4 Oct
2003
4 Oct
'03
5:20 p.m.
Ok guys so here's one (told ya it wouldn't be long before I was yakkin again -
I tried to send this earlier but it might have gone bouncy due to html in
message) - this is for all you MIDI and Ardour experts :)
How about syncing Ardour with MIDI - let's see there's a few different things
I need to do -
1) sync ardour to outside tape source via ADAT sync...I set it to ADAT in
options window, and expect it to wait and play when I play tape, but no cigar
2) sync ardour to outside source via MTC sync - same deal - although if I
play, and then hit stop, the transport marker sort of sits there waitiing and
jiggling - does this mean something?
3) sync Ardour to sequencer inside computer - say rosegarden - via MTC I guess
- whatever works...
anxiously awaiting replies :) thanks, have fun and yay! :)
--
--------------
Aaron Trumm
NQuit
www.nquit.com
--------------
4 Oct
4 Oct
5:56 p.m.
--- Aaron Trumm <aaron(a)nquit.com> wrote:
Ok guys so here's one (told ya it wouldn't be
long
before I was yakkin again -
I tried to send this earlier but it might have gone
bouncy due to html in
message) - this is for all you MIDI and Ardour
experts :)
How about syncing Ardour with MIDI - let's see
there's a few different things
I need to do -
1) sync ardour to outside tape source via ADAT
sync...I set it to ADAT in
options window, and expect it to wait and play when
I play tape, but no cigar
2) sync ardour to outside source via MTC sync - same
deal - although if I
play, and then hit stop, the transport marker sort
of sits there waitiing and
jiggling - does this mean something?
Within the Options menu there are flags that can be
set that will cause Ardour to print Midi and MTC
messages to the consol from which it was started. I'd
suggest gettting those messages and sending a report
to ardour-dev.
It's been a long time but I seem to recall controlling
transport from external MTC.
I believe that Ardour 1.0 will abandon MTC generation
in favor of SMPTE--not sure if that applies to reading
external messages. Anyone know?
Ardour generates bursty MTC which isn't very useful
because devices like my Tascam DM-24 can't interpret
it. Apparently SMPTE will be significantly easier to
implement. I'm looking forward to SMPTE because I
desperately need to sync Ardour and a mixer.
3) sync Ardour to sequencer inside computer - say
rosegarden - via MTC I guess
- whatever works...
The preferred solution for syncing jack clients is
jack_transport functionality. I haven't noticed any of
the midi sequencer developers announcing inclusion of
Jack O'Quin's new transport feature set. I believe the
API is stable and waiting for people to implement it.
Paul D. recently announced that he has the transport
functionality for Ardour at %80.
I would suggest asking the Rosegarden and Muse
developers if it's on their radar.
I believe you'll find that JAMin and ecasound support
the new functionality. Alsaplayer might too. The old
sync functionality is still supported but obviously
deprecated. So you can probably sync an ecasound,
jamin alsaplayer chain.
ron
anxiously awaiting replies :) thanks, have fun and
yay! :)
--
--------------
Aaron Trumm
NQuit
www.nquit.com
--------------
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6:14 p.m.
Within the Options menu there are flags that can be
set that will cause Ardour to print Midi and MTC
messages to the consol from which it was started. I'd
suggest gettting those messages and sending a report
to ardour-dev.
hmmm - that's a good idea
I seem to have gotten past this to SOME degree - I repatched my midi patch
bay, and now ardour responds - but sort of spottily - I usually have to make
several attempts at hitting play on the outside device (a darwin harddisk
recorder) before ardour responds. when it responds, it seems to stay in sync
well for awhile, although what it won't do is pick up from anywhere but the
beginning - which is the point of using MTC instead of MIDI clock,
largely...the problem now is it stops after about a minute, but I think this
is an issue with recording (as that's what I'm doing) and I'm about to test
to see if it stops when just playing, and to see if when recording while not
in sync it stops...
I believe that Ardour 1.0 will abandon MTC generation
in favor of SMPTE--not sure if that applies to reading
external messages. Anyone know?
the way I understand it, MTC really just IS smpte, translated into the MIDI
stream so that MIDI devices such as synths and sequencers (and Darwin, and my
mixer) can deal with it (my mixer has an actual smpte port too I think)
it's always nice to have 'em all
I have yet to get ardour to really SEND anything. it's trying to be a slave
alright, but I was hoping that it would send ADAT sync (that's the other,
better way to sync darwins is with the adat 9 pin sync card)...it doesn't
seem to want to receive ADAT sync either - that might have something to do
with my card, though - I recall seeing something where the ardour guys
weren't able to get the ADAT sync to work with the Hammerfall cards yet...
The preferred solution for syncing jack clients is
jack_transport functionality. I haven't noticed any of
the midi sequencer developers announcing inclusion of
Jack O'Quin's new transport feature set. I believe the
API is stable and waiting for people to implement it.
Paul D. recently announced that he has the transport
functionality for Ardour at %80.
I see this option in the options window of ardour - I thought that might be
what would be really great, actually, is if jack could be the centerpiece for
sync, and for example, ardour, rosegarden AND external devices could sync to
jack - having a jack be a solid master time code source sending all sync
codes out at once, with syncing to it just being a matter of connecting up a
virtual and/or real cable,
I believe you'll find that JAMin and ecasound
support
the new functionality. Alsaplayer might too. The old
as I see people talking, it sounds like ecasound might be a better option in
some cases for initial tracking... but ecasound has no GUI whatsoever, right?
--
--------------
Aaron Trumm
NQuit
www.nquit.com
--------------
5 Oct
5 Oct
1:23 p.m.
On Sat, 2003-10-04 at 16:04, Aaron Trumm wrote:
largely...the problem now is it stops after about a
minute, but I think this
is an issue with recording (as that's what I'm doing) and I'm about to test
to see if it stops when just playing, and to see if when recording while not
in sync it stops...
If you are having problems with Ardour, please join the ardour-dev
mailing list and tell us about them. There is a lot of functionality in
Ardour, and sometimes we don't notice if something breaks.
Taybin
4:43 p.m.
If you are having problems with Ardour, please join
the ardour-dev
mailing list and tell us about them. There is a lot of functionality in
Ardour, and sometimes we don't notice if something breaks.
yes, actually I wanted to do this - I figured it would help you, even to
report the little bugs - but I can't get on it - it's set up to reject mail
from servers that reject some kind of bounce - my ISP does this so I'm kinda
screwed unless I get a hotmail account or something - is there any way y'all
can bypass said feature?
the current report on this issue is that I've now gotten Ardour to record up
to 8 tracks (I haven't tried more) simulatneously while playing 8 more for
over 10 minutes - the change was I unpatched the midi from the darwin to
ardour - I guess it was receiving (or sending and then receiving back?) some
kind of MTC stop? I'm not sure. I just know after unpatching MIDI I could
record and it wasn't stopping. that meant I couldn't sync to the tape and
record though. (worked around that by sliding new tracks into place)...
6 Oct
6 Oct
9:55 a.m.
On Sun, 2003-10-05 at 14:25, Aaron Trumm wrote:
yes, actually I wanted to do this - I figured it would
help you, even to
report the little bugs - but I can't get on it - it's set up to reject mail
from servers that reject some kind of bounce - my ISP does this so I'm kinda
screwed unless I get a hotmail account or something - is there any way y'all
can bypass said feature?
Send an email to Paul Davis at paul(a)linuxaudiosystems.com. He's the
only one who can manually add people to the mailing list.
the current report on this issue is that I've now gotten Ardour to record up
to 8 tracks (I haven't tried more) simulatneously
while playing 8 more for
over 10 minutes - the change was I unpatched the midi from the darwin to
ardour - I guess it was receiving (or sending and then receiving back?) some
kind of MTC stop? I'm not sure. I just know after unpatching MIDI I could
record and it wasn't stopping. that meant I couldn't sync to the tape and
record though. (worked around that by sliding new tracks into place)...
I think there might currently be a bug with MTC stop. Or at least,
other people have had similar problems.
Taybin
5 Oct
5 Oct
4:45 p.m.
sent twice, cuz I think the 1st one will get rejected due to html...
If you are having problems with Ardour, please join
the ardour-dev
mailing list and tell us about them. There is a lot of functionality in
Ardour, and sometimes we don't notice if something breaks.
yes, actually I wanted to do this - I figured it would help you, even to
report the little bugs - but I can't get on it - it's set up to reject mail
from servers that reject some kind of bounce - my ISP does this so I'm kinda
screwed unless I get a hotmail account or something - is there any way y'all
can bypass said feature?
the current report on this issue is that I've now gotten Ardour to record up
to 8 tracks (I haven't tried more) simulatneously while playing 8 more for
over 10 minutes - the change was I unpatched the midi from the darwin to
ardour - I guess it was receiving (or sending and then receiving back?) some
kind of MTC stop? I'm not sure. I just know after unpatching MIDI I could
record and it wasn't stopping. that meant I couldn't sync to the tape and
record though. (worked around that by sliding new tracks into place)...
3:16 p.m.
Aaron Trumm <aaron(a)nquit.com> writes:
the way I understand it, MTC really just IS smpte,
translated into
the MIDI stream so that MIDI devices such as synths and sequencers
(and Darwin, and my mixer) can deal with it (my mixer has an actual
smpte port too I think) it's always nice to have 'em all
Basically true. The main practical difference between SMPTE timecode
and MTC is that the SMPTE timecode is encoded in an audio stream. If
digitized and fed to a JACK port, this becomes sample-synchronous,
which can potentially provide excellent timing. Synching to an
external SMPTE clock will be difficult for many JACK clients because
of clock drift. But generating SMPTE from within a JACK timebase
master client should be very solid, because then there's only one
clock source.
MIDI messages are generally not delivered with accurate timing by
existing Linux interfaces. I believe this is why ardour has trouble
with it.
--
Jack O'Quin
Austin, Texas, USA
4:47 p.m.
Basically true. The main practical difference between
SMPTE timecode
and MTC is that the SMPTE timecode is encoded in an audio stream. If
digitized and fed to a JACK port, this becomes sample-synchronous,
which can potentially provide excellent timing. Synching to an
external SMPTE clock will be difficult for many JACK clients because
of clock drift. But generating SMPTE from within a JACK timebase
master client should be very solid, because then there's only one
clock source.
yes this sort of confirms what I said in another post, which is that it
would be really good to use jack as a master time code hub and have
everything (internal AND external) sync to that...
the other sample accurate sync (the one I've always trusted the most) is
ADAT sync
MIDI messages are generally not delivered with
accurate timing by
existing Linux interfaces. I believe this is why ardour has trouble
with it.
hmmm - I see
--
Jack O'Quin
Austin, Texas, USA
4:48 p.m.
arg! I forgot to switch the thing again, and so i have to send this twice
in case it gets rejected - sorry if it's a duplicate...
Basically true. The main practical difference between
SMPTE timecode
and MTC is that the SMPTE timecode is encoded in an audio stream. If
digitized and fed to a JACK port, this becomes sample-synchronous,
which can potentially provide excellent timing. Synching to an
external SMPTE clock will be difficult for many JACK clients because
of clock drift. But generating SMPTE from within a JACK timebase
master client should be very solid, because then there's only one
clock source.
yes this sort of confirms what I said in another post, which is that it
would be really good to use jack as a master time code hub and have
everything (internal AND external) sync to that...
the other sample accurate sync (the one I've always trusted the most) is
ADAT sync
MIDI messages are generally not delivered with
accurate timing by
existing Linux interfaces. I believe this is why ardour has trouble
with it.
hmmm - I see
4 Oct
4 Oct
7:09 p.m.
On Saturday 04 Oct 2003 7:41 pm, R Parker wrote:
The preferred solution for syncing jack clients is
jack_transport functionality. [...]
I would suggest asking the Rosegarden and Muse
developers if it's on their radar.
Very much so -- we (Rosegarden developers) simply haven't had time to
deal with it. No sync protocol is fully working in Rosegarden yet:
we had quite a bit of the framework ready a year ago, but have yet to
find that burst of time and effort to get the bulk of the heavy
lifting done.
Chris
7721
days inactive
7723
days old
linux-audio-user@lists.linuxaudio.org
10 comments
5 participants
participants (5)
-
Aaron Trumm -
Chris Cannam -
Jack O'Quin -
R Parker -
Taybin Rutkin