide tape width improves noise, it actually detracts from frequency
response (it would take an entire article to explain why).
People usually use tape these days to add 2nd order harmonic distortion (warmth)
and saturation distortion (compression). If you really want that, both can be
had more reliably by alternative means.
--
Will J Godfrey
http://www.musically.me.uk
Say you have a poem and I have a tune.
Exchange them and we can both have a poem, a tune, and a song.
I saw a mastering video with a guy who charges
US$1k/song or something, and his "secret weapon" was a 2-track 1/4" deck.
He'd dump the master mix from ProTools to the 1/4" deck at like 30ips, resample
it back, and that got him the sweet lucrative loving he wanted from his customers.
Because mmmmm, tape compression. You can fake it in digital, but it's not
the same.
I thought, wow. You take a medium in which even
cheap consumer crap has effectively perfect resolution, and dump it to a medium with
basically 12-bits resolution (analog tape), and then A/D it back, and that's "the
sound" they wanted.
Bob Katz begs to differ:
7 Nov
7 Nov
10 a.m.
On 2013-11-05 21:27, Will Godfrey wrote:
On Tue, 5 Nov 2013 13:57:16 -0500
Joe Hartley <jh(a)brainiac.com> wrote:
One very often disregarded ingredient of a happy customer to a master
studio, is a kickass sales man :)
Everybody knows water is better for the body than soda. Yet, most of us
prefer buying soda. Because it tastes "better" and contains sugar!
Tastes, Sounds and colours etc.. are abstract and individual sensations:
they are easily manipulated with discourse. While i find it interesting
and sometimes amusing, I have never been fund of definitions of
aesthetic, or attempts to encircle the very nature of "quality". Like i
said i find it interesting, because it muses my thoughts. But given to
people with less confidence in what their own appreciation is all about
is dangerous, when not evil.
Best regards,
Set
On Tue, 5 Nov 2013 09:55:49 -0800
Ken Restivo <ken(a)restivo.org> wrote:
Reading his comments I get the strong feeling he will say whatever gets him the
most money. I've worked with 30ips machines. They are a total nightmare, and
while a wide tape width improves noise, it actually detracts from frequency
response (it would take an entire article to explain why).
People usually use tape these days to add 2nd order harmonic distortion (warmth)
and saturation distortion (compression). If you really want that, both can be
had more reliably by alternative means.
I saw a mastering video with a guy who charges
US$1k/song or something, and his "secret weapon" was a 2-track 1/4" deck.
He'd dump the master mix from ProTools to the 1/4" deck at like 30ips, resample
it back, and that got him the sweet lucrative loving he wanted from his customers.
Because mmmmm, tape compression. You can fake it in digital, but it's not
the same.
I thought, wow. You take a medium in which even
cheap consumer crap has effectively perfect resolution, and dump it to a medium with
basically 12-bits resolution (analog tape), and then A/D it back, and that's "the
sound" they wanted.
Bob Katz begs to differ:
9 Nov
9 Nov
10:17 p.m.
On Thu, Nov 07, 2013 at 10:00:26AM +0100, Set Hallstrom wrote:
Everybody knows water is better for the body than soda. Yet, most of us
prefer buying soda. Because it tastes "better" and contains sugar!
The other reason is: "Why pay for water!!"
--
"If you're not careful, the newspapers will have you hating the people
who are being oppressed, and loving the people who are doing the
oppressing." --- Malcolm X
28 Oct
28 Oct
12:52 p.m.
On Mon, Oct 28, 2013 at 5:48 AM, michael noble <looplog(a)gmail.com> wrote:
Must be that time of year again when slashdotters get
a bee in their bonnet
about how useless Linux is for audio production. Enter at your own risk...
http://ask.slashdot.org/story/13/10/27/0534248/ask-slashdot-best-cross-plat…
Ha, I stopped reading /. a long time ago. I can see not much has changed...
--
Brett W. McCoy -- http://www.brettwmccoy.com
------------------------------------------------------------------------
"In the rhythm of music a secret is hidden; If I were to divulge it,
it would overturn the world."
-- Jelaleddin Rumi
1:24 p.m.
Quoting Brett McCoy <idragosani(a)gmail.com>om>:
On Mon, Oct 28, 2013 at 5:48 AM, michael noble
<looplog(a)gmail.com> wrote:
Same here. It seemed to turn into a cynicism fest in many
circumstances. If this kind of post (no I didn?t go in, I have enough
anger already) is anything special or just the usual I don't know.
However there is a HUGE watershed going on at the moment that
undoubtedly is spilling well beyond the borders of open source land.
Something extraordinary IS happening and I don't see why anyone should
be embarrassed about giving themselves a pat on the back or even
getting others to pat them on that back ! An enormous amount of work
by thousands upon thousands is paying off. The fruits started
happening with Android, despite proprietary drivers (if Google had
refused that none of the mobile phone manufactures would have even
used Android!), then Ubuntu, as well as the less visible internet
servers and embedded technologies. But the one that takes the biscuit
for me is Steam announcing SteamOS. This is going to be a huge change
in what has been a long standing corporate culture of
Microsoft/Nvidia/Intel. Video games are the quintessential example of
the Real Time application. Graphics and sound all running as a real
time application. There's hints of where this is going in things like
the 3D synth by Robert Gareus. Look at the 3D menu / interface that
you can spin around in Borderlands 2. It amazes me that we are not
already using 3D window managers and are still stuck in static 2D land
(go ask Ted Nelson about that).
Where does this take Linux Audio Users ? Well the future is bright.
What's over that horizon ? I've been looking at Blender Game Engine
for doing VJ visuals (it can play full frame video within the game
engine and spin that around a'la a high end vision mixing desk).
Combined with sound who knows what kind of 3D dynamic sound mixing
environments could be created ?
So Linux bashing, go easy on them.
DJ Barney
Must be that time of year again when slashdotters
get a bee in their bonnet
about how useless Linux is for audio production. Enter at your own risk...
http://ask.slashdot.org/story/13/10/27/0534248/ask-slashdot-best-cross-plat…
Ha, I stopped reading /. a long time ago. I can see not much has changed...
--
Brett W. McCoy -- http://www.brettwmccoy.com
------------------------------------------------------------------------
"In the rhythm of music a secret is hidden; If I were to divulge it,
it would overturn the world."
-- Jelaleddin Rumi
_______________________________________________
Linux-audio-user mailing list
Linux-audio-user(a)lists.linuxaudio.org
http://lists.linuxaudio.org/listinfo/linux-audio-user
4:06 p.m.
On Monday 28 October 2013 10:44:40 Barney Holmes did opine:
Same here. It seemed to turn into a cynicism fest in many
circumstances. If this kind of post (no I didn?t go in, I have enough
anger already) is anything special or just the usual I don't know.
However there is a HUGE watershed going on at the moment that
undoubtedly is spilling well beyond the borders of open source land.
Something extraordinary IS happening and I don't see why anyone should
be embarrassed about giving themselves a pat on the back or even
getting others to pat them on that back ! An enormous amount of work
by thousands upon thousands is paying off. The fruits started
happening with Android, despite proprietary drivers (if Google had
refused that none of the mobile phone manufactures would have even
used Android!), then Ubuntu, as well as the less visible internet
servers and embedded technologies. But the one that takes the biscuit
for me is Steam announcing SteamOS. This is going to be a huge change
in what has been a long standing corporate culture of
Microsoft/Nvidia/Intel. Video games are the quintessential example of
the Real Time application. Graphics and sound all running as a real
time application. There's hints of where this is going in things like
the 3D synth by Robert Gareus. Look at the 3D menu / interface that
you can spin around in Borderlands 2. It amazes me that we are not
already using 3D window managers and are still stuck in static 2D land
(go ask Ted Nelson about that).
Where does this take Linux Audio Users ? Well the future is bright.
What's over that horizon ? I've been looking at Blender Game Engine
for doing VJ visuals (it can play full frame video within the game
engine and spin that around a'la a high end vision mixing desk).
Combined with sound who knows what kind of 3D dynamic sound mixing
environments could be created ?
So Linux bashing, go easy on them.
DJ Barney
I have not yet looked at SteamOS, but you are claiming realtime for it.
That pulls my curiosity trigger because one of my hobbies is CNC
machinery, and its realtime demands are far more stringent than some .1
millisecond accurate audio delivery. Currently we are running linuxcnc on
2.6.32-122-RTAI, but that RTAI patch is invasive as hell, and extremely
difficult to apply to a newer kernel, so we are running on Ubuntu-10.04.4
LTS yet, with an occasional hiccup at other functions.
If SteamOS is claiming real time, just how "realtime" is it? We need to
have an I/O heartbeat running at a 20 to 25 u-sec rate, with not over a 3
u-sec jitter in that timing to run well. Currently the intel atom based
boards are the goto boards for that, but we could sure use some additional
iron in the mix, which oddly, seems to point toward the BeagleBoneBlack
because of its bank of programmable realtime units (PRU's) and a true feast
of I/O pin availability that can serve as the step pulse generators.
I have an old HP box with a 1 Ghz athlon in it that could serve as a proof
of concept box if this is downloadable and buildable on it.
So, what say you that have tasted this?
Thanks.
Cheers, Gene
--
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
Immanuel Kant but Kubla Khan.
A pen in the hand of this president is far more
dangerous than 200 million guns in the hands of
law-abiding citizens.
Quoting Brett McCoy <idragosani(a)gmail.com>om>:
> On Mon, Oct 28, 2013 at 5:48 AM, michael noble <looplog(a)gmail.com>
wrote:
Must be that time of year again when slashdotters get
a bee in their
bonnet about how useless Linux is for audio production. Enter at
your own risk...
http://ask.slashdot.org/story/13/10/27/0534248/ask-slashdot-best-cros
s-platform-linux-only-audio-software?utm_source=rss1.0mainlinkanon&ut
m_medium=feed
Ha, I stopped reading /. a long time ago. I can see not much has
changed... --
Brett W. McCoy -- http://www.brettwmccoy.com
----------------------------------------------------------------------
-- "In the rhythm of music a secret is hidden; If I were to divulge
it, it would overturn the world."
-- Jelaleddin Rumi
_______________________________________________
Linux-audio-user mailing list
Linux-audio-user(a)lists.linuxaudio.org
http://lists.linuxaudio.org/listinfo/linux-audio-user
_______________________________________________
Linux-audio-user mailing list
Linux-audio-user(a)lists.linuxaudio.org
http://lists.linuxaudio.org/listinfo/linux-audio-user 
4:13 p.m.
On Mon, Oct 28, 2013 at 11:05 AM, Gene Heskett <gheskett(a)wdtv.com> wrote:
I have not yet looked at SteamOS, but you are claiming
realtime for it.
That pulls my curiosity trigger because one of my hobbies is CNC
machinery, and its realtime demands are far more stringent than some .1
millisecond accurate audio delivery. Currently we are running linuxcnc on
2.6.32-122-RTAI, but that RTAI patch is invasive as hell, [ ... ]
If SteamOS is claiming real time, just how "realtime" is it?
There is no comparing even the RT kernel with RTAI. They are totally
different conceptions. RTAI is basically a microkernel that runs a normal
kernel as a client. It requires drivers for every device that is included
in "realtime land" (i.e. for audio, you cannot use ALSA, you would need new
drivers that run in the RT executive.
SteamOS *might* use the RT kernel, but I'd be incredibly surprised if they
even considered RTAI.
--p
(disclaimer: i haven't looked at RTAI for quite a long time, things might
have changed)
5:51 p.m.
On Monday 28 October 2013 12:33:34 Paul Davis did opine:
On Mon, Oct 28, 2013 at 11:05 AM, Gene Heskett
<gheskett(a)wdtv.com> wrote:
Thats what I was thinking too. There is another patch set we have used
experimentally that seems almost as good, the Xenomai branch and some of
the guys who are running servo only systems are quite enthusiastic about
it. Servo systems aren't as sensitive to stumbles in the stepper rates,
generally tolerating millisecond response times fairly well.
My experiences with the earlier versions of the RT patch set were less than
satisfactory, but that was 6 or 7 years ago. The first thing it did was
kill tvtime, but now we're all digital here in the states so its Kaffeine
to the rescue, but I've not a clue if it works with the current RT kit.
Have any of you played with the Xenomai patches for your audio work?
Thanks Paul.
Cheers, Gene
--
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
If you want to travel around the world and be invited to speak at a lot
of different places, just write a Unix operating system.
-- Linus Torvalds
A pen in the hand of this president is far more
dangerous than 200 million guns in the hands of
law-abiding citizens.
I have not yet looked at SteamOS, but you are
claiming realtime for
it. That pulls my curiosity trigger because one of my hobbies is CNC
machinery, and its realtime demands are far more stringent than some
.1 millisecond accurate audio delivery. Currently we are running
linuxcnc on 2.6.32-122-RTAI, but that RTAI patch is invasive as hell,
[ ... ]
If SteamOS is claiming real time, just how "realtime" is it?
There is no comparing even the RT kernel with RTAI. They are totally
different conceptions. RTAI is basically a microkernel that runs a
normal kernel as a client. It requires drivers for every device that is
included in "realtime land" (i.e. for audio, you cannot use ALSA, you
would need new drivers that run in the RT executive.
SteamOS *might* use the RT kernel, but I'd be incredibly surprised if
they even considered RTAI.
6:06 p.m.
I read it.
The problem is that genuine problems are mixed in with misunderstanding and
things taken out of context.
No doubt, Linux Audio world is very much distinct from Windows and OS X.
I think real bitter feelings arise from people who came over to Linux
because of ideological reasons and not
because Linux works better for them from a technological point of view. And
thus they are torn apart by
their longing for a system that would work for them and their ideology,
according to which all things
proprietary are evil, etc. I can see some of that in that thread.
L.V.
6:59 p.m.
On Mon, 28 Oct 2013 21:05:58 +0400
Louigi Verona <louigi.verona(a)gmail.com> wrote:
I read it.
The problem is that genuine problems are mixed in with misunderstanding and
things taken out of context.
No doubt, Linux Audio world is very much distinct from Windows and OS X.
I think real bitter feelings arise from people who came over to Linux
because of ideological reasons and not
because Linux works better for them from a technological point of view. And
thus they are torn apart by
their longing for a system that would work for them and their ideology,
according to which all things
proprietary are evil, etc. I can see some of that in that thread.
L.V.
I've put my own comment on there, basically saying that *any* OS is quite
capable and that you don't need the best, most expensive kit to make good
music. No replies so far :)
--
Will J Godfrey
http://www.musically.me.uk
Say you have a poem and I have a tune.
Exchange them and we can both have a poem, a tune, and a song.
8:14 p.m.
On Mon, 2013-10-28 at 21:05 +0400, Louigi Verona wrote:
The problem is that genuine problems are mixed in
with
misunderstanding and things taken out of context.
No doubt, Linux Audio world is very much distinct from Windows and OS
X.
There is something absolutely equal for all of them, OS X, Windows and
Linux, they all need a computer. Much of today's rock music is made on
analog equipment again.
Visit a friends site, not a musician, he writes about music
http://www.cosmiclava.com/ . Write to the bands he's writing about and
ask them what they use to produce their music. Most use analog tapes,
real Mellotrons etc..
Sure, sometimes it's just hype, you don't need an Orange amp, there are
other good amps too, anyway, many are open minded, are comfortable with
averaged Marshall amps etc. and really, really tried to use the computer
for production, but it simply doesn't provide the wanted results.
There still are some young, real rock musicians making a living from
their music, don't think of all that crap like Metallica, Red Hot Chilly
Pappers etc. who don't have any talent for real rock'n'roll.
You can't sound like the MC5, Jimi Hendrix, Roky Erickson, old Hawkwind
etc. pp. using virtual amps, an OS X, Windows or Linux wha-wha, even a
Morley isn't a Cry Baby, perhaps a Ibanez Blubber can replace a Cry
Baby. Doing the recording with a hard disc recorder also has got
drawbacks, but some young musicians like this real rock'n'roll sound.
Not my 2 cents, an objective study.
8:28 p.m.
Recording an album is good possible on Linux. It's far more problematic
to compose music (both by music notation and MIDI) on Linux, MIDI tools
is the neglected child here.
Ardour3 has MIDI, but there're debates how useful it is atm. Ardour is
focusing on audio engineering, so you probably shouldn't expect it to
get comparable results as you'll get on other platforms.
Qtractor is more mature, but is lacking stuff like Jack Midi and also
the busses system is a bit strange imho.
I've little experience with Muse2, but it is pretty mature if I believe
the stories. It doesn't have a very inspiring GUI though.
Moreover, small issues are the biggest problems on linuxaudio for a good
workflow. If you're unlucky you're more busy reporting issues then
making music.
As mentioned before, the NON tools + Carla, are making things much
better for me. But also here non-sequencer is less mature then
non-timeline and non-mixer. Laborejo is promising when working with
notation but also lacking matureness and features.
Regards,
\r
8:37 p.m.
On Mon, 2013-10-28 at 20:28 +0100, rosea.grammostola wrote:
Recording an album is good possible on Linux. It's
far more problematic
to compose music (both by music notation and MIDI) on Linux, MIDI tools
is the neglected child here.
Ardour3 has MIDI, but there're debates how useful it is atm. Ardour is
focusing on audio engineering, so you probably shouldn't expect it to
get comparable results as you'll get on other platforms.
Qtractor is more mature, but is lacking stuff like Jack Midi and also
the busses system is a bit strange imho.
I've little experience with Muse2, but it is pretty mature if I believe
the stories. It doesn't have a very inspiring GUI though.
Moreover, small issues are the biggest problems on linuxaudio for a good
workflow. If you're unlucky you're more busy reporting issues then
making music.
As mentioned before, the NON tools + Carla, are making things much
better for me. But also here non-sequencer is less mature then
non-timeline and non-mixer. Laborejo is promising when working with
notation but also lacking matureness and features.
I completely agree with this for MIDI music. Qtractor is amazing for
MIDI, but bad for hard disc recording. Ardour is good for hard disc
recording, but bad for MIDI. I don't care.
$ sudo pacman -Syu
[snip]
warning: ardour: ignoring package upgrade (2.8.16-1 => 3.5.14-1)
[snip]
But indeed, some only want it all in one application and other OS do
provide it. Again, I don't care about it, I can live with it, while I
prefer myself one app for all.
But it's not fair to bash the musicians who are comfortable with other
OS and who can't use Linux for their needs.
And we still have all those driver issues. We are computer nerds +
musicians and can live with the driver issues, an averaged musician is a
musician and not a computer nerd.
8:38 p.m.
On Mon, Oct 28, 2013 at 3:28 PM, rosea.grammostola <
rosea.grammostola(a)gmail.com> wrote:
Recording an album is good possible on Linux. It's
far more problematic to
compose music (both by music notation and MIDI) on Linux, MIDI tools is the
neglected child here.
Ardour3 has MIDI, but there're debates how useful it is atm. Ardour is
focusing on audio engineering, so you probably shouldn't expect it to get
comparable results as you'll get on other platforms.
you will see focus return to MIDI in ardour3 within a couple of months. and
i absolutely intend for it be comparable to "other platforms".
8:48 p.m.
On 10/28/2013 08:38 PM, Paul Davis wrote:
On Mon, Oct 28, 2013 at 3:28 PM, rosea.grammostola
<rosea.grammostola(a)gmail.com <mailto:rosea.grammostola@gmail.com>> wrote:
Recording an album is good possible on Linux. It's far more
problematic to compose music (both by music notation and MIDI) on
Linux, MIDI tools is the neglected child here.
Ardour3 has MIDI, but there're debates how useful it is atm.
Ardour is focusing on audio engineering, so you probably shouldn't
expect it to get comparable results as you'll get on other platforms.
you will see focus return to MIDI in ardour3 within a couple of
months. and i absolutely intend for it be comparable to "other platforms".
Good to know, thx for clarifying.
\r
8:42 p.m.
On Mon, Oct 28, 2013 at 08:28:07PM +0100, rosea.grammostola wrote:
Recording an album is good possible on Linux. It's
far more
problematic to compose music (both by music notation and MIDI) on
Linux, MIDI tools is the neglected child here.
Ardour3 has MIDI, but there're debates how useful it is atm. Ardour is
focusing on audio engineering, so you probably shouldn't expect it to
get comparable results as you'll get on other platforms.
I use Muse for sequencing...no complaints. There's no reason the DAW
has to also be the sequencer.
--
+ Brent A. Busby + "We've all heard that a million monkeys
+ Sr. UNIX Systems Admin + banging on a million typewriters will
+ University of Chicago + eventually reproduce the entire works of
+ James Franck Institute + Shakespeare. Now, thanks to the Internet,
+ Materials Research Ctr + we know this is not true." -Robert Wilensky
8:46 p.m.
On Mon, 2013-10-28 at 14:42 -0500, Brent Busby wrote:
There's no reason the DAW has to also be the
sequencer.
Correct, I synced the C64 by click and the Atari ST by SMPTE to analog
gear. But wouldn't it be wonderful to have it all in one application
instead of running Qtractor or Muse and Ardour?
4:50 p.m.
I can't bother reading the discussion. (it's automn on my side of earth:
enough natural bitterdom among my people already)
But I really liked that advice "any reputation consultant would give".
It's like Buckminster Fuller said: "you do not change the system by
fighting it. To change the system, make a new one, that turns the old
system irrelevant".
I've withnessed alot of friends going linux lately. They buy a new
computer, but put ubuntustudio on the old, and eventualy stay there :)
Thats probably a good reason for old grumpy cats to get worried about
their position on their dictated wrong-vs-right scale, and rant about
how their expensive software was worth becoming a paranoid pirate or a
grumpy broka-A**. :D
Being bitter is a good way to develope premature elderdom,
fantasy-freeze and also depression. So let them rant, it will come back
to them. :D
Meanwhile! Let's produce some kickass music!!!!
<3
On 2013-10-28 16:05, Gene Heskett wrote:
On Monday 28 October 2013 10:44:40 Barney Holmes did
opine:
Same here. It seemed to turn into a cynicism fest in many
circumstances. If this kind of post (no I didn?t go in, I have enough
anger already) is anything special or just the usual I don't know.
However there is a HUGE watershed going on at the moment that
undoubtedly is spilling well beyond the borders of open source land.
Something extraordinary IS happening and I don't see why anyone should
be embarrassed about giving themselves a pat on the back or even
getting others to pat them on that back ! An enormous amount of work
by thousands upon thousands is paying off. The fruits started
happening with Android, despite proprietary drivers (if Google had
refused that none of the mobile phone manufactures would have even
used Android!), then Ubuntu, as well as the less visible internet
servers and embedded technologies. But the one that takes the biscuit
for me is Steam announcing SteamOS. This is going to be a huge change
in what has been a long standing corporate culture of
Microsoft/Nvidia/Intel. Video games are the quintessential example of
the Real Time application. Graphics and sound all running as a real
time application. There's hints of where this is going in things like
the 3D synth by Robert Gareus. Look at the 3D menu / interface that
you can spin around in Borderlands 2. It amazes me that we are not
already using 3D window managers and are still stuck in static 2D land
(go ask Ted Nelson about that).
Where does this take Linux Audio Users ? Well the future is bright.
What's over that horizon ? I've been looking at Blender Game Engine
for doing VJ visuals (it can play full frame video within the game
engine and spin that around a'la a high end vision mixing desk).
Combined with sound who knows what kind of 3D dynamic sound mixing
environments could be created ?
So Linux bashing, go easy on them.
DJ Barney
I have not yet looked at SteamOS, but you are claiming realtime for it.
That pulls my curiosity trigger because one of my hobbies is CNC
machinery, and its realtime demands are far more stringent than some .1
millisecond accurate audio delivery. Currently we are running linuxcnc on
2.6.32-122-RTAI, but that RTAI patch is invasive as hell, and extremely
difficult to apply to a newer kernel, so we are running on Ubuntu-10.04.4
LTS yet, with an occasional hiccup at other functions.
If SteamOS is claiming real time, just how "realtime" is it? We need to
have an I/O heartbeat running at a 20 to 25 u-sec rate, with not over a 3
u-sec jitter in that timing to run well. Currently the intel atom based
boards are the goto boards for that, but we could sure use some additional
iron in the mix, which oddly, seems to point toward the BeagleBoneBlack
because of its bank of programmable realtime units (PRU's) and a true feast
of I/O pin availability that can serve as the step pulse generators.
I have an old HP box with a 1 Ghz athlon in it that could serve as a proof
of concept box if this is downloadable and buildable on it.
So, what say you that have tasted this?
Thanks.
Cheers, Gene
--
Set Hallstrom
AKA Sakrecoer
http://sakrecoer.com
WARNING: Remember clear-text email is subject to mass surveillance
systems. Alone this information is useless. Our summed communications
are worth humanity.
Please keep in mind Internet is a boulevard in a crowded virtual city.
Privacy is found under the cloaks.
Quoting Brett McCoy
<idragosani(a)gmail.com>om>:
> On Mon, Oct 28, 2013 at 5:48 AM, michael noble <looplog(a)gmail.com>
wrote:
Must be that time of year again when slashdotters get
a bee in their
bonnet about how useless Linux is for audio production. Enter at
your own risk...
http://ask.slashdot.org/story/13/10/27/0534248/ask-slashdot-best-cros
s-platform-linux-only-audio-software?utm_source=rss1.0mainlinkanon&ut
m_medium=feed
Ha, I stopped reading /. a long time ago. I can see not much has
changed... --
Brett W. McCoy -- http://www.brettwmccoy.com
----------------------------------------------------------------------
-- "In the rhythm of music a secret is hidden; If I were to divulge
it, it would overturn the world."
-- Jelaleddin Rumi
_______________________________________________
Linux-audio-user mailing list
Linux-audio-user(a)lists.linuxaudio.org
http://lists.linuxaudio.org/listinfo/linux-audio-user
_______________________________________________
Linux-audio-user mailing list
Linux-audio-user(a)lists.linuxaudio.org
http://lists.linuxaudio.org/listinfo/linux-audio-user
29 Oct
29 Oct
3:37 p.m.
Quoting Gene Heskett <gheskett(a)wdtv.com>om>:
Cheers, Gene
--
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
Immanuel Kant but Kubla Khan.
A pen in the hand of this president is far more
dangerous than 200 million guns in the hands of
law-abiding citizens.
_______________________________________________
Linux-audio-user mailing list
Linux-audio-user(a)lists.linuxaudio.org
http://lists.linuxaudio.org/listinfo/linux-audio-user
On Monday 28 October 2013 10:44:40 Barney Holmes did
opine:
Same here. It seemed to turn into a cynicism fest in many
circumstances. If this kind of post (no I didn?t go in, I have enough
anger already) is anything special or just the usual I don't know.
However there is a HUGE watershed going on at the moment that
undoubtedly is spilling well beyond the borders of open source land.
Something extraordinary IS happening and I don't see why anyone should
be embarrassed about giving themselves a pat on the back or even
getting others to pat them on that back ! An enormous amount of work
by thousands upon thousands is paying off. The fruits started
happening with Android, despite proprietary drivers (if Google had
refused that none of the mobile phone manufactures would have even
used Android!), then Ubuntu, as well as the less visible internet
servers and embedded technologies. But the one that takes the biscuit
for me is Steam announcing SteamOS. This is going to be a huge change
in what has been a long standing corporate culture of
Microsoft/Nvidia/Intel. Video games are the quintessential example of
the Real Time application. Graphics and sound all running as a real
time application. There's hints of where this is going in things like
the 3D synth by Robert Gareus. Look at the 3D menu / interface that
you can spin around in Borderlands 2. It amazes me that we are not
already using 3D window managers and are still stuck in static 2D land
(go ask Ted Nelson about that).
Where does this take Linux Audio Users ? Well the future is bright.
What's over that horizon ? I've been looking at Blender Game Engine
for doing VJ visuals (it can play full frame video within the game
engine and spin that around a'la a high end vision mixing desk).
Combined with sound who knows what kind of 3D dynamic sound mixing
environments could be created ?
So Linux bashing, go easy on them.
DJ Barney
I have not yet looked at SteamOS, but you are claiming realtime for it.
We don't know the gritty technical details of SteamOS yet. I was only
claiming that video games are a form of Real Time application. Things
have to go off, be processed, and return within a given time limit,
but it's not as stringent as the needs of a robotics production line.
As every gamer knows, esp. PC gamers, there are sometimes slight
glitches, short freezes and frame rate drops because the game is not
tuned to known hardware like it is for a console. Who would put up
with this while watching TV, or from their hardware CD player ? Yet, I
payed £20 for Borderlands 2 recently. Should I not have guaranteed
uninterrupted game play for that price ? But I think this is what
Valve are up to. Developers will develop for known hardware specs and
if there are glitches on other machines then "its your own problem"
(but I hope they will support DIY PC people as well). All this has
some similarity to the company, I forget the name, who sell music
production systems pre-installed on a known hardware config laptop.
Quoting Brett McCoy
<idragosani(a)gmail.com>om>:
> On Mon, Oct 28, 2013 at 5:48 AM, michael noble <looplog(a)gmail.com>
wrote:
Must be that time of year again when slashdotters get
a bee in their
bonnet about how useless Linux is for audio production. Enter at
your own risk...
http://ask.slashdot.org/story/13/10/27/0534248/ask-slashdot-best-cros
s-platform-linux-only-audio-software?utm_source=rss1.0mainlinkanon&ut
m_medium=feed
Ha, I stopped reading /. a long time ago. I can see not much has
changed... That pulls my curiosity trigger because one of my
hobbies is CNC
machinery, and its realtime demands are far more stringent than some .1
millisecond accurate audio delivery. Currently we are running linuxcnc on
2.6.32-122-RTAI, but that RTAI patch is invasive as hell, and extremely
difficult to apply to a newer kernel, so we are running on Ubuntu-10.04.4
LTS yet, with an occasional hiccup at other functions.
Valve development may help with that, assuming they actually work on
any RT stuff, but I'd be very surprised if they didn?t. This is
happening with Android development being flowed back into the Linux
kernel -
http://www.zdnet.com/blog/open-source/linux-guru-re-merging-of-android-into…
If SteamOS is claiming real time, just how "realtime" is it? We need to
have an I/O heartbeat running at a 20 to 25 u-sec rate, with not over a 3
u-sec jitter in that timing to run well. Currently the intel atom based
boards are the goto boards for that, but we could sure use some additional
iron in the mix, which oddly, seems to point toward the BeagleBoneBlack
because of its bank of programmable realtime units (PRU's) and a true feast
of I/O pin availability that can serve as the step pulse generators.
We should see the source code of SteamOS sometime in 2014.
I have an old HP box with a 1 Ghz athlon in it that could serve as a proof
of concept box if this is downloadable and buildable on it.
So, what say you that have tasted this?
I will be installing SteamOS on my PC when it comes out. If it has any
use for music production remains to be seen. What I'm tracking is the
effect these developments are having on the future of developments for
Linux audio users in the open source ecosystem.
Thanks.
Cheers !
--
Brett W. McCoy -- http://www.brettwmccoy.com
----------------------------------------------------------------------
-- "In the rhythm of music a secret is hidden; If I were to divulge
it, it would overturn the world."
-- Jelaleddin Rumi
_______________________________________________
Linux-audio-user mailing list
Linux-audio-user(a)lists.linuxaudio.org
http://lists.linuxaudio.org/listinfo/linux-audio-user
_______________________________________________
Linux-audio-user mailing list
Linux-audio-user(a)lists.linuxaudio.org
http://lists.linuxaudio.org/listinfo/linux-audio-user
10:18 p.m.
On Tuesday 29 October 2013 17:13:48 Barney Holmes did opine:
Quoting Gene Heskett <gheskett(a)wdtv.com>om>:
I don't know as I'd go so far as to install it just because its there, but
I will certainly keep my ears tuned for suitable comments when it does hit
the streets.
We both know that there is a certain amount of iron to do the work, and
that one thing done exceedingly well, will be balanced by some other aspect
thats so bad the local stray cat population surplus will be quickly solved.
:)
Thanks Brett.
Cheers, Gene
--
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
Prerecorded for this time zone.
A pen in the hand of this president is far more
dangerous than 200 million guns in the hands of
law-abiding citizens.
On Monday 28 October 2013 10:44:40 Barney Holmes
did opine:
I have not yet looked at SteamOS, but you are claiming realtime for
it.
We don't know the gritty technical details of SteamOS yet. I was only
claiming that video games are a form of Real Time application. Things
have to go off, be processed, and return within a given time limit,
but it's not as stringent as the needs of a robotics production line.
As every gamer knows, esp. PC gamers, there are sometimes slight
glitches, short freezes and frame rate drops because the game is not
tuned to known hardware like it is for a console. Who would put up
with this while watching TV, or from their hardware CD player ? Yet, I
payed £20 for Borderlands 2 recently. Should I not have guaranteed
uninterrupted game play for that price ? But I think this is what
Valve are up to. Developers will develop for known hardware specs and
if there are glitches on other machines then "its your own problem"
(but I hope they will support DIY PC people as well). All this has
some similarity to the company, I forget the name, who sell music
production systems pre-installed on a known hardware config laptop.
Quoting Brett McCoy
<idragosani(a)gmail.com>om>:
> On Mon, Oct 28, 2013 at 5:48 AM, michael noble <looplog(a)gmail.com>
wrote:
> Must
be that time of year again when slashdotters get a bee in
> their bonnet about how useless Linux is for audio production.
> Enter at your own risk...
>
> http://ask.slashdot.org/story/13/10/27/0534248/ask-slashdot-best-c
> ros
> s-platform-linux-only-audio-software?utm_source=rss1.0mainlinkano
> n&ut m_medium=feed
Ha, I stopped reading /. a long time ago. I can see not much has
changed...
Same here. It seemed to turn into a cynicism fest in many
circumstances. If this kind of post (no I didn?t go in, I have enough
anger already) is anything special or just the usual I don't know.
However there is a HUGE watershed going on at the moment that
undoubtedly is spilling well beyond the borders of open source land.
Something extraordinary IS happening and I don't see why anyone
should be embarrassed about giving themselves a pat on the back or
even getting others to pat them on that back ! An enormous amount of
work by thousands upon thousands is paying off. The fruits started
happening with Android, despite proprietary drivers (if Google had
refused that none of the mobile phone manufactures would have even
used Android!), then Ubuntu, as well as the less visible internet
servers and embedded technologies. But the one that takes the
biscuit for me is Steam announcing SteamOS. This is going to be a
huge change in what has been a long standing corporate culture of
Microsoft/Nvidia/Intel. Video games are the quintessential example of
the Real Time application. Graphics and sound all running as a real
time application. There's hints of where this is going in things like
the 3D synth by Robert Gareus. Look at the 3D menu / interface that
you can spin around in Borderlands 2. It amazes me that we are not
already using 3D window managers and are still stuck in static 2D
land (go ask Ted Nelson about that).
Where does this take Linux Audio Users ? Well the future is bright.
What's over that horizon ? I've been looking at Blender Game Engine
for doing VJ visuals (it can play full frame video within the game
engine and spin that around a'la a high end vision mixing desk).
Combined with sound who knows what kind of 3D dynamic sound mixing
environments could be created ?
So Linux bashing, go easy on them.
DJ Barney That pulls my curiosity trigger because one of
my hobbies is CNC
machinery, and its realtime demands are far more stringent than some
.1 millisecond accurate audio delivery. Currently we are running
linuxcnc on 2.6.32-122-RTAI, but that RTAI patch is invasive as hell,
and extremely difficult to apply to a newer kernel, so we are running
on Ubuntu-10.04.4 LTS yet, with an occasional hiccup at other
functions.
Valve development may help with that, assuming they actually work on
any RT stuff, but I'd be very surprised if they didn?t. This is
happening with Android development being flowed back into the Linux
kernel -
http://www.zdnet.com/blog/open-source/linux-guru-re-merging-of-android-i
nto-kernel-eases-sysdev-a-bit/10635
If SteamOS is claiming real time, just how
"realtime" is it? We need
to have an I/O heartbeat running at a 20 to 25 u-sec rate, with not
over a 3 u-sec jitter in that timing to run well. Currently the
intel atom based boards are the goto boards for that, but we could
sure use some additional iron in the mix, which oddly, seems to point
toward the BeagleBoneBlack because of its bank of programmable
realtime units (PRU's) and a true feast of I/O pin availability that
can serve as the step pulse generators.
We should see the source code of SteamOS sometime in 2014.
I have an old HP box with a 1 Ghz athlon in it
that could serve as a
proof of concept box if this is downloadable and buildable on it.
So, what say you that have tasted this?
I will be installing SteamOS on my PC when it comes out. If it has any
use for music production remains to be seen. What I'm tracking is the
effect these developments are having on the future of developments for
Linux audio users in the open source ecosystem.
Thanks.
Cheers !
4106
days inactive
4118
days old
linux-audio-user@lists.linuxaudio.org
69 comments
25 participants
participants (25)
-
Alexandre Prokoudine -
Atte -
Barney Holmes -
Brent Busby -
Brett McCoy -
Chris Bannister -
Dave Phillips -
david -
drew Roberts -
Felix Homann -
Fons Adriaensen -
Gene Heskett -
Joe Hartley -
Ken Restivo -
Len Ovens -
Leonardo Palomares -
Louigi Verona -
michael noble -
Paul Davis -
Pete Wright -
Ralf Mardorf -
rosea.grammostola -
S C Rigler -
Set Hallstrom -
Will Godfrey